[bvpcvm]

The pavilion in front of the Elizabeth. On 10th and Flanders.
The corner on 11th and Burnside, between Baha Fresh and Mio, across from Powell's.


one wonders: WTF?

the burnside location has been empty since it was built in, what? 2001? and the elizabeth pavilion would make a wonderful little coffe shop (and lord knows the pearl suffers from a coffee deficit).

does anyone have any inside info on why these two locations are STILL vacant after all these years?

[pdxtraveler]

According to one of the other posts, I believe in the 'what's going on in the pearl thread'. The Elizabeth spot was leased by a new Spanish? restaurant.

The Brewery block space is just a weird size I think.

[bvpcvm]

ok, guess i missed that one about the elizabeth.

how about this, then: the block that used to be the distillery on 23rd, just south of pastini. rc ford is supposedly redoing it for retail, but progress seems to have slowed to a crawl. i know some mexican restaurant (per rumor) has applied for a liquor license for the northmost space, but the rest... any insiders out there have any idea?

[pdxman]

You know what they need in the pearl? More cheap places to eat--thus a wendys would be a perfect fit in that corner spot. As far as i know there isn't one in DT at all and i'm always craving a junior bacon cheese and a frosty. Since its the pearl i'm sure they could make it classy.

[bvpcvm]

it seems like an obvious spot for some cheep eatz; i wonder if there isn't some kind of clause in baja fresh's lease that keeps the corner from being leased to a cafe or restaurant.

i haven't been there but noodles & co. just opened next to sushiland. i hear it's cheap; no idea what the food is like.

[PDX City-State]

I've wondered about this as well--it is a weird space and I don't think it would be very good for a restaurant because there isn't much space for a kitchen--and not great for a retail spot because of the traffice on Burnside. A bar? A coffee shop--not that Portland needs another one.

[pdxstreetcar]

You know what they need in the pearl? More cheap places to eat--thus a wendys would be a perfect fit in that corner spot. As far as i know there isn't one in DT at all and i'm always craving a junior bacon cheese and a frosty. Since its the pearl i'm sure they could make it classy.

I agree, although I was thinking a Burgerville.:eat: Afterall its local, seasonal, sustainable and fairly high quality which seems to be the Pearl type. The typical suburban model store wouldn't work in the Pearl or downtown but it could be a one-of-a-kind flagship location.

Of the top of my head the cheap eats in the Pearl:
Byways Cafe
Fullers Coffee Shop
Pizza Schmitza
Hot Lips Pizza
Taco del Mar
Subway
Noodles & Co.
Baha Fresh
Cha Cha Cha
Daily Cafe
Pearl Bakery
the Mediterranean place next to Schmitza
Low Brow Lounge

[Urbanpdx]

Add to that Nancy's across the freeway.

[westsider]

Old town @ Everett + Broadway, John's Cafe. The food is pretty good for a greasy spoon diner and the prices are unbelievable. At this place its still possible to get a good meal for 3-5 dollars.

[zilfondel]

Every fast food restaurant in DT or close in turns into a complete druggie/homeless hangout. NO THANKS!

[pdxstreetcar]

Anyone know what happened to "Periodicals and Books Paradise" the huge back issue magazine store at Hawthorne & 33rd? Did they move? I went there today and found that the store was closed.:(

[tworivers]

(and lord knows the pearl suffers from a coffee deficit)

Anyone been to Cafe Allora? I like that place.
Good coffee, good food, nice people. Moderately spendy.
And it's at 9th and Glisan, so you can sit there and stare at the 937 site.

[urbanlife]

I would love to have a burgerville downtown, even if it were in the pearl.

The noodle place is actually pretty good....worth stopping in. As for cheap eats, happy hour has been my favorites for finding the cheap food.

[dkealoha]

I just came across... Eddie Bauer is going in the Metropolitan
http://www.urbanworksrealestate.com/listings/images/Metropolitan_Site_lg.gif

A few things going in the Meriwether...
http://www.urbanworksrealestate.com/listings/images/Meriwether_floorplan_3lg.gif

and Umpqua Bank in the John Ross...
http://www.urbanworksrealestate.com/listings/images/John_Ross_Floor_Plan.gif

[PacificNW]

Any word on where Niketown is relocating? I heard a rumor that the block the Club Portland/Silverado's sits is the destined location...

[pdxman]

I seemed to think they were heading for the pearl, but idk...

[65MAX]

Any word on where Niketown is relocating? I heard a rumor that the block the Club Portland/Silverado's sits is the destined location...

That triangular lot would be ideal for a Niketown flagship/showpiece. High visibility between Downtown, West End and Brewery Blocks/Pearl.

[65MAX]

In other retail news....

Carl Greve is moving into the vacant space at Broadway and Morrison (the old Gap space).

[urbanlife]

it will be interesting to see how much of an entertainment and retail district the SoWa will become.

[der Reisender]

^agreed, there is so much potential for a great, active retail area. it has been and will continue to be fun to watch it develop over time

[bvpcvm]

In other retail news....

Carl Greve is moving into the vacant space at Broadway and Morrison (the old Gap space).

i thought that's where lucky jeans was going?

last night i noticed that the old stars antique mall on 21st and everett, which was remodeled about a year ago, has finally been leased to a tacqueria called "CHA".

[MarkDaMan]

Wow, an almost 13,000 sq ft of continuous retail space in the John Ross, that's pretty substantial...I wonder if it will be a restaurant or national chain clothing store?

[Urbanpdx]

it will be interesting to see how much of an entertainment and retail district the SoWa will become.

I really really doubt it will become one at all. Even John's Landing (which is not much of anything) will always be more than SOWA.

[MarkDaMan]

that's cause you are biased against the South Waterfront...the facts though are a bit different. Within ten years you will have two of Oregon's most powerful universities, and over 40,000 students, within 4 streetcar stops, a light rail line, and aerial tram ride, next to each other. That in itself (and there are many more examples of why SoWa is a given success) gives the South Waterfront and southern end of downtown, a much stronger built in demand that the Pearl didn't have, and look at how well it is thriving...not only is the Pearl thriving, but it was maturing during the height of the early 21st century recession.

The South Waterfront wont be completed tomorrow, and hopefully not in ten years. What the South Waterfront does for Portland is allow future growth, whether it be office, condos, apartments, or university expansions, for many years to come.

[Urbanpdx]

But the Pearl (and NW Portland in general) are successful because of easy access to I-405 and other major arterials. Retail in SOWA will look like that around PSU or Riverplace...nothing very interesting...

imho :)

[MarkDaMan]

It is impossible, and frankly a bit naive, to categorically compare the retail environment in the South Waterfront with Riverplace and PSU. PSU has a bunch of older buildings and large garages that don't allow street level retail, and frankly aren't all that inviting. If you look at the newer PSU developments such as the urban center, the new engineering school, the planned student center on the old advanced technology site, the new dorms(?) above Chipotle on Broadway, the addition of the MAX, and the Montgomery blocks, PSU's retail environment, as well as the streetscape, is going to greatly improve in the very near future.

Riverplace was a flawed design, and similiar to what Prometheus was offering in the late 80's early 90's for their land in the South Waterfront. Most housing in Riverplace was built on top of one level of parking. There were no through streets, pedestrian or otherwise, between housing units except the main boardwalk, and the development didn't connect with the surrounding community, one side being the large Waterfront Park bowl, another side bordered by a hill with several roads. The Strand has already filled up many long vacant retail fronts, and created a town center, in case you haven't been there recently.

The South Waterfront meanwhile is new...brand new. The retail will be connected to the inviting streetscape and the spaces available will be in a mix of sizes and styles. Since the towers are being developed on smaller than the downtown full block buildings, several new developments like the John Ross and the first Prometheus tower, will have central plazas that face away from the street. There are also going to be pedestrian only sections of road (between Atwater and Meriwether for one) that will offer a 'lifestyle center' type development that ALL major retails nationwide are jumping on board with. With the higher than normal demographics for the area and 1000 employees already working in the first OHSU building, retailers and restauranters wont ignore the district, even if Portland wanted them too.

[Urbanpdx]

I hope you are right but I still predict you are not.

[Dougall5505]

also remember that in the john ross Desmond Mason's wife has leased a boutique clothing store but it wasn't in that picture so maybe she hasn't finalized it yet
edit: i saw over the summer that there was a picture in the bella espresso space that said it was opening september 2006; i checked out that sign recently and theres duct tape over the date now.

[urbanlife]

I kind of see something that will be a cross between what Mark and Urbanpdx see. I think it will be slower pace there. Very much an urban sleepy neighborhood. There will be a collection of fine dining and cafes there, that is a given. Where people live in Portland, so will there be coffee, food, and alcohol. As for shopping and entrtainment, that is a different one. I am not sure that is going to live up to anyone's expectations....or it might be more like what Mark pointed out. For this it might take years, even decades to have anything really happen.

I think when OHSU starts building their campus is when real changes will begin in that area.

[Drmyeyes]

John's landing does not seem analogous to SoWa. SoWa has connectivity that's far superior to John's landing, at least presently; walking and streetcar to name two means of access. I haven't checked out SoWa a lot so far, but I've walked over there some. Even without much activity as of 2-3 months ago, it seems to have the potential for a nice walking feel. My thinking is that's of critical importance for a bustling residential, entertainment district.

N.W. 23rd and 21st have it, OTCT, particulaly 3rd and has it. John's landing, though it's been a nice feature for that neighborhood over the years, is mostly a local mall. Those two big fast streets east and west of it really cut the neighborhood up. Either you drive to it, or use it as a neighborhood resident, and that must be death for a lot of potential business.

I'm not exactly sure what the issues are for Riverplace, but the it does seem to make sense that the parking garages mess up more effective pedestrian, and therefore, retail and other use of that area. It's still a nice walk, but once you hit the walk in front of the hotel on the north, the complex is just a big wall until you get past McCormicks. SoWa is so much better than JL, and may be much better than RP too. Time will tell.

[westsider]

Either you drive to it, or use it as a neighborhood resident, and that must be death for a lot of potential business.

It seems to me that the most successful shopping areas in the region are auto-centric. Bridgeport village, washington square, streets of tanasborne, even lloyd center gets the large majority of it's business from people driving to it.

[Drmyeyes]

"...Bridgeport village, washington square, streets of tanasborne, even lloyd center...". westsider.

Apples and Oranges. All those places are completely different from the places I mentioned: N.W. 23rd and 21st, OTCT 3rd and 4th. Even JL is not a mall on the order of those regional malls you mentioned. Regional malls were designed to profit from the unique character of the individual automobile, and they have done so very successfully in their golden era, which has been waning for some time now. That waning is what opened the way for NW and the Pearl, and other places being actively cultivated to support their kind of activity.

As a long time resident, it's very amusing to see a place like Bridgeport attempt to ape the feel of a real neighborhood with little streets amongst the stores and so forth. Or the Lloyd Center, which, even though it is a regional mall, once had the feel of an open plaza marketplace to the neighborhood around it, but with the addition of the roof, has become a kind of sterile womb removed. The enclosed mall, coupled with the car desert, really kills integration with the neighborhood.

I think it's going to take time, but all these new places; N.W. 23rd and 21st, OTCT, SoWa, Riverplace, PSU area, and even JL are going to gradually knit together very nicely as multi-use areas, very much unlike what regional malls have been. I mean, already, at least for me, it can be a very nice walk from downtown to riverplace, to SoWA and back, maybe through the university district, then over to the pearl and down through OTCT. Then of course, there's the streetcar if you can't or don't want to walk or bike.

More people are going to want to do this because it feels great. This accessibility and people's receptivity to doing their shopping through the aid of their own body's motive power seems to stand a good possibility of, if not equating the economomic production of regional malls, at least making the new neighborhood developments become very productive economic centers in a way that is unique to thier own particular character. This is the future. If your develpment plans to help people do without a car, you're ahead of the game.

[PacificNW]

The Regional Mall concept is reinventing itself. There was a downturn for them but, for the most part, they are getting the consumer to return for their day of shopping.

The Macy's at Washington Square is their top performer for the region and their location at Bellevue Square is second. These malls were packed during the holidays. For the most part all the national anchor department stores have shown sales increases for the year.

The regional mall is not quite a dinosaur yet.

[urbanlife]

The Regional Mall concept if reinventing itself. There was a downturn for them but, for the most part, they are getting the consumer to return for the day of shopping.

The Macy's at Washington Square is their top performer for the region and their location at Bellevue Square is second. These malls were packed during the holidays. For the most part all the national anchor department stores have shown sales increases for the year.

The regional mall is not quite a dinosaur yet.

And never will be. The regional mall will always have a purpose in cities. I have nothing wrong with them, it is just good to see Portland creating options and a better city.

[PacificNW]

Ditto...

[MarkDaMan]

^I went shopping at Washington Square Mall two weekends ago, found a pot and pan set I liked for almost 75% off at Macys...yeah...and came downtown to buy it. I would have felt guilty buying it in the burbs...but I did enjoy the walk around the mall, and do go to regional malls every couple months, but I am downtown daily and enjoy it much more.

[PDX City-State]

Retail in SOWA will look like that around PSU or Riverplace...nothing very interesting...


I agree that it won't be exciting or amazing, but it won't be anything like Riverplace or PSU. If you used retail around PSU as a comparable retail space when decided rent in a site study, you would probably not have a job in the morning.

[Drmyeyes]

You can't live at the malls. Lifestyle centers try to copy the feel of real neighborhoods because the experience of shopping in places that you might also live in are what people have a growing interest in. People like to drive too, so malls will likely be around, but getting to them gets increasingly awkward as the population becomes more dense. As a result, the prospects for downtown and its surrounding neighborhoods, where this is becoming less the case, looks better and better.

[PacificNW]

I am surprised that Tigard/Washington Square haven't been trying to get light rail closer to the mall especially with a line going to Clackamas TC and one bordering Lloyd Center. I think Drmyeyes is correct in his above post. LC and CTC appear to be positioning themselves well for the future (transportation, wise).