[Gallup]

I feel people ignore my posts on here....

Then speak up! Take your shirt off and yell: HEY, LOOK AT ME! And if that doesn’t work, go on one of the forum meetings that come up and jump them. That’s what I did, they never saw me coming. Don’t ask anyone about it though, I made them not remember anything:whip:

[texboy]

haha! I may heed your advice!

[ATXboom]

Ha... yes Texboy - I knew you were starting your internship there... so that pretty much sealed up the deal for me... but I was trying to add even more legitimacy. Consider the Austonian UP!

[Gallup]

Seriously, it’s not that they don’t listen, it’s that you have yet to prove yourself. There are some people who come on here and say this and that and we never hear from them again. On the other hand, there are people on here that have been around for a while and they say stuff and months later it comes true. We start to have a feel for these guys and enjoy reading their posts. I am not one of the latter people, I don’t even listen to what I have to say. This really is a great place to come in contact with those who are very in the know and work as developers/ city employees and local residents. It is also a fun place to see trolls lurking around, though Kevinfromtexas does a good job at keeping those guys in check. Again with the whip, :whip: oh yea, feel it, like it!

[AustinGuy]

trust me guys, the tower's a go...Im the intern on The Austonian.

congrats! any word on what % of units are presold over at the austonian?

[texboy]

I should find out tomorrow...I have the obligatory "first day" paper work to fill out and probably a tour of the job site...I plan on asking alot of questions!

[KevinFromTexas]

I plan on asking alot of questions!

Groovy. Find out how tall the cranes will be. I can't wait to see this beauty rise on the horizon from my neighborhood.

Just the other day I noticed 360 from the HEB parking lot at South First Street and William Cannon Drive. The building really stood out well there. It seemed like at least the top 150 feet or more of the building was visible. I couldn't believe it. The only other two buildings I've been able to see there are the Frost Bank Tower and One American Center. And the only reason I've been able to see One American Center is because after Frost Bank was built, I noticed the view. Before then I hadn't really ever paid attention to it because I figured there wasn't a view there. The crane for the building has been visible from that spot for a year though, but I was surprised to see the building sticking up that much. I'll have to get a picture of it.

[priller]

No no no, you're not being ignored, texboy. I am really looking forward to hearing about your experiences with the Austonian. I'm sure we all are.

[MichaelB]

I feel people ignore my posts on here....

Post well noted !!!!!! Welcome to Austin!!!!! Don;t worry.... we'll all be hiting you up for a tour!

[ATXboom]

http://www.statesman.com/news/content/news/stories/local/01/03/0103migration.html

Thursday, January 03, 2008

The boom is back: More migrating to region

In 2006, more people moved to Central Texas from elsewhere in the United States than in any year since the tech bust.

Net migration into Hays, Travis and Williamson counties exceeded the levels experienced in the height of the tech boom in 2000, according to an analysis of 2006 IRS tax data by the Capital Area Council of Governments.


Total California migration to Travis, Hays and Williamson counties

Houston, San Antonio and other Central Texas counties continued to be the top sources for new residents in all three counties, but the number of people moving from California has increased significantly.

About 2,700 more people moved here from California in 2006 than in 2005, driven largely by lower housing prices and job opportunities.

[ATXboom]

Thursday, January 3, 2008 - 2:24 PM CST

Need a job? Austin's got plenty, report saysAustin Business Journal

There's good news for those looking for work in Austin in 2008.

The Austin area ranked as one of the top metro areas in the nation when it came to online job advertisements in December, according to a report by The Conference Board.

Austin had 5.07 advertised vacancies per 100 people in the local labor force, just below Milwaukee, with 5.31 vacancies per 100 locals, and San Jose, with 5.30 online job ads per 100 people, according to the report.

Nationally, there were 2.3 advertised vacancies online for every 100 people in the work force in December, according to The Conference Board, a nonprofit research organization based in New York that tracks the postings on 1,200 Internet job boards.

Austin also had the highest number of advertised vacancies in relation to the number of unemployed of any metro area in the nation.

A total of 43,200 jobs were advertised on the Internet in December 2007, up 19.7 percent from 36,100 in December 2006. The national growth rate of online job postings was slower -- 6 percent -- during the same year-to-year period.

In Austin, the number of new ads was up 17.6 percent from 25,600 in December 2006.

The Conference Board generates a monthly report of help-wanted advertising in the nation's newspapers

[texboy]

Alright guys...as promised, a few tid bits on the Austonian from my first day on the internship...

There will be one tower crane....not sure the height, but I know it will be quite the beast taking up the entire length of the north part of the block pre assembly. It will be delivered next friday and set up on Saturday.

As far as sales of the condos go...not really sure I have permission to give out specific numbers, but I will say, the number wasn't what I was expecting, but not exactly sure if the number is on par with sales projections either so I will leave it at that.

The building will be going vertical within the next couple of weeks.

There is one level of below grade parking.

This next thing, y'all might not like.......so brace yourselves



At this point the crown will not be lit....and thats all I can say about that.


Really that is all of the major stuff that I know for now! I will be working in the off site office for the construction company in downtown most of the time, but will have to make frequent trips to the site to update plans, take pictures for the construction company etc.

Ill keep y'all updated with whatever I can in the coming months

[JAM]

At this point the crown will not be lit....and thats all I can say about that.


Interesting. I guess it is an extra expense which the owners would have to pay.

[shanny]

i have a feeling that will change. texboy, did you ask them about a webcam? if not suggest one!

[texboy]

too be honest shanny...it doesn't sound promising, it didn't sound like it was a big deal to the developer.

[Saddle Man]

Well that's going to suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck!

[Strayone]

^ Yeah no web cam will ... suck, but within a 6-8 months we will be able to see The Austonian from most parts of Austin proper, so we can rely on the pics posted here until it peaks over the tree line of our neighborhoods. Egad Priller those fabricated views are awesome!

[KevinFromTexas]

This will be an easy building to photograph though. Auditorium Shores, Town Lake Park, Congress and South First.

Bummer about the crown being dark. I sure hope they change their mind about that. Our skyline is boring at night. More lighting please!

[DanE008]

^^ No joke on the lighting, I really wish one of these projects would be more adventurous with their lighting scheme. Oh well I guess that's more of an office building thing.
Tom Stacy??

[Saddle Man]

The 'suuuuuuuuuck' was for the no top lighting. I'm not so concerned about a web cam.

[ATXboom]

Thanks Texboy,

Can you inquire if the developer has future plans for a 2nd tower on the adjacent property?

I remember hearing something along those lines... Like 5 years out or so.

[MichaelB]

The 'suuuuuuuuuck' was for the no top lighting. I'm not so concerned about a web cam.

Oooooo, agreed. It looks totally designed to light up. Hum. Light the Bitch!

And thanks for the info Texboy!

[Blakesalot!]

I guess that email I got from the Austonian sales office about there being two tower cranes was wrong. Sorry about the bad info.

I guess one is good enough, though. :)

[Saddle Man]

FYI I just went by 21C sale office. The doors are still locked, and now there are boxes (some taped up and one open) by the front door. I'm not saying anything about 21C. I'm just passing along what I saw, so don't jump me about it. Take it however yall wish.

[GoldenBoot]

And this does not include the budget terminal and the future, 21-gate south terminal. Way, way down the road, plans could call for two mid-field concourses. Each capable of being expanded to 20+ gates.


THE NEAL SPELCE AUSTIN LETTER
Volume 29, Number 38
Friday, January 4, 2008

For the first time since the new Austin-Bergstrom International Airport (ABIA) opened for passengers 5/23/99, a major terminal expansion will begin in 2008.

Coming off a year when a record number of passengers crammed into ABIA, look for airport officials to seek permission from the Austin City Council in February to add from 6 to 9 gates to the existing 25 gates at the Barbara Jordan Terminal…

[Jdawgboy]

They better light that crown. They have been advertising it with night renderings as lit up so that would be a bad move on their part if they don't light the crown.

[ATXboom]

http://www.austintowers.net/Austin_Downtown/index.html

Welcome to Austin: The New Migration Boom
January 03, 2008 21:46 Filed in: Market Analysis

The more people that come to Austin, the stronger the downtown condo market. As Austin grows and expands, the value of central living only goes up. As one of the fastest growing cities in the country, this trend is one of the positive factors supporting long-term growth of the downtown population.

Today's news is good news for downtown residents and bad news for anyone that sits in Austin traffic: new statistics from the census bureau show a dramatic acceleration in migration into Travis county and the rest of the Austin metropolitan area. The latest statistics, covering the full year 2006 (Thanks Census Bureau for the quick turn around!), show that a net 9,405 migrated into Travis county in 2006. This tops the tech boom record of 8,575 set in 2000 and represents a strong turn-around from 2002, 2003, and 2004 when the county experienced a net outbound migration.

Here are the migration statistics from 2000 - 2006:

2000 | +8,575
2001 | +4,867
2002 | -11,402
2003 | -7,152
2004 | -1,787
2005 | +1,602
2006 | +9,405

In addition, total migration into central Texas from California more than doubled over the last two years. Californians represent a major portion of new Austin residents, many of whom come with large amounts of home equity. AustinTower's own survey and readership statistics show that Californians are the most active out-of-state shoppers for downtown Austin condos -- followed by residents of New York, Florida, and Illinois.

[AustinBob]

I know this falls squarely into the category of wishful thinking, but I've wondered all along if they plan to announce something more imaginative for the crown. The Austonian is an overall attractive building and I've never thought that the boring, generic crown really made sense, even when it was going to be lighted.

[KevinFromTexas]

I'd like to see more lighting on our skyline. We have too many buildings that are either completely dark at night (Bank of America, 301 Congress), or else ones that don't have very decorative lighting. 300 West Sixth was a disappointment. Early on I remember they had lit the barrel vaulted roof with lights up the north and south sides of them. They also had the "ring lights" where they have them now. It looked much better. Then they later turned those off. The lighting on the building looks incomplete. It's like some lights are burned out. Boring.

I don't expect many of the residential towers to have flood lights lighting up the sides of the towers. I doubt they will since that would be unpleasant to the residents. But as for the crowns, they had better turn on the lights! It would seriously suck to have all these new great buildings only to have them be dark at night.

Another thing that is disappointing is the lack of holiday lights on our skyline. Many cities do this, but over the last few years none (or few) of the buildings have had holiday lights.

I feel like lights on our skyline is important to making it feel like a neighborhood. Just one more thing to give it a familiar feel.

[JAM]

Ever walk by 100 Congress at night? Don't you love getting blinded by the ground lights :)

I think lighting it up would be cool too, and love seeing it done. Adds drama to our nighttime skyline. Its fine and dandy to for us to want these residential towers to have lighting, but don't forget someone has to pay for the energy. Energy costs are usually the 2nd highest expense line item in running a condo and increase HOA fees. It's also an expense to add the lights and also to pay someone to go out and change bulbs. And the Home Owners Assoc could vote to turn them off at anytime to cut HOA fees. Maybe the builder will make provisions for the lighting, but expect the HOA to pay for install once they take possession of the building. Of course, that would cost the builder $ too.

[MichaelB]

FYI I just went by 21C sale office. The doors are still locked, and now there are boxes (some taped up and one open) by the front door. I'm not saying anything about 21C. I'm just passing along what I saw, so don't jump me about it. Take it however yall wish.

OK.... so I walked past the 21C office today and, being ever the snoop, I caught a guy who works there coming out of the door. I asked him if the property was a "go".... made up a story about bringing someone by to look at the property, etc..... he said it was and they were just doing viewings by appointment. Sooooooo..... maybe a ruse? Seemed matter of fact about it. We'll see.... hope it flys.

[texboy]

I have full access to the plans for the Austonian...the only lighting planned on the crown is the red airtraffic lights on the very top...this is as of right now.

by the way...official height for the Austonian (Kevin) 662'8"....just fyi

[KevinFromTexas]

Would they really charge the residents for lighting the building? I understand it's a cost just like everything else that is ultimately paid for by the residents, but lighting the building is sort of an advertisement for the building.

I do worry that the green building and energy consciousness will make builders decide to cut out the lights to make them more energy efficient. Surely there are ways of getting around that by having lights that use low energy, but still do their job in creating a nice lighting design.

[KevinFromTexas]

I have full access to the plans for the Austonian...the only lighting planned on the crown is the red airtraffic lights on the very top...this is as of right now.

by the way...official height for the Austonian (Kevin) 662'8"....just fyi

What?! They had told me 683 feet. I exchanged emails with David Mahn himself (VP of Benchmark). Are you sure that height isn't to the point below the mechanical penthouse? It doesn't make sense that the height would change like that. Is it still 56 floors?

Can you please find all the heights for the building? Any of the heights in the upper reaches of the building. Top floor, height below the mechanical penthouse and height to the penthouse? Also I'd like to know what the podium height will be along Congress & 2nd.

[texboy]

Well with the recent energy Bill passed in congress, Im not surprised they aren't planning on lighting the crown. I mean for pete's sake...by the year 2014...incandescant light bulbs will now be BANNED in the US....you know, I'm all for energy conservation, but taking away the choice of lightbulbs from people is just absurd....there are other ways to help the environment besides taking away the publics right to choose...I HATE florescent lighting...and now looks like if I don't stock up on incandescants, I will forever have to live in ugly white light....BLAH! ...sorry rant over.

[texboy]

Ill check again on Monday, but Im pretty sure thats what the plans said...and that was the above grade height...but again Ill check on Monday...It very well could have been the small print playing tricks on me. It is definitly still 56 main floors and 60 if you are counting the mech. penthouse, sloshtank etc...

[JAM]

Would they really charge the residents for lighting the building? I understand it's a cost just like everything else that is ultimately paid for by the residents, but lighting the building is sort of an advertisement for the building.

I do worry that the green building and energy consciousness will make builders decide to cut out the lights to make them more energy efficient. Surely there are ways of getting around that by having lights that use low energy, but still do their job in creating a nice lighting design.

Yes, all common areas including taxes, garbage, utilities, repairs ares split between tenants, usually based on square footage.

I don't know much about them, but LED lighting seems to be promising for low energy applications.

ICK - no incandescents by 2014? What about Halogen?

[texboy]

not sure...let me see if I can't find the article I read the other night....

[Strayone]

Any business spends some amt of $ for signage/lighting which indeed is meant to catch the eyes of the customer. So it should seem to go with a residential building of the magnitude of The Austonian. At the very least it ought to have some minimal crown lighting if not for the earlier overnight hours. But for the most part it would be considered ornamental in a management company's mind. At least the building will have a striking array of lights at night while the residents are entertaining their guests.:whip:

[KevinFromTexas]

Ill check again on Monday, but Im pretty sure thats what the plans said...and that was the above grade height...but again Ill check on Monday...It very well could have been the small print playing tricks on me. It is definitly still 56 main floors and 60 if you are counting the mech. penthouse, sloshtank etc...

Thanks. Please do look up all the heights listed at the top of the building and the podium. I was relying on the original heights to do my model of the building, plus for accuracy at Emporis and of course so we'd know here on the forum.

As for lighting issues with efficiency. The Tower of the Americas down in San Antonio went through a renovation project that wrapped up earlier last year. They replaced the old lights with LED bulbs. The tower looks beautiful, I think this is the best it's ever looked.

Here's an article on the new lights on the tower.
http://www.pr.com/press-release/28815

And here's what it looks like:

The "ring lights" around the top and bottom. Even those red lights above the observation deck are LED lights.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2214/2128568872_64cf229cb1_o.jpg

The article above mentioned that they can change the colors automatically using computer programs. The red and green lights faded in and out.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2370/2128568906_cc0f70e074_o.jpg

The bottom of the top house.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2306/2128569104_b16f2a5bec_o.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2309/2128584942_516d8bf467_o.jpg

I'm not sure if the shaft of the tower is lit using LED's. But I did notice that the hue seems to be different than what it used to, which makes me think they are LED lights. It certainly does look different and better.

[Dragonfire]

Wow, no lighting for the crown? That's ridiculous, considering most of the renderings for the Austonian show some sort of lighting for the crown. And I agree that we need more nightlighting for Austin, as really the only noticeable lighting comes from the UT Tower, the Capitol, and the Frost Bank Tower.

[actham]

Speaking of lighting...does anybody know what the two "cages" on the top of each end of Amli II are for? I seem to remember someone saying they were for lighting.

[Saddle Man]

LED's would help on the electric bills.

[MichaelB]

Yes, all common areas including taxes, garbage, utilities, repairs ares split between tenants, usually based on square footage.

I don't know much about them, but LED lighting seems to be promising for low energy applications.

ICK - no incandescents by 2014? What about Halogen?

Yep.... The cost of lighting the building would indeed be split by all the tenants. I am very dissapointed it will not be lit. But at somepoint someone had to start considering how high those Codo Assoc. fees would be. I believe that building fess are already in the mid 60's (65cents/sf...ish)...or is that the W? Anyway, does anyone know for sure? Texboy? So, maybe that is why.... but I wonder what the cost of lighting a crown would be split between 56 floors of residents and businesses?

OK.... just to be absurd... if we can give tax breaks to the G*d D*mn Domain... can we give a tax breaks to have a better skyline at night?

[shanny]

absolutely....let the city cover the cost of lighting the crown :tup:

[MichaelB]

Speaking of lighting...does anybody know what the two "cages" on the top of each end of Amli II are for? I seem to remember someone saying they were for lighting.

On the forum walk we all speculated. I think they are for lighting. At one point "they" were experimenting with a traslucent material on them (similar to what is on the side of the garge). Best I know. I looked again today... they are still the same.

As a side note: Was anyone walking downtown a few weeks ago when we had those crazy winds? It was bet Xmas and New Year. I was by 36o and the whole building was whistling ... is was sooooo eerie! There was no one around and it was loud! I take it the sound was from the wind on all the plasitic on the balconies and the walls.... but it was really loud.... and CRAZY!

[texboy]

Honestly I don't know what y'all are complaining about when it comes to lighting on the buildings....what about Frost Bank...One Amercican....the two buildings bordering congress on the lake...etc...ALOT of cities would die to have some of the buildings that Austin has (ie San Antonio, Elpaso, Houston?, etc) Everytime I have driven down Congress at night, it takes my breath away at how beautiful that view is driving towards the capitol...its absolutely one of a kind!

[MichaelB]

Honestly I don't know what y'all are complaining about when it comes to lighting on the buildings....what about Frost Bank...One Amercican....the two buildings bordering congress on the lake...etc...ALOT of cities would die to have some of the buildings that Austin has (ie San Antonio, Elpaso, Houston?, etc) Everytime I have driven down Congress at night, it takes my breath away at how beautiful that view is driving towards the capitol...its absolutely one of a kind!

I'll admit I am Just being gluttonous! I want more!!!! No really... the Austonian will be soo much taller than everyting else here... it will be a beacon. If it was another 30story building I would not be as disappointed. Plus... architecturally... it was designed to be lit....at least so says the renderings.... Wondering if it will just look like the lights are off.

[priller]

This is a portion of the plans filed with the city, which I grabbed from the city's web site.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2006/2169280965_aafc380e40_o.jpg

As you can see, it has the top listed as 682' 11". Texboy, do the plans now have that different?

About the lighting, I looked at the renders again and I was wondering if the top is supposed to be lit from the inside? There will be a health club on the top floor, I believe. Is the top portion supposed to be like a big open area, like an atrium? Any light you can shed on this (pun intended!) will be most helpful, texboy.

[texboy]

ok yea those are the prelim plans that I was actually looking at in the office...that 82 looked like a 62 to me...I prob should get my eyes checked! haha

[texboy]

from what I can remember from the plans the top portion is either a mechanical room or a slosh tank....there is actually about 4 floors above the 56th floor dedicated to mechanical and such...the top floor (on the lighting plan mind you) had no indication of any wiring or places for lighting....the top is basically flat so it would have been easy for me to spot any kind of heavy duty lighting.

[priller]

Thanks for the info texboy. This is great having someone on the inside! I suppose we should try not to inundate you with too many questions. That will get old for you really fast.

[texboy]

Haha no prob...I like being able to contribute on here something more than opinions! lol

[WallerCreekView]

I believe that building fess are already in the mid 60's (65cents/sf...ish)...or is that the W? Anyway, does anyone know for sure?

HOA for the Austonian shows as 64 cents/sq. ft. here:

http://austin.bizjournals.com/austin/stories/2007/12/10/story4.html

The W and the Four Season Residences both are listed as 61 cents/sq. ft. here (although these numbers may have changed since September):

http://www.austintowers.net/Austin_Downtown/files/tag-w-hotel-0026-residences.html

I thought I recalled one of these three being listed as 67 cents when I took the Downtown Living Tour a few months back, but I'm not positive. I'll post an update if I ever locate my notes.

[MichaelB]

Haha no prob...I like being able to contribute on here something more than opinions! lol

Yes, indeed, it is great having the info.... thank you!

[MichaelB]

HOA for the Austonian shows as 64 cents/sq. ft. here:

http://austin.bizjournals.com/austin/stories/2007/12/10/story4.html

The W and the Four Season Residences both are listed as 61 cents/sq. ft. here (although these numbers may have changed since September):

http://www.austintowers.net/Austin_Downtown/files/tag-w-hotel-0026-residences.html

I thought I recalled one of these three being listed as 67 cents when I took the Downtown Living Tour a few months back, but I'm not positive. I'll post an update if I ever locate my notes.

Thanks. I know where I live is .48 and that adds up quick!

[KevinFromTexas]

This is a portion of the plans filed with the city, which I grabbed from the city's web site.

priller, do you have a link to that info? How do you access it? If I recall, you have to enter in some corresponding permit number or something. ??

ok yea those are the prelim plans that I was actually looking at in the office...that 82 looked like a 62 to me...I prob should get my eyes checked! haha

Thanks a bunch for the clear up. Even if it had been shorter I would have wanted to know for sure the heights. I hate having any doubts about building heights.

[priller]

Kevin, first go to: http://coagis1.ci.austin.tx.us/website/COAViewer_dev/devviewer_disclaimer.htm

I use the "standard" viewer instead of the java one. Zoom in on downtown until you get pretty close in to the block you want. Then click on the box next to "Site Plan Review Cases", the press the "Refresh Map" button at the top. That will show you the case numbers. For the Austonian, for example, the number is SP-06-0583C.

Once you have the number, go to: https://www.ci.austin.tx.us/devreview/a_queryfolder_permits.jsp

In the middle of the page there is a section to "Search by Case Number". Enter in the number there and click submit. Then at that point just go exploring. Happy hunting!

[ivanwolf]

FYI,
priller and kevin, anyone else
my previous post for more info http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showpost.php?p=2889440&postcount=949

site plan numbers for the following projects
360: SP-05-1468C
Altivida: SP-05-1177C
AMLI II: SP-05-1399C
AMLI Riverside: DA-2007-0670
Aquaterra: SP-00-2599C
Austonian: SP-06-0583C
7Rio: SP-2007-0255C
Crescent Machinery: SP-05-1438C
222 & 300 Riverside: SP-06-0716C.SH
Legacy: SP-06-0605C
Monarch: SP-03-0021C
Ovation: SP-2007-0266C
Presidio at Judges Hill: SP-06-0310C
Rainy & Davis: SP-07-0123C
Red River Flats: SP-05-1224C
Shore & Hotel base: SP-05-1575C
Skyline:SP-05-1407C
Spring: SP-06-0519C
Star Riverside: SP-06-0240C
Super Coop College Houses: SP-07-0060C.SH
W Hotel/Condos: SP-2007-0371C
Zilker Park Lofts: SP-2007-0412C

Hope this helps.
Sometimes these can be difficult to find unless you know the exact address or know what they (developers) called it before naming them. But these are the ones i have found or spent time looking for.

[priller]

Thanks, ivanwolf, I think you were the one who showed me how to do this in the first place.

[KevinFromTexas]

Is there a quicker way to find the elevations? Once you enter in the number there's such a long list of things to go through. How do you know which one shows the building elevations?

[priller]

Yeah, Kevin, there is a lot of stuff to go through there. All the water drainage and traffic control and all that stuff. If you look at the first page of the site plan there will be a table of contents, that should tell you which page is the elevation. Then you can go directly to that page.

For example, I was looking up the info for 21 Rio this weekend, after MichaelB reported the crane had gone up for it. I found its case number (SP-2007-0378C.SH), then looked that up. That took me to the PERMIT/CASES list. I clicked on the one that ends with "SP", which is where all the site plan data is located. Scrolled down to the bottom of that page to the list of "FOLDER ATTACHMENTS". The first page of the actual engineering plan is the file named "SPL-SP-2007-0378C.SH_0~001". I clicked on that to download the image. At the top right corner on that image was an "Index of sheets". I looked there and saw that sheet 14 was listed as "BUILDING ELEVATIONS". I went back to list of attachments and clicked on "SPL-SP-2007-0378C.SH_0~014", which is the image file for page 14. And -- finally -- that showed the elevation.

There I saw it listed the top height as 335' 6", which seemed kind of high to me, but then I noted it had the ground starting at 100', so the actual building height wil be 235' 6". I don't know why they do that, but many of the plans I've looked up do the starting at 100' thing.

[southsideatx04]

Sorry I'm behind, so 21c is a go for sure. I read somewhere on the forum that the office is closed and the boxes inside are packed up. I'm sure I'm wrong but it caught my eye. Is there anybody that can clear it up?

[Saddle Man]

I said the door is still locked (during the day on weekdays and the weekend), and that there were boxes in the office by the doors. Most of the boxes were taped up with one open. All the stuff in the office is where it's always been. Nothing (as of when I saw the boxes last week) seems to ever move in there. I didn't say to was a go or a no-go, because I don't know.

I do know that there were utility workers all over the blocks around where 21C is supposed to go this last Friday. They blocked off all the meters. A friend (who is a member of DANA) was saying that this was part of some prep work for 21C. I certainly hope so, because I really want this building to go up. It's a good one.

[southsideatx04]

Thanks for the clarification. I really like this building hate to see the economic turmoil affect our downtown boom.

[Kevinb]

MGIC is a pretty good source for metro by metro economic outlooks.

Metros summary:

http://www.mgic.com/pdfs/mt_summary.pdf

Austin :cheers: :

http://www.mgic.com/pdfs/mt_austin_tx.pdf

Nation :yuck: :

http://www.mgic.com/pdfs/mt_national_overview.pdf

[arbeiter]

Wow, looking at that, Austin is a diamond in the rough. If the downturn/recession is small, Austin will emerge unscathed. If it's moderate to severe, Austin will be affected, only a few quarters after everyone else. (This is how it always used to be - Austin would decline later on, for longer periods of time, and take longer to recover.)

[priller]

Walked by 21C after lunch today. Looked the same as always to me -- empty except for bored leggy model-like receptionist. I suppose I should go in there sometime, just to give them something to do.

The main thing I've noticed is that if you didn't already know 21C was a condo sales office, I don't think you would know what that office was for. My first guess would be art gallery or interior design. They really need a building model.

[MichaelB]

Sorry I'm behind, so 21c is a go for sure. I read somewhere on the forum that the office is closed and the boxes inside are packed up. I'm sure I'm wrong but it caught my eye. Is there anybody that can clear it up?

I caught some one in the office last week.... they said it was a go and the office is only open by appointment.

OK... so I just wrote one of the folks in the development area I met at 21c Loiusville..... I will let you know what I find out.

M

[JAM]

If it's moderate to severe, Austin will be affected, only a few quarters after everyone else. (This is how it always used to be - Austin would decline later on, for longer periods of time, and take longer to recover.)

That was certainly our observation last recession. We opened for business here here in 2003 and Austin was in doldrums both in jobs and housing while other big cities in TX and elsewhere were seeing a recovery. Back in 2003, we had tons of people, some with master degrees coming to us for a retail positions that they were clearly over qualified. I felt so bad for many of them and wanted to hire them all. We are hiring again, and now can't hardly get a resume, let alone a qualified person.

However, as far as the downturn, I think Austin got hit at the same time as everyone else because job creation here is so tech heavy. I don't know about other fields, but I do know hi-tech, which was my past life for over 20 years, or at least, I am attempting to make it my past :) It seems the tech job market in Austin is just now starting to really take off, similar to what was seen in Dallas and Houston a few years back. I sometimes suspect it is because California filled its offices with projects 1st, and once they were full, they started filling other areas, such as Austin.

Ironically, it seems Austin tech job growth is just starting to really boom just before the next recession. It is still no where close to 1999/2000 levels. Back then my phone was ringing off the hook all day long and I could name my price. Certainly not the same today.

[KevinFromTexas]

Yeah, Kevin, there is a lot of stuff to go through there. All the water drainage and traffic control and all that stuff. If you look at the first page of the site plan there will be a table of contents, that should tell you which page is the elevation. Then you can go directly to that page.

For example, I was looking up the info for 21 Rio this weekend, after MichaelB reported the crane had gone up for it. I found its case number (SP-2007-0378C.SH), then looked that up. That took me to the PERMIT/CASES list. I clicked on the one that ends with "SP", which is where all the site plan data is located. Scrolled down to the bottom of that page to the list of "FOLDER ATTACHMENTS". The first page of the actual engineering plan is the file named "SPL-SP-2007-0378C.SH_0~001". I clicked on that to download the image. At the top right corner on that image was an "Index of sheets". I looked there and saw that sheet 14 was listed as "BUILDING ELEVATIONS". I went back to list of attachments and clicked on "SPL-SP-2007-0378C.SH_0~014", which is the image file for page 14. And -- finally -- that showed the elevation.

There I saw it listed the top height as 335' 6", which seemed kind of high to me, but then I noted it had the ground starting at 100', so the actual building height wil be 235' 6". I don't know why they do that, but many of the plans I've looked up do the starting at 100' thing.

Thanks. I'll take a look. And yes, that 235 foot height seems much more accurate. The old height the papers were quoting said 220 feet, which I never thought was right. From the rendering I counted 21 floors, plus they were calling it a "21-story tower".

[arbeiter]

That was certainly our observation last recession. We opened for business here here in 2003 and Austin was in doldrums both in jobs and housing while other big cities in TX and elsewhere were seeing a recovery. Back in 2003, we had tons of people, some with master degrees coming to us for a retail positions that they were clearly over qualified. I felt so bad for many of them and wanted to hire them all. We are hiring again, and now can't hardly get a resume, let alone a qualified person.

However, as far as the downturn, I think Austin got hit at the same time as everyone else because job creation here is so tech heavy. I don't know about other fields, but I do know hi-tech, which was my past life for over 20 years, or at least, I am attempting to make it my past :) It seems the tech job market in Austin is just now starting to really take off, similar to what was seen in Dallas and Houston a few years back. I sometimes suspect it is because California filled its offices with projects 1st, and once they were full, they started filling other areas, such as Austin.

Ironically, it seems Austin tech job growth is just starting to really boom just before the next recession. It is still no where close to 1999/2000 levels. Back then my phone was ringing off the hook all day long and I could name my price. Certainly not the same today.

What business are you in?

I am still teetering on whether to come back to Austin to do some temporary work and take advantage of this.

[texboy]

Kevin....Its 93' to the pool/recreation level on The Austonian...

[KevinFromTexas]

Kevin....Its 93' to the pool/recreation level on The Austonian...

Thanks!

[AustinGuy]

Seems as if the current economic weakness is centered in states outside of Texas (California, Florida, Arizona, Nevada). So far, things are holding up pretty well here, although the housing inventory in the burbs is starting to pile up a bit.

I'm curious how much of a benefit Texas gets from the high oil prices. It could buffer us somewhat if there is another recession vs the last tech led one where oil prices were super low.

[JAM]

Seems as if the current economic weakness is centered in states outside of Texas (California, Florida, Arizona, Nevada). So far, things are holding up pretty well here, although the housing inventory in the burbs is starting to pile up a bit.

I'm curious how much of a benefit Texas gets from the high oil prices. It could buffer us somewhat if there is another recession vs the last tech led one where oil prices were super low.

Oil sure seemed to help Houston last round. I was between Austin, Dallas and Houston at that time, mostly Dallas and Houston. Houston seemed to go unscathed compared to Dallas and Austin, who both were slammed by the tech bust. High oil prices should help even more this round, but I'm not sure how much Dallas, Austin and SA benefit from it. I've noticed a few energy exploration related companies in Austin, but not many. I should add, that during the last recession, you sure could tell it was going on in Houston. When you would go out to a restaurant, it didn't have the same buzz like 1999. It felt like everyone was holding their breath, hoping it didn't hit home.

[KevinFromTexas]

A few shots from I-35 on Sunday of Legacy @ Town Lake.

I had the white balance set wrong, so they came out a bit dark.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b234/KevinFromTexas/Austin%20pics/P1160392EDIT.jpg

You can see the silhouette through the trees.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b234/KevinFromTexas/Austin%20pics/P1160393EDIT.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b234/KevinFromTexas/Austin%20pics/P1160394EDIT.jpg

[DTAustin]

That was certainly our observation last recession. We opened for business here here in 2003 and Austin was in doldrums both in jobs and housing while other big cities in TX and elsewhere were seeing a recovery. Back in 2003, we had tons of people, some with master degrees coming to us for a retail positions that they were clearly over qualified. I felt so bad for many of them and wanted to hire them all. We are hiring again, and now can't hardly get a resume, let alone a qualified person.

However, as far as the downturn, I think Austin got hit at the same time as everyone else because job creation here is so tech heavy. I don't know about other fields, but I do know hi-tech, which was my past life for over 20 years, or at least, I am attempting to make it my past :) It seems the tech job market in Austin is just now starting to really take off, similar to what was seen in Dallas and Houston a few years back. I sometimes suspect it is because California filled its offices with projects 1st, and once they were full, they started filling other areas, such as Austin.

Ironically, it seems Austin tech job growth is just starting to really boom just before the next recession. It is still no where close to 1999/2000 levels. Back then my phone was ringing off the hook all day long and I could name my price. Certainly not the same today.

I noticed an uptick in the high-tech market starting in the beginning of 2004, which is when I started getting random calls from recruiters again. I think the last call before that was in mid 2001. ;) It's been an upward ramp since that time. Of course, this is all dependent on your skill set.

Regardless, the tech market in Austin is still very hot, and probably getting hotter. (Hopefully it isn't an indicator of a crash as you mentioned above.) Over the long term, the predictions are that there will be a huge shortage of tech workers, even with outsourcing overseas. Many companies perceive Austin as having a much better quality of life and a much lower cost of living and cost of doing business than California. Though, I'm not sure if that's good or bad for Austin. ;)

One of the differences during this economic adjustment compared to 2001 is that Austin's economy is much more diverse. There are more creative workers, and fewer software developers. There is also a big interest from people outside of Austin who want to have a second home in Austin. I'd bet a lot of the high-end condo's will be owned as second homes.

[Gallup]

Tom Stacy is putting his property for his new tower on the market and you’d be a damned fool to think that the buyer would stick to the same plan. That project is toast.:Titanic:
On the bright side, there is a project afoot that will add a tremendous amount of retail space in a very strategic location downtown. The backers are hot stuff and this project will move forward.

[Gallup]

This Saturday, January 12, Mayor Will Wynn and the City of Austin invite members of the community to attend a Town Hall Meeting to discuss Phase One of the Downtown Austin Plan.


The Downtown Austin Alliance encourages you to attend the meeting, where you will have the opportunity to review and provide feedback on the initial findings and preliminary strategies for creating a more livable, diverse and sustainable downtown.


The input received at this meeting will help the consultant focus their work during Phase Two, which will begin this spring.


WHEN: Saturday, January 12, 9:00 a.m. - 12:30 p.m. (sign-in starts at 8:30 a.m.)

WHERE: Austin Convention Center, 500 E. Cesar Chavez Street, Ballroom A

[Kevinb]

On the bright side, there is a project afoot that will add a tremendous amount of retail space in a very strategic location downtown. The backers are hot stuff and this project will move forward.


Please share more info! Green water site?

[TXAlex]

Tom Stacy is putting his property for his new tower on the market and you’d be a damned fool to think that the buyer would stick to the same plan. That project is toast.:Titanic:
On the bright side, there is a project afoot that will add a tremendous amount of retail space in a very strategic location downtown. The backers are hot stuff and this project will move forward.

TStacy's project looked doomed from the beginning. It had a great amount of doom energy.

[priller]

Tom Stacy is putting his property for his new tower on the market and you’d be a damned fool to think that the buyer would stick to the same plan. That project is toast.

No big shock there. And coincidentally, my wife and I were walking past the parking garage at 5th and Brazos (which I assume would be demolished for the Stacey project) and a crew there was busy tearing down the old booth-like structures still there on the bottom floor. Gave me a brief glimmer of hope that maybe Stacey was making a move, but I guess not.

On the bright side, there is a project afoot that will add a tremendous amount of retail space in a very strategic location downtown. The backers are hot stuff and this project will move forward.

Come on! You can't leave us with just that!

[ATXboom]

Friday, January 4, 2008
Elevating downtown's playing fieldAustin Business Journal - by A.J. Mistretta ABJ Staff


Two years out of Duke University in 1997, the young developer from North Carolina who had grown up sketching buildings and villages came to visit a friend in Austin, and was blown away by the bustling day and nighttime activity of downtown. More shocking to Andrews was the fact that so few people actually lived downtown.

"I thought, 'there's got to be a real opportunity to do a residential project,'" he says. He returned to Durham, sold his interest in a project he had created there and moved to Austin. Over the next three years he managed to gain control of several attractive parcels downtown and tried to sell prospective development partners in Dallas and Houston on his vision for high-rise residential in the capital city. They didn't bite.

So Andrews switched gears, created a residential mortgage company and bided his time. By 2004, with downtown Austin's renaissance beginning, he couldn't ignore the perfect storm brewing for a residential tower.

"I put together a presentation with hundreds of photos and data all about Austin and went on a dog and pony show," he says. In between hitting up residential development companies from California to the Carolinas, Andrews read about Novare Group and what that Atlanta company was doing in some of its projects, marrying its high-end Twelve hotel brand with condos. The prospect intrigued him.

Andrews placed a call to Novare CEO Jim Borders. "He answered the phone, and it's a good thing he did, because I'm not sure I would have left a voicemail," says Andrews. "He told me that Austin was on their radar screen. I flew out there, and we decided to become partners."

Andrews' company, Andrews Urban LLC, and Novare Group purchased a piece of property in the southwestern quadrant of downtown. Two years later, on that slice of land stands the tallest building to date on the Austin skyline, and the first of the next generation of downtown condos. The project is essentially sold out.

When residents begin moving into the 430 units at 360 Condominiums in the late spring, work will already be under way on Andrews Urban and Novare's second project on Block 51 fronting West Sixth Street. That as yet unnamed tower will bring 433 condos and retail. Later in 2008 dirt will turn for Twelve Domain, the partnership's first endeavor outside downtown at North Austin's mixed-use Domain development. Finally, construction is slated to start in 2009 on downtown's Block 52 where the central post office now stands. That project will yield a hotel, condos, retail and possibly office space in a roughly 550-foot tower.

Andrews says he feels confident that the sales momentum of 360 will carry forward on future projects despite the increasingly competitive condo landscape.

"We believe we're delivering a luxury product at the most competitive price, by far, in downtown Austin," he says.

[evergreen1]

I caught some one in the office last week.... they said it was a go and the office is only open by appointment.

OK... so I just wrote one of the folks in the development area I met at 21c Loiusville..... I will let you know what I find out.

M

I don't know anything specific about this or the other major announced projects however I do know they are all backed by substantial entities. I believe they are all a go..if there is a hitch it is pre sale requirements that lenders or developers self impose. Pre sales are quite usual in many cities but rarer in Austin.

[southsideatx04]

I don't know anything specific about this or the other major announced projects however I do know they are all backed by substantial entities. I believe they are all a go..if there is a hitch it is pre sale requirements that lenders or developers self impose. Pre sales are quite usual in many cities but rarer in Austin.

Those substantial entities know that Austin is going to grow no matter what. Austin city limits property values are going to continue to rise as the city continues to grow. I would do the same thing.

[KevinFromTexas]

A few interesting views I've noticed lately.

I noticed the Palisades West office building from North I-35. The view was from WAY out north between Austin and Round Rock, a good half mile or so north of Parmer. That general view also has a view of the tv towers in West Austin. You can also see the midrises at The Arboretum from there.

The 2nd was a view of Palisades West from South First Street & Ben White Boulevard/Texas 71. It was quite prominent there.

The 3rd spot was from northeast corner of Emerald Forrest Drive and Stassney Lane. They're tearing out a swath of trees in a vacant lot along Stassney there. With the trees gone you can see the overpass along Ben White. Beyond that I swore I saw Palisades West.

The other view is from Gobi Drive which is near my house. Tonight from that spot I saw the crane for 360. And also tonight I caught a glimpse of Frost Bank Tower's crown from the top of my street. And I also noticed 360's crane tonight from about midway down my street. There's never been a view of anything in downtown from our street, but there it was. I only saw it through the trees above the houses, and only since they cut down all the trees on that vacant lot along Stassney.

[JAM]

I noticed an uptick in the high-tech market starting in the beginning of 2004, which is when I started getting random calls from recruiters again. I think the last call before that was in mid 2001. It's been an upward ramp since that time. ;)

Same observation. Are you hinting that you took your phone off the hook so you could enjoy Lake Travis ;)



Of course, this is all dependent on your skill set.

Avionics, ASICs, Oil and Fashion merchandising :cheers:



Regardless, the tech market in Austin is still very hot, and probably getting hotter. (Hopefully it isn't an indicator of a crash as you mentioned above.)


No crash I hope and not my idea, just regurgitating the media scare.


Over the long term, the predictions are that there will be a huge shortage of tech workers, even with outsourcing overseas. Many companies perceive Austin as having a much better quality of life and a much lower cost of living and cost of doing business than California. Though, I'm not sure if that's good or bad for Austin. ;)


Yes, but definition of "hi-tech" is changing. My little sister and my niece who has a communications degree develop websites.




One of the differences during this economic adjustment compared to 2001 is that Austin's economy is much more diverse. There are more creative workers, and fewer software developers.


I will have to respectfully disagree with this, s/w engineers, or so claimed, are a dime a dozen right now. However, good ones are not. Now, it is up to management to distinguish the difference.


There is also a big interest from people outside of Austin who want to have a second home in Austin. I'd bet a lot of the high-end condo's will be owned as second homes.

Oh yeah! On my floor, in adjacent units, I have no neighbors, they all live out of town.

Maybe we should start a Austin or Texas economy thread so we don't hi-jack this one. Its all interrelated. I have faith it won't be as bad this time, but wondering if we are going to feel it a bit.

[ATXboom]

Dear Downtown Austin Plan Interested Persons:



Thank you for your interest in the Downtown Austin Plan. I want apologize (to most of you) for the late notice of this upcoming event. It turns out that there was a “coding error” in the database of Downtown Austin Plan “interested persons.” For the last few months, when I thought I was sending e-mails to all of you (including a notice of this upcoming meeting), I was sending e-mails only to a fraction of you. We discovered this only late yesterday.



I am writing today to invite you to the Town Hall meeting that will take place this Saturday, January 12th, at the Austin Convention Center (Ballroom A). Sign-in will begin at 8:30 a.m., and we will get underway promptly at 9:00 with a summary of the Phase One draft report. Then, there will be breakout sessions on particular topics, and we aim to wrap up about 12:30 p.m.



We are nearing the completion of the Downtown Plan’s Phase One, which is meant to identify opportunities and challenges facing Downtown and set the priorities for Phase Two, where the actual plan and implementation steps will be developed in detail. At the meeting, ROMA Design Group and HR&A Advisors will present their initial findings and preliminary strategies for creating a more livable, diverse, and sustainable Downtown. These include, among other ideas, how to reshape Downtown into unique districts, how to achieve affordable housing, and how to move forward with comprehensive transportation planning.



As you may know, there is some on-street parking in the area of the Convention Center, and there are two Convention Center parking garages, as shown on the map that you can access at: http://www.austinconventioncenter.com/Maps/ACC_Parking.pdf.



Thank you for your continued interest in the Downtown Austin Plan, and we look forward to seeing you Saturday.



Jim Robertson, Architect

Manager - Urban Design Division

Neighborhood Planning and Zoning Department

City of Austin

505 Barton Springs Road

Austin, Texas 78704

T: 512.974.3564

F: 512.974.6525

jim.robertson@ci.austin.tx.us

www.cityofaustin.org

[Gallup]

Son of a bitch; you guys are going to run me out of here aren’t you. What the hell am I talking about right, well, here it goes. I’ve just confirmed that CLB’s 7th and Rio has been put on hold. Guys, it’s not the Austin market that is causing this, it’s that the guys on Wall Street are scrutinizing the lending industry more than ever. The projects that have moved will be fine, and if we see movement at Four Seasons, 21c or the Novare projects they will be fine as well. For people wondering if the downtown condo market will crash, don’t quit your day job. Austin has a vibe and energy that people around the country want and crave. These units will be coveted and in high demand for many years to come. My guess is that when lenders have their acts together and have finished documenting their losses they will start to get busy again and at that time 7th and Rio will rise. It’s in such a sweet spot that they are sure to move forward eventually.

[AustinGuy]

Son of a bitch; you guys are going to run me out of here aren’t you. What the hell am I talking about right, well, here it goes. I’ve just confirmed that CLB’s 7th and Rio has been put on hold..

Well that sucks. I thought that was a great location.

Whether or not condo prices drop here will depend on the job situation. If unemployment goes up and rent prices downtown drop, condo prices aren't likely to hold. I'm a firm believer in the long run of downtown Austin though, so if there is a dip, it is probably a good buying opportunity.

[Gallup]

Come on! You can't leave us with just that!

Sorry guy, it is what it is. I will say this, it’s not Green. You will all rejoice and sing and while doing so you will dance and drink and eventually you will carol and skip. Speaking of Green, what are we waiting for. Someone on here knows something about that plan. It can’t be too far away, we will then have to dance and sing all over again. :cheers:

[Kevinb]

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/5550/360ud4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/3184/360buw0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/7572/360cam7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/4849/musichallww4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/1026/monarchxp9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/329/360monarchyx8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/4426/austinis8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/5853/90544081gt2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[arbeiter]

good work, are they HDR?

[MichaelB]

Son of a bitch; you guys are going to run me out of here aren’t you. What the hell am I talking about right, well, here it goes. I’ve just confirmed that CLB’s 7th and Rio has been put on hold. Guys, it’s not the Austin market that is causing this, it’s that the guys on Wall Street are scrutinizing the lending industry more than ever. The projects that have moved will be fine, and if we see movement at Four Seasons, 21c or the Novare projects they will be fine as well. For people wondering if the downtown condo market will crash, don’t quit your day job. Austin has a vibe and energy that people around the country want and crave. These units will be coveted and in high demand for many years to come. My guess is that when lenders have their acts together and have finished documenting their losses they will start to get busy again and at that time 7th and Rio will rise. It’s in such a sweet spot that they are sure to move forward eventually.

Kick you out over this? Heck no. This is a reasonable, non-hysterical, not-bitter rather optimistic evaluation of a local vs national econnomic situation.

I do, however, want to kick you ....somewhere..... for the big tease about the retail project! But I understand. (Do you accept alcoholic bribes?)

[Kevinb]

good work, are they HDR?

Yes, and they were shot without a tripod so some have some ghosting. Sorry ;) I thought this group would enjoy them anyway!

[arbeiter]

Yes, and they were shot without a tripod so some have some ghosting. Sorry ;) I thought this group would enjoy them anyway!

is that red building in the warehouse district the old Real World building?

Unfortunately I've only been back to Austin 3 or so times since 2004 so I haven't kept track with everything like I used to.

[priller]

is that red building in the warehouse district the old Real World building?

That's the one. It's now a Tex-Mex restaurant.

[austin242]

Gallup Will this project be tall or spread out?

[MichaelB]

That's the one. It's now a Tex-Mex restaurant.

With the pool still inside!