[Electrical Porpoise]

I lived in Baton Rouge for a while and even if there is something to do odds are you won't do it because of the traffic. I guess I live a different lifestyle because I can't see how it is any different -- for example if I wanted to do something this afternoon I can't think of one thing that I could do in Baton Rouge and not Mobile. I guess the same can be said for most cities that size.

But obviously every person is different so I understand.

[10101000]

LSU KID How long have you lived here in B. R.? Mobile is a great town no matter what. Some cities are not for everybody.

[10101000]

I lived in Baton Rouge for a while and even if there is something to do odds are you won't do it because of the traffic. I guess I live a different lifestyle because I can't see how it is any different -- for example if I wanted to do something this afternoon I can't think of one thing that I could do in Baton Rouge and not Mobile. I guess the same can be said for most cities that size.

But obviously every person is different so I understand.

I agree, I Mobile and Baton Rouge are so much alike. The only differences is LSU oh and the River.

[pkp]

I agree, I Mobile and Baton Rouge are so much alike. The only differences is LSU oh and the River.

They are a lot alike. Even though BR is larger, I do think Mobile is a bit more urban, however. I am not sure you could live in Baton Rouge without a car, but I think it might be doable in Mobile (not really easy, but doable).

[10101000]

I would agree with you in some extent as well.

[pkp]

all of mobile is urban sprawl! at least baton rouge had taken SOME attempts to make a TND or something similar like the Walden development off Kenilworth, or perkins rowe or Rouzan, bla bla bla... there's nothing like that in mobile. What smart growth are you referring to that is in mobile? (and sometimes i feel mobile IS a forsaken city...which is why i probably not move back there unless a lot changes) It is home for me, but I'm glad its not my current home.

I would argue that Mobile core and the surrounding residential areas are much more vibrant than BR. Baton Rouge's "smart growth" is basically plopping down a lifestyle center in the suburbs. There are strides being made downtown in BR, but for the most part, these developments are drive to/drive from destinations. I would not really care to see this in Mobile (although there are several starting to be built on both sides of the bay) - I would rather see our existing core redeveloped, which I think is happening. Not sure where you lived in Mobile, but where I am is about the furthest thing there is from sprawl.

[The 251]

Not sure where you lived in Mobile, but where I am is about the furthest thing there is from sprawl.

You wouldnt happen to live at The Tower on Ryan Park would you

[10101000]

Lucky dog if that is the case

[phoenixboi08]

I think what mobile needs is a more vivd cultural identity. As far as the arts, entertainment, and general public. I mean, when you go to New Orleans, you KNOW you are in NOLA! There's just this atmosphere, and attitude among the locals. That's why I believe Airbus is such a positive thing for this city. We NEED some foreign players in our economy. We need some diversity.

[Bogue]

Please excuse me in advance, this post may be all over the place before I finish. I've been doing a lot of traveling in the southeast this summer and the one thing that jumps out in traveling to other cities similar in size to Mobile, is that our infrusture is way below par to those cities. Jackson, MS., Knoxville, TN., Little Rock, AR., and soon Baton Rouge, LA., all have interstate loops around there cities. The loop helps drive through traffic move faster and it opens the spur through town to be less crowded for local traffic. I've talked to tons of travelers and they all say the same thing, Interstate 10 (Wallace Tunnels) is one of the worst if not the worst bottle necks on there trip to Flordia. (That's a major problem in itself, passing through and not stopping) Nearly everyone who lives in Dallas, Memphis, St. Louis, Houston, Kansas City, Shreveport, etc.....have driven through Mobile on the way to Orlando. We in Mobile need to realize the interstate system was built for the purpose of moving people long distance's and as quickly as possible. We have to less selfish and realize a downtown I-10 bridge must be built. No more excuses. Many cities have high bridges in there downtown and it can be made to work, even enhance the area.

Now on Mobile's population decline, who cares. Most large MSA's have a very small city population. Atlanta, GA......city of Atlanta around 450,000, Atlanta MSA....... 8th largest in the Untied States. It's the region that matters. What hurts Mobile is the fact we are sandwich between two other fairly large MSA area's Pensacola and Gulfport/Biloxi. I often wonder how large Mobile would be if those two area's didn't exist.

Now for Downtown, we've got to get another larger cruise ship and then make is easy for those people to explore downtown. Also once there in downtown, there has to be things for them to do that is only unique to Mobile. For example, the Riverwalk in New Orleans. Seems like most of the stores have a Nawlin's flavor. Mobile needs to capture it's own style, and make Mobile the destination and not just the stop over on the way to Disney World or cruise to Mexico.



Knoxville doesn't have an interstate loop around it. I lived in Pigeon Forge for a while. There's a spur that heads to their airport and their interstate goes straight through their downtown. 40 branches off and heads to Nashville... Their traffic is horrible sometimes and sprawl is ridiculous out west. Their downtown is trashed, the architecture is sad (Victorian... eww), and while they made some great efforts at renovating some parts of town there ain't much going on there. They have a concert series (or used to) one night a week in the Summer that was pretty cool. They do have a ton of natural stuff to do in their general area by virtue of their location, but we do as well.

There are plenty of reasons for us not to want an I-10 bridge downtown. If traffic bottlenecks then oh well. I see no reason for us to mortgage our economic future so that folk can shave a little time off their trip through.

I believe there is a Western bypass on the books, though in reality I-65 is already bypassing both downtown and midtown.

I like that Biloxi and Pensacola are nearby. Between the three cities there's a lot of history and opportunities for entertainment. We aren't the only city to grow, just the biggest of the three. When things go well for them we all do well.

[pkp]

You wouldnt happen to live at The Tower on Ryan Park would you

I actually live in Oakleigh. If I lived in an apartment, that is probably where I would live, though.

[Electrical Porpoise]

Baton Rouge doesnt have a loop either...they do have the worst road system on earth, though.

Mobile does have a loop, just not around west Mobile.

[Scottybo]

More like a triangle.

[Alabadrock]

It IS a triangle-esque shape... hmmm

[MobileLSUboy2005]

I live on grelot between cody and hillcrest (for the entire 21 years of my life)....where everything you must access by a car pretty much...i mean i guess as a kid i used to ride my bike to a few different places around my neighborhood, and it was nice. but really, to do most stuff you'd have to drive. In baton rouge, I live near the university, so if i didnt have a car, the free bus system could get me to a FEW places i may need to go. I just think BR has more upscale shopping and restaurants and such like at perkins rowe...wooo...and now the mall of louisiana has really started attracting much higher end stores (and larger square footages of the same stores we have in mobile) but i mean...you can't blame mobile for not having it, because as we've discussed on here over and over, Mobile gets hurt by being sandwiched between Biloxi/Gulfport, and Pensacola and such, and we just flat out have a bit smaller of a population...

[10101000]

No, Mobile is not hurting because of Biloxi and Pensacola. Baton Rouge is very close to New Orleans and it is not hurting. You cannot label Mobile like that at all. I lived in Pensacola and the people that I knew there came to Mobile. Mobile has so much more than Pensacola, things that Pensacola want's bad. LSU boy you must be oblivious to the development in Mobile and what we have. If you want to break it down, the Mall of Louisiana was to be built in Mobile back in 1995 when Mobile and it's bourgeois rejected the whole deal. The development firm Jim Wilson & Associates from Montgomery, decided to move in to Baton Rouge. The Mall of Louisiana looks so much like River chase. Too bad that old Mobile did not want it. Things are so much more different now and I see a much better attitude than before. Mobile does have a lot of the same stores they are just scattered all over the metro.

[CottonCity251]

Since education will play an important role in the future success of Mobile (training workers and competing with neighboring municipalities with school systems), I wanted to get some peoples take on Manzie replacing Fleet Belle and Crenshaw replacing Fournier. I think a few of you guys said yall were from Toulminville and I don't know alot about that community, the schools, or the officials that pepresent that area. I have always heard that Fournier and Belle (Thomas before him) were pretty corrupt and caused alot of problems for the school board and the system as a whole. Will the new blood on the board help change the school system for the better or are we in for more of the same? I know there was alot of drama with the Manzie vs Belle election. I also was curious about Crenshaw coming from Bishop St. There has been alot of scandal surrounding the Bishop St and previous administrators from there (David Thomas). Was Crenshaw a better choice than Marshall?

Being an alumini of LeFlore and a native of Toulminville I thought for sure Fred Marshall was going to take the district seat but I was wrong. Fred Marshall name still can be heard echoed through the halls of LHS for success of his administration at the school. I started as a freshman years after he had already left the school. During his tenure, LHS was the most renown high school from Mobile County Public School for its academics, sports, and community service. If I'm not mistaken, he had the longest running administration of all high schools with him being at LeFlore for about 14 years straight. After he left, the school enrollment decline, the white population at the school drasticly declined, and crime/suspension/discipline increased. With about 43 years with the school board, it seems like he was the man for the job but I guess people are tired with the pass of the system and want a new beginning. I think Crenshaw will do a great job though. As far as Fleet Belle, he got on the board to be a superstar....kind of glad he is gone. I hope some more faces get gone in the next few years.

[Bogue]

I would love to see more shopping in Mobile, but if it don't happen then it doesn't bother me that bad. Anything that's really needed can be found around town. What few stores I would like to see that aren't around will come as the population and/or economic situation increases. I suspect this problem will pretty much solve itself over the next decade.

Earlier in the thread I heard an allusion to a new shopping center that would be north of Mobile. Anyone know any specifics on that? Have any renderings?

[MobileLSUboy2005]

No, Mobile is not hurting because of Biloxi and Pensacola. Baton Rouge is very close to New Orleans and it is not hurting. You cannot label Mobile like that at all. I lived in Pensacola and the people that I knew there came to Mobile. Mobile has so much more than Pensacola, things that Pensacola want's bad. LSU boy you must be oblivious to the development in Mobile and what we have. If you want to break it down, the Mall of Louisiana was to be built in Mobile back in 1995 when Mobile and it's bourgeois rejected the whole deal. The development firm Jim Wilson & Associates from Montgomery, decided to move in to Baton Rouge. The Mall of Louisiana looks so much like River chase. Too bad that old Mobile did not want it. Things are so much more different now and I see a much better attitude than before. Mobile does have a lot of the same stores they are just scattered all over the metro.

I am very aware of the change of attitude in Mobile. I know the city is changing, and its gonna be great - eventually. I work for one of the largest national commercial construction companies, headquartered in Mobile, although I am working in the Baton Rouge office right now, but I know all about Mobile and surrounding area developments. I know our local economy is expanding while nationally, well, we all know what its doing. I also knew that the Mall of La was going to come to Mobile, but didn't. My point was not to say how terrible Mobile is and will be, but that yea, its changing, but growth is while right now speedy, not in the direction I would like it to be going, meaning I would like to see higher-end retailers and dining, etc. than whats currently planned/already there. Make Mobile more upscale than it already is. Show that we have some class. The last things we need are more crappy-ass dollar stores and walmarts, although walmart has been cutting back big-time on their new-store building (the company I work for has the national walmart contract). Does anyone know what is going on with the one on Airport by Providence though?
And as far as saying Baton Rouge's proximity to New Orleans doesn't hurt it? Well i think it had in the past, pre-katrina. And of course Pensacola doesn't compare to Mobile, but it most certainly takes away from our tourism industry since they have the awesome crystal clear water that we don't. If Alabama could legalize gaming or a lottery or BOTH then that would certainly help. We are the ONLY state in the Southeast without either. Keep Alabamian's money in our own state's pockets!

[10101000]

I understand how you feel, I am just glad that Mobile is what it is now.

[Bogue]

I know the city is changing, and its gonna be great - eventually.

I happen to think the city's great right now. Certainly it can be better, but that can be said of any city. I don't think the lack of high-end shopping is make-or-break for a town b/c it affects only a tiny percentage of the city population (which also goes for any city).

I would prefer that the city's recruiters lean more towards finding more options for the middle class for shopping/dining and towards more family-friendly entertainment options for locals.

[Randallg223]

Now with so much residential development going on downtown, I think it's time to focus on making DT more liveable. I know if I lived DT I'd want a grocery/deli store, drug store, high end clothing, hardware, etc, within walking distance and not driving distance. To me part of the beauty of living DT would be the need not to have a car to do daily errands, to make our city a walkable city.

What about Mobile having a aquarium, and yes I know New Orleans, Atlanta and Chattanooga all have aquarium's. And I've been to all of them, and that's my point, build it and they will come. We need to make Mobile a destination city to the tourist industry. Over time I'm sure more money can be make from tourism than any tanker project. With two cruise ships we'll have visitor's evey couple of days instead of every four of five days, if we had a aquarium, maritime museum, explorium/IMAX (we have), riverwalk shopping, sidewalk cafe's etc......give the cruiser a reason to drive/fly in a day or two before and explore our DT.

[CottonCity251]

I am very aware of the change of attitude in Mobile. I know the city is changing, and its gonna be great - eventually. I work for one of the largest national commercial construction companies, headquartered in Mobile, although I am working in the Baton Rouge office right now, but I know all about Mobile and surrounding area developments. I know our local economy is expanding while nationally, well, we all know what its doing. I also knew that the Mall of La was going to come to Mobile, but didn't. My point was not to say how terrible Mobile is and will be, but that yea, its changing, but growth is while right now speedy, not in the direction I would like it to be going, meaning I would like to see higher-end retailers and dining, etc. than whats currently planned/already there. Make Mobile more upscale than it already is. Show that we have some class. The last things we need are more crappy-ass dollar stores and walmarts, although walmart has been cutting back big-time on their new-store building (the company I work for has the national walmart contract). Does anyone know what is going on with the one on Airport by Providence though?
And as far as saying Baton Rouge's proximity to New Orleans doesn't hurt it? Well i think it had in the past, pre-katrina. And of course Pensacola doesn't compare to Mobile, but it most certainly takes away from our tourism industry since they have the awesome crystal clear water that we don't. If Alabama could legalize gaming or a lottery or BOTH then that would certainly help. We are the ONLY state in the Southeast without either. Keep Alabamian's money in our own state's pockets!

You must work for White-Spunner? I used to work for the delivery company that delivers their plans to the office and construction sites downtown...and must were Wal-Mart, Sam's, and Home Depot. Is their new office finished yet?

[MobileLSUboy2005]

You must work for White-Spunner? I used to work for the delivery company that delivers their plans to the office and construction sites downtown...and must were Wal-Mart, Sam's, and Home Depot. Is their new office finished yet?

Yea, i do work for White-Spunner, you must have worked for Ridgeways or Callagaz? haha yea the new office is finished, and I saw part of it in a video-confence call this morning, but I havent been in it yet! I want to, but Im only in Mobile on weekends. I worked in the main office and on jobsites in Mobile last summer but that (obviously) was their old location. Luckily I was able to find a position here in Baton Rouge for this summer (for sure beats living with the parents at home...)

[Musicisright]

Thought everybody would get a kick out of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBhtXdBKSew&NR=1).

[Port_of_Bama]

I would love to see more shopping in Mobile, but if it don't happen then it doesn't bother me that bad. Anything that's really needed can be found around town. What few stores I would like to see that aren't around will come as the population and/or economic situation increases. I suspect this problem will pretty much solve itself over the next decade.

Earlier in the thread I heard an allusion to a new shopping center that would be north of Mobile. Anyone know any specifics on that? Have any renderings?


I talked to Dow last summer in Books A Million and he told me there is a plan for a new mall in either Tillmans Corner or Saralnad near the Motor Sport park. I havn`t had a chance to talk to him since then about updates.



During the next city meeting I hope we all can voice our opinions on better shopping and attractions. Every Christmas I see more Mississippi tags in Bel- air parking lot than I se Mobile county and Mobile county is borderd by 3 Miss counties.

Huntsville has 3 Malls but I would take Bel-Air over any of the three any day and that includes there bridgstreet which is very simular to Eastern Shore Centre but with no big box stores such as Belk or Dillards.

[Scottybo]

Thought everybody would get a kick out of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBhtXdBKSew&NR=1).

We've got Big Titted Sphinxes ... :haha:

[pboo74]

I talked to Dow last summer in Books A Million and he told me there is a plan for a new mall in either Tillmans Corner or Saralnad near the Motor Sport park. I havn`t had a chance to talk to him since then about updates.



During the next city meeting I hope we all can voice our opinions on better shopping and attractions. Every Christmas I see more Mississippi tags in Bel- air parking lot than I se Mobile county and Mobile county is borderd by 3 Miss counties.

Huntsville has 3 Malls but I would take Bel-Air over any of the three any day and that includes there bridgstreet which is very simular to Eastern Shore Centre but with no big box stores such as Belk or Dillards.
Will anyone from here will be going to the city meeting about downtown on the 22nd,if so please ask about downtown having a shopping mall,movie theatre,aquarium,the moda to run later, resturants to open later,zoo,dinner night crusies/sightseeing crusies all for downtown.I can't stress this enough when people come to town for the holiday cruise ship it will give them something to do as well as shopping spending money in the city even coming in town a day or to early, also helping the hotels business.Think leaders of Mobile and take quick action were're getting left behind by other midsize cities?Please present some of these ideas at the meeting....

[pboo74]

I talked to Dow last summer in Books A Million and he told me there is a plan for a new mall in either Tillmans Corner or Saralnad near the Motor Sport park. I havn`t had a chance to talk to him since then about updates.



During the next city meeting I hope we all can voice our opinions on better shopping and attractions. Every Christmas I see more Mississippi tags in Bel- air parking lot than I se Mobile county and Mobile county is borderd by 3 Miss counties.

Huntsville has 3 Malls but I would take Bel-Air over any of the three any day and that includes there bridgstreet which is very simular to Eastern Shore Centre but with no big box stores such as Belk or Dillards.
I wonder if it will be a open air,or a closed in mall?

[SouthSky]

Destruction of American National Bank 'building' downtown.

di7hFpPrxCY

[NitekKetin]

From the June 22 Press Register Real Estate Column:

"A Huntsville investment and development firm paid more than $9.5 million for 95 acres at the northwest corner of Interstate 65 and Alabama 158 in Saraland and plans to build a shopping center, according to John Hughey of Propst Development , one of the buyers. The Mitchell Company, based in Mobile, will also work on the project, he said. The land was owned by the Altmayer family, which was represented by Re gions Bank trust department."

The regional shopping center proposed for these 95 acres will probably be another large power center anchored by the usual 'big box' suspects. Costco may even enter the market at this site.

[nimsjus]

I was downtown today. Between the cruise ship loading and the market, downtown was pretty lively. I had not realized how close Fort Conde Village is to the dock. I think we could work with Carnival to convert that into a Cruise stop that they advertise as part of the trip, either beginning or end. I know the cruise companies are usually very hokey with what they do at their stops, but as long as they respect the historic buildings I would be down for cruise realted, touristy, hokey stuff being down there as opposed to empty historic buildings and a few offices. Plus Carnival could help foot the bil for the preservation work. There is also the Conde-Charlotte Museum there for them to be entertained. There were tons of people parking 25 yards away that did not come towards town because Ft Conde Village is the closest thing to the parking lot and it is empty. I bet Rousso's is kicking themself for leaving now that a couple of thousand people now park twice a week across the street from there old spot. I know they have already moved out at the Eastern Shore Center. I also took some pictures of onging projects so here goes...
O'Gwynn Condo on Conti
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1746.jpg
Office/Retail on St Emanuel behind the new Hampton
http://s177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/?action=view&current=IMG_1749.jpg
10 St Emanuel Condos (6 tiny condos with Gayfers building wrapped all around it)
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1750.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1751.jpg
Kress and Neisners Buildings (No work has really started)
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1760.jpg
Hampton Updates
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1761.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1762.jpg
Space 301 (Completed)
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1770.jpg
Future site of a bakery on Dauphin according to Downtown Alliance
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1784.jpg
Catherdral Square Gallery's new spot across from Liquid/Bicycle Shop
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1789.jpg
Carriage Works (This, along with the Clarkson Townhouses, is my favorite residential project downtown. I wish I could live here).
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1785.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1787.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w222/nimsjus/IMG_1788.jpg
I did not take any of Gayfers or the one on St. Francis because no work has started on either as far as I could tell. I took some more artistic pictures for my house that I'll post later.

[NitekKetin]

Thanks for the update! I thought the former Rousso's building at Fort Conde Village was going to be a steakhouse at one point.

[mobile]

It would be nice if someone would really invest in the Fort Conde Village area. Make that a spot with a lot of foot traffic, something for tourist and for us. That could be made into a real nice spot with the road work that’s already there.

[mobile]

It would be nice if someone would really invest in the Fort Conde Village area. Make that a spot with a lot of foot traffic, something for tourist and for us. That could be made into a real nice spot with the road work that’s already there.

Any Ideas on what we could turn that area into?

[SouthSky]

Nice pics, nimsjus... the Hampton is coming along quite well.

I think you could make Fort Conde into a fashionable bar/shop district with some upscale restaurants. If Mobile supports it, then cruisers will enjoy the company in the village.

[nimsjus]

Thanks for the update! I thought the former Rousso's building at Fort Conde Village was going to be a steakhouse at one point.

It was reported that way a while back. If I remeber correctly Bob Baumhower (sp?) was suposed to do the steak house but nothing ever came. I always thought that was a terrible place for a business and I wondered how Russo's cut it there for so long. Now I think it has alot of potential with all those cruisers to support it along with locals.

[mobile]

Ok I'll post this again don't think like an OLD Mobilian, think like a new Mobilian who wants to see Major growth in the are and 4 our City 2 be on TOP! Have an Imagination!!!


This is what I would like to see for Mobile sometime in the next 10 or 20yrs....... (I know some of My Ideas are a far from being possible but if I could I would give Mobile all of this thing)

1. Tear down the Orange Grove projects. We would have to rebuild them somewhere else because it wouldn’t be right to put that many people out of a home. As long as those projects are there that large piece of land above (it’s about the same size as DT mobile it self) will never be used. People would be too scared to walk in that area. Then I would like to turn Bishop State into a 4 year HBC like Alabama A&M, Alabama State, or Miles with a football team and all. It would take over the old Orange grove land. That would add more density to DT Mobile just like UAB does 4 B-Ham. Then that would connect you safely to the land behind Orange Grove.
2. Now that we have access to that land it is large enough to put are aquarium, large zoo, and a Dome the size of the superdome. All three could be connected by a river walk like atmosphere with 3 mile creek. We could have a few shop and restaurants along the river walk.
3. Now we can teardown the current Civic Center and put up 4 condominiums/ apts., a parking garage behind them, and a nice little park in front that connects to the Spanish Plaza. That would really increase DT living and foot traffic.
4. Do something with that area behind Ft. Conde if I spelt that right. Maybe like a Market Place or something that will get people to walk over there. Maybe u guys can come up with a better Idea?????? Also do something with that land 4 the Mardi Gras Park. Build the park or Build the Condo, I don’t care just do something!!!
5. This is 4 our river front area….CSX old site must turn it into something good to get people to cross Water Street. Also, a better way to cross Water Street. Build The Maritime Museum. I also wonder is the Ports Could afford to lose the land right below the Cruise terminal. If so we could turn that area into an strip like the area in Sydney Australia where all there clubs and nightlife is. It would be right on the water and right by the Cruise Ships. Now that would be nice.
6. I would also like to see all other Ideas that u guys have brought up come to life between St. Louis Street and Gove. St. Like Chain Town, more places to eat, shop, live, more night clubs, ect….
7. I would like to see a large Pro. Size Baseball Stadium built right on the bay!!! Standing at home plate with a camera espn would have a great view of DT mobile and the Battle ship could be lit up. And on the back side of the stadium behind the parking could be 2 more Cruise ship terminals for large Cruise ships. Maybe we could host team like the Brave, Astros, and rays. I would take a lot of dredging but it could work.
8. The land behind battle Ship Park could be a huge amphitheater like the one in VA Beach.

That’s it 4 now I gotta get back to Work. But just Imagine Mobile with all of this!!!!

Give me some feedback tell me what u guys like what u don’t like and what u think is a possibility for Mobile in the next 10 or 20 yrs. U know this would be one of the hottest cities in The U.S.

[mobile]

Oh yeah, add the motorsports park and the mall in North Mobile.

[sahara727]

We've got Big Titted Sphinxes ... :haha:

...and over 1,000 cannons. :haha:

[Bogue]

That video was hilarious.

On the O'Gwynn building... What's the price range on those?

[Electrical Porpoise]

2. Now that we have access to that land it is large enough to put are aquarium, large zoo, and a Dome the size of the superdome. All three could be connected by a river walk like atmosphere with 3 mile creek. We could have a few shop and restaurants along the river walk.
3. Now we can teardown the current Civic Center and put up 4 condominiums/ apts., a parking garage behind them, and a nice little park in front that connects to the Spanish Plaza. That would really increase DT living and foot traffic.
I would LOVE it if they could ever do that. I think the north side of downtown by the Press-Register has some promise, and the aforementioned additions would make the rest of the area nicer.

[mobile]

I would LOVE it if they could ever do that. I think the north side of downtown by the Press-Register has some promise, and the aforementioned additions would make the rest of the area nicer.

Thanks for the reply

[nimsjus]

That video was hilarious.

On the O'Gwynn building... What's the price range on those?

I think they are in that 200k-325K range. I know that is pretty broad. The website does not list prices but I feel like I remember seeing a figure aroun 275K. All the places downtown are in that range it seems like. Here is the companies website:
http://drummondgrouponline.com/condos.asp
and an article on some of the current projects/prices
http://bama.live.advance.net/business/press-register/index.ssf?/base/business/1214126241173610.xml&coll=3
and a blog I found on Mobile/downtown
http://marionsellsmobile.squarespace.com/

[pkp]

I have seen a lot of posts about an aquarium in Mobile. Look, there are already several in the Southeast, and face it, ours probably would not be nearly as nice. Why bother. Same goes for a zoo - been done a thousand times and we don't have the resources or corporate sponsors to make ours nice. Also, forget about pro sports. Cities very rarely recoup their investments in these endeavors - and we are not a major market. Plus, NOLA is less than 2 hours away and already has basketball and football. Let B'ham chase the ridiculous dream of having a pro sports team - lets focus on something realistic!

I say we get the Maritime Museum done (The National Maritime Museum of the Gulf of Mexico, that is). It would be the only one - there couldn't be another. It's different, and if done well, I think it will be a big draw. Polish that off with some good pedestrian bridges across Water St. build out the old CSX site with some retail and public space, and your off.

Honestly, the best thing going for us now is all the residential and low to mid-rise office development downtown. The Gayfers and Kress renovations alone are amazing - I would have never imagined that would have ever happened. These are the types of things that will make our city center great - I would rather have a bunch of little successes than big pie in the sky projects that try to compete with larger markets.

Just my two cents.

[mobile]

I have seen a lot of posts about an aquarium in Mobile. Look, there are already several in the Southeast, and face it, ours probably would not be nearly as nice. Why bother. Same goes for a zoo - been done a thousand times and we don't have the resources or corporate sponsors to make ours nice. Also, forget about pro sports. Cities very rarely recoup their investments in these endeavors - and we are not a major market. Plus, NOLA is less than 2 hours away and already has basketball and football. Let B'ham chase the ridiculous dream of having a pro sports team - lets focus on something realistic!

I say we get the Maritime Museum done (The National Maritime Museum of the Gulf of Mexico, that is). It would be the only one - there couldn't be another. It's different, and if done well, I think it will be a big draw. Polish that off with some good pedestrian bridges across Water St. build out the old CSX site with some retail and public space, and your off.

Honestly, the best thing going for us now is all the residential and low to mid-rise office development downtown. The Gayfers and Kress renovations alone are amazing - I would have never imagined that would have ever happened. These are the types of things that will make our city center great - I would rather have a bunch of little successes than big pie in the sky projects that try to compete with larger markets.

Just my two cents.

Yeah and as long as we keep that attitude we will always be overshadowed by other cities in the south! I never said anything about a pro team but since u bring that up yeah N.O. has a football and basketball team but them don’t have a baseball team and the closest to us is like 5 or 6 hours away. So maybe someday in the future if we can get our MSA close to 1.5million (MS, AL, and FL). Than we could support a baseball team and the people from N.O. and B.R. could come to Mobile to watch our baseball team just like we go over there to what there football and basketball teams.

U got to start thinking outside of the box!!!!

[Electrical Porpoise]

We will never get a big three pro team, or at least in the next fifty years, but an Arena team, a PGA event, or something like that is more than a legit possibility.

It wasn't that long ago that the Babe was cranking them out of "The Pit" and Arnie was winning at Azalea City.

[mobile]

The population of the Phoenix metropolitan area increased by 45% from 1990 through 2000. So somebody tell me why The Mobile Area can't grow by 45% over the next 10yrs??? We gotta change are mind set and start to think bigger or we will always be know as the other place that has Mardi Gras.

[Bogue]

It is entirely possible for Mobile to grow meteorically, but the Phoenix explosion happened in conjunction w/ a massive expansion of the economy nationwide and a surge in migration from the Midwest and NE to the Sunbelt. Those may restart in a few years, but it's not a given that that particular set of stars aligning will happen.

Give Mobile B'ham's massively bloated MSA (it covers 12 counties, many of them large ones) and it's already around 1.3-1.5 million. I think for pro teams, etc. We would need to think in terms of the CGC (Central Gulf Coast) as one single unit... Biloxi/G'port, Pascagoula, & Pensacola (& all of their suburbs) combined. Ultimately, these cities will all grow into us (and we into them). They are, culturally, economically, politically, & (in many cases) genetically tied to us (and we to them). Intra-regional cooperation is going to be VERY important for Mobile to achieve its full potential given our geographic placement. The CGC that I just described may easily be pushing up towards 2.5 million a decade from now, btw.

There are lots of political challenges to going regional, but it's something we've got to encourage our politicians to aim for.


On the Aquarium... I like the idea of having one. Sure, there are several of them, but that doesn't preclude our ability to have a nice one. There's only one w/in driving distance (a distinction that's shrinking by the day due to the expense of gas) and that's 2 1/2 hours drive away. I think Aquaria can be great educational tools and are good family-friendly entertainment.

I would love a zoo of size in town, but that's almost gonna' be required to be a bit out from the main part of town. Even the close parts of West Mobile are fairly built-out now so the Mobile Zoo would be further out somewhere if we want to have one of truly sufficient size. Maybe Theodore/Tillman's Corner? Maybe in Baldwin County near Daphne/Spanish Fort?

I would also like to know more about the Gayfers/Kress renovations. I've seen the exterior shots, but I haven't seen any mock-ups of what it's going to look like when they're done. I agree that it's GREAT to have all the little successes, but we shouldn't be dismissive of greater hopes. You never know when things will fall your way.

[Electrical Porpoise]

The population of the Phoenix metropolitan area increased by 45% from 1990 through 2000. So somebody tell me why The Mobile Area can't grow by 45% over the next 10yrs??? We gotta change are mind set and start to think bigger or we will always be know as the other place that has Mardi Gras.

It can definitely grow (and will!), but if you are responding about a pro team there is no way it will happen any time soon due to many other reasons than city size.

With that being said I am with you regarding forward thinking.

[pkp]

Yeah and as long as we keep that attitude we will always be overshadowed by other cities in the south! I never said anything about a pro team but since u bring that up yeah N.O. has a football and basketball team but them don’t have a baseball team and the closest to us is like 5 or 6 hours away. So maybe someday in the future if we can get our MSA close to 1.5million (MS, AL, and FL). Than we could support a baseball team and the people from N.O. and B.R. could come to Mobile to watch our baseball team just like we go over there to what there football and basketball teams.

U got to start thinking outside of the box!!!!

I never said not to think outside of the box. But, I for one really don't want to be just another sprawling sunbelt city. If I wanted Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas, I would move there. I want to be bigger and better. But just copying what everyone else (sports, zoo, aquarium, etc...) has is not thinking outside of the box. You are working to copy something that other cities (with much greater resources) already have. Let's be progressive, let's be smart. Let's focus on transportation, culture, education, arts. I can guarantee you, unless we are looking at a 3MM MSA, forget about pro sports. And why would that make us a better city anyway? I think B'ham is a great city, but their leadership's pursuit of a domed stadium and a pro sports team is the biggest waste of time and resources I think I have ever seen. If I was looking to spend $500 - $600MM on something, how about something that creates well paying jobs and better opportunities - not something that provides a $7 per hour concession stand job or a $8 an hour retail job. Create real economic development and these things will come.
How about the Portland of the South, with better food and more interesting culture of course.:)

[pkp]

It is entirely possible for Mobile to grow meteorically, but the Phoenix explosion happened in conjunction w/ a massive expansion of the economy nationwide and a surge in migration from the Midwest and NE to the Sunbelt. Those may restart in a few years, but it's not a given that that particular set of stars aligning will happen.

Give Mobile B'ham's massively bloated MSA (it covers 12 counties, many of them large ones) and it's already around 1.3-1.5 million. I think for pro teams, etc. We would need to think in terms of the CGC (Central Gulf Coast) as one single unit... Biloxi/G'port, Pascagoula, & Pensacola (& all of their suburbs) combined. Ultimately, these cities will all grow into us (and we into them). They are, culturally, economically, politically, & (in many cases) genetically tied to us (and we to them). Intra-regional cooperation is going to be VERY important for Mobile to achieve its full potential given our geographic placement. The CGC that I just described may easily be pushing up towards 2.5 million a decade from now, btw.

There are lots of political challenges to going regional, but it's something we've got to encourage our politicians to aim for.


On the Aquarium... I like the idea of having one. Sure, there are several of them, but that doesn't preclude our ability to have a nice one. There's only one w/in driving distance (a distinction that's shrinking by the day due to the expense of gas) and that's 2 1/2 hours drive away. I think Aquaria can be great educational tools and are good family-friendly entertainment.

I would love a zoo of size in town, but that's almost gonna' be required to be a bit out from the main part of town. Even the close parts of West Mobile are fairly built-out now so the Mobile Zoo would be further out somewhere if we want to have one of truly sufficient size. Maybe Theodore/Tillman's Corner? Maybe in Baldwin County near Daphne/Spanish Fort?

I would also like to know more about the Gayfers/Kress renovations. I've seen the exterior shots, but I haven't seen any mock-ups of what it's going to look like when they're done. I agree that it's GREAT to have all the little successes, but we shouldn't be dismissive of greater hopes. You never know when things will fall your way.


Hargrove and Assoc is finishing out the Kress Building and Gayfers is being turned into office and residential. As you probably know, this is basically two entire blocks, and will be totally developed in the next 3-9 months. On the little successes, these are the best to have because their loss might not be that big of a deal. The loss of one huge project can kill a city, i.e., Brookley. I would rather see the city center brimming with a bunch of stores and residential projects any day than one huge skyscraper. It's one thing if you drive down I-10 and see downtown once a month. It's different if you live here - these little things make all the difference.

[pkp]

The population of the Phoenix metropolitan area increased by 45% from 1990 through 2000. So somebody tell me why The Mobile Area can't grow by 45% over the next 10yrs??? We gotta change are mind set and start to think bigger or we will always be know as the other place that has Mardi Gras.

Why would you want it to? Phoenix is a shit hole, urban waste land with some god spas and golf courses that are draining the CO river dry. If you want to be big, think NYC, Chicago, European cities, etc... not one of the most sprawling cities in the world. Growth for the sake of growth is pointless. "Good" growth is a different story.

[Bogue]

I'm completely with you on "good" growth... Atlanta is example numero uno on how not to let things get in terms of sprawl. I think we should learn from their mistakes and successes and try to emulate the good things.

I am completely with you on hoping for a plethora of small businesses and shops, etc. but a large project can do a TON to promote that set-up. I also think you underestimate the impact from those sports events. Baseball would make the most sense as an ultimate aim (more games, higher impact... plus the city has a long history w/ that sport).. but that's sort of something that's far out there. There are still tons of big projects that can drive development, etc.


On that particular note... I've read some of the articles in the B'ham News lately referring to their attempts to plan for their future water needs... and I've seen how the drought impacted Atlanta so severely. I think we need to prepare for the development that will be coming and to head off the danger of a drought impacting our development.

We should build a new reservoir or two in the upcountry area. There are vast areas with scattered populations, cheap land (relatively speaking) and lots and lots of rivers and creeks.

I also think that we need to start looking at transportation. We need a light rail service linking the airport in Mobile to Daphne. Start w/ that and then branch it out to places like Saraland, Fairhope, Foley, & Gulf Shores when ridership makes it feasible. With gas prices going where they've gone and the population spreading on the Eastern Shore and northward in Mobile there needs to be a way to give folk an economical and expeditious way for people to get to work. A light rail system can function as the centerpiece and make it work more quickly.

[nimsjus]

I also think that we need to start looking at transportation. We need a light rail service linking the airport in Mobile to Daphne. Start w/ that and then branch it out to places like Saraland, Fairhope, Foley, & Gulf Shores when ridership makes it feasible. With gas prices going where they've gone and the population spreading on the Eastern Shore and northward in Mobile there needs to be a way to give folk an economical and expeditious way for people to get to work. A light rail system can function as the centerpiece and make it work more quickly.

We always talk about light rail and I love the idea. However, every time I try to think of where a line would have to be to work, I have a hard time making a route that would maximize its use. The bus system would also have to be revamped to provide feeder service to the train, rather than try to serve the key locations in the city like it does now. THis morning though when I read you line about a straight rail line that just runs from Daphne to the airport it got me thinking in an "if you build it they will come" kind of thought process. Right now a a long straight line would not be particularily useful because the person from Daphne working off Cottage Hill can't really ride a train to work if it is a fixed line down Airport and the feeder buses don't get close enough to his/her work. But maybe businesses and residential projects will begin to congregate along the line creating and urban strip along the train line after its completion. Create nodes/stations at either end, and maybe others at downtown, the loop, the mall, airport/mcgregor, airport/university, airport/schillinger. I can just see the malls (especially springdale) redeveloping their parking lots into a more urban enviroment complete with a couple of taller buildings (regions/marriot with maybe two more simlar sized new bulidings) around the line allowing people to easily run downtown or over the bay. Can you imagine an urban or at least non-sprawl core running from Daphne to the airport? I think the current gas situation finally makes mass transit more viable in the sprawl-loving South.

[MobiMan]

I believe a newer larger ZOO and Aquarium, in or very close to DT is something needed for the children... You know our schools take children on field trips every year to the N.O.ZOO. Think about the cost for gas, wear and tear on the Busses, paying the driver's and most importantly the money we are spending in N.O. and other places ...Now think about all the counties in Florida,Mississippi,and just north of us that are also going to the N.O. ZOO spending money... that money could be spent right here, why send it out of town... and its great Education for our children... Remember and i can't stress this fact enough we do have the largest school district in alabama... Ok now we have a cruise ship
but people arent coming a day or 2 early to take in the sights and explore our beautiful and historic city. they are ariving and getting straight on the boat and when they return, they aren't staying a day or 2 later they are getting in their cars and leaving...WHY? Because we have nothing to do or offer them or atleast thats what they think... we need more, Mobile can't grow without people, and people dont want to live where there is nothing to do... and i here people that are from here and some that are here for school say that all the time... most say they can't wait to get out of Mobile... The Biggest reason, you guessed it, NOTHING TO DO... Everyone doesn't just want to walk the streets of DT and think WOW these old buildings are nice and oh look at that tall building i hear it's the tallest in Alabama... We want something to do and so do people who visit...Also bring back the Carriage rides people love that and its romantic and a great way to see the city...The city stopped the carriage rides because of the horse manuer smell and waste on the streets, but they actually sell bags for the horse to wear so there is no waste on the streets... And please stop trying to make us Atlanta, what the f@#&, why would you want us to be Atlanta or N.O. ...Having some of the same things are fine, we should look at them for ideas, but we are Mobile we are Mobilians we have our own identities we dont need someone elses... Do you remember when everyone was saying Dauphin street was a small Bourbon Street... didn't you hate that... Mobile is Mobile and we need to build a strong foundation and build on that... starting with race relations and getting these children Educated, Black, white, our new Hispanic Mobilians, Asian, and Other... Think about the children, happy children grow up to be happy adults and if they are happy here as children they will stay here as adults... I keep reading how these great people are getting building's , streets, colleges and other things named after them in New York, Dallas and other places, and guess what those people are from Mobile born and raised and moved to those other places and obviously did something very special to make national news... Now imagine if they would have done those great things here at home... With education and happiness means less crime in the future... every day i see black people women and men more often men and a few white people here and there, in the Mobile Press Register going to jail either for drugs, murder, or just being stupid, and one thing that most of them have in common are that they are unhappy and uneducated, and trying to make an easy buck or killed someone over a momma joke or baby momma drama crap...We need attractions, theres a reason all the big cities have them, because its brings people from all around close and far, and for people there on business its something to do while they are there, and it helps create happy families, and with word of mouth it brings even more people, and you need people to visit and see your beautiful city so maybe they will say hey i love it here this is where im gonna live...W e need people to grow and they have to have a reason to come here in the first place... Job's good school's and lots of things to do... a good quality of life

[Bogue]

Yeah, I suspect the part going between Daphne the mall would get the biggest traffic. It would take a huge amt. of money to just get that leg up and running (esp. given the geography & geology to get across the bay). I just included the airport b/c I thought it might drive up use of the airport if folk on the Eastern Shore could get a quick drop-off at a train stop at the Eastern Shore Center or at the Bass Pro Shop area & a straight shot out to the airport. It also might make it easy for folk living in Midtown & Downtown to take a quick shopping trip across the bay. They wouldn't have to worry about traffic. This also lessens the impact on I-10 during rush hours. It might also be feasible to have the leg going from downtown out to the airport in streetcar style. That might be the way to get around the route planning through the historic neighborhoods of Midtown.

[MobiMan]

What about and aerial Tram system from DT to the eastern shore, have a drop off, pick up point on both sides of course so it can come and go, actually make it 2 so one can go as one is coming,(they could design it like an old DT trolly to match the historic DT) then taxis, trollies, the Wave whoever can take them wherever they wanna go from there. Some run on Batteries and solar power together, so they are green, that would help put us in the green zone... we could also use Bio Diesel fuel for our trollies and the wave sysytem... it cost around $1 to make a gallon of bio fuel, it is one part alcohol (methane) to 5 parts cooking oil and a tbl spoon of a catalyst, you mix it together and then let it settle then you pour the Bio Diesel off the sediment and pour it in your tank... its that simple... the city could make a contract with restaurants and pick up their old oil, or anyone could... Get some 55 gallon drums mix it up use a hand pump or electric and there you go... your own little Bio Fuel Station... you could supply Bio Fuel to the city, and any company thats wants to go somewhat green... you will need a lot of 55 gallon drums or a very large tank... the thinking behind this is to help relieve the traffic problems at the tunnels, i doubt it would solve it completely but it would help, and wouldnt it be cool

[Bogue]

I think economic situations are more at fault for what's going on w/ lower income folk and crime than attractions, but I agree that education can play a key role in changing that situation for the better. There's always going to be a few folk who think the alternate is better, but there's no harm in working to fix as much of the problem as able.

[Bogue]

The aerial tram system is an interesting take. It would probably go down in a hurricane, though... but maybe they can reinforce the towers so that all that would need to be replaced is the cables.

I believe an aerial tram is used to link an island in NYC to the rest of the city.

Not sure it would be a viable transport link, though, b/c it wouldn't significantly lessen travel time. It'd be a tourist thing mainly it would seem, but a pretty cool tourist attraction.

[MobiMan]

Sorry about the post i seperated everything and then when i posted it, it all came out ran together...

As far as Attractions helping with crime and poverty, that wasn't what i meant, i just got carried away and ran all that together.
But actually it can help, it generates more tax money for the city,
which in return can and would in part be used for Education ,more police officers, more job's, and if and only if our local Government would set up some kind of mandatory assistance for these people, and a time frame on how long people can stay on foodstamps, welfare, and as far as low housing give them a time frame on how long they can stay living off tax payers, say a single mother of 2 children, husband left she's uneducated, unemployed and has no where to go, so she put herself and her kids in the system, ok they set it up where she gets free day care, foodstamps, a place to live, and with that come's mandatory job training or college classes, paid for by local Government and private donation's, maybe even some local colleges can take a few for free, i know they have some if not all this stuff now, but it should be mandatory and regulated, we have tomany people here that have been on welfare for years and years, they were raised on it and they are now raising their kids on it, and some even have men living in the public housing with them not paying a dime, and selling dope on street corners driving $50,000 dollar cars with 22's, living and eating on our tax money, and living better then those of us that are working a real job, those on welfare aren't regulated like they should be and most these women have more kids, and that just add's to what they get every month, hell i was in wal-mart on the Beltline and the lady in front of me had, what looked like 6 inch finger nails, long fake hair, pedicure, and about a $300 coach purse that she pulled an EBT Foodstamp card out of to pay for her groceries... ok im getting carried away again



Ok now i also made a mistake on the Aerial Tram saying it would help with traffic at the tunnels... ok that was going to far, they usually only carry around 20 to 40 people at a time, although im sure it would have a very small impact on the traffic problem, but not a big one, It would be exciting for those of us that want to have fun DT and then afterwards would like to shop accross the bay, and those from the Easter Shore that would like to come here, im sure it would draw huge crowds at first then it would drop down and go to being more managable and comfortable, it would be worth looking into, and both sides of the bay could put in on it, the only thing i ask is do it with style and class, i can't stand seeing these modern day boxes hanging from a wire

[pboo74]

Mobiman I'am glad you said all of those things it's very true and if someone can say this stuff in the city meetings this week for downtown that will be awesome.I wondered why they stopped the horse and carriage that was neat for the city.They need to bring it back.

[mobile]

I never said not to think outside of the box. But, I for one really don't want to be just another sprawling sunbelt city. If I wanted Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas, I would move there. I want to be bigger and better. But just copying what everyone else (sports, zoo, aquarium, etc...) has is not thinking outside of the box. You are working to copy something that other cities (with much greater resources) already have. Let's be progressive, let's be smart. Let's focus on transportation, culture, education, arts. I can guarantee you, unless we are looking at a 3MM MSA, forget about pro sports. And why would that make us a better city anyway? I think B'ham is a great city, but their leadership's pursuit of a domed stadium and a pro sports team is the biggest waste of time and resources I think I have ever seen. If I was looking to spend $500 - $600MM on something, how about something that creates well paying jobs and better opportunities - not something that provides a $7 per hour concession stand job or a $8 an hour retail job. Create real economic development and these things will come.
How about the Portland of the South, with better food and more interesting culture of course.:)


U don’t have to tell me that you’re not thinking outside the box its obvious u are not. I never said anything about Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas????? But those cities do have a lot more to do than we do.

I would take a baseball team over whatever u are talking about anyway of the week. Do u understand how much more exposure that would give us??? No were not ready for it now but I’m said in the future of Mobile. And are MSA doesn’t have to be 3million to get a sports franchise. Example, Green Bay’s MSA is less than 300,000. Putting a baseball team here would put much more wealthy people in our are than whatever u are talking about.

And Portland who thinks of Portland when it comes to big Cities? I would much rather live in Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas…. O or Phoenix than Portland.

Just my 2 cents

[Bogue]

The carriage rides would be cool.

[Bogue]

Portland has a NBA franchise (the Trailblazers) and they are considered a great place to live... too cold for my liking, of course.

It has a ton of things going for it in terms of things to do, many would prefer it over the sprawling metropoli that have sprung up over the last 20 years.

[mobile]

Why would you want it to? Phoenix is a shit hole, urban waste land with some god spas and golf courses that are draining the CO river dry. If you want to be big, think NYC, Chicago, European cities, etc... not one of the most sprawling cities in the world. Growth for the sake of growth is pointless. "Good" growth is a different story.


WOW really man, really??? U just gonna throw someone’s city un the dumps like that. Harsh words to call that City A Shit Hole!!! Just because u don’t like doesn’t make it a shit hole. I would prefer to live in Phoenix than NYC or Chicago or any European City. But this is coming from the same guy who is always bashing Baldwin County as well. Do you think that your ideas are just the best and everyone else should agree with what ever shit that spews out of your mouth? Not everyone is going to agree with you.

Newsflash: Some people may prefer to live in Baldwin or west Mobile. Not everyone wants to live the same life style.

[mobile]

Portland has a NBA franchise (the Trailblazers) and they are considered a great place to live... too cold for my liking, of course.

It has a ton of things going for it in terms of things to do, many would prefer it over the sprawling metropoli that have sprung up over the last 20 years.


I know that Portland has a basketball team but so does ATL, Dallas, Phoenix, and Charlotte. And I would prefer to live in any of those places and I bet they have more things to do than Portland does. Anyway I never said Mobile should try to be like Phoenix.

I just said that if Phoenix can grow like it did so can Mobile if we do the right things to make it happen! If you build it they will come, so we just need to start building. JMO

[Bogue]

Charlotte's a decent city... Atlanta, Phoenix, & Dallas are just covered in sprawl is my only major problem w/ them. I'm far from being against development. I just don't want that kind of sprawl.

[mobile]

This is the list I want Mobile on. O and I want us on top of this list.


Fastest-growing metro areas
St. George, Utah has added more people than any other area; Hinesville-Fort Stewart, Georgia has lost the most.
By Les Christie, CNNMoney.com staff writer
October 16 2006: 10:43 AM EDT


NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- St. George, Utah had the biggest gain in population in the United States during the past six years, according to a U.S. Census report released Tuesday.

The city in the southwestern corner of the state grew 31.6 percent to 118,885 between April 1, 2000 and July 1, 2005. St. George nosed out the former leader, the Greeley, Colorado metro area, which has gained 26.6 percent over the same period.

A metropolitan area is defined as one that has a core urban area and a population of 50,000 or more.

Most of the fastest growers were medium to smaller metro areas and six of the top 10 were located west of the Mississippi. Only one of the four eastern cities in the top 10 - Raleigh, North Carolina - was outside Florida.

In sheer numbers, Atlanta has added more people, 669,699, than any other metro area. It grew by 15.8 percent during the period. Other big gainers included Dallas (657,957), Riverside-San Bernardino (655,133) and Phoenix (613,201).

Quite a number of places lost population. Hinesville-Fort Stewart, Georgia decreased 4.6 percent, a greater rate than any other metro area. Numerically, the biggest loser was Pittsburgh, where the population dropped 45,013.

The Census Bureau also published stats for micropolitan areas, those with populations between 10,000 and 50,000. Palm Coast, Florida, is the fastest growing of these places; it gained 53.3 percent.

Losing the highest percentage of its population was Pecos, Texas, which dropped 11.4 percent

[mobile]

I would also like to see mobile on top of this list.

best places to live.

Mobile, AL $43,412 9.00% 2.00%-5.00% $2,064 -1.65%
1 Fort Collins, CO $64,623 6.70% 4.63%-4.63% $2,194 6.13%
2 Naperville, IL $112,258 6.75% 3.00%-3.00% $2,006 12.14%
3 Sugar Land, TX $101,168 8.25% n/a $2,490 30.53%
4 Columbia/Ellicott City, MD $96,082 5.00% 2.00%-4.75% $2,813 11.58%
5 Cary, NC $98,360 7.00% 6.00%-8.25% $2,203 16.14%
6 Overland Park, KS $89,792 7.53% 3.50%-6.45% $2,108 10.07%
7 Scottsdale, AZ $84,747 7.95% 2.87%-5.04% $2,588 8.75%
8 Boise, ID $58,489 5.00% 1.60%-7.80% $1,738 12.11%
9 Fairfield, CT $113,429 6.00% 3.00%-5.00% $2,505 4.05%
10 Eden Prairie, MN $105,177 6.50% 5.35%-7.85% $2,173 7.33%
Best places average $76,893 6.55% 2.74-6.46% $2,207 10.97%

[NitekKetin]

I would also like to see mobile on top of this list.

best places to live.

Mobile, AL $43,412 9.00% 2.00%-5.00% $2,064 -1.65%
1 Fort Collins, CO $64,623 6.70% 4.63%-4.63% $2,194 6.13%
2 Naperville, IL $112,258 6.75% 3.00%-3.00% $2,006 12.14%
3 Sugar Land, TX $101,168 8.25% n/a $2,490 30.53%.....


These numbers are meaningless without context. I hope it isn't equating high income with quality of city life and other factors.

[NitekKetin]

This is the list I want Mobile on. O and I want us on top of this list.


Fastest-growing metro areas
St. George, Utah has added more people than any other area; Hinesville-Fort Stewart, Georgia has lost the most.
By Les Christie, CNNMoney.com staff writer
October 16 2006: 10:43 AM EDT


Mobile and the Central Gulf Coast is not going to *rocket* to the top of that list without a substantial reason for it to do so. We need strong school systems, a couple of top notch institutes of higher learning, cultural venues and quality infrastructure. Trendy professional sports teams and low density suburban planning are not steps in the right direction.

[pkp]

mobile-
St. George, UT and Sugar Land, TX. Really shooting for the stars, huh?

And on Phoenix, my point is that just because a city triples in size in ten years does not make it better. I feel like a broken record, but this IS and urban living forum. If I liked sprawling cities, I would have joined stripmall.com, or parkinglot.com, or 25laneinterstate.com. People are certainly entitled to like what ever kind of city they want - it takes all kinds. But, as someone who actually lives in the city, I have my opinions on the direction I would like to see it take. And on Baldwin County, I've got a place there at the beach too. There are good things about it. The beaches are nice, and there is still some nice rural land there. However, if its sprawl (like the majority of the ES and even moving as far East as Loxley), I'm not going to like it no matter where it is. You kids just don't get it. I really don't understand why you are on this forum if all you are concerned with is having 10MM residents even if it means turning into just another sprawling sunbelt city. In addition, I would love to see us have 10 pro sports teams and 5 aquariums and a dozen zoos and 20 more shopping malls with a Gap. But guess what - lets spend some that capital on better schools (especially the community college system), public safety, transportation, real economic development, etc... These things are great, but other than the construction jobs, you are talking about a bunch of minimum wage jobs that are not going to increase the living standards here. There is certainly nothing wrong with working at a concession stand at a stadium or being a cashier at a store, but wouldn't you rather have some jobs paying $50,000 a year with full benefits than jobs paying $12,000 with nothing else? Good jobs are what make places grow. I think we can work to provide these while growing our city (and region) in a smart, sustainable manner.

[MobiMan]

We take this Forum all over the place...PKP you are right we do need Economic Development, and so far they are doing pretty good at bringing better higher paying jobs to Mobile, We have 2000 people from here working at Northrop Gruman in Pascagoula, we have our own shipyards, Benders, Atlantic Marine, Austal(which is exspanding and will bring in another 1000 jobs)TK 2500 jobs not sure about wages i went to their meeting and they arent set on wage prices yet but somewhere in the $50,000 range.
Hopefully we will be building the new Tanker, those will be in the $50,000 to low $60,000's. and also we haven't been hit by the new Vendors that will relocate or atleast open up shop here once TK is finished...And if we get the Tanker deal we will be hit by even more Vendors setting up shop, Those could bring in another few hundred to a few 1000 new job's, those things should Create a small boom in population, TK is bringing in 35000 workers for their project, maybe some of those people will like here and stay, ofcourse they would probably live out of city limits, but you never know
Good things are coming to Mobile we just need to be patient,
and prepair ourselves for whats about to come,
also if you have unique Business ideas that you feel will provide a good service, you need to make a business plan and start working on putting the finances together...
Mobile is gonna grow, we wont hit 1mm in our lifetime and if we did it would be to sudden, we wouldn't be ready, we need to be around 300,000 residents,
not more poor people but middle class or higher, so we can get those big name store's everyone want's here, and even with the extra 100,000 people in the city we would have to build, a few Highrise condos and apartment buildings...

one thing that gets me is our land is so limited here in Mobile, and instead of apartment and condo builders or owners building up they build out, retail also, Colonial mall is the largest Mall on the gulfcoast, i never undertood why they didint build up atleast 2 or 3 stories, they would have used less land, had more parking and more out parcels, its an indoor Mall so up would have been ideal, And they could have built it with style

We have to have positive Growth, we need upper class higher paying jobs, when those big stores look for new locations for their stores
they don't only check to see how many people you have living in the area
they wanna know what the median income is as well... if there is not enough people making a certain amount of money they are not going to locate a store here.even if we have 300,000 people


And whats the deal with dollar stores they are on every corner in mobile
i stopped counting after 30,
they are less than a mile apart in some areas, Amazing
Mobile= Wal-Marts and Dollar stores
and those jobs dont pay shit, but atleast people are working i guess
Minumum wage went up and so did the cost of living, food and gas prices went up right after
as soon as big retailers find out they have to pay more they charge more and claim that item they buy from china for a dollar and sell you for $25 cost them $24 after freight, stocking it, advertising, payroll, and so and so on

let me stop before i get way off topic

[phoenixboi08]

I know that Portland has a basketball team but so does ATL, Dallas, Phoenix, and Charlotte. And I would prefer to live in any of those places and I bet they have more things to do than Portland does. Anyway I never said Mobile should try to be like Phoenix.

I just said that if Phoenix can grow like it did so can Mobile if we do the right things to make it happen! If you build it they will come, so we just need to start building. JMO

I was born and raised in Phoenix. I've been living in Mobile for about 4 1/2 years, since I was about 15, And am begining to see some of the same threads of boom! :tup:
However, PHX was booming even before I was born, '90. That city has one of the, if not THE, STRONGEST real estate markets in the country. I've had friends whose parents worked in LA and commuted back and forth. People like to have the benifits of being in a slower enviornment than what they're used to. They just don't want to give up all the amenities. PHX has had AMAZING development, although, you ABSOLUTELY have to have a car to live there. The bus system is great and they just finised a light rail system, but it's just TOO big. It's like...take Mobile, and multiply it by three. That's about right, I think (area of course). It's the SECOND largest capital city in area, Not to mention the LARGEST capital city in pop (No.5 in the country). All that's great, but has an economy that Mobile doesn't have. This city won't be able to support an infrastructure that big for a while. That's why I'm SOOOO against sprawl. I wouldn't want Mobile to become that big (well, not if it isn't smart growth, but a completely different story)
I know I'm going on and on, but my point is that Mobile isn't going to have an pop. explosion. Don't get me wrong. The economy will explode and the pop. will grow dramatically in a short time...If you lived in Phoenix for a year, or even 6 months, you'd know what I mean when I say explosion. That pace wouldn't be good for Mobile.:shrug:

[phoenixboi08]

mobile-
St. George, UT and Sugar Land, TX. Really shooting for the stars, huh?

And on Phoenix, my point is that just because a city triples in size in ten years does not make it better. I feel like a broken record, but this IS and urban living forum. If I liked sprawling cities, I would have joined stripmall.com, or parkinglot.com, or 25laneinterstate.com. People are certainly entitled to like what ever kind of city they want - it takes all kinds. But, as someone who actually lives in the city, I have my opinions on the direction I would like to see it take. And on Baldwin County, I've got a place there at the beach too. There are good things about it. The beaches are nice, and there is still some nice rural land there. However, if its sprawl (like the majority of the ES and even moving as far East as Loxley), I'm not going to like it no matter where it is. You kids just don't get it. I really don't understand why you are on this forum if all you are concerned with is having 10MM residents even if it means turning into just another sprawling sunbelt city. In addition, I would love to see us have 10 pro sports teams and 5 aquariums and a dozen zoos and 20 more shopping malls with a Gap. But guess what - lets spend some that capital on better schools (especially the community college system), public safety, transportation, real economic development, etc... These things are great, but other than the construction jobs, you are talking about a bunch of minimum wage jobs that are not going to increase the living standards here. There is certainly nothing wrong with working at a concession stand at a stadium or being a cashier at a store, but wouldn't you rather have some jobs paying $50,000 a year with full benefits than jobs paying $12,000 with nothing else? Good jobs are what make places grow. I think we can work to provide these while growing our city (and region) in a smart, sustainable manner.

I HATE to double post, but...
Okay I'm not fond of sprawl either, but you have to take into context that every city isn't New York, Chicago, etc...Phoenix, for instance is a YOUNG city (it is older than the state itself, but that's beside the point). The development in the city is logical and makes sense. You don't have to drive cross city to get to good retail, dining, entertainment. I mean look at the new stadium (2008 Super Bowl) They built that in Glendale. An area that's comparable in distance from their downtown as our downtown is to Causey Middle School (probably a little further)
My point is, urban development isn't always tall skyscrapers, ect (though I willfully admit that IS the name of this website :haha: ). There are other components. I mean think about it. With a city of over 1.5 million people, you're going to get some sprawl, but the city has managed a GREAT infrastructre. You should really chenck out the cities thread. There are MANY MANY urban developments planned and already built all over the city. Having lived there for so long I can easily say that it isn't just suburbs. There are many urban qualities to the city. And the downtown area is never too far away. I lived over
The highway and street layouts are efficient. I've rarely EVER been stuck in bad traffic despite the number of people.


And it isn't exactly growth THEN a strong economy. Phoenix is a huge manufactoring center. There are 2 army bases. not to mention that it currently home to seven major Fortune 1000 companies, several Fortune 500 companies, and the greater Phoenix area is a $50 billion marketplace driven by technology. World-leading companies such as Intel, Avnet, Motorola, AlliedSignal, Honeywell and Boeing Company have chosen Phoenix for their corporate and regional headquarters. Industry giants such as American Express, Phelps Dodge, Sumitomo Sitix, Prudential, Charles Schwab and Mayo Clinic have major operations in Phoenix
The government is also very efficient and open to propositions and ideas
..IDK, I guess to each his own, right?

http://www.efineliving.com/vs_location.asp?PHX

[Port_of_Bama]

I wonder if it will be a open air,or a closed in mall?


I don`t know I hope it`s an open air mall we have the climate for it especialy winter months. The idea you presented are good I believe the first meeting is this Friday and I will bring you ideas as well as others up. A tema from Baltimore suppose to be putting this thing together.

[Port_of_Bama]

Nice pics, nimsjus... the Hampton is coming along quite well.

I think you could make Fort Conde into a fashionable bar/shop district with some upscale restaurants. If Mobile supports it, then cruisers will enjoy the company in the village.



Wow ! what a good idea man, to me that area has sooooo much potential and is realy my favorite part of Mobile period. I guess because it is what we have left of what Mobile use to look like over 300 yeras ago, and that neighborehood has one of the best skyline views of Mobile.

[Port_of_Bama]

Why would you want it to? Phoenix is a shit hole, urban waste land with some god spas and golf courses that are draining the CO river dry. If you want to be big, think NYC, Chicago, European cities, etc... not one of the most sprawling cities in the world. Growth for the sake of growth is pointless. "Good" growth is a different story.


Yeah being a big sprawl like Phoenix.ATL and others is not a good look. I would rather see the City limits build up first.

[pboo74]

Thanks Port of Bama,isn't their a meeting 2morrow also?Please make sure our voices r heard and let us know how the meeting goes please. :tup: Hey I hope it's an open air mall as well.Maybe something like that can fit into downtown some how.

[Del]

Didn't the Rousseau's guy used to complain that the city had talked him into staying/ locating at Fort Conde and then the promised other venues, which were supposed to help drive traffic to his establishment, never materialized?

I think the encircling ramps of I-10 have got to have something to do with the lack of development down there.

[MobiMan]

I remember Rousso's being packed out a few times when I drove by there.
What i believe he should have done was tear down the old Rousso's and build
up maybe 2 stories with a big terrace and big windows where people could have seen the skyline. I have eaten there a few times the food and service was great, and there was a good crowd, I've always wondered what happened

Maybe they will develope that area

[sandebr00]

For those who are interested, the Mobile City Council is meeting soon to decide the fate of the zoning ordinance for the Village of Springhill. I have received conflicting information as to the date of the meeting, but according to Linda St. John, of the Village of Springhill, the meeting is set for August 7th at 7:00 pm at Government Plaza. I will update this thread immediately if I hear differently.

To let you know, Linda has stressed to me that passage of the ordinance is far from guaranteed. Some people are still opposed to it, even though it is entirely optional at this point. Linda also mentioned that the Village needs "overwhelming" support from the public to ensure passage.

Throughout this thread, we've all discussed actively trying to better Mobile. Here's an opportunity for us all to do just that. I encourage everyone to visit the Village's website at www.thevillageofspringhill.

Also, please try to attend this meeting to show your support. I'll be there, as Linda has asked me talk in favor of the ordinance and to discuss how a similar zoning ordinance benefited Atlanta (where I used to live). Passage of this ordinance could be a huge benefit to all of Mobile, and maybe over time other areas in Mobile will be encouraged to pass similar zoning ordinances.

Thanks again for considering attending this meeting!!

[| BRAVO |]

I was hoping somebody in the area of the new Joe Cain's Restaurant may snap a couple of pics of the "flaming torches" installed on their canopy. The company I work for produced them and I only got to see them headed out the door... they looked a little disproportional. I'd like to see how they look on site.

Thanks and no rush.:cool:

[10101000]

I don`t know I hope it`s an open air mall we have the climate for it especialy winter months. The idea you presented are good I believe the first meeting is this Friday and I will bring you ideas as well as others up. A tema from Baltimore suppose to be putting this thing together.

I would like to see a mixture of both. Open-air and enclosed, but not like most would think. My idea is different from what I have seen so far, but of course someone else might have thought of it.

[10101000]

10538 I-65 & SPRING HILL 3451 SPRING HILL AVE MOBILE AL

10797 DAUPHIN & DU RHU 9 DU RHU DRIVE MOBILE AL

11322 OLD SHELL & MCGREGOR 4401 OLD SHELL RD MOBILE AL

11429 AIRPORT & FOREMAN 6601 AIRPORT BLVD MOBILE AL

11774 UNIVERSITY & OLD SHELL 5611 OLDSHELL RD MOBILE AL

11983 HWY 59 & CR 4 3800 GULF SHORE PKWY GULF SHORES AL

10951 FOLEY BEACH & CANAL 4725 MAIN ST ORANGE BEACH AL

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/07/18/starbucks-closure-list-al_n_113646.html

[Del]

Wow. Nine in Baton Rouge.

[10101000]

John Word is Back:
World Class Jazz Returns to Mobile Causeway
In the early 1980’s John Word’s was the downtown restaurant in the Kaliefh House at 352 Dauphin St., and his love of New York City jazz brought the Roy Merriwether Trio from NYC and from Hollywood the legendary Peanuts Hucko Band. This poster WHERE DINING TURNED TO DANCING marked the high time of jazz in Mobile. (the poster won Best of Show in the annual advertising contest). After almost 20 years he is back as JOHN WORDS RESTAURANT and JAZZ CLUB opens in the new Captain’s Table next to the Battleship on the Causeway. John Word will warm up the new club with Mobile’s own legend Joe Lewis Trio and then August 17 Roy Merriwether lands by jet in Mobile with famed drummer Paul Samuels. Word has bought a new paino bar to remind us of those heady days downstairs as Roy Merriwether magically made the jazz Steinway sing like a percussion orchestra. The Causeway is home of many fine restaurants and music, but the king of the causeway John Word is taking the neon street to a new level.

[10101000]

Wow. Nine in Baton Rouge.

Yeah, only because of CC's coffee house.

[MobileLSUboy2005]

mobile-
St. George, UT and Sugar Land, TX. Really shooting for the stars, huh?

And on Phoenix, my point is that just because a city triples in size in ten years does not make it better. I feel like a broken record, but this IS and urban living forum. If I liked sprawling cities, I would have joined stripmall.com, or parkinglot.com, or 25laneinterstate.com. People are certainly entitled to like what ever kind of city they want - it takes all kinds. But, as someone who actually lives in the city, I have my opinions on the direction I would like to see it take. And on Baldwin County, I've got a place there at the beach too. There are good things about it. The beaches are nice, and there is still some nice rural land there. However, if its sprawl (like the majority of the ES and even moving as far East as Loxley), I'm not going to like it no matter where it is. You kids just don't get it. I really don't understand why you are on this forum if all you are concerned with is having 10MM residents even if it means turning into just another sprawling sunbelt city. In addition, I would love to see us have 10 pro sports teams and 5 aquariums and a dozen zoos and 20 more shopping malls with a Gap. But guess what - lets spend some that capital on better schools (especially the community college system), public safety, transportation, real economic development, etc... These things are great, but other than the construction jobs, you are talking about a bunch of minimum wage jobs that are not going to increase the living standards here. There is certainly nothing wrong with working at a concession stand at a stadium or being a cashier at a store, but wouldn't you rather have some jobs paying $50,000 a year with full benefits than jobs paying $12,000 with nothing else? Good jobs are what make places grow. I think we can work to provide these while growing our city (and region) in a smart, sustainable manner.

thank you for your humor, and ideas....i agree, you can't expect mobile, a city with less than 3/4 of a million people in the entire CSA to have everything a MAJOR US city has. I often compare it with Baton Rouge, because they are similar in size, have similar layouts (altho mobile's is much better), and have similar economies, (minus a major university in mobile of course - no, south does NOT count). I want to try and make Mobile the best medium-sized city it can be, by smart growth and forward thinking. But as always, my biggest complaint is that the city cannot attract good retailers, other than what every other mediocre town like Tallahassee and Pensacola have... We can do better, and eventually we'll get it right.
To increase standard of living, get better schools and stuff!

[10101000]

As said before the retailers will come in time. I believe in the next 5 years are so.

[NitekKetin]

Retailers are going to be much more cautious as to which markets they will enter in the next five years. Eastern Shore Centre, in particular, will continue to attract mundane local fare like Jack's Music and Busy Babes.

[10101000]

Yeah that is why Pottery Barn and Williams Sonoma is still there I mean go figure. At this point, if they pay the rent I think they will stay. Of course they could just tear it down and just have Bel-Air, you know that place is rocking with high-end retailers!

Oh, I forgot you can go to Cordova mall and hang out with the local retailers there too, because they do not have a lot to show for. Or I could just keep on going. You could have nothing at all. Good thing you were born in America even. BE GREATFUL!

[10101000]

Retailers are going to be much more cautious as to which markets they will enter in the next five years. Eastern Shore Centre, in particular, will continue to attract mundane local fare like Jack's Music and Busy Babes.

Why do you even live in Mobile if you do not like it?

[NitekKetin]

Well, Bel Air Mall has proven to be much more healthier than ESC or Legacy Village. I mean, when inline tenant space is usually quickly leased by a quality national retailer. For instance, 22,000 square feet is be redeveloped as the first Forever21 store outside B'ham. The former Bombay space is transforming into Journeys Kids.

[10101000]

I saw that, but ESC is a burb deal. They did not want to be in the city.

[BamaGrad04]

Airport passenger counts down
Decline at Mobile Regional much steeper than neighboring airports
Tuesday, July 22, 2008By JEFF AMYBusiness Reporter

Passenger traffic at Mobile Regional Airport fell nearly 15 percent in June compared with the same month in 2007 and is off 7.5 percent for the first six months of the year, a much steeper decline than nationwide or at neighboring airports.

The drop came as airlines added more flights and larger planes in June, meaning some carriers saw their Mobile-bound planes only half-full on average. Airlines have announced that they will cut three weekday round-trips to Mobile after Labor Day, but officials warned Monday at a Mobile Airport Authority meeting that at least one more daily round-trip could be in jeopardy.

"Fuel prices increased, fares increased and passengers are really looking for the best value," Aviation Director Thomas Hughes said.

American Eagle, which added a fifth flight to and from Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport as of June 1, has now warned that its planes are too empty to turn a profit, Hughes said. The airline's planes to and from Mobile, including a once-daily round trip to Chicago that will end after Labor Day, were 67 percent full in June, according to airport figures.

"The fifth flight to Dallas is not as strong as it needs to be right now," Hughes said.

The Air Transport Association says that with the current high price of jet fuel, the average plane needed to be 83.5 percent full to make a profit in the first quarter of 2008. Nationwide, the average plane was 77.2 percent full during that period.

American Eagle had 21.3 percent of Mobile passengers in June. A subsidiary of AMR Corp., based in Fort Worth, Texas, the American Airlines regional carrier said last month that it would cut flights between Chicago and almost all Gulf Coast airports, part of a company-wide cost-cutting drive.

Delta has said it will cut the number of round trips to Atlanta from seven to six after Labor Day and reduce its seat total on Mobile-Atlanta planes by 21 percent. Most of those seats were added at the start of summer.

Mark Sixel, an airline consultant, said disappearing passengers are being driven away by high prices as airlines try to raise enough money to stay solvent

"It's a fare issue at this point," said Sixel, president of the Sixel Consulting Group, based in Eugene, Ore. "As fares go up, you tend to make flying a less attractive alternative."

Sixel said that business-oriented markets such as Mobile have seen the greatest fare increases. Markets that have discount carriers or and cater to leisure travelers, such as Gulfport and Pensacola, benefit because airlines "have to be much less aggressive or that traffic will disappear," he said.

Traffic has fallen much less at Pensacola Regional Airport, 0.4 percent so far this year, while the number of fliers to and from Gulfport-Biloxi International Airport has risen 18.6 percent in the first six months of 2008.
Worldwide, passengers on U.S. airlines rose 0.4 percent in the first five months of 2008, the Air Transport Association said, thanks to a 5.4 percent growth of international travelers. Domestic traffic fell 0.3 percent.

[NitekKetin]

I saw that, but ESC is a burb deal. They did not want to be in the city.

At any rate, Bel Air has done much better over the years handling its vacancy problems than ESC. Have you seen a copy of ESC's leasing plan? Several retailers apparently backed out of that mall.

[MobileLSUboy2005]

Well, Bel Air Mall has proven to be much more healthier than ESC or Legacy Village. I mean, when inline tenant space is usually quickly leased by a quality national retailer. For instance, 22,000 square feet is be redeveloped as the first Forever21 store outside B'ham. The former Bombay space is transforming into Journeys Kids.

i think all the gadzook's are being converted into forever 21's, they are doing the same in Baton Rouge too. Hell, all the gadzooks carried more forever 21 line clothes than their own haha.

[10101000]

I love Bel- Air, but they have so many people robbing stores at night there. Two weeks ago when I was there someone robbed the store next to Bama fever Tiger pride. It was bad! I thought I was about to die.