[MrChills]

Last week I was in Salt Lake City on business and stayed an extra day on the weekend to check out what the city and area had to offer. I had very mixed feelings about the area, the people were nice and the scenery was one of a kind, but the city is too conservative for my likings, anyway, I'll paste in some commentary I wrote on the flight back and some photos, enjoy!

I move left, he moves left, I proceed to turn right, he turns right. "Do you need an ID or cover?" I ask the burley dimwitted bouncer blocking my path to the bar. "Well, actually we require a membership for you to enter the bar". A fucking membership to drink a measly beer? This guy has to be kidding. Well, ten minutes and four yankee dollars later, along with my personal information entered into a mysterious system; I am presented with a temporary membership. This provisional pass will allow me to drink at this bar only for the next two weeks (every bar requires a unique membership). What's more interesting about this situation is that I was not in North Korea or Saudi Arabia, but rather in Salt Lake City, Utah. In case you don't know, Utah is in America, yes, the same America that is hell bent on liberating the rest of the globe.

We are consistently informed that Middle Eastern countries are oppressed by fanatical religious groups and that all countries should be ruled by the people and not religion. This concept sounds good, but, if the majority of the people who have the freedom to vote are religious fanatics, the theory starts to loose its relevance. Case in point, Utah, where close to 80% of the population belongs to the Ladder Day Saints (LDS) or Mormon Cult, opps… I mean religion. This group has a strangle hold on the state and its laws like no other place I have seen in North America. Half of the real estate in the downtown area is owned and operated by the LDS. The center of their land investments is dominated by an ominous 19th century temple, which is off-limits to the general heathen population; what a shame as it's truly a breath taking structure. The LDS receives five billion a year in donations from members, six billion from merchandize, and 30 billion a year runs through the organization in some way shape or form. With revenues that high it's no wonder they are trying to change every law in the state to match their doctrine.

People who want to share their religious view with you, rarely ever want you to share yours with them, this couldn't be truer than in Utah. If you are a LDS follower and don't believe in certain aspects of life, I can accept that, but why feel the urge to force these restrictions on the rest of the population. I believe in karma marinated in sex, drugs and rock and roll, but you don't see me ramming my belief system down their throats. That is something I could never understand about religion; you do what you want to do and I will do what I want to do, both could turn the other cheek and live in harmony. The core foundation of most religions is peace and understanding, although, you rarely (if ever) see this.

The saddest part about my trip to Utah is that it's one of the most beautiful areas I have ever visited. Rolling prairies transform almost immediately into snow capped peaks nestled in the foothills of the Rocky Mountains. It is an outdoor paradise; the air is fresh, the views spectacular and the people extremely friendly. But, fanatic religion hangs over the city like a cancer eating at the sole of the very freedoms America moralizes to the world. If it were not for this absolute foolishness, yours truly would seriously consider a move to Salt Lake City. However, with alcohol being a staple part of my diet, and my problem with authority and religion, this move will not happen anytime soon. I can only wonder how many other potential citizens and tax revenue the picturesque state of Utah has lost due to their backward laws.

View from the Little America Hotel in downtown SLC
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124609759-M.jpg

Exit into downtown from the I80
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124610623-M.jpg

Walking downtown on Main St.
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124610690-M.jpg

Heading into the hills
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124610855-M.jpg

I wouldn't mind seeing this view every morning ;)
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124610946-M.jpg

Downtown view
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611056-M.jpg

What would Jesus graffitti
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611231-M.jpg

Downtown
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611387-M.jpg

SLC has a decent light rail system
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611490-M.jpg

Downtown
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611592-M.jpg

More downtown
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611683-M.jpg

Mormon temple, I found out that even if you are a mormon, you can't enter this amazing building, you have to be a super mormon or something
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611842-M.jpg

Riley's Peak
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124612363-M.jpg

Sundance Film Festival in Park City
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124612606-M.jpg

Park City street
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124612875-M.jpg

Ice fishing
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124612984-M.jpg

Amazing
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124613071-M.jpg

Mount Timpangos
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124613187-M.jpg

http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124613414-M.jpg

http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124613543-M.jpg

http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124613681-M.jpg

[potts]

Great pic MrChills! I just got a job for a major airline that may require me to relocate to Salt Lake City, among a few other major cities, and let me tell you that SLC is at the bottom of my list! I'm gay, agnostic and, like you, alcohol is a staple in my diet. I would get shot there for sure! I really hope that I don't get sent to that place! I begin job training there in a couple weeks. :(

[Evergrey]

Park City looks awesome.

[Comrade Reynolds]

Great pic MrChills! I just got a job for a major airline that may require me to relocate to Salt Lake City, among a few other major cities, and let me tell you that SLC is at the bottom of my list! I'm gay, agnostic and, like you, alcohol is a staple in my diet. I would get shot there for sure! I really hope that I don't get sent to that place! I begin job training there in a couple weeks. :(

Uh no you won't get shot. :rolleyes:

Ok, it's great you walked into SLC and had a terrible time doing anything. Your generalities of this city are far beyond the reach of my own words, but it won't stop me from trying.

Yes Utah is conservative and has conservative drinking laws. However compared to many southern states, the laws in Utah are fairly "liberal". I'd also like to correct you in saying that you do not need a membership to get into "bars", rather memberships are reserved for private clubs -- there is a difference.

It is a shame people automatically associate a city with its drinking, because if you actually cared to venture beyond the aspects of beer and alcohol, you might have found a thriving progressive city. I'm a non-Mormon that's pretty far left on the political spectrum and never have I felt out of place in Salt Lake City. Utah? Well that's different, but SLC and Utah are two different places.

I'm not going to discuss the break down of Salt Lake's political leanings, because I think it would be a futile effort. But I will say this, you probably don't know Salt Lake City's mayor is Rocky Anderson -- dubbed the most liberal mayor in America and currently on his way to Washington DC for a massive anti-war protest. There he will be one of only a few guest speakers for the event. Think it's a fluke Salt Lake City could elect a little raving commie like Anderson? Well he's in his second term, has always had solid approval ratings and prior to running for mayor of Salt Lake, was a very known lawyer for the ACLU. Yes, that ACLU.

Don't judge an entire city based on what you perceive its image to be. Does SLC have some weird laws? Sure, but that's only because we're in Utah. Once you get beyond the membership thing, you'll find Salt Lake is pretty much like any other city in America. You just need to make sure you're not walking in with a closed mind, or you obviously won't see what I've seen all the years I've called SLC home.

[kpexpress]

Utah is one of the most photogenic states in the union! We have the rugged mountian scenes and also the most interesting rock formations (red rock) and canyons the world has ever seen.

Park City is an incredible historic city and has got to be the most liberal in the state.

[urbannomad]

The Salt Lake area is indeed beautiful, and having lived there for 3 years I can tell you that a lot of the stereotypes and perceptions of SLC are all wrong (and I am a big beer fan myself). The city is actually VERY liberal and has a huge gay population much more so than many other larger cities and probably all of ones it's size. The suburbs and state however are conservative, and that being the case, certain laws have to be enforced ie the bar laws. The memberships really aren't a big deal if you live there because odds are someone you know has a membership, or at least that was the case with me since I was never a "member" of any club, but did go out a lot (I was 22). However the law only applies to clubs that sell liquor... at beer bars, brew pubs, restaurants, etc you don't have to have any special "membership." Overall, if you can deal with ignorant stereotypes Salt Lake City is by far one of the best places to live, especially if you like to do things other than sit in front of the tv.

[soleri]

I appreciate the commentary and it dovetails with my experience of SLC. I don't particularly care if people are devout Mormons. In fact, I'd probably prefer Mormons because theirs is not really a fire-and-brimstone religion. Mormons are great businessmen and always one epiphany away from changing laws and edicts to maximize profits. That's why Utah exudes a commercial and entrepreneurial spirit. I suspect as Utah becomes more cosmopolitan and tied into global tourism their arcane drinking laws will change.

What I really hate about Utah is the sprawl from Provo to Logan. It's gruesomely ugly. The interstate makes it clear that the commercial spirit of this state believes in no mitigations for aesthetics. SLC itself is interesting. You get the feeling it is a rather small oasis in the midst of unrelenting suburbia. In this respect, it's no different than any other city in an otherwise conservative state (Portland, e.g.). Urban values can create places worth living in, but you're usually working in the context of values alien to your own. This is why SLC is so frustrating. It's really a beautiful place but where the state politics are informed by fear and reaction.

[Surrealplaces]

. Case in point, Utah, where close to 80% of the population belongs to the Ladder Day Saints (LDS)


I don't believe the percentage is that high. I kow in SLC the percentage is more around 25%

Yes SLC, is pretty conservative compared to the average city, but less consvervative than expected.

Being a non-Mormon myself, the only thing that I noticed out of the ordinary was going for a coffee. The waitress came over with a glass coffee pot that had an orange rim (usually signifying de-caff), and when I pointed out that I didn't want de-caff, she said, 'oh, the orange rimed are for caffinated coffee'

Only in Salt Lake city :)

The city is beautiful though, especially in the summer, and from what I've heard is slowly becoming more liberal.

[Surrealplaces]

I just wanted to point out something here.

What's more interesting about this situation is that I was not in North Korea or Saudi Arabia, but rather in Salt Lake City, Utah. In case you don't know, Utah is in America, yes, the same America that is hell bent on liberating the rest of the globe.

We are consistently informed that Middle Eastern countries are oppressed by fanatical religious groups and that all countries should be ruled by the people and not religion. This concept sounds good, but, if the majority of the people who have the freedom to vote are religious fanatics, the theory starts to loose its relevance.

I'm sure this is a loose exaggeration and not meant to be taken exactly as is, but nonetheless. I guess you've never been to Saudi Arabia..... I have, and I can tell you that Saudi and SLC are worlds apart. If you think people in Salt Lake are religious fanatics then you might want to travel to Saudi, or some of other countries in that region. Trust me Salt Lake City looks like Woodstock compared to those places.

[Northernlad]

I don't believe the percentage is that high. I kow in SLC the percentage is more around 25%

Yes SLC, is pretty conservative compared to the average city, but less consvervative than expected.

Being a non-Mormon myself, the only thing that I noticed out of the ordinary was going for a coffee. The waitress came over with a glass coffee pot that had an orange rim (usually signifying de-caff), and when I pointed out that I didn't want de-caff, she said, 'oh, the orange rimed are for caffinated coffee'

Only in Salt Lake city :)

The city is beautiful though, especially in the summer, and from what I've heard is slowly becoming more liberal.

You are correct about Salt Lake City being conservative, that is a given, but it is not as conservative as most people would think.
The percentage of Mormons (LDS) in Salt Lake Proper is not as high as some people would expect, but then again Salt Lake proper is surrounded by the suburbs which all have a high percentage of Mormons. But why is that all bad? This place was settled by Mormons and will always have an extreme Mormon majority. Mormon's can be rebels too, maybe an occasional coffee or sip of beer:haha: Whenever there is an extreme religious influence in a city there will be those who speak out against that religion and speak very loudly to have their voices heard.
You should visit sometime in the Summer which I think is the best season in SLC. The inversions/smog are not as bad in summer.

[Complex01]

Well those are nice scenery pics, thats all I have to really say...

[boden]

MrChills...America is not hellbent on liberating the world.
It has done that already....twice.

Nice pics.

[PHX31]

Regarding the drinking laws, the part that really got me was that all the beer and wine and liquor sold had to have a sticker on it... and it was a much lesser alcohol content than anywhere else. Something like a budweiser is, say, 5% alcohol, but it Salt Lake city it is 3.5% alcohol. I don't understand how all the beer manufacturers brew a special blend specifically for Utah. How is that practical?

[urbannomad]

"I don't understand how all the beer manufacturers brew a special blend specifically for Utah. How is that practical?"

Because it's not just Utah that has near-bear laws. Even worse is Maryland you can't buy beer in the grocery store there (in some counties), or parts of the south and all their "dry" county laws, in the Houston Heights restaurants require people to have memberships for a beer because they have a strict no alcohol policy in the entire neighborhood . Who wants Budweiser anyway, SLC has some of the best microbreweries all right there in downtown. And in reality not nearly the worst ant-alcohol laws in the country.

[James Bond Agent 007]

Wow, those mountain pics alone made it worth clicking on this link!

[wrendog]

Thanks for the Pictures and the false stereotypes.

[mSeattle]

Great looking scenes!

The mountain ones are a given - wow!

But this one was cool too.
http://felthamkeats.smugmug.com/photos/124611056-M.jpg

[MtnClimber]

I love utah, great views, an good skiing!

[KevinFromTexas]

Gorgeous. I see why aunt and uncle like it there.

[MtnClimber]

[B]

But, fanatic religion hangs over the city like a cancer eating at the sole of the very freedoms America moralizes to the world. If it were not for this absolute foolishness, yours truly would seriously consider a move to Salt Lake City. However, with alcohol being a staple part of my diet, and my problem with authority and religion, this move will not happen anytime soon. I can only wonder how many other potential citizens and tax revenue the picturesque state of Utah has lost due to their backward laws.



Well I can only imagine how many potential citizens and tax revune twisted San Fran has lost to its cancer eating morality :haha:

[I-15]

Great pics
I look at Mt Timpanogos out my front window every morning
I love living in such a beautiful setting!!

[davericard]

I am glad that there seems to be a huge misunderstanding about SLC. It seems to keep the closed minded dip shits away!! I'll take SLC just the way it is. Beautiful

[pdxman]

To me, Utah has always seemed more beautiful in pictures than in person. Mt. Timp being the exception. I was just there a few weeks ago and it was sunny but man was it smoggy and brown. I know utahns will say its the "inversion" but thats just a nice way of saying its smoggy. The stereotypes ring partly true in utah county but outside the "bubble" its just as normal as anywhere else with a few different laws. Utah has an excellent business climate and a great job market and slc to me seems quite progressive compared to most cities. Sure, religion plays a part in lots of things there--but what do you expect its the center of the mormon religion. If you don't like it don't live there, but don't bash it. Its different and it does a lot of things right. I suppose thats why many people like to bash it.

[Sacto]

Gorgeously crafted location.

[MtnClimber]

To me, Utah has always seemed more beautiful in pictures than in person. Mt. Timp being the exception. I was just there a few weeks ago and it was sunny but man was it smoggy and brown. I know utahns will say its the "inversion" but thats just a nice way of saying its smoggy. The stereotypes ring partly true in utah county but outside the "bubble" its just as normal as anywhere else with a few different laws. Utah has an excellent business climate and a great job market and slc to me seems quite progressive compared to most cities. Sure, religion plays a part in lots of things there--but what do you expect its the center of the mormon religion. If you don't like it don't live there, but don't bash it. Its different and it does a lot of things right. I suppose thats why many people like to bash it.

I really love Utah, but in the summer it can get pretty brown, but it really is an inversion layer that makes it look so hazy. Keep in mind that SLC is in a basin just like LA.

During the winter months you get a high pressure over the Wasatch range, which compresses the denser cold air into the valley. Especially when it is windless, its impossible to get rid of the inversion layer. It can and does last for weeks at a time and sometimes stretchs from Provo north. During the winter you just pray for snow to come so that the inversion layer will dissapear!

All the more reason why people out west need to be more careful about allowing coal burning plants and pollutants in the air.. Since most of the western cities are in valleys or basins between mountain ranges.

[IdahoMountainBoy]

I really love Utah, but in the summer it can get pretty brown, but it really is an inversion layer that makes it look so hazy. Keep in mind that SLC is in a basin just like LA.

During the winter months you get a high pressure over the Wasatch range, which compresses the denser cold air into the valley. Especially when it is windless, its impossible to get rid of the inversion layer. It can and does last for weeks at a time and sometimes stretchs from Provo north. During the winter you just pray for snow to come so that the inversion layer will dissapear!

All the more reason why people out west need to be more careful about allowing coal burning plants and pollutants in the air.. Since most of the western cities are in valleys or basins between mountain ranges.

Agreed. I traveled to SLC to tour U of U in October after the forest fires had been extinguished and prior to the inversion season and the smog was terrible. My ex says its continually getting worse and hes trying to leave....Ironically, I flew to LA right from SLC and it was beautifully clear lol....nonetheless, gotta love the Timp

[az06]

I thought this forum was for city photos. What's with all the negativity about mormons? There is actually more non-mormons that live there than there are mormons- that 80% isn't right. Some of them might be a little loud, but there are people like that everywhere! SLC was founded by mormons; you can't expect to go there without hearing about them. Anyway, nice pictures. That is a good spot for downtown views, and yes, you can see a lot better in the summer without all that smog.

[direfloyd]

Is this the hypocrite bigot forum now?

[potts]

To clarify, just under half of the population in Salt Lake City proper are members of the LDS church. As for the state of Utah as a whole, nearly 80% belong to the church.

Anyhow, I was the first person to reply to this particular thread almost one year ago before I moved here. And my, how my perceptions of SLC have changed! The city is FAR more liberal than I could have imagined! The alcohol thing is a little annoying, but you get over it. I'm also a flight attendant so I'm gone half the time. But I think SLC is a wonderful, thriving, quirky, and diverse little metropolitan. I must admit, however, that I've not really ventured too far outside of the city limits. I've heard that the farther you get from SLC, the crazier it gets.

[SLO]

Some people just want to force their values (karma marinated in sex, drugs and rock and roll) on other cultures. Utah definitely has a Mormon culture, but hey, they settled the area what do you expect. SLC has a great mix to it, and the Mormon culture just adds to it.
This is one of the worst if not the worst thread opening Ive ever seen here. Just embarrassing....

[Smuttynose1]

I'm from New Hampshire and am going to Salt Lake next month. I'm very excited but just want to make sure if I'm planning on going out to just bars and restaurants (not clubs) do I need to register for anything in advance? Where do I do that - through the state, or the bar Web sites?

Unfortunately, I have a huge weakness for coffee and beer. Will I get dirty looks if I order a beer at dinner? Are there common coffee chains like Starbucks and Dunkin Donuts in Utah?

[ady26]

The Good: location!
The Bad: to small for my living wishes!

[softee]

Salt Lake City is cool.

If I lived in a liberal city that most people ignorantly dissed as being backwards and conservative it would really tick me off... oh wait, I do!

[Comrade Reynolds]

To clarify, just under half of the population in Salt Lake City proper are members of the LDS church. As for the state of Utah as a whole, nearly 80% belong to the church.

Anyhow, I was the first person to reply to this particular thread almost one year ago before I moved here. And my, how my perceptions of SLC have changed! The city is FAR more liberal than I could have imagined! The alcohol thing is a little annoying, but you get over it. I'm also a flight attendant so I'm gone half the time. But I think SLC is a wonderful, thriving, quirky, and diverse little metropolitan. I must admit, however, that I've not really ventured too far outside of the city limits. I've heard that the farther you get from SLC, the crazier it gets.

Believe it or not, Utah's LDS population is now only 61%.

But yes, Salt Lake is nothing like the state of Utah. Salt Lake reminds me a lot of Portland, but it still has some ways to go before it can really be compared to that city.

[Comrade Reynolds]

I'm from New Hampshire and am going to Salt Lake next month. I'm very excited but just want to make sure if I'm planning on going out to just bars and restaurants (not clubs) do I need to register for anything in advance? Where do I do that - through the state, or the bar Web sites?

Unfortunately, I have a huge weakness for coffee and beer. Will I get dirty looks if I order a beer at dinner? Are there common coffee chains like Starbucks and Dunkin Donuts in Utah?

You shouldn't have a problem within the city. I'm guessing you would get looks if you did the same in Provo or any place in Utah County. In fact, Salt Lake has some nice microbreweries. As for Starbucks, they're located throughout the city, but there aren't any Dunkin Donuts (not a surprise, since I don't think they're located in much of the western US).

[alphawolf]

We have two DKs in Boise. Surprised SLC doesn't though.....doesn't that Flying J up by Ogden have one inside?

[BG918]

Surprised how much snow is already up there. I will be in the Colorado mountains in a few weeks, hopefully there is plenty up there too.

The whole Mormon thing kinda creeps me out though.

[I-15]

Surprised how much snow is already up there. I will be in the Colorado mountains in a few weeks, hopefully there is plenty up there too.

The whole Mormon thing kinda creeps me out though.

Not much snow in Utah yet, these pictures were from last winter.

BTW, Oklahoman's creep me out too;)

[Top Of The Park]

....I'm suprised there hasn't been a lot more development

[PA Pride]

Although some of the intro speech was interesting, the Mormon bashing is shameful... Not very nice.

SLC looks really unique and I hope it continues to prosper.

As for people complaining about liquor and other law oddities: Every state and city has quirks like that. Who cares?

[dktshb]

Nice photos but some of those pictures look smoggy or hazy... even a few mountain shots.
S.L., Denver, Phoenix and LA... we all have the same inversion issues.

[potts]

I'm from New Hampshire and am going to Salt Lake next month. I'm very excited but just want to make sure if I'm planning on going out to just bars and restaurants (not clubs) do I need to register for anything in advance? Where do I do that - through the state, or the bar Web sites?

Unfortunately, I have a huge weakness for coffee and beer. Will I get dirty looks if I order a beer at dinner? Are there common coffee chains like Starbucks and Dunkin Donuts in Utah?

I think you'll be surprised by how "normal" Salt Lake really is. The memberships for the "private clubs" is basically nothing more than a cover charge. You might have to fill out a tiny slip of paper and pay five bucks. It's that simple. And Salt Lake Cityans love beer. There a several microbreweries in the region so you can really find some yummy brews. Try Squatters, Red Rock, or The Bayou downtown. As far as coffee, just like most major cities, Starbucks' are on just about every corner. But I would recommend you bypass Starbucks and instead opt for one of the local coffee shops such as Beans and Brews, The Coffee Garden, or Salt Lake Coffee Break. SLC has quite a bit of character and a young population. Reminds me a bit of Austin at times. Outside of SLC, things get a little weird though.

[peanut gallery]

In fact, Salt Lake has some nice microbreweries.

I can attest to that, at least based on my experience several years ago. My wife and I were driving to Nebraska to meet up with some of her family there and some from Michigan. We plotted microbreweries along the way in Cheyenne, SLC, Denver and several other stops. Our favorite (and I must admit this surprised us) was the one in SLC. I wish I could remember the name of the place, but it was downtown not far from the old Salt Palace, IIRC. Their beer was excellent and the food was pretty good too.

[airhero]

Some people just want to force their values (karma marinated in sex, drugs and rock and roll) on other cultures. Utah definitely has a Mormon culture, but hey, they settled the area what do you expect.

They did settle the area. But they also settled Las Vegas...

[Magnus1]

That last picture is shear greatness.



Utah Liqour laws and 3.2 beer can go straight to hell! :hell:

[jaysinister]

thought i would tell you that i just moved to salt lake city, and there is a huge gay community cause i am gay myself..lots of gay bars..i go to the punk/goth bars for a mixed crowd and i am a freak..but i drink every damn day...haha...just cant get good beer here thats all so io switched to vodka...just give it a shot...and i have never been descriminated against..maybe there scared of me..