[Kevin]

Top 20 U.S. Metropolitan Areas 2006 Estimates*

1. New York–Northern New Jersey–Long Island 18,740,000
2. Los Angeles–Long Beach–Santa Ana 12,950,000
3. Chicago–Naperville–Joliet 9,500,000
4. Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington 5,910,000
5. Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington 5,850,000
6. Miami–Fort Lauderdale–Miami Beach 5,500,000
7. Houston–Sugar Land–Baytown 5,380,000
8. Washington–Arlington–Alexandria 5,270,000
9. Atlanta–Sandy Springs–Marietta 5,040,000
10. Detroit–Warren–Livonia 4,480,000
11. Boston–Cambridge–Quincy 4,400,835
12. San Francisco–Oakland–Fremont 4,160,000
13. Riverside–San Bernardino–Ontario 4,030,000
14. Phoenix–Mesa–Scottsdale 4,020,000
15. Seattle–Tacoma–Bellevue 3,240,000
16. Minneapolis–St. Paul–Bloomington 3,180,000
17. San Diego–Carlsbad–San Marcos 2,930,000
18. St. Louis 2,820,000
19. Tampa–St. Petersburg–Clearwater 2,720,000
20. Baltimore–Towson 2,670,000

*2005-2006 growth rates estimates are the same growth rates estimates of the previous year 2004-2005 found here
http://recenter.tamu.edu/data/popm00/

Another list I created Top 20 CSA estimates for 2006.... did the best I could on this one. Please correct the mistakes if you see any.

1. New York–Northern New Jersey–Long Island 18,740,000
2. Los Angeles–Long Beach-Riverside–San Bernardino–Ontario 16,980,000
3. Chicago–Naperville–Joliet 9,500,000
4. Washington–Arlington–Alexandria-Baltimore–Towson 7,940,000
5. San Francisco–Oakland-San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara 5,930,000
6. Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington 5,910,000
7. Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington 5,850,000
8. Boston–Cambridge-Worcester-Barnstable-Manchester-Nashua 5,820,835
9. Miami–Fort Lauderdale–Miami Beach 5,500,000
10. Detroit–Warren–Livonia-Ann Arbor-Flint 5,470,000
11. Houston–Sugar Land–Baytown 5,380,000
12. Atlanta–Sandy Springs–Marietta 5,040,000
13. Phoenix–Mesa–Scottsdale 4,020,000
14. Seattle–Tacoma–Bellevue-Olympia-Bremerton-Silverdale 3,720,000
15. Tampa–St. Petersburg–Clearwater-Lakeland 3,380,000
16. Cleveland–Elyria–Mentor-Akron-Canton-Massillon 3,230,000
17. Minneapolis–St. Paul–Bloomington 3,180,000
18. Denver–Aurora-Boulder-Fort Collins-Loveland-Greeley 3,140,000
19. San Diego–Carlsbad–San Marcos 2,930,000
20. St. Louis 2,820,000

I added Lakeland to Tampa. Not too sure about it though.

[Sekkle]

I think the Riverside-San Bernadino Metro area is one of the fastest growing in the US, right? I'm sure a lot of that growth is people from the LA area seeking (slightly) cheaper housing, but it's not like the LA metro population is declining because of people moving to Riverside... So how long before LA-Long Beach-Riverside-San Bernadino overtakes NYC in the CSA estimate category?

[LMich]

I really wish the Census would keep yearly estimates of UA's (Urban Areas/Clusters), as well.

[trueviking]

13. Riverside–San Bernardino–Ontario 4,030,000

four million people with no city?....what's the deal?

[seaskyfan]

I think some of your CSA boundaries aren't large enough. Here's the info from the Census site - using 7/1/05 estimates - for the top 20 CSAs (I think Phoenix isn't considered a CSA but rather a stand alone Metro, which is why if doesn't show up on this list - same with Miami and Tampa/St. Pete). Here's the link to the census page:

http://www.census.gov/population/www/estimates/Estimates%20pages_final.html

New York-Newark-Bridgeport, NY-NJ-CT-PA 21,903,623
Los Angeles-Long Beach-Riverside, CA 17,629,607
Chicago-Naperville-Michigan City, IL-IN-WI 9,661,840
Washington-Baltimore-Northern Virginia, DC-MD-VA-WV 8,125,656
Boston-Worcester-Manchester, MA-RI-NH 7,427,336
San Jose-San Francisco-Oakland, CA 7,168,176
Philadelphia-Camden-Vineland, PA-NJ-DE-MD 6,372,799
Dallas-Fort Worth, TX 6,171,301
Detroit-Warren-Flint, MI 5,428,000
Houston-Baytown-Huntsville, TX 5,380,661
Atlanta-Sandy Springs-Gainesville, GA-AL 5,249,121
Seattle-Tacoma-Olympia, WA 3,806,453
Minneapolis-St. Paul-St. Cloud, MN-WI 3,467,108
Cleveland-Akron-Elyria, OH 2,931,774
Denver-Aurora-Boulder, CO1 2,869,377
St. Louis-St. Charles-Farmington, MO-IL 2,840,179
Pittsburgh-New Castle, PA 2,478,883
Sacramento--Arden-Arcade--Truckee, CA-NV 2,187,694
Charlotte-Gastonia-Salisbury, NC-SC 2,120,745
Cincinnati-Middletown-Wilmington, OH-KY-IN 2,113,011

[urbanflyer]

Heh, my city in Japan and its CSA would take the #3 spot yet it can't be found on most globes and is missing from several atlases. Geocentricism for ya. :rolleyes:

[Swede]

^Hehe, my city wouldn't make that list and still shows up on all globes and pretty much all atlases.
/yay for being a national capital :D

[liat91]

Top 20 U.S. Metropolitan Areas 2006 Estimates*

1. New York–Northern New Jersey–Long Island 18,740,000
2. Los Angeles–Long Beach–Santa Ana 12,950,000
3. Chicago–Naperville–Joliet 9,500,000
4. Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington 5,910,000
5. Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington 5,850,000
6. Miami–Fort Lauderdale–Miami Beach 5,500,000
7. Houston–Sugar Land–Baytown 5,380,000
8. Washington–Arlington–Alexandria 5,270,000
9. Atlanta–Sandy Springs–Marietta 5,040,000
10. Detroit–Warren–Livonia 4,480,000
11. Boston–Cambridge–Quincy 4,400,835
12. San Francisco–Oakland–Fremont 4,160,000
13. Riverside–San Bernardino–Ontario 4,030,000
14. Phoenix–Mesa–Scottsdale 4,020,000
15. Seattle–Tacoma–Bellevue 3,240,000
16. Minneapolis–St. Paul–Bloomington 3,180,000
17. San Diego–Carlsbad–San Marcos 2,930,000
18. St. Louis 2,820,000
19. Tampa–St. Petersburg–Clearwater 2,720,000
20. Baltimore–Towson 2,670,000

*2005-2006 growth rates estimates are the same growth rates estimates of the previous year 2004-2005 found here
http://recenter.tamu.edu/data/popm00/

Another list I created Top 20 CSA estimates for 2006.... did the best I could on this one. Please correct the mistakes if you see any.

1. New York–Northern New Jersey–Long Island 18,740,000
2. Los Angeles–Long Beach-Riverside–San Bernardino–Ontario 16,980,000
3. Chicago–Naperville–Joliet 9,500,000
4. Washington–Arlington–Alexandria-Baltimore–Towson 7,940,000
5. San Francisco–Oakland-San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara 5,930,000
6. Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington 5,910,000
7. Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington 5,850,000
8. Boston–Cambridge-Worcester-Barnstable-Manchester-Nashua 5,820,835
9. Miami–Fort Lauderdale–Miami Beach 5,500,000
10. Detroit–Warren–Livonia-Ann Arbor-Flint 5,470,000
11. Houston–Sugar Land–Baytown 5,380,000
12. Atlanta–Sandy Springs–Marietta 5,040,000
13. Phoenix–Mesa–Scottsdale 4,020,000
14. Seattle–Tacoma–Bellevue-Olympia-Bremerton-Silverdale 3,720,000
15. Tampa–St. Petersburg–Clearwater-Lakeland 3,380,000
16. Cleveland–Elyria–Mentor-Akron-Canton-Massillon 3,230,000
17. Minneapolis–St. Paul–Bloomington 3,180,000
18. Denver–Aurora-Boulder-Fort Collins-Loveland-Greeley 3,140,000
19. San Diego–Carlsbad–San Marcos 2,930,000
20. St. Louis 2,820,000

I added Lakeland to Tampa. Not too sure about it though.


Just curious as to some of the components to your CSA's
1.Barnstable with Boston?
2.Lakeland with Tampa?
3.Canton with Cleveland?
4.Fort Collins/Loveland with Denver?
I know they are always making ubdates so if true is quite interesting. Thanks for the postings.

[villelumiere]

Heh, my city in Japan and its CSA would take the #3 spot yet it can't be found on most globes and is missing from several atlases. Geocentricism for ya. :rolleyes:


I, and others have often made the point that U.S. census data on CSAs/MSAs is only useful in comparing with other U.S. cities.

Several East Asian, South Asian and European cities would approach or exceed 20,000,000 if the national census ordained that tens of thousands of sq. kms be included. London would be about 18,000,000 I can't even imagine what Tokyo , Bombay, etc would be.

All, and I mean ALL international comparison is meaningless unless or until there is an agreed methodology.

The U.S. figures are useful for tracking how U.S. cities and their extensive hinterlands are developing. Thay have no ustility in international comparison and neither do any other national figures.

[staff]

^Hehe, my city wouldn't make that list and still shows up on all globes and pretty much all atlases.
/yay for being a national capital :D
But still, Stockholm feels bigger than pretty much all of those cities. :)

[hydrobond]

What about the Cincy-Dayton area? It's somewhere in the neighborhood of 3 mil.

[fleonzo]

This is what I found too:


New York-Newark-Bridgeport, NY-NJ-CT-PA 21,903,623
Los Angeles-Long Beach-Riverside, CA 17,629,607
Chicago-Naperville-Michigan City, IL-IN-WI 9,661,840
Washington-Baltimore-Northern Virginia, DC-MD-VA-WV 8,125,656
Boston-Worcester-Manchester, MA-RI-NH 7,427,336
San Jose-San Francisco-Oakland, CA 7,168,176
Philadelphia-Camden-Vineland, PA-NJ-DE-MD 6,372,799
Dallas-Fort Worth, TX 6,171,301
Detroit-Warren-Flint, MI 5,428,000
Houston-Baytown-Huntsville, TX 5,380,661
Atlanta-Sandy Springs-Gainesville, GA-AL 5,249,121
Seattle-Tacoma-Olympia, WA 3,806,453
Minneapolis-St. Paul-St. Cloud, MN-WI 3,467,108
Cleveland-Akron-Elyria, OH 2,931,774
Denver-Aurora-Boulder, CO1 2,869,377
St. Louis-St. Charles-Farmington, MO-IL 2,840,179
Pittsburgh-New Castle, PA 2,478,883
Sacramento--Arden-Arcade--Truckee, CA-NV 2,187,694
Charlotte-Gastonia-Salisbury, NC-SC 2,120,745
Cincinnati-Middletown-Wilmington, OH-KY-IN 2,113,011


http://www.census.gov/population/www...ges_final.html

[seaskyfan]

Thanks Fleonzo.

Here's a link to a .gif at the Census site that shows the CSAs as of 2003:

http://www.census.gov/geo/www/maps/msa_maps2003/msa2003_previews_htm/cbsa_csa_us_wall_0603_rev.htm

They've made a couple of updates to CSAs since the time of the maps, including adding the Providence MSA to the Boston CSA (hence the big jump in Boston's CSA pop) and adding Reading to the Philly CSA.

[Wheelingman04]

What about the Cincy-Dayton area? It's somewhere in the neighborhood of 3 mil.

It may or may not become a CSA by 2010.

[markdv]

Amazing how fast some of these metro's are growing. By my calculations Philly might be bounced out of the top 10 by 2015/2020 , BBBUUUUUTTTTTTT, these growing cities can't compare to the older , established cities when it comes to history, culture, and atmosphere.

[Derek]

I think the Riverside-San Bernadino Metro area is one of the fastest growing in the US, right? I'm sure a lot of that growth is people from the LA area seeking (slightly) cheaper housing, but it's not like the LA metro population is declining because of people moving to Riverside... So how long before LA-Long Beach-Riverside-San Bernadino overtakes NYC in the CSA estimate category?

i hope never...it will be nothing but houses on top of houses on top of houses...all sprawl...like there isnt enough already...and traffic will only get worse and worse...

[JAM]

Thanks Fleonzo.

Here's a link to a .gif at the Census site that shows the CSAs as of 2003:

http://www.census.gov/geo/www/maps/msa_maps2003/msa2003_previews_htm/cbsa_csa_us_wall_0603_rev.htm

They've made a couple of updates to CSAs since the time of the maps, including adding the Providence MSA to the Boston CSA (hence the big jump in Boston's CSA pop) and adding Reading to the Philly CSA.

Interesting map. It would be interesting to divide the NA into Super Regions. Population stats on Atlantic Seaboard, Great Lakes, West Coast (maybe divided between N and S of CA border), Desert cities, Gulf Coast, etc.

[edluva]

I'm not sure if LA will ever overtake NY because by then, NY and Philly might merge...so no worries, markdv ;). Even if LA and SD merged, it wouldn't be enough because philly's metro is too big, even after considering SD's growth rate. Though for sure, both NY and LA would be head and shoulders above the rest of the country. And I wonder if CA's growth will ever slow - it's already catching up to Spain.

[VivaLFuego]

Is the Chicago number including the Crystal Lake - Round Lake Beach - Grayslake statistical area, which is often seperate?

[Jersey Mentality]

^ If they included Wisconsin which they did Im very sure they included Lake (IL) and Mc Henry Counties as well which include those cities.

[robhut]

That list is missing Miami??
I did not see it.
Miami Dade, Broward and Palm Beach counties, more thn 5,000,000.

[phillyskyline]

I'm not sure if LA will ever overtake NY because by then, NY and Philly might merge...so no worries, markdv ;).

I'm speaking from pure emotion but that will never happen! I would be shocked if you found one citizen in the city of Brotherly Love who would go along with merging with the NYC metro....

[hudkina]

Hopefully by then the Census Bureau will use a more conservative definition of urban areas.

[The Agonist]

I'm speaking from pure emotion but that will never happen! I would be shocked if you found one citizen in the city of Brotherly Love who would go along with merging with the NYC metro....


They wouldn't have to go along with it. If it satisfied the definition of a CMSA or an MSA, then it would be one.

[hudkina]

The two urban areas won't merge for decades (if at all, assuming sprawl will be curbed in the future) and the commuting numbers between the two metros aren't even close to be considered for a CSA.

[edluva]

well in that case, there's hope for LA yet...
though by that time, being the biggest metro in the country won't be that big a deal anymore. Globally, twenty + million metros would be a dime a dozen by then, though many would probably be third-world like Lagos

[grfrednet]

The two urban areas won't merge for decades (if at all, assuming sprawl will be curbed in the future) and the commuting numbers between the two metros aren't even close to be considered for a CSA.

Currently, both metros (NYC and Philadelphia) border one another if I'm not mistaken... Or if I am mistaken, it is NYC's CSA that borders Philly's MSA.

Bucks County Pennsylvania, and Mercer County New Jersey is the "meeting point" of both "metro" areas. Given the influx of New York city residents moving into Philadelphia and its environs who still commute to their city of origin, it is hardly a reach to suggest that these two metro areas will merge in the not too distant future.

For the record, I couldn't care less about being included in New York's metro area. Evidently, that prospect bothers a number of fellow citizens in our great city. Who cares. Philadelphia will still be hot even if it is considered the "New York-Philadelphia Metropolitan Area."

[fleonzo]

"New York-Philadelphia Metropolitan Area."

This sounds like something that WILL happen....wierd....?
BTW- On the regular Amtrak it's about 1hr 20min- at most!

[Jersey Mentality]

The city limit line between NE Phila and the most extreme southeast point of Staten Island are only about 35 aeronautical miles. Maybe 50 by road/land.

[villelumiere]

Hopefully by then the Census Bureau will use a more conservative definition of urban areas.


Some hope? Just do as I do. Ignore MSA's as meaningless. CSA's have some real meaning.

[passdoubt]

4. Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington 5,910,000
5. Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington 5,850,000

As if Philadelphians didn't have enough reasons to hate Dallas.

[WonderlandPark]

The MSA numbers are useless, I would only use CSA, like villelumiere says.

[vertex]

well in that case, there's hope for LA yet...
though by that time, being the biggest metro in the country won't be that big a deal anymore. Globally, twenty + million metros would be a dime a dozen by then, though many would probably be third-world like Lagos

Or LA...

[hudkina]

Currently, both metros (NYC and Philadelphia) border one another if I'm not mistaken... Or if I am mistaken, it is NYC's CSA that borders Philly's MSA.

Bucks County Pennsylvania, and Mercer County New Jersey is the "meeting point" of both "metro" areas. Given the influx of New York city residents moving into Philadelphia and its environs who still commute to their city of origin, it is hardly a reach to suggest that these two metro areas will merge in the not too distant future.

For the record, I couldn't care less about being included in New York's metro area. Evidently, that prospect bothers a number of fellow citizens in our great city. Who cares. Philadelphia will still be hot even if it is considered the "New York-Philadelphia Metropolitan Area."

I think that the Trenton, NJ urban area shouldn't exist on its own and that it should all be included with Philadelphia's urban area. For some reason the census bureau keeps them separate. I find that especially odd since they added Wilmington, DE to Philadelphia's urban area and the area between Wilmington and Philadelphia is more sparsely populated than the area between Trenton and Philadelphia.

In that Case Philadelphia would have a much stronger connection to New York's MSA via Mercer County, but even with Mercer County being in the Philadelphia MSA the commuter exchange rate wouldn't come close to the 15% minimum. Without Mercer County, the commuter exchange rate between the Philadelphia MSA and the New York MSA is only 2.2%, while with Mercer County the commuter exchange rate between the Philadelphia MSA and the New York MSA would be 4.9%, which is more than double.

Granted, even if that number did reach 15% leaders from the Philadelphia MSA would have a say in whether they would want to be included in a CSA with New York. I'm not sure what local opinion states, but I'd think that most wouldn't want that to happen.

[seaskyfan]

I think that the Trenton, NJ urban area shouldn't exist on its own and that it should all be included with Philadelphia's urban area. For some reason the census bureau keeps them separate. I find that especially odd since they added Wilmington, DE to Philadelphia's urban area and the area between Wilmington and Philadelphia is more sparsely populated than the area between Trenton and Philadelphia.

In that Case Philadelphia would have a much stronger connection to New York's MSA via Mercer County, but even with Mercer County being in the Philadelphia MSA the commuter exchange rate wouldn't come close to the 15% minimum. Without Mercer County, the commuter exchange rate between the Philadelphia MSA and the New York MSA is only 2.2%, while with Mercer County the commuter exchange rate between the Philadelphia MSA and the New York MSA would be 4.9%, which is more than double.

Granted, even if that number did reach 15% leaders from the Philadelphia MSA would have a say in whether they would want to be included in a CSA with New York. I'm not sure what local opinion states, but I'd think that most wouldn't want that to happen.

Why would they have a say in this? I thought it was just a call the Census Bureau made based on commute patterns.

[edluva]

Or LA...

being that it's an American metro, there's certainly a good share of poverty in LA, but being the second largest concentration of billionaires in the world and having a per-capital gdp at around the US national average hardly qualifies for third world.

[vertex]

being that it's an American metro, there's certainly a good share of poverty in LA, but being the second largest concentration of billionaires in the world and having a per-capital gdp at around the US national average hardly qualifies for third world.

You obviously don't get around much in LA, do you? :)

[dfane]

I think that the Trenton, NJ urban area shouldn't exist on its own and that it should all be included with Philadelphia's urban area. For some reason the census bureau keeps them separate. I find that especially odd since they added Wilmington, DE to Philadelphia's urban area and the area between Wilmington and Philadelphia is more sparsely populated than the area between Trenton and Philadelphia.

In that Case Philadelphia would have a much stronger connection to New York's MSA via Mercer County, but even with Mercer County being in the Philadelphia MSA the commuter exchange rate wouldn't come close to the 15% minimum. Without Mercer County, the commuter exchange rate between the Philadelphia MSA and the New York MSA is only 2.2%, while with Mercer County the commuter exchange rate between the Philadelphia MSA and the New York MSA would be 4.9%, which is more than double.

Granted, even if that number did reach 15% leaders from the Philadelphia MSA would have a say in whether they would want to be included in a CSA with New York. I'm not sure what local opinion states, but I'd think that most wouldn't want that to happen.

I somewhat agree with you with Trenton, but Trenton is a little further away and also has a NY influence. But to say Delaware County is sparsely populated is crazy. You around 600,000 living between Philadelphia's border and Delaware. You have the city of Chester, Ridley, Interboro area Chichester, Marcus Hook etc they are not sparsely populated at all.

btw can someone break down the CSA and MSA accronyms for me I am not positive (and stupid)?

[SteveD]

I somewhat agree with you with Trenton, but Trenton is a little further away and also has a NY influence. But to say Delaware County is sparsely populated is crazy. You around 600,000 living between Philadelphia's border and Delaware. You have the city of Chester, Ridley, Interboro area Chichester, Marcus Hook etc they are not sparsely populated at all.

btw can someone break down the CSA and MSA accronyms for me I am not positive (and stupid)?

CSA = Consolidated Statistical Area
MSA = Metropolitan Statistical Area

[Marcu]

Does anyone have the projections for 2025 and 2050?

[caltrane74]

Dallas is that big? whoa. 6 million people that's crazy. I always thought Houston was the biggest city in Texas. Is it because Fort Worth is included in the population that Dallas gets to this size? Either way I'm impressed.

[grfrednet]

4. Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington 5,910,000
5. Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington 5,850,000

As if Philadelphians didn't have enough reasons to hate Dallas.

Just for perspective, the Dallas-Fort Worth metro is about 9000 square miles compared to Philadelphia's metro at around 5000 square miles.

[LMich]

Does anyone have the projections for 2025 and 2050?

That would be almost wholely pointless. It's hard enough projecting accurately a year or two ahead, let alone what you're asking for.

[hudkina]

When the commuter exchange rate is between 15% and 25% local leaders have a say in whether or not they want to be included in the larger CSA. If the number is 25% or more the smaller metro is automatically added. I have yet to hear of a metro that has refused, as it only brings more money to the area and doesn't do much to negatively effect the metro.

BTW, I didn't mean that the area was sparsely populated in the sense that it was rural (it is an urban area after all), what I meant is that the level of development between Wilmington and Philadelphia isn't as dense as that between Trenton and Philadelphia. The whole stretch from Trenton to Wilmington is one contiguous built-up area that should be one common urban area. Instead they kept Trenton's urban area separate.

[The Agonist]

Just for perspective, the Dallas-Fort Worth metro is about 9000 square miles compared to Philadelphia's metro at around 5000 square miles.

What difference does that make? All it means is the philly metro is somewhat denser.

There might be more people in 9000 sq miles around philly than dallas, but those people aren't necessarily in the philly metro.

And how much more populated would Dallas have to get before the area difference doesn't matter? Is that what you really want to cling on to?

[edluva]

You obviously don't get around much in LA, do you? :)

So does that mean NY is third world? I mean it has the Bronx, Queens, and Brooklyn
And I guess if I can purchase a Rolex in Lagos, I'd better retract what I said.

for the record, I live in the Mid-City/Eastside border (Koreatown). Ever been?

[vertex]

So does that mean NY is third world? I mean it has the Bronx, Queens, and Brooklyn
And I guess if I can purchase a Rolex in Lagos, I'd better retract what I said.

for the record, I live in the Mid-City/Eastside border (Koreatown). Ever been?

If you're talking about Wilshire Blvd, then yes a number of times.

It's odd that you exude a confidence and optimism about LA, and yet you find it necessary to continue to defend it from an observation that contains the smallest kernel of truth.

In addition, you still find it necessary to keep putting down Lagos. Not that I really care; it only appears that you have a hard time accepting LA for what it is.

[fflint]

^That, or he just doesn't agree with your observation. Whichever.

[edluva]

my understanding of LA differs from yours, vertex. Unlike you, i would rather group LA with NY, Houston, Miami, and Chicago than with Lagos where it concerns third world status. And unlike you, I've been harboring this deep-seated beef with Lagos all these years. Sorry Lagosians.

There are shitloads of poor in LA, just as in any other "first world" city of its size. Or perhaps I'm wrong and Zurich, Nagoya, and Oslo are the only non third-world cities in existence?

Accepting LA for what it is - yeah, that's rich.

[grfrednet]

What difference does that make? All it means is the philly metro is somewhat denser.

There might be more people in 9000 sq miles around philly than dallas, but those people aren't necessarily in the philly metro.

And how much more populated would Dallas have to get before the area difference doesn't matter? Is that what you really want to cling on to?


I made an observation based on a quote that "passdoubt" made. I'm not exactly sure I understand what I would be "clinging on to" as you put it. Furthermore I wasn't speculating about the commuting patterns of those living outside of Philadelphia's MSA radius.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

my understanding of LA differs from yours, vertex. Unlike you, i would rather group LA with NY, Houston, Miami, and Chicago than with Lagos where it concerns third world status. And unlike you, I've been harboring this deep-seated beef with Lagos all these years. Sorry Lagosians.

There are shitloads of poor in LA, just as in any other "first world" city of its size. Or perhaps I'm wrong and Zurich, Nagoya, and Oslo are the only non third-world cities in existence?

Accepting LA for what it is - yeah, that's rich.

:tup:

[vertex]

Accepting LA for what it is - yeah, that's rich.

Then choose to ignore what you want, the poorer you are for it.

[fflint]

Then choose to ignore what you want, the poorer you are for it.
Merely saying "LA is more like Nigeria than New York" doesn't make it so, no matter how obnoxiously you pursue that claim. You may be convinced your odd and unsupported opinion is a fact, and that anyone who doesn't share it is dishonest or ignorant--but none of that is obviously true.

[PhillyRising]

Granted, even if that number did reach 15% leaders from the Philadelphia MSA would have a say in whether they would want to be included in a CSA with New York. I'm not sure what local opinion states, but I'd think that most wouldn't want that to happen.


Only if Philadelphia gets top billing and New York takes the back seat....:yes: :haha: :D

[glowrock]

If you're talking about Wilshire Blvd, then yes a number of times.

It's odd that you exude a confidence and optimism about LA, and yet you find it necessary to continue to defend it from an observation that contains the smallest kernel of truth.

In addition, you still find it necessary to keep putting down Lagos. Not that I really care; it only appears that you have a hard time accepting LA for what it is.

Vertex, you're acting like a freaking idiot. To say L.A. is somehow third world is just as inanely stupid as Tom Tancredo saying Miami's a third world city! What the hell are you talking about?

Aaron (Glowrock)

[vertex]

Glowrock and fflint, judging by your replies, it seems that my original comment is being interpreted as some sort of knee-jerk, right-wing reply. In fact, my original reply to edluvr was a nothing more than a wry response/observation.

Anyone who spouts uninformed or xenophobic impressions about third-world cities (especially when trying to favorably compare their own city in contrast) constitutes a cheap-shot artist in my book.

By suggesting LA was in the same category is only intended to provide a little light-hearted irony, something that a lot of people on this board lack.

[fflint]

^Whatever, dude.

[MJB83]

Then choose to ignore what you want, the poorer you are for it.

Per capita incomes per 2005 Census estimates (metro area):

LA: 25,362
Phoenix: 24,866
National: 25,035

[Lecom]

Go Philadelphia. Only 60,000 to go up to the largest city besides the Big Three. Next step - creating some jobs to lure to se people in.

Feels kind of awkward not living in the country's largest metro anymore, when you took beating every city in nearly every type of chart for granted.

[edluva]

...By suggesting LA was in the same category is only intended to provide a little light-hearted irony, something that a lot of people on this board lack.

yeah, irony that required two-pages of willfully placed replies on your behalf to suddenly reveal itself. you're so full of it.

[urbanflyer]

Anyone who spouts uninformed or xenophobic impressions about third-world cities (especially when trying to favorably compare their own city in contrast) constitutes a cheap-shot artist in my book.

By suggesting LA was in the same category is only intended to provide a little light-hearted irony, something that a lot of people on this board lack.

What we don't lack is people acting like dicks. No need to name names, is there?

[bryson662001]

Go Philadelphia. Only 60,000 to go up to the largest city besides the Big Three. Next step - creating some jobs to lure to se people in.

Feels kind of awkward not living in the country's largest metro anymore, when you took beating every city in nearly every type of chart for granted.

Huh? Take some asprin, sleep it off.....and then try again tommorrow.

[vertex]

Anyone who spouts uninformed or xenophobic impressions about third-world cities (especially when trying to favorably compare their own city in contrast) constitutes a cheap-shot artist in my book.

By suggesting LA was in the same category is only intended to provide a little light-hearted irony, something that a lot of people on this board lack.

What we don't lack is people acting like dicks. No need to name names, is there?

Feel better now? Get that load off your chest? Thanks for participating...

[Grumpy]

I have a question concerning the surface of those metropolitan areas:
As they grow in population is there also a growth in surface?
I mean are some areas getting bigger in square miles also or are they staying the same?

[LMich]

What do you mean? Are you asking if new areas are added to the current areas as they sprawl further outwards? Yes, but I'd think that'd be the same everywhere. As areas grow they usually grow is size, as well, if even some less than others because they are getting denser.

[seaskyfan]

I have a question concerning the surface of those metropolitan areas:
As they grow in population is there also a growth in surface?
I mean are some areas getting bigger in square miles also or are they staying the same?

Not necessarily. A lot of metropolitan areas in the US (basically anything outside of New England and Puerto Rico I believe) are composed of counties. Much of the time the growth is happening inside the counties included in the metropolitan area. There are times when the metro area has spread to include additional counties which are then added onto the over metro area - increasing the land area of the metro area.

Much of the time you'll see the additional counties included in the larger statistical areas. For example I live in the Seattle-Bellevue-Everett Metropolitan Area (King and Snohomish Counties), in the Seattle-Tacoma-Bellevue MSA (above counties plus Pierce County), and in the Seattle-Tacoma-Olympia CSA (which adds Island, Kitsap, Thurston, and Mason Counties).

Hope that didn't make it more confusing.