[Derek]

When's the next boom going to occur? :(

[bmfarley]

When's the next boom going to occur? :(
Concernig the housing market... 4-5 years from now; after housing prices have signalled that they've landed and flattened. AB32 and the fight against global warming.... housing demand could decrease for the burbs relative to downtown areas.

[HurricaneHugo]

Straight from the horses mouths:

The Barratt project (Echelon) on 11th and Island is on hold indefinitley. Can't get it to make sense financially. Thomas Jefferson Law School was planned to take up the bottom floors.

Library Tower has cancelled all of the exisiting escrows/reservations. Mothballed for now.

The Renaissance Marriott on 5th should break ground in January.

The land for Cosmo square is quielty being shopped.

Diegan is still looking for a hotel operator (flag).

I know you're just the messenger...but...

*shoots messenger*

:(

[sandiego_urban]

Library Tower has cancelled all of the exisiting escrows/reservations. Mothballed for now.
A few months ago, the salesperson told me they were looking at turning it into a condo hotel. I guess it didn't work out for them :(

The land for Cosmo square is quielty being shopped.
What a bummer...This was the one project I was hoping to see go up. Perhaps the new buyer will see that the approved proposal eventually gets built.:shrug:

Diegan is still looking for a hotel operator (flag).
I've spoken to two different sales agents from The Diegan, and even they don't know who the hotel operator is going to be. Both did tell me that the "higher ups" were in the process of negotiating a deal and that an announcement was going to be made anytime now. They keep saying this will be the most high-end property downtown, so we shall see.....

[sandiego_urban]

I guess the W is in, and Mandarin Oriental is out. Since we already have a W, I was really hoping for the latter -



Source Says UTC May Get Ultra-Hip W Hotel

Project to Be Part of Mixed-Use Development Now Under Way

By CONNIE LEWIS
San Diego Business Journal Staff

The county is apparently slated for a repeat of “whatever, whenever.”

According to Joe Terzi, a Starwood Hotels regional manager, San Diego’s second W Hotel is planned. The wherever is University Towne Center.

The first W, which opened in the Marina District near downtown in 2002, introduced hip to the local lodging market with its jazzy décor and rooftop patio bar, a concept that has since been copied by other downtown hotels.

Terzi confirmed in late May that Newport Beach developer Makar Properties LLC plans to build a new W that will have from 200 to 220 rooms.

Houston-based Hines, an international real estate firm whose resume includes Petco Park, is also building a 15-story, Class A office tower as part of what is being called La Jolla Commons — a multimillion-dollar mixed-use project that broke ground in mid-November. It is bordered by La Jolla Village Drive, Executive Drive and the 805 freeway.

On May 30, a public relations representative with a firm representing Makar said that it hadn’t announced the new W Hotel because the contract between Starwood and Makar has not yet been signed. Officials of Makar did not return phone calls seeking comment.

However, Terzi said that base work construction had begun on the hotel and that details of the project, which includes some top-floor residential condos, were being finalized.

“We fully expect to open a new W in the latter part of 2009,” he said. He did not know the cost of construction or how many condos were planned.

Going Up North

While the bulk of the county’s hotel development has been centered in downtown and the Gaslamp Quarter in response to the demand for increased room inventory to feed demand from the 2.6-million-square-foot waterfront San Diego Convention Center, Terzi said UTC is as good or better a market than downtown.

The upscale UTC neighborhood that many refer to as the Golden Triangle includes a mix of biotech, technical, financial, educational and commercial firms.

“In terms of business, that market (UTC) is very strong because it does not have to rely on convention center business,” he said.

Conventions tend to be seasonal, sources say, with more taking place in the spring and fall and fewer in the summer. According to the latest report from the Los Angeles offices of PKF Consulting, a national firm that tracks the lodging industry, occupancy in UTC-area hotels averaged 80 percent in March, while room rates averaged $156 nightly. In downtown, occupancy stood at 82 percent during the year and room rates averaged $195.

Carl Winston, director of San Diego State University’s Tourism and Hospitality School, said the W “is a strong brand that will perform well in the UTC market.”

“I think Starwood, which includes the Sheraton, Four Points, Westin and Luxury Collection brands, is underrepresented north of Interstate 8 up to the Orange County line,” he said.

He added that the UTC area is “a wonderful example of a high-end suburban and lodging market.”

“I liken it to Orange County around the John Wayne Airport,” he said.

No Occupancy Report

The W San Diego does not report occupancy. Its Web site advertised a rate of $349 for a room for two with two double beds for Saturday, June 2.

When the 258-room W San Diego changed hands a little more than a year ago, neither the seller, Kennedy Associates Real Estate Counsel Inc. of Seattle, nor the buyer, San Clemente-based Sunstone Hotel Investors Inc., a real estate investment trust, cited the price. But a report by Atlas Hospitality Group, an Irvine brokerage, placed it at $96 million, or $375,000 per room, as opposed to the county’s 2006 sales average of about $143,000 per room.

Kennedy Associates had arranged the purchase and renovation of the property formerly known as the Old Columbia Square for $62 million for a group of labor union pension funds.

Starwood has W Hotels worldwide. According to its Web site, the company counts 18 in North America, including five in New York City, two in Chicago and two in New Orleans. Los Angeles and San Francisco each have one. Aside from the second San Diego W, others that are planned or are under construction in the United States are in Fort Lauderdale, Fla.; Hoboken, N.J.; Scottsdale, Ariz.; and Miami’s South Beach.

[SD_Phil]

^Well, I guarantee photo updates on that project. Honest! ;)

[SDCAL]

Straight from the horses mouths:

The Barratt project (Echelon) on 11th and Island is on hold indefinitley. Can't get it to make sense financially. Thomas Jefferson Law School was planned to take up the bottom floors.

Library Tower has cancelled all of the exisiting escrows/reservations. Mothballed for now.

The Renaissance Marriott on 5th should break ground in January.

The land for Cosmo square is quielty being shopped.

Diegan is still looking for a hotel operator (flag).

How depressing!! What "horses mouths" (or horses rear ends :) ) did this come from? Even though the news is bad, thanks for doing the research - - it's so frustrating trying to get the scoop!

[sandiego_urban]

Yet another article and rendering of the Columbia Tower proposal. The headline is misleading since it won't be the tallest (in actual feet) downtown.

From this month's SD Metropolitan Magazine -

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/sdscene2_1.jpg

Tallest Downtown Tower Is Proposed

A Point Loma-based company whose principals trace their origins to the Indian town of Chhatrala has submitted plans to build a 47-story tower of hotel suites and luxury condominiums on Columbia Street Downtown. At about 500 feet, the $200 million, 350,000-square-foot structure would be the tallest Downtown building. Jenish “JP” Patel, COO of the Chhatrala Group, a family owned hotel management and development company headquartered on Rosecrans Street, says the first 26 floors of the building would contain 364 hotel rooms and the remaining floors would be luxury condominiums. Each of the condos would have private entrances from elevators. Condos on some of the floors would have swimming pools and spas on their balconies, says Patel. Chhatrala Group purchased the land at 1270 Columbia St. (between India and State streets) for $10.1 million from Bay Structures. The property is being used as a parking lot operated by Five Star Parking.

“We’re very excited about the project. It should do well for us,” says Patel, 27. Plans for the building, which was designed by C.W. Kim Architects & Planners, were submitted to the CCDC last month. The company hopes to break ground in 18 months. Completion would be in 2011. Patel says the Chhatrala Group is “heavily involved” in construction projects in India and is building a similar 40-story structure in Surat. Patel’s uncle, Hemant Chhatrala, is president of the company and his father, Ashvin Patel, is director of operations. Another uncle, Shailesh Patel, is director of acquisitions and development. Ashvin Patel’s grandfather is from Chhatrala, located in the state of Gujarat.

The Downtown project is the largest undertaken by the company, which owns and manages several hotels in the county and in Victorville. The company also is drawing plans for new headquarters on Rosecrans at Hugo Street, where the Sun Harbor Motel now sits. The motel will be demolished and construction is to start in August, Patel says.

[bmfarley]

I guess the W is in, and Mandarin Oriental is out. Since we already have a W, I was really hoping for the latter -



Source Says UTC May Get Ultra-Hip W Hotel

Project to Be Part of Mixed-Use Development Now Under Way

By CONNIE LEWIS
San Diego Business Journal Staff

The county is apparently slated for a repeat of “whatever, whenever.”

According to Joe Terzi, a Starwood Hotels regional manager, San Diego’s second W Hotel is planned. The wherever is University Towne Center.

The first W, which opened in the Marina District near downtown in 2002, introduced hip to the local lodging market with its jazzy décor and rooftop patio bar, a concept that has since been copied by other downtown hotels.

Terzi confirmed in late May that Newport Beach developer Makar Properties LLC plans to build a new W that will have from 200 to 220 rooms.

Houston-based Hines, an international real estate firm whose resume includes Petco Park, is also building a 15-story, Class A office tower as part of what is being called La Jolla Commons — a multimillion-dollar mixed-use project that broke ground in mid-November. It is bordered by La Jolla Village Drive, Executive Drive and the 805 freeway.

On May 30, a public relations representative with a firm representing Makar said that it hadn’t announced the new W Hotel because the contract between Starwood and Makar has not yet been signed. Officials of Makar did not return phone calls seeking comment.

However, Terzi said that base work construction had begun on the hotel and that details of the project, which includes some top-floor residential condos, were being finalized.

“We fully expect to open a new W in the latter part of 2009,” he said. He did not know the cost of construction or how many condos were planned.

Going Up North

While the bulk of the county’s hotel development has been centered in downtown and the Gaslamp Quarter in response to the demand for increased room inventory to feed demand from the 2.6-million-square-foot waterfront San Diego Convention Center, Terzi said UTC is as good or better a market than downtown.

The upscale UTC neighborhood that many refer to as the Golden Triangle includes a mix of biotech, technical, financial, educational and commercial firms.

“In terms of business, that market (UTC) is very strong because it does not have to rely on convention center business,” he said.

Conventions tend to be seasonal, sources say, with more taking place in the spring and fall and fewer in the summer. According to the latest report from the Los Angeles offices of PKF Consulting, a national firm that tracks the lodging industry, occupancy in UTC-area hotels averaged 80 percent in March, while room rates averaged $156 nightly. In downtown, occupancy stood at 82 percent during the year and room rates averaged $195.

Carl Winston, director of San Diego State University’s Tourism and Hospitality School, said the W “is a strong brand that will perform well in the UTC market.”

“I think Starwood, which includes the Sheraton, Four Points, Westin and Luxury Collection brands, is underrepresented north of Interstate 8 up to the Orange County line,” he said.

He added that the UTC area is “a wonderful example of a high-end suburban and lodging market.”

“I liken it to Orange County around the John Wayne Airport,” he said.

No Occupancy Report

The W San Diego does not report occupancy. Its Web site advertised a rate of $349 for a room for two with two double beds for Saturday, June 2.

When the 258-room W San Diego changed hands a little more than a year ago, neither the seller, Kennedy Associates Real Estate Counsel Inc. of Seattle, nor the buyer, San Clemente-based Sunstone Hotel Investors Inc., a real estate investment trust, cited the price. But a report by Atlas Hospitality Group, an Irvine brokerage, placed it at $96 million, or $375,000 per room, as opposed to the county’s 2006 sales average of about $143,000 per room.

Kennedy Associates had arranged the purchase and renovation of the property formerly known as the Old Columbia Square for $62 million for a group of labor union pension funds.

Starwood has W Hotels worldwide. According to its Web site, the company counts 18 in North America, including five in New York City, two in Chicago and two in New Orleans. Los Angeles and San Francisco each have one. Aside from the second San Diego W, others that are planned or are under construction in the United States are in Fort Lauderdale, Fla.; Hoboken, N.J.; Scottsdale, Ariz.; and Miami’s South Beach.
I think the writer of thie piece is biased toward UTC. I got that impression even before I read...
While the bulk of the county’s hotel development has been centered in downtown and the Gaslamp Quarter in response to the demand for increased room inventory to feed demand from the 2.6-million-square-foot waterfront San Diego Convention Center, Terzi said UTC is as good or better a market than downtown.

then 3 paragraphs later...

"... occupancy in UTC-area hotels averaged 80 percent in March, while room rates averaged $156 nightly. In downtown, occupancy stood at 82 percent during the year and room rates averaged $195."

What point is being made? Because it's lost on me.

If demand for UTC hotels is year round, how could March hotel figures be lower than year-round demand for downtown hotels ... and still be considered stronger?

[eburress]

I guess the W is in, and Mandarin Oriental is out. Since we already have a W, I was really hoping for the latter -



Maybe I'm not reading this right, but it looks like this new W won't replace the Mandarin Oriental at La Jolla Commons. It looks like it's instead going to be at UTC (i.e., the mall), I assume as part of it's reconstruction.

Is that what the rest of you read?


In any case, that's kind of exciting. I wonder if it will include a trendy new bar (there's hardly anywhere good to go up in this part of town).

[eburress]

What point is being made? Because it's lost on me.

If demand for UTC hotels is year round, how could March hotel figures be lower than year-round demand for downtown hotels ... and still be considered stronger?

I think the point is that a new W is being built in UTC. The writer didn't say UTC was as good or better than downtown...Terzi did.

"Terzi said UTC is as good or better a market than downtown"


If anything, the writer is pointing out the inaccuracy of Terzi's quote.

[bmfarley]

I think the point is that a new W is being built in UTC. The writer didn't say UTC was as good or better than downtown...Terzi did.

"Terzi said UTC is as good or better a market than downtown"


If anything, the writer is pointing out the inaccuracy of Terzi's quote.
Alright... I'll give that to you. howdver, I felt the writer had some long-winded sentences prior to that section that seemed to try to pump up UTC. Maybe the writer is a high school intern or just graduated from school and is learning on the job.

[eburress]

^^ Between us, UTC seems like kind of an odd spot for a trendy hotel like a W (especially considering that part of UTC is closer to Miramar than it is to La Jolla) but I really didn't detect a pro-UTC bias from the writer when I read the article. I'm still trying to figure out if this W is going to be built in La Jolla Commons or if it's going to be part of the redeveloped UTC mall, so that shows you what I know! hahaha

[ShekelPop]

^^ Between us, UTC seems like kind of an odd spot for a trendy hotel like a W (especially considering that part of UTC is closer to Miramar than it is to La Jolla) but I really didn't detect a pro-UTC bias from the writer when I read the article. I'm still trying to figure out if this W is going to be built in La Jolla Commons or if it's going to be part of the redeveloped UTC mall, so that shows you what I know! hahaha

First, E, I was trying to find an answer to your question and I realized after a few minutes its in the subheading of the Article's title:
"Project to Be Part of Mixed-Use Development Now Under Way"

So ya, it seems the W is in the Commons project.

[Marina_Guy]

Here you go...

http://www.sddt.com/images/news/2007/05/30/story_7th-and-Market.jpg

I think, before you all pass judgement on this one, you should ask for more renderings. Call CCDC. I went to the design review meeting for this project. It is awesome. It contains a public parking garage, a high end hotel, ultra luxury APARTMENTS, a police store front, a cultural space, and room for a 10 to 20k square foot grocery store. The architect is Carrier Johnson. I think if you saw other renderings you would appreciate the top more. There are also a series of green roofs as well.

I look forward to the Related Companies doing a 1st class job in San Diego.

One other note, you all have excellent comments about new buildings why don't you go to the CCDC design review meetings and comment? Rarely does the public show up for these meetings. I think much more public comment would be appreciated.

[PadreHomer]

I really don't see a problem with the top of the building as it is in that rendering. I think it is both unique and attractive.

[eburress]

I think, before you all pass judgement on this one, you should ask for more renderings. Call CCDC. I went to the design review meeting for this project. It is awesome. It contains a public parking garage, a high end hotel, ultra luxury APARTMENTS, a police store front, a cultural space, and room for a 10 to 20k square foot grocery store. The architect is Carrier Johnson. I think if saw other renderings you would appreciate the top more. There are also a series of green roofs as well.

I look forward to the Related Companies doing a 1st class job in San Diego.

One other note, you all have excellent comments about new building,s why don't you go to design review meetings and comment? Rarely does the public show up for these meetings. I think much more public comment would be appreciated.

Somebody who's aware of when and where these reviews are going to take place should post the info here. Speaking for myself, I couldn't go to every design review, but I would like to go to some.

[HurricaneHugo]

Wait a minute, La Jolla Commons is only 15-stories tall?

I thought it was taller...

[eburress]

Wait a minute, La Jolla Commons is only 15-stories tall?

I thought it was taller...

The first tower (the office tower currently under construction) is 15 stories. The hotel and residential towers are much taller.

Speaking of which, that 15 story office tower has been stuck on floor #8 for a while now.

[SD_Phil]

^Yep. It hasn't changed for at least 2-3 weeks, at all as far I can tell. Not only in terms of getting taller but no development whatsoever. What's up with that?

It almost looks like they framed up 8 floors and then started working on the highrise behind it (which has seen progress). Weird.

[eburress]

^^ at least someone's working on something, although I believe that thing directly behind the office building is the development's parking garage.

[PadreHomer]

FAA restrictions ;)

[sandiegodweller]

FAA restrictions ;)
I know that you are being funny but the land planning for that site was affected by the Miramar flight path

[sandiego_urban]

Between us, UTC seems like kind of an odd spot for a trendy hotel like a W (especially considering that part of UTC is closer to Miramar than it is to La Jolla)
Have you been to PF Chang's and Japengo on a weekend night? It's basically the Gaslamp Lite. With Del Mar, La Jolla, UTC and UCSD nearby, I'm sure it will be a destination in itself. There's definitely a market for this type of hotel in the area.


I'm still trying to figure out if this W is going to be built in La Jolla Commons or if it's going to be part of the redeveloped UTC mall, so that shows you what I know! hahaha
As ShekelPop said, it will be part of La Jolla Commons. The posted article mentions Makar, who is the developer of the project.


I think, before you all pass judgement on this one, you should ask for more renderings. Call CCDC. I went to the design review meeting for this project. It is awesome. It contains a public parking garage, a high end hotel, ultra luxury APARTMENTS, a police store front, a cultural space, and room for a 10 to 20k square foot grocery store. The architect is Carrier Johnson. I think if you saw other renderings you would appreciate the top more. There are also a series of green roofs as well.

I look forward to the Related Companies doing a 1st class job in San Diego.
Sounds great! I saw a much larger rendering of the project that's been posted here in print and it looks pretty nice. I'll try to scan it and post it here since it shows more detail of the base. This proposal seems to take the phrase "mixed-use" to the extreme. Is there anything that this block won't have? ;) Did CCDC happen to present the other proposal for the same block that wasn't selected?

FYI - Related Companies http://www.related.com/index.asp?model=homeRelated&view=1&companyid=7 also did the Time Warner Center in NYC, which gives this project a pretty good chance of happening. :tup:

One other note, you all have excellent comments about new buildings why don't you go to the CCDC design review meetings and comment? Rarely does the public show up for these meetings. I think much more public comment would be appreciated.
What time do these meetings usually take place? I'm sure it's during the regular workday, right?

The first tower (the office tower currently under construction) is 15 stories. The hotel and residential towers are much taller.

La Jolla Commons
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ljcommonsgq2.jpg

[keg92101]

Have you been to PF Chang's and Japengo on a weekend night? It's basically the Gaslamp Lite. With Del Mar, La Jolla, UTC and UCSD nearby, I'm sure it will be a destination in itself. There's definitely a market for this type of hotel in the area.



As ShekelPop said, it will be part of La Jolla Commons. The posted article mentions Makar, who is the developer of the project.

La Jolla Commons
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ljcommonsgq2.jpg

Man, nothing kills this thread faster than UTC talk...

[Marina_Guy]

Man, nothing kills this thread faster than UTC talk...

So true. UTC is such a wasteland. But, unfortunately?, it is one of the major employment centers of the region. And I think Westfield is going to upgrade UTC before Horton Plaza.

Any thoughts on the state of Horton Plaza these days? I have many :stunned:

[SDCAL]

So true. UTC is such a wasteland. But, unfortunately?, it is one of the major employment centers of the region. And I think Westfield is going to upgrade UTC before Horton Plaza.

Any thoughts on the state of Horton Plaza these days? I have many :stunned:

I like the interior of horton plaza but the exterior really needs to be updated. It is very 80s looking to me. Not sure how or what could be done, but it really is kind of an eyesore from the exterior despite it's vital central location - :(

[ShekelPop]

I like the interior of horton plaza but the exterior really needs to be updated. It is very 80s looking to me. Not sure how or what could be done, but it really is kind of an eyesore from the exterior despite it's vital central location - :(

I basically agree. I know they have farmers markets on the public plaza facing broadway and I know theyre currently looking for a tenant for the space where Planet Hollywood used to be (or unless something is going on there now that I'm unaware of), but I'd love to see that whole broadway frontage space in front of Horton to be turned into a much nicer public space. Its just completely dead to me. I think that space could definitely benefit from some renovation. I guess what I'm picturing is something like a Union Square (NYC) but with the ability to sit down, or some other type of public Piazza.

[Marina_Guy]

I basically agree. I know they have farmers markets on the public plaza facing broadway and I know theyre currently looking for a tenant for the space where Planet Hollywood used to be (or unless something is going on there now that I'm unaware of), but I'd love to see that whole broadway frontage space in front of Horton to be turned into a much nicer public space. Its just completely dead to me. I think that space could definitely benefit from some renovation. I guess what I'm picturing is something like a Union Square (NYC) but with the ability to sit down, or some other type of public Piazza.

The old Planet Hollywood (and if you can remember way back (Robinson's department store) is rumored to be demolished. An office building with retail will take its place. Someone should adopt Horton Plaza park soon. Get some retail to front it and turn it into something like Union Square in SF. As for the rest of the mall, I will wait to hear more comments before I give mine!

[Derek]

I like the mall. But its soooooo boring on the outside. Stucco walls with virtually nothing appealing. Put some windows in the shops or something.

[MagnumMike]

I am a Phoenix native, I don't live in San Diego, but I was there this past week and I enjoyed the visit. Yeah, I was one of those "Zonies" driving around town.

I was also impressed with everything that was done with your downtown and all of the cranes you have on different sites. Looks like things get done pretty fast in your town, unlike here! Many plans have been drawn for office, residential and mixed use tall structures, some would have been 52 stories tall, but unfortunately, only a few of those buildings become reality.

I took a few pictures of the progress that's currently going on in your downtown when I was on the deck of the USS Midway.

http://www.members.cox.net/mss292/DownTownSanDiego1.jpg
http://www.members.cox.net/mss292/DownTownSanDiego2.jpg

[keg92101]

The old Planet Hollywood (and if you can remember way back (Robinson's department store) is rumored to be demolished. An office building with retail will take its place. Someone should adopt Horton Plaza park soon. Get some retail to front it and turn it into something like Union Square in SF. As for the rest of the mall, I will wait to hear more comments before I give mine!

Horton Plaza is a dump! I hate that place. I'm tired of John Jerde's "experience of getting lost and trying to figure out how to get out"!!! The entire site, (less the Balboa Theatre) needs to be razed and the grid system brought back to connect the Marina District with the Gaslamp quarter. I think that it has served it's purpose being the ultimate catylist that started the entire re-development in downtown, and Westfield should begin demolishing it in phases in order to get a higher and better use from the site (which I heard they want to do a High-rise at the old Planet Hollywood lot).

[SDPhil]

Since I live in the Marina District, I have a different perspective on Horton Plaza. Most of us have no problem being separated from the Gaslamp. We know where it is, but we don't necessarily want to live in it.I do agree the park out front is a pit, it's basically a homeless hangout. Revamping the front is not a bad idea, just not sure what you could put in there. One thing that would help the back is the proposed Mandarin Hotel. With some decent venues street level, that would have the effect of extending the Gaslamp westward.

[SDCAL]

Since I live in the Marina District, I have a different perspective on Horton Plaza. Most of us have no problem being separated from the Gaslamp. We know where it is, but we don't necessarily want to live in it.I do agree the park out front is a pit, it's basically a homeless hangout. Revamping the front is not a bad idea, just not sure what you could put in there. One thing that would help the back is the proposed Mandarin Hotel. With some decent venues street level, that would have the effect of extending the Gaslamp westward.

proposed Mandarin Hotel
??

haven't heard of this, a Mandarin-Oriental Hotel??? What are the details of this proposal :)

[eburress]

^^ Wasn't that going to be the Hotel Intercontinental? I never heard about a Mandarin Oriental there.

[Derek]

Yes, it is an Intercontinental Hotel and it is (or was) supposed to go on the site of the large parking garage I believe. Though a Mandarin Oriental would be nice. ;)

[sandiego_urban]

Thanks for posting the pics MagnumMike! Glad you enjoyed your visit :)

Any thoughts on the state of Horton Plaza these days? I have many :stunned:
I'm with everyone else who thinks that Horton Plaza needs to be reinvented. For one, it's tenant mix needs to be updated to reflect downtown's growing residential population, while at the same time, retaining it's appeal to both tourists and locals.

The biggest issue with me is the the exterior of the mall. As it is now, everything faces inward, instead of towards the surrounding streets. I realize that when it was built over 20 years ago, downtown wasn't what it is today. I'm for blowing up the exterior and making more entrances into the mall from every street, as well as lining the exterior with shops and businesses.

Another area that needs to be addressed is the frontage along Horton Plaza Park. I'm liking the suggestions already made to turn it into something like Union Square in SF. A weekly farmers Market there would be cool, too.


Yes, it is an Intercontinental Hotel and it is (or was) supposed to go on the site of the large parking garage I believe.
I guess no one recalls that the latest proposal is for a Regent International http://www.regenthotels.com/reg/home/index.html to be built there. Like Mandarin, it's a pretty exclusive brand that originated in Asia.

I was able to find the article that was released early last year -



Posh Horton Hotel shoots for the stars: lots of room for a Downtown luxury property, some say.


The owner of a San Diego-based firm that plans to build a hotel touted as the first step in the upgrade and renovation of Westfield Horton Plaza says it will be Downtown's first "true" luxury lodging facility.

Michael Gallegos, the president and chief executive officer of La Jolla-based American Property Management, which owns and operates some 43 hotels nationwide, confirmed his company plans to spend $120 million to build a 350-room, 38-story property that will carry the Regent International Hotels brand. That tab includes only the price of building the hotel. The land would be leased from Horton Plaza.

Minneapolis-based Regent, which has eight hotels, includes one in Beverly Hills and the remainder abroad. At least six are under development in the United States and abroad. The company is owned by Carlson Hospitality Worldwide of Minneapolis.

"It will be the most extraordinary hotel Downtown San Diego has ever seen," Gallegos said.

Aiming for the Mobil 5-Star rating, arguably the highest and most stringent...

[Derek]

^Thanks for the info on the Regents! I totally agree with you about the multiple entrances and placing businesses on the street as well.

[SDCAL]

Excellent, a Regent downtown would be very nice. Both Mandarin-Oriental and Regent are much higher-end than Intercontinental. Hopefully this one will get off the ground one of these years!!!

Mandarin-Oriental has an existing location in SF and they are going to be building a very cool hotel-condo tower in LA's Grand Avenue project downtown, a multi-faceted project aimed at making downtown LA more of an urban core.

It sounds from earlier posts like the W is going into LJ Commons instead of Mandarin-Oriental, maybe they have decided not to join the SD market yet since they are building a lanmark hotel in LA?

Anyhow, I really do think a big 5-star chain would do well downtown because it will fill a market that is becoming increasingly needed downtown. Right now the US Grant seems to be the only ultra-high-end hotel that makes national 5 star rankings. It must really be something on the inside because I never thought the exterior was anything too special. I mean it is a cool historic building but I would not peg it as being downtown's best and most luxurious hotel from the outside, especially with the eyesore or 80s revival Horton Plaza facade across the street!!

[SDCAL]

http://www.regenthotels.com/reg/home/index.html

Am I seeing things or does this map have some kind of white mark where San Diego is?? Strange, maybe I am hallucinating

Look at their most recent project in Bangkok, the buildings look cool. They even have the sail-like tops but not in a hideous way :)

[eburress]

I think the mall should be re-built in a way that extends the surrounding streets through the property as pedestrian-only avenues (almost like Disneyland or CA Adventure), blurring the lines between the mall and downtown. As part of the reconstruction, shops and stores would be added around the "mall's" perimeter, and residential and commercial areas would be added to the upper floors (parking would be on the interior of each block).

[Derek]

^Like Santa Monica's Third Street Promenade.

[Derek]

http://www.regenthotels.com/reg/home/index.html

Am I seeing things or does this map have some kind of white mark where San Diego is?? Strange, maybe I am hallucinating

Look at their most recent project in Bangkok, the buildings look cool. They even have the sail-like tops but not in a hideous way :)

That is strange. We should ask them about that!

[stockjock]

Another area that needs to be addressed is the frontage along Horton Plaza Park. I'm liking the suggestions already made to turn it into something like Union Square in SF. A weekly farmers Market there would be cool, too.[/I]

FYI, there is a farmer's market at Horton Plaza each Thursday.

[mongoXZ]

Random Project updates. . .

See 'em while they're hot! I'm too lazy to save them on my imageshack page.:)

Aria
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_evillage1_camera1/imgbuf/buf_3623/1181651464597188.jpg

Vantage Pointe
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_evillage1_camera1/imgbuf/buf_3623/1181651464597448.jpg

Smart Corner
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_evillage1_camera1/imgbuf/buf_3623/1181651464599290.jpg

Hilton
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_1apne_camera1/imgbuf/buf_2439/1181651464597675.jpg

Legend
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_1apne_camera1/imgbuf/buf_2439/1181651464597745.jpg


Columbia Crane Cluster (Bayside Bosa, Sapphire, Breeza)
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_1amnorth_camera1/imgbuf/buf_5983/1181651464598182.jpg

Electra
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_1apsw_camera1/imgbuf/buf_4408/1181651464598735.jpg

Random Shots

Ballpark Cluster
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_coronado_camera1/imgbuf/buf_574/1181651464598518.jpg

Marina/Coronado Bridge
http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_1apsw_camera1/imgbuf/buf_4408/1181651464598858.jpg

http://live6.truelook.com/timages/live6/ecodb/ecodb_1apsw_camera1/imgbuf/buf_4408/1181651464599031.jpg

[Derek]

Thanks for those! :)


Brake Depot must die!

[HurricaneHugo]

Soon enough...

[bushman61988]

Wow, Aria is looking really nice.

I'm also shocked by how fast Vantage Point is going up, considering it took forever just to build the freakin Parking Garage.

But my concern is with that Hilton...
Does no one else see this as the ugliest, boxiest tower that they could have possibly put on the bayfront? What are the nice parts of this tower?

[Derek]

I like the Hilton. I don't know why. It isn't the most exciting design ever, but it isn't boring or ugly in my opinion.

[bmfarley]

I like the Hilton. I don't know why. It isn't the most exciting design ever, but it isn't boring or ugly in my opinion.
In my opinion, the ugliest tower in downtown, on the waterfront or not, is the Manchester Grand tower #1.... ; the first one built. Not the 2nd.

The 2nd ugliest is/are the Harbor Club towers.

The nicest looking tower to me... the Manchester Grands Tower #2... the one with the castle like roof. It is the west or north tower.

[sandiego_urban]

Here's an article from the SD Daily Transcript (May 31) regarding the proposal on Market St. Seems like a nice project, and if all goes well it could break ground within 18 months -


http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ev-2.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ev-3.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ev-4-1.jpg

[SDCAL]

In my opinion, the ugliest tower in downtown, on the waterfront or not, is the Manchester Grand tower #1.... ; the first one built. Not the 2nd.

The 2nd ugliest is/are the Harbor Club towers.

The nicest looking tower to me... the Manchester Grands Tower #2... the one with the castle like roof. It is the west or north tower.


Hahaha I actually have just the opposite oprinion. I like the first taller one, but hate the 2nd. The roof on the 2nd one just seems too big for the size, the first one looks decent at night

[eburress]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ev-2.jpg



^^ Speaking of bad roofs! :yuck:

[bushman61988]

Hahaha I actually have just the opposite oprinion. I like the first taller one, but hate the 2nd. The roof on the 2nd one just seems too big for the size, the first one looks decent at night

Yea, I agree. The 1st one DEFINITELY looks more pleasant at night.

And I actually don't feel that bad about the Harbor Club Towers, I think they look pretty unique...it's all just a matter of personal taste.

^^ Speaking of bad roofs! :yuck:

Yeah, I was a little disappointed by the close-up of this roof...i mean, I guess it is unique.. But i just kind of don't understand it...
I mean, is it glass, or what?

But it will look GREAT from the Ballpark!

[sandiego_urban]

Yeah, I was a little disappointed by the close-up of this roof...i mean, I guess it is unique.. But i just kind of don't understand it...I mean, is it glass, or what?
I'm sure it's glass, but I'm praying that it's not the highly reflective type that you see in the Dallas skyline. Talk about 80's design......

[mongoXZ]

I like the roof because it breaks free of that Vancouver-style flatness that's being repilcated all over our skyline.

BTW, what's the hell is a "police storefront" that they keep mentioning in this project?

[spoonman]

I'm probably alone here, but I like the 80's style roof. It's sort of residential halfway up, then commercial looking at the top. I'm guessing that was the intention.

If the building stood alone it would look weird that way, but the way it will fit into the skyline, I think it might look good for that area (which has a lot of residential looking buildings). Funny thing is that it reminds me of New York-New York in Las Vegas.

[spoonman]

I like the roof because it breaks free of that Vancouver-style flatness that's being repilcated all over our skyline.

BTW, what's the hell is a "police storefront" that they keep mentioning in this project?

A police storefront is basically a junior sized police sub-station.

[spoonman]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/Jaygergon/downtown%20development%203/ev-2.jpg
http://www.radicalextremesportscars.com/usa/us_news_2004/radical_west_news_march05/020.jpg

[bushman61988]

I'm probably alone here, but I like the 80's style roof. It's sort of residential halfway up, then commercial looking at the top. I'm guessing that was the intention.

If the building stood alone it would look weird that way, but the way it will fit into the skyline, I think it might look good for that area (which has a lot of residential looking buildings). Funny thing is that it reminds me of New York-New York in Las Vegas.


No, ur definitely not alone, cuz I like the rooftop as well, because it's so's different than those damn flat, boxy Vancouver roofs. But the more I look at it, it looks as if it's not really a pinnacle-type top that I was expecting, but more slanted like The Mark..
Damn Lazy-Ass architects.


I think this building in these renderings look more like Icon than anything from New York New York.

[sandiegodweller]

Marriott To Develop Boutique Hotels With Ian Schrager

June 14, 2007: 04:01 PM EST


NEW YORK (Dow Jones) -- Hotel operator Marriott International Inc. said Thursday that it has inked a partnership with boutique-hotel pioneer Ian Schrager to create a new brand of up to 100 "lifestyle" hotels.

The venture will attempt to combine the individualized service of Schrager's boutique hotels with Marriott's (MAR) operational and global scale.

Schrager, originally known for running the infamous disco and nightclub Studio 54, has become a hotel mogul, developing trendy lodging destinations in New York, London, Miami and other cities. He's also been involved in residential and mixed-use developments.

Marriott has a market capitalization of about $17.8 billion and operates such staid brands as Renaissance Hotels, Residence Inn, Courtyard by Marriott and TownePlace Suites. It also operates the high-end Ritz-Carlton hotels.

"Nobody has done what Ian has been able to do with his hotels time and again, and he is the perfect partner to help us create and launch a new, modern genre of hotel," said J.W. Marriott Jr., chairman and chief executive of Marriott International. "These hotels will be an excellent complement to the Marriott portfolio of brands and allow us to use our global platform and ability to execute to create something completely new, different and original."

The hotels, which are still unnamed, will be located in "gateway" cities across North and South America, Europe and Asia. The initial list of markets to be explored includes New York, Miami, Los Angeles, Chicago, San Francisco, San Diego, Boston and Las Vegas in the U.S.; London, Paris, Berlin, Frankfurt, Madrid, Barcelona, Milan and Rome in Europe; and Beijing, Shanghai, Singapore, Bangkok, Seoul and Tokyo in Asia, Marriott said.

The hotels will have about 150 to 200 rooms and be designed by a "diverse set of world-renowned architects and designers," Marriott said. The partners said they expect these hotels to be "the most environmentally responsible" lodging options as well.

"In our view, this growth plan utilizes Marriott's strengths in hotel development and management," Merrill Lynch analyst Amanda Bryant told clients. She said the plan will give the brand a "fairly sizeable presence and a nice complement to the other brands within the portfolio."

The partners will divide responsibilities for rolling out the brand, with Schrager leading the effort on concept, design, marketing, branding and food and beverages. Marriott will oversee the development process and operate and manage the completed hotels.

In particular, Marriott will use its relationships in the development community to identify potential participants in various markets. The partners said they expect to have at least five firm development deals signed under the new brand by the end of 2007 and 100 hotels open or in the pipeline within a decade.

[eburress]

I like the roof because it breaks free of that Vancouver-style flatness that's being repilcated all over our skyline.


I'll give you that - it seems like almost all of the buildings in that part of town are so boxy, which is partly why I was so excited about Cosmo. :(

I don't care for the roof at all though, but I didn't like the Pei/Cobb tower at first either. After seeing the videos and other renderings, it has started to grow on me.

[Derek]

So is Cosmo Square completely dead?

[spoonman]

I had forgotten about Pei Cobb Tower. Does anyone recall when the groundbreaking is?

[spoonman]

So is Cosmo Square completely dead?

I think we would all be speculating at this point. My guess is that it may reappear when the market picks up.

[Derek]

^I had the same thought that it may come up again when the market picks up.

[CoastersBolts]

Speaking of the Pei Cobb Tower, someone mentioned they saw an artists rendering video of it. Where could I locate that? Thanks.

[Derek]

^^^

http://www.700westbroadway.com

[mello]

Right now I will take anything with some real height (over 400 feet) in that part of town. Now that Cosmo and Library Tower are on hold at least this will bring something with a presence to the Gaslamp/Western East Village.

The Mark is ok but not quite tall enough to make a *big impact* if you know what I mean, I wish the Mark could have been 44 floors like Electra.

Everyone here should go check out the Marsielle proposals thread and look at all the cool and at least different kind of architecture they have in their proposals, makes all of our stuff look so bland:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=130524
I wish we could get some stuff like that. :rolleyes:

[Derek]

The Mark came out a lot more bland than I thought it would. The entire concrete column on the backside of the building stands out like a sore thumb!

[HurricaneHugo]

I had forgotten about Pei Cobb Tower. Does anyone recall when the groundbreaking is?

Hopefully after a redesign.

[PadreHomer]

Hopefully after a redesign.
I wouldn't expect anything great and unusual from the Irvine Company, no matter who the architect is.

[stockjock]

Looks like KB Homes has backed out of 10th & B and it could now be 23 stories of low-income housing:

http://www.ccdc.com/events/resources/Item%2010%20-%2010th%20&%20B.pdf

[sandiegodweller]

Looks like KB Homes has backed out of 10th & B and it could now be 23 stories of low-income housing:

http://www.ccdc.com/events/resources/Item%2010%20-%2010th%20&%20B.pdf


Why take out the Burger King? It appears that it is already a low income housing project.

[Derek]

^LOL!

Good for KB Homes though. :)

[eburress]

THIS is what needs to get built over near the ballpark.

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/samclark/dallas/museum_1.jpg

Like I've said before, that part of town needs more curves (not boxy "towers" with lame '80s roofs)!

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showpost.php?p=2898843&postcount=1437

[mello]

Yeah I agree eburress, it is a shame to see these gorgeous towers that other cities are getting and we are stuck with "The Legend" ha my ass, and Vantage Pointe type of schlock architecture :yuck:

We need something bold and striking in out skyline, something to refresh it. Say that building right there -- Museum Tower in Dallas-- built at say 650ft. would be a really nice signature tower in our skyline if it were built at 7th and Market.

That location is FAR away from the flight path and would be a great spot to put a stunning 650 to 700 foot signature tower in SD's skyline to give it a focal point which it so desperately needs.

Example look at how much better Brisbanes skyline is now that it has two 700 foot plus towers sticking out of its dense cluster of 500 footers....

[HurricaneHugo]

for a second there i thought that was proposed here....

...then my dreams were horribly crushed =(

[spoonman]

That tower seems like Cosmo's style mixed with Electra's height...I love it:tup:

PS: That area around that tower makes me feel less bad about Pantoja Park and it's low-rise neighborhood

[eburress]

^^ Oh sorry - I didn't mean to get anyone's hopes up! :)

Speaking of towers in Texas, I just got back from a trip to Dallas and Austin, and both cities have a number of really spectacular 500ft+ buildings going up. I'm excited for them but it makes me very sad that the same thing will never happen in San Diego.

[eburress]

That tower seems like Cosmo's style mixed with Electra's height...I love it:tup:

PS: That area around that tower makes me feel less bad about Pantoja Park and it's low-rise neighborhood

That park in the foreground is a perfect example of something that would be great for San Diego. It is going to be built over a sunken portion of Woodall Rogers freeway.

Edit -> Museum Tower will be 560ft, so it's actually a little taller than Electra's height.

[mello]

I just wanted to post this shot because I think it pertains to our
discussion of San Diego "breaking through" the 500 foot barrier.
Up until 2005 Brisbane's skyline was quite similar to ours, it had
good density but no towers taller then 550 feet. Now here it is with
a 620 footer and a 750 footer.

I think Brisbane is also a good skyline to compare to San Diego because
of the similar massing and bulk of skyline plus many residential towers
are prominent in this city just like ours. A good percentage of their high
rises are residential compared to many cities that are mostly office.
So take a look: scroll >>>>> Sorry I didn't think it would post so big!

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/b/b3/BrisbaneSkylineFromEast15Oct06.JPG:cheers:

I'll try to resize ;)

[eburress]

^^ That is a very nice skyline and those new towers certainly add to its appeal. Obviously some strategically-placed skyscrapers in downtown SD would do a lot for our skyline, but like I said before though, it's too bad it will never happen.

[HurricaneHugo]

ours is still better

[mello]

^^^ I know you and I have been around the forums for quite some time so you probably are familiar with the Brisbane skyline and seen it from different angles. I for one have checked it out a lot (along with all the cities in OZ) because I was thinking about moving to that country.

So if you honestly think our skyline is better then I am surprised but of course respect your opinion. That pic isn't the best Brisbane angle and surely isn't a "glamour shot" really showing off the skyline, I just used it to show the bulk and massing of the city.

[SDCAL]

^^ That is a very nice skyline and those new towers certainly add to its appeal. Obviously some strategically-placed skyscrapers in downtown SD would do a lot for our skyline, but like I said before though, it's too bad it will never happen.

It will happen, it just won't be anytime soon. Maybe by 2030 or something when other cities are building structures we can't even imagine right now, SD will allow things to go up to 600 ft, yippie

[Derek]

I say by atleast 2020.

[eburress]

It will happen, it just won't be anytime soon. Maybe by 2030 or something when other cities are building structures we can't even imagine right now, SD will allow things to go up to 600 ft, yippie

hahaha...how depressingly optimistic! In 20 years we'll have buildings that are slightly taller than the ones we have now. Yayyyy!

[spoonman]

I posted some info about La Jolla Commons under the projects & construction heading. As many of you know, there are others under Vantage Point, Electra, etc. If you have anything to contribute to those, be my guest as it would be nice to "dust them off"

[Derek]

Speaking of NBC, does anybody have any proposed start dates? Or are the drawings still not up to par?

[SDCAL]

Speaking of NBC, does anybody have any proposed start dates? Or are the drawings still not up to par?

It may be held up in legal issues. I found this article from the 15th of june:

SAN DIEGO -- A proposed waterfront development on San Diego Bay has generated complaints, lawsuits and concerns about public safety.

The 10News Investigation team heard these complaints and began researching and talking to experts over the past six months. We were spurred on when we learned that the ground underneath the Broadway Navy Complex is similar in some ways to the ground under the Marina District in San Francisco. That area was devastated during the 1989 earthquake.

This report will be considered controversial but there is no controversy when it comes to the extent of damage that can occur when a earthquake hits hard.


"The ground moves 5, 10, 20 feet pulling buildings apart," said Professor Scott Ashford of UCSD School of Engineering.

Some fear the same could happen in San Diego along the downtown waterfront if developers are allowed to build the high rise Navy Broadway Complex.

There are claims that an active earthquake fault may be right under the proposed waterfront project being proposed by developer Doug Manchester.

Here is what we found:

The recently discovered Coronado Fault was active as recently as 500 years ago. It runs under Coronado and San Diego Bay and comes ashore in San Diego near Seaport Village, just south of the proposed complex. Any fault that has had movement in the past 10,000 years is considered an active fault. This Coronado Fault clearly qualifies as active.

"You want to know where it is, what it's capable of and how often it will generate earthquakes that will be a problem to your structure," said Ashford.


A map created in 1859 shows the bay before it was dredged and widened.

More importantly to the 10News investigation, it shows the areas where fill was used to eventually create San Diego's waterfront. Like in San Francisco's Marine District, that fill can cause trouble.

The trouble is liquefaction, which turns the ground into quicksand and can rip foundations wide open.


Geocon are the seismic consultants hired by project developer Manchester. In the Geocon study, it says there geologists "Did not find signs of faulting at the site. It is suitable for the proposed development."

As part of the investigation, 10News had an independent geologist, Dr. Jeffrey Johnson, review the Geocon study.

His 10 page report for the 10News investigation team raises serious issues.

Read Assessment Part I and Assessment Part II.


Read Manchester's response to the seismic concerns.

Johnson said the geology study done for Manchester did not analyze enough data.

Geologist Michael Kennedy said he is also concerned.

Kennedy mapped and named the Coronado fault as part of a Caltrans safety study on the Coronado Bridge in 2001.

Kennedy told 10News "public safety makes it imperative that the exact location of these youthful faults be mapped onshore prior to any development."

Dr. Jeff Babcock at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography is mapping the Coronado fault with 3D technology.

Babcock has not plotted the fault on land yet, but he said he is sure it runs north, under the navy's project and probably where the Port Commission intends to build its new development, as well.

"I would be hard pressed to determine if it's capable of a magnitude seven like the Rose Canyon fault, but we don't know," said Babcock.

10News took these concerns and the geology report to Manchester and the Port Commission, since they're also building in the same area but we have received no responses to our request for an interview. We have offered them copies of the study the 10News I team developed with Dr. Johnson, but no responses yet.

10News then went to the mayor's office. While the mayor was unavailable to talk with us, we did speak to his public information officer.

"It's our understanding Manchester has done a preliminary study, and the navy is satisfied. They've had buildings there for close to 100 years," said mayor's spokesperson Fred Sainz.

Maybe, maybe not. An officer from the US Navy accompanied the 10News Investigative team when we reviewed the 3D maps being developed by Dr. Babcock.

Manchester's attorney sent a letter to the California Coastal Commission, saying Manchester is withdrawing his application for a permit, saying the law doesn't require one for the project.

[SDCAL]

^^^in addition to the earthquake controversy, i have heard there are some lawsuits being brought against the nbc proposal for unrelated reasons. i'll try to find the details............

[SDCAL]

anyone know anything about the library??? On the city's website if you go to the library section they act as though it's still going to be built. They sy completion date of '2009" and on the latest minutes from their meetings they said the proposal was sent to the State Library Commission in the last couple of months
They also make reference to some bond measure in the state senate that would allocate $1 billion in library grants, however if you read the fine points they only pay up to $30 million to a single project if it passes. The last I heard the libraries cost would be over $200 million and they only hve $80 million of it so far, $30 million more wouldn't cut it.

Just one other barren lot sitting in East Village with no action :slob: :yuck:

[Derek]

That earthquake shit is crap. (teehee)

The Marina district in San Francisco was so devasted because it sat on landfill, land dug up from bay excavations or something like that. That definitely is not the case in San Diego. San Diego isn't even located remotely close to a major fault. Besides, there are strict building regulations in place in the state of California to make buildings as earthquake proof as possible. I think they are built on special rollers or something, so the building sways with the ground, kind of like how bridges sway in the wind. I know they have to be able to withstand an earthquake of a 7.0 magnitude (think of the Transamerica Pyramid in San Francisco, it was built to withstand earthquakes stronger than 7.0 and swayed one foot back and forth for one minute in the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake, with a magnitude of 7.1, and suffered absolutely no architectural damage). San Diego will never get hit with an earthquake stronger than a 7.0.


As for the library, I really hope this eventually goes through. Downtown and all of the surrounding neighborhoods are in dire need of a new library. Downtown's current library sucks ass and is a hangout spot for homeless at night (and it smells like piss). This new library would serve thousands of people and is state of the art, providing resources that not everybody has in the neighborhoods on the outskirts of downtown.

[Derek]

Oh, does anybody have any Lane Field news as well?

[HurricaneHugo]

Does anybody have any news at all!

[mello]

^^^ Yeah I know this town is starting to lag a little bit. Lane Field, Ballpark Village, NBC, lets roll people get some shit going here. Not to mention the old police headquarters, north embarcadero..... I could go on and on.

[Derek]

NEVP is still a go from what I have heard. They are just waiting for Lane Field to commence construction.

[bmfarley]

Yep, that earthquake stuff sounds like crap. There are thousands of faults all across California with many in urban areas. It is something that just needs to be considered during the design phase. The Cal Berkeley football stadium is built right on top of one! And they intend to rebuild it right where it is.

And as for the SF Marina District... the Loma Prieta ruptured 100-150 miles away near Santa Cruz. The SF Marina District felt it because of the Bay Mud that it was built upon.... and 60 year old buildings and their foundations not built to todays standards. It was not because of the location of the fault.

So for that matter... any fault in the San Diego area capable of what Loma Prieta did... is also relevant. It's not just the one in our Marina District! And, as mentioned above, faults are dealt with with the design.

I would guesstimate that the fault in our Marina District will be dealt with by pilings being driven into the ground to provide a solid base for the foundation. The fault should certainly NOT be fatal to any project in our Marina District!

As an aside... there are hundreds of highway/freeway bridges, or rail line bridges crossing faults in California and across the world. they cannot be avoided.

[SDCAL]

^^^in addition to the earthquake controversy, i have heard there are some lawsuits being brought against the nbc proposal for unrelated reasons. i'll try to find the details............

OK, this article summarizes the other complaints about NBC

http://www.c3sandiego.org/BroadwayComplex.html

This is from Jan 07 and I am not sure how much of it is just people complaining or actual lawsuites filed that may delay or even kill construction

The two main complaints various groups have are :

(1) That the environmental impact report is outdated and incomplete; NBC developers are using a report from 1992 instead of doing a more current one

(2) That high-rises should be set back from the coastal area so as not to create a "wall" that makes a view from the bay one-dimensional instead of two-dimesional by having shorter buildings to the front and taller ones set back