[Eeyore]

The block directly across the street from the site is about 75% empty to make way for the Block 23 redevelopment.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/one.jpg



I really like this building.

[wong21fr]

Some more love for the northern front range:

NASA pact will bring research park to Colorado (http://www.bizjournals.com/denver/news/2010/12/13/nasa-pact-will-bring-research-park-to.html)
The Denver Business Journal
Greg Avery
13 December 2010

-Northern Colorado will be home to a new research park focused on aerospace and clean energy manufacturing under a new pact between NASA and a manufacturing trade association.

-It’s expected to be located between Boulder and Loveland. NASA will work with local manufacturers at the park to commercialize products derived from NASA space and energy research.

-Elaine Thorndike, CAMT CEO, said she hopes the effort to turn academic, government and private research into viable manufacturing companies will lead to the creation of 10,000 jobs and $300 million in economic activity over the next five years.

[Eeyore]

^

That is great for Colorado!

[acw007]

Man I would love to see Fort Collins get a minor skyline of towers. I feel it's only a matter of time.

If we have another decade like the last one where over 50 new buildings where constructed in downtown Fort Collins we will be in prime shape for some taller buildings when the height limitations are loosened come 2020.

[acw007]

Woodward Pledges $1M to Under-construction Museum in Fort Collins

The city's Discovery Science Center has received a $1 million pledge from the Woodward Governor Company Charitable Trust to bring traveling science exhibits to the new museum.

Currently under construction, the more than 47,000 square-foot Fort Collins Discovery Museum is slated to open in 2012. The museum was formed from the merger of the Discovery Science Center and the Fort Collins Museum.

Along with exhibits about science, history, culture, music, energy and sustainability, early childhood, and water, the museum will feature a 360-degree digital dome theater, a rooftop observation deck, and the local history archive. It will be located at the corner of College Avenue and Cherry Street in downtown.

“Funding of the Woodward Traveling Exhibit Experience will provide the space to host national touring exhibitions, such as ‘Grossology’ and ‘Titanic’ as well as offer a venue for displaying our collections and special community-based exhibits. Being able to bring new and exciting experiences to our region will help augment our vision of inspiring inquisitive thinkers and encourage responsible stewardship of the past, present and future,” Annette Geiselman, Discovery Science Center Director, said in a statement.

The Woodward Charitable Trust views this commitment as a solid investment for the Fort Collins community, providing resources to expose children and school groups to critical STEM (Science Technology Engineering and Math) education,” Woodward Chairman and CEO Thomas A. Gendron said in a statement.

Fort Collins-based Woodward is an independent designer, manufacturer, and service provider of energy control and optimization solutions used in global infrastructure equipment.

[Crush_Buds]

What's the height limit at?

[acw007]

It varies by block. In general blocks that already have tall buildings have a 150 ft / 12 floor limit and the height limit steps down to 9 floors to 6 floors and finally 3 floors with a 4th floor setback in the old city center and on the edge of the historic residential neighborhoods. But there is some room to play with, if a new building provides public parking, is LEED certified, contains class A office space, or is architecturally superior you can build taller.

[Eeyore]

I will say that I am impressed on how Fort Collins weathered this last recession.

[acw007]

Work is progressing nicely on the new Fort Collins Discovery Museum. A crane started being assembled today and the precast panels will start being hoisted into place on the 20th.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/m3.jpg

I’m told this thing they call a mud slab has something to do with positioning the panels or its to set the panels on or something. I’m surprised the outer walls are going to start going up so soon.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/m4.jpg

[Eeyore]

Great pictures 007.

[Front_Range_Guy]

County commissioners are considering staying downtown now.

According to The Gazette (www.gazette.com), The downtown partnership is offering 3 alternatives...

Office space in the Alamo Corporate Center:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c243/Chris80906/downtownxmaseve7.jpg

The Plaza Or The Rockies:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c243/Chris80906/downtownxmaseve9.jpg

or the Conover Building:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c243/Chris80906/August252006073.jpg

The DP says all three alternatives would cost less than the current plan to add onto the regional building offices east of downtown.

[Eeyore]

Downtown is better I think.....

[Cirrus]

Government offices belong downtown. If you don't at least make that level of public investment, the private sector won't bother doing it's part either.

[acw007]

My fantastic boyfriend bought me a new camera for Christmas so before I visited family I ventured downtown for a photo update.

The Lincoln Center renovation and expansion is going very slowly but that always seems to be the case with construction.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0012-1.jpg

Visible progress on the back side of the main theatre. This part of the addition includes green rooms and VIP accommodations.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0015-1.jpg
There is a nice large rendering of the project on Mulberry.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0016-1.jpg

Work also continues on this building soon to be home to the design and engineering division of Otter Box.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0013-1.jpg

Otter Box new headquarters is speeding along. You can see a slide connecting the first and second floor in these photos.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0017-1.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0019-1.jpg

The new Fort Collins Discovery is really picking up steam. Almost the entire eastern wall is now up.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0032-1.jpg

I took the photo of the museum standing in front of CSU’s soon to be expanded Engines and Energy Conversion Lab so I finally got around to taking a photo of the historic power plant.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0034-3.jpg
RMI2’s new building is an inch away from completion and it surprisingly looks stellar. I thought it would come out just fine but I think it looks fantastic.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0037-1.jpg

I’m a big fan of the monument signage and solar panel carports.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0039-1.jpg

While driving buy I snapped a couple photos of some recently renovated buildings. Ingredient’s new restaurant did wonders for the once run down Poudre Valley National Bank building. Other tenants in the just renovated building include the National Audubon Society who are relocating their offices from downtown Boulder to Fort Collins.
Before
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/381853836_138c92f724.jpg

After
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0029-1.jpg

Nordy’s Barbeque & Grill recently took over the space of a now defunct furniture store.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0028-1.jpg

I also spotted work being done on this building on College that is supposed to be demolished to make way for a new three story mixed use building but I’m not sure what’s going on now.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/IMG_0027-1.jpg

[acw007]

Here is a rendering I dug up of the building that was/is/I don't know the status, proposed at 215 North College. You can see work being done on it in the last photo I posted. It was supposed to break ground fall 2008 but we all know what happened next.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg152/acwilson007/215NorthCollege.jpg

[Eeyore]

Nice pictures 007. I am going to have to make the trek up there in 2011 and eat at Ingredient.

[Eeyore]

I decided to post this because I don't understand the thinking. Why would they not start from I-25 building the triple-level flyover over then build bridges over Academy and Powers with a single point stop light on Academy and Powers connecting the Airport directly to the interstate with no stop lights. Now we will have to get off on Academy where they have stop lights drive around to reach the expressway taking more time then is necessary. Personally, I think this is a lack of real planning from Springs planners, just like we have seen from them in the past.

This is from the Chieftain:

COLORADO SPRINGS — By next Christmas, getting to the Colorado Springs Airport will be more like flying in Santa's sleigh. A $55.4 million reconfiguration and extension of Milton E. Proby Parkway will shave precious time off the southern airport route for motorists. "It will provide direct access to (Interstate 25) that we haven't enjoyed in the past," said aviation director Mark Earle. "It's a terrific project." A new two-mile, four-lane expressway will extend Milton Proby Parkway between Academy and Powers boulevards. Drivers will reach the expressway from the South Academy Boulevard exit off Interstate 25.

The design also includes the city's first triple-level flyover, said Colorado Springs City Engineer Robin Kidder. The interchange, just south of Drennan Road, will enable continuous movement in all directions for north- and southbound Academy traffic. Construction will return Drennan to a residential street, as traffic is relocated to the new Proby Parkway between Academy Boulevard and Hancock Expressway. The project is on target to be completed in October, Kidder said.

The link: http://www.chieftain.com/business/local/article_af51810e-1235-11e0-a3b8-001cc4c002e0.html

[Cirrus]

^
Because A) that would be 10 times as expensive, and B) it isn't necessary because the volume of traffic going to Colorado Springs airport is not high enough to justify that kind of investment.

[Eeyore]

I don't think it would be that much more as all your talking about is a mile or two going directly west. Most of the cost is with the triple fly over and they would still only have one just at the interstate where it should be and then they could maybe get matching federal funds since its on the interstate. Plus I think you would be surprised how much traffic would use that road. Right now its makes no sense for anyone on the north side of the Springs to drive down Academy to use to triple fly over so its mainly for south Colorado Springs and Pueblo residents. If they built it to I-25 then people from the north side could easily drive to the interstate and get off at the expressway that would take them directly to the airport.

I was thinking and where they goofed in the past was where they built the new highway 24 as it goes west from the interstate to Academy where the old airport was and then stops at Academy. Again that goes to poor planning. If they had built it further south then now it could have connected to this expressway going directly to the airport.

[PLANSIT]

^Will you just stop? It's like I'm reading the DP comments section.

[Cirrus]

Most of the cost is with the triple fly over 10 times more was an exaggeration, but it would definitely cost a lot more. Interchanges are extremely expensive. You can build a whole streetcar line for the cost of a single interstate exit. A triple flyover involving an interstate would literally cost hundreds of millions of dollars just on its own. I've seen highway interchange projects get into the billions.

You really don't appreciate how expensive it would be to do what you propose.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I think the only reason you want to see this happen is because you think it would be "cool."

The idea here is to connect the airport to Academy, which then connects with I-25. There isn't money, land, or a need to build a new highway all the way to the interstate, complete with a new interchange.

I'd guess the flyover is necessary at Academy & Proby to make the connection seamless, so traffic can flow continuously. If you have an interchange where traffic has to stop, you defeat the purpose of connecting the two highways.

South Academy is very heavily traveled, and Academy and Drennan is notoriously dangerous. Hopefully this will allow traffic in that area to flow more smoothly, and cut down on traffic accidents. There isn't a whole lot of traffic going to the Colorado Springs Airport right now. I can say with confidence that the people who use South Academy every day are going to benefit more from this project than people who use the airport. At least in the short term.

[Eeyore]

You guys make a good point. I will wait till its done and see what its like as I am sure I will be driving it all the time when I go to the Colorado Springs Airport. As a side note the Pueblo Chieftain does not do many positive stories about the Springs and this was positive so that must mean something.

[Front_Range_Guy]

The Space Foundation is staying in Colorado Springs. An official announcement is coming Thursday. The EDC has worked out an incentives package with the organization to keep them in town. It includes office space off of Garden of the Gods Road.

The Space Foundation is important to Colorado Springs because it's annual symposium at The Broadmoor brings thousand of people and millions of dollars into the economy every year.

[Eeyore]

^

That is great! Not only do they have the space symposium but they work with UCCS and CSU Pueblo with things like a S.T.E.M floor and that will only help the region attract air and space companies.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Details of the deal to keep The Space Foundation in Colorado Springs were released today. You can read about the 15 year deal by clicking this link (http://csbj.com/2011/01/06/space-foundation-gets-new-home/). This rendering of what the remodeled building will look like was posted on the website of The Colorado Springs Business Journal today.
http://csbj.com/files/2011/01/space1.jpg

More good news today. El Paso County Commissioners announced they will be sticking to the original plan of moving their offices into Centennial Hall downtown. You can read more about that in this article (http://www.gazette.com/articles/county-110716-centennial-officials.html) from The Colorado Springs Gazette.

[bunt_q]

You don't do yourself credit. If those two news bits happened in Pueblo, they'd be good for at least 4 or 5 posts, not just one. And a plethora of dancing fruit. ;)

[bunt_q]

Personally, I think El Paso County's approach to all of this is just... sad. The Intel plant is an embarrassment (and not just because it'll double my mother's commute and triple my brother's). An old warehouse that just happens to be available is not a suitable home for government (unless you hate government and want it to go one without any dignity whatsoever... oh wait...). And Human Services was by far the worst possible choice to move. The access up there is horrible... and believe it or not, the human services clientele tends not to have a lot of money for driving. There's a reason Denver's Human Services Center is where it is.

I know the comparisons get old... but when we're talking El Paso County, the comparisons are a little more fair, because I think Denver County is actually smaller now, or real close. And not only did Denver clean up the City & County Building, but they consolidated (same thing El Paso County is doing - to save money) by building a brand new office building (still saving money) and a brand new justice center... Granted, the City & County thing helps, but that doesn't explain it all. The fact that the County government want to abolish county government has more to do with it. Sad...

[Front_Range_Guy]

I'm not sure what you want me to say. I try to savor the small victories. Small victories are all we ever get here.

[bunt_q]

Post 2, just venting.

Post 1, you should make 15 posts out of the small victories. And then change your signature to "Colorado's Real Second City" (because the Springs is...) And definitely still add dancing fruit.

Just poking Eeyore, we all love you!

[Front_Range_Guy]

I understand the sources of your frustration, but at this point I think bitching about it is a little played out.

I try to focus on the positive. Everyone knows the negatives, and pointing them out on this forum is going to accomplish exactly nothing.

It's hard to find the motivation to continue posting here when people are constantly undermining my attempts to focus on something other than what's wrong with Colorado Springs.

... and yes... I realize I'm plenty guilty of being negative in the past.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I ate at Il Postino for the first time last night. It's in the old Tre Luna Events Center space in the Independence Building (built in 1898) and is part of the Mining Exchange Hotel project. (http://www.miningexchangehotel.com/)

The food and atmosphere were amazing, and the service was adequate. I could see myself spending a lot of time there.

There are a handful of exterior and interior photos on their website, just click here. (http://www.ilpostinocs.com/gallery/restaurant)

[Eeyore]

I still don't think its fair to compare El Paso county to the city and county of Denver in the way Bunt did as Denver is a completely urban county while El Paso is a large county with both a urban city and rural areas and even Mountains. So while I don't agree with everything El Paso county does and I think they should stay in downtown I don't think its fair to compare it to Denver.

As far as the Space Foundation I agree some dancing fruit is needed as that is good for all of Colorado that it stays in the Springs. Also, I love how the building looks.

:banana: :dancingbacon :tomato: :leek: :fruit:

[Eeyore]

I ate at Il Postino for the first time last night. It's in the old Tre Luna Events Center space in the Independence Building (built in 1898) and is part of the Mining Exchange Hotel project. (http://www.miningexchangehotel.com/)

The food and atmosphere were amazing, and the service was adequate. I could see myself spending a lot of time there.

There are a handful of exterior and interior photos on their website, just click here. (http://www.ilpostinocs.com/gallery/restaurant)

Great! I will go soon as well.

:D

[Front_Range_Guy]

I don't really think it's a fair comparison, either. The two regions couldn't be more different in just about every way. It's true that Denver and El Paso Counties have similar populations, but that's where the similarities stop. Denver County is dense and urban, and at the center of a massive metro area filled with millions of people. El Paso County is well... not dense and urban, most of the people who live here live in suburban-style developments that just happen to be in Colorado Springs city limits. More than half of the county is rural open space. Colorado Springs is not surrounded by large suburban cities as Denver is. Not surprisingly, the politics and attitudes in the 2 regions are completely different too.

Denver = big city at the center of a major metro area

Colorado Springs = small city surrounded by overgrown suburbs.

[wong21fr]

^I'm a bit confused here. Don't most residents of El Paso County reside within the city limits of Colorado Springs?

[Front_Range_Guy]

That's what I'm trying to get at. That's one of the key differences between the 2 metro areas. I guess what I'm trying to say is something that Bunt has said several times in the past, and that we all know. Colorado Springs is mostly suburb. The actual urban area is very small. It's more like a small city with big surburbs (even though they are in city limits.) Denver is a large, comparatively dense city, with real suburbs... which are also quite large. Many times larger than the suburban areas of Colorado Springs.

[bunt_q]

But when you're talking specifically about something like county services, especially human services, the two are incredibly similar. So the comparison is quite appropriate in that sense. Counties all provide the same services. Partially rural or not, if you've got roughly 600k to serve with similar poverty rates etc, why shouldn't their approaches to providing services be comparable.

Same for courts... Similar in many ways. If you take out the state-issues that wind up in Denver District Court because it's the capital... why not compare? No reason at all El Paso County should invest less in its courts, county services, etc than another comparable sized county. If you're not comfortable with the Denver comparisons, then let's jump to Jefferson County. They built the Taj Mahal out in Golden, while El Paso County is refitting warehouses in BFE. How do you reconcile those two? It's not politics, Jeffco is plenty conservative (or was when they built that thing). Poor leadership? That's worth bitching about because it can change!

FRG I know you're particularly sensitive to the negatively, but you have to toughen up some. Sorry... I'm with you on not needing any more generalized Colorado Springs is the devil complaining. But that doesn't mean we can't / shouldn't discuss specific instances of bad decisions and/or utter stupidity. If that happens to outnumber the good news, sorry, that's just the situation. I don't think we should sugar coat reality though. If it's 60/40 bad, then it's only fair the discussion follows.

[Eeyore]

I still don't think its a fair comparison.

Denver is a principal city and county of a metro of 3 million people while Colorado Springs is a principal city of a metro area of 600,000 people all in the same county. Thus, Denver has things Colorado Springs can not even think of having such as Mile Hi Stadium, Coors Field and the Pepsi Center with the economic activity they generate then you have the many restaurants, condos and retail stores that serve a much larger population then just the city and county of Denver. Then Denver is home to many federal jobs and state jobs and corporations that bring money into the city. All of this makes Denver the center of economic activity that far exceeds the economic activity of Colorado Springs is the center of, thus, the basic needs will be greater in Denver then they are in Colorado Springs for simple things like a jail, court system and basic human services.

[bunt_q]

State and federal properties are all untaxed. Apart from the employees' $7 lunches, they contribute very little to the tax base. By the same token, the military is pumping plenty of cash into the economy down there.

So how does Jefferson County afford it? How is that an unfair comparison?

[Eeyore]

Good point but the employees still add to the economic activity of the region. However, if you take that part of my argument out it still leaves my other points so I still argue that its not fair to compare Denver to Colorado Springs.

Jefferson county is a suburban county with a few large suburbs, thus, has different demographics and needs then a principal city has as they can and do let Denver tackle all the major issues.

I think a better comparison would be Albuquerque, New Mexico as they are a city of 541,614 with a MSA of 869,684.

BTW the military is the main thing Colorado Springs has going for it and I have read that it could be in trouble in the long run. I was not going to post about this but it seems to fit the discussion we are having so I decided to.

This is from FOX news:

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. (AP) — The Pentagon's plans to cut defense spending aren't expected to have a big immediate impact on Colorado Springs.

The Defense Department on Thursday announced a proposal to freeze its growing budget to help the nation reduce its massive deficit. The plan is based on the war in Afghanistan ending on time and Congress agreeing to charge retired military families more for health care.

The Gazette reports that the plan would leave military bases and programs in Colorado Springs intact for the short term. However, the planned post-war downsizing following 2015 could reduce the number of troops in the city.

Defense spending makes up an estimated 40 percent of the area's economy and those dollars have lessened the impact of the recession.

The link: http://www.kdvr.com/news/sns-ap-co--pentagonbudgetcuts-colorado,0,3154295.story

[bunt_q]

Eeyore I think you're missing the point. I was talking about county services (and buildings to support them). Jefferson County can't let Denver take any of that load. It doesn't work that way. Take food stamps - those are dependent on where you live. Same for nearly all other human services. Courts, same thing. I have a hard time believing Jefferson County has a caseload that's lighter than El Paso County's.

So the question remains - how can Jefferson County afford to build something like the Taj Mahal, but El Paso County cannot?

[Eeyore]

First of all the Springs is far right thus cheap but I would bet that Jefferson county is a more affluent county then El Paso county is, thus, has more money to what they need to do.

I'm sorry but I have to use Pueblo as a example even though I have tried not to. Because of the "white flight" Pueblo West has a much higher average income then the county as a whole and I would suspect that Jefferson county is the same way in Denver although I can't find the numbers on that. So that gives them a advantage over El Paso county as a whole.

[Front_Range_Guy]

Maybe El Paso County can afford it, but is afraid of building anything too opulent, for fear of alienating their mostly conservative constituents.

Whether that's the right move or not is a judgment call, and maybe taking the safe route does equate to a lack of leadership, but in this political climate, and in this county, I can understand why they're doing this on the cheap.

On the rare occasion when I allow myself to dream, I like to think that maybe someday, in better times, the county will be able to build an office tower at Centennial Hall and consolidate there.

[Cirrus]

It's acceptable for governments not to build Taj Mahals, but there is really no excuse (other than not caring) for not locating downtown. If the government isn't even willing to invest downtown, why should any private company?

[Front_Range_Guy]

:previous:

I'm not buying that argument. Explain.

[Cirrus]

If the government isn't even willing to invest downtown, why should any private company?

What's to explain? It's the government's job to use its tools to direct money and resources to things we think are important. That's the sole reason why we have a government. If even the local government doesn't care enough about downtown's success to locate their own offices there, it is a clear signal that a healthy downtown is not a priority for them. Few private companies will invest in something that even its owner (in this case the government) isn't interested in.

Less abstractly, when government locates downtown it helps downtown, by virtue of providing citizens a reason to go downtown and by virtue of providing a built-in customer base for supporting downtown businesses. These are things that any good local government of a downtown area should be inherently interested in pursuing. On the other hand, when government locates in some office park in the suburbs they accomplish little except adding to traffic congestion.

[Front_Range_Guy]

If the government isn't even willing to invest downtown, why should any private company?

What's to explain? It's the government's job to use its tools to direct money and resources to things we think are important. That's the sole reason why we have a government. If even the local government doesn't care enough about downtown's success to locate their own offices there, it is a clear signal that a healthy downtown is not a priority for them. Few private companies will invest in something that even its owner (in this case the government) isn't interested in.


I still don't buy it. Land values, rent costs, space needs, parking needs, proximity to the homes of employees and customers, access to related businesses and other amenities. These are the things businesses look at when deciding where to locate. Not where the county commissioners meet.

[Cirrus]

Oh sure, it's not the *only* thing that matters, but it's certainly a strong political message.

[Eeyore]

I agree with cirrus on this on.

I think there are some things that should be in downtown.

1) Main government offices.
2) Cultural facilities like the museums and performing arts center, symphony etc.
3) Facilities like a convention center.
4) Any major sporting arenas like a football stadium, basketball arena, hockey arena and baseball stadium.

In my opinion Denver is a example of how downtown's should be and that is why I always use Denver as a example.

[bunt_q]

Businesses look at all of those things, and yes, amenities. Amenities require paying customers. Government employees pay. More business follows. Self reinforcing cycle. I think you two are saying the same thing.

Businesses actually do look at things like "how much will my employees like working here" and "what restaurants can I go to over lunch." Trust me, the drive through at the Garden of the Gods McDonalds is going to be a much busier place after a thousand county workers move up there. And there are a couple of restaurants on west Bijou all the way to Tejon that are going to have a much harder go of it. And that's just a start...

Plus all the stuff Eeyore listed, I agree. The location of Sky Sox Stadium, while certainly cheaper and arguably even more convenient, says a lot about that city and its priorities. Folks do notice stuff like that. And for all the complaining folks do (and did do) about the prospect of downtown parking, I can almost guarantee the Sky Sox would have better attendance downtown. People find places to park. It's tough to quantify, but making a game a package deal, part of a larger destination, "going downtown," helps give people a reason to go when just the baseball isn't quite enough.

[Cirrus]

4) Any major sporting arenas like a football stadium, basketball arena, hockey arena and baseball stadium.The only exception to your post is football stadiums. There are several things about football stadiums specifically (as opposed to other types of stadiums) that make them particularly unfit for downtowns.

1. They are bigger than the others, and therefore require more land.

2. They are used far less frequently than the others (8 home games a year for NFL versus about 80 for a baseball stadium or shared NHL/NBA arena), and therefore are sitting empty far too often to take up so much valuable real estate.

3. Tailgating is an important part of football-going culture for many people, and you can't do that without a lot of surface parking lots around the stadium, which you shouldn't be building downtown.

Mile High stadium is about as close to downtown as any NFL stadium should ever get.

Otherwise you're right about all that.

[Eeyore]

Your right. I just have always considered that part of downtown as its right across the Interstate.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I agree with 99% of what you guys are saying. At least in principle.

I still think that a business that wants to be downtown will locate downtown regardless of where county offices go. I also think that most of the people in this city, and therefore most of the businesses in this city, don't want to be downtown. Downtown has been the center of government for years, and look at the state it's in.

I think the desire to be downtown is largely an ideological one, and either an organization subscribes to that ideology or it doesn't.

Obviously keeping those government workers downtown would be better for downtown's overall economic health, but I don't think that's what we're debating.

[Cirrus]

Downtown has been the center of government for years, and look at the state it's in.Imagine the state it would be in had government abandoned it years ago!

[bunt_q]

You're awfully hard on downtown Colorado Springs? What's wrong with it? It's still livelier than anywhere else in the city. And it's perfectly charming. It's just very small relative to the city around it. But it's still one of only three or four parts of Colorado Springs worth seeing at all.

It hasn't changed all that much since I was in high school, but if anything I'd say it's improved a tad. Sure, Chinook and Michelle's were nice, but from a different era for Colo Spgs. The food offerings are better, the fountain was a nice addition to Acacia, and the streetscape improvements/planters/art... while you probably don't even notice them because they're been around for a while now, were a vast improvement on what was there before. And by the way, criticized as a total waste of money at the time.

What are we debating?

[bunt_q]

If we subscribe to this idea that government should go wherever it's cheapest and convenient for the majority of the populace (as opposed to leading by example and locating in the historic core of the city), it's only a matter of time until the City Council moves to an abandoned big box somewhere around Acadamy & Maizeland. Cheap, even ghetto, and quite central. Would you be ok with that?

[Eeyore]

http://i394.photobucket.com/albums/pp25/josseppie/coloradosprings.jpg

I found this rendering of Palmer Village. Its from on Nor'Wood Development's site. I am not sure if its old or what but thought I would post it here.

[bunt_q]

Very, very old. Note the ballpark...

[acw007]

LOVELY. That render is a few years old. From 2007ish I think.

[Front_Range_Guy]

This article from The Colorado Springs Business Journal (http://www.csbj.com) is interesting.

John Weiss, publisher of the Colorado Springs Independent newspaper, said today he’s interested in buying The Gazette and, if he succeeds, would possibly rename it the Colorado Springs Sun.

Click here to read the full report. (http://csbj.com/2011/01/17/a-return-of-the-colorado-springs-sun/)

[Eeyore]

This article from The Colorado Springs Business Journal (http://www.csbj.com) is interesting.



Click here to read the full report. (http://csbj.com/2011/01/17/a-return-of-the-colorado-springs-sun/)

I like the idea of a locally owned paper but why change the name?

[Front_Range_Guy]

I can't really say? Nostalgia? Maybe it would signal a change in editorial policy.

I don't know anything about the old Colorado Springs Sun or its slant, so it's hard for me to even guess.

[Pizzuti]

If a business is failing or the brand recognition becomes mixed with positive/negative feelings, you re-name it to kind of disown the past and welcome people to give it a second shot. The fixation on newness is very American I think - something extremely common in the business world, as well as in politics.

[Front_Range_Guy]

:previous:

True, although I don't think it's something often done with newspapers, and I certainly don't think it's common for surviving newspapers to take on the brand of long defunct newspapers

In this case I think there's probably a specific reason Weiss wants to resurrect the "Sun" brand.

[Eeyore]

Do you think the Colorado Springs Independent would stay in business?

BTW I never heard of the Colorado Springs Sun before. When was its last date published?

[Brainpathology]

Could it just be as simple as wanting the City's name in the paper name? I always found it a little odd that the main paper in COS didn't actually say Colorado Springs "something".

If this guy runs the Independent too I would imagine distancing the paper from it's conservative past might be tempting to imagine. However, he is (presumably) a businessman first and I doubt anyone would think a turn too far from the current conservative/libertarian editorial policies would do very well in the paper's readership base.

[Eeyore]

Well its the Colorado Springs Gazette so the only difference is it would be the Colorado Springs Sun.

[Brainpathology]

Oh ok.. I thought it was just called the Gazette Telegraph but yeah.. checkout their website and I was mistaken... scratch that speculation by me then lol

[PLANSIT]

Was the Sun a more progressive left leaning paper? If so, maybe there is a concerted effort to rebrand the paper as the "not Gazette" paper.

[bunt_q]

Could it just be as simple as wanting the City's name in the paper name? I always found it a little odd that the main paper in COS didn't actually say Colorado Springs "something".

If this guy runs the Independent too I would imagine distancing the paper from it's conservative past might be tempting to imagine. However, he is (presumably) a businessman first and I doubt anyone would think a turn too far from the current conservative/libertarian editorial policies would do very well in the paper's readership base.

Oh wouldn't it be ironic if the good people of Colorado Springs had to turn to the Denver Post for editorial commentary they could occasionally agree with.

We got the Sun when I was little...

I have to admit, the thought of the Independent buying the Gazette makes me smile...poetic justice...a true life David versus Goliath. They should be able to appreciate that, no?

[Eeyore]

Oh wouldn't it be ironic if the good people of Colorado Springs had to turn to the Denver Post for editorial commentary they could occasionally agree with.

We got the Sun when I was little...

I have to admit, the thought of the Independent buying the Gazette makes me smile...poetic justice...a true life David versus Goliath. They should be able to appreciate that, no?

Or better yet the Pueblo Chieftain. Other then its anti Springs rhetoric and Pueblo booster-ism the paper is pretty conservative in its editorial positions.

[Front_Range_Guy]

I share bunt q's sentiments. I know my dad has a copy of The Sun somewhere. Maybe I'll see if I can dig it up this weekend.

[wong21fr]

Or better yet the Pueblo Chieftain. Other then its anti Springs rhetoric and Pueblo booster-ism the paper is pretty conservative in its editorial positions.

There are other editorials than booster-ism and anti-Springs rhetoric in the Chieftain?

Huh.

[Eeyore]

There are other editorials than booster-ism and anti-Springs rhetoric in the Chieftain?

Huh.

Yes. I just don't pay attention to them because I am usually against them when they talk about national politics. So I only read the editorials related to Pueblo and Colorado Springs.

[Cirrus]

I suppose national politics are a problem for the Chieftain. Pueblo city is liberal but all the hinterlands are conservative. It wouldn't surprise me if they get more subscriptions from the hinterlands. Canyon City and La Junta and Walsenburg and all those towns put together that look up Pueblo as the nearest city probably add up to a lot of subscribers.

[Eeyore]

Plus you have Pueblo West and they have 35,000 people and is more republican.

[acw007]

The new Fort Collins Discovery Museum has been really speeding along these past few weeks.
I stopped by to site to take some photos last weekend but they turned out horrible.
Fortunately I have these photos to share courtesy of the museum.

The interior of the museum is quite large.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5045/5370650410_cbac42a219_b.jpg

This picture shows just how close the new museum is to the Poudre River.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5043/5370065685_03185721e3_b.jpg

The crane started installing steal beams this week.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5201/5370045483_5517122b53_b.jpg

This picture does a great job of showing how tall and imposing the museum will be.
The construction worker at the bottom left of the elevator core is dwarfed by the structure.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5169/5370670986_f354af9e87_b.jpg

Newly installed support for the sealing over the traveling exhibit hall.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5127/5370651458_61b54b585e_b.jpg

The outdoor area on the western side of the museum over looking the river will feature outdoor exhibits.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5281/5307820284_2eed04d046_b.jpg

The Discovery Museum has this (http://www.fcmdsc.org/about/new/site.html) cool little feature on their website that shows a 360 view of the interior and they add an update every week so you can check out the progress.

[Front_Range_Guy]

:previous:

Good stuff. Thanks for posting those. The pic with midget construction worker is cool...

[Eeyore]

Agreed. Great pictures......

[Front_Range_Guy]

Here's an entertaining entry from today's police blotter.


Record ID 1084
Incident Date January 29, 2011 Time 12:10:00 PM Division Falcon Shift I
Title Arrest Location 2511 N. Logan Ave.
Summary On 01/29/11, officers were dispatched to the above address which is the Evangelical Christian Academy to investigate a reported disturbance. The RP is the pastor of the church and indicated that a female unknown to him was pounding on his vehicle and was attempting to take his cell phone. While in route, officers were advised that the suspect had removed all her clothing and was now striking other vehicles in the parking lot. Upon arrival, officers contacted the RP who stated that the suspect had left the parking lot. During this contact, Officer Palmer observed the suspect exit a nearby home and begin walking towards him. The suspect was clothed at this time and came at Off. Palmer in a threatening manner and did push him two times. Off. Palmer did deploy his Taser resulting in one probe striking her left breast and the other on her wrist. The suspect was handcuffed and detained. The investigation revealed that the suspect had not caused any damage or injury. She was in possession of numerous prescription drugs. Medical personnel on scene stated that numerous pills were missing therefore; she was transported to Memorial for treatment. The suspect was charged with Obstructing a Peace Officer for this incident. It was also determined that she had a signed complaint for violating a restraining order and a warrant for an assault. After treatment at Memorial Hospital; the suspect will be transported to CJC and booked on the above charges.

Adults Arrested Cawiezell, Megan 09/15/1976
Media Contact Name and Phone Number: Lt. Stromer 444-7240

[CastleScott]

Just a question for you guys in the Springs/Pueblo: What happened to that hotel that was built near the I-25 Interquest interchange (its about 12-14 stories tall with a nice design just on the northeast corner of the interchange)? Its all boarded-up on the first level, my rabbi and I drove by it yesterday after our service and he said someone lost their shirt on that project. Anyway I thought I'd ask you all for some info on the matter...

Thanks

Scott from Castle Rock

[Eeyore]

Last I heard the developer ran out of money to the project is on hold.

[Front_Range_Guy]

The project stalled because of financing problems.

According to the hotel's website (http://www.coloradospringsrenaissance.com/home.aspx), it's currently scheduled to open this summer.

[Eeyore]

I hope they get it going. It does not look good having a 1/2 built building sit empty on the north side of the Springs especially one that is a highrise.

[CastleScott]

^ Thanks for the earlier info guys..;)

Scott

[Denver Dweller]

Condo development has sold 180 of first 190 units
By Alicia Wallace Camera Business Writer
Posted: 01/30/2011 09:37:18 PM MST

Work on the second phase of the Peloton, a $150 million condominium development in central Boulder, could be underway by the second quarter, the project's officials said Friday.

When the project opened to its first residents in 2008, the Peloton boasted a clubhouse, 190 completed residences and the cores and shells of the two buildings that were to house the 195-unit second phase.

"We always envisioned the second phase would go shortly behind the first (190 residences)," said Chris Theiss, the Peloton's development director.

The financial meltdown and recession, however, put major crimps in that plan, Theiss said, adding the Peloton was not immune from the housing slowdown. Officials held off on building out the second phase of units until the vast majority of the first 190 were sold, he said.

As of last week, 180 units have sold, he said.

Earlier this month, Peloton officials received an extension on the building permit submitted in 2007 for the second phase, according to city of Boulder construction permit filings. Theiss said Peloton officials intend to submit an updated building permit with the intention of first bringing on line the smaller, 79-unit building by the end of the year.

It is unclear when the final 116-unit building could come on board.

[The Dirt]

Condo development has sold 180 of first 190 units
By Alicia Wallace Camera Business Writer
Posted: 01/30/2011 09:37:18 PM MST

Work on the second phase of the Peloton, a $150 million condominium development in central Boulder, could be underway by the second quarter, the project's officials said Friday.

When the project opened to its first residents in 2008, the Peloton boasted a clubhouse, 190 completed residences and the cores and shells of the two buildings that were to house the 195-unit second phase.

"We always envisioned the second phase would go shortly behind the first (190 residences)," said Chris Theiss, the Peloton's development director.

The financial meltdown and recession, however, put major crimps in that plan, Theiss said, adding the Peloton was not immune from the housing slowdown. Officials held off on building out the second phase of units until the vast majority of the first 190 were sold, he said.

As of last week, 180 units have sold, he said.

Earlier this month, Peloton officials received an extension on the building permit submitted in 2007 for the second phase, according to city of Boulder construction permit filings. Theiss said Peloton officials intend to submit an updated building permit with the intention of first bringing on line the smaller, 79-unit building by the end of the year.

It is unclear when the final 116-unit building could come on board.

Can you provide a link to the article? (those are the forum rules, anyway) Where is this project located?

[acw007]

It’s a really nice looking development. I’m curious how expensive the average unit is. The remaining units are pretty pricey.

[wong21fr]

Interesting, apparently this was first proposed for Grand Junction but they couldn't get enough private money behind it:

CU, businesses eager to create Springs med-school branch (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_17255254?source=bb)
The Denver Post
By Micheal Booth
February 1, 2011
COLORADO SPRINGS — After years of frustrated attempts to expand the University of Colorado School of Medicine to the Western Slope, health care officials are now teaming with business leaders here to create a southern branch of the school by 2013.
CU needs more spots for physicians, clinics outside the Denver area want to train doctors who will stay for a career, and Colorado Springs business promoters are looking for growth accompanied by prestige.

Read more: CU, businesses eager to create Springs med-school branch - The Denver Post (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_17255254?source=bb#ixzz1Ck2I3RWV) http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_17255254?source=bb#ixzz1Ck2I3RWV

[Front_Range_Guy]

Very cool, hopefully this goes somewhere...

[Eeyore]

It could be huge. I have to admit I am jealous.

[wong21fr]

It could be huge. I have to admit I am jealous.

Not too huge, this is not intended to be a full-blown new medical school. Rather, medical students would complete their first two years of (mostly) classroom-based instruction at the Anschutz Campus and would then relocate to UCCS to finish the final two years of clinic rotations. Doing so would allow CU Med to increase their class sizes as apparently the current constraint is a lack of clinical rotation spots in the Denver Metro Area.

This proposal could be expanded to include other major geographic areas such as Grand Junction and Fort Collins/Greeley and is intended to address the lack of primary care doctors in these areas.

[Eeyore]

Oh ok. Plus Pueblo has that anyway at our hospitals now. I have met students in medical school who were at the local hospitals on rotations.

[wong21fr]

^Yep, this proposal would make it easier for medical students to do clinical rotations in other geographic areas of the state w/o having to deal with coming back to Denver.

[Brainpathology]

I did rotations in Alamosa, Greeley, Pueblo, Colorado Springs in addition to Denver and unfortunately just training doctors in these areas isn't going to make them stay there. If anything doing my rotations in Pueblo and Greeley cemented how underpaid, overworked and unsatisfying a career in primary anything (psych, surgery, peds, or family practice) was. Great if daddy and mommy pay your way debt free through med school (or if health reform also made medical school free for those who could be accepted). But not really attractive or even feasible long term for someone leaving undergrad and med school with 250+k of debt. Basically you have the debt of med school and get paid as a nurse, yay! (don't get my wrong either, being a nurse with the pittance of debt a nursing degree requires is a GREAT career with upwards of an entire decade of earning power returned to you compared to any primary care specialty)

EDIT: I never got to my point.... if I was allocating money to the Colorado higher education system this would get cut really quickly. There are plenty of opportunities to rotate anywhere in the state with housing paid for by the medical school. This includes Pueblo, Alamosa, Greeley, GJ, Montrose, etc etc. Simply requiring 1 of every 3 rotations in year 3 and 4 be out of Denver would free up the exact amount of space for extra students. In fact confining them to COS would actually constrain rather than expand their opportunities for rural exposure. There is nothing rural or under-served about COS anyway.

[bunt_q]

I did rotations in Alamosa, Greeley, Pueblo, Colorado Springs in addition to Denver and unfortunately just training doctors in these areas isn't going to make them stay there. If anything doing my rotations in Pueblo and Greeley cemented how underpaid, overworked and unsatisfying a career in primary anything (psych, surgery, peds, or family practice) was. Great if daddy and mommy pay your way debt free through med school (or if health reform also made medical school free for those who could be accepted). But not really attractive or even feasible long term for someone leaving undergrad and med school with 250+k of debt. Basically you have the debt of med school and get paid as a nurse, yay! (don't get my wrong either, being a nurse with the pittance of debt a nursing degree requires is a GREAT career with upwards of an entire decade of earning power returned to you compared to any primary care specialty)

I have a hard time sympathizing with "underpaid" primary care physicians, sorry. :) $250k in debt is mighty unfortunate, yes. But I think I'd still prefer the math on a primary care doctor over lawyer math these days.

Let's see...

Doc Debt: $250,000
Starting Pay: $125,000?
Median: $200,000?

versus

Lawyer Debt: $110,000
Starting Pay: $65,000
Median: $110,000

(All numbers approximate) But I think doctors still have a pretty good deal. :)

[Brainpathology]

I have a hard time sympathizing with "underpaid" primary care physicians, sorry. :) $250k in debt is mighty unfortunate, yes. But I think I'd still prefer the math on a primary care doctor over lawyer math these days.

Let's see...

Doc Debt: $250,000
Starting Pay: $125,000?
Median: $200,000?

versus

Lawyer Debt: $110,000
Starting Pay: $65,000
Median: $110,000

(All numbers approximate) But I think doctors still have a pretty good deal. :)

That would be great if the numbers were that good and for people who do well all through training they can be. However, that's not what I've been hearing my colleagues getting for primary car jobs lately. There are jobs out there now for less than 100k. I think people would be happy to find a primary care job where they were taking home 200k now. I've heard they are rare (then again I've heard pathology is dying which is nonsense). I DO know starting pathology jobs (for example in Santa Barbara in private practice this year for a colleague) are running as low as 120k to start, after 6years of residency/fellowship training. (same time training as a neurosurgeon in other words).

If we're comparing MD's to JD's you'll get no argument from me. It is WAY WAY too easy to become a JD from what I have been told.

And yes in general Doctors have a great deal... but when presented with:

A: HUGE hours 100-150k to start, live in the middle of nowhere, have little support AND have debt out the ears (even with repayment programs). Not much money left over to lobby to protect your salary (sucks but that's the game now and no one cares to fix it) (family practice, peds, internal medicine, psych)

B: Reasonable hours same salary as above or a little more, live in the city, pretty safe salary, still a lot of debt, not much stress (neurology, infectios disease, hospitalist, others)

C: Lots of hours and stress but double or triple the above salary; phenomenally strong lobbying, and lots of control in large hospitals (surgury subspecialties, a few internal medicine subspecialties like nephrology, cardiology etc)

D: great hours and same money or a little less than C, and also reasonably powerful national organizations lobbying on your behalf. To be frank this is where pathology is VERY lucky at this moment (though it's precarious) to have the College of American Pathologists or CAP. (radiology, anethesia-still sorta, some pathology jobs, derm, ENT)

Where does that leave option A when you're in medical school when all the talk is about downward pressure on reimbusements and upward pressure on hours? IF you plan for the future and have to listen to that for 4 years what would you do? It doesn't matter where you train or what help you're given if you listen to everyone saying things are getting worse for DR's because of insurance companies, malpractice, lowering reimbursements etc. You are NOT going to choose the least compensated AND most overworked specialties. People who think like that aren't smart enough to be in medical school in the first place. (maybe they are at JD mills diluting your pool of workers... I dunno)

[bunt_q]

That would be great if the numbers were that good and for people who do well all through training they can be. However, that's not what I've been hearing my colleagues getting for primary car jobs lately. There are jobs out there now for less than 100k. I think people would be happy to find a primary care job where they were taking home 200k now. I've heard they are rare (then again I've heard pathology is dying which is nonsense). I DO know starting pathology jobs (for example in Santa Barbara in private practice this year for a colleague) are running as low as 120k to start, after 6years of residency/fellowship training. (same time training as a neurosurgeon in other words).

If we're comparing MD's to JD's you'll get no argument from me. It is WAY WAY too easy to become a JD from what I have been told.

And yes in general Doctors have a great deal... but when presented with:

A: HUGE hours 100-150k to start, live in the middle of nowhere, have little support AND have debt out the ears (even with repayment programs). Not much money left over to lobby to protect your salary (sucks but that's the game now and no one cares to fix it) (family practice, peds, internal medicine, psych)

B: Reasonable hours same salary as above or a little more, live in the city, pretty safe salary, still a lot of debt, not much stress (neurology, infectios disease, hospitalist, others)

C: Lots of hours and stress but double or triple the above salary; phenomenally strong lobbying, and lots of control in large hospitals (surgury subspecialties, a few internal medicine subspecialties like nephrology, cardiology etc)

D: great hours and same money or a little less than C, and also reasonably powerful national organizations lobbying on your behalf. To be frank this is where pathology is VERY lucky at this moment (though it's precarious) to have the College of American Pathologists or CAP. (radiology, anethesia-still sorta, some pathology jobs, derm, ENT)

Where does that leave option A when you're in medical school when all the talk is about downward pressure on reimbusements and upward pressure on hours? IF you plan for the future and have to listen to that for 4 years what would you do? It doesn't matter where you train or what help you're given if you listen to everyone saying things are getting worse for DR's because of insurance companies, malpractice, lowering reimbursements etc. You are NOT going to choose the least compensated AND most overworked specialties. People who think like that aren't smart enough to be in medical school in the first place. (maybe they are at JD mills diluting your pool of workers... I dunno)

Yeah, I think MDs still have enough leverage that they can make that choice. JDs, meanwhile, have no leverage. A $46k entry level govt job gets, no exaggeration, 200 applicants these days. Long hours... eh... everybody has those anymore, if you want to keep your job. The advantage doctors have is that demand can't go away. People still get sick. More hours, less pay, more debt... same pressures every profession faces, I think doctors are just starting from such a position of wealth, and had it so good for so long, it causes them more heartache when things change.

There are far too many lawyers. Comparing it to engineers though... one problem with engineering is that one firm has no qualms about low-balling its rates to get work. Billing rates for engineers are absurdly low, because there's no unifying body saying, "whoa guys, keep them above $100, or else..." Law isn't like that - 100,000 unemployed lawyers, and billing rates don't budge. The ABA controls its monopoly tightly... but doesn't seem at all concerned with more and more law graduates, fewer and fewer jobs. Something has to give. And since it's going to be tough to close JD mills once they're up and running, I think the downward pressures on salaries will continue. Like with doctors. Engineers have steady pay, and there are usually jobs... maybe they have the right idea. It'll be hard to find equilibrium as long as law school costs as much as it does. I imagine doctors are headed the same way. Folks still need health care, even if they are broke, unemployed, destitute, you name it, and somebody's got to provide it!

[Brainpathology]

Yeah, I think MDs still have enough leverage that they can make that choice. JDs, meanwhile, have no leverage. A $46k entry level govt job gets, no exaggeration, 200 applicants these days. Long hours... eh... everybody has those anymore, if you want to keep your job. The advantage doctors have is that demand can't go away. People still get sick. More hours, less pay, more debt... same pressures every profession faces, I think doctors are just starting from such a position of wealth, and had it so good for so long, it causes them more heartache when things change.

There are far too many lawyers. Comparing it to engineers though... one problem with engineering is that one firm has no qualms about low-balling its rates to get work. Billing rates for engineers are absurdly low, because there's no unifying body saying, "whoa guys, keep them above $100, or else..." Law isn't like that - 100,000 unemployed lawyers, and billing rates don't budge. The ABA controls its monopoly tightly... but doesn't seem at all concerned with more and more law graduates, fewer and fewer jobs. Something has to give. And since it's going to be tough to close JD mills once they're up and running, I think the downward pressures on salaries will continue. Like with doctors. Engineers have steady pay, and there are usually jobs... maybe they have the right idea. It'll be hard to find equilibrium as long as law school costs as much as it does. I imagine doctors are headed the same way. Folks still need health care, even if they are broke, unemployed, destitute, you name it, and somebody's got to provide it!

All of what you say is correct in medicine...as it is in everything else. To be clear too I wasnt' asking for you to 'sympathize" with Dr's. I wouldn't change what I'm doing for anything in the world and I love going to work every day. I DO have the luxury of starting from nothing and having no money or doctors in my family so a job starting at 120k with potential to go to 200k seems just peachy to me.

I just wanted to explain what I've seen of the choices med school graduates are presented with and how those choices aren't going to be (in my opinion), changed much at all by opening a medical school extension in Grand Junction or Greeley and certainly not in an urban area like Colorado Springs. Doctors aren't skipping primary care because we're not aware that there are a shortage of doctors in lots of areas. It's impossible NOT to know that in an American medical school.

The only thing I can think of to get doctors to stay in these sorts of places would be to set up RESIDENCIES there. It would be FAR harder to abandon your patients if you could do rotations THEN residency in a primary specialty in say Durango than it is now when you do rotations there, then go to a city to do a residency and then have lost the connections you would have made with your patients out in the boonies back in medical school. So, gaurantee a residency spot in that small city primary residency, outside of the match, to a student who passes their rotation in a rural area in a primary specialty. That way if they really want to bet on manipulating doctors' feelings to get them to choose lower paying, higher work specialties (which the language of that article makes it 100% clear they ARE doing) then they are going about it all wrong.