[Eeyore]

This article is proof that not only me and Pueblo's media is noticing CSU Pueblo but the secret is out so I predict in 15 to 20 years CSU Pueblo will be on the same level as CU Boulder and CSU...

:wizard:

[Eeyore]

Ok I just found some bad news that I have to say here. The Pueblo Transit Authority no longer give free rides for CSU - Pueblo students. I think the city should fire the anti Pueblo people running the system and hire some real leaders. This is absolutely ridclious.

[wong21fr]

This article is proof that not only me and Pueblo's media is noticing CSU Pueblo but the secret is out so I predict in 15 to 20 years CSU Pueblo will be on the same level as CU Boulder and CSU...

:wizard:

Only in your mind as you sit in the padded room.

I predict that CSU-P will reach 10,000 students in the next ten years and will be a solid mid-level school servicing southern Colorado and providing opportunities for the younger generations so that they can get the hell out of there.

And it will continue to be the doormat for other RMAC teams. ;)

[Eeyore]

Only in your mind as you sit in the padded room.

I predict that CSU-P will reach 10,000 students in the next ten years and will be a solid mid-level school servicing southern Colorado and providing opportunities for the younger generations so that they can get the hell out of there.

And it will continue to be the doormat for other RMAC teams. ;)

You and I agree on where CSU Pueblo will be in the next 10 years. I guess where we disagree is where is will be in 20 years. I predict it will be around 20,000 students...

:cool:

[wong21fr]

And I bet it will take a lot longer, if ever, to reach 20,000.

But to be the equal of CU? Never.

[Eeyore]

And I bet it will take a lot longer, if ever, to reach 20,000.

But to be the equal of CU? Never.

Once its at 20,000 students then it will be in the same leauge as CU and CSU but be in a warmer climate yet still only a hour and a half drive to ski. That will make it more apealing to students.

:D

[wong21fr]

^Jesus, is that how you actually rank colleges?

Whatever. CSU-P should just bus in some illegal aliens and call it a day then. Because obviously you don't give a shit whether the institution actually offers quality programs and is recognized for it's outstanding academics and research. It's all about size. If CSU-P didn't give a any degrees at all you wouldn't care as long as it was big.

Well here's a number that CSU-P needs to hit to be considered in the same caliber as CU. One. One Nobel prize winning professor. Just one.

It's not the size that counts, it's how you use it. If you believe the other way, than that's your extreme loss.

[glowrock]

Once its at 20,000 students then it will be in the same leauge as CU and CSU but be in a warmer climate yet still only a hour and a half drive to ski. That will make it more apealing to students.

:D

Eeyore, you're insane. Not insane in a good way, just freaking out of your mind insane!

If you think number of students and warmer climate is all there is to having a major university, you're either insane or are simply living in your own little closed-off, Pueblo world. Either way, it's pathetic.

Aaron (Glowrock)

[Eeyore]

As the school grows it will naturally get more and better programs. You can see the change now at only 5,000 students imagine what it will look like at 10,000 students then 15,000 students and eventually 20,000 students. Here is a recent article talking about how C.S.U Pueblo has more master programs:

With the recent addition of a master's in history program, Colorado State University-Pueblo now offers seven graduate degree programs.

The link: http://www.chieftain.com/articles/2009/05/17/news/local/doc4a10e8e84bfd6288236250.txt

Look at this that I posted earlier about its business program:

Colorado State University-Pueblo is taking its internationally accredited Master's in Business Administration program on the road to Colorado Springs.

The link: http://www.chieftain.com/articles/2009/09/04/business/local/doc4aa08776a3e52288951885.txt


This is already having a impact on the Pueblo area so imagine what kind of impact it will have once it reaches 10,000 students then 20,000 students!

If CSU Pueblo did not have a bright future then the Denver Post would not have written such a great article about it.

[wong21fr]

Whatever, your fantasies are your own and no one can sway you. Have fun with them.

[Eeyore]

I had not read the Pueblo Chieftain today and missed this important article about CSU Pueblo!


Colorado State University-Pueblo's fall enrollment has topped the 5,000-student mark for the first time in 25 years, aided by another record number of freshmen students.

The official enrollment numbers released Wednesday show the university with a total head count of 5,051 students, a 9.6 percentage jump from last year's count of 4,610 students

:banana: :tup: :cool: :cheers:

The Link : http://www.chieftain.com/articles/2009/09/10/news/local/doc4aa88c5fe8ef8487388631.txt

[wong21fr]

Wow, this is while Metro State jumped up to 22,904.

Yeah, Metro State is now equal to CU and CSU. Just look at those numbers.

I look forward to the day when CSU-P joins this trio.

[Eeyore]

Wow, this is while Metro State jumped up to 22,904.

Yeah, Metro State is now equal to CU and CSU. Just look at those numbers.

I look forward to the day when CSU-P joins this trio.

Me too!

:D

Question does metro offer masters and doctorate programs?

This is what I found:

The 53 majors and 82 minors offered at Metro State are just the beginning of the academic choices available to you. Altogether, you have more than 300 academic options, including concentrations within majors and teacher licensure in early childhood, elementary, secondary and special education.

So they will never be on the same level as CSU Pueblo, CU Boulder and CSU Fort Collins....

[glowrock]

I had not read the Pueblo Chieftain today and missed this important article about CSU Pueblo!


Colorado State University-Pueblo's fall enrollment has topped the 5,000-student mark for the first time in 25 years, aided by another record number of freshmen students.

The official enrollment numbers released Wednesday show the university with a total head count of 5,051 students, a 9.6 percentage jump from last year's count of 4,610 students

:banana: :tup: :cool: :cheers:

The Link : http://www.chieftain.com/articles/2009/09/10/news/local/doc4aa88c5fe8ef8487388631.txt

I am so sick and freaking tired of this thread being your own personal blog, Eeyore! Enough already! You're a booster, an extreme booster, hell, even a ridiculously over the top booster! We freaking get it, you love Pueblo! My god, give it a fucking rest, would you? :hell:

This crap about CSU-Pueblo is getting insane, too. In Colorado, you've got CU and CSU (by far the major universities), with UNC being pretty well respected, especially for teaching, business, and a few other areas. DU is very well respected, especially for business and law. CSM (if you don't know, School of Mines) is one of the most well-respected schools in the nation when it comes to engineering, geology, petroleum, and mining programs. Of course CU-Denver/Metro State/Auraria Campus is growing very fast as well, and has some excellent programs.

It's one thing to be happy that your local university is growing. That's a very good thing for Southern Colorado, no doubt about it. But your constant boosterism about how it's going to be the same as CU and CSU is driving me up the goddamned wall! :hell:

Aaron (Glowrock)

[Eeyore]

This crap about CSU-Pueblo is getting insane, too. In Colorado, you've got CU and CSU (by far the major universities),

Aaron (Glowrock)

CSU Pueblo is part of the CSU system and why we are a major university in the state! Also, unlike USSC and CU Denver we have major sports program that will grow as we grow making CSU Pueblo one of the top 3 universities in the state that students will want to go to in the future. That is why the Denver Post ran a article on CSU Pueblo!

:yes:

[wong21fr]

You know, if you went to the schools that you did for the sports teams, please turn in your degrees. Or burn them outside.

Unless you're playing for a school then choosing a school because of the team has to be the most asinine choice made in a young persons life.

Eeyore, just what the hell did you major in anyway?

[Eeyore]

Students pick their university based in part on the sports program, that is why most of the large universities spend so much money on having a great sports program. That is one reason why CSU Pueblo is now growing so fast.

Now as far as my majors I know I dont have to answer it but why not.

I have a bachelors degree in Psychology from CSU Fort Collins.

Bachelors from CSU Pueblo is Business with a emphasis in marketing and

a Masters in Business Administration with a emphasis in international business from the University of San Diego.

[wong21fr]

I haven't run into a student that picked their school because they like the team. Most seem to actually value the educational aspect a bit more. I'm willing to be that if CSU-P had spent all of their money on the athletic programs and none on improving the academics that the school would have nowhere near the growth that it has. While the athletics are highly visible it's the school's push to get programs that are up to snuff that has increased enrollment and retention by a far larger factor.


BTW, Metro has Master's programs. They were approved this year and will be offered in fall of 2010. So shove that in your pipe and smoke it.

Unfortunately, CSU-P doesn't seem to offer doctoral programs either which means it will never be on the same level as CSU, CU, DU, Mines, UNC... maybe someday.

[pyeblow]

Eeyore, at some point it does get really ridiculous. They're right.

[Eeyore]

I haven't run into a student that picked their school because they like the team. Most seem to actually value the educational aspect a bit more. I'm willing to be that if CSU-P had spent all of their money on the athletic programs and none on improving the academics that the school would have nowhere near the growth that it has. While the athletics are highly visible it's the school's push to get programs that are up to snuff that has increased enrollment and retention by a far larger factor.


BTW, Metro has Master's programs. They were approved this year and will be offered in fall of 2010. So shove that in your pipe and smoke it.

Unfortunately, CSU-P doesn't seem to offer doctoral programs either which means it will never be on the same level as CSU, CU, DU, Mines, UNC... maybe someday.

Then why do the major universities spend so much money to make their sports teams the best if they do not help the school? Like it or not having a visible sports programs helps your university. Just look at this forum, the only schools that get talked about are the ones with major sports programs.

I agree currently CSU Pueblo is not on the same level as CSU Fort Collins and CU Boulder but as we grow we will. The plan is to continue to add more masters programs then add doctorate programs. In 10 years once they had a chance to grow the university lets see what all of us are saying.

As far as metro, good. I could not find it on line but I am glad to see they have masters programs.

As far as me being to much of a booster for Pueblo, I don't think anyone could promote their town they love to much. If not for people like me who constantly think of ways to make their city better many towns would not be nearly as good for its citizens to live in.

[wong21fr]

Major universities spend so much money on sports because it brings more money in. Football and basketball are the two biggest athletic revenue producers for a lot of colleges on the DI level. For other schools, it's about increasing brand recognition.

I didn't say that athletics aren't a visible portion of a school. Of course it is. What I say is that it's the academic quality of a school's programs that gets students in the doors and keeps them there. Five years ago CSU-P's academic programs were heading down the drain and the students were leaving. It isn't athletics that has reversed that. It's the investment in the faculty, facilites, and student life that has been the biggest factor.

A school's academic programs don't increase in quality because of the size of the school. They first increase in quality and then the students follow. But if a school slacks off on increasing quality, their student body is not going to grow no matter how many local boosters show up to the football games.

[Eeyore]

Major universities spend so much money on sports because it brings more money in. Football and basketball are the two biggest athletic revenue producers for a lot of colleges on the DI level. For other schools, it's about increasing brand recognition.

I didn't say that athletics aren't a visible portion of a school. Of course it is. What I say is that it's the academic quality of a school's programs that gets students in the doors and keeps them there. Five years ago CSU-P's academic programs were heading down the drain and the students were leaving. It isn't athletics that has reversed that. It's the investment in the faculty, facilites, and student life that has been the biggest factor.

A school's academic programs don't increase in quality because of the size of the school. They first increase in quality and then the students follow. But if a school slacks off on increasing quality, their student body is not going to grow no matter how many local boosters show up to the football games.

You and I are actually saying the same thing.

I have said many times the main reason CSU Pueblo is growing is because it is part of the CSU system and it now has the benefit if being in that system. Then adding the sports programs just helped by getting that word out, brand recognition as you put it. That is why I say in 10 to 20 years CSU Pueblo will be on the same level as CSU Fort Collins and CU Boulder. If it was still USC I would not be saying that in fact I would not be surprised if the state would have shut it down in the next 10 years if the school would not have made the move.

[wong21fr]

We are saying some of the same things with you placing greater emphasis on some and I on others.

But I will still contend that your belief of CSU-P being at the level of CU and CSU in twenty years is false. Instead, I think that the CSU/CSU-P system should be compared to Cal State with CSU being the equivalent of San Diego State and CSU-P being Cal State, Dominguez Hills.

CSU-P will always play second fiddle to CSU. That's just the way it is. In this regard, it would be better for CSU-P to have stuck it out on its own so it could be more competitive. But, as you said, the reputation of USC was so badly damaged that it took absorbtion into the CSU system to survive.

[Eeyore]

You could be right but I think in the end both schools will level out and CSU Fort Collins will be better in some areas and CSU Pueblo will be better in other areas. Only time will tell, but it is fun to try and predict.

That being said there was no way it could have stayed USC and I say that as a Pueblo booster. Even if CSU Fort Collins is always seen as the primary school CSU Pueblo is already much better off then it was as USC and that is before it hits 10,000 students and 20,000 students and it never would of reached that as USC.

[acw007]

The more you speak the less interested I become in posting here. Eeyore, if you haven’t gotten the hint people are tired of listening to your ludicrous rants. For someone who claims to have all the education you claim to have you really seem to be clueless. If you have any desire to maintain some level of harmony here than you should ramble less and limit your post to subjects that are actually related to urban development. Its becoming increasingly harder to post here with all the dumb arguing because one person won’t shut up or take the hint. I say that as a friend. Take the hint buddy. :)

[Eeyore]

If my posts are really bothering you guys I have no problem starting a Pueblo only thread then anyone who wants to read it can go there if not then they wont have to read my "rants".......

[wong21fr]

The more you speak the less interested I become in posting here. Eeyore, if you haven’t gotten the hint people are tired of listening to your ludicrous rants. For someone who claims to have all the education you claim to have you really seem to be clueless. If you have any desire to maintain some level of harmony here than you should ramble less and limit your post to subjects that are actually related to urban development. Its becoming increasingly harder to post here with all the dumb arguing because one person won’t shut up or take the hint. I say that as a friend. Take the hint buddy. :)

I'd give it a few more months, the biggest reason that Eeyore rambles is because there is nothing else to talk about. There's no development news to really speak of and this always brings about ramblings and arguments. I actually find this more entertaining than the renewable energy postings in the Denver Development thread because there are no opposing viewpoints, they've all been driven off or banned. It's just an endless thread of harmony that makes me want to get drunk.

But, if nothing has picked up in six months and Eeyore is still posting the same stuff I'm going to drive down to Pueblo and personally break each of his fingers.

[acw007]

If my posts are really bothering you guys I have no problem starting a Pueblo only thread then anyone who wants to read it can go there if not then they wont have to read my "rants".......

You are missing the point. Like several people have stated, this is not your twitter. But maybe you should start a blog like I did. Post pretty pictures, post your ideas, say what ever you like. That could be a good idea. No one is telling you to leave this website or go some where else. Just tone it down. We all appreciate your contribution to this forum. Just stay on topic.

And Wong, I completely agree with you on the Denver thread.

[glowrock]

As far as me being to much of a booster for Pueblo, I don't think anyone could promote their town they love to much. If not for people like me who constantly think of ways to make their city better many towns would not be nearly as good for its citizens to live in.

Guess what, you ignoramus... YOU'RE WRONG! You are the most obnoxious booster in the history of SSP, and trust me, there have been some VERY annoying boosters in the past, including one right here from Denver!

You refuse to listen to ANYONE, you constantly spout out your nonsense on your personal blog, err, this thread, and simply don't understand that it's annoying the hell out of many of us!

Damn it, Eeyore. I very rarely react this way with people, but I've been reading your boosterism for months now, and it's wearing me really, really thin right now! :hell:

Aaron (Glowrock)

[Eeyore]

I'd give it a few more months, the biggest reason that Eeyore rambles is because there is nothing else to talk about. There's no development news to really speak of and this always brings about ramblings and arguments. I actually find this more entertaining than the renewable energy postings in the Denver Development thread because there are no opposing viewpoints, they've all been driven off or banned. It's just an endless thread of harmony that makes me want to get drunk.

But, if nothing has picked up in six months and Eeyore is still posting the same stuff I'm going to drive down to Pueblo and personally break each of his fingers.

I agree, 6 months from now Pueblo should have some really major developments I can talk about!

:tup:

To be honest I kind of take it as a honor that I am told I am the biggest booster in a site that is devoted to boosters. How many people can say that? Not only am I told in real life I like Pueblo to much but I am told that in a site for people who love their cities. My friends laugh when I tell them that.

:haha:

[wong21fr]

Come on Glowrock, he's kept to one thread which is frequented by what? Four-five people? It's not that big of deal.

It's giving some of us here something to talk about. The Denver thread is downright boring and the worthwhile conversation on it is pretty much nill. Meanwhile, this thread is hearkening back to the good ol' days when there were legendary debates, even if they were completely void of any real substance.

[Eeyore]

wong21 said:

he's kept to one thread

I take it other boosters talked about their cities in threads that were not about their city? How lame is that? Why would I go into Denver's tread or Phoenix or Atlanta and talk about Pueblo? If they want to know about Pueblo they can come here just like when I want to know about Denver I go into Denver's.

Edit: Just wanted to say comparisons are ok we all do that and I have no problem when another city is used to make a point that is relevant to this room.

[acw007]

wong21 said:

he's kept to one thread

I take it other boosters talked about their cities in threads that were not about their city? How lame is that? Why would I go into Denver's tread or Phoenix or Atlanta and talk about Pueblo? If they want to know about Pueblo they can come here just like when I want to know about Denver I go into Denver's.

Edit: Just wanted to say comparisons are ok we all do that and I have no problem when another city is used to make a point that is relevant to this room.

Oh really? I call bullshit. You know you do that on other websites.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Colorado Springs is mostly likely going to miss the first deadline under the terms of the new USOC deal because it's fighting a lawsuit challenging the legality of COP's. I wish they'd just put us all out of our misery and leave already.

[TonyAnderson]

I find this thread quite entertaining compared to most. Many don't have a lot of conversation going. Most of the bickering in this thread is from people over reacting to Eeyore's posts, which to be honest, are usually relevant to the thread. It's crazy how upset people get over it. I mean he's just stating his point of view, and in a nice way. If you disagree then is it really that hard to point out why in an intelligent and calm way? Instead everyone seems to explode with anger because Eeyore won't see things the same way they see it. Though some do respond with very funny and witty rebuttals and facts. That's actually my favorite part.

[Front_Range_Guy]

:previous:

Agreed.

[Eeyore]

I find this thread quite entertaining compared to most. Many don't have a lot of conversation going. Most of the bickering in this thread is from people over reacting to Eeyore's posts, which to be honest, are usually relevant to the thread. It's crazy how upset people get over it. I mean he's just stating his point of view, and in a nice way. If you disagree then is it really that hard to point out why in an intelligent and calm way? Instead everyone seems to explode with anger because Eeyore won't see things the same way they see it. Though some do respond with very funny and witty rebuttals and facts. That's actually my favorite part.

To be honest that is my goal. I would love if people from different parts of the country read this thread because they found it different and funny but walked away learning something new about Pueblo. You never know when that person is someone who might actually move a company here or start a new business here and before they read this thread would of never considered Pueblo.

:yes:

[Eeyore]

Pueblo strong found this about Pueblo Sprigs Ranch! This 150 page document talks about the development. I will print it out tomorrow and read it but thought I would post it tonight.

:cheers:

http://www.pueblo.us/documents/Planning/PSRDevelopmentStandards8508.pdf

[acw007]

To be honest that is my goal. I would love if people from different parts of the country read this thread because they found it different and funny but walked away learning something new about Pueblo. You never know when that person is someone who might actually move a company here or start a new business here and before they read this thread would of never considered Pueblo.

:yes:

The problem with that is you manipulate facts and figures in an effort to make Pueblo look better. If most people read the things you post about Pueblo and then went to visit Pueblo they would be extremely disappointed. I see threw the bullshit as do most people that post here so I don’t really care to respond to your insane rants and raves. There is nothing wrong with wanting the best for your city but lying and manipulating is not the way to get that. Plant some trees, pick up the garbage, fix the roads, and condemn 90% of the city and you’ll have a cute little town. :)

[acw007]

Pueblo strong found this about Pueblo Sprigs Ranch! This 150 page document talks about the development. I will print it out tomorrow and read it but thought I would post it tonight.

:cheers:

http://www.pueblo.us/documents/Planning/PSRDevelopmentStandards8508.pdf

That doesn’t change the fact that the development will never take place. That doesn’t change the fact that sprawl doesn’t equal a stronger downtown. And that doesn’t change the fact that Pueblo is the least attractive place to live in Colorado. If Colorado was a person Fort Collins, Boulder, and Greeley would be our brain, Denver and Colorado Springs would be the heart and soul of the state, And Pueblo would be Colorado’s asshole. Colorado would be better off with out Pueblo. I vote to move Pueblo and all of its meth to New Mexico.

[wong21fr]

Pueblo strong found this about Pueblo Sprigs Ranch! This 150 page document talks about the development. I will print it out tomorrow and read it but thought I would post it tonight.

:cheers:

http://www.pueblo.us/documents/Planning/PSRDevelopmentStandards8508.pdf

According to this, they are planning for high-rise buildings and a monorail.

[Eeyore]

I am glancing at the document and I will read it in more detail in the coming days but some of the things I see right away are:

1. They are looking at a monorail! How kewl would that be.
2. Amphitheater to have concerts.
3. Sky scrapers

I will have a bigger report once I read it all. This will make Pueblo the place to be not only in Colorado but the Rocky Mountain Region. I can see why my uncle said what he did.

This calls for some dancing fruit!

:banana: :dancing: :leek: :pepper: :pepper: :tomato: :cucumber:

[wong21fr]

^Yep, this will project will truly change Pueblo. It will redefine what Pueblo is.

[acw007]

^Yep, this will project will truly change Pueblo. It will redefine what Pueblo is.

If it were a real project. But it’s not. As many have stated this was a water grab. The project has no money. The land has been up for sale for over a year. The asking price was originally $230,000,000, the price then plummeted to $145,000,000 last fall. And now the asking price is an extremely pitiful $45,000,000. Who ever owns the land is desperately trying to unload it.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I think we all have long shot projects that we hold on to the idea of, even if we know there is only a slight chance they will become reality. For me it's Pikes Peak Place. The 20+ story mixed use proposal on the northeast corner of Pikes Peak and Nevada, which, technically is still an active proposal, even though it was shelved when the market tanked.

Let Eeyore have Pueblo Springs. If it's dead, he'll find out eventually.

[acw007]

I don't want Eeyore to kill himself when he finally realizes it was never a real proposal. I like Eeyore more then I let on lol.

[Eeyore]

I understand it might not happen, in life there are no guarantees but no one can say I am making it up the plans are there for all to read.

Like I said in the coming days I will read all 150 pages and have a larger more detailed report but I agree with wong, if this happens it will redefine Pueblo......

[wong21fr]

Like I said in the coming days I will read all 150 pages and have a larger more detailed report but I agree with wong, if this happens it will redefine Pueblo......

Of course, I was being sarcastic....

[Eeyore]

Of course, I was being sarcastic....

I am not. I am even more exited about Pueblo's future then I was before! If/when this development happens along with other big developments I have talked about Pueblo will not only be the best city in Colorado but one of the best cities in the country.

I mean imagine having sky scrapers from downtown Pueblo to El Paso County connected by a monorail. Then have a major amphitheater and lake with a exclusive yacht club. These are not some fantasy stories made up by me but in the developers plans. Combine that with the alternative energy companies coming to Pueblo and the stage is set for Pueblo to finally be all that its founder intended it to be.

:whip:

[acw007]

In all honesty that document looks like a 9th grader assembled it. That is all I have to say about it because I am 100% confident that, that plan will never see the light of day. I like you Eeyore, I think you are fantastically entertaining but Pueblo is and always will be at the bottom in this state. You are in a state that has one of the highest concentrations of high tech employers, one of the highest levels of green jobs, and some of the most forward thinking practices and polices in the nation. Because of cities like Fort Collins, Denver, and Boulder. We are the future and Pueblo is still playing catch up.

[Eeyore]

I think the plans are amazing I love the architecture from the houses to the commercial buildings and highrises, better then anything I have seen for any city in Colorado. The annexation should come soon, maybe as early as 4th quarter this year, then shortly after I suspect you will see some major construction beginning in Pueblo and some major announcements that will shake the state to its very core.

This next decade is going to be Pueblo's decade I can feel it......


2021 will be a very interesting year in Pueblo. Much of the planed developments will have started and Pueblo will be well on its way to being a very nice large city. Yet it will be the 100th anniversary of the flood of 1921 that set Pueblo economic development efforts back decades. It will be interesting to see how Pueblo remembers that anniversary. I hope I am around to see it.

[Pizzuti]

In my experience, the words "springs," "ranch" and "meadows" are red flags indicating the worst 1990s-era, sprawled and generally bad templates for development.

Pueblo Springs Ranch, coincidentally, has 2 of the three. And sure enough, it's going up entirely outside the existing city limits of Pueblo, or so I gather. Who puts skyscrapers, not only outside downtown, but outside the current boundaries of the city? That would be like building a brand new new urban business core for the Denver metro area on unincorporated Adams County just east of DIA. Why split the assets rather than contribute to one good one? Here, you have high rises just a few blocks or subdivisions away from open fields? What sustains the high land values that are the very purpose for packing in that kind of density? It takes a huge city and all its assets to draw enough residents to fill a downtown skyscraper.

You see suburban office parks like the Denver Tech Center and Interlocken in Broomfield, with mid-rises that look shiny and pretty and futuristic, but these developments are actually opposite of what we want. They pull energy away from the actual CBD and contribute to its decay and loss of character. They also contribute to sprawl and road traffic. There's a reason why Silicon Valley, in all its importance and huge population, never gets credit or attention for being a great region for a city experience - it's decentralized, with no focal point.

I can tell that this developer was trying to do well with the monorail and all, but why not put those kinds of resources downtown in Pueblo where they can contribute to the historic and existing city, as well as benefit from its existing infrastructure and resources? There's a reason why downtown areas look drastically different from suburbs; development styles are supported by their settings.

[Eeyore]

In my experience, the words "springs," "ranch" and "meadows" are red flags indicating the worst 1990s-era, sprawled and generally bad templates for development.

Pueblo Springs Ranch, coincidentally, has 2 of the three. And sure enough, it's going up entirely outside the existing city limits of Pueblo, or so I gather. Who puts skyscrapers, not only outside downtown, but outside the current boundaries of the city? That would be like building a brand new new urban business core for the Denver metro area on unincorporated Adams County just east of DIA. Why split the assets rather than contribute to one good one? Here, you have high rises just a few blocks or subdivisions away from open fields? What sustains the high land values that are the very purpose for packing in that kind of density? It takes a huge city and all its assets to draw enough residents to fill a downtown skyscraper.

You see suburban office parks like the Denver Tech Center and Interlocken in Broomfield, with mid-rises that look shiny and pretty and futuristic, but these developments are actually opposite of what we want. They pull energy away from the actual CBD and contribute to its decay and loss of character. They also contribute to sprawl and road traffic. There's a reason why Silicon Valley, in all its importance and huge population, never gets credit or attention for being a great region for a city experience - it's decentralized, with no focal point.

I can tell that this developer was trying to do well with the monorail and all, but why not put those kinds of resources downtown in Pueblo where they can contribute to the historic and existing city, as well as benefit from its existing infrastructure and resources? There's a reason why downtown areas look drastically different from suburbs; development styles are supported by their settings.

You make some good points but I am not a urbanist. I would much rather companies locate in Pueblo Springs Ranch then other developments in Colorado and especially outside of Colorado.

As far as how it is all connected. I would love to see downtown Pueblo tied to this development all the way up to downtown Colorado Springs with a monorail. Downtown Pueblo could still be the focal point but it would extend north to El Paso county where you would find some of the tallest sky scrapers in the state and country along with one of the largest universities, CSU Pueblo, and research and development parks. If this region is planned out correctly, as it appears to be, Pueblo/ Colorado Springs will quickly be on the top 10 list of metro areas not only in the country but the world.

On top of this you have devlopments like the proposed Colorado Engery Park and solar plants. There is so much going on now its fun to watch it all come to pass.....

[acw007]

Like I said, I vote to move Pueblo and all of its meth out of Colorado.

[glowrock]

Hey Eeyore, is that newfangled Pueblo Springs development going to have its own maglev system? ;)

Aaron (Glowrock)

[Eeyore]

Hey Eeyore, is that newfangled Pueblo Springs development going to have its own maglev system? ;)

Aaron (Glowrock)

Good question but how jealious would Colorado be if it did!

:haha:

[Pizzuti]

Pueblo/ Colorado Springs will quickly be on the top 10 list of metro areas not only in the country but the world.


Jeez why stop at "world" when you can have the whole universe?

I actually foresee that in 25 years or so, downtown Pueblo will be an intergalactic commerce center where embassies from 9 or 10 alien species will make their homes. The 15-20 million additional residents required for Pueblo to rival London, Tokyo or Buenos Aires will be dwarfed by the 100 million or so citizens of the Raelian Republic that will move in to get jobs in the solar industry and Pueblo's global stock exchange. I could easily see Pueblo's first 10-mile skyscraper starting construction next to the thriving spaceport by 2030, and it will be connected to Mumbai through the world's very first subway that burrows through the core of the Earth. Of course, Pueblo's satellite cities of Denver, Albuquerque and Houston, Texas will be mere subdivisions on the outskirts of Pueblo's awesomely ever-expanding awesomeness.

[Front_Range_Guy]

If this region is planned out correctly, as it appears to be, Pueblo/ Colorado Springs will quickly be on the top 10 list of metro areas not only in the country but the world.

Well now this is just silly.

[Front_Range_Guy]

from The Colorado Springs Gazette (http://www.gazette.com)

Springs software firm wins $300M contract, plans 100 jobs
Comments 9 | Recommend 3
September 10, 2009 4:24 PM
R. SCOTT RAPPOLD
THE GAZETTE
Intelligent Software Solutions Inc. today won the biggest government contract in its 12-year history, a $300 million deal with the Air Force Research Laboratory that will result in the company hiring about 100 employees this year.

About two-thirds of the hires will be at the company’s Colorado Springs headquarters, said ISS President Jay Jesse.

The latest hiring will continue an expansion already under way to work on a four-year, $8 million contract awarded last month for the laboratory’s Autonomous Space and Ground Systems for Space Superiority program and to support a major sale in March of the company’s command and control enterprise software to the Canadian Air Force.

The five-year Web Enabled Temporal Analysis System Toolkit contract will start with about $50 million to complete more than 100 projects for 50 military commands and likely will reach $300 million within two years, Jesse said. Much of the work includes installing the company’s data analysis software on more military computer networks, including some in Afghanistan and Iraq, and expanding use of its software that tracks significant events, such as bomb explosions and troop movements.

“This has been an outstanding year for ISS, Despite the recent economic downturn, we have actually grown substantially,” Jesse said in a news release issued today. ISS now employs about 250 in the Springs and 150 in other locations worldwide.

The company expects to increase its revenue from $60 million last year to nearly $80 million this year and hopes to reach $100 million next year, he said.

Privately held ISS was started in 1997 by Jesse and three other former engineers from GTE Government Systems. The company now handles about 70 information technology contracts totaling nearly $600 million, mostly with the Air Force, but also including work for the Naval Surface Warfare Center, the Coast Guard, agencies in the U.S. intelligence community, Northern Command in Colorado Springs and several other joint military commands.

[wong21fr]

Now this is fun to watch.

[acw007]

from The Colorado Springs Gazette (http://www.gazette.com)

Springs software firm wins $300M contract, plans 100 jobs
Comments 9 | Recommend 3
September 10, 2009 4:24 PM
R. SCOTT RAPPOLD
THE GAZETTE
Intelligent Software Solutions Inc. today won the biggest government contract in its 12-year history, a $300 million deal with the Air Force Research Laboratory that will result in the company hiring about 100 employees this year.

About two-thirds of the hires will be at the company’s Colorado Springs headquarters, said ISS President Jay Jesse.

The latest hiring will continue an expansion already under way to work on a four-year, $8 million contract awarded last month for the laboratory’s Autonomous Space and Ground Systems for Space Superiority program and to support a major sale in March of the company’s command and control enterprise software to the Canadian Air Force.

The five-year Web Enabled Temporal Analysis System Toolkit contract will start with about $50 million to complete more than 100 projects for 50 military commands and likely will reach $300 million within two years, Jesse said. Much of the work includes installing the company’s data analysis software on more military computer networks, including some in Afghanistan and Iraq, and expanding use of its software that tracks significant events, such as bomb explosions and troop movements.

“This has been an outstanding year for ISS, Despite the recent economic downturn, we have actually grown substantially,” Jesse said in a news release issued today. ISS now employs about 250 in the Springs and 150 in other locations worldwide.

The company expects to increase its revenue from $60 million last year to nearly $80 million this year and hopes to reach $100 million next year, he said.

Privately held ISS was started in 1997 by Jesse and three other former engineers from GTE Government Systems. The company now handles about 70 information technology contracts totaling nearly $600 million, mostly with the Air Force, but also including work for the Naval Surface Warfare Center, the Coast Guard, agencies in the U.S. intelligence community, Northern Command in Colorado Springs and several other joint military commands.

Good news. nice :)

[Eeyore]

Well now this is just silly.

I guess I did get over exited I am just happy.

Great news too FRG!

:cheers:

[Front_Range_Guy]

I guess I did get over exited I am just happy.

Great news too FRG!

:cheers:

It happens. ;)

With the economy being what it is, I think news of anyone adding jobs is reason to celebrate. :cheers:

[Front_Range_Guy]

From the Colorado Springs Independent (http://www.csindy.com)

Yes on 2C, No on 300
Independent and Gazette present editorials sharing same message
by John Weiss and Steven K. Pope


To the citizens of Colorado Springs:

We write today with a united, fervent appeal from the region's two largest newspapers.

In light of our city government's latest budget shortfall for 2010, producing an anticipated $25 million in reduced or eliminated services, programs and jobs, we share deep concerns for the potentially disastrous effects on our quality of life.

At the same time, we concur that presently, our city has only a single viable path to avoid such a catastrophic impact next year: This fall, Colorado Springs voters not only must endorse the proposed property tax increase, but also defeat Doug Bruce's destructive measure on the same ballot.

Therefore, in an unprecedented action, we are presenting our positions in tandem, printing side-by-side editorials from our separate perspectives that both reach the same conclusion. We have set aside our many differences to graphically illustrate how important it is for citizens to vote this fall to ensure the short- and long-term health of the city we love.

For the sake of our community, join with us to help save our city from a terrible — yet still avoidable — fate. Thank you.

John Weiss, Publisher, Colorado Springs Independent

Steven K. Pope, President and Publisher, The Gazette

READ THE EDITORIALS HERE (http://www.csindy.com/colorado/message-to-our-readers/Content?oid=1425860)

[Crush_Buds]

A: I already made my argument on how Burlington will be the next greatest thing in Colorado because it makes amazing coats. It is our 2nd city and will be our first in five years. A relative of mine who is super smart said so. Lord knows people that are smart can never be wrong. And everything they say is fact and must happen. Everyone that disputes it is wrong, because it is not what I want to hear. Here is a map to prove it:

http://web03.bestplaces.net/city/Burlington_CO.gif


B: Eeyore, the only reason you are "not an urbanist" is because of your hope the Pueblo Springs-Shithole-Sprawl-Ranch proposal. I bet if such a project was not proposed near YOU, you would finally admit why it is such a completely ass backwards and retroactive development. But you would rather not admit that something bad may be going on right next door. Not every damn person that says it is a bad thing is an "urbanist." They are instead realistic people that have opened their eyes to productive, and smart growth for socieity. With all your education, you must know of some books or experts to tell us how suburban style sprawl is a good thing for constructive growth and plans for the future?

C: Every single arguement you have about the growth of Pueplo requires a city to "level off" or "max out." Are you fucking insane? It does not happen that easily. Nor does wishful make it so, or even reasonable. Yes, if a fucking nuclear bomb hit Northern Colorado, Pueblo would be primely placed for growth!

D: Don't post about pictures of your cat.

E: CSU-Pueblo's inherent problem is that its called CSU-Pueblo. Christ, it does not even have its own unique name. Most people I know from Northern Colorado go to CSU-P because they can't get into CSU so they attend CSU-P for a bit, then transfer elsewhere. I mean shit, the fucking school is inherently dependent on it's Fort Collins founders. It will never get larger, nor rival, CU, CSU, UNC, DU, unless it becomes a independent university. Do you really think the people of CSU would create a campus to allow such a thing happen to their main institiution? An institution that has been around since 1870??? Not a fucking chance.

F. :tup:

[Front_Range_Guy]

I've spent enough time talking with eeyore to know that he doesn't have a problem with suburban sprawl. I agree, the "I'm not an urbanist" argument is getting tired, but the fact is, Eeyore wants Pueblo to grow. He doesn't care how.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Some months ago, The Gazette launched "Fresh Ink." A small publication focusing on Downtown, Old Colorado City, and Manitou Springs. I'm not a fan of much The Gazette does, but I did like the fact that it at least acknowledged that these areas of the city were unique enough to justify having their own publication. I just read in the South Side Business News that The Gazette is preparing to launch Fresh Ink South, focusing on the Fountain Valley area, where I live. Terrible idea. Putting a spotlight on downtown and the (relatively) urban west side makes sense, but Fresh Ink South makes no sense. Way to ruin the illusion Gazette. Besides, this area is already well served by The Fountain Valley News (http://www.ftnvalleynews.com/) and The South Side Business News. (http://www.southsidebusiness.com/)

[Eeyore]

I was going to post this last night but with the excitement of Pueblo Springs I forgot. This will be a great boost to the economy and help get us out of the recession.


With buildings nearing completion, Pueblo’s project to destroy its longtime stockpile of chemical weapons is moving quickly into a new phase.

“Systemization and Operations” is what officials with prime contractor Bechtel and other firms there call the project, but what that means is that the people who actually will do the hands-on job of dismantling the weapons and neutralizing the 2,611 tons of mustard agent they contain now are coming to work.

The link: http://www.chieftain.com/articles/2009/09/10/news/local/doc4aa88caec8929075252860.txt

[glowrock]

If I recall correctly, Bechtel was supposed to be neutralizing and removing that mustard gas several years ago, Eeyore. Yes, it's very important work, and yes it will require a lot of workers.

That being said, wow, what an awful job ;)

Aaron (Glowrock)

[wong21fr]

^I'm willing to bet that a lot of the employees that end up being hired are going to be out of towners, not local hires. This work is somewhat specialized and a lot of the workforce will be contractors who will relocate on a temporary basis and will leave once the work is complete. That said, there will be a hiring surge that will benefit Pueblo. But, what happens in eight years or so when the program is complete and all of those jobs leave? Will this bring about another bust phase to the local economy?

[CS-Urbanist]

Consider this a random drug test and this page just failed. I was hoping that coming back to look at this site a couple months later, the content would have improved. Still terrible crap about random crap in Pueblo. Seems to me that a lot has happened too. Any discussion about Councilman Heimlicher resigning, potential replacements? USOC building? Jan Martin's proposal? Streetcar Feasibility study? downtown's form-based codes? Anything of interest in the development world?
Is Colorado Springs even included on this anymore?
...disappointing... I'll check back in later to see if this sparks anything.
btw eyeore, everyone knows you are not even close to an "urbanist" so you don't need to state it so often.

[Eeyore]

^I'm willing to bet that a lot of the employees that end up being hired are going to be out of towners, not local hires. This work is somewhat specialized and a lot of the workforce will be contractors who will relocate on a temporary basis and will leave once the work is complete. That said, there will be a hiring surge that will benefit Pueblo. But, what happens in eight years or so when the program is complete and all of those jobs leave? Will this bring about another bust phase to the local economy?

That gives us 8 years to get the alternative energy sector going in Pueblo especially on the land at the depot

[wong21fr]

Consider this a random drug test and this page just failed. I was hoping that coming back to look at this site a couple months later, the content would have improved. Still terrible crap about random crap in Pueblo. Seems to me that a lot has happened too. Any discussion about Councilman Heimlicher resigning, potential replacements? USOC building? Jan Martin's proposal? Streetcar Feasibility study? downtown's form-based codes? Anything of interest in the development world?
Is Colorado Springs even included on this anymore?
...disappointing... I'll check back in later to see if this sparks anything.
btw eyeore, everyone knows you are not even close to an "urbanist" so you don't need to state it so often.

Well, considering that of the two to three Springs posters, one has almost given up almost all hope (FRG), Citycenter occasionally drops some juicy nuggets, and you just dropped some pieces of information that I have never heard of. How about expanding on a couple of them and we'll get a discussion going?

If COS posters would actually post more, there would be more to discuss than the new shade of paint on the Pueblo DA's office that will make the city greater than Seattle.

[Eeyore]

I guess i can add what I have heard since I do get Springs news.

740 KVOR reported that the reason the councilman quite is he got a new job out of state, I forget where, and wanted to see if he liked it before he quite. Nothing on a replacement. Maybe Bruce lol just joking.

FRG last post on the Olympics said he thought they would miss the first deadline because of the lame law suite over the certificate of participation. Well he did not call it a lame law suite that is my editoral.

[CS-Urbanist]

If COS posters would actually post more, there would be more to discuss than the new shade of paint on the Pueblo DA's office that will make the city greater than Seattle.

Chicken or the Egg? I'm guessing that COS posters do not post more because this site is predominantly about the new shade of paint on the Pueblo (fill in the building).

Anyway, Jerry Heimlicher who I consider to be a great councilman announced this week that he is stepping down at the end of the month and a replacement will be appointed by the other members of council. There's not too much positive about this since Jerry did do a great job, unless the City appoints someone really progressive. Then, I could see it being very positive. Council needs some new energy and hopefully it can happen.

The Streetcar Feasibility Study just got kicked off and I was hoping someone had some insight.

Form-based codes... Curious to know if any applications have come in. Any insight? All I have heard is that they assembled a board for it.

Jan Martin proposed a mill increase to help with the City's dire budget. Hopefully the voters put it through in November. Doug Bruce is still obnoxious.

I don't remember what else I mentioned before, but was curious to see if anyone knew anything.

[PLANSIT]

Well, I don't post anything, because I don't live there anymore, nor do I see much in the way of urban happenings to spark any debate or interest. COS just doesn't have much going for it, especially for its size. Compare the Boise thread and while they have twenty-fold the number of posters, they also have twenty-fold the amount of urban happenings. I'm sure there are things our there that are fairly interesting regarding proposed projects and so-forth, but the few posters in the know, aren't going out of their way to point them out. I guess I can make an effort to scan the Gazette, Independent, etc. and see if there is anything worth posting. COS is just really not a city that this environment (SSP) compliments. If there was a site devoted to sprawl or how-to-fuck-up-a-city, I would imagine COS would dominate.

[PLANSIT]

I am interested, however, in the Streetcar Feasibility Study. OKC is about to vote on bringing Modern Streetcar back to downtown. It's going through AA as we speak.

[Eeyore]

Residential


I have been looking over the Pueblo Springs Ranch development standards and one thing I like are the housing standards. They will include a few nice designs including Tuscan, Classic American, Country European, Spanish Colonial, Prairie Ranch, Craftsman, Mediterranean, Southern Itialn, Brownstone (like the row houses you see in Chicago or NYC) and Contemporary. That should give a nice up scale mix for the new city. Personally I could see my self living in a Brownstone that is just a block or two away from a monorail station.

Another thing I like is the lay out of the streets. It appears that they are using the same model that is found in Suburban Nation. Having the house close to the streets with garages in the back or on alleys and having the streets connected with walkways.

Overall I believe if they follow these standards Pueblo Springs will be a premier place for people to live on the Front Range!

[Front_Range_Guy]

If you look through the past few pages, you can see I made a couple of feeble attempts to generate discussion. Most were drowned out by the squabbling over Pueblo, or just weren't interesting enough to bother commenting on. Bottom line, Colorado Springs is a suburban city. The overwhelming sentiment here is that the future is out in the northeast nether reaches, and because of that, there isn't shit to say. Let's face it, from the urbanist's perspective, this town sucks.

I threw in the towel some time ago. If CS-Urbanist or someone else wants to take the reigns and prove me wrong, by all means, go ahead.

[Front_Range_Guy]

This town is overwhelmingly populated by glenn beck right wing wackadoos. I've mentioned the tax proposal here, but we all know how that's going to go.

[Eeyore]

Just imagine what this site would be like if I was in the Springs and FRG was in Pueblo....

Since I am obviously not a urbanist I would be a very happy camper with all the developments going on up there constantly reminding people how the Springs is the states second largest city and closing in on the city of Denver. That would make me even more annoying to people I am now.

Finally, I have a feeling the FRG would appreciate downtown Pueblo more then I do.

[Front_Range_Guy]

We are polar opposites.

[Eeyore]

This town is overwhelmingly populated by glenn beck right wing wackadoos. I've mentioned the tax proposal here, but we all know how that's going to go.

This has to be the biggest thing about the Springs I do no understand.

When I sit back and think about it logically it would seem like republican cities would be much better for business then democratic cities. The reality is the opposite, democratic cities are much more business friendly unless you get so far over like Boulder where they do not want growth at all, even there they have more going on they just discourage it. Seems very odd to me.

:shrug:

[Front_Range_Guy]

The El Paso County Republican Party has radicalized. You can throw the old definition of Republican out the window. Here, it means any government is bad government, and everyone should be Christian. It also means this city doesn't have a chance.

More Liberal cities are willing to spend money to make money, and that's why they do a better job of creating respectable urban environments, and attracting people and jobs.

The numnutt majority here is too blinded by it's extremism to realize you don't attract jobs by refusing to offer incentives, or maintain basic infrastructure.

Any suggestion of community spirit and pride, or unity, or working together, is immediately dismissed as marxism and socialist. God forbid we work together to create a better city. Nope. working together is socialist. Investing in our city is socialist. Anything that doesn't involve ME ME ME is effing socialist.

If not wanting to live in an economically depressed, crumbling shithole is socialist, I guess I'm a socialist.

[Eeyore]

I did learn something on my way to Greece that I found interesting. It seems like people want to blame the far right conservatives for the problems with the Springs, the Focus on the Family Crowd.

Well I was waiting for my plane in San Francisco and was talking to one of them. He teaches Christian Classes all over the world and he and I started talking about the Springs. I had expected him to tell me how he likes how it has developed and like the suburban feel. Well to my surprise it was the exact opposite. He was as conservative as Pat Robertson but said the problem with the Springs was the city council did not want to think of themselves as a big town thus they do not let any highrises be built. He said he lives in the city and they refuse to let any condo highrises be built by his house because they tell him they don't want it to look like Denver. He said until they get a new younger generation in things wont change. I found my self agreeing with everything he had to say and that surprised me...

[Front_Range_Guy]

:previous:

Sure, there are Christian's who like cities.

[Eeyore]

I find my self torn. I like surburban life but also like urban life. Thus I dont see why a city cant have both.....

[Pizzuti]

^You mean like Boulder?

Great closed-knit community, abundant public transportation, lots of cultural festivals and events, urban-looking street grid with distinctive downtown - yet most people live in single-family homes and use sidewalks and bike lanes to get around, and its always an easy trip to the mountains or open space.

[Front_Range_Guy]

A very large city can have both. I'm thinking Chicago. It's not quite so easy in a smaller city for economic and political reasons. There are also those who believe the question should not be "can we have both?", but "should we have both?"

[Eeyore]

Boulder, no. Not to be rude but that would be the last city I would live in. They are to anti growth for my personality. I would not get along with anyone up there. Plus Boulder feels to much like a suburb of Denver to me. I like living in the main city in a metro area. That has its own tv stations etc.

I think if the Springs did it right in the future they could have a nice urban area from downtown to Manitou Springs and old Colorado City as well as have a great suburban area with Bannen Lewis Ranch.

I am hoping that is how Pueblo develops with our downtown and Pueblo Springs Ranch.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Boulder has an Eeyore?

Most cities have older, urban neighborhoods surrounding their cores made up of a mix of single family housing, apartments, and businesses. Even Colorado Springs. You make an important point. Living in an urban environment doesn't mean you have to live in a highrise apartment. You can live in the city, and have a home to call all your own.

[Eeyore]

Personally I wouild love to live in a row house kind of like the gray stones in Chicago's boi town. All I need would be a patio on the top of the guarge in the back and I would be a happy camper.

[Pizzuti]

I'm not a perennial advocate of Boulder, but I was making a point about how you make a city "urban," which is through public amenities and zoning. "Urban" is something that springs up when space is restricted, either naturally or artificially, as is the in most downtown areas where demand for land exceeds supply. Mountain towns like Vail and Breckenridge become more "urban" at small sizes because there is no where to grow out, since boundaries are restricted by National Forests and steep mountains. Boulder is helped to become more "urban" because of its self-imposed boundaries. Downtown Denver is "urban" because all the land for miles has been taken up by development.

I don't get what we're talking about now, though. What is "urban" - besides possibly the most broadly used word in our lexicon?

In education, "urban school" is code for a racially-diverse school or low-income area. To most of us commenting here, "urban" is a physical arrangement of architecture or style of planning that puts an emphasis on street fronts and a mixture of building uses in the same building or at least on the same street, and public amenities and transportation. That would include much of Boulder, as well as a lot of Fort Collins. To Eeyore, "urban" seems to be about height and city size and little else.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I would like to live here. (http://walstongroup.com/lofts/index_316.cfm)

[acw007]

I think as our cities continue to evolve you will find that Fort Collins is and will be what Boulder and Colorado Springs could have been. We are one of the most progressive and forward thinking cities in the Nation but we aren't Boulder far left. We are more inclusive and less restrictive. I think we are the happy medium.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I think as our cities continue to evolve you will find that Fort Collins is and will be what Boulder and Colorado Springs could have been. We are one of the most progressive and forward thinking cities in the Nation but we aren't Boulder far left. We are more inclusive and less restrictive. I think we are the happy medium.

I agree with this.

[Eeyore]

007,

I don't think Fort Collins can ever be what Colorado Springs could be. Colorado Springs is a principal city in a 2 city metro area that has a downtown and suburbs. Yes they can spend more time on their downtown then they do but I don't think Fort Collins could ever really brake out of the shadows of Denver.

FRG,

That is nice.

Pizutti,

My definition of urban is little more advanced then that. I just think that a city needs to have more then just a great urban area to be a great city. I would not want Pueblo to be only urban anymore then I would want it to be only suburban.

[acw007]

Oh Eeyore, the more you speak the more apparent the scale of your ignorance becomes. None of us in this state will ever outshine Denver and that is just fine to me. We are already an award winning community with accolades stacked to the rafters. We are innovative and progressive. Our buildings are green, our streets are tree lined, our city is wind powered. We are a mecca for the new energy movement, chip designers, software developers, pharmaceutical companies, and beer. People move here from all over the world for our fantastic weather, our clean air, our hundreds of miles of trails and bike lanes, and our tens of thousands of acres of open spaces and natural areas. Companies move here because we are one of the smartest cities in the world, we have a top notch research university, and all the amenities of a large city in one of the most livable cities in America. I have no need to convince you that we are and will be a great city because in all honesty I would never want to follow your standard of greatness. How would you know greatness when you come from Colorado’s asshole? Pueblo is a smelly city left over from another decade. Fort Collins is the future. If you think size is the only thing that constitutes a great city than you are truly clueless.

[Eeyore]

Transportation

I have to say I am surprised as to how much detail they have done on this and how much it will add to the greater Pueblo metro area.

First off highways.

Of course it will be built using I-25 as the back bone, that is how most of the front range is including Pueblo. It will make it a nice easy drive from the tech park to the currant downtown.

On top of this I love how they are going to build Pueblo Springs Ranch Parkway that will run from the Caesar Cavez highway by the university north thru Pueblo Springs and the tech park and into El Paso county. It will provide a easy way for people to get around. I hope it is a limited access parkway that is at least 6 lanes.

For the feeder roads and side roads I love all the detail including how they want it to be landscaped. I, also, like how they are telling the developers how they will build the streets including walkways, and alleys and limited use of cul da sacks and when they do use them they have to have walk ways as well. Like I said earlier this reminds of me the book Suburban Nation and what he suggested cities do to make the residential areas more livable for its residents. I think if they follow this plan Pueblo Springs will have some awesome roads connecting the neighborhoods and commercial areas that will make Pueblo Springs a nice mix of urban and suburban. Like the book said you cant stop development so the best option is to manage it the best way you can.

Next mass transportation

This has to be the part that shocked me the most. If the developers can actually build a mass transit system using a monorail that would be one of the most unique systems in the country. Only Disney has anything close to that. I would love to see a system like that not only used in Pueblo Springs but the current city of Pueblo. Imagine having a few lines. One could connect downtown Pueblo to the tech park. One could connect the tech park to the university and airport. One could connect downtown to the university and the airport. If developed right this could be something that draws people to Pueblo especially if they want to build the tech park dense with gray stones like they have in Chicago.

So far I am pleased with the proposed transportation network and can't wait to see it built.

:cheers:

[Eeyore]

Oh Eeyore, the more you speak the more apparent the scale of your ignorance becomes. None of us in this state will ever outshine Denver and that is just fine to me. We are already an award winning community with accolades stacked to the rafters. We are innovative and progressive. Our buildings are green, our streets are tree lined, our city is wind powered. We are a mecca for the new energy movement, chip designers, software developers, pharmaceutical companies, and beer. People move here from all over the world for our fantastic weather, our clean air, our hundreds of miles of trails and bike lanes, and our tens of thousands of acres of open spaces and natural areas. Companies move here because we are one of the smartest cities in the world, we have a top notch research university, and all the amenities of a large city in one of the most livable cities in America. I have no need to convince you that we are and will be a great city because in all honesty I would never want to follow your standard of greatness. How would you know greatness when you come from Colorado’s asshole? Pueblo is a smelly city left over from another decade. Fort Collins is the future. If you think size is the only thing that constitutes a great city that you are truly clueless.

I beg to differ. As Pueblo and Colorado Springs grow we will some day be a large metro area as well. I don't think we will ever pass the size of the Denver metro area but we do not have to as we can be just as successful. Look at other large states they have more then one metro area that are successful even the smaller ones. In fact in some states the smaller metro's are more successful then the larger one. The problem with Fort Collins is location. If it was just a little bit father anyway from Denver it would not be in the shadow of Denver. So yes I agree you city will be very successful and people will move there but it will always have Denver looking over its shoulder.