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WaterlooInvestor
May 7, 2007, 7:57 AM
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Cambridgite
May 7, 2007, 2:12 PM
Here are the #'s showing Kitchener near the bottom for Federal government employment:

Federal government employment, wages and salaries, by census metropolitan area
(Employment) 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006
employment (persons)
Total census metropolitan areas 268,891 274,095 273,589 276,907 283,005
Ottawa–Gatineau (Ont.–Que.) 108,050 112,310 112,324 113,835 117,826
Montréal (Que.) 26,718 26,636 26,450 25,919 25,726
Toronto (Ont.) 21,440 22,186 22,098 22,199 22,448
Vancouver (B.C.) 16,404 16,438 16,251 16,700 17,101
Halifax (N.S.) 16,341 16,479 16,437 16,544 16,336
Québec (Que.) 12,100 12,160 12,295 12,357 13,773
Winnipeg (Man.) 12,099 12,319 12,223 12,481 12,515
Edmonton (Alta.) 9,094 9,019 9,111 9,190 9,218
Victoria (B.C.) 8,452 8,689 8,668 8,787 8,833
Calgary (Alta.) 6,521 6,549 6,533 6,574 6,637
St. John's (N.L.) 4,490 4,408 4,270 4,519 4,544
Regina (Sask.) 3,488 3,522 3,546 3,697 3,125
Hamilton (Ont.) 2,751 2,757 2,746 2,756 2,859
Saskatoon (Sask.) 2,562 2,494 2,495 2,522 2,519
London (Ont.) 2,115 2,103 2,109 2,139 2,352
Sudbury (Ont.) 2,015 1,906 1,832 2,008 2,066
Windsor (Ont.) 1,674 1,653 1,659 1,812 2,040
Saguenay (Que.) 1,256 1,126 1,145 1,190 1,241
Sherbrooke (Que.) 945 960 973 1,001 1,140
St. Catharines–Niagara (Ont.) 1,081 1,084 1,093 1,213 1,132
Saint John (N.B.) 1,199 1,202 1,141 1,175 1,101
Kitchener (Ont.) 1,004 1,003 1,091 1,089 1,047
Thunder Bay (Ont.) 931 924 904 914 892
Trois-Rivières (Que.) 415 364 304 328 367
Oshawa (Ont.) 272 287 289 304 341

Obviously the capital city Ottawa, border cities like Windsor, and port cities like Halifax are going to have a larger federal employment base. But a city like Regina having 3 times as many federal workers, yet it's less than half the size, is just plain screwing over Kitchener.

That's not quite the point I was making. What I meant is that when you travel out of province, no one even knows where it is, but everyone has heard of St. John's, Regina, Victoria, and even Charlottetown!! It's just sad. St. John's and Victoria have their own news channels even. I'm not too worried that federal government employment is low, even though it should be a lot higher for it's size. Private sector employment is doing very well here. But it's strange how it has no visible presense in Canada's urban system. Maybe it's because it's overshadowed by Toronto (London and Hamilton aren't well known relative to their size), or it could be because it's a relatively new metro that has seen most of its growth in more recent years and is yet to establish itself. It could also be because it's actually a collection of smaller communities connected by suburban development. I don't know, but Kitchener needs to represent itself, that's for sure. Getting the Penguins would have helped a lot.

rapid_business
May 7, 2007, 2:54 PM
It's defiantly the Toronto shadow. On a much smaller scale, look to cities like Sherwood Park and St. Albert here in Edmonton. 60,000 and 70,000 respectively, but they are in the shadow of Edmonton. (I guess they are part of the CMA though, so that doesn't work...)

A place like Regina represents a large area of land, and is the only major population base for a long ways. That's why it sticks out. As per KW, I can see the logic when they see that a 1 hr. trip S, E, or W brings you into communities with larger populations that appear to play a larger role nationally.

KW will get it's time. It just needs time to do so.

Cambridgite
May 7, 2007, 9:06 PM
It's defiantly the Toronto shadow. On a much smaller scale, look to cities like Sherwood Park and St. Albert here in Edmonton. 60,000 and 70,000 respectively, but they are in the shadow of Edmonton. (I guess they are part of the CMA though, so that doesn't work...)

A place like Regina represents a large area of land, and is the only major population base for a long ways. That's why it sticks out. As per KW, I can see the logic when they see that a 1 hr. trip S, E, or W brings you into communities with larger populations that appear to play a larger role nationally.

KW will get it's time. It just needs time to do so.

I'm only going on what my cousins in Edmonton say, but aren't Sherwood Park and St. Albert suburbs of Edmonton and not suburbanized towns? Mississauga is fast approaching 700,000 and it is still a suburb of Toronto, whether it's self-sufficient in a lot of ways or not.
There is nothing south of KW except Brantford, which is much smaller. West is London, which is about the same size, if not smaller by now (metro population). The east and southeast are the only areas where there are larger metros overshadowing KW. Toronto is the obvious one to the east and Hamilton is to the southeast. Even with Hamilton, it's a little over 700,000 in its metro, so I don't think it really casts an overwhelming shadow on KW.
I get what you're saying about Regina though. It's out in the boonies...well, wheat fields anyways... KW absolutely has to share the spotlight with other large and mid-sized centres, which is probably why Halifax gets so much more attention.
KW is also growing faster than most communities of similar size though, so it's probable that it will work its way up the heirarchy of Canadian cities as it has done in the past. We're just about to overtake London, and I'd say we'll probably pass Winnipeg (everyone's passing them, lol) and maybe even Quebec City in the next 20-25 years. Assuming no other cities pass KW in that time frame, that would make the Kitchener CMA the 8th largest in Canada. We gotta get some respect for that, lol.

Cambridgite
May 7, 2007, 9:09 PM
Hmm, who's going to overtake who? That could result in one interesting and heated thread.

jeremy_haak
May 7, 2007, 10:55 PM
You can check the Ministry of Finance's population predictions, which, by 2031, predict a population of over 700000 for Waterloo Region and (I believe) over 300000 for Guelph. That said, Waterloo Region only predicts a population in the neighbourhood of 650000 in the same time period, though it is legally mandated to plan according to the MOF's predictions. (all these numbers are rough estimates from memory.) Quebec's population has already surpassed 700000, and Winnipeg's is pretty close, so, while I wouldn't be surprised to see K-W surpass them in the future, it'll likely be awhile still.

Cambridgite
May 7, 2007, 11:53 PM
You can check the Ministry of Finance's population predictions, which, by 2031, predict a population of over 700000 for Waterloo Region and (I believe) over 300000 for Guelph. That said, Waterloo Region only predicts a population in the neighbourhood of 650000 in the same time period, though it is legally mandated to plan according to the MOF's predictions. (all these numbers are rough estimates from memory.) Quebec's population has already surpassed 700000, and Winnipeg's is pretty close, so, while I wouldn't be surprised to see K-W surpass them in the future, it'll likely be awhile still.

Yes, you are correct about those provincial and regional predictions...well, except that 300,000 is for Wellington County, not just Guelph, although most of that growth will be in Guelph. Don't forget, however, that these are predictions. I wish I had the source on me, but I do remember reading that Waterloo Region once predicted its population to reach 1 million by the turn of the millenium. We are only now a little over half of that. Those predictions made the assumption that the fertility rate of the baby boom was going to continue. The provinces growth projections make the assumption that the inner ring of the Greater Golden Horseshoe (Toronto, Hamilton, and Oshawa CMAs) will take in 3/4 of the population growth of the broader region, with only a quarter of that going into the outer ring (where Waterloo Region lies). That's 3 million more people into the GTA vicinity, which has relatively little land left inside the greenbelt. I personally think that the outer ring is going to see a much greater share of the growth. All I have to go on is my gut instinct for this, but 3 million more people within an area that can only expand so much seems unlikely. There would have to be an incredible amount of intensification for that. I wouldn't be surprised to see this Region reach 1 million by 2031.
Also look at the social and economic trends in this Region. Until not long ago, this was a very white and blue collar, sleepy town. Just look at how much things have changed in the past 10 years. It's becoming a lot bigger and more cosmopolitan than it used to be. Trends change over time. And for that matter, growth may be even slower than predicted. But could people up in Barrie ever predict that their sleepy little town would one day be invaded with Ex-Torontonians and become the fastest growing CMA in the country?

CharlesMunroe
May 8, 2007, 7:03 AM
I dont see why Kitchener should have their own station and think they should feel priviledged to be mentioned along with London. Why should Kitchener have their own? Its CBC radio! They even say the London station wont be very different from the Toronto station. So whatever your hearing now on the Toronto station is what you'll here on this new one. Kitchener already recieves Toronto airwaves but London does'nt? Then it would make no sense at all to put it in Kitchener. Be glad you were even mentioned.


Obviously the capital city Ottawa, border cities like Windsor, and port cities like Halifax are going to have a larger federal employment base. But a city like Regina having 3 times as many federal workers, yet it's less than half the size, is just plain screwing over Kitchener.

Regina is a provincial capital, I'm surprised there is'nt more. Kitchener is only the capital of mennonites, that does'nt require govt employees. If large amounts of govt jobs are going to be moved to politically insignificant small cities they should be going to struggling cities. Kitchener sounds like anything but struggling.

That's not quite the point I was making. What I meant is that when you travel out of province, no one even knows where it is, but everyone has heard of St. John's, Regina, Victoria, and even Charlottetown!! It's just sad. St. John's and Victoria have their own news channels even.

Its sad? Those are all capitals. Of course everybody has heard of them. Why should anyone in Newfoundland or BC ever hear of Kitchener?

The provinces growth projections make the assumption that the inner ring of the Greater Golden Horseshoe (Toronto, Hamilton, and Oshawa CMAs) will take in 3/4 of the population growth of the broader region, with only a quarter of that going into the outer ring (where Waterloo Region lies). That's 3 million more people into the GTA vicinity, which has relatively little land left inside the greenbelt. I personally think that the outer ring is going to see a much greater share of the growth. All I have to go on is my gut instinct for this, but 3 million more people within an area that can only expand so much seems unlikely. There would have to be an incredible amount of intensification for that. I wouldn't be surprised to see this Region reach 1 million by 2031.


Maybe your region will reach 1M by 2031 but at the same time the GTA could easily absorb 3M more people, just look at Tokyo. There is still lots of undeveloped land in the GTA. Even Scarborough still has farmhouses and barns surrounded by field. There is plenty of room for intensification too. Using Scarborough as an example again, east of Markham road it goes from urban to suburban. Scarborough is a massive part of the 416 and half of it is underdeveloped. Then you have all the 905, even less developed for the most part. GTA can easily take on 3M over that time.

WaterlooInvestor
May 8, 2007, 10:50 AM
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MolsonExport
May 8, 2007, 4:53 PM
The University of Waterloo is superior compared to London's UWO.

What a load of malarkey.

koops65
May 8, 2007, 5:47 PM
I wish I knew where you're from CharlesMunroe, cause then I'd put down your town too! Capital of Mennonites indeed... You're rude...

WaterlooInvestor
May 8, 2007, 6:47 PM
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CharlesMunroe
May 8, 2007, 7:46 PM
WaterlooInvestor - None of that explains why Kitchener should have their own CBC radio station. CBC's only goal sounds to cover as many listeners as posssible. I believe Kitchener can pick up Toronto airwaves but London cannot? Kitchener also can pick up London? Kitchener is going to have double coverage from Toronto and London yet your saying you should have triple coverage with another station in Kitchener. Why? A station in London will give them more coverage then a station out of Kitchener would. An additional station in Kitchener will do CBC nothing at all. They already said the London station won't be much different from Toronto. Same shit.

I have nothing at all against the region and I hope it becomes the metroplis some of you feel it is. I wish every Canadian city was doing as good. I am interested in it and want to learn more but Kitchener is, and always has been, politically insignificant. It has always been a small city. To say your being screwed over because provincial capitals have more fed jobs is laughable.

Laying claim to be the education capital, high tech capital, insurance capital and now the automotive capital is extremely pretentious and wreaks of "Vaughanism". You know, the city ABOVE Toronto.

I admit I dont know the region well but like I say I am interested and would like to know more. Much of this pride seems to come from the high tech side. How many people are employed by RIM and Opentext? Thats the two that the region is high on right?

I hope the region continues to prosper, it sounds like a nice place. I've never been there, never had a reason. I will check it out sometime this summer but I fear you guys have built it up so much that it can only disapoint to the point of being most over-rated. It sounds like it has a lot going for it but know your place, your far from being the center of Canada. Heres a quote from that Globe article you should keep in mind...
Luck helps, too. It's just an hour from Toronto and the key financial backers of new ventures.



I wish I knew where you're from CharlesMunroe, cause then I'd put down your town too! Capital of Mennonites indeed... You're rude...

As far as I knew there were more Mennonites around Kitchener then anywhere else. Whats rude about that? Just saying that doesnt make you deservant of federal jobs. It sounds like your ashamed of your Mennonite community and heritage.
And yes I am from Oshawa so go ahead and have a ball. The dirty old 'Shwa has been getting kicked around for decades so I doubt there will be anything I've never heard before but take your best shot. Funny thing is Oshawa likely has as much or more going for it then Kichener and likely contributes more.

MolsonExport
May 8, 2007, 9:44 PM
UWO is a good school as well, just that UW ranks higher on most people's list. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14321230/site/newsweek/ #84 University of Waterloo





Anyone can cherrypick to find a list that conveniently supports their point of view. I have seen many, many, many such lists; all with a great deal of variability (and most of which ranking UWO in the top 5 or 10 in Canada).

jeremy_haak
May 8, 2007, 11:10 PM
WaterlooInvestor - None of that explains why Kitchener should have their own CBC radio station. CBC's only goal sounds to cover as many listeners as posssible. I believe Kitchener can pick up Toronto airwaves but London cannot? Kitchener also can pick up London? Kitchener is going to have double coverage from Toronto and London yet your saying you should have triple coverage with another station in Kitchener. Why? A station in London will give them more coverage then a station out of Kitchener would. An additional station in Kitchener will do CBC nothing at all. They already said the London station won't be much different from Toronto. Same shit.

Is there an article about this CBC move? The CBC already has repeaters across Ontario, including London, so this would have nothing to do with reception. Presumeably the CBC will be opening a bureau in London that would actually produce its own material, most likely the Ontario Morning show (currently produced in Toronto, but only aired outside of Toronto, Ottawa and Northern Ontario), and possibly an afternoon show to replace the one that is currently broadcast out of Toronto and mostly talks about the traffic on the DVP. I would expect that it would be branded more as a Southwestern Ontario station than a London one. I also imagine it would be similar in size to the stations in Thunder Bay and Sudbury.

rapid_business
May 8, 2007, 11:31 PM
Anyone can cherrypick to find a list that conveniently supports their point of view. I have seen many, many, many such lists; all with a great deal of variability (and most of which ranking UWO in the top 5 or 10 in Canada).

Please do show. I have never seen such numbers.

Cambridgite
May 9, 2007, 12:42 AM
I wish I knew where you're from CharlesMunroe, cause then I'd put down your town too! Capital of Mennonites indeed... You're rude...

Charles Munroe,
Actually, the mennonite culture is most prevalent north of Waterloo now, out in the boonies. If you've ever been to Kitchener and taken a walk around in a busy place like Fairview Mall or downtown (during the day, on nice days), you would quickly notice that it isn't a horse and buggy, mennonite town, or even overwhelmingly German/white for that matter. Even Toronto used to be a wasp community, but times are changing. You've probably been to St. Jacobs once, seen the over-commercialized Mennonite culture and then based your whole perception of the Region on that. Speaking of which, it's funny how when people think of KW, it's the rural aspects that come to mind, lol.

flar
May 9, 2007, 12:43 AM
You can't easily measure the aspects for which Western excels compared to Waterloo. Waterloo is an excellent school, highly regarded especially in tech circles, but Western has cultural capital that Waterloo will never have.

Cambridgite
May 9, 2007, 12:56 AM
Laying claim to be the education capital, high tech capital, insurance capital and now the automotive capital is extremely pretentious and wreaks of "Vaughanism". You know, the city ABOVE Toronto.

Yes, it's pretentious. Perhaps even an exaggeration. But that doesn't give you the right to compare us to Vaughan. :yuck:

And yes I am from Oshawa so go ahead and have a ball. The dirty old 'Shwa has been getting kicked around for decades so I doubt there will be anything I've never heard before but take your best shot.

Gladly.. Okay, here's one to start. Oshawa is the capital of laid-off GM workers and Toronto commuters.

Funny thing is Oshawa likely has as much or more going for it then Kichener and likely contributes more.[/QUOTE]

" 'Prepare to be amazed'. Well, I guess that's better than their old motto, 'You've missed the turn off to Burlington'."

"Bold, vibrant, innovative. None of these things describe the City of Oshawa. But how about this word?....beaver pelt"

I didn't say it. Stephen Colbert did. :jester:

Cambridgite
May 9, 2007, 12:59 AM
You can't easily measure the aspects for which Western excels compared to Waterloo. Waterloo is an excellent school, highly regarded especially in tech circles, but Western has cultural capital that Waterloo will never have.

Yes, but London has more nightclubs and more Western graduates grow up to become professional alcholics. :haha:

Waterlooson
May 9, 2007, 4:47 AM
What a load of malarkey.

Why, because you work there? :rolleyes:

Waterlooson
May 9, 2007, 4:53 AM
Anyone can cherrypick to find a list that conveniently supports their point of view. I have seen many, many, many such lists; all with a great deal of variability (and most of which ranking UWO in the top 5 or 10 in Canada).

It's interesting that you didn't provide links to any of these "lists". In engineering, computer science and mathematics, Waterloo has the best reputation of any university in Canada.

Waterlooson
May 9, 2007, 5:01 AM
You can't easily measure the aspects for which Western excels compared to Waterloo. Waterloo is an excellent school, highly regarded especially in tech circles, but Western has cultural capital that Waterloo will never have.

Never is a long time.... clearly, you are not aware of what is occuring intellectually and culturally in Waterloo or at its associated institutions. It should be mentioned that the two universities excel in different fields, but overall, Waterloo ranks higher nationally and internationally.

flar
May 9, 2007, 12:05 PM
Let's see the lists where Waterloo is ranked high internationally.

rapid_business
May 9, 2007, 1:52 PM
Let's see the lists where UWO is in the 'top 5 or 10 Universities in Canada'...

FazDeH
May 9, 2007, 5:08 PM
^^^ Umm, I've seen such lists aswell, CBC had one along time ago, Im sorry I didnt save the link. The lists were sub categorized. As memory serves me, and please dont bite off my head for saying this, UWO was ranked higher for social sciences, medicine, arts, and business, in fact UWO Ivy school for business was listed #1. Waterloo, listed higher for engineering, computer science and math. There was also listings for student services, activities, sports etc. both ranked well. Theres no reason for getting into a dick meassuring contest here. lol Shouldnt we consider ourselves lucky to have 2 highly ranked schools in SWO? oh yah and Laurier. didnt mean to leave it out. Yeah for that little school!
I have lived in both cities, and with some degree of confidence I can say that London has a culture that I find to be more desireable. though DT Kitchener is more urban chic, I always found it to be dirty. PARTS WERE NICE, dont get me wrong, but the overall esthetics, meh Im gonna have to side with London.
Why is there some stupid feud between London and KW? seriously, both are nice places to live. Both lack behind Toronto, pretending we're just as cool.
there I said my 2 cents.

flar
May 9, 2007, 5:13 PM
Western is always in the top 5 of the Macleans rankings, in the category with McGill, Toronto and Queen's. Waterloo is in a different category, but was just edged out by the University of Guelph this year. University rankings are a little silly though.

Tony
May 9, 2007, 5:24 PM
What does this bickering and picking on KW have to do with development?

Those of you in this thread whose only intention is to simply bash K-W (usually in favour of London) should GTFO and leave the rest of us who are actually interested in what's going on in K-W alone.

...and to everyone, stop with the K-W vs. London, city v. city BS.

Waterlooson
May 9, 2007, 7:40 PM
Let's see the lists where Waterloo is ranked high internationally.

Of course we are only comparing the Universities, and not the cities.

Here's Newsweek's definitive ranking of the top 100 global universities:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14321230/

While the University of Waterloo is ranked #84 in the world, Western didn't make this list.

Waterlooson
May 9, 2007, 7:51 PM
^^^ Umm, I've seen such lists aswell, CBC had one along time ago, Im sorry I didnt save the link. The lists were sub categorized. As memory serves me, and please dont bite off my head for saying this, UWO was ranked higher for social sciences, medicine, arts, and business, in fact UWO Ivy school for business was listed #1. Waterloo, listed higher for engineering, computer science and math. There was also listings for student services, activities, sports etc. both ranked well. Theres no reason for getting into a dick meassuring contest here. lol Shouldnt we consider ourselves lucky to have 2 highly ranked schools in SWO? oh yah and Laurier. didnt mean to leave it out. Yeah for that little school!
I have lived in both cities, and with some degree of confidence I can say that London has a culture that I find to be more desireable. though DT Kitchener is more urban chic, I always found it to be dirty. PARTS WERE NICE, dont get me wrong, but the overall esthetics, meh Im gonna have to side with London.
Why is there some stupid feud between London and KW? seriously, both are nice places to live. Both lack behind Toronto, pretending we're just as cool.
there I said my 2 cents.

Lets not get into a city vs. city discussion.

The University of Waterloo doesn't have a business school or a medical/dentistry school, but it does have Canada's highest rated certified accountant's school. Its faculty of mathemactics is the world's largest and its computer science school is tops in Canada (the only one in Canada Bill Gates thought worthy of a personal visit) - and so is its faculty of engineering. Its School of Architecture is very highly ranked in Canada (perhaps #1 in the country?).

The list of university rankings has some problems largely because it relies on laurels achieved too long ago. The University of Waterloo is only 50 years old (Western has a much longer history) and continues to see major new development... like a new accounting building, a new building for engineering and a huge development - which will be unique in Canada - for quantum computing and nanotechnology.... I don't see that level of growth happening at Western.

CharlesMunroe
May 9, 2007, 9:59 PM
I was'nt implying a horse and buggy town by any means. I really would like to know how many people RIM and Opentext do employ. I know they made a lot of people rich in the stock market but how big of an actual impact do they make on the region?
BTW, congrats on "buying" the rights to host next years Memorial Cup. It was announced today, Kitchener got it.

FazDeH
May 9, 2007, 10:58 PM
Yeah I wasnt trying to start a London vs KW debate, it was only a response to earlier posts. I liked Waterloo, I did my undergraduate there. Yeah to both universities, enough said.

and CharlesMunroe "BTW, congrats on "buying" the rights to host next years Memorial Cup. It was announced today, Kitchener got it." really? you feel the need to be that rude? common man, totally unnessissary.

Cambridgite
May 9, 2007, 11:48 PM
I was'nt implying a horse and buggy town by any means. I really would like to know how many people RIM and Opentext do employ. I know they made a lot of people rich in the stock market but how big of an actual impact do they make on the region?
BTW, congrats on "buying" the rights to host next years Memorial Cup. It was announced today, Kitchener got it.

Open Text has about 300 employees in their Waterloo head office.
http://www.opentext.com/news/pr.html?id=1508

RIM has about 3,000 employees. Here's a list of Waterloo Region's top employers.
http://www.region.waterloo.on.ca/web/region.nsf/c56e308f49bfeb7885256abc0071ec9a/d8870b03464400a185256b1400699983!OpenDocument

I apologize for my nasty comment about the 'shaw'. But that's what happens when you compare my hometown to Vaughn. :haha: Albeit, some of the newer areas resemble it terribly. :(

Cambridgite
May 9, 2007, 11:57 PM
Since we're on the topic of techy stuff, here's an article that talks about the new Mazak Technology Centre that just opened (I think it's open) in Cambridge.

http://www.newswire.ca/en/releases/archive/May2007/02/c3895.html

I saw it while driving by. It's kind of a building that just popped up in the middle of nowhere, and I wasn't sure what they do there, so I decided to check it out. It's just off the 401, south of Jamieson Parkway and between the Franklin and Townline exits. Finally, back to the developments!

CharlesMunroe
May 10, 2007, 5:07 AM
Cambridgite, thanks for that employer list. RIM has a lot more jobs then I expected, thats good to see. ATS is the one I would be more excited about having in town though. They're a top solar panel maker right? They should have a great future. Any expansion plans announced? I bet they expand more then the others. Also, did'nt Dare get shut down recently screwing the workers out of their pensions?

FazDeH, lighten up man! It was said "tongue in cheek" and if you followed the bid process, which started 2 years ago, you'd know what I was talking about.

Kitchener was never considered a favorite and was'nt even mentioned much. Until a couple weeks ago during the big presentations when Kitchener guranteed the league an unprecedented $1.8 million profits. Other bids were thought to be closer to a million. Then all the media talked about leading up to the announcement was the money, which is never suppose to be a deciding factor.

Congrats on getting them. I'm surprised nobody here has mentioned it. It will have a huge impact on your area and is a great opportunity to show off your city to the country for a week and a half and leave $10-15 million in your city. With a chance to see some of the greatest hockey. It will be a great party with long lasting benefits.

WaterlooInvestor
May 10, 2007, 12:20 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 10, 2007, 12:49 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 10, 2007, 12:52 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 10, 2007, 1:08 PM
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FazDeH
May 10, 2007, 4:04 PM
"FazDeH, lighten up man! It was said "tongue in cheek"" quote^^^ Yeah I realize, sorry

Cambridgite
May 11, 2007, 10:06 PM
Hey, any of you guys know if anything is happening to the Lang Tannery in downtown Kitchener? That building is just sitting there rotting, and it has so much potential!! It's quite close to Kaufman Lofts, the UW school of Pharmacy, and Peer Group (all recent conversions/developments). It seems logical that that building can't be sitting empty for too much longer. The region really seems to have a thing for adaptive re-use in particular.

Cambridgite
May 11, 2007, 10:43 PM
Here's some information about the potential redevelopment of "the block that rocks".

http://www.coldwellbankerpbr.com/news.aspx?article=rockin-kit-core.html

I wonder if that's where Icon Condominiums is going. They did say it was steps from city hall.

WaterlooInvestor
May 12, 2007, 7:48 AM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 12, 2007, 5:01 PM
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Cambridgite
May 12, 2007, 8:16 PM
As for the Lang Tannery, it is a dump - but then again so was the Kaufman site 3 years ago. That area is the best to show the changing face of Downtown Kitchener. It shows there's still a lot of work to be do be done: Lang Tannery, Uhaul storage, the top-right corner of King&Victoria.[/QUOTE]

Don't forget the almost suburban amounts of parking there! :jester:

Cambridgite
May 12, 2007, 8:28 PM
I can't believe we were just talking about this property, and today there's a front page write-up in The Record:

Village of lofts, shops eyed for old Lang property :cheers:
MATT WALCOFF
KITCHENER (May 12, 2007)

http://www.therecord.com/graphics/home_page_front_story/kwr1040014_1.jpg
KITCHENER
Lang Tanning property
Block of Charles St. W., Francis St., Joseph St. and Victoria St. S.

http://www.therecord.com/graphics/home_page_front_story/kwr1040014_2.jpg
PETER LEE, RECORD STAFF
The former Lang Tanning could become Kitchener's version of Toronto's Distillery District.


For 60 years, the former Lang Tanning property in downtown Kitchener has sat in limbo, awaiting redevelopment that has yet to come.

With urban living becoming popular again and demand for land in Kitchener outpacing supply, real estate agent John Whitney, who has been commissioned to sell the property, says it's finally time to revitalize the 5.6 acres on Joseph Street.

Whitney sees the property as Kitchener's version of Toronto's Distillery District -- a pedestrian village of lofts, restaurants and upscale shops in buildings formerly used to produce whisky.

"This is going to be a very, very significant project for downtown Kitchener," he says. "It couldn't be a better time with all the activity that is generating in downtown."

But unlike the developers of the Distillery District, Kitchener's Kaufman Lofts or Waterloo's Bauer Lofts, the buyer of the Lang Tannery would not be starting with a vacant building.

Over the past few decades, the airy spaces of the former tannery have become home to martial arts studios, artists' workshops, wood shops and other small businesses -- more than two dozen in total.

Some of the businesses fear redevelopment of the property will put them out of business.

Andrew Wainwright of AJW Specialty Lumber says he has put a great deal of money and effort into his woodworking shop in the main tannery building.

He says he and some of his fellow tenants likely would not be able to find affordable space elsewhere in town.

"The City of Kitchener, if they want to redevelop this building, is being very short-sighted," he says. "They want to keep the downtown alive, and there are a lot of small businesses that might have to be shut down if the building is developed."

The property includes more than 400,000 square feet of space in 18 to 20 buildings, depending on how one counts some of the structures that have been attached to each other over the years.

Ball Construction Inc. has owned the property since 1973, when the company bought it from Lang Tanning. Production had ceased in 1954.

"They've just kind of been babysitting the buildings all these years," Whitney says. "They've enjoyed tenants and cash flow, and now they're saying it's up to the next developer to recycle the building to further glory."

Jim Ball, one of the three brothers in charge of Ball Construction, says his company always intended to redevelop the buildings. It has spent hundreds of thousands of dollars keeping the structures up to building code.

The Balls are selling the building because they have reached retirement age and realize it will take someone else to make the commitment necessary to give the property another life, he says.

Unlike the city-owned Centre Block, the City of Kitchener is likely to let the market decide what to do with the Lang property, says Rod Regier, executive director of the city's economic development department.

The zoning for the property allows mixed-use development, and the buildings have no historical designation that would prevent an owner from reworking them. Whitney says he expects a new owner would keep the main building's historic facade for the charm value.

The building will also require some minor environmental remediation but nothing that should hold up any reconstruction, Whitney says.

Regier says he is not too concerned about what might happen to the building's existing tenants.

"The city is not without alternative low-cost warehouse space," he says.

Not all of the tenants oppose the redevelopment of the property.

"I think it would be a great idea to revitalize the downtown," says fashion designer Stephanie Storm, whose company, Glyphiks Design, is headquartered in the former tannery.

"We've all been kind of expecting it for a while," says Storm, who is planning to move her workspace into her home's basement.

Whitney's agency, J.J. Barnicke Whitney Ltd., has begun sending out feelers to potential buyers.

Whitney says he hopes to close a sale by fall. Redevelopment of the buildings might then take a few years.


TANNERY ONCE LARGEST IN BRITISH EMPIRE

The Lang Tanning complex is one of the last reminders of downtown Kitchener's industrial heritage.

Founded by German immigrant Reinhold Lang in 1849, Lang Tanning grew to become the largest tannery in the British Empire in the 1920s and 1930s.

The factory employed as many as 600 people and turned out 800 hides a day, using tree bark from around the world to colour leather used in various products.

The buildings currently on the site date from 1895 to 1949, according to real estate agent John Whitney.

Lang Tanning was unable to compete with the synthetic products that became popular after the Second World War, and the plant closed in 1954. For the next 19 years, the Lang company rented out most of the building to Uniroyal Ltd., which used the buildings for tire storage.

Ball Brothers Ltd., now Ball Construction Inc., bought the building in 1973, intending to redevelop it.

That redevelopment never occurred, and small businesses eventually occupied nearly all of the building's space.

The last redevelopment proposal for the site to come to light came from Kitchener developer Alex Ruge, who wanted to build a shopping centre and apartment building there in the late 1980s.

Ruge -- who was released from a U.S. prison last month after serving 40 months for bribery -- was unable to work out a deal for the property.

You know it's funny. When my alarm clock went off this morning, the radio was on and I heard them talking about that. Unfortunately I was half asleep and couldn't remember much of it by the time I actually woke up.

It is pretty ironic though, especially after I posted that question. I feel bad for the existing businesses in that building and I think the city should make an effort to accomodate them. It may be feasible to rework some of them into the ground floor, but only so much can be done. Some of them may just have to relocate to the suburbs....I dunno..:shrug: However, what exists there now really doesn't seem to be maximizing the use of that site. I really like the idea of the mixed-use building and as that pedestrian environment extends into the warehouse district with all of the other developments, I think it's really well timed. Now let's hope Manulife will sell its parking lot in future years (probably after the LRT gets developed)!

As for the block that rocks, I hope the clubs do come back! Kitchener and (especially) Cambridge are hurting for an entertainment district. Uptown Waterloo's is alright.

Cambridgite
May 13, 2007, 7:09 PM
The City of Kitchener plans to create mixed-use corridors on some major roads within the inner-city. These include, Queen street south to the train tracks, Victoria street south to the train tracks, Victoria street north to Lancaster, King street west to Waterloo, King street east to the expressway. These corridors would give adjacent neighborhoods a local shopping street and would centralize on and compliment the downtown core. Other detached mixed-use corridors include parts of Belmont Avenue and the top of the top of Lancaster, near the expressway.

http://www.kitchener.ca/pdf/mixed_use_design_brief_report.pdf

I like the idea a lot. It could be achievable over time, but I think there needs to really be a lot of vibrancy within the immediate downtown before these corridors can be extended outward. I especially like how King street would be a continuous, mixed-use corridor from Uptown Waterloo, all the way down to the expressway. This would be AMAZING and would certainly complement the LRT service. I always found inner-city Kitchener to be weird in that its main streets outside the downtown aren't mixed-use and they seem really incohesive. Some single-detached homes here, a conveniece store there, gas stations, auto-body shops and car dealerships. I'm not sure how this plan may conflict with existing homes and businesses, but I'd really like to see the small downtown made large.

WaterlooInvestor
May 14, 2007, 2:42 AM
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Cambridgite
May 14, 2007, 3:10 AM
Awesome photos, WaterlooInvestor! :tup: I'm still collecting a lot of photos right now as I'm gradually creating a photo thread for the whole Region. Unfortunately, the weather wasn't great when I was taking pics of Victoria Park. Would I be able to use those? They look great!

rapid_business
May 14, 2007, 5:05 AM
yeah. please direct me to some good pictures of the region. I have no idea what to expect, and am moving there in less then 3 months now.

WaterlooInvestor
May 14, 2007, 6:44 AM
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rapid_business
May 14, 2007, 2:00 PM
I'm full aware of what I'm getting into in terms of the size of city we're moving to. That's life, and we can deal with that. I'm there primarily for my education, so the rest really can take a back seat.

Vibrancy sets the tone of a city in my opinion. Vibrancy can make a town of 20,000 feel cooler then some cities over a million. Some think we only really find this in our club/lounge districts, and gentrified arts districts, but I would beg to differ.

Anyways. Sell me on the city, but show me what sucks too. If you have pics, I'd like to see... uptown, downtown, Uni, parks, cool neighbourhoods, shitty neighbourhoods, random houses, industrial parks, the 401, etc

Cambridgite
May 14, 2007, 3:35 PM
Pros and Cons of Waterloo Region:

Pros:

- easy to find work
- safe and clean, with 2nd lowest homocide rate in Canada, behind Oshawa CMA
- generally friendly people
- good universities
- all of your necessities are here, and if you have a car, you'll do quite well
- lots of nice small towns nearby, such as St. Jacobs and Stratford, although they are overrun with tourists from the city
- countryside is ideal for road biking
- since you'll be here in the summer, expect mostly warm and humid conditions (i like that kind of weather). Some good thunderstorms too!
- increasingly vibrant uptowns/downtowns
- if you look for it, there are some really nice parks, neighborhoods, and districts. Sometimes they are hidden though (i.e. Belmont Village).
- Region of small towns. For better or for worse, every town within this conurbation has its own unique identity and feel.
- Good trail system and the architecture of downtown Galt is stunning! Nice scenery along the Grand River as well.
- Increasingly culturally diverse. Immigration and migration from the GTA has really changed the demographics of the KW area. It is still far behind TOR/VAN, but is definitely more diverse than you might expect for a city of its size.
- Close to Toronto. Generally, there is no need to go there, but it can be fun :) ! Whenever you need your big city fix, Canada's largest metropolis is just around the corner.
- Region of progress. This is probably the feature that most entices me to stay here. There is always improvement. One minute you're complaining about what the region lacks, and the next minute the region has it! Definitely a city of the future.

Cons:
- SPRAWL!! This region has bland and terrible urban sprawl. It's an absolute eyesore and I can't see how anyone can find beauty in it. Traffic and smog are getting worse as well. It has to be at least 90% suburban.
- In the shadow of Toronto. The region lacks a lot of media attention, or any kind of known presence because of this. Many of the people living here grew up in the Toronto area and so their expectations run high, only finding themselves disappointed when they arrive. It is still viewed as small-townish.
- Lack of community pride. You'll really find this when you go to University. People do not get out and explore the community and life pretty much stops at University Plaza. As a result, people say "this place is so boring" or "I can't wait to get back to Toronto". There is an attitude of defeat when it comes to entertainment. People don't want to make a fun time, so they complain and/or have fun elsewhere. A lot of outsiders have very negative views on the region. Visit the "most underrated cities in Canada" thread under "Canada". You'll see what I mean.
- Kitchener has the largest downtown in the Region and it's still sub-par for a 500,000+ metro. At best, it's about as developed as St. John's. Even St. John's has MUCH more interesting architecture and topography though. Downtown Kitchener has just come out of a 30 year period of severe decline. The downtown lost a lot of its industrial base and basically become the St. Louis of Canada. Things are turning around rather quickly in the past 5 years, but it will take a long time to make it a region-wide attraction or even change the negative perceptions people have, which are GREATLY exaggerated. People base a lot of their opinions of a city on downtown areas. Without a strong core, all you have is suburbs. Suburbs are the same shit everywhere, just different piles.
- Physical geography is bland and non-descript. Rolling hills are the best way to describe it. Outside the city, it is very agricultural.

rapid_business
May 15, 2007, 3:08 AM
Good list. Anything else? Favorite locations, pubs, 3rd places, local shops, etc? Any list of pictures?

(oh, and here is a shamless plug of what's happening in Edmonton... (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=126429))

Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 4:37 AM
First of all, I will start out with our limited nightlife scene. In Cambridge, 2 of the clubs we used to have are shut down. One was a country bar, located in a plaza, and it moved to Brantford to escape the high taxes and cost of land, as well as the NIMBYs in the new subdivision behind it, who were bitching about the noise, even though they knew the club was there when they bought their house :hell: . Rumour has it that Hooters is moving into the building. Fiddler's Green was located in downtown Galt in a really nice building, but the owner was going into retirement and sold the place. It is now becoming an upscale restaurant. Since the closure of these 2 clubs, a new club/strip club called Lenny B's has just opened up in an industrial park. It is huge and apparently it's good, but I've never checked it out.

Kitchener's club scene is a bit of an improvement. If you're into country :yuck: , the Stampede Corral is at Courtland/Stirling, in a run-down plaza. In downtown Kitchener, there is Elements (hip hop), the Wax (rock/alternative), the Still, and Club Abstract (goth). Passions Lounge appears to be a mostly black club while Club Renaissance is where you go if you're gay. My favourite bar is the Still. It's a chilled out atmosphere :cool: and it has a nice patio and volleyball courts out in front, as well as a tropical sort of feel. Don't expect much dancing though. There is also a Spanish club at Ottawa/Westmount, located in a strip mall. It's mostly middle-aged people though.

Waterloo is the undisputed club capital of the Region. This has almost entirely to do with the student population living in the area. The closest thing the region has to a nightlife district is King/Bridgeport. Within a block or two from that intersection, there is the Silver Spur, the Fox and the Fiddle, McMullens, Ethels Lounge and others. On Friday and Saturday nights it can get quite busy there and there are cops walking around everywhere! Just up the street is Phil's, which is by far the Region's dirtiest bar. It plays heavy metal music and the floors are sticky. The thing that makes Phils so popular is the cheap drinks. It is the perfect place to get drunk and get out. Fubar is located in University Plaza, right next to the University of Waterloo and it's mostly rap/hip-hop. The drinks are overpriced and I was had a problem with an asshole DJ (don't ask). REV (revolution) is located in an industrial park in Waterloo and is mostly rap/hip-hop/R&B. It's pretty large and is home to southern Ontario's largest live-to-air (whatever that means :shrug: ). A local radio station, 91.5 the Beat, plays it on the radio late on Friday nights. In terms of on-campus bars, U of Waterloo has the Bomb Shelter while Laurier has the Turret.

If you have the transportation available, I would check out downtown Guelph, which has a pretty good bar scene.

Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 5:07 AM
Another thing I would recommend is that if you're staying in KW over the fall, check out Oktoberfest. KW is home to the largest Oktoberfest in North America and it's pretty reputable. Unfortunately, I've never actually been to it myself. I'm only 20 and both this year and last year, due dates have conflicted with my ability to attend.

In terms of my favourite local business, I would recommend you to check out Ye's Sushi in downtown Kitchener. It's all-you-can-eat for $13 at lunch and $20 at dinner. The selection and service is great and the place has grown popular very quickly. I think it's a revitalization strategy on its own :D !! In the market district (downtown Kitchener's east end), there's a bit of an oriental ethnic strip forming. Nothing close to Toronto's Chinatown, but perhaps worth checking out. The area actually has more of a Vietnamese focus than anything else. Downtown Galt is also an area you should visit. Pictures can only do so much to give you the experience. If you like biking, Cambridge has great trails and they run along the Grand River through Galt. I could go on forever talking about all the nifty little restaurants and cafes that have opened up in the downtowns of Kitchener, Waterloo, and Galt in recent years. They are great places to check out if you seek refuge from the big chains. If you like good ice cream palours, downtown Hespeler has "Indulge", which is possibly the only viable business in that area :haha: .

As far as good parks go, I think the best ones are Waterloo Park (obviously near Uptown Waterloo), Victoria Park (downtown Kitchener), and Riverside Park (downtown Preston). Other notable parks are Victoria Park in the Dickson Hill neighborhood of Galt, Churchill Park in southern Cambridge, and RIM Park in Waterloo. The Cities are pretty green overall. My favourite residential neighborhoods include Dickson Hill/Blair Road (considered the tri-cities most desirable neighborhood) in Galt, Civic Centre, Victoria Park, KW Hospital in Kitchener, and Belmont Village, near the KW border. All of these neighborhoods will be included in my pics. I'd have to say, Waterloo Region probably has some of the most well-preserved inner-city neighborhoods I've seen :tup: .

Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 5:09 AM
Another thing I would recommend is that if you're staying in KW over the fall, check out Oktoberfest. KW is home to the largest Oktoberfest in North America and it's pretty reputable. Unfortunately, I've never actually been to it myself. I'm only 20 and both this year and last year, due dates have conflicted with my ability to attend.

In terms of my favourite local business, I would recommend you to check out Ye's Sushi in downtown Kitchener. It's all-you-can-eat for $13 at lunch and $20 at dinner. The selection and service is great and the place has grown popular very quickly. I think it's a revitalization strategy on its own :D !! In the market district (downtown Kitchener's east end), there's a bit of an oriental ethnic strip forming. Nothing close to Toronto's Chinatown, but perhaps worth checking out. The area actually has more of a Vietnamese focus than anything else. Downtown Galt is also an area you should visit. Pictures can only do so much to give you the experience. If you like biking, Cambridge has great trails and they run along the Grand River through Galt. I could go on forever talking about all the nifty little restaurants and cafes that have opened up in the downtowns of Kitchener, Waterloo, and Galt in recent years. They are great places to check out if you seek refuge from the big chains. If you like good ice cream palours, downtown Hespeler has "Indulge", which is possibly the only viable business in that area :haha: .

As far as good parks go, I think the best ones are Waterloo Park (obviously near Uptown Waterloo), Victoria Park (downtown Kitchener), and Riverside Park (downtown Preston). Other notable parks are Victoria Park in the Dickson Hill neighborhood of Galt, Churchill Park in southern Cambridge, and RIM Park in Waterloo. The Cities are pretty green overall. My favourite residential neighborhoods include Dickson Hill/Blair Road (considered the tri-cities most desirable neighborhood) in Galt, Civic Centre, Victoria Park, KW Hospital in Kitchener, and Belmont Village, near the KW border. All of these neighborhoods will be included in my pics. I'd have to say, Waterloo Region probably has some of the most well-preserved inner-city neighborhoods I've seen :tup: .

Well, that was a mouthful, but I figure that's pretty good for now.

rapid_business
May 15, 2007, 5:16 AM
Thanks. Yeah, we'll (my wife, my dog and I) be moving down for a couple (3 that is) years at least. So we'll be there for a couple OktoberFest's along with the rest.

Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 5:18 AM
Oops, double post.
Anyways, here are some pics of Old Galt for now.

http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a138/ldoto/2005/IMGP3240.jpg&imgrefurl=http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D84378%26page%3D5&h=768&w=1024&sz=438&hl=en&start=17&tbnid=saw61OQlfqkS9M:&tbnh=113&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3DNorth%2BEnd%2BLondon,%2BOntario%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den

I didn't take them, but I will be taking some others and adding them to this collection. Downtown livens up a bit in the summer. By the way, how do you post pictures up on these threads? I'm not good with technology :( .

rapid_business
May 15, 2007, 5:42 AM
I don't think that is the right link. I see a crappy apartment in London on that link.

Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 6:07 AM
Well, I'll try again.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=126650

I hope this is it. If not, go under "my city photos", 4th page, and "It's not on the map, but Galt has some of North America's finest stone architecture."

Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 6:25 AM
Good list. Anything else? Favorite locations, pubs, 3rd places, local shops, etc? Any list of pictures?

(oh, and here is a shamless plug of what's happening in Edmonton... (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=126429))

Dear god, that is one hell of a condo boom :cheers: !! Congrats on Edmonton moving into the same leagues as Toronto and Vancouver!! What is all this I hear about Deadmonton :shrug: ? Looks like a boomtown to me. And Century Park must be Edmonton's larger-scale version of Barrel Yards. That development is just nuts. Downtown Edmonton will be bustling in no time!

WaterlooInvestor
May 15, 2007, 11:02 AM
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Cambridgite
May 15, 2007, 4:20 PM
Good postings Cambridgite. I just have to clarify one misconception some people have though. Although "Many of the people living here grew up in the Toronto area" it isn't anywhere near a majority of our population. (I know you didn't say this, but there are others that do). As you can see KW's growth is fairly balanced:
http://www.statcan.ca/english/freepub/91-214-XIE/2006000/ct004_en.gif


I never said that everyone did, but based on my experience living here, a lot of people did. However, living in an area of Cambridge that is relatively close to the 401, my experience may also be biased. Neither did I say that all those people who move here from the Toronto area are necessarily commuters. Some of them are. But I have also met lots of people who move here for a job relocation. Sometimes both work locally or one spouse continues commuting. If the intraprovincial migration figure were to be examined more closely, I would be willing to bet that many of those people are from the GTA, as opposed to other parts of Ontario. I laughed when I saw the little red bar to the left, as I am one of the few interprovincial migrants to this region (grew up in New Brunswick until I was 10). With all of that construction going on in Edmonton..I think we know where that interprovincial out-migration is going :haha: .

Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 4:07 AM
Good news guys!! Barrel Yards WILL begin construction in September 2007 :banana: ! The entire development will take about 5 years to complete. I did find it strange how there was no mention of the office building in the article though. Barrel Yards proposal did include an office building at Erb and Father David Bauer.

http://www1.servicecanada.gc.ca/en/on/offices/0602lmb/pdf/kitchener0602_e.pdf

Look under construction in the second page. This will provide us with lots of good photo updates in the future. 770 units of URBAN, high-density housing. Waterloo Region is surprising me more and more every day :) .

Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 5:51 AM
OCCUPANCY is expected to take place in March 2008 for the Bauer Lofts. I guess this means the actual construction must be starting soon.

http://www.bauerlofts.com/

I hate how all these brownfield clean-ups are taking so long. I wanna see the cranes go up!! :banana:

WaterlooInvestor
May 16, 2007, 8:13 AM
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Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 2:27 PM
Population Increase: Also to note for interprovincial migration - I've run into quite a few people who moved to the Kitchener CMA from our zone of influence. (ie. 2 people from stratford, 1 from woodstock, 1 from tavistock, 1 from brussels, 2 from port elgin, 1 from hanover, etc...)

Really? I know one person who periodically moves back and forth from Woodstock, but that's it as far as those communities are concerned. I've never even heard of Brussels. Tavistock and Hanover ring a bell, but I don't even know where they are. They may be in our zone of influence, but really Southern Ontario is overlapping zones of influence. Certainly our zone of influence overlaps with Toronto's, Hamilton's, and London's zones of influence. But really, you don't know many people here who moved from the Toronto area? Or students originally from the Toronto area who graduated and decided to stay here? It seems a lot of the people I know are from either Toronto, Mississauga, Brampton, or immigrated from another country (especially India). Doesn't Waterloo get similar migration patterns?

[/QUOTE]Funny that you're from N.B., my grandma and two of her sisters grew up in Shediac. (going back to visit next month) They now live in KW.[/QUOTE]

Cool :cool: . Isn't Shediac the one with the big lobster statue? :haha:

[/QUOTE] Barrel Yards: That link is from last summer. Any newer updates?[/QUOTE]

Sorry man. Couldn't find much on it. It seems there's a lot of projects that are proposed at the moment but are awaiting construction. I'm willing to bet 1-2 years from now the skyline is going to be full of cranes. We've got a lot of brownfield remediation to do before that though.

Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 2:30 PM
And of course, I know lots of people from older generations of migration from Newfoundland (mainly Bell Island) and Portugal. Oh boy, Cambridge is quite the place to be when Portugal is playing in the World Cup!

rapid_business
May 16, 2007, 10:48 PM
Bauer Lofts are sold out too I assume? Is there new condo/lofts in uptown or downtown for sale right now? pre-sale that is...

Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 11:06 PM
Bauer Lofts are sold out too I assume? Is there new condo/lofts in uptown or downtown for sale right now? pre-sale that is...

Bauer Lofts are completely sold out, even though they haven't even started construction! Currently there are the in-towns up for sale. That's a townhouse development on the south-west corner of inner-city Kitchener, in the Highland/Queen area. However, those may be a little more spacious and expensive than what you're looking for, plus it's a little offset from the real high amenity area (10-15 minute walk from the immediate downtown). I'm not sure if LeMarche (Market district, downtown Kitchener) is entirely occupied yet, but it probably will be in 3 months if you're not quick. Kaufman's is totally sold out. From there, it looks like everything is in the planning or clean-up stage and nothing is actually being sold. Many of the developments going on right now are from brownfields, so the process takes forever :hell: ! Plus all those announcements of new developments just came about. I think we're at a point now where demand is exceeding supply. Your best bet is to look on the resale market. Bridgeport Lofts may be a possibility. They are student housing in Uptown Waterloo. Thinking of renting? There's lots of apartments around campus and also in the uptown/downtown areas. X-Flats and Andys apartments are under construction, so you may be able to get into one of those (I'll check). They are located across from each other. They are a 10-15 walk north of Uptown Waterloo and well-served by transit. They are about a 15-20 minute walk from U of W campus.

Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 11:11 PM
X-Flats are about 50% sold and construction is only around the start.

http://www.x-flats.com/main.html#main

Cambridgite
May 16, 2007, 11:35 PM
X-Flats will be ready for occupancy for Spring 2008 by the way....so that's a little late for what you want.
On the other hand, Andy's Apartments will be ready for September 1, 2007, so that's your best bet :tup: .

http://www.andysapartments.ca/316king/

rapid_business
May 16, 2007, 11:38 PM
X-Flats are about 50% sold and construction is only around the start.

http://www.x-flats.com/main.html#main

hahaha... 5 bdrm., 2 bth. in a 1400 sq. ft. unit? Obviously meant to buy and rent out to students. I wouldn't touch a place in there with a ten-foot-pole unless I meant to keep it and rent it out for years.

Realistically, we'll rent a place for a bit while we look for something to buy out there. There are a couple houses in the University area we are interested in, but ideally a loft in the uptown or downtown area is our 'flow'. As I've said before, it's good to go somewhere where our gain from real-estate here can be benificial.

WaterlooInvestor
May 17, 2007, 6:28 AM
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Cambridgite
May 17, 2007, 1:58 PM
The opposite effect occurs with the small towns North/West of the Region. I imagine KW receives most of the small town migration simply because it's closer. Other areas I've heard people moving from: Owen Sound, Goderich, Listowel.

Funny you say that, because I know a guy from Kitchener who wanted to do the opposite and move to Listowel to get a bigger house for far less money. I haven't been to Listowel, but I understand it's a long commute. I just think people are crazy :koko: for putting material goods ahead of their own health and well-being. With the price of gas, you're probably not saving much anyways.

Cambridgite
May 17, 2007, 2:25 PM
The Uptown Shops and Residences
http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/2963/uptownshopsandresidenceos5.jpg

To live here, do you have to also own the commercial space on the bottom floor? What's the deal with this? :shrug:

Cambridgite
May 17, 2007, 7:49 PM
Here's a link from 570 NEWS that talks about the upswing in Downtown Kitchener. It's been a long time coming! :cheers:

http://www.570news.com/news/local/article.jsp?content=20070508_042339_4944

Downtown Kitchener Booming
May 07, 2007 - 4:23 am
By: Sherry Morely







The latest statistics suggest Kitchener's downtown is increasingly becoming the place to live.

The population has grown by five-per cent and close to 500 permits were issued last year, compared to less than 100 new residential units in 2005.

21-per cent of the city's construction occurred in the downtown and central neighborhoods last year.

That's three times more than in 2005.

Manager of downtown and community development Silvia Wright says they're hoping a growing population will make the core more attractive for businesses.

The above article compares activity from 2006 to that of 2005.

With the very recent announcement of much larger-scale projects such as Centre Block, Icon Condominiums, and the Lang Tannery, I think we can expect to see this continue. Developers, businesses, and purchasers have enough confidence that soon enough, your average Joe living off Fischer-Hallman wont be afraid to go downtown anymore!! :tup:
Keep in mind, the city has been trying hopelessly to revitalize Downtown Kitchener for DECADES! It's why we now have such monstrosities as Market Square, oodles of surface parking, and we almost ended up with the Central Library instead of the Centre Block development. I think they finally have it right.

Cambridgite
May 18, 2007, 5:45 AM
Here is the 2006 Downtown Kitchener Monitoring Report.
http://www.kitchener.ca/pdf/downtown_monitoring_report_2006.pdf

Look under the residential population part and see the spike in 2006! Other than that, still lots of great stuff. It seems that the whole image of downtown K-town must be changing rather quickly.

WaterlooInvestor
May 18, 2007, 12:01 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 18, 2007, 12:02 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 18, 2007, 12:16 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 18, 2007, 12:29 PM
moved

Waterlooson
May 18, 2007, 4:41 PM
Check out this video of Waterloo:


http://www.intelligentwaterloo.com/en/iw_video.html

Cambridgite
May 18, 2007, 4:59 PM
Okay, if I hear the words "innovative" and "entrepreneurship" one more time, I think I'm going to puke. :jester:

Waterlooson
May 18, 2007, 5:29 PM
Okay, if I hear the words "innovative" and "entrepreneurship" one more time, I think I'm going to puke. :jester:

That wouldn't be very "innovative" of you. Are you sure that you really live in Waterloo Region? :jester:

Cambridgite
May 18, 2007, 6:52 PM
That wouldn't be very "innovative" of you. Are you sure that you really live in Waterloo Region? :jester:
:previous: :haha: :haha: :haha: :tup:

Waterlooson
May 18, 2007, 9:07 PM
Waterloo, a most intelligent community.... London eat your heart out!

http://www.therecord.com/breakingnews/breakingnews_4787261.html

Cambridgite
May 18, 2007, 9:36 PM
This is going to be good....

London vs. KW. Toronto vs. Montreal vs. Vancouver. Calgary vs. Edmonton. Can't we all just unite as Canadians against the Americans? :haha: j/k

Cambridgite
May 18, 2007, 9:37 PM
By the way, why is there always beef between London and KW on skyscraper forums anyways?

rapid_business
May 18, 2007, 10:04 PM
you forgot Regina VS. Saskatoon, Winnipeg Vs. Themselves...

Cambridgite
May 18, 2007, 10:34 PM
Haha, true. And I'm sure there's more (thinking of St. John's vs. Halifax and Saint John vs. Moncton). Nothing like a little healthy competition to strengthen Canada's cities! :tup:

Waterlooson
May 18, 2007, 11:48 PM
By the way, why is there always beef between London and KW on skyscraper forums anyways?

Without starting some city vs. city event, I would like to answer your question. London used to be bigger, better and stronger in nearly every way than Waterloo Region.... but with Waterloo Region's much faster growth rate for several decades now, that is no longer true. Waterloo is like the brash upstart who demands recognition. Maybe it's like a younger more powerful lion challenging the old king over the pride.

Cambridgite
May 19, 2007, 12:06 AM
Without starting some city vs. city event, I would like to answer your question. London used to be bigger, better and stronger in nearly every way than Waterloo Region.... but with Waterloo Region's much faster growth rate for several decades now, that is no longer true. Waterloo is like the brash upstart who demands recognition. Maybe it's like a younger more powerful lion challenging the old king over the pride.

Yeah, it was actually pretty funny reading the "what is Southwestern Ontario?" thread. It was basically several pages stating "KW has a better economy and better universities" (from KW forumers) versus "KW is a bedroom community of Toronto" (from Londoners). It was kind of stupid and irrelevant to the topic, which in itself was stupid since the boundaries are arbituary. Funny how Windsor barely even mentioned.

WaterlooInvestor
May 19, 2007, 2:46 PM
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WaterlooInvestor
May 19, 2007, 2:47 PM
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Waterlooson
May 19, 2007, 3:11 PM
Notice how often they mention "innovation and entrepreneurship" in that last article. LOL

Cambridgite
May 19, 2007, 8:54 PM
Let's have a "smarter than everywhere else" festival. It will be full of innovation, entrepreneuriship, and co-operation among stakeholders!! :banana: :haha: :haha: :haha:

Under our "most intelligent community" banner, we can have another banner that says "London sucks"! :jester:

Waterlooson
May 19, 2007, 10:12 PM
Let's have a "smarter than everywhere else" festival. It will be full of innovation, entrepreneuriship, and co-operation among stakeholders!! :banana: :haha: :haha: :haha:

Under our "most intelligent community" banner, we can have another banner that says "London sucks"! :jester:

You better go out and buy one of those innovatiove water-saving toilets from some enterprising UW graduate entrepreneur who is taking advantage of UW's generous IP policy before you go on some puking binge.... I mean, such "most intelligent community" banners are a real possibility.

Cambridgite
May 19, 2007, 11:48 PM
You better go out and buy one of those innovatiove water-saving toilets from some enterprising UW graduate entrepreneur who is taking advantage of UW's generous IP policy before you go on some puking binge.... I mean, such "most intelligent community" banners are a real possibility.
:previous: :haha: :haha: :haha: