[mcc16]

that theoretical 86 million that could go somewhere else though...like lrt

[CMD UW]

Well I'm sure many other NHL cities which have had new arenas recently built (New Jersey) were able to to do so without raising taxes for all citizens. Just doesn't make sense to do that. City council will be able to find a funding option which doesn't call for a tax increase, I'm sure.They issue bonds (which US-municipalities are allowed to do) to fund these types of developments. Essentially they take on debt which at the end of the day is paid by taxes.

Purpose of municipal bonds - Municipal bonds are securities that are issued for the purpose of financing the infrastructure needs of the issuing municipality. These needs vary greatly but can include schools, streets and highways, bridges, hospitals, public housing, sewer and water systems, power utilities, and various public projects.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Municipal_bond

[Coldrsx]

Interesting they DONT talk about Ottawa or Calgary... you know, markets that relate on a much more relative basis.
--------------------------------------------
'Don't screw Edmonton' in arena deal
By CANDICE WARD, EDMONTON SUN
Last Updated: April 10, 2011 10:22pm
Story
Comments
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An artist conception of the 104 Ave. area for the proposed downtown Edmonton arena district. (Supplied image)
Edmonton should take a page from the playbooks of Vancouver and Toronto, according to former municipal officials in those cities.

A longtime Vancouver councillor and ex-Toronto mayor, whose respective cities are home to privately funded downtown arenas, have offered up a bit of advice for dealing with Edmonton’s arena issue.

“Don’t screw the general populace of Edmonton to get them to pay for an (arena),” said George Puil, former Vancouver city councillor.

In the early 1990s, the Vancouver Canucks were seeking money to expand their home at Pacific Coliseum.

The owners of the Canucks, Orca Bay Sports and Entertainment, approached the Pacific National Exhibition (PNE), who pegged the cost to be around $80 million.

Former Edmonton Oilers coach Pat Quinn was with the Canucks at the time and said, “We can build our own arena for $80 million,” according to Puil.

So that is what they did.


http://www.edmontonsun.com/news/edmonton/2011/04/10/17942961.html

[Coldrsx]

From 'Voices for democracy, Speak up Edmonton'
----------------------------------------------------------

Dear Members of Voices for Democracy Board and Supporters: The outcome of the Wednesday, June 6th City of Edmonton Council meeting was a disappointing but not unexpected. I want to thank everyone who took the time to come out and be present. It was a frustrating day to watch most of our elected representatives ask feeble questions of city administration. The shining stars though that did ask very tough questions were Linda Sloan (this woman was awesome), Tony Caterina and Ed Gibbons. Many of the things these three said were highly quotable. I also must mention Don Iveson. Although I was unimpressed with his performance he at least did argue that significant development was going on in the downtown without the introduction of an arena. The behavior of the Mayor was absolutely unfathomable – whistling to himself, overly courteous to children in the audience and referring to Councilor Krushell as “sweetie” and “Kimmie” – astonishing and highly unprofessional. However, all of this aside I was most surprised that Ed Gibbons voted in favor of this debacle. What was that all about – especially after his grilling of the city administration on their poorly prepared and delivered reports to council?

The whole experience was momentarily deflating. The vote of 10 to 3 in favor of continuing negotiations with Katz an unhappy outcome. But out of this whole dreary mess came a resolve that the push to use “public funds” for this unwanted and unnecessary arena isn’t going to happen. So now we need to regroup and review the 17 motions that were agreed to by Council and come to an understanding of what they actually mean for the Edmonton taxpayers.

I just want to remind the Board and all of our supporters that there is NO meeting scheduled for Sunday, April 10th.

I have made arrangements to rebook our room for at Enterprise Square (old Bay Building downtown), 2nd Floor, Room 2-173 (room beside the one we were in), 10230 Jasper Ave, for April 17, 2011 commencing at 11:00 a.m. Confirmation and a proposed agenda of this meeting will be forthcoming to the Board and our supporters.

Between now and the next meeting we can all give some thought to the situation and come prepared to share ideas on how we should proceed.

Outlined below for everyone are the 17 motions that council passed on April 6th.

Council Motion (April 6, 2011)

City Council has directed Administration to negotiate a financial framework for a downtown City-owned sports and entertainment facility with the Katz Group, based on the series of terms and conditions outlined below:

That Administration negotiate a financial framework for a downtown City-owned sports and entertainment facility with the Katz Group based on the following terms and conditions:

1. Maximum Price - $450,000,000 to be set prior to any approval by Council of adequate price guarantees

2. Confirmation of Katz Group commitment of $100M.

3. User fee (Ticket Surcharge) to fund capital costs of $125M

4. Evaluate options for a CRL(s): That administration revise and reframe projected CRL project(s) to support the City’s overall downtown plan with $20 million from the CRL to be directed to arena and the balance of proceeds used to support other priority downtown projects (Quarters, Jasper Avenue, Warehouse District) in conjunction with the overall downtown plan.

5. a) Evaluation options for further support (potentially $105 million) to be paid for by either direct tax revenues from the arena, or savings from not having to pay current subsidy and parking revenue increase to the City.
b) That the total of 4 and 5 in terms of the City’s direct contribution to the arena building would not exceed $125 million

6. City owns the arena and the land for any new facility.

7. Agreement on fair market value of the arena property.

8. An agreement is entered into with the Katz Group, with the Katz Group responsible for operating costs and generating necessary revenues for 30 years.

9. Project cannot proceed until the balance of funds are confirmed.

10. That Administration continues to work with Northlands to ensure the City understands their financial challenges and how these can be addressed.

11. Location agreement whereby the necessary agreements are signed to ensure that the Edmonton Oilers operate out of the facility for 30 years.

12. That the City retain the right to access to facility 4 weeks per year – uses to be determined by the City but may include allocation of uses to Northlands or other bodies, for example, the Canadian Finals Rodeo, Capital EX and other events the City deems of civic importance.

13. City to negotiate options for potential revenue sharing.

14. Investigate the opportunities for lottery through establishment of foundation, with proceeds directed towards community benefits in the new facility.

15. That Administration provide a report on options for the naming rights.

Amendment (L.Sloan/S. Mandel) Carried
16. That Administration negotiate the requirement for a Community Benefits Agreement associated with the above framework as part of any negotiated agreement.

Amendment (L.Sloan/J. Batty) Carried
17. That the final negotiated agreement be brought back to

I hope that all of this information is of interest and look forward to your continued support and assistance as we move forward on this arena issue.

Wayne MacDonald

Secretary

Voices for Democracy

[Kevin_foster]

The sun put so much negative spin on this issue, it makes me sick. Front page "DONT SCREW EDMONTON", really?

Drives home the point that the Edmonton Sun is just a tabloid paper on par with the national enquirer.

[craner]

^^ Wow - there's a different perspective.
Statements like: " . . . unwanted and unnecessary arena . . . " really irk me - as if this group thinks they speak for the whole population of Edmonton. :hell:

[MrOilers]

Many of the things these three said were highly quotable.

I agree that Caterina is highly quotable.

[EdmTrekker]

The sun put so much negative spin on this issue, it makes me sick. Front page "DONT SCREW EDMONTON", really?

Drives home the point that the Edmonton Sun is just a tabloid paper on par with the national enquirer.

Metro is free and MUCH better.
The Sun is a joke...I hope they have to pay for street space for their boxes...it should not be free.

[Coldrsx]

Arena deal leaves nagging questions


BY GARY LAMPHIER, EDMONTON JOURNAL APRIL 12, 2011 6:48 AM COMMENTS (12)


STORYPHOTOS ( 1 )



Conceptual image of the proposed downtown Edmonton arena district.
EDMONTON - I love a parade as much as the next guy. I hate being cast as a party pooper.

But that's how I felt last week as praise rained down on Mayor Stephen Mandel and council for green-lighting the downtown arena project.

I remain troubled by nagging questions. I wish I wasn't, but I am. I'm just not willing to jump on board this train yet, even if it has apparently left the station.

While I love the mayor's vision for a shiny new downtown, at the risk of sounding hopelessly anal, I'm just not able to ignore some lingering questions.

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/Arena+deal+leaves+nagging+questions/4598727/story.html

[Coldrsx]

A question was poised to Jan at the lecture last night as to 'what an arena might to to downtown Edmonton'.

I will paraphrase his reply.

"If it is just an arena with parking, it will do nothing. If it fits into the surroundings, has context, and is designed for people at the street, it will do wonders"

He referenced the SKYDOME and how much energy it drives into downtown Toronto pre/post games when it might be rather quiet otherwise. He mentions how they included little onsite parking so that people are forced to use the TTC. He spoke about how bars, restaurants, and shops were ALIVE before and after games.

It was refreshing to hear this.

[Airboy]

I agree with him on that point. The area around Skydome and also around AT&T in San Fran is quite lively before and after games. And there is little parking at both centres.

[Gary Wayne]

Does anybody know when the katz group is going to start nagotiating with the city again so we can see shovels in the ground. Any further delay will only give the anti arena forces time to cause more problems.

[Coldrsx]

^time IS of the essence for all involved.

[christopherj]

I would have guessed the city and Katz group are already meeting again...

[BLACK STAR]

Yeah you wonder if they just said...lets negotiate but keep it on the down low till we have this ironed out?

[CMD UW]

Yes, lots of action goin' on folks.

[Coldrsx]

April 12: More letters on a downtown arena in Edmonton


EDMONTONJOURNAL.COM APRIL 11, 2011


STORYPHOTOS ( 1 )



Conceptual image of the proposed downtown Edmonton arena district.
Photograph by: Katz Group, edmontonjournal.com
I feel the need to write about the downtown arena in Edmonton as I believe there is a perspective that isn’t really talked about and I think it is getting forgotten.

I am an avid Oilers fan and concertgoer from outside of Edmonton. I feel we are getting over looked in this whole debate as well as the fact that the Edmonton Oilers bring the city huge dollars from surrounding areas.

I live in Whitecourt and have been a multi-mini-pack holder for several years now and attend an average of between 10 and 15 games a year. Each of these games include me buying meals, gas, snacks, and usually other merchandise, and the odd time a hotel room.

. . .

—Mike Penner, Whitecourt

---

Re: “Consensus grows as levy shrinks,” Opinion, April 8, and “Northlands vows Rexall Place will stay open despite new arena; Venue would compete for concerts, other events,” The Journal, April 8.

Is someone trying to hoodwink our councillors and city taxpayers into thinking they won’t have to pay almost entirely for the new Katz arena?

It seems the “restrictions” in Mayor Stephen Mandel’s 17-point motion which councillors were forced to vote on before they left April 6 did not include:

A contract to keep the Oilers in Edmonton for 30 more years.

. . .

—Aileen Tayler, Edmonton

---

Why are Canada, Alberta, Edmonton taxpayers expected to provide the majority of the funds to construct a money-making building for a billionaire who pays many of his hockey employees/players each a million dollars or more for working part of a year?

No other business owner in Edmonton or the rest of Alberta expects to have a building paid for by taxpayers, even if they receive incentives to relocate to a specific municipality or region.

If this project proceeds as currently envisaged, it can be concluded that there is justification for contributing taxpayer funds to the developers of shopping centres, offices and manufacturing and other industrial buildings in Edmonton, all of which contribute to the employment and well-being of Edmontonians.

. . .

—Alastair Aikman, Edmonton

---

As a director of an organization that represents merchants within Chinatown and Little Italy, I can confidently state that the majority of merchants within this community feel that a major attractions centre such as the new arena would have a positive effect on the downtown area, in particular to the eastern edge of downtown that meets the boundary of Chinatown and Little Italy.

A spur of new business would bring a wealth to the community that would inevitably augment the current opportunity to invest in the neighbourhoods’ attractiveness, thus alluring more business and visitors to the community.

Chinatown offers a diversity and cultural richness that more Edmontonians would be persuaded to experience because of its adjacent location to the proposed arena.

. . .

—Terry Lui, Edmonton

© Copyright (c) The Edmonton Journal

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/opinion/letters/April+More+letters+downtown+arena+Edmonton/4597575/story.html

[EdmTrekker]

Yes, lots of action goin' on folks.

Katz needs to secure a construction contract fast...as the L&M will creep up through summer and into fall and by next year have a major impact. Perhaps a DB approach like GoA is using for RAM should be considered. Lock that price in now!

[Xelebes]

Cold, remember to post only an excerpt of the articles (the letters), unless otherwise given permission from the writer.

[Gary Wayne]

Is their know news on further developments with the Arena. It would be nice to heer something positive is going on between the Katz group and the City.

[Jasper and one o nin]

^Know, there, oops, eye meen their, does not a peer too bee...

[Gary Wayne]

Thanks Jasper
I need to be more aware these mistakes. Dyslexia, is a chalange for me at times . I love this forum and always enjoy what you and the many other forumers have written.

[NutZero]

http://www2.goldmansachs.com/our-firm/progress/louisville/video.html

Louisville's downtown arena. Funding / ownership model differs but dynamic result is impressive...

[Shodan]

Katz arena plan still needs acceptable fiscal formula
Public-private funding systems can work

Gary Lamphier
Edmonton Journal

Tuesday, April 26, 2011

It's over, says AEG president Tim Leiweke.

The days of relying on public money to build new stadiums for pro sports teams are history, he says. It's time for private enterprise to step up to the plate...

glamphier@edmontonjournal.com
© Edmonton Journal 2011

Copyright © 2011 CanWest Interactive, a division of CanWest MediaWorks Publications, Inc.. All rights reserved.
CanWest Interactive, a division of CanWest MediaWorks Publications, Inc.. All rights reserved.

http://www2.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=b7369eab-0d20-4a4a-a675-7637b3a0cd54&sponsor=

[Coldrsx]

Interesting article and one that I think/hope sheds some light on the current negotiations.

[CMD UW]

I think that was a good article by Lamphier. The East Village in San Diego has done phenomenally well. I work with a gent who recently relocated from San Diego who was talking about how the East Village has changed their downtown.

I too am waiting for more details from Katz and Co.

[DRan]

Chamber of Commerce event coming up..

Below is information about our upcoming Connections 4 Business on May 3rd. Whether for or against, join us and find out the latest information on the new Downtown Arena directly from the Katz Group. If you have any questions about the arena, this is the event to attend. If you are unable to attend, please feel free to pass this information along. We look forward to seeing you next Tuesday!


Time: 7:30-8:30am

Location: 600-9990 Jasper Avenue, World Trade Centre Edmonton

Speaker: Steve Hogle, Vice President of Communications – Katz Group

Topic: "If not now, when? If not us, who?" An update on the Edmonton Arena District.

Topic Overview: The Edmonton Arena District (EAD) is one of the greatest opportunities we have before us that can take our city to a whole new level. Come learn what the project is all about and what the developers hope to achieve. The Katz Group's Vice President of Communications, Steve Hogle, will walk us through a presentation on the EAD and will then entertain questions on what is arguably the hottest topic of discussion in our city.

Please find registration form at: http://www.edmontonchamber.com/connections4business.aspx

[240glt]

^ I went to a private presentation by Steve a few weeks ago, this is the same one. Very informative, I encourage everyone to attend

[Coldrsx]

Arena seat-ownership proposal a tough sell with Edmonton council

Group should work privately with Katz and leave city out of it: Mandel

BY GORDON KENT, EDMONTONJOURNAL.COM APRIL 27, 2011 1:29 PM BE THE FIRST TO POST A COMMENT


STORYPHOTOS ( 3 )



More Images »

Conceptual image of the proposed downtown Edmonton arena district.
EDMONTON - A group ran into tough questioning Wednesday as it tried to convince the city to fund a downtown arena by selling seats in the facility.

The proposal first brought up last fall by Chicago-based Stadium Capital Financing Group involves selling ownership of 1,600 to 2,000 premium seats in the arena for between $278,000 and $417,000 each.

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/Arena+seat+ownership+proposal+tough+sell+with+Edmonton+council/4684611/story.html

[240glt]

Interesting idea, but have to agree with the writer, could be a hard sell

[rapid_business]

Why are they talking about half-million dollar seat purchasing, and not $20k seat licensing like several other arenas already use?

[Jasper and one o nin]

It makes no sense. You sell the seats and then thats that. Where is the ticket revenue after that to, oh I dont know, pay for player's salaries?
Council should not have even gave this any consideration.
A license fee would work. Plain and simple. If you want the privilage to have premium seats in the new arena, you have to purchase a license. If you no longer want the seats, you can sell the license to someone else, and they have rights to the seats and the ability to purchase tickets for any event for that seat. The initial revenue from the license goes towards building the arena. If there are 5000 premium seats at $10,000 a seat, that is $50,000,000. Even a graduated license fee based on your ticket - Platinum 2500x$20,000 - Gold 2500x$15,000 - Silver 2000x$10,000 and Copper 2000x$7,500 - that comes to $177,000,000
I dont know why this is not being considered. If you can afford $7,000 for season ticket - you should be able to afford the license (that you will eventually get back).

[Harrison]

Well a seat license sure seems to work for many NFL arenas, not sure why such a plan couldn't work in such a strong hockey market like we have in Edmonton.

[Coldrsx]

Update

http://edmonton.ca/city_government/documents/arena_update_april_26-2010.pdf

[Coldrsx]

Potential NHL markets should make Oilers worry

But Edmonton has edge over Quebec, Winnipeg

BY DAVID STAPLES, EDMONTON JOURNAL MAY 6, 2011 COMMENTS (19)


STORYPHOTOS ( 1 )



Conceptual image of the proposed downtown Edmonton arena district.
Photograph by: Katz Group, edmontonjournal.com
Is there any real possibility that the NHL Oilers will leave Edmonton in 2014, after the team's lease expires at Rexall Place?

Some clarity on this issue can be found in two recent reports, one by the Conference Board of Canada, the other by the University of Toronto's Mowat Centre. Both public interest groups took a dispassionate look at a passionate topic, just what it takes for a Canadian city to support an NHL team. Both groups found Edmonton to be a stronger market than either Winnipeg and Quebec City, which are both desperate to get NHL teams again.

This issue is alive because the Oilers will be restricted free agents in 2014, able to move on if the city and the Oilers aren't effectively working together to keep the team here. For the NHL and the Oilers, that means a new downtown arena must be built here with some amount of public subsidy from the city and the provincial government.

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/Potential+markets+should+make+Oilers+worry/4737388/story.html

[Fog Ducker]

At the rate this city fucking moves this thing will be built sometime in the year 2140.

[11thFloor]

:previous: by which point everybody on this forum will be dead. it really seems like that's because they don't want it to happen in the first place.

[Jasper and one o nin]

take it easy, these things do not take overnight. Nor should thy either. City is just looking out for the best interests of the City. That is what they are there for. It is a balancing act. YOu could say the same thing about the Katz Group as well.

[Coldrsx]

Exactly. These things take time and trust me, they are moving rather quickly given complicated nature of this.

[bigcitydude]

At the rate this city fucking moves this thing will be built sometime in the year 2140.

i understand the frustration, i feel the same, but to Edmonton's credit, The Epcor was just built, The Pearl is being built, the LRT is being expanded, the airport land is being redeveloped in the near future and there is talk at least of a new arena and museum.

[Gary Wayne]

I guess one just has to be patiant . I choose to beleave it will all come togeather very soon.

[Coldrsx]

Katz Group won’t fund arena with seat ownership

Proposal not feasible for Edmonton, says group’s CFO

BY GORDON KENT, EDMONTONJOURNAL.COM MAY 18, 2011 12:50 PM BE THE FIRST TO POST A COMMENT


STORYPHOTOS ( 4 )



More Images »

Conceptual image of the proposed downtown Edmonton arena district.
EDMONTON - The Katz Group has ruled out funding a downtown arena by selling about 2,000 seats in advance.

Chicago-based Stadium Capital Financing Group proposed selling ownership of seats in the new facility for $278,000 to $418,000, raising up to $694 million that could go to arena construction, maintenance and the Katz Group.

But Katz chief financial officer Paul Marcaccio told council Wednesday they studied this idea as part of their early work on the arena project and decided it wouldn’t work in Edmonton.

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/Katz+Group+fund+arena+with+seat+ownership/4804678/story.html

[christopherj]

Per the Oilers twitter:

"News conference upcoming at City Hall for major #yegarena announcement."

"News conference will be at 9:30. We'll have all the details as they come in."

!!!

[christopherj]

More from twitter:

"NHL_Oilers Edmonton Oilers
Agreement is for a 35-year period. 18,500 seat arena."

"NHL_Oilers Edmonton Oilers
City costs in $125 million range"

"NHL_Oilers Edmonton Oilers
$125 million in facility improvement fee. Katz Group to take care of maintenance of arena."

[Hallsy's Toupee]

http://www.metronews.ca/edmonton/local/article/864935--City-Katz-group-come-to-terms-on-arena-deal


After months of negotiations, it appears the City of Edmonton and the Oilers ownership have the foundation on which to build a new arena.
During a press conference late Wednesday, Mayor Mandel announced city council has approved an agreement framework between the city and the Katz Group to build a new downtown arena.

The framework sustains NHL hockey in Edmonton for 35 years, supports downtown revitalization and limits the city's risk, Mandel said.

The framework includes the price of the arena set at $450 million.

The city's contribution will be $125 million and will include $45 million from a CRL and the balance from parking revenue and a redirection of current subsidies. The Katz Group will contribute $100 million. Another $125 million will come from a user-paid facility fee.

The arena will have 18,500 seats and 350 parking stalls, according to a release provided to media.

The design of the arena must be acceptable to both the city and the Katz Group, and the public will have an opportunity to provide input for the plan.

The city will own the building and the land, and the Katz Group will operate the building and be responsible for all maintenance, upgrades, operating and capital expense costs.

The agreement also ensures the Oilers remain in Edmonton for at least 35 years.

The next step is for both parties to begin work on a master agreement, including work to secure the remaining 100 million, according to Mandel.

[Witty Nickname]

What? No more toilet bowl?

http://a123.g.akamai.net/f/123/12465/1d/media.canada.com/8b155442-1233-4729-a252-c06490ca0f9f/dubvision.jpg

[Hallsy's Toupee]

Official news release here:
http://www.edmonton.ca/city_government/news/city-and-katz-group-agree-on-agreement-framework-to-build-arena.aspx

[feepa]

What? No more toilet bowl?

http://a123.g.akamai.net/f/123/12465/1d/media.canada.com/8b155442-1233-4729-a252-c06490ca0f9f/dubvision.jpg

that was a concept from someone not even related to the oilers, the city or even connected to either. The Saddledump can stand proud still.

[Shodan]

Yup, Here we go...

City of Edmonton and Katz Group reach arena deal

edmontonjournal.com
May 18, 2011 10:48 PM

EDMONTON — The City of Edmonton and the Katz Group have reached a framework agreement to build a new downtown arena.

Under the agreement which will keep the Edmonton Oilers in the city for a minimum of 35 years, the most that can be spent on the arena will be $450 million.

At a hastily called news conference at City Hall Wednesday evening, reporters learned The City of Edmonton will own the land and the building...

© Copyright (c) The Edmonton Journal

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/story_print.html?id=4806505&sponsor=

[Hallsy's Toupee]

^ Jeez, you must think it's not news unless it's a Journal story. Or did you miss the earlier posts?

[Shodan]

^ Jeez, you must think it's not news unless it's a Journal story. Or did you miss the earlier posts?

Sorry 'bout that; just got back from dealing with the Slave Lake situation and got a bit over enthused. My apologies.

[Hallsy's Toupee]

Sorry 'bout that; just got back from dealing with the Slave Lake situation and got a bit over enthused. My apologies.

Ah, don't worry about it. I was in angry drunk mode last night. :crazy2:

So c'mon Edmonton, let's get this done!

[Calgarian]

Good news Edmonton!

Any rumours on how they will raise the last $100mil?

[s211]

So is this really "it", or are there still conditions that could scuttle this?

[240glt]

There will still be some grandstanding and indignation but for all intents & purposes this is likely a done deal

[Luk_o]

Congrats E-Town. Looking forward to cruising up the QE2 in a few years for a Battle o' AB in the new arena. Hopefully by then construction has started on a new home for the Flames too.

[rapid_business]

Good news Edmonton!

Any rumours on how they will raise the last $100mil?

Put pressure on the prov. & feds I believe.

[You Need A Thneed]

The feds and the province aren't going to give any money.

I think Edmonton better start looking at cutting $100 million out of the budget, that, or Katz can pony up the rest of the money for an arena he wants full revenue from.

I say it for the Oilers, and I'll say it for the Flames too, if the Province puts in a quarter of the cost, the Province gets a quarter of the revenue, or no deal, period.

[Kevin_foster]

Let's rally Gretzky to provide some pocket change :D

[Calgarian]

Put pressure on the prov. & feds I believe.

Both have already stated publicly that they won't be contributing any money.

[240glt]

They'll get their 100 mil one way or the other.

Seen it so many times on large infrastructure projects involving private & public dollars. The only difference here is the optics are a little bad, But it will happen.

[SHOFEAR]

that 450 million is not just for the arena, it most likely includes elated infrastructure like the ped overpass, sidewalks and roadway rehab, etc etc.

Thats all stuff that the city can recieve fed/provincial money for.

[ue]

More from twitter:

"NHL_Oilers Edmonton Oilers
Agreement is for a 35-year period. 18,500 seat arena."

"NHL_Oilers Edmonton Oilers
City costs in $125 million range"

"NHL_Oilers Edmonton Oilers
$125 million in facility improvement fee. Katz Group to take care of maintenance of arena."

If it's a 35 year plan, it should have capacity for the next 35 years, not just the capacity for the needs of 2014.

[Hallsy's Toupee]

Stelmach did make a subtle hint though. He said the province won't fund private facilities but is willing to fund public facilities. Note that the deal last night states that the city will own the arena and land. So the door is still open to provincial funding.

[feepa]

If it's a 35 year plan, it should have capacity for the next 35 years, not just the capacity for the needs of 2014.

What would capacity be in 35 years? The problem becomes sight lines getting much bigger than this.

If you need a super-concert venue, head to commonwealth.

[CMD UW]

Both have already stated publicly that they won't be contributing any money.True, but that's when it was a 'private' endeavor. With the City owning the land and the arena, it becomes 'public', ergo, qualifies for public money.

[Urban_Genius]

I know Katz will want to get the revenues from the naming rights, but IMO that should be put towards that 100 million dollar gap. Besides that, expect funding from the Provincial and perhaps the Feds for "infrastructure" purposes. So many loopholes.

Glad to see council have some common sense and get this thing built. Rexall is a dump in a less than desirable area. Imagine what having the 3rd busiest arena in the country is going to do to the downtown.

[s211]

The feds and the province aren't going to give any money.

I think Edmonton better start looking at cutting $100 million out of the budget, that, or Katz can pony up the rest of the money for an arena he wants full revenue from.

I say it for the Oilers, and I'll say it for the Flames too, if the Province puts in a quarter of the cost, the Province gets a quarter of the revenue, or no deal, period.

So this isn't a done deal yet, then. Wow, but this drags on.

[Shodan]

Two arenas unsustainable: Oilers owner
Daryl Katz confident Rexall Place won't compete against new downtown facility

Gordon Kent and John Mac Kinnon
Edmonton Journal

Friday, May 20, 2011

Oilers owner Daryl Katz says Northlands will do the right thing and not operate Rexall Place as a competitor to a $450-million downtown arena.

Northlands officials have repeatedly indicated they might continue holding concerts and other events at Rexall if the Oilers move out, but Katz said Thursday that wouldn't be best for Edmonton...

gkent@edmontonjournal.com jmackinnon@edmontonjournal.com
© Edmonton Journal 2011

Copyright © 2011 CanWest Interactive, a division of CanWest MediaWorks Publications, Inc.. All rights reserved.
CanWest Interactive, a division of CanWest MediaWorks Publications, Inc.. All rights reserved.

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[Shodan]

Ah, don't worry about it. I was in angry drunk mode last night. :crazy2:

So c'mon Edmonton, let's get this done!

Ya, this could evolve into a "Downtown Edmonton Arena: Just Build The Damn Thing Already" thread. BTW, that must have been some brewski :cheers:

I'm just coming down off my "Atlanta Thrashers going to Wpg" high myself - Go Jets!!! :banana:

[CorporateWhore]

So where might one see the renderings of the most recent plans for this arena? Will it be similar to what we saw last time (the swooping indoor plaza thing) or are they going back to the drawing board? I would imagine 450 million should get you something fairly nice.

[Jasper and one o nin]

New era dawning downtown?
By John MacKinnon, Edmonton Journal May 20, 2011 6:36 AM

With their framework of agreement, the Katz Group and the City of Edmonton have taken a big step toward building the signature NHL arena Oilers owner Daryl Katz and Mayor Stephen Mandel see as a centrepiece of an improved downtown.

If the obvious holes in that framework -that pesky missing $100 million, for starters -are filled in, the project can also be about constructing a new narrative for a city playing catch-up with modern urban North American life.



http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/dawning+downtown/4814593/story.html

[Jasper and one o nin]

Province has been careful to say that they will not provide funding for a for profit business. They have not said, they would not fund the construction of a community arena. The $450 million plan includes a second rink which is suppose to be a public facility.

[Coldrsx]

So where might one see the renderings of the most recent plans for this arena? Will it be similar to what we saw last time (the swooping indoor plaza thing) or are they going back to the drawing board? I would imagine 450 million should get you something fairly nice.

It will be codesigned by the Katz Group and the City. I suspect we will see something quite different from the public images right now:tup::cheers:

[Airboy]

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/Alberta+politicians+open+wallets+Edmonton+arena/4812893/story.html

[Coldrsx]

... let the games really begin! October should be interesting.

[feepa]

well, it's taken longer than I expected, but the knuckle draggers are out in full force in on c2e and the comments section of any newspaper carrying this story!!

"not with my tax payer dollars" "tell katz to fund the thing with his billions" "no billion dollar hand outs for millionaires" etc etc etc.... Where do these people come from?

[BLACK STAR]

^ Lets turn it around just for shits a giggles.


I dont want my tax dollars to fix roads potholes sewers and for gawd sake...dont use my tax dollars for healh care:rolleyes:

It will all be over soon!!...After just one more study to determine if there needs to be another study.

[Harrison]

With only $100 million still up in the air as to where it wil come from, what's wrong with Katz ponying it up? That much he can chip in, for a total of $200 million from him if I'm not mistaken, which is justified given he will be taking a share, if not the whole slice, of the revenues. The man is worth $1.6 billion, surely the last $100 million can be spared by him so that this arena can be started ASAP

[Coldrsx]

Just because he is wealthy does not mean throwing in another hundred mil is appropriate. There are economics involved and a business model in play.

[Xelebes]

With only $100 million still up in the air as to where it wil come from, what's wrong with Katz ponying it up? That much he can chip in, for a total of $200 million from him if I'm not mistaken, which is justified given he will be taking a share, if not the whole slice, of the revenues. The man is worth $1.6 billion, surely the last $100 million can be spared by him so that this arena can be started ASAP

That 1.6 billion is tied up in other assets, namely Rexall.

[BLACK STAR]

Forbes Lists him now at over 2 Billion.:sly:

[hilman]

Plus he has already spent $200 million on buying the team and will be spending another $100 million on the other part of the district, that's a $400 million investment into our city, I think that's sufficient.

[Coldrsx]

The thing people forget is that the actual direct tax dollars exposure to Edmontonians is higher if we renovated Rexall than if we do what we see before us now.... but thanks St.Albert.
-------------

Taxpayers will carry burden


BY TERRY CHAMPION AND ST., EDMONTON JOURNAL MAY 25, 2011


Re: "Arena arguments are wishful thinking; Expensive project unlikely to revive Edmonton's downtown core," by Lorne Gunter, May 22.

Lorne Gunter has it right when he states that, "There will be no major economic revival from a new downtown arena, certainly not one large enough or widespread enough to justify city, provincial or federal taxpayers chipping in."

I agree. I do not want any of my municipal, provincial or federal taxes to be spent on subsidizing professional sports teams. This scheme just shifts more and more of the costs onto the taxpayer every time council and the Katz Group negotiate.

Terry Champion, St. Albert

© Copyright (c) The Edmonton Journal

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/opinion/letters/Taxpayers+will+carry+burden/4835542/story.html

[Jasper and one o nin]

^vocal minority

[Jasper and one o nin]

TALKING ABOUT A DOWNTOWN ARENA FOR EDMONTON
May 27, 2011 Update


City Council has approved an agreement framework to build a new arena in downtown Edmonton. The City’s four key goals in the agreement are to:
• protect the City’s interest
• sustain NHL hockey in Edmonton
• provide public infrastructure as a catalyst for downtown revitalization
• develop a funding framework that does not increase current property taxes.

To learn more and stay informed as the project progresses visit www.edmonton.ca/downtownarena.

Council’s approval of the agreement framework is a significant step forward for the project. However, there are many more steps to come prior to construction.

The agreement framework provides the principles for City administration and the Katz Group to negotiate a master agreement for the project. The master agreement will outline the specific obligations and responsibilities of each partner in the project.





Highlights of the Agreement Framework
Some of the highlights include:
Funding:
• the price for the design and construction of the arena is set at maximum $450 million
• the City’s contribution to the building is $125 million
• the Katz Group will contribute $100 million
• $125 million will be raised through a user-pay facility improvement fee
Land:
• the City will own the arena building and land
• the City will purchase the land from the Katz Group at the price the Katz Group has optioned the land for
Operations:
• the Katz Group will operate the building and be responsible for all operating, maintenance and infrastructure costs, including the costs of any upgrades.
• the Katz Group will receive all revenues, including naming rights and parking revenue
• the Oilers will remain in Edmonton for at least 35 years
Other:
• subject to funding from other orders of government, the City will build a community rink
• a Community Benefits Agreement will be negotiated
• the City will have access to the new arena for a set period of time each year to stage large community events such as Capital EX and the Canadian Finals Rodeo

The City’s contribution of $125 million will be made up of $45 million raised by a Community Revitalization Levy (CRL), with the remaining $80 million to come from sources such as new parking revenue, tax revenue from the arena, and redirected City subsidies. These funding sources won’t increase current property taxes or reallocate resources from other infrastructure projects.

These terms of the agreement framework are consistent with feedback from Edmontonians during the City’s consultations late last year. They are also aligned with the terms and conditions Council passed on April 6.


Next Steps
Funding
The focus in the next few months will be on securing the additional $100 million for the project. The City and the Katz Group have agreed to collaboratively approach other orders of government. The project will not proceed until all funding is secured.

Community Revitalization Levy
Finalizing the CRL boundary is an essential piece of work that will be undertaken in the near future. The CRL boundary and plan will need to be approved by the Province before it can proceed. That process could take at least a year. A CRL is a way for municipalities to dedicate some of the property taxes in a specific area to pay the costs for a new public facility or new infrastructure in that area.

Design
The City will also develop the process Edmontonians will use to provide input about the design of the arena. The design must be acceptable to both the City and the Katz Group. Also, it must also be consistent with the Capital City Downtown Plan. This is a critical aspect of the deal to ensure that the arena contributes to the overall vision of revitalizing Edmonton’s downtown into a vibrant, dynamic place where people choose to live, work and play in.

Northlands
Council has also directed the City to continue its work with Northlands to find a sustainable future for their operations. This work is ongoing.

[Coldrsx]

Good overview for those who don't follow this as much as some of us.

Clarity is good.

[craner]

Geezus Cold - 29,000+ posts - that's got to be more than anyone.
How are you going to celebrate 30,000 next week ?
;)

[feepa]

Geezus Cold - 29,000+ posts - that's got to be more than anyone.
How are you going to celebrate 30,000 next week ?
;)

Curiosity got to me here... Cold has the second most posts on all of SSP. Only Vid is higher.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/memberlist.php?order=DESC&sort=posts&pp=50

(ignore the banned spambots with 4 million posts)

(sorry for the further derail...)

[Coldrsx]

Hahaha... this is quite a good resource for information, locally and internally.

[Coldrsx]

Stelmach too busy with fires and floods to think about Edmonton's downtown arena project


By Keith Gerein, edmontonjournal.com May 27, 2011



* Story
* Photos ( 2 )


Alberta Premier Ed Stelmach speaks with reporters after visiting Ecole Coloniate Estate Schools located at 37 Coloniate Way in Beaumont, Alberta on Tuesday May 24, 2011. The Alberta government announced $550 million for schools across the province Tuesday and one of the areas to benefit from the cash is Beaumont.

More Images »

Alberta Premier Ed Stelmach speaks with reporters after visiting Ecole Coloniate Estate Schools located at 37 Coloniate Way in Beaumont, Alberta on Tuesday May 24, 2011. The Alberta government announced $550 million for schools across the province Tuesday and one of the areas to benefit from the cash is Beaumont.
Photograph by: Walter Tychnowicz, edmontonjournal.com

EDMONTON - Premier Ed Stelmach has been so swamped dealing with fires and flooding he hasn’t had time to think about whether his government will help fund Edmonton’s downtown arena project.

The premier, who submitted a letter Friday naming Oct. 1 as his official resignation day, said he’s happy to sit down with city officials prior to that date, once things calm down.

“I can tell you we are dealing with a catastrophic event in Slave Lake,” Stelmach said. “I am off to High River because of the flooding and there is another big rainstorm being predicted for later this week. These are very important matters we have to deal with immediately. It’s not that we’re not going to work with the city.”

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/Stelmach+busy+with+fires+floods+think+about+Edmonton+downtown/4853015/story.html

[Coldrsx]

Looks like Kerry D is asking people to give their feedback on 'the deal' again and wants people to voice their concerns... More to come

[Jasper and one o nin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfkIHlUXlks

[CMD UW]

^Cool thesis video.

[Kevin_foster]

From COE Twitter Feed:

Latest 311 #yegarena call totals: 2491 support, 282 supp w/conditions, 1701 opposed, 80 calls for info. #yeg

(https://twitter.com/#!/CityofEdmonton)

[Coldrsx]

TALKING ABOUT A DOWNTOWN ARENA FOR EDMONTON
June 28, 2011 Update

City Council has approved an agreement
framework to build a new arena in downtown
Edmonton. The City’s four key goals in the
agreement are to:
 protect the City’s interest
 develop a funding framework that
does not increase current property
taxes
 provide public infrastructure as a
catalyst for downtown revitalization
 sustain NHL hockey in Edmonton.

Council’s approval of the agreement
framework is a step forward for the project.
However, there are many more steps to come
prior to construction. The framework
provides the principles for City
administration and the Katz Group to
negotiate a master agreement for the project.

A new arena for Edmonton has been under
discussion for several years and has
involved extensive review, discussion, public
consultation and due diligence on the City’s
part. To learn more and stay informed as the
arena project progresses visit
www.edmonton.ca/downtownarena.

Latest news
Since Council approved the agreement
framework to build a $450 million arena in
downtown Edmonton, City administrators
and the Katz Group are working to finalize a
Master Agreement. The agreement will
outline the specific obligations and
responsibilities of each partner.

As well, an initial request has been made to
the Province of Alberta to start talks on their
role with this project.



Follow up after Council’s May meeting
Since Council’s approval of the agreement
framework some questions have been
raised publicly.

Why in private?
The discussion that led to Council’s
approval of the framework agreement was
held in private so as to not harm either the
City’s or a third party’s economic interests.

The City is governed by the Freedom of
Information and Privacy (FOIP) Act. The Act
outlines that the City has a responsibility to
protect private information.

It’s important to remember that Council
approval followed almost a year of
discussion and public consultation, including
addressing 17 terms and conditions that
had been passed at the April meeting.

City contribution
The agreement limits the City’s contribution
for design and construction to $125 million.
Although the April conditions set the amount
from a Community Revitalization Levy
(CRL) at $20 million, the May agreement
increased that to $45 million. Administration
will bring further information to Council on
the CRL boundary, the public infrastructure
costs and the timelines in July. The first step
in the CRL process is to secure Council’s
approval on a CRL boundary.

Sources for the remaining $80 million of the
City’s contribution are expected to come
from new parking revenue, tax revenue from
the arena and redirected City subsidies.
These sources won’t increase current
property taxes.

The City would borrow up to a maximum of
$250 million ($125 million for its direct
contribution and $125 million covered by the
Facility Improvement Fee) to finance the
capital costs of the arena. The Katz Group
would repay the City the $125 million
recovered through the Facility Improvement
Fee and any interim financing costs, if
applicable.

Who pays for the land and other public
infrastructure?
The current agreement specifies that the
City will own the land and the building with
the maximum cost of the building and the
design to be $450 million. The Katz Group
will be the primary tenant.

Land costs for the arena are estimated at
about $20 million and the City will own that
land as an asset.

Any public infrastructure (i.e. LRT, a
pedway bridge over 104 Avenue) required
in the area will be built by the City, the same
as with other projects, such as connecting
the LRT expansion to Southgate or NAIT.

What about cost overruns?
The agreement sets the maximum price for
the design and construction at $450 million.
At the appropriate time, construction
tenders will reflect this as the maximum
amount allowed for prospective bidders. If
no tender is received at this price, then a
decision will be made at that point as to next
steps.

With any construction project, safeguards
are built into the contracts to protect the
City’s interests in the event of costs
overruns. Sometimes contractors are liable,
sometimes insurance might cover extra
costs. The City regularly manages large
construction projects on time and on
budget.

Revenue sharing
Under the agreement, the Katz Group will
be responsible for all operating costs and all
capital upgrades, maintenance and
improvements for a 35-year period. In return
they receive all operating revenue, including
naming rights and parking revenue. This is
the most straight forward way of assigning a
relative mix of costs, revenues and
responsibilities. The City will ensure building
performance and maintenance standards
are set and met.

The future of Northlands and Rexall
Place
Work continues on the future of Rexall
Place and Northlands. Council has directed
Administration to explore scenarios for the
future viability of Northlands and Rexall
Place.

A summary of the agreement framework is
available at
http://www.edmonton.ca/city_government/pl
anning_development/agreement-
framework.aspx

Stay informed about the proposed
downtown arena & entertainment district
at www.edmonton.ca/downtownarena.

[Gary Wayne]

So, does anyone hear have an opinion on the latest remarks by the premier about not funding the arena. I was surprised my self that Mayer Mandel has not responded.

[MrOilers]

Now what?

$100 million is not money that somebody's just going to throw away.

[EdmTrekker]

So, does anyone hear have an opinion on the latest remarks by the premier about not funding the arena. I was surprised my self that Mayer Mandel has not responded.

My recollection is that he said the Province would support funding infrastructure. That is a big word...and means vertical and horizontal infrastructure. I have no doubts that the Province will be assisting- in some form and worth some value.

Shucks Stelmach announced $25M for Calgary Stampede Infrastructure just today.

[Coldrsx]

...exactly.