[Attrill]

He won't sign it until he figures out how to spin it into HIS great idea. Time to light the torches and mobilize the peasantry.

[aaron38]

UPDATE: SPRINGFIELD -- State lawmakers today passed a bill to fund Chicago-area mass transit with a sales tax increase, but Gov. Rod Blagojevich said he wouldn't go along until lawmakers agreed with his requirement to provide free bus and train rides for the state's senior citizens.

Oh come on! Is that really what we need right now, holding up funding for the entire city to give a perk to the seniors?

Sure that'd be great, who doesn't like free stuff, but we need to fight the real problems first. I'm supporting a raise in my sales taxes to keep the trains running for ALL Chicago, not to give out free rides.

Sign the damn bill boy wonder.

[BVictor1]

Blagojevich holds up transit funding

http://www.chicagotribune.com/media/photo/2008-01/34671192.jpg
CTA President Ron Huberman waits to meet with Governor Blagojevich after Illinois lawmakers passed a bill to fund Chicago-area mass transit. (Tribune photo by José Moré / January 10, 2008)

By Ray Long and Jeffrey Meitrodt | Tribune staff reporters
3:34 PM CST, January 10, 2008

UPDATE: SPRINGFIELD -- State lawmakers today passed a bill to fund Chicago-area mass transit with a sales tax increase, but Gov. Rod Blagojevich said he wouldn't go along until lawmakers agreed with his requirement to provide free bus and train rides for the state's senior citizens.

[j korzeniowski]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/media/photo/2008-01/34671192.jpg


that's when i reach for my revolver ...

seriously, looks like huberman is about to draw. he also looks like ben stiller. he also looks like he is pissed.

i am numb right now. i just can't fucking believe it.

[Mr Downtown]

What???? Where did this come from? Why give free rides to seniors, who are statistically one of the wealthiest age groups? Couldn't be because they are also most likely to vote, could it?

[ardecila]

Hold up.... why is this such a big deal?

All the legislature can do is pass feel-good bills like the "moment of silence" crap. This fits right in with that theme, and provides Blago with a way to politically save face while allowing the tax increases that CTA/Metra/Pace need.

I honestly can't see too much opposition in the legislature to providing free rides to seniors (who also vote, btw). It pulls more seniors off the roads, who are often accident-prone, especially when they have sight or hearing impairments. How many seniors take mass transit anyway? The revenue loss wouldn't be huge, right?

[ardecila]

that's when i reach for my revolver ...

seriously, looks like huberman is about to draw. he also looks like ben stiller. he also looks like he is pissed.

i am numb right now. i just can't fucking believe it.

Huberman might be simply tired and pissed at being photographed through a window like Britney Spears. He IS staring directly at the camera.

[aaron38]

I honestly can't see too much opposition in the legislature to providing free rides to seniors (who also vote, btw). It pulls more seniors off the roads, who are often accident-prone, especially when they have sight or hearing impairments. How many seniors take mass transit anyway? The revenue loss wouldn't be huge, right?

The only oppostion is in figuring out who gets stuck with the bill.
If the state wants to give free rides, fine. But pass the funding first, then go decide which other program to cut to get the funding.

Because Illinois isn't running a surplus, so the money has to come from somewhere.

[Chicago3rd]

Hah Hah...you all wanted him so bad in office. He and Stroger made me vote Republican for the first time and this is exactly why. The man is not in touch with reality! So I am pissed at him...but more pissed at all the voters who put the crook in office!

This is the FIRST we have heard of such a thing from Bagofshit.

[j korzeniowski]

Hold up.... why is this such a big deal?

All the legislature can do is pass feel-good bills like the "moment of silence" crap. This fits right in with that theme, and provides Blago with a way to politically save face while allowing the tax increases that CTA/Metra/Pace need.

I honestly can't see too much opposition in the legislature to providing free rides to seniors (who also vote, btw). It pulls more seniors off the roads, who are often accident-prone, especially when they have sight or hearing impairments. How many seniors take mass transit anyway? The revenue loss wouldn't be huge, right?

well, i am under the impression that this could still fail. the senate and house have to vote on this all over again, don't they? if they do, i am worried as hell that the senate will fall 1 vote shy again.

if there is no chance this fails, fine, let the seniors ride in the engineer's cabin for all i care. i just can't believe he doesn't sign it and alleviate millions of riders' (well, hundreds of thousands) worries and sign the damn thing.

[MayorOfChicago]

Huberman's kinda cute...


but anyway.


W. T. F.!?!?!?

You have GOT to be kidding me that our worthless gov. is throwing this random crap in at the last second. Why in gods name couldn't he have mentioned this 2 months ago. Is he just doing this on purpose now? Or is he really just an 11 year old boy who likes to get a rise out of people?

Who wants to grab some torches and drive down to Springfield with me.

[nomarandlee]

Anyone think Blago really doesn't want the transit thing sorted out? I mean is know he has strange ideas and has poor people skills but I can't think of a more irresponsible maneuver then changing the goal post at the 11th hour and making a new demand out of nowhere right when things become sorted. I don't have a problem with the demand itself but it should have been made weeks/months ago and is boderline criminal to raise at the 11th hour.

[spyguy]

Let's just hope the Feds get him before it's too late.

[honte]

^ Just what I was thinking. Can't we start the requisite gubernatorial indictment ceremony a few years early this time?

[Chicago3rd]

Everyone light a candle for Fitzgerald!

[the urban politician]

What???? Where did this come from? Why give free rides to seniors, who are statistically one of the wealthiest age groups?

^ What about seniors who ride the CTA? I don't tend to think of wealth when I see an 80 year old lady on a bus.

I'm optimistic. Even though Blago is being a twit right now, this law will serve me well about 34 (damn that number keeps getting smaller) years from now

[ardecila]

Roughly 75% of Chicagoans oppose free rides for seniors, according to a Tribune poll.

[Chicago3rd]

^ What about seniors who ride the CTA? I don't tend to think of wealth when I see an 80 year old lady on a bus.

I'm optimistic. Even though Blago is being a twit right now, this law will serve me well about 34 (damn that number keeps getting smaller) years from now

Guess you haven't live in Lakeview, Lincoln Park or Gold Coast...lol.

Why would you want to subsidize wealthy people? I stated the poor seniors...that is enough. And they needn't ride during rush hour free either.

[Chicago3rd]

Roughly 75% of Chicagoans oppose free rides for seniors, according to a Tribune poll.

I wish the Tribune would have asked a better question. Like was this the right time to interject this idea into the issue.....lol. Makes those of us who voted no on this poll look nasty.

[Abner]

Is there any transit system in America where seniors ride free? How would the CTA even implement such a harebrained policy?

[the urban politician]

Roughly 75% of Chicagoans oppose free rides for seniors, according to a Tribune poll.

^ No roughly 75% people who read the Tribune oppose free rides for seniors ;)

[the urban politician]

Is there any transit system in America where seniors ride free? How would the CTA even implement such a harebrained policy?

^ I guess I've foundly found a use for that fake white beard in my closet

[k1052]

I'm not sure if our political situation in this state would be called a comedy or a tragedy if it was made into a play.

Our governor is a sulking child and the legislature amounts to a pimp convention.

[VivaLFuego]

Couldn't be because they are also most likely to vote, could it?

Couldn't be. And we all know seniors can't afford the $1 fare they currently pay, and that if they didn't have the money those cruel bus drivers would surely throw them off the bus...

[VivaLFuego]

Is there any transit system in America where seniors ride free? How would the CTA even implement such a harebrained policy?

There is a "free ride" button on the fareboxes....and of course seniors would have to show some ID verifying that they are, in fact, older than dirt.

[the urban politician]

^ They should just brand all seniors' forearms. Then they can simply run their arms over barcodes to enter train platforms and buses

[honte]

Chicago should pass a rule to simply exterminate anyone who dares live here beyond age 65.

There, I improved the transit bill. Are we done yet?

[LaSalle.St.Station]

Damn that's a bit of fare box revenue the CTA has to write off from now on... good luck making the fare box recovery ratio now.

[Attrill]

... good luck making the fare box recovery ratio now.

That's a great point I hadn't thought of (not that I supported it anyways). Blago is truly an idiot.

[BVictor1]

If they are going to go this route, then I do believe that there should be a small fee. I believe the the tax rates that will go into effect will only cover operational cost. It woun't help purchase new equipment. If seniors are to ride the CTA, and the gov' want to make the burden less, seniors should pay a 1-time yearly fee of say $50 - $100 bucks, then this money could go to maintainence.

[Chicago Shawn]

Damn that's a bit of fare box revenue the CTA has to write off from now on... good luck making the fare box recovery ratio now.

Right, so how do we know the sales tax increase will even cover the projeced deficit now? The numbers need to be re-crunched. If he wants to propose such a thing then reaserch it first and provide the funds otherwise this shit starts all over agian the next time the opperating budget is calulated. BagAssoBitch, you Fucking Assclown.

[the urban politician]

^ Perhaps it has already been studied?

[MayorOfChicago]

Don't these people already get reduced fares!?!?!?

I don't think a LOT of seniors are pissing their pants over having to pay $35 a month for a transit pass, or .85 each ride........

I swear Blago is doing this on purpose, there's no other reason why he'd be doing this RIGHT NOW.

[MayorOfChicago]

I love this quote from the front page of the Sun Times today!


They listed out who we should blame, and this was one of them:

Many Downstate legislators: After Chicago legislators agreed to force Chicago-based ComEd's parent company Exelon to subsidize lower rates for Downstate Ameren's customers, many Downstate legislators showed their gratitude by refusing to support a mass transit proposal that is funded solely by the Chicago region yet funnels millions to Downstate mass transit districts. Some are professional Chicago haters, others wanted to force Speaker Madigan to agree to a statewide capital plan. Many simply can't understand the importance of public transit because they've never used public transit and don't know anyone who has.

[Attrill]

^ Perhaps it has already been studied?

Would you like to place a bet on that? What Blago has basically done is to scribble "old people no pay" in crayon at the bottom of the bill and called it an amendment.

I'm sure there are ways it could be done (i.e. money is set aside to a fund that reimburses CTA/PACE/Metra for each ride), but they haven't even done a serious study to see how much it will cost. This is not the sort of thing you spring as a surprise less than 2 weeks before a critical deadline.

[aaron38]

I'm not sure if our political situation in this state would be called a comedy or a tragedy if it was made into a play.

Definitely a greek tragedy.
Have you seen Avenue Q? We're the Schadenfreude for the rest of the country.
(German for 'Happiness at the misfortune of others')

[pip]

I love this quote from the front page of the Sun Times today!

Many Downstate legislators: After Chicago legislators agreed to force Chicago-based ComEd's parent company Exelon to subsidize lower rates for Downstate Ameren's customers, many Downstate legislators showed their gratitude by refusing to support a mass transit proposal that is funded solely by the Chicago region yet funnels millions to Downstate mass transit districts. Some are professional Chicago haters, others wanted to force Speaker Madigan to agree to a statewide capital plan. Many simply can't understand the importance of public transit because they've never used public transit and don't know anyone who has.

They listed out who we should blame, and this was one of them:

Unbelievable. What a bunch of loser freeloaders. And the irony is they are the conservative part of the state. You know the mantra of self sufficiency.

[Haworthia]

Definitely a greek tragedy.
Have you seen Avenue Q? We're the Schadenfreude for the rest of the country.
(German for 'Happiness at the misfortune of others')

I think the word we're looking for is travesty.

Personally, I'm opposed to the free ride plan. If the CTA is having funding issues, why propose a way to make the system less sustainable? I just think it's a way for Blag to score political points.

Have I mentioned that I hate our Governor?

So is Avenue Q that musical with the Rated R muppets?

[j korzeniowski]

Is there any transit system in America where seniors ride free? How would the CTA even implement such a harebrained policy?

i have read it would be first-in-the-nation. i assume that seniors would apply for, and receive, special chicago smart cards.

i still cannot believe that he brought that up now. why not mention it effing two days ago?! twat.

[VivaLFuego]

It's actually a pretty complicated proposal, but you wouldn't get that by listening to Blagojevich. By having seniors ride free, and costing CTA about $20 million a year (those seem to be the estimates floating around), that actually messes with the statutory recovery ratio of system-generated revenue, which means implementing such a thing would require either a fare increase or service reduction to maintain the recovery ratio, unless the RTA Act were amended to specifically allow free senior rides to be credited as system-generated revenue, or something of that sort. Of course, such legislative minutia is of no interest whatsoever to Rod, given that he keeps pulling all of this last minute shit out of his blagojevich.

[VivaLFuego]

Lost in all the hoopla, and seemingly receiving no coverage anywhere, there is a 2008 CMAQ grant to support weekend Yellow Line service. I'm not sure when this service would start, but it's pretty cool news, I think. It certainly will go a long way towards supporting Skokie's efforts in making their downtown (anchored by a new Oakton station) into a retail/recreational/employment destination.

A $303,000 grant will help the Chicago Transit Authority operate weekend service on the Yellow Line rail branch. The CTA will implement weekend service on the Yellow Line and operate from 6:00 a.m. to 10:00 p.m. on Saturdays and Sundays with a frequency of approximately every 12 to 20 minutes. The service would link Skokie, the Howard Red Line station and several CTA and Pace bus routes the serve regional employers with the rest of the CTA rail network.

Also of interest in CMAQ:
- $17 million towards renovation of Clark/Division subway station (CDOT project). This is (potentially) really great news, because the money previously set aside for Clark/Division was reapportioned to support the Grand/State rehab. For $17 million, I doubt the renovation will be spectacular (considering Grand is costing $60mil), but anything is better than its current state, which is arguably the worst and most disgusting in the system. Judging by the progamming of the funds, construction would occur sometime between 2009-2011. The previous number I had seen for this rehab was $33 million, so I wonder if the revised amount is basically just elevator installation, a fresh coat of paint, some spiffed up light fixtures, and new signage. Of course, this isn't the first time this station has appeared in the capital program, so until there's a contract award for reconstruction, I won't hold my breath.
- $7 million for the replacement of the 35th Street Pedestrian Bridge over LSD with a new bridge that is ADA-compliant and will accomodate bicycles; a CDOT project. I'm of mixed opinion on this, because the old bridge is kind of cool, if a bit dilapidated. I have no idea what the design of the new bridge will be.
- Several signal interconnect projects on major Chicago arterials (Cicero, Roosevelt, 79th), about $5-8 million each.
- About $1 million for "improvements" to the #47, #50, #52, #59, #73, and #152 bus routes. I don't know what these improvements are, but I would guess a combination of improved frequency and above all, expanded hours of operation (the #73 and #152 for example end mysteriously early in the evening).

[Chicago Shawn]

It's actually a pretty complicated proposal, but you wouldn't get that by listening to Blagojevich. By having seniors ride free, and costing CTA about $20 million a year (those seem to be the estimates floating around), that actually messes with the statutory recovery ratio of system-generated revenue, which means implementing such a thing would require either a fare increase or service reduction to maintain the recovery ratio, unless the RTA Act were amended to specifically allow free senior rides to be credited as system-generated revenue, or something of that sort. Of course, such legislative minutia is of no interest whatsoever to Rod, given that he keeps pulling all of this last minute shit out of his blagojevich.

It would be real nice if we could just bill medicare $0.85 for each ride and send the charges to Washington. Seems fair considering the feds axed the paratransit subsidy. Which actually brings up another question to mind, does the free rides idea include paratransit too? I know PACE took over that respsonsibilty, but the extra money needs to come from somwhere.

[Chicago Shawn]

Lost in all the hoopla, and seemingly receiving no coverage anywhere, there is a 2008 CMAQ grant to support weekend Yellow Line service. I'm not sure when this service would start, but it's pretty cool news, I think. It certainly will go a long way towards supporting Skokie's efforts in making their downtown (anchored by a new Oakton station) into a retail/recreational/employment destination.



Also of interest in CMAQ:
- $17 million towards renovation of Clark/Division subway station (CDOT project). This is (potentially) really great news, because the money previously set aside for Clark/Division was reapportioned to support the Grand/State rehab. For $17 million, I doubt the renovation will be spectacular (considering Grand is costing $60mil), but anything is better than its current state, which is arguably the worst and most disgusting in the system. Judging by the progamming of the funds, construction would occur sometime between 2009-2011. The previous number I had seen for this rehab was $33 million, so I wonder if the revised amount is basically just elevator installation, a fresh coat of paint, some spiffed up light fixtures, and new signage. Of course, this isn't the first time this station has appeared in the capital program, so until there's a contract award for reconstruction, I won't hold my breath.
- $7 million for the replacement of the 35th Street Pedestrian Bridge over LSD with a new bridge that is ADA-compliant and will accomodate bicycles; a CDOT project. I'm of mixed opinion on this, because the old bridge is kind of cool, if a bit dilapidated. I have no idea what the design of the new bridge will be.
- Several signal interconnect projects on major Chicago arterials (Cicero, Roosevelt, 79th), about $5-8 million each.
- About $1 million for "improvements" to the #47, #50, #52, #59, #73, and #152 bus routes. I don't know what these improvements are, but I would guess a combination of improved frequency and above all, expanded hours of operation (the #73 and #152 for example end mysteriously early in the evening).

Very cool news all around. The new bridge at 35th Street was designed by Teng and Associates, and is a pretty slick design.

[Mr Downtown]

does the free rides idea include paratransit too?

No, according to this morning's Tribune.

[Chicago3rd]

It's actually a pretty complicated proposal, but you wouldn't get that by listening to Blagojevich. By having seniors ride free, and costing CTA about $20 million a year (those seem to be the estimates floating around), that actually messes with the statutory recovery ratio of system-generated revenue, which means implementing such a thing would require either a fare increase or service reduction to maintain the recovery ratio, unless the RTA Act were amended to specifically allow free senior rides to be credited as system-generated revenue, or something of that sort. Of course, such legislative minutia is of no interest whatsoever to Rod, given that he keeps pulling all of this last minute shit out of his blagojevich.

Which means those of us who are paying more taxes for the CTA/RTA will have to pay more at the fare box to bring that ratio up. I tell you he came up with this plan yesterday morning when he was taking his morning crap.

[VivaLFuego]

Very cool news all around. The new bridge at 35th Street was designed by Teng and Associates, and is a pretty slick design.

These came up online, is this what you remember seeing?
http://www.architecture.org/drivesite/images/details/epstein/35-1lg.jpg
http://www.architecture.org/drivesite/images/details/epstein/35-2lg.jpg
If so I won't mourn the loss of the old bridge, but I'm skeptical this could be built for the $7 million appropriated by CMAQ, so presumably there would be other funds coming from somewhere.

[VivaLFuego]

Which means those of us who are paying more taxes for the CTA/RTA will have to pay more at the fare box to bring that ratio up. I tell you he came up with this plan yesterday morning when he was taking his morning crap.

Actually he claims he came up with it November:
http://thecapitolfaxblog.com/2008/01/11/quote-of-the-month

“I was reading a book not long ago about Ronald Reagan’s summit with Mikhail Gorbachev and how it began a whole process of nuclear arms reductions and it was a historic second term for president Reagan in reducing the nuclear arsenal between the Soviet Union and the United States ... So I thought about that and then I thought about real life circumstances, people who take public transportation, thought about my own background growing up with a mother who was a ticket agent for the CTA, thought about the story I just said about my dad when he was a senior citizen and envisioned the possibility that we could find ourselves where this was the only option I had as we approached the precipice of a scenario where there would be drastic service cuts and fare increases, and I thought why not then see what you can do, as I said, turn a lemon into lemonade and make it better, and the idea for seniors came up and that’s where it began and it’s been an idea that I’ve had since before Thanksgiving and one that we are really happy now to have a chance to be able to execute and implement.”


I'm reminded of a few months ago, when he compared himself to Roosevelt. Now he's Reagan, for insisting seniors get free transit rides.

[Pandemonious]

Springfield is fucking useless to those of us in Chicago.. perhaps its about time we look back to the ideas thrown around in 1925 and just go ahead and finally secede from the rest of this crappy state and start our own state of Chicago.. we even already have our own cool flag. Chicago is by far the econonomic engine of this state anyway, and we can just start buying our crops from other states too.

Something like 64 percent of Illinois businesses and 70 percent of Illinois employment are located in the Chicago area.

I have heard downstaters whine about having to redirect funds to Chicago, when those funds and more probably came from here anyway. They can go ahead and have the rest of the state, and Blahdickovich can run that into the ground for all I care.

[Nowhereman1280]

I don't think he was comparing himself to Regan, I think he was comparing himself to Gorbachev, fucking communist...

:yuck: :hell: :koko:

That's right, Blago is a commie...

I'll vote for secession in a heartbeat! The worthless bums in Springfield have never done us any good and they just take Chicago's wealth and waste it on building more highways for their SUV's!

[VivaLFuego]

It's (unfortunately) against the U.S. Constitution for a new state to secede from another, right? Meaning, a Chicago secession would require a constitutional amendment, not just a referendum.

[Chicago Shawn]

^^^Yes, that is the bridge.



It's (unfortunately) against the U.S. Constitution for a new state to secede from another, right? Meaning, a Chicago secession would require a constitutional amendment, not just a referendum.

Perhaps a President Obama could drum up some support for it? It would be a very mutual break away from the majority of the state population. I have family in rural Illinois and the Chicago hatred is strong among the rural folks, most of which is totally unjustified, but nonetheless.

Check me up as another supporter for the State of Chicago, I think we should ask NW Indiana to join us as well, seeing we are well interlinked and Indianapolis could give two shits about them.

[VivaLFuego]

Perhaps a President Obama could drum up some support for it? It would be a very mutual break away from the majority of the state population. I have family in rural Illinois and the Chicago hatred is strong among the rural folks, most of which is totally unjustified, but nonetheless.

Check me up as another supporter for the State of Chicago, I think we should ask NW Indiana to join us as well, seeing we are well interlinked and Indianapolis could give two shits about them.

Our gross regional product is what, like $450 billion? We'd be the 18th largest economy in the world, just behind Turkey (about half as much as India, South Korea, and Mexico), subtantially more than Switzerland, Sweden, and Taiwan....

[Rail Claimore]

It's (unfortunately) against the U.S. Constitution for a new state to secede from another, right? Meaning, a Chicago secession would require a constitutional amendment, not just a referendum.

No, it would simply require Congressional approval and the approval between the parties involved (Illinois and Chicago).

[honte]

^ Cool. Where do I sign?

I'm all for it, as long as the People's Democratic State of Chicago gets the biggest star on the US flag, and our state constitution guarantees free transit for seniors as long as this great country may live.

[Chicago3rd]

Can't we have the Constitutional Convention here in Illinois? It came up a few weekends ago in regards to being able to recall and petition amendments.

I am for all of that.

[spyguy]

http://www.pioneerlocal.com/skylinenews/news/733693,sl-gopsenate-011108-s1.article

GOP rookies set sights on Durbin

January 11, 2008
By JIM JAWORSKI

Andy Martin

...He supports a strong transportation system, specifically a high-speed rail system in Illinois.

"We need high-speed rail because it will tie this area together," he said. "That is why it is so distressing to see this nonsense going on in Springfield."

[Kngkyle]

Blago's Senior CTA Decision Is First Step In Plan

CHICAGO (CBS) ― After months of debate and disagreement, Illinois lawmakers have agreed on a way to fund public transportation. But Gov. Rod Blagojevich has thrown a wrench in those plans by agreeing to the bill, only if seniors ride for free. CBS 2's Dana Kozlov reports on more of Blagojevich's last minute decision.

Ideally, Gov. Rod Blagojevich says everyone should be able to ride public transportation for free. This is a first step that he defends taking and defends waiting until the last minute to do so.

Full article and video:
http://cbs2chicago.com/consumer/cta.funding.rod.2.628108.html


-----

Now I must say, making public transit free for all would be quite an awesome thing for the city. That is, of course, assuming the state actually funds the RTA the money they need to offer a decent service. A get-what-you-pay-for type deal would be horrible.

[ardecila]

If you think homeless, vandalism, and crime problems on the CTA are bad now, wait until CTA trains and buses become totally free and open.

[LaSalle.St.Station]

How quickly we forget our roots, Hog butcher, Cyrus McCormick, Grain Warehousing, Commodities trading..... We're all tied together... we advance together.







Springfield is fucking useless to those of us in Chicago.. perhaps its about time we look back to the ideas thrown around in 1925 and just go ahead and finally secede from the rest of this crappy state and start our own state of Chicago.. we even already have our own cool flag. Chicago is by far the econonomic engine of this state anyway, and we can just start buying our crops from other states too.

Something like 64 percent of Illinois businesses and 70 percent of Illinois employment are located in the Chicago area.

I have heard downstaters whine about having to redirect funds to Chicago, when those funds and more probably came from here anyway. They can go ahead and have the rest of the state, and Blahdickovich can run that into the ground for all I care.

[Nowhereman1280]

How quickly we forget our roots, Hog butcher, Cyrus McCormick, Grain Warehousing, Commodities trading..... We're all tied together... we advance together.

Are you referring to free rides or secession? Because in the case of the rest of the state, its more like "some of us drag the rest of us down and take our money"...

Chicago does not need the rest of the state, the rest of the state just harms us...

[LaSalle.St.Station]

I don't get the " they're holding us back " stuff. It's right out of the Jim Edgar play book of Illinois politics.... " us vs them" Chicago Metro has 3 major oil refineries but none are in the city, is the city self sufficient?, does it rely on other economies to sustain itself?, as do other parts of Illinois rely on the city? That's all i'm saying.

[Attrill]

How quickly we forget our roots, Hog butcher, Cyrus McCormick, Grain Warehousing, Commodities trading..... We're all tied together... we advance together.

Exactly. The old business model isn't there, but the marketing, advertising, accounting, legal, financial, technical, and other services that are supplied by the city proper both feed off of and drive the economies of rural and suburban areas.

It is in the commodity exchanges getting the money for crops grown and hogs processed downstate. It is in the marketing and advertising services provided to the superstore chains covering the state. It is in the architectural and engineering firms that design the processing plants, roads, and other large scale projects outside the city. It is in the software companies that build the custom software to map field harvests or sell industrial parts online.

All sorts of small and medium sized companies in the city limits sell services to suburban and downstate businesses, and those businesses wouldn't be viable without having access to those services.

[BVictor1]

If you think homeless, vandalism, and crime problems on the CTA are bad now, wait until CTA trains and buses become totally free and open.

Don't be ignorant.

It's time for the City of Chicago to get that casino. If it's going to cost $20 million a year to let seniors ride free, a city owned casino could plug that gap with revenue it takes in. And as you know from reading those articles, riding public transit would be free for seniors state wide. Blago is now thinking of future legislation to make public transit free for the disabled. Hell, if he's going this far, if we do get that casino, fares should be reduced to $1 for everyone else within 5 years of it opening.

Just my thoughts.

[BVictor1]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-transit_12jan12,0,7151508.story?coll=chi_tab01_layout

Free rides could raise fares

Cost estimate doubles for senior benefit

By Richard Wronski, Jon Hilkevitch and David Mendell, Tribune staff reporters Tribune staff reporter Jeffrey Meitrodt contributed to this report
6:20 AM CST, January 12, 2008

Transit officials acknowledged Friday that Gov. Rod Blagojevich's plan to give free rides to seniors would probably cost twice as much as originally estimated and require them to raise fares for other riders.

[BVictor1]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-metra_12_webjan12,0,588770.story?coll=chi_tab01_layout

Metra to keep 10% fare hike

No increases seen for 2009 or 2010

By Richard Wronski | Tribune staff reporter
12:56 PM CST, January 11, 2008

Metra riders will still face a 10 percent fare increase starting Feb. 1, despite Springfield's action to avert a transit "doomsday" by tentative approval of new mass transit legislation.

[the urban politician]

If you think homeless, vandalism, and crime problems on the CTA are bad now, wait until CTA trains and buses become totally free and open.

^ I couldn't disagree with you more. I actually think the exact opposite would happen.

I think making the CTA free is a great idea, if the State were actually willing to pay for it.

But they're clearly not, so I'm not sure why it's even being discussed

[Mr Downtown]

Every place (of any size) that free transit has been tried (remember Austin's grand experiment in the 80s?), the regular riders have begged to have fares reinstated, exactly because the buses became rolling homeless shelters and mental wards.

[bnk]

:previous:

I now have visions of older street people living on the El or bus now, esp in winter. You can't kick them of for the are the Blago chosen people.:(

Bad things man, bad things.

[Chicago3rd]

I went to the gov's page and wrote the following message in his propaganda "send a message to your legislators":

http://www.illinois.gov/gov/

Dear legislators,

Bagofwind is planning on stealing money from the poor families so that he can please the wealthy seniors. PLEASE call a Constitutional convention so we can get this "republican" out of office and get a decent Democrat in his place.

How dare he make himself not available to the public.

[Nowhereman1280]

I don't get the " they're holding us back " stuff. It's right out of the Jim Edgar play book of Illinois politics.... " us vs them" Chicago Metro has 3 major oil refineries but none are in the city, is the city self sufficient?, does it rely on other economies to sustain itself?, as do other parts of Illinois rely on the city? That's all i'm saying.

How do you not get it, this is what we are talking about right now, the dumbass SUV whores from the south fucking over OUR transit system because they want to get their greasy little hands on a few more freeways.

I'm not talking economics here, I'm talking how their politicians blatantly screw over Chicago over and over again. Obviously I'm not saying "lets sever economic ties with the downstaters" that's ridiculous, I'm saying lets split the government so those dumbasses can't pull tyranny of the majority on us anymore! Chicago, as a city state, would be sooooo much better off if we didn't have to pay 1.50 in taxes for every dollar we get back while the downstaters pay .75 in taxes for every dollar they get back...

[BorisMolotov]

The problems with this are, where do you draw the lines? And the rest of Illinois would shrivel up and die.

[Dr. Taco]

Don't be ignorant.

ardecila is right. And can you imagine how overcrowded everything would be? In order to cope with increased demand, they'd need to have more trains, and a bigger strain would be put on the system, resulting in even more needed money. we'd be going through this whole underfunded cta mess again in a short time.

If you go to a show and they're charging $7 bucks for a pint of miller lite, you reflexively complain about how much shitty beer costs, but imagine if the beer was priced at market value (or even grocery store value) and there were 4,000 people at the venue. Not only would there not be enough beer, everybody involved would lose (long lines, rowdiness, etc)

Prices are not for payment alone, but for containment as well

[VivaLFuego]

And can you imagine how overcrowded everything would be? In order to cope with increased demand, they'd need to have more trains, and a bigger strain would be put on the system, resulting in even more needed money. we'd be going through this whole underfunded cta mess again in a short time.


This is my biggest issue with free transit, too. The existing system is already at capacity coming in from the north side, so making transit free would not only mean making up for the portion of operations currently covered by fares (about $500 million per year) but also would require additional capital and operational funds to expand the system to meet that demand. I mean, I would love it if it happened, but we're probably talking something on the order of a $1.5bn+ tax increase. Feasible to us, perhaps, but politically impossible in this climate. Now, if the funds came through the federal government as part of an ultra-super-mega pollution and greenhouse gas mitigation program....

in re: it being a mobile homeless shelter, in theory you could use some of the resources formerly devoted to fare controls as security and enforce a policy of no "loitering" and no "sleeping" in transit vehicles and facilities, thus having the pretext to throw the bums off. The ACLU might go nuts, but we're getting ahead of ourselves in such discussions anyway...

[Dr. Taco]

^ I almost exclusively ride on the last car of the el when I ride, and more than a couple times I've gotten on the blue line after midnight and stepped into a car that reeked of pot smoke and booze, and homeless are sleeping interstitially. I mean, I didn't mind too terribly, but its a little depressing sitting in there with that happenin. I'd say devoting some money to train security for night hours would be a good application of funds. They can at least get the potsmokers off the train :rolleyes:

[LaSalle.St.Station]

How do you not get it, this is what we are talking about right now, the dumbass SUV whores from the south fucking over OUR transit system because they want to get their greasy little hands on a few more freeways.

I'm not talking economics here, I'm talking how their politicians blatantly screw over Chicago over and over again. Obviously I'm not saying "lets sever economic ties with the downstaters" that's ridiculous, I'm saying lets split the government so those dumbasses can't pull tyranny of the majority on us anymore! Chicago, as a city state, would be sooooo much better off if we didn't have to pay 1.50 in taxes for every dollar we get back while the downstaters pay .75 in taxes for every dollar they get back...

I think i get it, Illinois is a representative governed state. When the majority of people in Illinois live in Chicago I thing you'll ger your wish but the majority lives outside city limits and you just have to deal with the political consequences.

[Nowhereman1280]

I think i get it, Illinois is a representative governed state. When the majority of people in Illinois live in Chicago I thing you'll ger your wish but the majority lives outside city limits and you just have to deal with the political consequences.

Illinois may be a representative government, but our national philosophy is based on the belief that the majority has no right to do things to a minority group that harm the rights of a minority group. Also, we believe, that if a minority group is being oppressed they have the right to rebel against this oppression and do something about it, and honestly I'm starting to think the only rational solution to this problem is separation of the opposing parties.

Clearly holding our crucial transit funding hostage is clearly harmful to all of Chicagoland. Thus we, as a minority group within Illinois, have the right to take action to alleviate our situation.

[aaron38]

And can you imagine how overcrowded everything would be? In order to cope with increased demand, they'd need to have more trains

Yeah, free transit is great in principal, bad in reality. It's the same reason insurance companies have a doctor visit copay. It's to keep hypochondriacs from clogging the office, so that the doctor is available for those who really need her.
Can you immagine what the freeways would look like if the state was handing out free gasoline and free parking? It'd be mass gridlock.

If Blago wants to spend more money, he should leave the fares where they are, and fix and expand the system. The city needs the Circle Line and new stations more than it needs free rides.

[GregBear24]

I just don't understand why our politicians are so short-sighted. Nobody seems to understand that if you invest a lot in the cta in one chunk to make it better, faster, cleaner, etc... then more money can be made in the long run by attracting more businesses to the city, more tourists, more riders who already live here, and the domino effect can take place. The cta is so clearly what's holding our city back from being even more incredible than it already is. I mean, we have so much debt as it is already, so why not issue more bonds, borrow more and work with the feds to get some money for this. I don't think people outside of chicago realize how important this is to all people living and traveling in and around the chicago area. The relief of congestion is beneficial to everyone involved and the environment. Blago will be gone soon thank God, and hopefully someone like Obama can step in and use his influence in some way to set these fools in springfield straight.

[the urban politician]

I know that a lot of you here are really pissed off about Blago tampering with this legislation that has finally made it to his desk, and with plenty of good reason. But I've got to wonder if, unintentionally (I'm guessing), there might be a great blessing in disguise for Chicago area transit's future if Blago's amendment passes.

By providing free rides for the elderly, and with the elderly making up a huge voting block, transit may be seen more and more as a real public good, instead of some system for the inner city that needs bailing out every 3 years. Perhaps more and more elderly, in light of a lifetime of free rides, will use the CTA and rely on it than ever before, and thus will be a strong force behind maintaining high levels of service and, thus, push for adequate funding. Lets not forget that there has also been a huge boom of baby boomers moving back into the city as well as into those suburban TOD developments, all of who are getting close to that age 65 cutoff, and we've potentially got a good formula of conditions that may bode well for Chicago area transit for years to come.

[Busy Bee]

^interesting point. We'll see I suppose.

[ardecila]

I suppose it might stop some people from moving to Florida.

Every time I hear my parents complain about the weather in Chicagoland and wish they were in the South, I wonder why Chicagoland is so bad for seniors. My grandparents always did okay without moving to Florida.

[brian_b]

Don't be ignorant.

It's time for the City of Chicago to get that casino. If it's going to cost $20 million a year to let seniors ride free, a city owned casino could plug that gap with revenue it takes in. And as you know from reading those articles, riding public transit would be free for seniors state wide. Blago is now thinking of future legislation to make public transit free for the disabled. Hell, if he's going this far, if we do get that casino, fares should be reduced to $1 for everyone else within 5 years of it opening.

Just my thoughts.

Meh. Casino revenues are dropping, even in Atlantic City and Las Vegas. I'm not against having one, but there is no reason to overpay for the license. The legislature is out of their mind with what they want for it.

[Chicago3rd]

If you are furious about the transporation issue here in Illinois and other things check out this webpage.

http://impeachblago.com/index.html

[10023]

Every place (of any size) that free transit has been tried (remember Austin's grand experiment in the 80s?), the regular riders have begged to have fares reinstated, exactly because the buses became rolling homeless shelters and mental wards.

This is exactly right. Public transit should be affordable, not free.

Cities don't need free transit for seniors, or the disabled, and they certainly don't need free transit for everyone. They need quick, clean, efficient trains to bring people from outlying neighborhoods of the city to their downtown jobs, shopping and entertainment. Public transportation is necessary to continue the gentrification and revitalization of Chicago in particular. They should be using any excess revenue to improve the quality of service, rather than make the same bad service cheaper.

[10023]

The problems with this are, where do you draw the lines? And the rest of Illinois would shrivel up and die.

So?

[Vertigo]

One of the things that upsets me about this whole 'seniors ride free' sillyness is that in the end nothing is FREE. Someone always ends up paying for it. Politicians use these tactics though to show compassion and understanding towards people and unfortunately many people follow along. I've already heard several people say what a wonderful idea that this has been proposed.

I then respond 'Fine, do YOU want to pay more in taxes to subsidize this?'

This whole thing is especially ridiculous considering the amount of money that needs to be spent bringing the enitire system up to code so that seniors actually can use the service. Too many broken escalators, the entire Wabash leg of the loop needs to be rehabbed, dark dreary subway stations etc..

I'm not against the principle of seniors riding for free. I'm simply against this proposal at a time when so much more money is needed to modernize the current system.

[Busy Bee]

Too many broken escalators,...

Too FEW escalators to begin with. When I was in Paris for the first time a few months ago, almost all of their elevated stations have escalators—nice ones too.

[Nowhereman1280]

Too FEW escalators to begin with. When I was in Paris for the first time a few months ago, almost all of their elevated stations have escalators—nice ones too.

But do they have escalators like the one at North and Clybourn? I think not, that thing is fucking sweet, like 10 inches wide! Its skinny enough to force extremely overweight people to use the stairs!

[Busy Bee]

I encountered one that seemed to be about just under 2 feet wide. Thats true about North/Clybourn, fatties beware!

[Chicago3rd]

I encountered one that seemed to be about just under 2 feet wide. Thats true about North/Clybourn, fatties beware!

This fatty loves them because skinny asses cannot run past me on them.:D
(but I do stairs now so I don't get that joy any longer).

[Via Chicago]

Anyone happen to catch Chicago Tonight (well, tonight)? Dedicated the entire hour to the impending transit funding vote/crisis. Excellent piece. One of the points that stuck with me was how one of the guys talked about how London is pouring billions into expanding their transit, and how they view it as an investment. And yet we always look at it as a "subsidy".

I think this whole thing goes to show just how precarious Chicago's foothold is on the world stage. The last guy who they interviewed said it best: "Illinois without Chicago is Iowa."

[Busy Bee]

The new thread under this one notes Vancouver transit getting a $14B dollar investment. How frightening in comparison.

[VivaLFuego]

Right. Here, transit gets a "bailout" while new roads and interchanges are economic investment.

[jjk1103]

..........I know the transit funding agreement is paramount, but.........I just have a couple of unrelated transit questions.......what's new with the Grand Ave (Red) station re-hab ? ........what's new with the Super-station ? ....how is the Brown Line progressing ? ....any news there? ...any word on any progress on the Circle Line ? or Red line extension ? ........these issues may have been discussed recently, but I'm too lazy to pour through all the "transit funding crap" to look for it .......... :rolleyes:

[jephweiser]

..........I know the transit funding agreement is paramount, but.........I just have a couple of unrelated transit questions.......what's new with the Grand Ave (Red) station re-hab ? ........what's new with the Super-station ? ....how is the Brown Line progressing ? ....any news there? ...any word on any progress on the Circle Line ? or Red line extension ? ........these issues may have been discussed recently, but I'm too lazy to pour through all the "transit funding crap" to look for it .......... :rolleyes:

anyone?

[Taft]

Just when I think Blago can't be any dumber:

Blagojevich to skeptical seniors: 'Hold your nose and take a bus for free'

http://newsblogs.chicagotribune.com/clout_st/2008/01/blagojevich-to.html

Taft

[ardecila]

..........I know the transit funding agreement is paramount, but.........I just have a couple of unrelated transit questions.......what's new with the Grand Ave (Red) station re-hab ? ........what's new with the Super-station ? ....how is the Brown Line progressing ? ....any news there? ...any word on any progress on the Circle Line ? or Red line extension ? ........these issues may have been discussed recently, but I'm too lazy to pour through all the "transit funding crap" to look for it .......... :rolleyes:

Basic work for the Grand Avenue rehab has started. Go to CDOT's website to read more.

According to CTA's website, the Brown Line project is 65% done.

No word on Circle Line, Red Line extension, etc.

[jjk1103]

Basic work for the Grand Avenue rehab has started. Go to CDOT's website to read more.

According to CTA's website, the Brown Line project is 65% done.

No word on Circle Line, Red Line extension, etc.

........thank you !! :tup:

[j korzeniowski]

House passes mass-transit bill with free rides for seniors

Link, Chicago Tribune (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-legis_webjan18,0,6887104.story?coll=chi_breaking_500)

[pip]

!!


About damn time.