[You Need A Thneed]

looking north with mcknight in the distance. this is where the road suddenly winds, why? to keep people focused on the road?


There's a curve in the road there so they didn't have to disturb an existing wetland in the area, IIRC. Also, it saved a bit of money, as they didn't have to build a detour road for McKnight for while construction was on going. (McKnight has a curve too)

[You Need A Thneed]

Harvest Hills/ Centre Street & Nose Hill Drive are going to be the only lights on the road.

And there's rumours going around that the Nose Hill Drive interchange might be announced by the Alberta Gov't soon. There will be no lights on the NE section, or the SE section which should start construction next year.

I suppose it should be mentioned that at the time of opening in November, there will also still be lights at Crowchild trail, since the opening date was pushed back due to the LRT extention project over Stoney. But we at least know that that one will be done soon enough. The other ones we suspect will be started soon, but we don't have any official announcement yet.

[mersar]

Stoney Trail @ Tuscany/Scenic Acres
http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneytuscany-jun11-1.jpg

Due to how they paved it I'd bet we'll be driving over it in not too much longer.

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneytuscany-jun11-2.jpg
Further south

[mersar]

Looked like they've painted the lines on eastbound Stoney past Sarcee, nothing on west bound yet. They also put up the overhead signs on Sarcee, and unlike the ones on Stoney theres no 'closed' sticker stuck over top of the sign for eastbound Stoney.

[mersar]

Just noticed that there were some updates posted on the NW web page earlier this month. Not much to note in them (lists the 'todo' list as site cleanup and signage mostly), and repeats that Sarcee to Harvest Hills opens in July, and that Harvest Hills to Deerfoot will open with the NE in November as we'd speculated in the past.

[YYCguys]

^Oh, that's going to be splendid! As an Airdrionian moving to Royal Oak (I so would have prefered to move back to Bridgeland or to "eightwelve" on 14th AVE SW, places where I lived and loved, but...sigh...that is not to be) in the fall, this is going to make getting to the airport, where I work, a heck of a lot easier rather than battling the traffic and lights on either CHB or JLB!

[lubicon]

Looked like they've painted the lines on eastbound Stoney past Sarcee, nothing on west bound yet. They also put up the overhead signs on Sarcee, and unlike the ones on Stoney theres no 'closed' sticker stuck over top of the sign for eastbound Stoney.

Just noticed that there were some updates posted on the NW web page earlier this month. Not much to note in them (lists the 'todo' list as site cleanup and signage mostly), and repeats that Sarcee to Harvest Hills opens in July, and that Harvest Hills to Deerfoot will open with the NE in November as we'd speculated in the past.

Good news.

Took a drive up Shaganappi on Sunday and there were no lines painted on Stoney that I could see. That goes for both EB and WB Stoeny.

[mersar]

And a whole pile of numbers and details from the open house tonight:

Entire west ring road (Highway 1 to Highway 8) is about 8km, total cost $500M. This includes the interchanges at Highway 8, 17th Ave, Bow Trail, Old Banff Coach Road and the rest of the 16th Ave interchange, plus the second bridge over the river (4 lanes, roughly $150M was the estimate on that). So far the 16th Ave interchange has cost about $45M of the $150M it was budgeted at. The second bridge over the river is also a requirement to have completed prior to opening this leg according to the construction manager for Alberta Transportation who was there tonight.

The Nosehill interchange is still in the preliminary design phase, they are hoping that once Crowchild is open they'll be able to announce funding for it.

Tuscany/Scenic Acres will do a staged opening, traffic going over the bridge in August and the full thing open in October.

Crowchild likely will be fully open by next November, partially open probably late summer 2010. The city and the province did a joint tender on the bridge work so its all being done by one contractor for both the ramp bridges and the LRT bridges (the 2 ramp bridges for Crowchild and 1 for the LRT which cross the NB to WB off ramp, plus the SB to EB ramp over Crowchild). The NB to EB ramp will probably be moved 'soon', as its too close to the one bridge they need to dig out of the old Crowchild alignment. The other ramps, such as the WB to NB, are a possibility for next summer, I pointed out the huge congestion that the area is seeing and the person from AB transportation did agree that building that early would be a smart idea, but no idea of when it will actually be built.

In terms of the SW ring road, not much except for one person did ask about light rail running through it and the person from the province did indicate that there is definitely room for some form of rail, and he brought up the spur that was included in the WLRT long-term plan as a potential way it could be done.

And the overall numbers I found interesting: the budget for the ring road is approximately $1B per quadrant of the city, and its roughly 100km in length. Construction costs average roughly $25M/km including interchanges.

The current official completion date for the entire ring road, including the SW, is still 2015 (which they say is feasable, within a year or so, if they start building the west and SW as the SE wraps up completion in 2013)

[Wentworth]

And a whole pile of numbers and details from the open house tonight:
..
The current official completion date for the entire ring road, including the SW, is still 2015 (which they say is feasable, within a year or so, if they start building the west and SW as the SE wraps up completion in 2013)

Can't believe I forgot that open house was tonight! Were there any more specific details about the design of the west segment other than what has been previously published on their website? Or was it all about schedules and dollars?

[mersar]

Most of it was minor changes in terms of number of lanes at the various design stages (usually adding or removing a lane on the ramps), no alignment changes at all that I could see. The schedule/dollars was all just from asking questions myself and listening to what some others were asking.

[Wentworth]

Most of it was minor changes in terms of number of lanes at the various design stages (usually adding or removing a lane on the ramps), no alignment changes at all that I could see. The schedule/dollars was all just from asking questions myself and listening to what some others were asking.

Did they settle the intersection design at Old Banff? The last diagram I saw still showed 2 different options.

[MalcolmTucker]

I hope they figure out with the city where the LRT is going to go, and whether there should be a terminus and oversized P&R lot. Last time I saw an update, 17th Ave interchange only had access south. At least could put in bus access ramps to allow a tip to tip bus service.

[mersar]

I actually asked about the LRT over on that side, the view Alberta Transportation has is that its so far off in the future that it will cross Stoney (and where it likely will cross is quite a bit north of the 17th Ave interchange anyways due to the swing north at Aspen Woods) that they've not even included it in their planning so far. Technically according to the city Aspen Woods will be the terminus station in the long range, as no documents that I've seen, and it seemed that they've seen, show anything past it.

[lubicon]

And a whole pile of numbers and details from the open house tonight:

Entire west ring road (Highway 1 to Highway 8) is about 8km, total cost $500M. This includes the interchanges at Highway 8, 17th Ave, Bow Trail, Old Banff Coach Road and the rest of the 16th Ave interchange, plus the second bridge over the river (4 lanes, roughly $150M was the estimate on that). So far the 16th Ave interchange has cost about $45M of the $150M it was budgeted at. The second bridge over the river is also a requirement to have completed prior to opening this leg according to the construction manager for Alberta Transportation who was there tonight.

The Nosehill interchange is still in the preliminary design phase, they are hoping that once Crowchild is open they'll be able to announce funding for it.

Tuscany/Scenic Acres will do a staged opening, traffic going over the bridge in August and the full thing open in October.

Crowchild likely will be fully open by next November, partially open probably late summer 2010. The city and the province did a joint tender on the bridge work so its all being done by one contractor for both the ramp bridges and the LRT bridges (the 2 ramp bridges for Crowchild and 1 for the LRT which cross the NB to WB off ramp, plus the SB to EB ramp over Crowchild). The NB to EB ramp will probably be moved 'soon', as its too close to the one bridge they need to dig out of the old Crowchild alignment. The other ramps, such as the WB to NB, are a possibility for next summer, I pointed out the huge congestion that the area is seeing and the person from AB transportation did agree that building that early would be a smart idea, but no idea of when it will actually be built.

In terms of the SW ring road, not much except for one person did ask about light rail running through it and the person from the province did indicate that there is definitely room for some form of rail, and he brought up the spur that was included in the WLRT long-term plan as a potential way it could be done.

And the overall numbers I found interesting: the budget for the ring road is approximately $1B per quadrant of the city, and its roughly 100km in length. Construction costs average roughly $25M/km including interchanges.

The current official completion date for the entire ring road, including the SW, is still 2015 (which they say is feasable, within a year or so, if they start building the west and SW as the SE wraps up completion in 2013)

Speaking of this project, and adding to my rant of why the City and Province are really pissing me off with their piss poor infrastructure construction record, I noticed they have put up a few traffic signs along the soon to be re-aligned Tuscany Blvd. This is the portion that will swing the road south from its current alignment so that it can join up to the new interchagne. One of the lowlights was the 50km speed limit sign they have put up. This is a 34 lane divided road that does not run through any residential area at all, and only passes one exit into some condos. It is probably 1 km or more in length and the City has seen fit to put a ridicuously low speed limit on the road.

[You Need A Thneed]

Speaking of this project, and adding to my rant of why the City and Province are really pissing me off with their piss poor infrastructure construction record, I noticed they have put up a few traffic signs along the soon to be re-aligned Tuscany Blvd. This is the portion that will swing the road south from its current alignment so that it can join up to the new interchagne. One of the lowlights was the 50km speed limit sign they have put up. This is a 34 lane divided road that does not run through any residential area at all, and only passes one exit into some condos. It is probably 1 km or more in length and the City has seen fit to put a ridicuously low speed limit on the road.

Yeah that road seems to me that it should have about a 70 speed limit, as I'm sure that's what traffic will average driving on it anyway.

[craner]

And a whole pile of numbers and details from the open house tonight:

Thanks for the update mersar.;)

Question:
Is the interchange at the SE ring road and 17th Ave. SE being built as part of the NE segment or are they waiting for the SE leg ?

FYI (slightly OT)
There is an open house tonight at the Glenmore Inn on the Deerfoot / Glenmore interchange.

[mersar]

The interchange at 17th Ave SE will be done as part of the SE project.

[craner]

The interchange at 17th Ave SE will be done as part of the SE project.

Thanks - I had to assume that when I didn't see any signs of an interchange being built there yet. The SE leg construction start should be pretty seamless from the conclusion of the NE portion anyway.

[Wentworth]

I actually asked about the LRT over on that side, the view Alberta Transportation has is that its so far off in the future that it will cross Stoney (and where it likely will cross is quite a bit north of the 17th Ave interchange anyways due to the swing north at Aspen Woods) that they've not even included it in their planning so far. Technically according to the city Aspen Woods will be the terminus station in the long range, as no documents that I've seen, and it seemed that they've seen, show anything past it.

I can't really see it ever extending past 85th St (which is where it would make the most sense to build a P & R anyway.) If it went past 85th, you can see the right of way would go on the other side of the pond at 85th and then pass in front of Weber Academy... but there really isn't (and never will be) enough population past 85th to justify extending it e.g. up to Cougar Ridge.

On an unrelated note, I wonder if they've taken cyclists into account in the design of the 17th and Old Banff intersections. Don't laugh, there is quite heavy cyclist traffic there on the evenings and weekends as it is a popular touring route.

[mersar]

Lines are pretty much all painted on Stoney now, cut up Shaganappi then through Sherwood and back up Sarcee tonight, aside from a bit on the ramps at Shaganappi and on Shag and Sarcee themselves it looked to be pretty much done all the way to west of the Sarcee bridge.

[mersar]

Stoney @ Tuscany/Scenic Acres

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneytuscany-june22-1.jpg

[craner]

:previous: Is that Stoney going "over" Tuscany/SA ? (sorry - not that familiar with the configuration here).

[kap384]

:previous: Is that Stoney going "over" Tuscany/SA ? (sorry - not that familiar with the configuration here).

Yep
http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/Content/docType490/Production/stscenic-m2.pdf

http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/Content/docType490/Production/stscenic-m2.pdf

[You Need A Thneed]

The lines were all painted on Stoney both directions from Beddington Trail this afternoon. Looks like it could open soon. Most of the signage is up too, except for the ones on southbound Beddington.

[mersar]

Yep. Won't be long yet. Did you notice if they've got all the guard rails up along the ramps at Beddington? I can't recall if they were up yet last I was up there.

[You Need A Thneed]

Yep. Won't be long yet. Did you notice if they've got all the guard rails up along the ramps at Beddington? I can't recall if they were up yet last I was up there.

I'm pretty sure they are all up.

[mersar]

Yep, I took a look on my way to pickup my brother at the airport tonight and they looked to be all up. The lights on Beddington are flashing yellow as well and no longer covered up, so really won't be long yet.

[korzym]

new pics up for 3 interchanges at http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/804.htm

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/korzym/bedington.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/korzym/bedington2.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/korzym/sarceetrail.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/korzym/sarceetrail2.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/korzym/countryhills.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/korzym/countryhills2.jpg

[ksnaden]

I was riding my dirt bike tonight and the lines were up from Harvest Hills to Nose Creek EB. The ring road has been a fun place to ride around, it's going to be sad once it's open (for me riding), but going to Costco will be much easier from Coventry Hills.

[korzym]

First Nation votes on ring road deal
Last Updated: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 | 8:37 AM MT Comments0Recommend0
CBC News
The light blue trail is the proposed southwest portion for Calgary's ring road. The light blue trail is the proposed southwest portion for Calgary's ring road. (City of Calgary)

Members of the Tsuu T'ina First Nation vote Tuesday on a tentative deal with the province that would pave the way for a southwest Calgary ring road.

About 900 band members out of 1,500 residents are eligible to vote in the referendum that could change life on the reserve, and commuting in Calgary.

The controversial proposal would see the First Nation transfer 400 hectares of land, where the ring road would be built, to the province in exchange for $240 million and 2,000 hectares of Crown land on the northwest border of the reserve stretching west to the edge of Kananaskis Country.

The tentative deal was reached in March after decades of stops and starts in negotiations with the province. The stretch of land at issue is considered sacred and some of it contains burial grounds.

The southwest portion of the proposed road, which would run about 20 kilometres, is planned to start at an interchange at Sarcee Trail, Highway 8 and Glenmore Trial. The City of Calgary wants to see the road run though the First Nation's land from Glenmore Trail to 22X on the western edge of Calgary.
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/calgary/story/2009/06/30/calgary-first-nation-ring-road-tsuu-tina.html

[motion22]

The Beddington EB sign is up last night, it seems to me that they just need to hang the speed limit sign on light post, then everyone is ready to roll.

:haha:

[eggbert]

Tsuu T’ina First Nation members voted strongly against a proposed agreement Tuesday that would see the long-awaited southwest leg of Calgary’s ring road built through their reserve.

More than 60 per cent of voters were opposed to the deal.

Tsuu T’ina Chief Sandford Big Plume said the citizens have spoken and their wishes will be respected.

“The Nation will not enter into this agreement,” he said.

“This result reflects the passionate feelings Tsuu T’ina people have for their land. This was more than a simple economic transaction for us,” he said. “We consider our land to be a sacred trust.”

Mayor Dave Bronconnier said while the decision is “regrettable” the wishes of the voters must be respected.

“We were hoping for a different outcome to take on the transportation challenges this city faces,” he said. “But what we have here is a very clear result on a very clear question and although this is not the direction we wanted to head, we must respect the sanctity of the ballot box.”

Band council will ratify the votes on July 7 and members are expected to comment further at that time.

A spokesman for Alberta Transportation, a partner in the agreement, declined to comment on the vote result Tuesday.

“The votes won’t be official until council ratifies them so we have to wait for that,” said Trent Bancarz, who, earlier in the day said there were no other plans in place for that section and called the swath of land the “missing link in the ring road.”

Some see the ring road link as key to reducing congestion in the city’s southwest. But it’s been a controversial proposal from the beginning, with some Tsuu T’ina voicing early opposition to the sale of their land.

In March, the band council approved a draft of the agreement, but it had to be ratified by band members.

Tsuu T’ina spokesman Morten Paulsen said more than 700 people — or 78 per cent of eligible voters — cast ballots, with 38.5 per cent voting in favour of the agreement and 60.5 per cent opposed.

Although details of the proposal were not released to the general public, the Herald obtained documents showing the province was offering the Tsuu T’ina as much as $275 million — with a minimum $240 million held in trust by the federal government — in exchange for about 400 hectares to build the mammoth highway. It would slice through the east side of the reserve, bordering Calgary.

In addition, the band stood to gain nearly 2,000 hectares of Crown land on the reserve’s northwest edge.

Sources have also confirmed to the Herald that Tsuu T’ina’s overall share in the deal is worth close to $500 million, including cash payments, land transfers and infrastructure upgrades.

Chief Big Plume said in a news release following the vote that some citizens felt key elements of the proposal were unsatisfactory.

“The agreement did not guarantee that the Nation would receive additional reserve land,” he said. “Tsuu T’ina tried to solve that problem at the negotiating table. We regret that we were unable to do so.”

A city alderman said prior to the vote he doesn’t believe the proposed ring road is the answer to traffic woes in the southwest.

Brian Pincott worries about the cost to the city and said there are other solutions to traffic issues, including a commuter system that complements the LRT.

“Personally, I’m not convinced that it is the solution that everybody thinks it’s going to be,” he said.

Indeed, Bronconnier said late Tuesday that that chapter of the debate with Tsuu T’ina is closed.

“Given the result is clear that it’s time to think this through and work with the province to find another solution,” he said.

Earlier on Tuesday, there was a small protest near the Chief Joseph Big Plume building, where the vote was held.

Elliott Crowchild said he’s determined not to let the ring road be built through Tsuu T’ina land.

“I will go and stand up at the very end where they’re starting to build and put my life on the line,” he said. “They’ll have to kill me before this road goes through.”

dtetley@theherald.canwest.com

http://www.globaltv.com/globaltv/calgary/Tsuu+reject+ring+road+deal/1748512/story.html

I can't believe they rejected it!

[You Need A Thneed]

37th street tunnel, coming right up!

[WeavedWeb]

^That's exactly what Calgary needs, debate over TWO tunnels.:haha:

[korzym]

I agree its time we stop being a piggy bank for the native reserves, time for them to stand up on their own feet. If they insist on doing things their way, you know they have the freedom but they will have to endure the results of their decisions, hopefully the young generation will smarten up. What a big waste of time and resources, I guess we learned a lesson too. I think that casino is giving them a sense of independence

Two options at this point IMO.
Go ahead with the glenmore tunnel/bridge, or upgrade 14th street and Anderson. The NW has areas where their already building on the other side of the ring road, doing the 14th/Anderson upgrade would be treating them on the same level as those communities. Also macloed from glenmore to Anderson is awful. I think it would make sense if its the cheaper option, plus 14th and Anderson have plenty of unfunded intersections on the city budget to begin with.

I'm reading that the economy will be kicking butt in 2011-12 again from sources I pay good money for. That said, the province's revenue will be greater by then..costs are low now, might make sense to go into debt now if short on cash

[Slug]

Would having two tunnels cancel out the debate over two pedestrian bridges?

[MalcolmTucker]

^ The problem is while there is room along a couple routes to build the first ring road at ruinous expense, there is not room to build the second phase from highway 8 to 22x connecting in the outer ring road to an ultimate build out of 16 lanes.

I guess the positive side of this is that there will be no big box mall on the reserve. Also have to wonder if the reserve will ever get upgraded access to 37th St when the interchange is built (for the casino, etc), or whether the existing access might be removed due to safety much like Rocky Ridge Road.

This creates some interesting problems for the city too. If the section at 101st isn't going to be built, it would make sense to annex out another 50, 100 blocks and lay out space for the LRT line.

[eternallyme]

^ The problem is while there is room along a couple routes to build the first ring road at ruinous expense, there is not room to build the second phase from highway 8 to 22x connecting in the outer ring road to an ultimate build out of 16 lanes.

I guess the positive side of this is that there will be no big box mall on the reserve. Also have to wonder if the reserve will ever get upgraded access to 37th St when the interchange is built (for the casino, etc), or whether the existing access might be removed due to safety much like Rocky Ridge Road.

This creates some interesting problems for the city too. If the section at 101st isn't going to be built, it would make sense to annex out another 50, 100 blocks and lay out space for the LRT line.

The second phase should be cancelled, and long-distance traffic should be accomodated by expanding Highway 22 and 22X ultimately, bypassing both the city and the reserve.

[Tina Smith]

I called the phone # for the NW ring road and the recording says that Stoney is now open from Sarcee to Country Hills? It wasn't as of last night when I came through. Does anybody know if it is open today?

[mersar]

Sarcee to Country Hills opened last fall. Sarcee to Harvest hills is expected to open pretty much any day now though.

[Tina Smith]

OK. I was confused. I was thinking Sarcee to Beddington was actually Sarcee to Country Hills. Considering that the gov't is already 2 years behind schedule and the road looks finished to me, you'd have thought when they said it'd be open in July that they'd shoot for July 1. Typical of the gov't though...

[You Need A Thneed]

http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/swringgp.htm

The 2009 functional study design is now up on the Alberta Transportation website, if anyone wants to see what the Tsu'u Tina rejected.

[Tina Smith]

According to Alberta Transportation Stoney Trail NW will be open this coming Tuesday to Harvest Hills Blvd., barring poor weather in the interim which might delay the opening a day or two.

[You Need A Thneed]

According to Alberta Transportation Stoney Trail NW will be open this coming Tuesday to Harvest Hills Blvd., barring poor weather in the interim which might delay the opening a day or two.

There are showers forecasted for the next few days, so we'll see I guess. Rain could definately delay the line painting they have to complete yet.

[freeweed]

Awesome news, and a couple of months before I had guessed. Can't wait to drive it - the Balzac highway loses its charm in the summer, what with slow moving tractors all over the place.

[You Need A Thneed]

According to Alberta Transportation Stoney Trail NW will be open this coming Tuesday to Harvest Hills Blvd., barring poor weather in the interim which might delay the opening a day or two.
Where did you see/hear this? I don't see it on their website, but of course, they update their website on such an irregular basis.

Has anyone else found anything to confirm this?

[Stang]

Awesome news, and a couple of months before I had guessed. Can't wait to drive it - the Balzac highway loses its charm in the summer, what with slow moving tractors all over the place.

Speaking of the Balzac highway, 566, I wonder if Stoney being open to Harvest Hills will create some traffic issues around there.

Being close enough to Deerfoot, people might soon discover that they can go Stoney and then North on Harvest Hills/Centre and then west on 566 to get to QEII northbound.

I know that I use Highway 566/Symon's Valley/144 Avenue/85 Street to cut across from Balzac to get to the NW when I come back from/go to Edmonton.

With Stoney in place all the way to Harvest Hills/Centre Street I can see more people putting the puzzle together and jamming up those country roads a fair bit by putting together their own bypass.

Thoughts?

[mersar]

Has anyone else found anything to confirm this?

I can't see anything either to indicate it, though it is possible.

Speaking of the Balzac highway, 566, I wonder if Stoney being open to Harvest Hills will create some traffic issues around there.


I wouldn't be too surprised to see an increase at least until the rest of Stoney opens this fall. I also wouldn't be too surprised if theres a lot more bylaw enformcement and sheriffs along that stretch either, especially considering it seems no one ever does the speed limit through there.

[Stang]

I wouldn't be too surprised to see an increase at least until the rest of Stoney opens this fall. I also wouldn't be too surprised if theres a lot more bylaw enformcement and sheriffs along that stretch either, especially considering it seems no one ever does the speed limit through there.

Very true. At least it will be a relatively short period of time until Stoney connects all the way to the QEII.

[Tina Smith]

According to Allan Dixon at Alberta Tramsportation: (403) 297-5813 it should be open to Harvest Hills tomorrow...

[freeweed]

With Stoney in place all the way to Harvest Hills/Centre Street I can see more people putting the puzzle together and jamming up those country roads a fair bit by putting together their own bypass.

Thoughts?

I don't think it'll be much of an issue. Even our current use of those highways, while saving oodles of time and idling at stoplights hasn't generated much traffic really. I was actually surprised how many people think I'm crazy for driving it.

People are creatures of habit, and most Calgarians (especially new folks in the far-flung suburbs) don't even know those rural roads exist. It's "take anything to get to the Deerfoot, then north on Hwy 2" - no exceptions.

Stoney to Beddington to Deerfoot will be a damned fast route. 17km vs 13.5 or so for your shortcut - I don't think too many people will bother with it just to save what, a minute or two?

That being said, I never realized HH/Centre actually kept going that far. So *I* will be trying it out as soon as Stoney opens. But we're all kinda the wacky types here anyway. :haha:

[Dado]

On an unrelated note, I wonder if they've taken cyclists into account in the design of the 17th and Old Banff intersections. Don't laugh, there is quite heavy cyclist traffic there on the evenings and weekends as it is a popular touring route.

Better watch out for those parclo A4s. They're really bad because motorists on the crossroad who are about to go 'left' onto the freeway (via a right turn on the 270° ramps after crossing over the freeway) are usually already accelerating over the bridge (where cyclists are going even slower than usual) and blow past them. It's an idiotic design that should be banned as unsafe to cyclists and pedestrians and all current installations should be removed and turned into diamonds. Unfortunately here in Ontario the MTO just loves foisting Parclo A4s everywhere because we have the misfortune of being the jurisdiction wherein the Parclo A4 was invented (by the MTO, naturally).

I don't understand the love of these Parclo A4s, even as a motorist. The 270° turns don't allow for decent acceleration and then the merge lane that follows is usually short due to the fact that there is another merge lane for vehicles entering from the opposite direction. Diamonds allow for better acceleration (usually going downhill) and as you're going downhill you can look down to the left at the traffic on the freeway to start to figure out where to merge in - something that's not possible on the 270° ramps where your attention is more on steering and you don't have any height or perspective advantages. The ramps on a freeway with all diamond interchanges can also be configured later on easily as collector lanes. It also only makes sense to be turning to the direction that you're going to be going rather than turning off at the right to go left. And as a taxpayer, the extra length of crossroad span and land required for Parclo A4s is an unneeded extravagance.

[freeweed]

Welp, after a day of rain I just had to get out and go for a drive. Taking a look at various soon-to-be intersections, I can totally believe Stoney would be open this week to Harvest Hills. All lines look painted and it just seems like some concrete barriers to be moved. Very exciting!

Also, I took the above-mentioned "shortcut" to 566 just for fun. Totally something I'd do in the future.

[mersar]

Yep, I had to pop into superstore so I took a spin up Sarcee and back to take a look, I could totally believe this week, if not tomorrow.

[lubicon]

I use the 85 St / 144 Ave / Symons Valley Road / 566 shortcut all the time when I'm heading north. It's been great but is really starting to suffer with the development of Sage Hill and all the associated traffic (and lower speed limit). The opening of Stoney will change my routing. I don't think the shortcut north on Harvest Hills Blvd will be a big issue. It will only be an option sor such a short period of time that I doubt most people will even figure it out, and if they do it's only a short term thing.

I did try it out last weekend for fun, coming back into tosw from Airdrie. It's still very depressing to come up to Stoney and see the traffic lights, but what can you do. One interesting thing was the SB lanes of Harvest Hills do not have dedicated turning lanes on to EB Stoney. Its a 4 lane road (2 SB lanes) and both those lanes look like they will be used for turning AND straight ahead movements. Probably not a big deal since I doubt there will be much traffic using that movement. Maybe also a positive sign that they are not building turning bays - perhaps the lifespan of that intersection will be a short one and an interchange will be coming soon. I can only hope.

[eternallyme]

What will the speed limit be on the new Stoney Trail? I'd personally set it at 90 km/h if there are any at-grade intersections, and 100 km/h if a full freeway.

[You Need A Thneed]

What will the speed limit be on the new Stoney Trail? I'd personally set it at 90 km/h if there are any at-grade intersections, and 100 km/h if a full freeway.

If they had any sense at all, it would be at least 100 (hopefully 110), slowing to 80 through the at grade intersections.

It's a little bit ridiculous right now having the speed limit posted at 80 from Sarcee until the pedestrian bridge construction zone. Here's a virtually empty highway designed for speeds of at least 110 (probably 140) and the speed limit is posted at 80. It would be very safe driving 140 down that stretch.

[Oliver Klozov]

If they had any sense at all, it would be at least 100 (hopefully 110), slowing to 80 through the at grade intersections.


The completed parts of AHD in Edmonton are 100 slowing to 70 through at-grade intersections. I'm guess that Stoney will be similar with maybe 80 through Harvest Hills and Nose Hill but only 60 through Crowchild until it's completed.

When construction of the interchanges at HH and NH commence it will likely only be 60 and sometimes 50.

[You Need A Thneed]

tWhen construction of the interchanges at HH and NH commence it will likely only be 60 and sometimes 50.

I don't think it'll be that slow. Deerfoot /Hwy 2 is posted at 80 through both the Stoney interchange and the interchange up in Airdrie. I don't know why Harvest Hills anyway would have to be slower than that. Most of the time it will be 80.

Nose Hill Drive will require a detour road and widening, so for that it will likely be 60, but perhaps once Stoney is widened, it'll get put back up to 80 for the rest of the construction.

EDIT: Looking at the satellite view on Google Maps, I really wonder whether they will twin the Bow River bridge at the same time as the Nose Hill Interchange is built. If they widen Stoney under the interchange to how wide they want it in the end, there will be a bit of an S curve to get the lanes back into position to go over the existing bridge. Of course, the grading that they did for the future bridge would require the new bridge to be fairly close to the existing bridge too. So, perhaps it's not an issue. They still will want to twin the bridge sooner rather than later, as it'll get fairly busy with only two lanes each way (and no shoulders) over the existing bridge.

[Oliver Klozov]

You could very will be right about Harvest Hills staying at 80. I guess it depends on what kind of girders they use. If they use those cast-in-place ones, it will definitely be 60 or 50 due to the encroachment of the shoring.

I don't believe Hose Hill will require a detour for either road. From the looks of the proposed location on the AB Trans website, the current Nose Hill is the detour and the new bridge will be to the north.

I certainly agree that twinning the Bow River crossing (and the CPR crossing) in conjunction with Nose Hill would be the way to go. That may not happen however because I'm thinking they're thinking that the new crossings wont be required until the Hwy 1 to Hwy 8 leg is open.

[mersar]

Well I had been told that the second river crossing was required before the west leg is constructed, so its possible we could see it started around the time Nosehill gets done. That said, a huge amount of the timing will depend on whatever the solution for the SW ends up being

[Highroller]

I did try it out last weekend for fun, coming back into tosw from Airdrie. It's still very depressing to come up to Stoney and see the traffic lights, but what can you do. One interesting thing was the SB lanes of Harvest Hills do not have dedicated turning lanes on to EB Stoney. Its a 4 lane road (2 SB lanes) and both those lanes look like they will be used for turning AND straight ahead movements. Probably not a big deal since I doubt there will be much traffic using that movement. Maybe also a positive sign that they are not building turning bays - perhaps the lifespan of that intersection will be a short one and an interchange will be coming soon. I can only hope.

I live right next to HHB and Stoney and just took a look - not open yet and not much sign of life. Temporary barricades are in place for an opening though. A correction on the turning lanes - for both NB and SB on HHB, as you approach Stoney, there are two lanes. One is for turning only and the other is for straight through and turning (ie. three lanes worth through the intersection). Two lanes of turning & straight would be disastrous now that I think about it :)

There was a speed limit sign in the distance, but it was too far away to read it. If I head out later, I'll grab the DSLR and see if I can make out what it reads!

[sync]

so is stoney to harvest hills open?

haha, oops.

thanks for the info.

[freeweed]

I thought we heard that the eventual plan is for Stoney to be 110. It certainly is designed for it.

Personally, I'm curious as to how long they'll leave it at 2 lanes heading eastbound just after CHB. I thought the entire thing was being built for 3 lanes, but for some reason it cuts down to 2. And it's not just temporary leading to Sarcee, either - it truly looks like it can only do 2 lanes there.

[You Need A Thneed]

You could very will be right about Harvest Hills staying at 80. I guess it depends on what kind of girders they use. If they use those cast-in-place ones, it will definitely be 60 or 50 due to the encroachment of the shoring.

I don't believe Hose Hill will require a detour for either road. From the looks of the proposed location on the AB Trans website, the current Nose Hill is the detour and the new bridge will be to the north.

I certainly agree that twinning the Bow River crossing (and the CPR crossing) in conjunction with Nose Hill would be the way to go. That may not happen however because I'm thinking they're thinking that the new crossings wont be required until the Hwy 1 to Hwy 8 leg is open.

Yup, the bridge will get built just north of the current intersection, but they will still want to build a median in between the Northbound and Southbound lanes of stoney. You can see here (http://maps.google.ca/?ie=UTF8&ll=51.105354,-114.224575&spn=0.01032,0.016716&t=k&z=16) that there is not currently a median. You can also see here (http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/Content/docType490/production/stm_tc-ch-m1.pdf) that the plan is to build one.

[Highroller]

Still no sign of it opening. The traffic lights at HHB are dead. The speed limit signs for both east and west of HHB read 100 km/h.

[Tina Smith]

Does it look like it's open today? I drove up to Sarcee last night to see for myself and it's still not open. I'll call Allan at A.T. again today if it's not open. I drive from the NW to just north on HHB nearly every evening as I board my horse up that way and CAN'T WAIT to not have to follow construction traffic going 30-40 kms under the speed limit up 85 st and 144 ave!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mersar]

So long as its open by Saturday I'll be happy. I've got to drive my brother to the airport so it will be interesting to see the time difference between my usual route (off 1A at Bearspaw, down 144th ave to Beddington then Country Hills) and taking Stoney as far as Harvest Hills then the rest on Country Hills.

[craner]

I use the 85 St / 144 Ave / Symons Valley Road / 566 shortcut all the time when I'm heading north. It's been great but is really starting to suffer with the development of Sage Hill and all the associated traffic (and lower speed limit). The opening of Stoney will change my routing. I don't think the shortcut north on Harvest Hills Blvd will be a big issue. It will only be an option sor such a short period of time that I doubt most people will even figure it out, and if they do it's only a short term thing.

I did try it out last weekend for fun, coming back into tosw from Airdrie. It's still very depressing to come up to Stoney and see the traffic lights, but what can you do. One interesting thing was the SB lanes of Harvest Hills do not have dedicated turning lanes on to EB Stoney. Its a 4 lane road (2 SB lanes) and both those lanes look like they will be used for turning AND straight ahead movements. Probably not a big deal since I doubt there will be much traffic using that movement. Maybe also a positive sign that they are not building turning bays - perhaps the lifespan of that intersection will be a short one and an interchange will be coming soon. I can only hope.


God I hope so too. How idiotic building this leg with traffic lights.:koko: :shrug: :hell:

[lubicon]

It's about as idiotic as what they did with Anthony Henday Drive in Edmonton. Exactly the same situation, and the SW portion of that road is a complete cluster...

[mersar]

Everything looks like its ready, the only part that looks like it may not open with this stretch is the off ramps to and from Shaganappi. On Stoney itself they've set out a line of pylons all the way along where the ramps connect to Stoney, and the lines on the ramps themselves haven't been painted either. On the WB to NB ramp theres also a row of barriers up still.

[Tina Smith]

The recording at A.T. : (403) 270-9203 that used to say that it was open to Country Hills now says that it will be open today. Any more info would be appreciated! I drove up again to Sarcee last night because the sign on Stoney just north of Crowchild that said it ended at Sarcee was gone. Still not open, just the typical half dozen construction workers, not working but standing around chatting and smoking...

[freeweed]

I'm going to try driving it tonight unless I hear a negatory from one of you folks before then. Wasting gasoline helps the Alberta economy anyway. :haha:

[mersar]

Heres some shots from last night:

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneybeddington-july8-1.jpg

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneybeddington-july8-2.jpg

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneyshaganappi-july8-1.jpg

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneyshaganappi-july8-2.jpg

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneyshaganappi-july8-3.jpg

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneyshaganappi-july8-4.jpg

[Tina Smith]

AECOM says Enmax is having "some problems" there today but are working on resolving said problems. It may or may not open today...:( but will open when they work it out...

[Stang]

I'm going to try driving it tonight unless I hear a negatory from one of you folks before then. Wasting gasoline helps the Alberta economy anyway. :haha:

Confession: I checked the forum on my iPhone last night (while stopped, of course) to see if there were any reports of it being open and if it was worth a diversion on the way home. :)

[Stang]

Confession #2: I went anyway.

[Tina Smith]

Well I'll let you know when I get home from my pony this evening if it is. I plan to drive it for the third night in a row...I was elated when I saw the "closed at Sarcee" sign gone last night and in fumes when I got up there and saw it STILL closed!! :hell:

[Stang]

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneybeddington-july8-1.jpg

Is Symons Valley Road officially retaining its name N of Stoney then? I always assumed that Beddington Trail would eventually replace it entirely as it moved NW-ward.

[shevallo]

Just drove down 782 (Harvest Hills Blvd) across Stoney Trail. Enmax was there working on the lights. Stoney is still not open.

Also, noticed all the signs north of Stoney on Beddington (at all the Creekside lights) call Beddington Symons Valley Road.

[mersar]

Yep, I'd say probably open over night if Enmax can get the lights going. They've turned the lights at Beddington onto their proper sequence so you can actually hit a red there now, and there was a crew out sandblasting some of the old markers off Stoney just before Sarcee heading east

[mersar]

14th Street access
http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoney14-july9-1.jpg

Harvest Hills
http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneyharvesthills-july9-1.jpg

http://compscience.info/public/images/2009/stoneyharvesthills-july9-2.jpg

[frinkprof]

So anyone think it might be open now?

[yeeg]

I hope its open today. Makes delivering pizza easier.

[freeweed]

Someone PLEASE let me know if you find out it's open by this afternoon. Gotta take a run out that way and it would be sweet to take the fast way home. :cheers:

[Highroller]

That phone number on the prevous page says that the road will be open by 4 pm today.

[craner]

Is Symons Valley Road officially retaining its name N of Stoney then? I always assumed that Beddington Trail would eventually replace it entirely as it moved NW-ward.

I assumed the same as you did but it looks like the SVR name will remain north of Stoney. Seems silly to me but it certainly wouldn't be the first time a road changed names when it crosses an intersection. The one that really bugs me is Centre Street N with the bus trap as it becomes Harvest Hills Blvd. and then back to Centre street further north. Why not just keep Centre as a continuous main road so you know when you've changed quadrants ? Who plans this stuff anyway :shrug:

[DizzyEdge]

So the section that's supposed to be open, is it Stoney Trail/Country hills intersection in the west end through to Harvest hills?

[mersar]

Stoney is already open from Country Hills to Sarcee, this stretch thats supposed to open today is from Sarcee east to Harvest Hills.

[craner]

It's about as idiotic as what they did with Anthony Henday Drive in Edmonton. Exactly the same situation, and the SW portion of that road is a complete cluster...

:previous: Exactly! - couldn't / can't they (the Province) forsee the "cluster" happening. Now they are trying to go back and fix SW AHD and will be doing the same thing with NW Stoney before long (hopefully).
The P3's have proven to be far more effective with these projects.

[You Need A Thneed]

I think it's interesting that there's pretty much ZERO news coverage for this section opening up, however, it is the longest piece of the NW Ring road that will open up all at the same time.

You know there's going to be a huge deal when the whole thing opens up

[DizzyEdge]

Stoney is already open from Country Hills to Sarcee, this stretch thats supposed to open today is from Sarcee east to Harvest Hills.

Ah ok, and then the rest to Deerfoot is to be done by Nov? Sorry I don't live in an area where I would normally use the ring road, however I'm greatly interested in the full north section being done as I do live near 16th ave and I'm very curious how the N section being completed will affect traffic, particularly trucks.

[Tina Smith]

Correction: there is ZERO coverage, except for here. When I talked to A.T. last week the guy told me "they weren't exactly advertising this opening" and laughed. Amazing how amusing the gov't finds their incompetence...and I wouldn't count on 4 pm today given their track record...I will check AGAIN tonight although that will be my last waste of gas. Hopefully somebody else will report when they know it is open...

[DizzyEdge]

Correction: there is ZERO coverage, except for here. When I talked to A.T. last week the guy told me "they weren't exactly advertising this opening" and laughed. Amazing how amusing the gov't finds their incompetence...and I wouldn't count on 4 pm today given their track record...I will check AGAIN tonight although that will be my last waste of gas. Hopefully somebody else will report when they know it is open...

That could be why they're not advertising, probably waiting until it's actually open for real, considering all of the delays.

[You Need A Thneed]

Ah ok, and then the rest to Deerfoot is to be done by Nov? Sorry I don't live in an area where I would normally use the ring road, however I'm greatly interested in the full north section being done as I do live near 16th ave and I'm very curious how the N section being completed will affect traffic, particularly trucks.

There's going to be a lot fewer trucks. Though they won't all be gone, I'm pretty sure it will still be a truck route, as there's not really an alternative place to make one instead.

The intercity trucks will take the ring road. That's probably a high percentage of them.

As for delays, little stuff like rain can certainly play a big part in delaying the opening, as it would prevent them from painting whatever lines remain to be painted. Also getting the electrical fixtures to work properly while it's raining is probably not encouraged.

[mersar]

Yep, a good bit of traffic will likely move over to it in November. The one thing that may prevent some from taking it though is the fact there are zero truck stops along it, so especially if you're heading east through the city theres still going to be a need to go into the city if you need fuel. Going west theres at least the truck stop out at Highway 22.

[QBee]

Hi all... i havent actually ever logged in to speak.... But have to say thank you to all of you that have been keeping us all updated!

I work in Hamptons and past the golf course i can see the right part of the Sacree Tr N and Stoney Trail intersection. I can see the ramp that accesses onto Stoney Trail Eastbound. So i can let you all know when its open. I can also see the mainline stretch (at a distance) that goes from Beddington Tr around evanston and Panorama until it turns out of sight. The vehicles are 'ant like' in size but i will be able to see when there is trafic on it. Will keep you all posted. I am off at 4:30 and excited to take this route home...to Coventry... and hope to be able to make it in under 10 minutes. VERY EXCITING!:banana:

[DizzyEdge]

Yep, a good bit of traffic will likely move over to it in November. The one thing that may prevent some from taking it though is the fact there are zero truck stops along it, so especially if you're heading east through the city theres still going to be a need to go into the city if you need fuel. Going west theres at least the truck stop out at Highway 22.

Intersection of Deerfoot and the ring road would be a great place for a truck stop.

[mersar]

The issue is access. It would pretty much have to be off a intersecting road that itself isn't a highway, I'd personally think on the north side of Stoney at Metis would be suitable otherwise it would need to be on the east side of Stoney somewhere on the east edge of the city since the NW is pretty much all zoned residential adjacent to Stoney.

[You Need A Thneed]

I can see someone cashing in with a truck stop along the NE leg somewhere. close to the Metis interchange or the Country Hills Interchange makes sense.

There is already a truck stop just south of Country Hills on Freeport Blvd, that's not too far off the ring road path.

At the future 11th Street Interchange might be a good future location as well. Perhaps you could get one in by the Sarcee Interchange by the landfill site.