[nimsjus]

That is a great shot, I'm thinking they took it from the International Trade Center.

Hopefully 5 Guys Burger will be better than the overhyped Milo's.

5 guys is more like Cheeburger Cheeburger or Red Robin (more sitdown style).

[Port_of_Bama]

I would like to see a Red Robin in Mobile.

[BlessedMobile]

That is a great shot, I'm thinking they took it from the International Trade Center.

Hopefully 5 Guys Burger will be better than the overhyped Milo's.

That was taken from the convention center. I have seen that angle. If you go to the south end of the convention center on the second floor and go outside you will see that shot. You can get there and not go inside too. There are a few other shots like that of Atlantic Marine when they are busy that would convince you this is a REAL port city.

[BlessedMobile]

I'm probably being overly-sensitive as usual. Or very petty. But the original LA Times article in that link finishes with a line that just kills me:

"Feore, 70, is also one of a handful of older Mobilians who cherish the memory of a pre-revolutionary Havana that seemed especially magical by Alabama standards."

As if to say if you were living in an awesome place like LA or NYC, Havana would be another unmemorable yawner and wouldn't meet the standards of appreciation.

To continue the writer's direction to the absurd....."Hick Alabamians go ape sheet over Cuba though. I guess they are happy to step out of their cotton fields and see 1956 Fords driving on roads in Cuba (roads are things with pavement on them...for Alabamians)...those Alabamians probably have never seen what we modern people call "automobiles". We should probably spell automobile phonetically so Alabamians can read and pronounce the newest technology coming their way once they get running water in Mobile. Someone should import some ice so these backwards redneck people get an appreciation for the Inuit populations to their north they don't know exist. I bet they'd be amazed to see frozen water."

It just seems insulting to me. Otherwise, I like the article.

Some Californians like to think of themselves as cosmopolitan and the rest of the country are not so sophisticated. I guess when they ask Uncle Sam to bail them out with some of the TARP money they will get an earful of what we all think of them. At least in Alabama english is still the native language.

[philopdx]

Some Californians like to think of themselves as cosmopolitan and the rest of the country are not so sophisticated. I guess when they ask Uncle Sam to bail them out with some of the TARP money they will get an earful of what we all think of them. At least in Alabama english is still the native language.

If you read the line in context, it seems clear the author is setting up the following line in the article:

Feore, 70, is also one of a handful of older Mobilians who cherish the memory of a pre-revolutionary Havana that seemed especially magical by Alabama standards.

"I visited when I was 19, and it was just the most interesting and delightful place I'd ever been," he said.

If the cruise line ever sails back that way, he said he plans to be aboard.

Federal Taxes vs. Receipts

Now, Dear BlessedMobile, you appear the think that California and other "cosmopolitan" places are a drain on the federal government by receiving a TARP handout.

Did you know Alabama is consistently in the top ten states that receive proportionately more federal expenditures than it pays in federal taxes? In 2005 alone, Alabama paid 24.6 billion in federal taxes but received 42 billion in federal spending. http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/22685.html

I find it quite ironic that a state whose citizens are so eager to cast aspersions upon recipients of federal aid is hungrily sucking the government's teat dry to the tune of $17.4 BILLION.

Now let's examine California: In 2005, the same year that Alabama received federal welfare payments of $17.4 billion, California paid $289.6 billion in federal taxes and received $242 billion in federal spending. That means California paid $47.6 billion more to the federal government than it received.

In fact, some of the other heavy lifters that allow the Heart of Dixie to build its roads and bridges are other "cosmopolitan" states you may have heard of: New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Massachusetts, Illinois and Minnesota.

[philopdx]

Some Californians like to think of themselves as cosmopolitan and the rest of the country are not so sophisticated. I guess when they ask Uncle Sam to bail them out with some of the TARP money they will get an earful of what we all think of them. At least in Alabama english is still the native language.

So, the underlying assumption here is that somehow English is not the primary language in California, but thankfully, it is still spoken in places like Alabama.

The irony is thick here today. Yes, let's thank Jehovah that English is still spoken in a city originally named Fort Louis de la Louisiane and founded by two men by the name of Pierre Le Moyne d'Iberville and Jean-Baptiste Le Moyne de Bienville which lies in a bay originally discovered by Diego de Miruelo, Alonso Álvarez de Pineda, Pánfilo de Narváez and Hernando de Soto and originally inhabited by the Muskhogean people.

While I don't live in California, I do live on the west coast in a place that could be classified as "cosmopolitan". My friends and co-workers include people from: Turkey, Iran, India, Hong Kong, Malaysia, Mexico, Russia, Serbia, Ukraine, Korea, the UK and Somalia. And the funny thing is - we all speak English! I'm not sure where this mythological, sinister place is in the United States where no one speaks English and the people are nefariously plotting to impose their new world order by depriving "real America" of their sweet tea and grits.

[Port_of_Bama]

:previous: LOL, yes this city had it`s fair share of European influences, and has been called Fort De le Mobile and Conde,Charlotte and several other names. Though I wish we were still called Fort Louis rather than Mobile, but thank you for visiting anyway my friend.



I`m thinking that the surplus comes from the expensive hurrican aid we recieve each year I assume, we average about 3 to 4direct hits a year.

If you know of any different please inform me my friend.

[BlessedMobile]

I never said California WAS cosmopolitan and I sure would NEVER say Oregon is cosmopolitan. I don't see any point in debating your numbers as we here agree about the debits and credits to Alabama. Sadly, a lot of the federal money is to help the many poor with their needs and the military retirees. Thanks for lurking in the Mobile thread. Next time you're in Alabama stop by and have a nice glass of sweet tea and some fried chicken; it'll do you some good.

[nimsjus]

A couple of downtown related updates from Kathy Jumpers realestate coumn.

"The Mobile Area Chamber of Commerce Foundation paid $1.5 million for a 5,000-square-foot office building and parking lot at 456 Civic Center Drive, according to court records. Trinova, an engineering firm, sold the building and plans to relocate, according to Leigh Perry Herndon, a chamber spokeswoman. The building has also been home to Trinity's, a popular nightclub. The chamber will use the parking lot, but has no immediate plans for the offices, she said. The purchase was funded by chamber money, private grants and gifts, she said."
also...
"Planet Cellular has leased 3,300 square feet at 2 S. Water St. downtown and will open a corporate office and training center in September, according to Holly Shirley of Prudential Cooper & Co.'s commercial division, who worked for the tenant. Watson Realty represented the landlord."
and...
"Interior work and renovations to turn the 1830s Hall-Ford House at 165 St. Emanuel St. in Fort Conde Village into a bed and breakfast retreat are estimated to cost $1.14 million, according to building permit records. The adjacent circa 1857 Spear-Barter House has been restored as office space, according Larry Posner, the developer restoring the village structures off Royal Street."

Not downtown, but cool that he is investing in his hometown and not running off now that he has cash...
Oakland Raiders quarterback JaMarcus Russell paid $1.15 million for a 5,000-square-foot house and 5 acres on Dog River, according to court records. The property has 350 front feet on the river. Spencer Ruggs of Diamond Properties represented Russell, a Mobile native and former No. 1 pick in the NFL draft. Kym Trest of Roberts Brothers worked for the seller. Surety Land Title handled the closing.
http://www.al.com/business/press-register/kjumper.ssf?/base/business/124259685089240.xml&coll=3

[BlessedMobile]

"Interior work and renovations to turn the 1830s Hall-Ford House at 165 St. Emanuel St. in Fort Conde Village into a bed and breakfast retreat are estimated to cost $1.14 million, according to building permit records. The adjacent circa 1857 Spear-Barter House has been restored as office space, according Larry Posner, the developer restoring the village structures off Royal Street."

At one time Larry was going to develop the two houses as one B&B but it was going to cost way more than the $1.14 million. Office space in Fort Conde has always been at a premium so I guess he went with the numbers. His drawing of the proposed B&B which I saw was very attractive.

[Port_of_Bama]

I hate that the city allowed others to destroy the other sections of the old village. That particular section of Mobile is the most attractive to me even in the restoration state it is in now. I`m not biting off of New Orleans` French Quarter, but if Fort Conde Village was still as large as it was in the past .It would be on the same scale if not more attractive than the quarter in New Orleans. That is a very old French neighborhood the first in Mobile, origianlly called Fort de la Conde Charlotte and Fort Louis de la Louisiane. One could only imagine what tourist attraction that neighborhood would have been and could still be to day.

[BlessedMobile]

I hate that the city allowed others to destroy the other sections of the old village. That particular section of Mobile is the most attractive to me even in the restoration state it is in now. I`m not biting off of New Orleans` French Quarter, but if Fort Conde Village was still as large as it was in the past .It would be on the same scale if not more attractive than the quarter in New Orleans. That is a very old French neighborhood the first in Mobile, origianlly called Fort de la Conde Charlotte and Fort Louis de la Louisiane. One could only imagine what tourist attraction that neighborhood would have been and could still be to day.

The few remaining buildings to be renovated are in very bad shape. Larry Posner has made a silk purse out of a sow's ear in Fort Conde Village. The buildings are mostly law offices with a basic interior look. We probably aren't that far away from new construction on the vacant land inside the Village. I think Larry has done the restoration of Fort Conde Village more as a labor of love than of money. He has a lot of other irons in the fire but he personally handles Fort Conde. He is one New Yorker who has fallen in love with Mobile and commutes from NY to work on the Village during the week. We are fortunate to have Larry in our area.

[BlessedMobile]

Maybe I missed this announcement but I heard the other day that Serda's is going to open a shop on Hillcrest near Airport. Can someone tell me more about this. I love that place....hello Serda's ....good bye Starbuck's.

[NitekKetin]

They could have occupied that former Starbucks location in that (vacant?) strip mall adjacent to Providence Hospital. That former coffee shop even features a drive up window.

[| BRAVO |]

What happened to (Tim)?

[nimsjus]

While this is a good start, I don't think it is what people were shooting for when they ask for Downtown grocery stores. Congress and Broad is the extreme northwest corner of downtown. It needs to be closer to residents and it has to be a more nationally recognized store. To me this is a waste of the MLK associations funds. People already drive past the sorry Save-a-lot store at Broad and Govt to go to a WinnDixie a few blocks further. Local low-end stores like Save-a-lot, Food for Less and Greers are not what people were asking for when they said downtown grocery store. They wanted a Publix/WinnDixie/Fresh Market/Whole Foods in the core of downtown. If it is Greers it is going to have to be really nice like the one in downtown Fairhope and not like the stores they have on SpringHill Ave and S Broad.

Grocery store billed as anchor for downtown retail development
Thursday, May 21, 2009
By DAN MURTAUGH
Staff Reporter
A grocery store will anchor a 40,000-square-foot shopping complex planned for the corner of Congress and Broad streets in downtown Mobile, according to city officials.
The nonprofit MLK Avenue Redevelopment Corp. is behind the project. The organization's president, Michael Pierce, said the project would be completed within two years and would include a big-box store and a smaller strip mall.
He said he could not name any potential tenants.
The funding will come from the corporation's own assets, foundation grants and loans from financial institutions if necessary, Pierce said.
"All I can say is that it will be a first-class development that will allow access to goods and services not currently present in the community," Pierce said.
City leaders have long sought to bring more grocery stores to the downtown area. And there is at least some mutual interest.
Kamal Constantine, general manager of the Food For Less chain, said his company has been contacted by the development group but has not made a commitment.
Robert Greer, a vice president of Prichard-based Autry Greer & Sons, said his company has talked to the Downtown Mobile Alliance and is considering a survey to gauge the downtown market.
He said the ideal situation would be a store with some parking and within walking distance of new residences.
However, Greer said the company has not pledged to open at the Congress and Broad site.
Greer said the company would probably look at a store of about 18,000 to 20,000 square feet. A location could be opened in the "market" format the company has rolled out in some renovated stores, he said, but it might still end up competing with Greer's locations at Spring Hill Avenue and Ann Street and on South Broad Street.
"We are interested in expanding and in some new stores," Greer said.
Pierce has been working on the project for more than two years. The redevelopment group will buy the land from the Mobile County Health Department.
The property is part of the Broad Street-Beauregard Street Connection Project, a 1953 redevelopment plan created by the Mobile Housing Board and the city government.

[SouthSky]

I know that Greer's would probably build an upscale market store if they decided to move forward with this location but they have been in talks for some properties around central downtown to build for some while.

[Port_of_Bama]

What happened to (Tim)?


No idea Bravo


I hope it will be up scale, because I was looikng forward to a Publix, but it seems that Publix build town centre style stores. So there wouldn`t be any room for a Publix I believe .

[BlessedMobile]

40K s/f shopping center is very small. You could get a Greer's or Food For Less in there. If they made the deal very sweet you might see one of these guys in there but not one of the big boys. I'll ask my buddies tomorrow, who are local developers, what they think of the location, etc.
I have missed Tim with his great downtown photos and pithy comments. He does live in Mobile I thought. Who knows where he is? Tim.....Speak!

[NitekKetin]

I'm somewhat excited at the prospect of another Downtown grocery store. Hopefully the retail is built out towards the streets with landscaped parking or even a parking structure in the center. No outparcels please. The last thing we need in the Downtown core is a strip mall similar to that Office Depot anchored development in Midtown.

[Scottybo]

40,000 sq Ft would be ok for a grocery store. The Winn-Dixie I work at is 48,000 sq ft, which is a good size. I have seen smaller ones.

[NitekKetin]

^Yeah, 40K square feet is pretty good for your standard supermarket, but the anchor store of this development will probably be no more than 20K square feet. Perhaps an ambitious, creative developer will come in and do 65k square feet on the ground level for the grocery component and 20-35k square feet on a couple of levels above that, with all of this commercial space wrapping around a core of parking. Of course the architecture will be done in Spanish Rivial or Italianate styles.

[Scottybo]

Oh ok, I mis-read the post.

[BlessedMobile]

^Yeah, 40K square feet is pretty good for your standard supermarket, but the anchor store of this development will probably be no more than 20K square feet. Perhaps an ambitious, creative developer will come in and do 65k square feet on the ground level for the grocery component and 20-35k square feet on a couple of levels above that, with all of this commercial space wrapping around a core of parking. Of course the architecture will be done in Spanish Rivial or Italianate styles.

I am pretty sure that Michael Pierce of the MLK Redevelopment is doing his own development just as he did the earlier small strip center at MLK and Broad. Out of the 40K he could easily do a 30K grocery and small 1K stores and offices. He will have a hard time getting some mid level national tenants in there because of the demographics. I would look for a few local eateries and some government offices. It is very, very hard to get true local tenants who can afford the required rent and be confident of success. I had long wondered why that land was sitting idle. I once managed a 70K strip shopping center in Metairie which had a second floor; it was only half good for offices and then everyone complained about going up the stairs. Michael will make sure the building looks good no matter the architecture. I think he may have a catalyst to improve the shopping in the whole Broad Street area.

[NitekKetin]

Yeah, I wasn't being realistic with my ideas on the project, which were fueled by the excitment of having a new downtown grocery store. If done correctly, this development will contribute greatly to the urban grid.

Now, I wonder where they're going to have those carnival rides during Mardi Gras next year.

[CottonCity251]

Yeah, I wasn't being realistic with my ideas on the project, which were fueled by the excitment of having a new downtown grocery store. If done correctly, this development will contribute greatly to the urban grid.

Now, I wonder where they're going to have those carnival rides during Mardi Gras next year.

This sounds good...I'm pretty optimistic about this development. If done right it could spark new developments on that neglected side of DT. Hope they'll be finishing up Bring Back Broad St. about the time this opens. Delchamps would have been nice...hate they shut down for good!

[nimsjus]

No real news here...Barton Academy is in peril. Hopefully pieces like this really spur some kind of restoration effort. I'm not sure about the selling it to someone deal. You have to have some pretty stiff contracts to make sure someone doesn't come in and turn it into a parking lot later down the road. One reason it is still standing is because it was a goverment owned/used office during the time of Urban Renewal.
Riley to sign bill allowing school system to sell or lease Barton Academy
Friday, May 22, 2009
By ALEX PAPPAS
Staff Reporter
Gov. Bob Riley will sign a bill allowing vacant Barton Academy to be sold or leased by the Mobile County school board, according to local schools Superintendent Roy Nichols.
The signing comes at a time that two groups have, for the second time, listed the antebellum Barton as one of the most endangered historic buildings in all of Alabama.
Nichols said that the governor's office called him Tuesday telling him of Riley's plans.
The bill passed by the Legislature in April gives the school board more flexibility in finding ways to preserve and renovate the crumbling building on downtown Mobile's Government Street.
Designed in 1836, Barton is one of the oldest public school buildings in the nation.
From the 1970s to 2007, it served as the central administration office for the school system that is Alabama's largest at more than 60,000 students.
Barton has sat vacant since the central office staff moved out.
Renovation costs there have been estimated at $15 million to $20 million.
"The school board will do all it can to muster support for the building," Nichols said.
Nichols said that the board is "not necessarily interesting in selling the building," but he didn't rule that out. The most appealing option, he said, would be to secure an outside entity to invest in the building, while allowing the school board to use it in some fashion.
There have been suggestions that Barton could become an arts magnet school.
This week, the Alabama Historical Commission and the Alabama Trust for Historic Preservation identified Barton Academy as one of 12 "Places in Peril" in the state. The groups pointed to the fact that Barton had previously been named to the list in 2005 but had not received significant repairs or restoration since then.
Nichols said he was aware of the report.
Barton's inclusion in "Places in Peril" does not come with any legal mandate to force restoration efforts. The two groups, however, hope the designation will bring awareness to the need to preserve important cultural resources.
This week, a reporter stopping by Barton found the front gates locked, but noted the presence of maintenance trucks in the back parking lot. Several people coming out of an adjacent Social Security office said that they'd like to see the old building saved.
"It's a beautiful building," said Christy Cargile of Mobile, with her young son and daughter in tow. "If you're going to restore it, use it for children."

[phoenixboi08]

I've considered starting up some kind of citizen movement for the building, but was unsure how, so I abandoned the idea...maybe I'll give it another shot? Besides getting demolished, it'd also be a shame if the building just sits there and continues to grow ever more decrepit...Maybe a museum if not an arts magnet school. I kind of like the museum idea more since Birmingham already has the Alabama School of Performing Arts, which is like ASMS (AL. School of Math and Science).

[BlessedMobile]

I've considered starting up some kind of citizen movement for the building, but was unsure how, so I abandoned the idea...maybe I'll give it another shot? Besides getting demolished, it'd also be a shame if the building just sits there and continues to grow ever more decrepit...Maybe a museum if not an arts magnet school. I kind of like the museum idea more since Birmingham already has the Alabama School of Performing Arts, which is like ASMS (AL. School of Math and Science).

Barton will almost have to be a government project as the private sector sure can't make any money from it. A museum would be the best application as you would have far less interior work than a school or government office building. You could actually put several different museums and a few offices in there that could serve as training classes. I can't imagine anyone buying that place unless they are spending someone else's money...read that as "government". Mobile has matured to the point that we won't allow any more of our historic buildings to be destroyed. Barton has a chance to live now.

[SouthSky]

Another article on the Broad and Congress development:

http://blog.al.com/live/2009/05/mobile_city_officials_say_down.html

...and an article about the Eastern Shore in Smithsonian Magazine:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/44733002.html

[BlessedMobile]

Another article on the Broad and Congress development:

http://blog.al.com/live/2009/05/mobile_city_officials_say_down.html

...and an article about the Eastern Shore in Smithsonian Magazine:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/44733002.html

Just reading the comments on al.com about the shopping experience downtown shows that we have a few self-centered, small minded people chiming in their two cents ( and that's pushing it) worth of opinion about someone else's shopping needs and habits. I talked to my developer friends today and they feel that the center can attract a small grocer. That area of town is underserved especially with the larger HOPE VI project underway. No large grocer will consider downtown until there are a lot more people living there. The center will be built and it will be successful. The city is working out a project to develop the Civic Center area with apartments and shopping; that , in my opinion, will be the likely location of a larger grocer.

[CottonCity251]

The city is working out a project to develop the Civic Center area with apartments and shopping; that , in my opinion, will be the likely location of a larger grocer.

That sounds great! Will it include demolishing the arena and gutting the parking lot?

[BlessedMobile]

That sounds great! Will it include demolishing the arena and gutting the parking lot?

The plan is to demolish everything but the theatre. Just remember that this is a vision for the future. There would be private development on the property for residences and shopping. Everyone knows we need apartment rentals downtown in much larger numbers if we are to bring in some form of grocery and pharmacy. Let's go for the high-rise apartment building and not the low-level condos. We just need the economy to turn around and for venture capital to flow our way...it will and it will!

[NitekKetin]

The footprint of the Civic Center Auditorium would make a focal point for this new 'destination'. This lush Mardi Gras themed park would be the starting and endpoint for parade routes and a cultural space rivaling Cathedral and Bienville Squares. The lots north of this plaza could be developed into a mixture of hotel and higher density residential complexes with ample ground level retail and street interaction, while the areas south would be the sites of townhomes, rowhouses and, in order to match the scale of the neighborhoods south of Downtown, single family homes built to zero lot lines. The supermarket-anchored shopping center would probably be oriented towards Canal Street. Oh, how I love my somewhat infeasible developments!

[BlessedMobile]

The footprint of the Civic Center Auditorium would make a focal point for this new 'destination'. This lush Mardi Gras themed park would be the starting and endpoint for parade routes and a cultural space rivaling Cathedral and Bienville Squares. The lots north of this plaza could be developed into a mixture of hotel and higher density residential complexes with ample ground level retail and street interaction, while the areas south would be the sites of townhomes, rowhouses and, in order to match the scale of the neighborhoods south of Downtown, single family homes built to zero lot lines. The supermarket-anchored shopping center would probably be oriented towards Canal Street. Oh, how I love my somewhat infeasible developments!

NitekKetin....I thing you have seen the plans! :tup: What you see and believe is very feasible. I think that Spanish Plaza would become another better used parks than it is now as it will be in the buffer between Government St. and the developments on the Civic Center property.

[nimsjus]

NitekKetin....I thing you have seen the plans! :tup: What you see and believe is very feasible. I think that Spanish Plaza would become another better used parks than it is now as it will be in the buffer between Government St. and the developments on the Civic Center property.

Yeah I think you are dead on for what to expect for the civic center spot. Pie in the sky would be new malls/department store/whole foods, aquariums, amusement parks, etc. Those are the kinds of things that just are not going to be in the works for this site no matter how much some of us might want them. I think townhomes, mixed use, a few single family homes, and maybe a midrise condo/apt will be incorporated into a probably gridded streetscape to blend with the rest of that area and downtown. I think the most important compenent will be affordable, but interesting rental property (apts,townhomes, etc) Alot of the people who would consider living downtown (young professionals/college students) cannot afford to buy. That is why my wife and I didnot live down there. We were renting and it was very difficult to find some of these small individual rental units. It is a lot easier for renters to just find a big complex in west Mobile and sign up.

[CottonCity251]

Yeah I think you are dead on for what to expect for the civic center spot. Pie in the sky would be new malls/department store/whole foods, aquariums, amusement parks, etc. Those are the kinds of things that just are not going to be in the works for this site no matter how much some of us might want them. I think townhomes, mixed use, a few single family homes, and maybe a midrise condo/apt will be incorporated into a probably gridded streetscape to blend with the rest of that area and downtown. I think the most important compenent will be affordable, but interesting rental property (apts,townhomes, etc) Alot of the people who would consider living downtown (young professionals/college students) cannot afford to buy. That is why my wife and I didnot live down there. We were renting and it was very difficult to find some of these small individual rental units. It is a lot easier for renters to just find a big complex in west Mobile and sign up.

I don't know nimsjus, Sam Jones favors and visions the Civic Center lot as something like Atlantic Station in Atlanta. He also visions a riverside arena...I think that is why they give alternate options for the Civic Center and northern waterfront in the New Plan for Old Mobile. I like it!

[nimsjus]

I don't know nimsjus, Sam Jones favors and visions the Civic Center lot as something like Atlantic Station in Atlanta. He also visions a riverside arena...I think that is why they give alternate options for the Civic Center and northern waterfront in the New Plan for Old Mobile. I like it!

I would love it if some of those bigger things happened. I think at the very least we are going to get the things Nitekittin mentioned.

Here are a couple of things from the press register...
From the realestate column by Kathy Jumper- "Alion Science and Tech nology Corp. has leased 8,000 square feet on the ninth floor of the Riverview Office Plaza on Royal Street downtown, according to Ga vin Bender Jr. of Bender Real Estate Group , who represented the owners. Pete Riehm of Grubb & Ellis/Peebles & Cameron worked for the tenant"
Good to see RSA has not sucked up all the other tennants like some people suggested might happen. The other downtown office buildings are holding their own or are being sold to people who want to update them and lots of smaller buildings are being rennovated too.
Also there is an article on the racetrack. It is mostly just more hot air from the developers about how they will get their funding by summer. I will believe it when I see it with that project. I really want it to happen for Prichard but it is tough to get financing right now and I can't see how a project like this would get off the ground. Spanish Fort TownCentre (basspro) just opened in a pretty affluent area and is still 90% empty so I doubt anyone is going to jump to finance a race track with alot of retail attached to it in a relatively poor area (Prichard,Saraland, Satsuma).
http://www.al.com/business/press-register/insider.ssf?/base/business/124315662954100.xml&coll=3

[NitekKetin]

^I think the major problem with Spanish Fort Town Center is that most national retailers interested in having an Eastern Shore location would probably go to Eastern Shore Centre instead.

Still, Spanish Fort Town Center should have just never happened.

[nimsjus]

^I think the major problem with Spanish Fort Town Center is that most national retailers interested in having an Eastern Shore location would probably go to Eastern Shore Centre instead.

Still, Spanish Fort Town Center should have just never happened.

Agreed! If Bass Pro would have been located at ESC or at our existing malls (Springdale/BelAir) it would have turned any of those retail centers into a big time shopping center. ESC has struggled to stay full leased because there really is not the population base over there to support all of that. Bel Air actually has a much better occupancy rate. Either way Bass Pro should have been built with one of those other centers.

[BlessedMobile]

Agreed! If Bass Pro would have been located at ESC or at our existing malls (Springdale/BelAir) it would have turned any of those retail centers into a big time shopping center. ESC has struggled to stay full leased because there really is not the population base over there to support all of that. Bel Air actually has a much better occupancy rate. Either way Bass Pro should have been built with one of those other centers.

My developer friends think the Bass Pro will suffer a slow death in Spanish Fort. The Town Centre will be no better than it is now. I could never understand how the developer convinced Bass Pro that they would get tourist, travelers and Mobilians to shop there consistently...it just has not happened. Yes, the parking lot is often full...but with lookers.
I do know that the failing Colonial Bank who owns BelAir Mall will likely sell it to someone who will convert the mall to something more like the ESC. You can keep the big anchors, tear down the "mall" aspect of the place
and build back something more like a lifestyle strip center with better parking and better shops.

[Port_of_Bama]

Bass Pro should have been in Tillmans Corner where it was first proposed. The ESC should have been the WSC and the perfect area would have been across the street from Springhill Hsopital,near the Salt air development or out near Dawes. That is exactly what they get for looking over Mobile County no matter what Mobile County has the population asnd the demographics as well.

[NitekKetin]

Speaking of suburban shopping centers, I'm guessing that whole McGowin Park retail development near Hank Aaron Stadium has fizzled. Sigh, If only the nearby languishing Festival Centre could be redeveloped into a strong power center.

[Electrical Porpoise]

Bass Pro should have been in Tillmans Corner where it was first proposed. The ESC should have been the WSC and the perfect area would have been across the street from Springhill Hsopital,near the Salt air development or out near Dawes. That is exactly what they get for looking over Mobile County no matter what Mobile County has the population asnd the demographics as well.

They didnt overlook Mobile, they just didnt get much support. The developers are Mobilians and would have preferred to do it there but it was too cost inefficient.

Bass Pro and those areas will be fine.

[Port_of_Bama]

Speaking of suburban shopping centers, I'm guessing that whole McGowin Park retail development near Hank Aaron Stadium has fizzled. Sigh, If only the nearby languishing Festival Centre could be redeveloped into a strong power center.

I have forgotton about that, and yes the festival centre has potential.

[BlessedMobile]

They didnt overlook Mobile, they just didnt get much support. The developers are Mobilians and would have preferred to do it there but it was too cost inefficient.

Bass Pro and those areas will be fine.

I wish the "local" developer was true. ESC was done by MGHerring Group out of Dallas and the SF Town Center was done by Cypress Equities also out of Dallas. We can let time tell their investors whether the location choice was good or not...anyone care to hazard a guess? Here's a hint...read the link from the Town Center and tell me they are anywhere near where they said it would be. Please don't tell me it is a "sign of the times" as the Spanish Fort project is at least 5 years in the making.

http://www.mgherringgroup.com/Projects/PastProjects/tabid/55/Default.aspx

http://www.baldwincountynow.com/articles/2007/12/07/local_news/doc4756cc6a7b8ad011478169.txt

[Port_of_Bama]

:previous: Bottom line blessed the ESC should`ve been planned in Mobile County instead.

[Electrical Porpoise]

I wish the "local" developer was true. The company is not local but it was originally put together by a man from Mobile.


The only good thing about Mobile's malls is it keeps people employed that have to clean up Dog River.

[NitekKetin]

:previous: Bottom line blessed the ESC should`ve been planned in Mobile County instead.

Even though Mobile County has the population base, overall we lack the affluent demographics that higher-end stores desire. On the Eastern Shore, just the opposite is true, and thus regional centers like ESC and SFTC will have quite visible vacancies.

[BlessedMobile]

Even though Mobile County has the population base, overall we lack the affluent demographics that higher-end stores desire. On the Eastern Shore, just the opposite is true, and thus regional centers like ESC and SFTC will have quite visible vacancies.

Maybe I don't know what constitutes "higher end" stores. Look at the list of tenants from the ESC web site and tell me who is high end that we don't have in Mobile? I have a pretty good idea that the vast percentage of national retailers in the ESC shops are in Mobile. The ESC "look" may say upscale but the list of tenants does not. I have noticed that the local upscale tenants who originally opened have mostly closed. There will have to be more than a few upscale tenants that we don't have if we are to buy the notion that Baldwin County affluence was a strong factor in locating ESC to Spanish Fort. I think the developers sold their investors on the idea that travelers, Baldwin tourist and Mobilians would be big supporters. Personally, I strongly believe that Mobile will get a major lifestyle center after the economy swings up again; hopefully, a redevelopment of BelAir or the Festival Centre.
http://www.easternshorecentre.com/directory.php

[NitekKetin]

Pottery Barn and Williams-Sonoma could be see as upscale, while Sharper Image, before it imploded, was 'foolishly overpriced'. True, everything else is standard mall fare mixed in with an assortment of empty storefronts. Still, the shopping center does make a nice diversion from the crowded stores/malls of West Mobile during the Holiday season.

I kind of want ESC to be successful because it is supposed to be *the* upscale shopping complex of the South Alabama region.

[Port_of_Bama]

I would love to see ESC successful as well it`s a nice shopping center and is in a good location as well. I strongly believe that the demeographics in Mobile as far as income goes . The Money is still and always will be in Mobile,I know that the little shopping area that is across the street from Springhill avenue has upscale stores that Baldwin doen`t have like Jos A. bank I believe.

I`m just tired of Mobile beeing overlooked ,because developers believe that Mobile residents will ride to the ES to support shopping well i`m sure es shoppers would ride to Mobile as well. When I have family and friends visiting Mobile I shouldn`t have to travel to another county to impress them with a shopping experience.

Over all before they upgrade/build more retail in west Mobile. Dowtown need to be looked at 1st.If they are building and restring the buildings downtown into 250-600 K dollar lofts then the demographics will certainly be there. I believe they can start off simple downtown fisrt such as: Footlocker,Old Navy or Gap,Buckle,and Hat shack.To see how it would do tourist are downtown and they need something to do.

[Randallg223]

I know this is a topic that's been discussed 100's of times in this forum, but now in effect's me personally. In the past year it's become nessacary for me to travel across the bay to Baldwin county several times a month. It never fails that the I-10 bayway will have a accident either near the tunnel or on the bayway itself, probably 50% of the time I make the trip. I can not believe it's taken ALDOT or the Federal DOT as long as it has to resovle the problem. Just everyday rush hour traffic is horrible, and given a holiday on top of that, forget it. And what I've notice on the day's I travel is that probably 50% -60% are out of state tags. So this is not only locals who are casing the traffic tie ups. I-10 needs to be 8 laned (4 west bound 4 east bound) from the new McDonald road interchange to Past the Hwy 59 exit in Baldwin county, and it should have been done years ago. I know as a local I can travel Cochran bridge and the causeway, but why should I be forced to drive out of my way and inconvince myself just because the people in Mobile, Montgomery and Washington D.C. have failed to do there job. It is really way to late, anyone traveling to Florida from in any state west of Alabama drives through Mobile, and having talk to many of them this traffic problem is giving them a very negitive opinion of Mobile.

[Port_of_Bama]

I agree with you but I think I-10 should be widened from the Mississippi state line to the beach exits unless thats the hwy 59 exit also.

It isnt realy that diffficult to widen I-10 baybridge, all they have to do is just simpley add/build a lane going in both directions simular to what Pensacola is doing with there bridge that crosses there bay. The only problem that wouldn`t be resolved from that would be the tunnel , but atleast it would some sort of relief once you get on the bay bridge.


Traffic shouldn`t really give any one a negitive opinion of any city because traffic is in every moderate to large size city.

[nimsjus]

Ive been traveling I-10 alot recently too and have been visiting friends and family in Bham and Atl alot as well. I have mixed feelings on this issue. I have lived in Mobile my entire life (minus college at AU). I used to complain about the Bayway and Airport just like everyone else in Mobile. Having gone away and come back, I do not think traffic is as bad as most folks down here make it out to be. People here complain about the Bayway and Airport Blvd, but I spent 45 minutes on Hwy 280 in Bham to go about 7 miles at noon on Wednesday with no wrecks complicating things. I have never spent 45 minutes traveling 8 mile of the Bayway even during rushhour, much less at off hours. ATL is even worse so I think we blow things out of proportion here when it comes to traffic. The Bayway and Airport for that matter move at a pretty good clip most of the time. They never come to a standstill with normal traffic. The only thing that brings either roadway to a stand still is a wreck. Well a wreck is going to bring any road (big, small, busy, not busy, etc) to a stop and back up traffic so I dont think that is something that should be used to justify widening a road. We cant afford to make every road big enough that if soem of its lanes are blocked it can still handle 100% of its usual daily volume. That would be insanely expensive. However, I have said in the past, the only way I would support a ne Mobile River bridge would be if they widen the Bayway as well. I definitely don't see any need for 2 more lanes over the rive if it is all going to be funeled back into 2 lanes each direction on the Bayway. I might support a bridge if part of the plan involved making I-10 4 lanes in each direction from Theodore to at least Loxley if not the Florida line. I just dont think we are as bad traffic wise as most people suggest, especially having been in some places with legitimate traffic issues.

[Port_of_Bama]

Your right interstate traffic in Mobile is not that bad, on a city leve such as dauphin and Springhill Ave now that is another story in it`s self.

[Randallg223]

Traffic does come to a stand still on I-10 and the tunnel, even it there isn't a wreck or holiday. East bound I-10 reduces down from four lanes to two lanes, plus you have people leaving downtown trying to merge with I-10 right at the entrance of the tunnel. This is crazy. I've traveled to ATL and BHAM and yes they have serious traffic promblems, but in neither case does a interstate through there downtowns only have two lanes.

[Scottybo]

He meant normal traffic. He takes away holidays and rush hour I presume.

[nimsjus]

He meant normal traffic. He takes away holidays and rush hour I presume.

Well it would be hard to justify a multi-million (maybe billion) dollar project in eight laning all of I-10 because it gets slowed down on Memorial Day, 4th of July and Labor Day due to beach traffic. As for rush hour, I just don't think it is that bad. I drove it for August/September and March/April for internships every day and never really had any problems. I was going from Mobile to PCola so in theory I was going against the "traffic", but many on here and in town have tried to argue that it is not local traffic causing the congestion problem. If that is the case then my drive was comparable to people coming to Mobile from the Eastern Shore. I don't believe that at all and I think the root of the problem is sprawl to Baldwin Co (which is why I don't really support the Mobile River Bridge). Either way, I just dont think that the traffic is as big of an issue here as it is in most other places. Outside of beach holiday weekends and wrecks I think traffic moves fine. Wrecks slow traffic down on other roads all the time so I don't think that justifies widening the roads. Holiday weekends are 3 days a year, so that isnt really worth millions to me either.

[MobileLSUboy2005]

yea, i lived in Mobile for the first 18 years of my life, and then I lived in Baton Rouge the last four, and now I live in New Orleans, and trust me, Mobile has the least traffic problems of the three (its also the smallest of the three...) I would drive up and down Airport or 10 at 5:30pm before I'd drive anywhere on I-10 in BR, or NOLA at any time....

Sure the tunnels and bayway are a stupidly-designed bottleneck, but its nothing like the I-10 Mississippi River Bridge bottleneck at Baton Rouge and the O'Neal Lane bottleneck also in BR, the Siegen Lane to I-10/12 Split in BR, or the bottleneck in Metairie in NOLA (or anywhere else in nola for that matter...haha)

My parents visited me in BR last week and couldnt get over how amazingly awful the traffic was (or how amazingly good the nightlife, dining, and shopping are) there....I really wish Mobile could attract better food/shopping, then I'd consider moving back there one day! Its just hard to go back to a smaller city after living in bigger ones....

Peace!

[BuenaVista]

Whuuut? It would be cool, although rather unfeasble, if the GM&O Terminal was used as the station for this revived Sunset Limited.

It is a TERMINAL, not a station, DUH

[BuenaVista]

I hate that the city allowed others to destroy the other sections of the old village. That particular section of Mobile is the most attractive to me even in the restoration state it is in now. I`m not biting off of New Orleans` French Quarter, but if Fort Conde Village was still as large as it was in the past .It would be on the same scale if not more attractive than the quarter in New Orleans. That is a very old French neighborhood the first in Mobile, origianlly called Fort de la Conde Charlotte and Fort Louis de la Louisiane. One could only imagine what tourist attraction that neighborhood would have been and could still be to day.


Last Wednesday a Federal style townhouse at 354 St. Francis was destroyed. When alerted to the demolition, MHDC director, Deveraux Bemis, shrugged his shoulders and was heard to say " there was nothing I could do- it is not in an historic district" . He forgets that the name of his department is includes the words DEVELOPMENT- he is a sorry excuse for a director- reactive rather than proactive

[NitekKetin]

It is a TERMINAL, not a station, DUH

It's a building used for the facilitation of transport by rail.

[Port_of_Bama]

Last Wednesday a Federal style townhouse at 354 St. Francis was destroyed. When alerted to the demolition, MHDC director, Deveraux Bemis, shrugged his shoulders and was heard to say " there was nothing I could do- it is not in an historic district" . He forgets that the name of his department is includes the words DEVELOPMENT- he is a sorry excuse for a director- reactive rather than proactive


so sad !! :hell:

[Port_of_Bama]

yea, i lived in Mobile for the first 18 years of my life, and then I lived in Baton Rouge the last four, and now I live in New Orleans, and trust me, Mobile has the least traffic problems of the three (its also the smallest of the three...) I would drive up and down Airport or 10 at 5:30pm before I'd drive anywhere on I-10 in BR, or NOLA at any time....

Sure the tunnels and bayway are a stupidly-designed bottleneck, but its nothing like the I-10 Mississippi River Bridge bottleneck at Baton Rouge and the O'Neal Lane bottleneck also in BR, the Siegen Lane to I-10/12 Split in BR, or the bottleneck in Metairie in NOLA (or anywhere else in nola for that matter...haha)

My parents visited me in BR last week and couldnt get over how amazingly awful the traffic was (or how amazingly good the nightlife, dining, and shopping are) there....I really wish Mobile could attract better food/shopping, then I'd consider moving back there one day! Its just hard to go back to a smaller city after living in bigger ones....

Peace!



A friend of mine was visiting last week and said the same thing , she would condiser moving back to Mobile if there were more shopping options especially downtown.

As far as night life well it all depends, downtown has well over a dozen bars and clubs already . I counted atleast 35 through out the city that I know of.

I would love to see a Dave and Busters or ESPN in Mobile.

[BuenaVista]

so sad !! :hell:

I am a new member to this board- from what I can see, everyone has great ideas for Mobile, but I do not see anyone getting involved in the "down and dirty" of making any thing come to fruition! Get involved- join the Historic Mobile Preservation Society or the Downtown Business Improvement District or the Arts Council, etc. Attnend City Council meetings or at least be in contct with the City Government. Quit whining and complaining and hoping and speculating and get out there and make a difference!! I am out there trying to improve this tired old town. I work daily with with people who have an interest in making Mobile great and it is very tiresome to read all these comments! GET INVOLVED!!!!

[BlessedMobile]

It's a building used for the facilitation of transport by rail.

NitekKetin....you may find it interesting to have it confirmed that the GM&O was a train station originally...not a terminal as it is now described. You had it right. See the link below.

http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM49M5

[Port_of_Bama]

I am a new member to this board- from what I can see, everyone has great ideas for Mobile, but I do not see anyone getting involved in the "down and dirty" of making any thing come to fruition! Get involved- join the Historic Mobile Preservation Society or the Downtown Business Improvement District or the Arts Council, etc. Attnend City Council meetings or at least be in contct with the City Government. Quit whining and complaining and hoping and speculating and get out there and make a difference!! I am out there trying to improve this tired old town. I work daily with with people who have an interest in making Mobile great and it is very tiresome to read all these comments! GET INVOLVED!!!!


I understand where you`re coming from.If there is any big development be it shopping or entertainment I believe downtown should be the first to be looked at and then other areas.

[BlessedMobile]

Your right interstate traffic in Mobile is not that bad, on a city leve such as dauphin and Springhill Ave now that is another story in it`s self.

I travel Springhill Ave. every day and find that traffic has gotten much worse over the last two years. I am hoping that moving the nursing school over to main campus will take some of the load off of the road. It doesn't help matters when a train runs by on the tracks near I-65 at 5:00pm on some days. On the whole, I still like knowing that our much-improved downtown area is a source of some of the traffic.

[nouveau_Mauvilla]

Speaking of the GM&O Building, has anyone tried the cafe in there (Le Rose or La Rosa or something)? Heard it was pretty good. European cuisine, right?

[nouveau_Mauvilla]

I am a new member to this board- from what I can see, everyone has great ideas for Mobile, but I do not see anyone getting involved in the "down and dirty" of making any thing come to fruition! Get involved- join the Historic Mobile Preservation Society or the Downtown Business Improvement District or the Arts Council, etc. Attnend City Council meetings or at least be in contct with the City Government. Quit whining and complaining and hoping and speculating and get out there and make a difference!! I am out there trying to improve this tired old town. I work daily with with people who have an interest in making Mobile great and it is very tiresome to read all these comments! GET INVOLVED!!!!


We would all love to buy all the run-down historic buildings and fix them up and fill them with retail on the street-level and residential on top. Unfortunately, it's not that simple. Won't really dive into why.

As far as getting involved, I know that I, and the people around me, try to. I go to the market in Cathedral Square on Saturdays (BTW anyone go yesterday? They have some great stuff). I go to the artwalk, and eat downtown often, and have bought several pieces of art downtown from local artists. My dad's business recently renovated a building down there right on the parade route (Red Square Agency, an advertising firm). My mom and sister are on Restore Mobile and even though I am not, I'm still involved (Restore Mobile, formerly known as the Revolving Fund, recently/is purchasing several buildings and lots in Oakleigh/Leinkauf). I know the person who developed the new FBI building downtown a few years ago. My sister once spent a summer in the Tower on Ryan Park. My family used to be members of the Trade Club until it closed down. I saw Bryan Adams at the Saenger when he came. I go to Bayfest and the Chili Cook-off every year. I am activley involved in the Animal Rescue Foundation's Woofstock held in the fall in Cathedral Square. So as far as supporting downtown, I really try my part to do all I can. Also, I try to stay up to date with development and news such as from the Downtown Alliance and I often dream up ideas for downtown, much as others on here do.


Sorry for the rant... :shuffle:

[BlessedMobile]

Last Wednesday a Federal style townhouse at 354 St. Francis was destroyed. When alerted to the demolition, MHDC director, Deveraux Bemis, shrugged his shoulders and was heard to say " there was nothing I could do- it is not in an historic district" . He forgets that the name of his department is includes the words DEVELOPMENT- he is a sorry excuse for a director- reactive rather than proactive

Is this the building that was demolished on St. Francis? Zoom in on the street view and have a look.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=354+st.+francis+st.+mobile+alabama&um=1&ie=UTF-8&split=0&gl=us&ei=ZAsjSvngEIHCtwf60bXLBg&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1

[BlessedMobile]

Here is an interesting article ya'll might want to read. This is a list we do not want to be in. Most of us in Mobile are upbeat about ourselves and our city. I wish these cities the best.

http://images.businessweek.com/ss/09/02/0226_miserable_cities/1.htm

[nouveau_Mauvilla]

Is this the building that was demolished on St. Francis? Zoom in on the street view and have a look.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=354+st.+francis+st.+mobile+alabama&um=1&ie=UTF-8&split=0&gl=us&ei=ZAsjSvngEIHCtwf60bXLBg&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1

Blessed, I don't think that's it. I remember seeing it I think since Wednesday.

[SouthSky]

From today's Real Estate Front in the Press-Register:

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e36/ellisb123/orangebeachdev.jpg

[BlessedMobile]

Blessed, I don't think that's it. I remember seeing it I think since Wednesday.

I was hoping to go down there today and look for it but didn't make it. There should a big open space somewhere on St. Francis that wasn't there a week ago.

[Port_of_Bama]

Here is an interesting article ya'll might want to read. This is a list we do not want to be in. Most of us in Mobile are upbeat about ourselves and our city. I wish these cities the best.

http://images.businessweek.com/ss/09/02/0226_miserable_cities/1.htm

I was shocked to see certain cities in that article, and was also surprised to see that Mobile`s skyline is bigger than Jacksonville,Florida.

[Port_of_Bama]

From today's Real Estate Front in the Press-Register:

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e36/ellisb123/orangebeachdev.jpg

A dinner theater,and a nice upscale like bowling alley would be nice to have downtown.

[NitekKetin]

Where are ya'll getting finding color copies of the Register online?

That beach development looks kinda of bland.

[SouthSky]

Where are ya'll getting finding color copies of the Register online?

That beach development looks kinda of bland.

http://www.al.com/press-register/pageone/

...and I'm not holding my breath on this development coming to fruition.

[Port_of_Bama]

http://www.al.com/press-register/pageone/

...and I'm not holding my breath on this development coming to fruition.

The way the economy is im in dought !!

It doesn`t look bland to me I like it but it`s all a dream right now.

Though I do dream of seeing it right on the Mobile river :tup:

[phoenixboi08]

A dinner theater,and a nice upscale like bowling alley would be nice to have downtown.

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e36/ellisb123/orangebeachdev.jpg
This would have been perfect on the old GMCO lot, right between the Maritime Museum and the Cruise Terminal and the Civic Center...but then again, I don't think that space is big enough? It just would have been cool to have this as a hotel and convention center expansion plus shops and restaurants for cruisers and Museum goers...I don't think it's too bad, but I would have to change my mind if they decided to go RSA/Riverview green! :haha:

[Bayside]

I was hoping to go down there today and look for it but didn't make it. There should a big open space somewhere on St. Francis that wasn't there a week ago.

From what I can tell, it was 382 St. Francis St that was demolished. It was just west and adjacent to the barber shop on the corner of St. Francis and N. Clairborne St. I walked by it this morning. It doesn't look like it was a historic building. (You can go to Google Maps to see a photo.) Does anyone have any idea what they are going to build on the lot. Rogers and Willard is the contractor.

[nouveau_Mauvilla]

I don't think that OB development looks too bad. And hey, after you get married you can bowl a few rounds and then buy a coconut person and a magnet that says Orange Beach on it! :haha:

As far as the building, I'll try to go check it out sometime this week. I really hope it wasn't an historic building, and I doubt they would have demoished it if it was even though it wasn't in a historic district.

[Port_of_Bama]

I`m wih you Phoenix it`s time to ease off of the RSA green a little.:tup:

I think the city is going for the blue and green theme. Either way this dvelopment would have been nice downtown.

I know that Mr. Oliver and his company from California bought the CSX site, I wonder if they have any future plans for it ?

[BlessedMobile]

From what I can tell, it was 382 St. Francis St that was demolished. It was just west and adjacent to the barber shop on the corner of St. Francis and N. Clairborne St. I walked by it this morning. It doesn't look like it was a historic building. Does anyone have any idea what they are going to build on the lot. Rogers and Willard is the contractor.
I'm going to look it up on Google Map and see if it is historic. There are a lot of buildings downtown that aren't worth saving for any reason.

[BlessedMobile]

I recognize the building noted on Google Map as 382 St. Francis. It was the home of House of Specialties for 20 years or more until they moved to west Mobile about 10 years ago; I think it has been empty since. I've been in there plenty of times and it is more like a bomb shelter with all the passages and cubby holes. Ain't notin' historic about that place either inside or outside!

[DruidCity]

I don't think that OB development looks too bad.

Me, either. One of the unfortunate casualties, though, of the economic slump is the failure of Gulf Shores to move forward on its "Envision" plan, which aimed to redevelop the "T" area into a pedestrian/bike-friendly "downtown."
Existing restaurants, hotels, and amusements were demolished to make way for the new development, and then the crash hit, and much of the area remains empty today (with the Hangout being the one noteworthy addition).

No offense to Orange Beach, but this project sounds like the very sort of development Gulf Shores had hoped to attract as part of that old plan.

[phoenixboi08]

GMCO:
:koko: Sorry, meant CSX

I`m wih you Phoenix it`s time to ease off of the RSA green a little.:tup:

I think the city is going for the blue and green theme. Either way this dvelopment would have been nice downtown.


Yeah! :D I mean, the green is good, so long as it doesn't look too abrasive, like we're trying to hard...I think an interesting use of multiple colors could be cool. so long as we don't go too far overboard...but then again, I can see it now: "Mobile, the rainbow City!"...mixed messeges?

[Port_of_Bama]

LOL, I like Mobile the city of Mystics instead.

[CottonCity251]

LOL, I like Mobile the city of Mystics instead.

Me to.

[phoenixboi08]

LOL, I like Mobile the city of Mystics instead.

I like it too...they should really use it!

[BlessedMobile]

Come on ya'll...we know the "City of Mystics" isn't going to happen. Our lifestyle and culture shouts "Azalea City". I would much rather be associated with something of beauty that is more unique to our area.
Did anyone ever determine which building was torn down last week on St. Francis? I read two different locations.

[KB0679]

I was shocked to see certain cities in that article, and was also surprised to see that Mobile`s skyline is bigger than Jacksonville,Florida.

It's really not:

http://www.urban-photos.com/gallery/albums/city_galleries/jacksonville/jax_08_9053.jpg

http://www.urban-photos.com/gallery/albums/city_galleries/jacksonville/jax_11_2268.jpg

http://www.urban-photos.com/gallery/albums/city_galleries/jacksonville/jax_2300.jpg

[SouthSky]

While their's is bigger, we have a taller building. ;)

[Port_of_Bama]

Ummmm if im able to get Mobile`s sky line from the I-165 angle it is a little bit bigger but hight is a fact !

Now that i`m thinking from the same angle it is a little more dense as well. I know of two other great angles that i`ll try to post that prove me right. One is exiting off of I-10 approaching water street and the other one is the view of the skyline right off of the Cochrane Bridge !

If anyone is a familire with what i`m talking about would have to agree that our skyline appears to be a little bigger than what our friend from Chartlotte posted.

[Port_of_Bama]

I`m sorry but from this it appears to be a little bigger to me .This pic is also missing a couple of the buildings that I see when traveling this way, not to mention it`s a little out of date. http://www.comeseemobile.com/images/Mobile_Alabama_skyline_2007_narrow_art.jpg

[nouveau_Mauvilla]

^^ What is that taller building to the right of the Merchants' National Bank Building?

Also, I'll take the density of fewer buildings over more, shorter buildings spread out any day.

[Port_of_Bama]

I saw a huge wachovia sign at the entrance the other day and it`s under a little renovation. So I assume it belongs to Wachovia I believe and i`m glad you sgree with me on the density becasue it does apper to be dmore dense and taller as well.



For those who think i`m Jacksonville bashing i`m just stating my opinion and I think jacksonville is a great city. I`m just judging from the last Jacksonville pic that Mobile`s skyline appears to be a little bigger and more dense.


From the above pic if we were to have 2 more 3 or 400 footers on the west/right our skyline would really be nice ! I could see a 400 footer behind the Govt Plaza also another right between the Ramada and Holiday Inn that would be a good look. Not bad for a metro of 600 K though.

[nouveau_Mauvilla]

Yeah we could definitely use a couple more. Coming back over the bay, it looks kind of divided between Govt Plaza and everything else (if only the new courthouse could have been built up, or the proposed condo would have happened). I think that the old Red Cross property (assuming the current building is torn down, likely) would be nice as something tall (residential, hotel, maybe office if there's demand) and it would be a good catalyst for western infill and development. There is also plenty of potential property to the North where non-historical warehouses and the like could be developed into towers or at least nice urban buildings (my personal preference being that they be built historical-looking, to get back some of everything that we lost).