[PuebloStrong]

This link is to a new development by C.S.U. - Puebo

http://www.walkingstickvista.com/

This is a new development started by developers from Canada. They picked Pueblo due to our location and expected growth. They have a booth at the state fair in the Ag building, that is where I talked to them, but there has also been articles in the Chieftain about the project. Also, they are in talks with CSU - Pueblo on developing a new business park focused on scientifically based companies that will be located in the Walking Stick area. As I talked to them they said the next 12 years will see tremendous growth in the Pueblo metro area, from Pueblo Springs down to the new industrial park south of town.

Edit 1 - I had heard that the corporate headquarters was going to be by csu pueblo but dismissed it. If the new business park is going there focusing on scientifically based companies could that be a possibility? Has anyone heard anything on that? I would prefer it to be in downtown but any where in the city of Pueblo is my second choice lol.

Walking Stick Vista:
1. Two Home Builders from Colorado Spring Area, and not from pueblo!
2. The Developer is unknow to pueblo and the state!
3. New South Industrail Park is main growth for our Horizon Communities's South Point Master Planned Community!

Major Problems facing the developer is very limited to the interstate and, if CDOT able to built a huge bridge over the river. The area's growth is very slow, and compare to Northridge/Eagleridge's major growth from past 15 years!

I got link of sample of national retailers not in pueblo yet: http://pueblourbanrenewal.org/main/images/pueblo_retail_opportunities.pdf

Regency Ridge Communities already have two master planned community, is Eagleridge Master Planned and Regency Ridge Master Planned. Both Master Planned Community is doing great than Horizon Communities's South Point Master Planned Community!

[Eeyore]

Walking Stick Vista:
1. Two Home Builders from Colorado Spring Area, and not from pueblo!
2. The Developer is unknow to pueblo and the state!
3. New South Industrail Park is main growth for our Horizon Communities's South Point Master Planned Community!

Major Problems facing the developer is very limited to the interstate and, if CDOT able to built a huge bridge over the river. The area's growth is very slow, and compare to Northridge/Eagleridge's major growth from past 15 years!

I got link of sample of national retailers not in pueblo yet: http://pueblourbanrenewal.org/main/images/pueblo_retail_opportunities.pdf

Regency Ridge Communities already have two master planned community, is Eagleridge Master Planned and Regency Ridge Master Planned. Both Master Planned Community is doing great than Horizon Communities's South Point Master Planned Community!

That is good that they are not from Pueblo, we need some outside money invested in our city to really get some growth going. Also, the new bridge over I-25 by the eden exit will not be paid for by the state but by a special tax that is already being collected in the area. Finally, i heard from even better sources today that the corporate headquarters is going in the business park in that development. If that is true that will be a major kick start for the area.

[PuebloStrong]

That is good that they are not from Pueblo, we need some outside money invested in our city to really get some growth going. Also, the new bridge over I-25 by the eden exit will not be paid for by the state but by a special tax that is already being collected in the area. Finally, i heard from even better sources today that the corporate headquarters is going in the business park in that development. If that is true that will be a major kick start for the area.

The Dillon Flyover and Split Diamond Interchange. CDOT Planned to rebuilt Eden with new dillon interchange, and paid from tax and federal grants! Its common sense to built company headquater in thundervillage, because near major highways. Here is link of 2035 traffic plan: http://www.pacog.net/2035_RCPP_FINAL_NORTHEAST.pdf

[Eeyore]

The Dillon Flyover and Split Diamond Interchange. CDOT Planned to rebuilt Eden with new dillon interchange, and paid from tax and federal grants! Its common sense to built company headquater in thundervillage, because near major highways. Here is link of 2035 traffic plan: http://www.pacog.net/2035_RCPP_FINAL_NORTHEAST.pdf

Actually I think the corporate headquarters is going to be in the walking stick vista development, they are the ones who are building the business park focused on "scientific" companies. Like I have said I would prefer it to be in downtown, but if the developer is willing to do the work and bring in the companies then I say go for it. Having more business in Pueblo can only help out the city and downtown.

[PuebloStrong]

Actually I think the corporate headquarters is going to be in the walking stick vista development, they are the ones who are building the business park focused on "scientific" companies. Like I have said I would prefer it to be in downtown, but if the developer is willing to do the work and bring in the companies then I say go for it. Having more business in Pueblo can only help out the city and downtown.

Slim chance for corporate headquater to locate here, and maybe slight greater chance to get major region headquater to downtown or other business parks in town! Walking Stick Vista Zone is P.U.D, not design business park and only small-size to mid-size commercial centers! Mid-size Retail Center and not corporate headquaters coming to walking stick vista area or change to business zone & residential zone from PUD zone, up there!

[Eeyore]

Slim chance for corporate headquater to locate here, and maybe slight greater chance to get major region headquater to downtown or other business parks in town! Walking Stick Vista Zone is P.U.D, not design business park and only small-size to mid-size commercial centers! Mid-size Retail Center and not corporate headquaters coming to walking stick vista area or change to business zone & residential zone from PUD zone, up there!

You could be right, I am just saying what my sources tell me and they are very good ones. Also, the new development where the scientific business park will be located has not been annexed in the city but they are working on it now, it was in the Chieftain in December. I think its called fountain Lake Property. It is about 1,400 Acers located directly north of the walking stick golf course. In fact they are working on one of the major roads now, 47th street.

[citycenter]

Dillon interchange is far behind schedule. LOVES Truckstop has been trying to build up there for 8 years with no luck because of the delays with the interchange.

Also, why the hell is Pueblo so concerned about making everything a damn PUD development???? PUD is more time consuming and expensive for developers, and my guess is that they all have architectural requirements. Kinda funny to place architectural requirements on developers who are willing to RISK money in Pueblo, when you can still drive through town and it looks like a landfill on either side of I-25 from 29th street south! :slob:

[Eeyore]

I just talked to CDOT about the Dillon flyover and they told me that the city just got the federal money for the project and are working on the plans and its set to begin constriction in 3rd or 4th quarter of 2009.

Edit 1: I know people have always made fun of how Pueblo looks, but to be honest I like our old rustic look, as well as the south west flair (I would like to see Pueblo go more with the southwest look personally) perhaps it just me. Now its not to say I don't want to fix up the buildings and have newer areas as well and maybe that's what Pueblo is trying to accomplish with all the PUD's. That way we don't end up like the Springs, one big sprawling suburb. I am still told by developers that Pueblo is a much more business friendly city then most other cities in the country and one reason why you see development here.

[PuebloStrong]

Dillon interchange is far behind schedule. LOVES Truckstop has been trying to build up there for 8 years with no luck because of the delays with the interchange.

Also, why the hell is Pueblo so concerned about making everything a damn PUD development???? PUD is more time consuming and expensive for developers, and my guess is that they all have architectural requirements. Kinda funny to place architectural requirements on developers who are willing to RISK money in Pueblo, when you can still drive through town and it looks like a landfill on either side of I-25 from 29th street south! :slob:

If our Loaf N Jug bid out loves truckstop site! Every I-25 Exit in pueblo have loaf n jug store. In the past years, Loves Truckstop is ready to built a huge store at Eden Exit, but they never started!

Facts about city need Loves!
1. Pinon Truck Stop want Loves to built a huge truckstop in pueblo in 2006.
2. City need major regional gas stantion to counterpoint Loaf N Jug!
3. Feel like Loaf N Jug is block loves to built here!

Downtown have architectural requirements for new office buildings and architectural requirements for big box shopping center, too! PUD is waste of our tax money and our time!

[PuebloStrong]

I just talked to CDOT about the Dillon flyover and they told me that the city just got the federal money for the project and are working on the plans and its set to begin constriction in 3rd or 4th quarter of 2009.

Edit 1: I know people have always made fun of how Pueblo looks, but to be honest I like our old rustic look, as well as the south west flair (I would like to see Pueblo go more with the southwest look personally) perhaps it just me. Now its not to say I don't want to fix up the buildings and have newer areas as well and maybe that's what Pueblo is trying to accomplish with all the PUD's. That way we don't end up like the Springs, one big sprawling suburb. I am still told by developers that Pueblo is a much more business friendly city then most other cities in the country and one reason why you see development here.

DILLON FLYOVER AND SPLIT DIAMOND INTERCHANGE
Mr. Tedesco stated that CH2M Hill will be preparing a study, which should be completed within the next year and a half. There was a discussion regarding a new bridge to cross Fountain Creek. from meeting of 12/11/2007, adn here is link of meeting: http://pueblourbanrenewal.org/main/images/regular_meeting_minutes_121107.pdf

Im not sure about the new bridge over the creek at eagleridge or eden!

[PuebloStrong]

Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Denmark of May 9, 2008 about our Vestas Plant!

Vestas to build world's biggest turbine tower plant in the US
(2008.05.09)


In its interim financial report for Q1 2008, Vestas has announced its intention to build a tower factory in the state of Colorado, which is also home to a Vestas blade-manufacturing plant
In its interim financial report for Q1 2008, world-leading wind turbine manufacturer Vestas reveals that it has decided to build a tower factory, which it claims will be the world's largest, in Colorado. The Centennial State is already home to Vestas' first US factory, a blade-manufacturing facility in upstate Windsor which was officially opened in March this year.

Concerning the decision to build 'Vestas Towers', the company writes: "The decision was made in spite of the uncertainty surrounding the extension of the PTC* scheme. However, with 25 states in the US already having adopted targets for renewable energy's proportion of the local energy mix, Vestas is confident that the US will henceforth pursue a more long-term energy policy instead of the prevailing highly short-term approach to wind power."

Vestas reports that it will invest EUR 160m (USD 245m) in the tower production facility, to be commissioned from mid-2010. The facility is expected to produce around 900 towers per year, substantially increasing the in-house share of Vestas’ tower production. Vestas Towers will create 400 new jobs in Colorado.

Vestas also writes in the report that as part of its US expansion, the company will establish a research and development centre in the US in 2009. This adds no further information than was given in Vestas' first press release on the subject in November 2007. The company has declined to answer questions from the media about where in the US the facility might be located, although as previously reported on this website, it is known that Vestas has been in dialogue with the state of Minnesota, which is keen to attract the facility.

Other states rumoured to be interested include Iowa, Oregon, Texas and - you guessed it - Colorado.

I heard about vestas since July 21, 2008 from Councilman Ray Aguilera, and Why Denmark know before Pueblo!

:shrug:

[Eeyore]

DILLON FLYOVER AND SPLIT DIAMOND INTERCHANGE
Mr. Tedesco stated that CH2M Hill will be preparing a study, which should be completed within the next year and a half. There was a discussion regarding a new bridge to cross Fountain Creek. from meeting of 12/11/2007, adn here is link of meeting: http://pueblourbanrenewal.org/main/images/regular_meeting_minutes_121107.pdf

Im not sure about the new bridge over the creek at eagleridge or eden!

I think the way it will work is Dillon will fly over and connect with Plattville blvd. Then Eden will continue east over the river. If you are going north on I -25 the exit will be on Dillion and the on ramp will be on Eden. If you are going south bound the exit will be at Plattville and the on ramp at Dillion. Hence the "split diomand".

Edit 1: Now if you want to go east or west I am not sure how that will work. You might have to go then turn then turn and keep going your direction and no str8 through.

[PuebloStrong]

I think the way it will work is Dillon will fly over and connect with Plattville blvd. Then Eden will continue east over the river. If you are going north on I -25 the exit will be on Dillion and the on ramp will be on Eden. If you are going south bound the exit will be at Plattville and the on ramp at Dillion. Hence the "split diomand".

Edit 1: Now if you want to go east or west I am not sure how that will work. You might have to go then turn then turn and keep going your direction and no str8 through.

Plattville Blvd and Dillon Dr is going replace Eden exit name, because planned to move plattville blvd though new pinon ridge with planned loves truckstop.
I kept trying to get infomation from company about new pueblo loves store site!

[PuebloStrong]

HEARING – An Ordinance Vacating the Remaining Portions of Alley Adjacent to Lots 7,

8, 9 and 13 of State Addition Generally Located South of 2nd Street, East of Elizabeth

Street and West of Greenwood - Introduced August 11, 2008 by Councilwoman Vera

Ortegon

The applicant proposes to vacate the property to facilitate future redevelopment

of the property. The Planning and Zoning Commission at their Regular Meeting

on July 9, 2008 voted 6-0 to recommend Approval.

Required Council Action: Motion to Approve the Ordinance on Final

Presentation



From 8-25-2008 meeting.



An Ordinance Vacating the Remaining Portions of Alley Adjacent to Lots 7, 8, 9 and 13 of

State Addition Generally Located South of 2nd Street, East of Elizabeth Street and West

of Greenwood

The applicant proposes to vacate the property to facilitate future redevelopment

of the property. The Planning and Zoning Commission at their Regular Meeting

on July 9, 2008 voted 6-0 to recommend Approval.

Required Council Action: Motion to Pass on First Presentation, Set the Public

Hearing for Monday, August 25, 2008 and Order the Ordinance Published By

Title



From 8-11-2008 meetings.



HEARING – An Ordinance Changing Zoning Restrictions from I-2, Light Industrial to B-4,

Regional Business District, Covering a Parcel of Land Generally Located at the

Northwest Corner of 3rd Street and Greenwood Street - Introduced April 28, 2008 by

Councilwoman Judy Weaver

During the May 12, 2008 City Council Meeting, the Public Hearing was opened

and then continued until this date at the request of the applicant, the Colorado

State Board of Land Commissioners.

The applicant is requesting to rezone the property to facilitate commercial redevelopment

of the property. The Planning and Zoning Commission at their

Regular Meeting on March 12, 2008 voted 7-0 to recommend APPROVAL.

Required Council Action: Motion to Approve the Ordinance on Final

Presentation



From 5-27-2008 meeting



HEARING – An Ordinance Changing Zoning Restrictions from I-2, Light Industrial to B-4,

Regional Business District, Covering a Parcel of Land Generally Located at the

Northwest Corner of 3rd Street and Greenwood Street - Introduced April 28, 2008 by

Councilwoman Judy Weaver

The applicant, the Colorado State Board of Land Commissioners, has requested

a continuance on this Public Hearing until May 27, 2008 to allow their Acting

Director, John Brejcha to attend the Hearing.

The applicant is requesting to rezone the property to facilitate commercial redevelopment

of the property. The Planning and Zoning Commission at their

Regular Meeting on March 12, 2008 voted 7-0 to recommend APPROVAL.

Required Council Action: If it is Council’s desire to continue the public hearing,

open the public hearing and then entertain a motion to continue the public

hearing until May 27, 2008. If Council does not wish to continue the public

hearing, open the public hearing, receive testimony, close the public hearing and

proceed with the action to approve the ordinance on final presentation.



From 5-17-2008 Meeting.



An Ordinance Changing Zoning Restrictions from I-2, Light Industrial to B-4, Regional

Business District, Covering a Parcel of Land Generally Located at the Northwest Corner

of 3rd Street and Greenwood Street

The applicant is requesting to rezone the property to facilitate commercial redevelopment

of the property. The Planning and Zoning Commission at their

Regular Meeting on March 12, 2008 voted 7-0 to recommend APPROVAL.

Required Council Action: Motion to Pass on First Presentation, Set the Public

Hearing for May 12, 2008 and Order the Ordinance Published By Title



From 4-28-2008 Meeting.


:D

[PuebloStrong]

You're not going to get any answers from the city planning office. I c an tell you however that there are two office towers in development now for downtown Pueblo. A 23 story and a 16 story. One of the buildings will be home to a new HQ from the west coast. Also a couple local firms are planning to be residents of the new buildings. The development will tie into the riverwalk project.

:previous:

Past couple month, the city rezone about 5 downtown lots from I-2 zone to B-4 zone, and at Greenwood & 3rd! My infomation coming from city council meeting!

[Eeyore]

:previous:

Past couple month, the city rezone about 5 downtown lots from I-1 zone to B-4 zone, and at Greenwood & 3rd! My infomation coming from city council meeting!

This is great news! I hope we find out in the next week or 2 who it will be!!!!!

:banana: :tup: :cheers:

[Paulopolis]

Hey Eeyore and PuebloStrong,

Do you know how many jobs the Professional Bullriders' Association brought to Pueblo?

If all the development around HARP comes to fruition, it's really going to change Pueblo. I think it will finally begin to move the Pueblo economy from manufacturing-based to service-based. I hope. If you build it they will come.

[PuebloStrong]

Hey Eeyore and PuebloStrong,

Do you know how many jobs the Professional Bullriders' Association brought to Pueblo?

If all the development around HARP comes to fruition, it's really going to change Pueblo. I think it will finally begin to move the Pueblo economy from manufacturing-based to service-based. I hope. If you build it they will come.

:previous:

Hey, Paulopolis!

Please get the infomation on your own, and ask Pueblo Citizens for Positive Change Group at http://www.pueblog.us on PBR INC Jobs Count!

Pueblo is still manufacturing based city with Vestas Tower Plant to Our Steel Mill, and service based jobs at our 4 mid-size call centers! You never heard the pueblo core project, and about 4- 24 story highrises in the project!

[Eeyore]

The Milken Institute’s ranking of the best performing cities in the nation in 2008 just came out and according to the Montana business journal "Pueblo, Colorado was the top gainer in the nation among the smaller cities." This is also before Vestas starts constriction of their new facility and the Pueblo army depot begins their major hiring as well as others. Our current rank is 43.

[Top Of The Park]

I thought this thread died

[Eeyore]

I thought this thread died

LOL since the Vesta's announcement in Pueblo not much has happened in the Pueblo/ Colorado Springs metro area to be of any interest.

However that is changing, starting next week they are starting constriction of a new annex at Park View medical center in downtown Pueblo, it will be 6 stories when completed in 2010.

Here is the link:

http://www.parkviewmc.com/pmc.nsf/view/expansionupdate

[PuebloStrong]

The Milken Institute’s ranking of the best performing cities in the nation in 2008 just came out and according to the Montana business journal "Pueblo, Colorado was the top gainer in the nation among the smaller cities." This is also before Vestas starts constriction of their new facility and the Pueblo army depot begins their major hiring as well as others. Our current rank is 43.

I never heard the milken institute and who is them? There is a link to report, and very hard to find the report on both website.

[Eeyore]

I never heard the milken institute and who is them? There is a link to report, and very hard to find the report on both website.

The Milken Institute is a publicly supported, nonpartisan, independent think tank whose work makes a difference in the lives of people worldwide by helping create a more democratic and efficient global economy.

For more than 15 years, the Milken Institute has used capital-market principles and financial innovations to address social and economic challenges, from energy independence to poverty, here in the United States and around the world. We help business, foundation, academic and public-policy leaders identify and implement new ideas for creating broad-based prosperity.

Here is the link: http://www.milkeninstitute.org/

To be honest that is all I know of them. And this is why when asked earlier if Pueblo had been the best of any list my response was "there are so many lists in America that I think any major city has been on top of a list at one time or another."

[PuebloStrong]

The Milken Institute is a publicly supported, nonpartisan, independent think tank whose work makes a difference in the lives of people worldwide by helping create a more democratic and efficient global economy.

For more than 15 years, the Milken Institute has used capital-market principles and financial innovations to address social and economic challenges, from energy independence to poverty, here in the United States and around the world. We help business, foundation, academic and public-policy leaders identify and implement new ideas for creating broad-based prosperity.

Here is the link: http://www.milkeninstitute.org/

To be honest that is all I know of them. And this is why when asked earlier if Pueblo had been the best of any list my response was "there are so many lists in America that I think any major city has been on top of a list at one time or another."

WOW, Pueblo jump to 48 from 130 of 2007 numbers, and colorado spring fall to 111 from 96 of 2007 number! Colorado Spring having very bad year, and springs almost went into creek this morning from rain storm!

[Front_Range_Guy]

For some reason when I read this on the police blotter, I was compelled to post it here.

Incident Date September 12, 2008 Time 3:18:00 AM Division Sand Creek Shift III
Title Assault Location 711 Tia Juana
Summary Officers responded to 711 Tia Juana to investigate a disturbance. The investigation revealed that on or about Sept. 8th Russell Bowman, who claims to be an atheist, had threatened to cut the heads off of two females because they were Christians. On September 12th Bowman arrived at the females’ apartment with a knife and stood in the hallway. Another resident of the apartment retrieved a shotgun and approached Bowman who was by then walking away. The resident ordered Bowman to put the knife down. When Bowman refused and approached the resident, Bowman was struck with the butt-end of the shotgun causing an injury to Bowman’s eye. Bowman was treated at Memorial Hospital where it was determined the injury to the eye was so severe, the eye would need to be surgically removed. Mr. Bowman will be arrested for Felony Menacing. The case will be presented to the District Attorney’s Office to determine if any additional charges are appropriate.
Adults Arrested
Media Contact Name and Phone Number: Lt. Rigdon 444-7270

[Eeyore]

This was in todays paper, thought it was interesting:
Vestas incentives top $31 million
The city has promised almost $12 million from the half-cent sales tax fund.
By JAMES AMOS
THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN
September 13, 2008 03:40 am
The city and county, the state of Colorado and the federal government combined to put $31.8 million on the table to bring the new Vestas windmill tower plant to Pueblo.

Much of the money came from the city of Pueblo's special economic development fund. The money comes from a half-cent sales tax Pueblo voters have reauthorized several times to attract prospective businesses. Pueblo voters agreed in 2007 also to allow some of the money to be used to train workers for the new businesses.

Keith Swerdfeger, interim president of the Pueblo Economic Development Corp., said Friday that the money given to Vestas represents a good investment for Pueblo. One economic model shows that the Vestas plant, its equipment and its 450 jobs will bring more than $1 billion in economic activity for the Pueblo area in the next 10 years.

"That's property taxes, wages, jobs and spin-offs on other kinds of companies coming in," Swerdfeger said. "It (the model) shows the total economic impact over 10 years to Pueblo is $1,243,194,199."

The Pueblo Board of Water Works is putting up $2.5 million to build a 17,000-foot water main from its water system to the location of the new Vestas plant south of Pueblo.

That contribution is being counted as matching funds to enable the project to qualify for a $2.5 million federal grant, Swerdfeger said.

The water board also has agreed informally to approve a $350,000 waiver in tap fees. Swerdfeger said that's a standard economic incentive the water agency has offered to attract new businesses to Pueblo's Airport Industrial Park. Water officials agreed to the waiver even though the Vestas plant will be located elsewhere.

The city's large contribution, as well as money from Pueblo County, will be paid to Vestas in installments as construction work is finished and equipment is purchased, Swerdfeger said. PEDCo oversees the process and will reimburse the company for those costs.

Pueblo County officials agreed to provide a total of more than $8 million in money and tax waivers. State incentives equaled a little more than $6 million. They come in an array of formats, from enterprise-zone tax credits, which are available for many business expansion or startup projects, to special funds approved by the state's economic development department for the Vestas project.

Swerdfeger said some incentives and tax credits may end up costing more because they are based on the plant employing 450 people and buying $50 million in equipment and machinery.

In reality, both the machinery costs and number of jobs created may be higher, he said.

At 450 jobs, the project's incentive computes to costing about $70,000 per job.

The share paid by the city, county and water agency amounts to approximately $51,000 per job.

The city's share is about $25,400 per job. That's comparable to the $21,000 to $33,000 per job that the city paid for 76 jobs from the Professional Bull Riders Association when it moved to Pueblo in 2005.

[PuebloStrong]

Parkview Medical Center on Monday will start building a $31 million, 92,000-square-foot expansion that will add 27 private patient rooms.

The six-story addition also will include a new main entrance and expanded lobby, a gift shop and cafe and unfinished space on the upper two floors for 54 more private rooms in the future. Construction is expected to be complete early next year.

The expansion will begin with the dismantling of the current main entrance. The addition will be built on what is now the emergency room parking lot.

Mike Baxter, Parkview's vice president and chief operating officer, said the project is the result of months of planning by hospital leaders and architects who gathered opinions from patients, nurses, physicians, staff and community members.

The expansion will be financed with bonds, repayable over 30 years at 5 percent interest. Baxter credited CEO C.W. Smith for management that has resulted in the A-3 bond rating that made financing for the expansion possible.

“These finance terms were the best ever secured by the medical center,” Baxter explained. “With some business decisions, timing is everything and for Parkview the timing in securing the bond financing for this expansion was nearly perfect.”

Proceeds from the 2008 Parkview Foundation Starlight Gala will also be earmarked for the expansion project.

Baxter said the expansion won't change the hospital's licensed capacity of 305 beds.

Many existing semi-private rooms will be "reconfigured" so that, in the future, they may be used as private or semi-private rooms, depending on the number of patients in the hospital. Baxter said which type of room patients are admitted to will be determined primarily by their diagnosis and condition when they are admitted to the hospital, not by whether they have insurance or whether their insurance will pay for a private room.

"A lot of what plays into placing patients into private rooms is a medical decision. If someone comes in with an infection, they're going to get a private room," he said. "Prisoners typically require private rooms and anyone who's immuno-compromised gets a private room.

"Neither Medicaid nor Medicare pays for private rooms, but those patients will be placed where they need to be placed. Medicaid and Medicare only pay a fraction" of what is billed anyway, Baxter said.

"We're not going to be left with many semi-private rooms" when all existing rooms have been reconfigured, he said. That process will happen "as finances permit" and isn't part of the upcoming expansion.

:D

[PuebloStrong]

This was in todays paper, thought it was interesting:
Vestas incentives top $31 million
The city has promised almost $12 million from the half-cent sales tax fund.
By JAMES AMOS
THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN
September 13, 2008 03:40 am
The city and county, the state of Colorado and the federal government combined to put $31.8 million on the table to bring the new Vestas windmill tower plant to Pueblo.

Much of the money came from the city of Pueblo's special economic development fund. The money comes from a half-cent sales tax Pueblo voters have reauthorized several times to attract prospective businesses. Pueblo voters agreed in 2007 also to allow some of the money to be used to train workers for the new businesses.

Keith Swerdfeger, interim president of the Pueblo Economic Development Corp., said Friday that the money given to Vestas represents a good investment for Pueblo. One economic model shows that the Vestas plant, its equipment and its 450 jobs will bring more than $1 billion in economic activity for the Pueblo area in the next 10 years.

"That's property taxes, wages, jobs and spin-offs on other kinds of companies coming in," Swerdfeger said. "It (the model) shows the total economic impact over 10 years to Pueblo is $1,243,194,199."

The Pueblo Board of Water Works is putting up $2.5 million to build a 17,000-foot water main from its water system to the location of the new Vestas plant south of Pueblo.

That contribution is being counted as matching funds to enable the project to qualify for a $2.5 million federal grant, Swerdfeger said.

The water board also has agreed informally to approve a $350,000 waiver in tap fees. Swerdfeger said that's a standard economic incentive the water agency has offered to attract new businesses to Pueblo's Airport Industrial Park. Water officials agreed to the waiver even though the Vestas plant will be located elsewhere.

The city's large contribution, as well as money from Pueblo County, will be paid to Vestas in installments as construction work is finished and equipment is purchased, Swerdfeger said. PEDCo oversees the process and will reimburse the company for those costs.

Pueblo County officials agreed to provide a total of more than $8 million in money and tax waivers. State incentives equaled a little more than $6 million. They come in an array of formats, from enterprise-zone tax credits, which are available for many business expansion or startup projects, to special funds approved by the state's economic development department for the Vestas project.

Swerdfeger said some incentives and tax credits may end up costing more because they are based on the plant employing 450 people and buying $50 million in equipment and machinery.

In reality, both the machinery costs and number of jobs created may be higher, he said.

At 450 jobs, the project's incentive computes to costing about $70,000 per job.

The share paid by the city, county and water agency amounts to approximately $51,000 per job.

The city's share is about $25,400 per job. That's comparable to the $21,000 to $33,000 per job that the city paid for 76 jobs from the Professional Bull Riders Association when it moved to Pueblo in 2005.


:previous:
New Vestas Plant would be top dollar asset and major growth factor for new big building to major expansions on exist building in pueblo! I hope a small some of 1 billon dollar to rebuilt our interstate 25 and widen highway 50 between the city and pueblo west! We need to fix our road to get major growth in the steel city!

[PuebloStrong]

When the City doesn’t want to call a tax a tax they call it a fee. Because of the cost to assemble people for a convention and the ability of technology to conference large groups of people without transporting them, conventions are in decline.

Pueblo: This Will Cost You Money

Here’s Why a “Vote No” on the Convention Center Ballot Question is the Right Choice.
It doesn’t matter if it is called a tax or fee, the money is out of your pocket. Where’s the value to the community?

• National studies show the number and attendance of conventions and trade shows have been decreasing. It is a fact!

• The Urban Renewal Authority (URA), the gatekeepers of the Convention Center, has not been able to prove that the expansion will bring in a significant amount of out-of-town business to Pueblo. We have requested past performance records, URA provided incomplete and inaccurate files, leading one to question the credibility of the URA.

• The Convention Center operated at a deficit every year and will continue to do so even with the expansion. During the years 2005, 2006, and 2007 the operating deficit averaged $400,000 each year (Pueblo Chieftain, 6-4-08). City Attorney, told the City Council (6-9-08) that the Convention Center deficit was $500,000 for 2007.


• Each year we send Global Spectrum, the Convention Center management firm, over $120,000. In 2007 checks were written to Global Spectrum for over $150,000 (2007 Convention Center check history)

• Financing for the expansion would include paying interest only until the year 2019. What will the actual cost at the payoff year 2029 be, 14 million, 20 million? Remember the URA and the City has a history of cost over runs.
• We have until 2019 to make the decision as to how to spend the Vendor’s Fees or to stop collecting it after 2019. There should be other choices, beside the Convention Center expansion. Citizens of Pueblo think about what we really need.

Websites: The information from Pueblo Citizens for Positive Change (PCPC) is available at Pueblog.org and Pueblog.us.

Pueblo Citizens for Positive Change (PCPC), contact Ted Freeman 000-0000 and Alvin Rivera 000-0000. Volunteer contributions paid for this flyer.

Last Night, I set up fake account to get infomation from this group, and other word " Spying on PCPC". My fake Username is Jake_Bernal_03 for Pueblo USa Forum!

[Eeyore]

:previous:

That group is lame and full of backwards people. Unfortunately every city has a group like that fortunately, here in Pueblo they have no political power. Just a little site on the Internet and a few babble at a city council here and there.

My thought is this, if they like small towns, great not ever person like cities and there are many small towns in Colorado that would be great for them

:koko:

[The Dirt]

These are the same types of people that live 1 mile east of downtown Denver and kill high-rise projects a block off the Central Financial District because they want to protect their last sliver of a view of the mountains. NIMBYs are everywhere... what can you do?

[Eeyore]

These are the same types of people that live 1 mile east of downtown Denver and kill high-rise projects a block off the Central Financial District because they want to protect their last sliver of a view of the mountains. NIMBYs are everywhere... what can you do?

To bad we cant find a nice town in eastern Colorado and ship them there, say la Junta.

:cool:

[Denver Dweller]

Backers of the Colorado Energy Park plan to produce nuclear, solar, hydroelectric and perhaps even solar power.

By JAMES AMOS
THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN
September 18, 2008 02:37 am

If it becomes reality, the 21,000-acre Colorado Energy Park will be the biggest, most different energy producing complex in the country.

Backers of the $83 million park want to turn the large BX Ranch into an industrial park of clean and renewable sources of power, and perhaps attract other companies that want to be near power sources.

Thorne Davis, a real estate broker who helped engineer the Walking Stick development near Colorado State University-Pueblo, said he's joined with the ranch's owner to start negotiations with Alternate Energy Holdings Inc. of Texas on the project.

Alternate Energy will look at the land and determine if it can win a permit for nuclear power.

Nuclear is just part of what will make the park a winning project, Davis said. The land is also perfectly situated to produce several kinds of renewable energy, and has the water and other infrastructure to make it happen.

"We can create energy sources here in the Arkansas Valley," Davis said. The project will increase the tax base, boost enrollment and financing for renewable energy studies at the university and Pueblo Community College and provide well-paying jobs in an industry with a future.

Davis said he envisions the park having a nuclear power plant with as many as four reactors. The reactors will use a waterless "dry" design to avoid the large cooling towers and water used of older reactors.

Part of the reactors' heat will be used to cook any number of biomass commodities to make ethanol, Davis said. The commodities could be anything from switchgrass to municipal waste to cow manure.

Additionally, the bright sunshine in the area makes it perfect for a solar energy farm, Davis said, and wind turbines may also be feasible.

The land is situated on top of one of the larger natural-gas pipelines in the region, so a natural gas-fired power plant is also a possibility, he said, as is a small hydroelectric dam. Water for the project would come from the Weldon Ditch and perhaps the Huerfano/Cuchara Irrigation Co. Davis said water storage space is available both on the site and at the Cuchara Reservoir, which will have to be rebuilt.

The water is part of what makes the ranch a perfect location, Davis said. The Weldon Ditch's owners approached him to help sell their water rights in the Huerfano River. When they couldn't interest any cities, the group decided a power park would be even better.

The ranch has plenty of solitude because no one lives on it or even very close, Davis said. The natural gas pipeline passes underneath, the solar-power rating is high, there is wind power and plenty of water and water storage.

Additionally, there are two large electrical power transmission lines passing through the property and the BNSF railroad is only seven miles away.

Farmers who use the nearby water, and even other farmers in the Arkansas Valley, may profit by growing low-labor crops for the ethanol plant, Davis said.

This obviously is the right time to be pursuing alternate forms of power, Davis said.

"We're closing down (coal-fired) power plants and not building new ones," Davis said. "And within five years, we're going to start having rolling blackouts. Demand is growing and supply isn't."

But the project creates huge economies of scale for the power-producing aspects and other companies that want to participate, Davis said. A solar-panel manufacturer or an aluminum producer may want to locate in the park because of the available power.

Davis said he knows some people will oppose the project, especially the nuclear aspect of it.

"I'm sure there's a NIMBY (Not In My Backyard)" Davis said. "There's always a NIMBY somewhere."

But today's nuclear power is better and safer than what was being used in the 1970s, when a leak at Three Mile Island made nuclear power the butt of jokes about glowing in the dark. Even then nuclear power was very safe, as shown by the fact that no one was injured at Three Mile Island, he said.

In fact, Davis said nuclear power is far safer and healthier than coal-produced power.

When you consider the emission of mercury, sulphur and other chemicals, as well as the environmental impact from the smoke and carbon emissions of burning coal, nuclear is by far the better choice, he said.

One study has shown that it's "100 percent more hazardous to health and the environment to live near a coal-fired plant than a nuclear plant," Davis said.

Clearly there are many hurdles to jump before the project becomes a reality, he said.

But "there could be several billion dollars worth of energy infrastructure," at the park, Davis said. "And it would be clean and green."

[wong21fr]

So, where exactly would this nuclear plant garner the water it requires for it from?

That's the biggest blunder with placing a nuclear plant in a arid state, the lack of water required for its operation.

[Front_Range_Guy]

from gazette.com.

A visible example of credit crunch at work
Comments 8 | Recommend 0
September 19, 2008 - 10:17PM
RICH LADEN
THE GAZETTE

The nation's credit crunch has walloped at least one prominent Colorado Springs real estate developer, who acknowledged Friday he's trying to stave off financial collapse by shuttering his downtown office, laying off his staff and selling some of his high-profile holdings, which include a sprawling housing project east of town.

Only eight months, ago, Ray O'Sullivan was being lauded by City Council members after they approved his plans for a 22-story tower that would have been downtown's tallest building.

Today, because of the credit crisis, O'Sullivan said lenders have demanded he accelerate principal and interest payments on the more than $50 million in loans he owes.

But he doesn't have the money and said he doesn't know if he will survive financially.

Because of a downturn in the local and national economies, little land is selling for commercial and residential uses, no money is coming in and he can't obtain additional financing, he said.

Last month, O'Sullivan closed Realty Development Services, which had an office on Tejon Street in the heart of downtown; on Friday, the office was empty and the doors locked. He let go his 16 employees and a couple of consultants.

Now, O'Sullivan said he'll be forced to sell 1,100 home sites in Windsor in northern Colorado, where he spent the past few years getting the property annexed and zoned.

He's also seeking to sell Santa Fe Springs, which at one point was to feature nearly 5,400 single-family homes, townhomes and condos on 6,420 acres east of U.S. Highway 24 and Judge Orr Road in unincorporated El Paso County.

O'Sullivan said he hasn't filed for bankruptcy and is trying to hold on.

In July, he said he had shelved Cooper Tower, planned for the southeast corner of Nevada Avenue and Kiowa Street, because he couldn't obtain financing. On Friday, he said there remains some interest from third parties that may want to build and finance the project on their own.

Also, O'Sullivan said he hopes to go forward with a 1,000-unit housing project and a 25-acre retail development at Powers and Dublin boulevards, as well as development of 240 home sites in unincorporated Falcon east of Colorado Springs.

A former Californian, O'Sullivan began developing property in Colorado Springs in 1990 and moved here two years later. In recent years, he also developed residential and retail projects northeast of Powers and Stetson Hills boulevards.

Twenty years ago, during the community's last major real estate downturn and at the height of the nation's savings and loan collapse, several developers lost millions and left town. O'Sullivan said he doesn't want to leave, although he might no longer be a developer of large tracts of land.

"Not only am I trying to survive financially, but I'm trying to work on all fronts for whatever projects that I can keep viable," he said. "I'm not going to be able to keep all of my projects. Some are going to have be sold or potentially lost. But we certainly hope to get through this mess with some projects intact."

-

[Eeyore]

Backers of the Colorado Energy Park plan to produce nuclear, solar, hydroelectric and perhaps even solar power.

By JAMES AMOS
THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN
September 18, 2008 02:37 am

If it becomes reality, the 21,000-acre Colorado Energy Park will be the biggest, most different energy producing complex in the country.

Backers of the $83 million park want to turn the large BX Ranch into an industrial park of clean and renewable sources of power, and perhaps attract other companies that want to be near power sources.

Thorne Davis, a real estate broker who helped engineer the Walking Stick development near Colorado State University-Pueblo, said he's joined with the ranch's owner to start negotiations with Alternate Energy Holdings Inc. of Texas on the project.

Alternate Energy will look at the land and determine if it can win a permit for nuclear power.

Nuclear is just part of what will make the park a winning project, Davis said. The land is also perfectly situated to produce several kinds of renewable energy, and has the water and other infrastructure to make it happen.

"We can create energy sources here in the Arkansas Valley," Davis said. The project will increase the tax base, boost enrollment and financing for renewable energy studies at the university and Pueblo Community College and provide well-paying jobs in an industry with a future.

Davis said he envisions the park having a nuclear power plant with as many as four reactors. The reactors will use a waterless "dry" design to avoid the large cooling towers and water used of older reactors.

Part of the reactors' heat will be used to cook any number of biomass commodities to make ethanol, Davis said. The commodities could be anything from switchgrass to municipal waste to cow manure.

Additionally, the bright sunshine in the area makes it perfect for a solar energy farm, Davis said, and wind turbines may also be feasible.

The land is situated on top of one of the larger natural-gas pipelines in the region, so a natural gas-fired power plant is also a possibility, he said, as is a small hydroelectric dam. Water for the project would come from the Weldon Ditch and perhaps the Huerfano/Cuchara Irrigation Co. Davis said water storage space is available both on the site and at the Cuchara Reservoir, which will have to be rebuilt.

The water is part of what makes the ranch a perfect location, Davis said. The Weldon Ditch's owners approached him to help sell their water rights in the Huerfano River. When they couldn't interest any cities, the group decided a power park would be even better.

The ranch has plenty of solitude because no one lives on it or even very close, Davis said. The natural gas pipeline passes underneath, the solar-power rating is high, there is wind power and plenty of water and water storage.

Additionally, there are two large electrical power transmission lines passing through the property and the BNSF railroad is only seven miles away.

Farmers who use the nearby water, and even other farmers in the Arkansas Valley, may profit by growing low-labor crops for the ethanol plant, Davis said.

This obviously is the right time to be pursuing alternate forms of power, Davis said.

"We're closing down (coal-fired) power plants and not building new ones," Davis said. "And within five years, we're going to start having rolling blackouts. Demand is growing and supply isn't."

But the project creates huge economies of scale for the power-producing aspects and other companies that want to participate, Davis said. A solar-panel manufacturer or an aluminum producer may want to locate in the park because of the available power.

Davis said he knows some people will oppose the project, especially the nuclear aspect of it.

"I'm sure there's a NIMBY (Not In My Backyard)" Davis said. "There's always a NIMBY somewhere."

But today's nuclear power is better and safer than what was being used in the 1970s, when a leak at Three Mile Island made nuclear power the butt of jokes about glowing in the dark. Even then nuclear power was very safe, as shown by the fact that no one was injured at Three Mile Island, he said.

In fact, Davis said nuclear power is far safer and healthier than coal-produced power.

When you consider the emission of mercury, sulphur and other chemicals, as well as the environmental impact from the smoke and carbon emissions of burning coal, nuclear is by far the better choice, he said.

One study has shown that it's "100 percent more hazardous to health and the environment to live near a coal-fired plant than a nuclear plant," Davis said.

Clearly there are many hurdles to jump before the project becomes a reality, he said.

But "there could be several billion dollars worth of energy infrastructure," at the park, Davis said. "And it would be clean and green."

WOW!! This is absolutely amazing and would create thousands of jobs for the Pueblo Metro area. Plus it would be a catalysis for major employers moving into the area. This is another reason why I think Pueblo will see growth in the next decade not seen by any other Colorado city in the history of the state.

:banana: :tup: :haha: :cheers:

[Eeyore]

So, where exactly would this nuclear plant garner the water it requires for it from?

That's the biggest blunder with placing a nuclear plant in a arid state, the lack of water required for its operation.

Davis said he envisions the park having a nuclear power plant with as many as four reactors. The reactors will use a waterless "dry" design to avoid the large cooling towers and water used of older reactors.

Any other water could come from the Pueblo Resivor and Arkansaw river.....

:P

[FrancoRey]

A 'non-water' cooled reactor, eh? Hmm...sounds like another Plattville/St. Vrain nuclear plant to me. And we all know how well that 'non-water' cooled plant (cooled by liquid helium) worked :hahano:

[Eeyore]

:rolleyes:A 'non-water' cooled reactor, eh? Hmm...sounds like another Plattville/St. Vrain nuclear plant to me. And we all know how well that 'non-water' cooled plant (cooled by liquid helium) worked :hahano:

Yes but this is the 21st century and the technology is much better. Look at France they have nuclear plants all over and no issues.

Having this devlopment along with Pueblo Springs and the industrial park south of town will allow Pueblo to finally be the states largest city and help make the Pueblo/ Colorado Springs metro the largest metro in the region.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Reality check:

Pueblo Metro Area: 200,000

Springs Metro area: 600,000

Total: 800,000.

Denver Metro Area: 3 million.

Plus, Springs and Pueblo aren't even connected.

I basically don't give a rats about SSP anymore, but let's keep it realistic here people.

[Eeyore]

This was in the wall street journal so I had to post it here even though it is kind of a duplicate.

AEHI Agrees to Negotiate Contract for Colorado Energy Park to Build Multiple Large Advanced Nuclear Plants and Joint Venture Other Renewable Energy Sources


Last update: 9:15 a.m. EDT Sept. 15, 2008
BOISE, ID, Sep 15, 2008 (MARKET WIRE via COMTEX) -- Alternate Energy Holdings, Inc. (PINKSHEETS: AEHI) signed an agreement with a representative of the proposed Colorado Energy Park (CEP) southeast of Pueblo, CO to negotiate contracts on land and water rights for multiple large advanced nuclear reactors. The current CEP site is over 21,000 acres and is valued at $83 million, including substantial water use rights. CEP can host a mixed portfolio of renewable energy including solar PV and CSP, wind, biomass, small-hydro and nuclear. AEHI will seek a complement of multiple clean energy providers to fully utilize the large site and share the nuclear plant's transmission, water, road and rail infrastructure. When fully developed, CEP will help meet the state's and region's growing demand for electricity. At CEP, AEHI will help the US achieve energy independence, and meet the goal of increasing sources of green energy to reduce CO2 and toxic emissions from the global environment. The CEP as a merchant site should be able to wield power east of the Rockies as needed to meet demand.

Here is the link:

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/aehi-agrees-negotiate-contract-colorado/story.aspx?guid=%7B878490D1-F273-4B8B-A30D-50B21F77EC9F%7D&dist=hppr


If this passes and they develop the 21,000 acer park (which will be the largest of its kind in the country) what will that mean for Pueblo? How much growth will this cause for our region? Are we talking tens of thousands or more???? Does anyone have any knowledge of a project of this scope?

:shrug:

[PuebloStrong]

By PETER ROPER
THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN
Facing a chamber crowded with unhappy local contractors, Pueblo City Council still voted 5-2 Monday night to award a $21.5 million contract to a Colorado Springs construction company to build the city's new police building.

It was a close call in more ways than one. The winning bid, from Nunn Construction, Inc., was less than $120,000 lower than the bid from H.W. Houston Construction, of Pueblo - which is why the council chambers filled with electricians, sheet metal workers and others who wanted the contract awarded to a Pueblo construction company.

Council members said they wanted that, too, but had to follow the city charter in awarding the contract to the "lowest and best" bidder. Nunn's contract is for $20.5 million with an additional $1 million in contingency fees.

"Unfortunately, the saddest part is the local contractor came in at a higher rate than Nunn," Councilwoman Judy Weaver told the local businessmen. "I can't understand why a local company came in second."

Councilmen Ray Aguilera and Larry Atencio voted against the contract award Monday night, but City Attorney Tom Jagger did not give council much room to follow suit. Asked by Councilman Mike Occhiato what council could do, Jagger said the city only had one choice - to approve the low-bid contract - or start the bidding process over. Councilwoman Vera Ortegon said council had already restarted the police building project once before, when a previous architect kept raising the final price to over $33 million.

Telling the audience that council had no choice but to follow the charter language, Ortegon said that despite the hard choice against Houston, council had still saved the city $10 million on the project by discarding the first architect and getting a fresh start with Durrant, the firm that is overseeing the project now.

"If we rejected this contract, there wouldn't just be lawsuits against the city, but lawsuits against us personally," she told her fellow council members.

The vote came after several local contractors or union officials told council it would be a "slap in the face" to the Pueblo workers who live here, not to share in a $21 million construction project, given the closeness of the final bids.

Ray Nunn, president of Nunn Construction, said his company would be using a half-dozen Pueblo subcontractors, but that didn't shift the mood in the room.

"You're going to award the contract because it's a $100,000 less? The electricians on this job will be paid $800,000 alone," Dan Toussaint, business manager of Local 12 of the electrical workers union, told council. "It's a slap in the face to these people behind me to realize they aren't going to get a piece of that pie."

Kenneth Stringer, of Pueblo, said the 30 employees in his electric company need the work.

"The $118,000 between the two bids may not seem like a lot of money to some people, but it's a lot of money to me and my employees," he said. "We belong to (the Pueblo Economic Development Corp.), we pay taxes in this community and we need those jobs."

Ken West, of Houston Construction, told council that if it decided not to rebid the contract, the city should appoint a task force to re-examine its bidding process to guarantee that a local company would not be edged out again.

"In our bid, 17 of the 21 subcontractors were from Pueblo," West said. "We work hard to build economic development in this town. This (award) is not in Pueblo's best interest."

But Councilman Randy Thurston said that when the city discussed a local-preference ordinance in the past, local contractors had lobbied against it, saying it would hurt Pueblo companies in bidding elsewhere.

"There would be worse consequences in the future when other communities decided to do the same," Thurston said.

Aguilera voted against the contract, however, saying Pueblo workers needed the money, not Colorado Springs contractors.

During the work session, Occhiato said he wanted to change the building to include new photovoltaic solar-energy systems, even if it meant putting the project out to rebid.

That sparked responses from Council President Barbara Vidmar, Ortegon, and Weaver, that council had rejected the idea of designing the project for solar energy because the estimated costs had pushed the final price to above $30 million.

"Wasn't the original estimate that it would take about 100 years for the system to pay for itself?" Vidmar quizzed Hal Aavang, who is overseeing the project for Durrant.

He agreed with that estimate but also said the new building would be able to be retrofitted with solar power at any time during or after construction through a separate contract.

Occhiato said his concern was that the city's administration was making decisions about the building without a majority vote from council.

In other action Monday, council gave initial approval to a series of land annexations, totaling 840 acres, to support the Vestas wind-power company's plan to build a turbine-tower factory south of the city. Council will conduct public hearings on those annexations at its Oct. 14 meeting

:hell: :( :koko:

[citycenter]

This is not a surprise. Houston has been a little off their game. They have been pursuing so many projects in NORTHERN Colorado, I am shocked that they even bid on this new police station! NUNN is a good company and should do well for the city of pueblo. It's actually kinda nice to see some "outsiders" get work in Pueblo....this is a town that usually only supports the good old boy network. :yes:

[Eeyore]

[QUOTE=PuebloStrong;3816942]By PETER ROPER
THE PUEBLO CHIEFTAIN
Facing a chamber crowded with unhappy local contractors, Pueblo City Council still voted 5-2 Monday night to award a $21.5 million contract to a Colorado Springs construction company to build the city's new police building.

It was a close call in more ways than one. The winning bid, from Nunn Construction, Inc., was less than $120,000 lower than the bid from H.W. Houston Construction, of Pueblo - which is why the council chambers filled with electricians, sheet metal workers and others who wanted the contract awarded to a Pueblo construction company.

Council members said they wanted that, too, but had to follow the city charter in awarding the contract to the "lowest and best" bidder. Nunn's contract is for $20.5 million with an additional $1 million in contingency fees.

"Unfortunately, the saddest part is the local contractor came in at a higher rate than Nunn," Councilwoman Judy Weaver told the local businessmen. "I can't understand why a local company came in second."

Councilmen Ray Aguilera and Larry Atencio voted against the contract award Monday night, but City Attorney Tom Jagger did not give council much room to follow suit. Asked by Councilman Mike Occhiato what council could do, Jagger said the city only had one choice - to approve the low-bid contract - or start the bidding process over. Councilwoman Vera Ortegon said council had already restarted the police building project once before, when a previous architect kept raising the final price to over $33 million.

Telling the audience that council had no choice but to follow the charter language, Ortegon said that despite the hard choice against Houston, council had still saved the city $10 million on the project by discarding the first architect and getting a fresh start with Durrant, the firm that is overseeing the project now.

"If we rejected this contract, there wouldn't just be lawsuits against the city, but lawsuits against us personally," she told her fellow council members.

The vote came after several local contractors or union officials told council it would be a "slap in the face" to the Pueblo workers who live here, not to share in a $21 million construction project, given the closeness of the final bids.

Ray Nunn, president of Nunn Construction, said his company would be using a half-dozen Pueblo subcontractors, but that didn't shift the mood in the room.

"You're going to award the contract because it's a $100,000 less? The electricians on this job will be paid $800,000 alone," Dan Toussaint, business manager of Local 12 of the electrical workers union, told council. "It's a slap in the face to these people behind me to realize they aren't going to get a piece of that pie."

Kenneth Stringer, of Pueblo, said the 30 employees in his electric company need the work.

"The $118,000 between the two bids may not seem like a lot of money to some people, but it's a lot of money to me and my employees," he said. "We belong to (the Pueblo Economic Development Corp.), we pay taxes in this community and we need those jobs."

Ken West, of Houston Construction, told council that if it decided not to rebid the contract, the city should appoint a task force to re-examine its bidding process to guarantee that a local company would not be edged out again.

"In our bid, 17 of the 21 subcontractors were from Pueblo," West said. "We work hard to build economic development in this town. This (award) is not in Pueblo's best interest."

But Councilman Randy Thurston said that when the city discussed a local-preference ordinance in the past, local contractors had lobbied against it, saying it would hurt Pueblo companies in bidding elsewhere.

"There would be worse consequences in the future when other communities decided to do the same," Thurston said.

Aguilera voted against the contract, however, saying Pueblo workers needed the money, not Colorado Springs contractors.

During the work session, Occhiato said he wanted to change the building to include new photovoltaic solar-energy systems, even if it meant putting the project out to rebid.

That sparked responses from Council President Barbara Vidmar, Ortegon, and Weaver, that council had rejected the idea of designing the project for solar energy because the estimated costs had pushed the final price to above $30 million.

"Wasn't the original estimate that it would take about 100 years for the system to pay for itself?" Vidmar quizzed Hal Aavang, who is overseeing the project for Durrant.

He agreed with that estimate but also said the new building would be able to be retrofitted with solar power at any time during or after construction through a separate contract.

Occhiato said his concern was that the city's administration was making decisions about the building without a majority vote from council.

In other action Monday, council gave initial approval to a series of land annexations, totaling 840 acres, to support the Vestas wind-power company's plan to build a turbine-tower factory south of the city. Council will conduct public hearings on those annexations at its Oct. 14 meeting





"In my opinion this is not what this site is for, that being said I will comment on it.

You know I am a HUGE Pueblo supporter but if a Colorado Springs company can submit a lower bid then they should get the project. There is no fundamental right for company in Pueblo to get the bid, especially if they are higher. Look at our 4th street bridge, the contract went to a Longmount company because they had the lowest bid. That's how it should work, private companies do that all the time.

But I am glad to see the Industrial park being annexed........"

[Eeyore]

Reality check:

Pueblo Metro Area: 200,000

Springs Metro area: 600,000

Total: 800,000.

Denver Metro Area: 3 million.

Plus, Springs and Pueblo aren't even connected.

I basically don't give a rats about SSP anymore, but let's keep it realistic here people.

FRG, I understand this is where you and I differ and that's ok we bring our own unique perspectives to this room, also, I know I tend to be overly optimistic that is just my nature.

That being said I have to make one correction, you said that Pueblo and Colorado Springs are not connected. Since Pueblo has annexed the lariat around the Pueblo Springs Ranch that technically brings the city of Pueblo to the El Paso county line and Fountain is extending down to past the old race track. That means that the two metro areas are essentially touching each other, now granted it is still open space but once the final annexation goes through and the development starts with the Pueblo tech park you will see that close in rather rapidly. Then there will be no question our region will be one metro area with two principal cities.

Finally when I say we will be as large or larger then the Denver Metro area, I am talking long term. It would be foolish (even for me) to think we will catch up in 10 or even 20 years. But if we get a big growth spurt 50 to 100 years out is another story, and in the life if a city that is but a blink of a eye.

[PLANSIT]

^Um, Where to begin on that one?

First, Co. Springs and Pueblo, even with Pueblo Springs Ranch and its potentially ridiculous sprawl, will not bring the area any closer to being a significant statistical area for many many decades. The area between the two is nearly the size of C. Springs north to south. Why would you even want that to happen? There is no real gain from sprawling into each other.

Secondly, If C. Springs and Pueblo do ever become a metro area, it is highly improbable that the area will become larger than the Denver Metro - even 20, 50, or 100 years from now. Denver's grasp regionally is too great. Clustering of energy, finance, and education, along with greater infrastructure and national image reaffirms that Denver's growth will continue.

So, please stop with this nonsense and just focus on the reality of Pueblo. It's a great city that is trying to improve and taking the right steps to do so.

[Eeyore]

^Um, Where to begin on that one?

First, Co. Springs and Pueblo, even with Pueblo Springs Ranch and its potentially ridiculous sprawl, will not bring the area any closer to being a significant statistical area for many many decades. The area between the two is nearly the size of C. Springs north to south. Why would you even want that to happen? There is no real gain from sprawling into each other.

Secondly, If C. Springs and Pueblo do ever become a metro area, it is highly improbable that the area will become larger than the Denver Metro - even 20, 50, or 100 years from now. Denver's grasp regionally is too great. Clustering of energy, finance, and education, along with greater infrastructure and national image reaffirms that Denver's growth will continue.

So, please stop with this nonsense and just focus on the reality of Pueblo. It's a great city that is trying to improve and taking the right steps to do so.

Let me respond by saying that for better or worse I would not mind the Pueblo/ Colorado Springs metro area being the size of the Denver metro area, or close to it. That does not mean that as being a smaller metro area we are not great cities but that is just my personal preference.

Second, the Pueblo Springs Ranch and the Colorado energy park are not your typical developments but in fact the developers are starting a tech park and bringing in the main companies. Thus, if done right it could be a major boost to our area. I am sure people said that the DTC was a bad idea when it was first developed and now look what it has done for Denver. As far as Denver having a grasp on the energy, maybe oil based companies but Pueblo is becoming the regions center for renewable energy as seen by the latest developments and the future lies with renewable energy not fossil based. Thus, Pueblo should see growth as Denver did as this continues to catch on. On top of this we are still known as the manfucturing center for Colorado and the "Pittsburg" of our state.

Finally, we can argue on the fine points but nothing I say is not based on facts and the reality of what is going on in the region. No one knows what the area will look like 10 years from now let alone 100 years from now. Is it possible, even probable, that Denver will be the regions largest metro area YES, but is it also possible that with the growth of renewable energy and the fact that people like Governor Ritter and our senators are trying to make Pueblo the hub for it will cause our region to catch up YES.

Edit 1: You said that Denver is the center for education. Not true, yes you have many great school but we have plenty of great schools down here as well some of which are growing very rapidly. They are the Air Force Academy, University of Colorado at Colorado Springs, Colorado College, Colorado State university - Pueblo (which they want to make the renewable energy school for the region), Pueblo Community college ( it has campuses from Durango to canon city to Pueblo) and Pikes Peak community College. Finally many smaller private school in both cities.

[Top Of The Park]

Are they building the new PD headquarters at the present site? I am asking because I am wondering if they move it, will the river walk extend in the direction of where the current building and parking is?

[Eeyore]

Are they building the new PD headquarters at the present site? I am asking because I am wondering if they move it, will the river walk extend in the direction of where the current building and parking is?

No, they are moving it closer to the Arkansas river but still on main street. I forgot the exact cross street but its just west of the parking garage they built there. This will free up the land by the riverwalk for the planned development that the Denver company is working on which includes 300,000 square feet of office/retail space, a hotel(s), condos, parking garages (as many as 4), movie theater, and fitness center.

Edit 1: Eventually the Riverwalk is going to be extended under Sainte Fe and the Interstate past the baseball field and connect to the lake there. I am told the army corp of engineers will be responsible for that part but at this point nothing is set in stone and that is a good 5-10 years away.

[PuebloStrong]

No, they are moving it closer to the Arkansas river but still on main street. I forgot the exact cross street but its just west of the parking garage they built there. This will free up the land by the riverwalk for the planned development that the Denver company is working on which includes 300,000 square feet of office/retail space, a hotel(s), condos, parking garages (as many as 4), movie theater, and fitness center.

Edit 1: Eventually the Riverwalk is going to be extended under Sainte Fe and the Interstate past the baseball field and connect to the lake there. I am told the army corp of engineers will be responsible for that part but at this point nothing is set in stone and that is a good 5-10 years away.

:previous:

The “Grand Gardens” proposal is a $160 million development that will be constructed in and around the area encompassing HARP Phase III in downtown Pueblo. With such tenants as a movie theatre, bookstore, and fitness center, along side boutique shopping space and restaurants, Grand Gardens represents a catalyst development that will stimulate economic activity and growth for Pueblo.

Because there is a significant public investment component with Grand Gardens, several months of negotiation is expected before construction may begin. In addition to the negotiation process, there is much legwork that must take place on both the public and private end of the development; such work will take place concurrently with the negotiation process. Financing the public improvements, including four parking structures, infrastructure improvements, HARP expansion, and a possible expansion of the Pueblo Convention Center, may come from a variety of sources. Importantly, all sources of revenue will stem from the revenue potential of Grand Gardens itself. I.e., as Grand Gardens spins-off tax revenue, such revenue may be used to service revenue bonds sold to investors to finance public improvements up-front.

In December of 2006, in a joint effort with the HARP Authority, the URAP co-published a request for proposals (RFP) in an attempt to solicit “Master Developers” to improve the parcels in and around HARP Phase III. In January 2007, two development proposals were received as a result of the RFP.

In an effort to evaluate said proposals, and in conjunction with the City of Pueblo, Pueblo County, and the HARP Authority, a 21 member “Task Force” was created, which included representatives from the URAP, URAP staff, Pueblo City Council, City of Pueblo staff, the HARP Authority, the HARP Foundation, HARP Authority staff, the Pueblo County Board of Commissioners, Pueblo County staff, PEDCO, the Latino Chamber, the Greater Pueblo Chamber, the Downtown Association, and the Union Avenue Historic District Association.

Over the course of four meetings, the Task Force met to discuss and review the proposals with the goal to eventually formulate an official recommendation selecting a preferred developer. Apart from staff research and organization, the URAP contracted with several third party experts to help guide the selection process and review both proposals. The consultants include the following: URAP Bond Counsel, URAP Financial Counsel, Leland Consulting (real estate analysts), and, perhaps most importantly, Arnold Ray, who is an expert in the field of crafting large-scale public/private development deals.

The Task Force recommended Grand Gardens, LLC, as the preferred developer. On May 15th, 2007, the URAP Board of Commissioners officially endorsed Grand Gardens as the preferred development concept; likewise, on May 23, 2007, the HARP Authority endorsed Grand Gardens.

I heard Barns and Noble Bookstore plans to move into "Grand Garden" from Eaglerigde Shopping Center! Here is link to final site plan of "Grand Garden": http://pueblourbanrenewal.org/main/images/final_siteplan_.jpg

Only The Facts, People! :cool:

[Front_Range_Guy]

Presenting the first ever "Colorado Springs Funny Headline of the Day."

"Man in murder-for-hire plot wanted breast implants for girlfriend" (http://www.gazette.com/news/barnett_41030___article.html/police_fountain.html)

From The Colorado Springs Gazette. (http://www.gazette.com)

[wong21fr]

:rolleyes:

Yes but this is the 21st century and the technology is much better. Look at France they have nuclear plants all over and no issues.

Having this devlopment along with Pueblo Springs and the industrial park south of town will allow Pueblo to finally be the states largest city and help make the Pueblo/ Colorado Springs metro the largest metro in the region.

As long as you are doing some wishful thinking, realize that there are currently no civilian none-water cooled reactors in the United States and any utility would need to seek DOE certification for any alternate mode system. This energy campus is built on a lot of wishful thinking and hedging. I'm betting that they are primarily focused on getting an Xcel energy contract for a solar or wind plant. If Xcel looks at building a nuclear plant, maybe they have a chance. But, it's definitely a long shot.

Compare this announcement with Conoco Phillips alternate energy research campus in Denver. That's a project that is a force and one that has the capital lined up to actually build it.

[Eeyore]

As long as you are doing some wishful thinking, realize that there are currently no civilian none-water cooled reactors in the United States and any utility would need to seek DOE certification for any alternate mode system. This energy campus is built on a lot of wishful thinking and hedging. I'm betting that they are primarily focused on getting an Xcel energy contract for a solar or wind plant. If Xcel looks at building a nuclear plant, maybe they have a chance. But, it's definitely a long shot.

Compare this announcement with Conoco Phillips alternate energy research campus in Denver. That's a project that is a force and one that has the capital lined up to actually build it.

I admit I am not a expert in the field but just going by the Wall Street Journal and The Pueblo Chieftain on this topic. They say that contracts have been signed to develop what would be the "largest" energy park of its kind in the country and they want to develop CSU - Pueblo and Pueblo Community College. My friend who is a accountant for a Siemens looked at the proposal and said it could mean up to 20,000 new jobs!

Time will tell if what they say pans out or not but I hope it does for Pueblo, the state of Colorado and America...
:shrug:

Edit 1: Your comment about Denver does not surprise me either. If you look at what cities in Colorado have the best infrastructure to be business and industrial hubs the top two are Denver and Pueblo. We have the best east-west and north-south roads intersecting in the cities, best train access, best rivers, best natural gas lines, best power lines etc, all in one area. The gazette even admits that the Springs does not have the capacity to attract the type of industry Pueblo can (they said that when Pueblo got the Vestas plant as a reason they could never have attracted a company like that). Given this its no wonder that Denver is Colorado's "first" city and Pueblo (even given our size) is still considered Colorado's "second" city.

[bunt_q]

-

[Front_Range_Guy]

Having watched PuebloStrong and Eeyore's interaction's here, and having spent some time in Pueblo with friends who live there in recent weeks, I can't help but wonder if, to some extent, the city is looking at itself through rose colored glasses.

It's true Pueblo is, as it should be, reaping the benefits of recent investments in infrastructure, education, culture, and economic development... and a state government controlled by the democrats. You have no idea how disenfranchised I am by my own party.

My point is... outside of Colorado, most people probably don't look at Pueblo with the same adoration that people with connections to Pueblo do. In fact, I'm guessing across the country, people are most familiar with Denver, Aspen, Vail, and Boulder long before Colorado Springs or Pueblo enters their minds... and I'm willing to bet more people are familiar with Colorado Springs than Pueblo.

I love the community spirit in Pueblo, but it has a long way to go before it can call itself Colorado 2nd city (whatever the hell that means) and at a certain point, there is a risk that the unfettered boosterism will start to make the city look silly.

I try my damndest to be honest about El Paso County, and I think it's only fair that posters from other city's should do the same.

I guess I could throw away the facts and start becoming a shameless Colorado Springs booster... but I have no desire to feel like a moron.

[PLANSIT]

That's why I post less in this thread. The additional Pueblo posters are great, but the ridiculous nature of their boosterism is impossible to respond to - they are not listening. All these erroneous predictions and comparisons are just silly.

[Eeyore]

Having watched PuebloStrong and Eeyore's interaction's here, and having spent some time in Pueblo with friends who live there in recent weeks, I can't help but wonder if, to some extent, the city is looking at itself through rose colored glasses.

It's true Pueblo is, as it should be, reaping the benefits of recent investments in infrastructure, education, culture, and economic development... and a state government controlled by the democrats. You have no idea how disenfranchised I am by my own party.

My point is... outside of Colorado, most people probably don't look at Pueblo with the same adoration that people with connections to Pueblo do. In fact, I'm guessing across the country, people are most familiar with Denver, Aspen, Vail, and Boulder long before Colorado Springs or Pueblo enters their minds... and I'm willing to bet more people are familiar with Colorado Springs than Pueblo.

I love the community spirit in Pueblo, but it has a long way to go before it can call itself Colorado 2nd city (whatever the hell that means) and at a certain point, there is a risk that the unfettered boosterism will start to make the city look silly.

I try my damndest to be honest about El Paso County, and I think it's only fair that posters from other city's should do the same.

I guess I could throw away the facts and start becoming a shameless Colorado Springs booster... but I have no desire to feel like a moron.

I think I might surprise you but I think you are partially right, my friends tell me all the time that I am Pueblo's biggest "cheerleader" and a "optimist". That does not mean my facts are not right, i never post things that i just make up, I just take the best possible outcome of every possible development when in real life that does not always happen. I don't think that makes me a moran but someone who loves the city he lives in and always likes to talk about it. I know in the grand scheme of things Pueblo is nothing more then a city of 100,000 but then again in the grand scheme of things we are but on one tiny planet in a vast universe.

FRG, I am 35 years old and have been a champion of Pueblo all my life, I have a MBA and could live anywhere but choose to live here because I love this city and the front range urban corridor. That being said if you feel that my posts are not helping this room I have no problem stopping. You were the one who asked me to join it from seeing my posts on the Gazette and you know my style. Let me know.

Edit 1: I have to remind you that on the Pueblo thread you called Pueblo "colorado's second city". Here is your quote "The Pueblo Metro Area is home to around 150,000 people and is located about 113 miles south of Denver, or about 40 miles south of Colorado Springs. Pueblo is in many ways the economic hub for Southeast Colorado, and is sometimes referred to as Colorado's Second City despite the fact that population wise, it is not."

[Front_Range_Guy]

Yeah, you're right. I was partially mad about something posted in another thread when I unloaded here this morning. Sorry.

I was a much more positive person back then, now I pretty much hate everything and everyone. :o) (at least in the context of SSP-land)

Take what I say with a grain of salt, anymore, I just come here to vent.

[Eeyore]

Yeah, you're right. I was partially mad about something posted in another thread when I unloaded here this morning. Sorry.

I was a much more positive person back then, now I pretty much hate everything and everyone. :o) (at least in the context of SSP-land)

Take what I say with a grain of salt, anymore, I just come here to vent.

Ok, thats fair. Do you want to say what it was that got you so mad?

[Front_Range_Guy]

Blah... it's dumb. Sometimes I get into moods where I care what strangers on internet forums think... forget it.

[PLANSIT]

^ I think you adhere to the saying: "I hate people, but like persons".

[Front_Range_Guy]

:) Something like that.

[PuebloStrong]

Having watched PuebloStrong and Eeyore's interaction's here, and having spent some time in Pueblo with friends who live there in recent weeks, I can't help but wonder if, to some extent, the city is looking at itself through rose colored glasses.

It's true Pueblo is, as it should be, reaping the benefits of recent investments in infrastructure, education, culture, and economic development... and a state government controlled by the democrats. You have no idea how disenfranchised I am by my own party.

My point is... outside of Colorado, most people probably don't look at Pueblo with the same adoration that people with connections to Pueblo do. In fact, I'm guessing across the country, people are most familiar with Denver, Aspen, Vail, and Boulder long before Colorado Springs or Pueblo enters their minds... and I'm willing to bet more people are familiar with Colorado Springs than Pueblo.

I love the community spirit in Pueblo, but it has a long way to go before it can call itself Colorado 2nd city (whatever the hell that means) and at a certain point, there is a risk that the unfettered boosterism will start to make the city look silly.

I try my damndest to be honest about El Paso County, and I think it's only fair that posters from other city's should do the same.

I guess I could throw away the facts and start becoming a shameless Colorado Springs booster... but I have no desire to feel like a moron.

Front_Range_Guy,

I have a question for you, Front_Range_Guy. How many online friends you got? I got over 1700 online friend and Eeyore is my newest top online friend! I run city's myspace, pueblo west's myspace, centennail high school's myspace, and my personal myspace! My lastest comment I made to be funny joke, guys.

JB
The Bulldog Network!

[PuebloStrong]

^Um, Where to begin on that one?

First, Co. Springs and Pueblo, even with Pueblo Springs Ranch and its potentially ridiculous sprawl, will not bring the area any closer to being a significant statistical area for many many decades. The area between the two is nearly the size of C. Springs north to south. Why would you even want that to happen? There is no real gain from sprawling into each other.

Secondly, If C. Springs and Pueblo do ever become a metro area, it is highly improbable that the area will become larger than the Denver Metro - even 20, 50, or 100 years from now. Denver's grasp regionally is too great. Clustering of energy, finance, and education, along with greater infrastructure and national image reaffirms that Denver's growth will continue.

So, please stop with this nonsense and just focus on the reality of Pueblo. It's a great city that is trying to improve and taking the right steps to do so.

To me, Pueblo Springs Ranch "Pueblo East Project" is second pueblo west for the city of pueblo! Pueblo West design to be a major suburb for Pueblo.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Hey, maybe we could change Pueblo's name to "Pueblo Middle."

I don't know that there's much point in mentioning (again) that "major suburbs" take jobs and people away from the primary city in the metro area, leading to decay in town, and forcing people to commute for work and to shop, increasing congestion and pollution. I'm not being negative here. It's just common sense.

Also, I don't hate the suburbs necessarily. I just don't see how a person who has their favorite city's best interest at heart, can support the expansion of the suburbs. Nevermind the economy.

[Eeyore]

Hey, maybe we could change Pueblo's name to "Pueblo Middle."

I don't know that there's much point in mentioning (again) that "major suburbs" take jobs and people away from the primary city in the metro area, leading to decay in town, and forcing people to commute for work and to shop, increasing congestion and pollution. I'm not being negative here. It's just common sense.

Also, I don't hate the suburbs necessarily. I just don't see how a person who has their favorite city's best interest at heart, can support the expansion of the suburbs. Nevermind the economy.

FRG, I understand that you are against Pueblo Springs but what do you think about the proposed 21,000 acer "Colorado Energy Park" east of Pueblo???

:shrug:

[Front_Range_Guy]

Pueblo strong referred to Pueblo East as a second Pueblo West... I have no problem with clean energy (assuming that's what the Colorado Energy Park is), but "second Pueblo West" implies sprawl to me...

(I haven't been following the thread that closely.)

[Eeyore]

Pueblo strong referred to Pueblo East as a second Pueblo West... I have no problem with clean energy (assuming that's what the Colorado Energy Park is), but "second Pueblo West" implies sprawl to me...

(I haven't been following the thread that closely.)

FRG, Yes the new engery park will be the largest "renewable energy" park in the country. It will include but not limited to: solar PV and CSP, wind, biomass, small-hydro and nuclear.

As far as Pueblostrong calling the new "Pueblo Springs", "Pueblo East" I think he is referring to the location more then what it will be like once it is developed. Pueblo West was meant to be spread out as that was the thing to do back in the 1970's. The Pueblo Springs developers plan on having over 75,000 hosing units or 200,000 people on only 24,000 acers once it is fully developed. That population added to the current population of Pueblo will make us about the Size of the city of Colorado Springs is today but with less then 1/2 the land aera used.

Edit 1: just to clarify the Pueblo Springs development and the new energy park are two separate developments in Pueblo County. Pueblo Springs is 24,000 acers north of the current city limits and will include a tech park and housing units (both single family and multi-family). While the Colorado Energy park is 21,000 acers located east of the current city limits and will only include business (both power companies and heavy industrial). Both have little to do with the city per say and are private devlopers who picked the area due to the potential they see in Pueblo and our infrastructure.

[The Dirt]

What I don't understand is where Pueblo is getting the demand for 75,000 housing units. Does it have record low vacancy? Are there a lot of people driving into Pueblo for work from out of town and wish to move there? Is this research park going to create enough jobs to fill 75,000 households? I just don't see how it's possible to entice 200,000 people to move to Pueblo just based on housing availability. Something about this seems wonky. When is Pueblo Springs projected to be completely built out?

[Eeyore]

What I don't understand is where Pueblo is getting the demand for 75,000 housing units. Does it have record low vacancy? Are there a lot of people driving into Pueblo for work from out of town and wish to move there? Is this research park going to create enough jobs to fill 75,000 households? I just don't see how it's possible to entice 200,000 people to move to Pueblo just based on housing availability. Something about this seems wonky. When is Pueblo Springs projected to be completely built out?

I am not a expert in this I admit but I can say what I have read in the paper about the development. First off the Pueblo Springs was proposed and the annexation process was started long before the Colorado Energy Park was so I don't think the two are related at all and they are far apart so I don't see many people living in Pueblo Springs who works there.

My understanding is the developers are counting on the new tech park they will devlop by exit 110 to create the demand for the housing such as the development in the Denver Tech center has created the demand for the housing near there. Also, the growth of Fort Carson, which is just 5 to 10 miles north of Pueblo Springs is a major factor and they are planing many of those solgers to live in the area.

Edit 1: I don't know what the build out time is for The Pueblo Springs Development but the developers have said that phase 1 of the development has to be big enough to pay for the entire development. Not sure how big they mean when they say that though but we should find out fourth quarter this year or first quarter next year...

Finally, does anyone know what the big building is going up in Monument by the new theater? They are using big cranes and I see it all the time on my way to Denver but no sign????

[Front_Range_Guy]

The building in Monument is a hotel going up... 10 floors, I think. Maybe 11. Also, I think it's actually in Springs city limits...

I'm guessing the concept for Pueblo Springs was hatched before the economic apocalypse started. I doubt much will happen with it anytime soon.
It would seem that Pueblo is doing a relatively decent job at positioning itself to attract people and jobs once things pick back up again, but we're probably talking about a significant amount of time before that happens.

... though, getting back to The Dirt's point... a significant number of those homes will be sold to current residents who decide to move further out, which will not bode well for the center part of town.

I do belive that most people in Pueblo are liberal and progressive, willing to invest in their city... so I certainly think there is reason to be excited for the future. Just maybe not *quite* as excited as Eeyore is :o)

[Front_Range_Guy]

... on a completely different note, I found this little project by the Gazette to be delightfully morbid (http://www2.gazette.com/homicides/), and thought I might share.

[Eeyore]

... on a completely different note, I found this little project by the Gazette to be delightfully morbid (http://www2.gazette.com/homicides/), and thought I might share.

FRG that is funny in a morbid way... Does that go under the joke that you know you city has to many homicides when????

[The Dirt]

Wow. That just goes to show how much of a hotbed of criminal activity Colorado Springs is. We should just burn the whole city to the ground and move everyone 20 mile east to new suburban homes with acres and acres of peaceful tranquility, where you can spend your days in your 5,000 sq ft basement away from all the murders and sin of "the city".

[Eeyore]

I just heard on KCSJ that focus on the family is moving part of its organization east to save money and that will mean a loss of up to 50 jobs in the Springs....

[PLANSIT]

^That's great. Just a few thousand to go!

[PuebloStrong]

Here the facts from wikipedia and me, about suburb:

1.Lower densities than central cities, dominated by single-family homes on small plots of land, surrounded at close quarters by very similar dwellings.

A. Pueblo West have density of 218 per sq mile, and city's density is 2,265 per sq mile. City have 10 time bigger density of pueblo west!

2. Zoning patterns that separate residential and commercial development, as well as different intensities and densities of development. Daily needs are not within walking distance of most homes.

B. Pueblo West has no sidewalk , yet major trails design to stay alway from commercial development.

3. Subdivisions carved from previously rural land into multiple-home developments built by a single real estate company. These subdivisions are often segregated by minute differences in home value, creating entire communities where family incomes and demographics are almost completely homogenous, although suburban developments have become and are becoming more diverse.

C. Rural Subdivisions.

4. Shopping malls and strip malls behind large parking lots instead of a classic downtown shopping district.

D. Pueblo West Market Place, and Walmart Supercenter Shopping Center.

5. A road network designed to conform to a hierarchy, including culs-de-sac leading to larger residential streets, in turn leading to large collector roads, in place of the grid pattern common to most central cities and pre-World War II suburbs.

E. LOL, I dont understand the road design of pueblo west!

6. A greater percentage of one-story adminstrative buildings than in urban areas.

F. Yes, all pueblo west's building is one-story tall!

7. Limited or no access to public transit.

G. No city buses, and only school buses!

Any Comment on this facts?!

JB

[Eeyore]

Here the facts from wikipedia and me, about suburb:

1.Lower densities than central cities, dominated by single-family homes on small plots of land, surrounded at close quarters by very similar dwellings.

A. Pueblo West have density of 218 per sq mile, and city's density is 2,265 per sq mile. City have 10 time bigger density of pueblo west!

2. Zoning patterns that separate residential and commercial development, as well as different intensities and densities of development. Daily needs are not within walking distance of most homes.

B. Pueblo West has no sidewalk , yet major trails design to stay alway from commercial development.

3. Subdivisions carved from previously rural land into multiple-home developments built by a single real estate company. These subdivisions are often segregated by minute differences in home value, creating entire communities where family incomes and demographics are almost completely homogenous, although suburban developments have become and are becoming more diverse.

C. Rural Subdivisions.

4. Shopping malls and strip malls behind large parking lots instead of a classic downtown shopping district.

D. Pueblo West Market Place, and Walmart Supercenter Shopping Center.

5. A road network designed to conform to a hierarchy, including culs-de-sac leading to larger residential streets, in turn leading to large collector roads, in place of the grid pattern common to most central cities and pre-World War II suburbs.

E. LOL, I dont understand the road design of pueblo west!

6. A greater percentage of one-story adminstrative buildings than in urban areas.

F. Yes, all pueblo west's building is one-story tall!

7. Limited or no access to public transit.

G. No city buses, and only school buses!

Any Comment on this facts?!

JB

I have to admit I don't understand the reason for this post? No one questions if Pueblo West is a suburb or not, its obviously a suburb of Pueblo just some people prefer the density of Pueblo and to be honest I happen to agree with them. That is why I am glad Pueblo is annexing Pueblo Springs that way we don't have another Pueblo West on our hands........... But adamantly that is just a personal preference.....

[PuebloStrong]

I have to admit I don't understand the reason for this post? No one questions if Pueblo West is a suburb or not, its obviously a suburb of Pueblo just some people prefer the density of Pueblo and to be honest I happen to agree with them. That is why I am glad Pueblo is annexing Pueblo Springs that way we don't have another Pueblo West on our hands........... But adamantly that is just a personal preference.....

Just Making a major point about pueblo west as suburb for the city! Not about pueblo west as new city, and pueblo west want to be city in next 5 years. Remember pueblo west takes alway our mega growth from the city past 30 years!

JB

[Eeyore]

Just Making a major point about pueblo west as suburb for the city! Not about pueblo west as new city, and pueblo west want to be city in next 5 years. Remember pueblo west takes alway our mega growth from the city past 30 years!

JB

Pueblo has not had any mega growth in the past 30 years for Pueblo West to take. Even if Pueblo West would not have been developed and all the population was in the city of Pueblo they are only 30,000 and that would make the city of Pueblo about 135,000 now, compare that with the growth of the Springs, Denver or Fort Collins and that is small. Even if you look at what Pueblo has done in the past that is a small rate of growth, for example from 1880 to 1890 Pueblo saw a growth rate of over 600%!

Now all that being said I still believe in Pueblo's future, mainly because of our location. That is why it was settled with a fort and why our founders picked this site to start a city. Secondly is our infrastructure, second to only Denver with how good it is, and with some easy improvements we can catch up to them as well.

[bunt_q]

The Pueblo Springs developers plan on having over 75,000 hosing units or 200,000 people on only 24,000 acers once it is fully developed. That population added to the current population of Pueblo will make us about the Size of the city of Colorado Springs is today but with less then 1/2 the land aera used.


3 dwelling units per acre (dua) - the measure planners use to discuss densities - is a typical suburban density. That's not a bit denser than any other traditional suburban design. And not a bit denser than Colorado Springs.

[Front_Range_Guy]

The DOC has selected Colorado Springs for it's new HQ.

[Eeyore]

The DOC has selected Colorado Springs for it's new HQ.

Where did you see that?

Edit: Yea, I called the Pueblo Chieftain and they confirmed.

Edit 2: I am curious to see the kind of deal that Colorado Springs gave the DOC to stay there. Given your financial situation there I am surprised you were able to match the amount Pueblo was willing to give. It will be interesting to see the details when they come out, and the fall out on the fall ellections from it since most people up there are against any incentives.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I wouldn't be surprised if a good chunk of the money came from the developer. This was another case of a development already on the drawing board in dire need of a major tenant. When I look at deals like the USOC and the DOC, I do wonder if Colorado Springs will be able to live up to it's end of the bargain. Watching the news, one would think Colorado Springs could financially implode and declare bankruptcy at any moment.

Granted, I just skimmed through the press release, but it seems like the DOC was playing up the location as being close enough to the prisons in Fremont County, etc. without being terribly far away from Denver, and also the fact that it was the best deal from a financial stand point. The developer was playing up the green aspects of the project. The building will be 100,000 square feet with gold leed certification. I haven't seen a rendering, but based on the location and type of project that's been proposed, I can only assume it will be a sprawling, suburban style building of 3 or 4 floors.

OT: back in June I went to Centennial Hall and changed my address and affiliation from unaffiliated to Democratic, and somehow those changes were never saved in the clerk & recorders records. Maybe I'm paranoid, but I'm having a hard time believing it was a simple oversight. I'll be sure to check up on them in a few days. Considering how much "benefit of the doubt" I have given these people in my life, this makes me incredibly angry.

[PuebloStrong]

Pueblo has not had any mega growth in the past 30 years for Pueblo West to take. Even if Pueblo West would not have been developed and all the population was in the city of Pueblo they are only 30,000 and that would make the city of Pueblo about 135,000 now, compare that with the growth of the Springs, Denver or Fort Collins and that is small. Even if you look at what Pueblo has done in the past that is a small rate of growth, for example from 1880 to 1890 Pueblo saw a growth rate of over 600%!

Now all that being said I still believe in Pueblo's future, mainly because of our location. That is why it was settled with a fort and why our founders picked this site to start a city. Secondly is our infrastructure, second to only Denver with how good it is, and with some easy improvements we can catch up to them as well.

Pueblo West Metro Limit is touching our city limit at plattville/dillon train crossing, guys! Why our city goverment focas on pueblo spring ranch and not on pueblo west? To me, pw have major infrastructure, people, and growth. Just realize pueblo spring ranch is north of city, my new nickname of the project is "Pueblo North", because old nickname like putting down our county farming towns.

[Eeyore]

Pueblo West Metro Limit is touching our city limit at plattville/dillon train crossing, guys! Why our city goverment focas on pueblo spring ranch and not on pueblo west? To me, pw have major infrastructure, people, and growth. Just realize pueblo spring ranch is north of city, my new nickname of the project is "Pueblo North", because old nickname like putting down our county farming towns.

Actually Pueblo West has little infrastructure, that has been one of their biggest obsticales with incorporating the metro district into a city. Most of the roads are not paved, they have no gutter system to speak of, and you get out past a certain point and they are still on propane, lack cable and with few companies there the tax base is low to help fix a lot of these issues.

As far as Pueblo Ranch is concerned, this is not the city of Pueblo going "oh look at that land north of town, lets annex it so we can develop it and be spread out" as many people seem to think. This is a developer from Las Vegas who bought an old ranch because he thinks our area is prime for major growth and will develop it rather its in the city of Pueblo or not. For the developer its beneficial to have it in the city because he gets the use of our water, wont have to duplicate municipal services, leaving all of that to an already organized city. This will allow him to focus on recruiting companies to the new tech park so he will be able to sale houses that way he can make his money faster. Pueblo benefits from this because we get the population in the city and not have new suburbs surround us (I have lived here all my life and, for better or worse, I can say that Pueblo has never liked the fact we are no longer the states second largest city). Finally, we get some control as to how he develops it so its not one big sprawling mess of a "city" in northern Pueblo county. For example, I have seen how some of the major roads will go there from the current city and I have liked their ideas. I am not sure if that kind of corporation would of been possible if they would develop a city then later try to connect the two, look at Pueblo West. We still only have one major access there from Pueblo and it has been around for over 30 years!

In my opinion, its to late for Pueblo West, like it or not it is what it is and I would be surprised if it is ever annexed in the city of Pueblo. However, now is the time to develop a plan for Pueblo Springs (even if it takes 50 years to develop it will develop) and Pueblo can be proactive and have a nice pattern for growth laid out for the city for the next 50 years or we can sit back and let another sprawling mess get developed that the next generation will be asking "what were they thinking?"

Edit 1: I would like to tell a story about why I think Pueblo does not like that fact we are no longer the states second largest city. When I was a kid growing up here in the 80's, I can remember my grandparents generation (born from the 1910's to the 1920's) telling me how when they where in their prime (1940's and 1950's and 1960's) they would think Pueblo was the "cats meow" because we were the states second largest city. Even if you look back to stories in the Chieftain you can see a different attitude from the city in those years. Now maybe this is a right or wrong way to think, that can be debated, but I believe that deep down Pueblo longs to regain that title and that is one reason you see us vote every thing in that we think will help us get there. Not out of some since of duty or liberal philosophy but a since of we better do all we can to regain our title or we will continue to be left out in the dust....

[Front_Range_Guy]

Nothing earth shattering here, but an interesting read about some proposed changes to standards for building downtown... (http://csbj.com/story.cfm?ID=20390)

I have no idea what to think about this... uh... thing. (http://www.olivereg.com/University_Village_Colorado.html)

... and a quote from the business journal for Eeyore.

“We’ll look at what these cities do, and maybe we need to imitate what they do,” Crowley said. “Denver’s been doing well for itself for many years, and lately Pueblo has also. We’ll look at what our sister cities are doing that we aren’t.”

[Eeyore]

Nothing earth shattering here, but an interesting read about some proposed changes to standards for building downtown... (http://csbj.com/story.cfm?ID=20390)

I have no idea what to think about this... uh... thing. (http://www.olivereg.com/University_Village_Colorado.html)

... and a quote from the business journal for Eeyore.

FRG,

I am not sure about the new standards either, you guys have done that before. In fact in seems that's all you do, one study after another for your downtown then when the study is done nothing seems to happen. Then you have another study lol but maybe I am just cynical.

As far as the market place, I like that but not sure exactly where they want to put it? Can you explain where that would go? That is the "new" thing now around the county, look at what they replaced the Villa Itala mall in Denver with and Pueblo has two going in (downtown and one by csu -P) as well in downtown San Diego and its very popular.

Finally, I liked your quote about Pueblo, made my day lol

[Front_Range_Guy]

I'm cynical too. I'm trying to be less cynical and rejoin the forum. You're not helping. :P

University Village is planned for North Nevada Avenue between Fillmore and Woodmen and is meant to tie in with UCCS, which is planning to build various sports and reasearch facilities on the other side of Nevada from University Village.

I thought you would like that quote. :)

[Eeyore]

I like the concept of the university village. I do find it interesting that both schools in our area start one at the same time?!?!?! It almost seems like they look at what one does then they need to have the same thing. Keeping up with the joneses. But great idea...

[Front_Range_Guy]

They've actually been working on the concept for a couple of years, and there has been a lot of controversy over it. It started as a fairly inovative concept, truly urban... then they switched it to your average suburban strip mall, which caused outrage amongst those who care, and it went back to the drawing board. I think it's still too suburban, but I guess it looks better than the previous version. I found that website looking for information on the development that the DOC will be part of.

A couple of years back, CU named UCCS it's "growth campus" for the next whatever amount of years... 20, I think. I'm guessing UCCS and CSU Pueblo are getting so much attention because the university systems feel like they've got everything set up how they like it in Fort Collins and Boulder, and now it's time to start cleaning things up "down south."

That of course, is total speculation on my part.

[PLANSIT]

I'm cynical too. I'm trying to be less cynical and rejoin the forum. You're not helping. :P

University Village is planned for North Nevada Avenue between Fillmore and Woodmen and is meant to tie in with UCCS, which is planning to build various sports and reasearch facilities on the other side of Nevada from University Village.

I thought you would like that quote. :)

What a shithole. I hate C. Springs. This is ridiculous, you have a sweet opportunity to build a lasting retail component of a semi-major University and this is what you come up with?! I'm pissed.

FRG, do you have the original rendering?

[Front_Range_Guy]

No, I don't. I'm not sure I ever actually saw a rendering, I just remember reading an opinion piece in the Independent by someone who was outraged by the new design when the change was made. I can't seem to find it in google now, but it seems like this whole thing goes back to 2004 at least.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Here, though, (http://www.olivereg.com/Pdf/UVC/Gazette%20Articles.pdf) is an interesting collection of articles about developments related to UCCS that the developer has compiled. It seems like the bottom article sort of touches on some of the distaste for the project.

[PLANSIT]

Thanks for that.

A tunnel, that's it, a tunnel? Wow.

[Eeyore]

Here, though, (http://www.olivereg.com/Pdf/UVC/Gazette%20Articles.pdf) is an interesting collection of articles about developments related to UCCS that the developer has compiled. It seems like the bottom article sort of touches on some of the distaste for the project.

I think you guys need something closer to downtown Colorado Springs, something like the 16th street mall in Denver or the river walk in Pueblo but your own to bring people downtown to shop...

To bad you cant move the power plant and use that land to design a new urban shopping center and river walk, but I know that would most likely cost to much money.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I think you guys need something closer to downtown Colorado Springs, something like the 16th street mall in Denver or the river walk in Pueblo but your own to bring people downtown to shop...

To bad you cant move the power plant and use that land to design a new urban shopping center and river walk, but I know that would most likely cost to much money.

The reason I held out hope for Colorado Springs as long as I did is that there is plenty of *potential* all over the place to do amazing things. Everywhere I look, I don't see what is... I see what could & should be. The problem is there is ZERO leadership here, and until changes, none of that potential will ever be realized.

[Eeyore]

The reason I held out hope for Colorado Springs as long as I did is that there is plenty of *potential* all over the place to do amazing things. Everywhere I look, I don't see what is... I see what could & should be. The problem is there is ZERO leadership here, and until changes, none of that potential will ever be realized.

But what I don't understand is you guys grew so much when I was a kid, with people like your former mayor Bob Isaac. Seemed like back in the 80's and 90's the Springs could do no wrong? Was that the truth or were they just able to hide the problems????

[Front_Range_Guy]

The world has changed since that time, and Colorado Springs hasn't. Plus, the evangelicals moved in, and the far right have tightened their grip on the county. Also, Mayors Isaac and Makepeace actually provided leadership. Rivera could not care less about this town.

[Eeyore]

The world has changed since that time, and Colorado Springs hasn't.

So is it like Pueblo was, we grew in the 50's, 60's and early 70's then we did not change with the world so we sputtered out till just recently when we realized the hard way we had to change.

For the Springs you started everything 20 years after so now you are in your "wake up faze"?

if this is the case then for some reason it seems like once a city in Colorado becomes the second largest city they seem to sit back and think that growth should come? If this is true I wonder if this is just true of Colorado's second largest cities over time or most states????