[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Cambridgite]

Here's the commuting data from 2001. Integration with KW has only increased since then.

Place of residence / Place of work, Total - Sex, Male, Female

Wilmot (TP) / Toronto (C) 45 35 0
Wilmot (TP) / Mississauga (C) 85 70 15
Wilmot (TP) / Guelph (C) 95 45 55
Wilmot (TP) / Hamilton (C) 20 15 10
Wilmot (TP) / North Dumfries (TP) 95 70 30
Wilmot (TP) / Cambridge (C) 425 320 105
Wilmot (TP) / Kitchener (C) 1,910 910 1,000
Wilmot (TP) / Waterloo (C) 995 405 585
Wilmot (TP) / Wilmot (TP) 2,120 1,020 1,100
Wilmot (TP) / Wellesley (TP) 55 40 20
Wilmot (TP) / Woolwich (TP) 135 80 55
Wilmot (TP) / Stratford (C) 150 75 80
Wilmot (TP) / Perth East (TP) 45 30 15
Wilmot (TP) / East Zorra-Tavistock (TP) 35 20 10
Wilmot (TP) / Woodstock (C) 50 40 15
Wilmot (TP) / Blandford-Blenheim (TP) 30 10 30
Wilmot (TP) / London (C) 40 10 35

Wellesley (TP) / Guelph (C) 50 25 25
Wellesley (TP) / Mapleton (TP) 135 105 35
Wellesley (TP) / Cambridge (C) 155 85 70
Wellesley (TP) / Kitchener (C) 580 325 260
Wellesley (TP) / Waterloo (C) 785 395 385
Wellesley (TP) / Wilmot (TP) 145 70 70
Wellesley (TP) / Wellesley (TP) 565 365 195
Wellesley (TP) / Woolwich (TP) 410 200 210
Wellesley (TP) / Stratford (C) 40 35 10
Wellesley (TP) / Perth East (TP) 50 0 40

http://www12.statcan.ca/english/census01/products/standard/themes/RetrievePOWProductTable.cfm?Temporal=2001&PID=55532&METH=1&APATH=3&PTYPE=55440&THEME=49&FREE=0&AID=0&FOCUS=0&VID=0&GC=0&GK=0&SC=1&CPP=99&SR=1&RL=0&RPP=9999&POF=R&D1=0&D2=0&D3=0&D4=0&D5=0&D6=0&GID=520311

What are your thoughts? Do these townships look connected to Kitchener's CMA?

Here's the commuting data from 2001. Integration with KW has only increased since then.

Place of residence / Place of work, Total - Sex, Male, Female

Wilmot (TP) / Toronto (C) 45 35 0
Wilmot (TP) / Mississauga (C) 85 70 15
Wilmot (TP) / Guelph (C) 95 45 55
Wilmot (TP) / Hamilton (C) 20 15 10
Wilmot (TP) / North Dumfries (TP) 95 70 30
Wilmot (TP) / Cambridge (C) 425 320 105
Wilmot (TP) / Kitchener (C) 1,910 910 1,000
Wilmot (TP) / Waterloo (C) 995 405 585
Wilmot (TP) / Wilmot (TP) 2,120 1,020 1,100
Wilmot (TP) / Wellesley (TP) 55 40 20
Wilmot (TP) / Woolwich (TP) 135 80 55
Wilmot (TP) / Stratford (C) 150 75 80
Wilmot (TP) / Perth East (TP) 45 30 15
Wilmot (TP) / East Zorra-Tavistock (TP) 35 20 10
Wilmot (TP) / Woodstock (C) 50 40 15
Wilmot (TP) / Blandford-Blenheim (TP) 30 10 30
Wilmot (TP) / London (C) 40 10 35

Wellesley (TP) / Guelph (C) 50 25 25
Wellesley (TP) / Mapleton (TP) 135 105 35
Wellesley (TP) / Cambridge (C) 155 85 70
Wellesley (TP) / Kitchener (C) 580 325 260
Wellesley (TP) / Waterloo (C) 785 395 385
Wellesley (TP) / Wilmot (TP) 145 70 70
Wellesley (TP) / Wellesley (TP) 565 365 195
Wellesley (TP) / Woolwich (TP) 410 200 210
Wellesley (TP) / Stratford (C) 40 35 10
Wellesley (TP) / Perth East (TP) 50 0 40

http://www12.statcan.ca/english/census01/products/standard/themes/RetrievePOWProductTable.cfm?Temporal=2001&PID=55532&METH=1&APATH=3&PTYPE=55440&THEME=49&FREE=0&AID=0&FOCUS=0&VID=0&GC=0&GK=0&SC=1&CPP=99&SR=1&RL=0&RPP=9999&POF=R&D1=0&D2=0&D3=0&D4=0&D5=0&D6=0&GID=520311

What are your thoughts? Do these townships look connected to Kitchener's CMA?

They certainly do. But it doesn't matter how they look if they don't meet the guidelines. I used the instructions from 229-235 in this PDF to do the calculations (big file to load).
http://www12.statcan.ca/english/census01/Products/Reference/dict/appendices/92-378-XIE02002.pdf

It turns out they do meet the criteria, unless I'm missing something. 66% of Wellesley's labour force commutes to the CMA and 30% of the labour force working in Wellesley is from the CMA. 56% of Wilmot's labour force works in the CMA while 27% of the labour force working in Wilmot is from the CMA. The percentage commuting in Wellesley is 79%, while it is 73% in Wilmot. As you look at the minimum numbers needed to include them in the CMA, one can conclude that their integration is more than strong enough.

Regardless, why is it such a big deal that we enlarge our CMA to include them? It doesn't take any more than a few years for our CMA to gain the current populations of Wellesley and Wilmot anyways. Even if they were included, what does that prove? Look, we're bigger now? This wont really change anything, other than the numbers themselves. Sure, our CMA will hit the 500,000 mark a few years earlier. Big deal, it's going to happen soon anyways.

[Cambridgite]

Sorry, meant to say "percent commuting interchange", not "percent commuting".

[jeremy_haak]

The delineation rules for a CMA for the 2006 Census are here: http://www12.statcan.ca/english/census06/reference/dictionary/geo009a.cfm

I think the statistic we're interested in here is the percentage of the total labour force of Wilmot and Wellesley that work in the delineation urban core. Unfortunately, I don't know what the delineation urban core for the Kitchener CMA is, but for interest's sake, I'll calculate the percentage of the total labour force of each township working within the Kitchener CMA (Waterloo, Kitchener, Cambridge, North Dumfries, and Woolwich).

Forward Commuting:
Wilmot: 56%
Wellesley: 66%

Reverse Commuting:
Wilmot: 27%
Wellesley: 30%

For Forward Commuting:
My guess is that the percentage of people working within the CMA, but outside the urban core, is enough to drop the percentage below 50%.
For Reverse Commuting:
My guess is that once again the delineation urban core is what ultimately cuts the percentage to less than 25%

Overall, it's safe to assume that they'll both be included by 2011, though we'll have to wait a bit longer for the relevant parts of the 2006 census to be released.

[jeremy_haak]

Addendum:

OK, more data crunching.

I found this map for the Kitchener CMA: http://geodepot.statcan.ca/Diss/Maps/ReferenceMaps/retrieve_cmaca.cfm?pdf_index=33

It seems to indicate that the urban core includes Kitchener, Waterloo, and Cambridge and two small secondary urban cores, which I'm not sure are part of the delineation urban core or not.

In any case, if I just do the numbers for the three cities, there isn't a sufficient number of reverse commuter (living within the CMA and commuting to the township) to qualify. Both fall below 25%.

On the other hand, for forward commuters, the numbers both stay above 50% (52% for Wellesley, 53% for Wilmot). Your guess is as good as mine why they were included, because for all purposes, according to Statscan's definitions, they should be.

The only factor I can think of that could change things is that Statscan isn't listing the data from the CSDs with a very small number of commuters to or from those two townships. That could possibly raise the totals to a point where the ratios fall below 50%. I'm somewhat doubtful of that scenario though.

[Waterlooson]

You could be right, but quite frankly, until you produce the numbers, I'm going to believe that Stats Canada had maintained their integrity and correctly produced the boundaries for the Kitchener CMA. The census dictionary is explicitly clear on the criteria for including a CSD into a CMA. Show me the numbers, and I'll believe you.

At least you have an open mind, so that's good. However, it's so obvious that Kitchener CMA = (or greater than) Waterloo Region that asking for statistical proof ( by Stats Canada criteria) is like asking someone to prove (by genetic testing results) that their left index finger is part of their body. As a concrete example of this let's take Mannheim, which is essentially a Kitchener subdivision. However, it is just outside the Kitchener city limits and not part of the Kitchener CMA since it is in Wilmot township. Yet Mannheim is included within the Region of Waterloo. I seriously doubt Stats Canada would even have commuters stats for Mannheim... or St. Agatha... or New Hamburg.... or Baden... or Heidelberg (in Wellesley township and essentially a subdivison of Waterloo) etc.

Check this out (and check out some of the homes being built there):

http://www.mls.ca/map.aspx?AreaID=882

This example is even worse than is the case for Calgary where Okotoks (largely a bedroom community of Calgary) because there is much more distance between those two.... with Kitchener, excluding Mannheim is like excluding a finger as part of your body.

If anything the Kitchener CMA should be even larger than the Waterloo Region area.

[Waterlooson]

Okay, now I have read the subsequent posts... Stats Canada has commuter stats for the townships as a whole only. At any rate, WaterlooInvestor is certainly right in that the importance as an employment centre (and service/retail centre) of K-W-C over the surrounding townships is rapidly increasing.

Even if people living in places like Linwood don't commute into K/W (although lots would) for work (perhaps because they work on a farm) they all go there to shop on a regular basis. Stats Canada's arbitrary criteria has limitations.

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Cambridgite]

So basically, we have many exurbs (or small villages that function as exurbs) not being counted into the CMA. As far as whether or not the CMA should be extended beyond Waterloo Region, it could be iffy there. There are certainly lots of commuters from outside the Region, but the integration may not be strong enough (%-wise) to make the cut. I know Guelph just got included as one of the new CMAs in Statscan, but there is still quite a bit of integration between the 2 CMAs. I'm assuming they've done their homework on Guelph and others, but it would be interesting to see what the numbers say anyhow. And you'll see that once a CMA is formed, it cannot merge with other CMAs. However, within the area of the Greater Golden Horseshoe, it's basically a continuous grouping of CMAs that have a fairly strong commuter flow between them, but probably wasn't strong enough to be grouped into other CMAs before they were created as CMAs in their own right. Jeez, this stuff's kinda confusing.

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Cambridgite]

You know it's strange, but Puslinch Township forms an isolated little gap between the CMAs of Kitchener, Guelph, Toronto, and Hamilton. As we can clearly see from the data, it's an urban-commuter township. It looks like it should be part of the Guelph CMA, although Kitchener and Toronto are significant destinations as well. I'm surprised it's not put under a CMA, especially as Guelph's CMA is brand new. Although it could be that, since it's oriented quite a bit towards 3 CMAs, it doesn't have enough integration with any individual one to be counted into it. :shrug:

http://geodepot.statcan.ca/Diss2006/Maps/Maps_Cartes/CMACACT/ON/CMAT550-B.pdf

I was driving down one of the country roads there recently, and I saw a gated community. Too much like exurban America. :yuck:

[Cambridgite]

Here's some pics by downtown Kitchener by Flar.

http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a138/ldoto/2005/IMGP3240.jpg&imgrefurl=http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D84378%26page%3D5&h=768&w=1024&sz=438&hl=en&start=17&tbnid=saw61OQlfqkS9M:&tbnh=113&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3DNorth%2BEnd%2BLondon,%2BOntario%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den

They're mostly in the city centre district.

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Cambridgite]

I forgot to mention earlier, last Thursday, I was driving my Dad to and from the KW Hospital (he was sedated) and on the way back, we saw a sign that said Icon Condominiums: Right Here on the side of what used to be Howl at the Moon. So I figure the tower will be built on the parking lot at King/Francis, with the possible demolition of the vacant building that used to house Howl at the Moon. Since it's not a building with any heritage value, I don't think there will be much fuss about it. I can't wait to see the renderings for that project. :banana:

[waterloowarrior]

check out google earth... KW imagery finally!

[Waterlooson]

check out google earth... KW imagery finally!

I was just going to post that. :cheers:

[Deez]

Have you guys been reading any of the threads discussing the Manulife rumour for Toronto? Word has been spreading that they're planning on consolidating their operations in a new tallest tower in hogtown. While this would be huge for Toronto, it could have some serious impacts for Waterloo. Thoughts?

[Waterlooson]

Have you guys been reading any of the threads discussing the Manulife rumour for Toronto? Word has been spreading that they're planning on consolidating their operations in a new tallest tower in hogtown. While this would be huge for Toronto, it could have some serious impacts for Waterloo. Thoughts?

Yeah, I have some thoughts.... the "word" was started by one poster who was just engaging in idle speculation.... so any rumor suggesting that they will close the Waterloo operations and move them to Toronto is total rubbish. Waterloo is the headquarters for the Canadian operations (Canadian customer base) and has been for a very long time.... they aren't going anywhere.

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[Cambridgite]

WaterlooInvestor, those are a lot of articles.

First off, I'm sorry to hear about the fire, but I sure am glad it's not affecting Icon Condominiums. :cheers:

I checked out some of the proposals for Centre Block and I have to say there were some elements of the first one that I really liked. The pedestrian mall with the storefronts is a pretty neat idea, reminding me of European cities such as Paris. However, the downsides were that it was too low density for an area so central and a downtown theatre would never fly in Kitchener (at least not for a couple decades of intense development). To support downtown cinemas, you need a large critical mass of people. In a pedestrian-oriented downtown, that's basically the number of people who can walk, bike, or take a brief transit ride to the theatre. In today's world of super-sizing such features, places like Cambridge Galaxy, Waterloo Galaxy, and Empire Cinemas on Sportsworld Dr. in Kitchener, capitalize on their accessibility by mass numbers of people travelling by car. They all are close to highway exits and have rediculous amounts of surface parking. Downtown Kitchener does not offer this kind of accessibility. Downtown Kitchener needs to work on getting a full-out supermarket before it can even think of bringing back the cinemas.

The second proposal was odd to say the least. I'm not so sure how I feel about a park on top of stores and the awkward architecture they show there.

The third proposal just confused me. All I kept seeing was developers are evil, money hungry profit machines. They want the community to design the project, but that's what's going on here in the first place.....unless I'm missing something.

To be honest, I really liked the original proposal by Andrin. Mixed-use along King, keeping with the rhythm of the street. Live-work units fronting Young and Duke Streets, providing for a sense of enclosure. Two point towers adding the kind of density downtown Kitchener needs. To add to that, an accessible public park in the middle of it to provide an oasis and nice gathering spot in the heart of the city. A great example of this is College Park in downtown Toronto. Lots of office workers come to sit there and relax by the fountain during their lunch break. There are lots of pedestrians and a diverse base of people at that. The park is loaded with mature trees and it really has a soothing effect. I think downtown Kitchener could look to this park for inspiration.

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[WaterlooInvestor]

error

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Cambridgite]

I also prefer Andrin's initial design because it has nice qualities with density. I'm going to attend one of the public meetings, and so far the only suggestion I have is to increase density: adding another tower, or adding a few floors. (ie. how they added 2 floors at Kaufman's once they saw how strong demand was)

Update me on how the meetings go. I haven't been able to come out as I've been working a lot lately.

[rapid_business]

Big News:

The first round of Kaufman residents started moving in yesterday (June 6) :banana: :banana: :banana:

Now lets have fun watching the downtown population jump 20% over the next 6 months :cheers: :cheers:

Or let's watch the resale start, and we'll find a place....:banana:

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Deez]

ac888yow reported in the Ottawa Airport thread that Air Canada Jazz is looking into offering service between Waterloo and Ottawa/Montreal. Check for updates in that thread.

[Cambridgite]

Thank you Waterloo Investor and Deez. I'll be sure to check out both.

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Cambridgite]

From SSC: There has been a crane at the Arrow lofts site for the past couple of days installing metal beams on the roof of the existing building (to add more stories I assume).

I'll try to get a picture this weekend :)

Awesome!! Finally past the clean-up stage! :cheers:

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[Cambridgite]

Well, it may not be much yet, but at least they're starting to really get stuff done on it. :tup: Plus the hole beside it looks pretty big now.

I've never seen Victoria Park that busy. Was it on a really hot, humid day that you went?

[rapid_business]

the dirt looks very sandy.... is this normal for the region?

[koops65]

Last century Kitchener used to be named Sandhills.

[koops65]

Oops, I meant in the 19th century :cool:

[Cambridgite]

Last century Kitchener used to be named Sandhills.

Interesting. I never knew that. I know it changed from Berlin to Kitchener in 1914, but when did it change from Sandhills to Berlin?

[koops65]

Even though I'm from this area, I really dont know the history of it too well... I believe Berlin was used for much of the 19th century, Sandhills, and Ebytown for a while too, were used in the early part of the 19th century.

[Waterlooson]

K-W has a lot of clay soils too.

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[rapid_business]

Perhaps it would be easier to find investors with shared vision who have that kind of cash laying around. It's much easier to put forth the effort to help move the hands that control the substantially larger chequing accounts, then to do it yourself. The trick is finding the right person though.

[Cambridgite]

I've been thinking for sometime that most of us on here love Waterloo Region, we just want to build it's urban form. So why don't we do our own little part to help out?

I'm thinking of an "'investment cooperative". Basically we each try to save up $50,000. If 10 of us to do this, we'll have $500,000 (plus a bit more through financing) which we can use to start fixing up small buildings in Downtown/Uptown. Overtime, as we grow our money, we can hopefully take on larger projects.

Obviously most of us on here don't have $50 grand just lying around, but if we did this as a long term goal (ie. over the next 10 years) I think this could be doable. The idea fits in really well with the entrepreneurship-culture that KW is known for. Any thoughts?

Frankly, I'm a 20 year old Planning student at U of W and I'm working on saving up $5,000 this summer, not $50,000. I work a job not much higher than minimum wage and most of the money I make will be spent throughout the upcoming year. I can't even start thinking about something like that now. :(

By the time I'm done my degree, get a job and my own place, Waterloo Region will already be well on its way in improving its urban form. :)

[rapid_business]

exactly. forget the cash... participate in advocacy and letting your voice be heard. Show up at meetings, let developers know what you and other want... etc.

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[Cambridgite]

Downtown Kitchener really needs a grocery store that you don't need to drive to. :yes:

Also, where is MacKenzie King Square?

[Cambridgite]

Does anyone know what is happening to this house on Weber and Scott streets in downtown Kitchener?
http://s206.photobucket.com/albums/bb210/Cambridgite/?action=view&current=Picture200.jpg


WaterlooInvestor, I don't think there needs to be a company to help gentrify urban neighborhoods. If by gentrify, you mean the fixing up older homes and higher-income residents moving into them, resulting in an increase in the value of the area, I don't see why a company needs to do this. First off, this is already happening without any company aiding it. Secondly, gentrification results naturally from a strong core. If the core is weak and undesirable, the surrounding neighborhoods will either reflect that through decay or they will just function as suburbs, except older (especially in Waterloo Region, where most of the inner-city housing stock is single family homes). Thirdly, a gentrification company would have a lot of opposition from affordable housing activists who want to keep the core run down, so poor people have a place to live. This is already happening in KW.

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[Cambridgite]

Wow, I thought the original plan was ambitious, but this is amazing! :D
That is some really impressive, big city stuff going on in Uptown Waterloo. :cheers:

How many storeys are there in the Clarica tower on King? Are we in for a new tallest?

[Waterlooson]

$200-$250 million (up from 100-130)
1006 units (up from 750)
Building heights up to 25 stories (up from 17)
230,000 sq ft of commercial and office space (up from 150,000)
280 hotel rooms (up from 120-150)
Plus a more modern design

All these changes equate to WaterlooInvestor being one happy guy :D :cheers:

(I dare someone to say Waterloo Region isn't urbanizing :haha:)


Along with the strong support of the Ontario government for the LRT, this is a big boost for Waterloo.... hopefully all this development will stimulate more new investment in Kitchener.

[jeremy_haak]

Downtown Kitchener really needs a grocery store that you don't need to drive to. :yes:

Also, where is MacKenzie King Square?

There's a pretty cool Asian food market about a block from the Farmer's Market. You're right though.

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[Cambridgite]

I uploaded the Bauer Lofts render to Photobucket .

Residential: 131 units
Office: 107,392 sq. ft.
Retail: 42,600 sq. ft.

• Building A – Existing 2-storey building to be retained and to accommodate ground floor retail, restaurant and service uses with office uses on the second floor;
• Building B – New 15-storey building to accommodate ground floor retail and restaurant uses, two floors of office uses and 12 storeys of residential apartment units (131 units proposed);
• Building C – New 4-storey building proposed to accommodate specialty food store (Vincenzo’s which is relocating from Belmont http://www.vincenzosonline.com/) on the ground floor and 3 storeys of office uses above the ground floor.

http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa262/AndrewEH/BauerLoftsRendering.jpg

Gorgeous!! :cheers:
I think I just wet myself. :haha:

[WaterlooInvestor]

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[Deez]

Westmount Grand: A new condo at Westmount & Erb. 12 stories high. That area is becoming densly populated.

http://www.westmountgrand.com/

http://www.westmountgrand.com/images/underconstruction.jpg

That's the south-east corner right...the channelized right turn and low rise building to the right would seem to indicate that's the case. If so, the two lots that this will be built on were owned by my former landlord (who was a big asshole). No wonder those places were in such disrepair.

'Bout time the density around the University started to go up.

[Cambridgite]

:previous:
Well, that's cool. However, it's a little far from Uptown and wont really add any urbanity to Waterloo. It will add to the skyline of Corbusier-style buildings in that vicinity though. :)

[Cambridgite]

Taken from the home page of the Bauer Lofts:

"In response to the continued demand for residential lofts in the Bauer Buildings, we are excited to announce an encore release of new loft units! We have redesigned the second and third floors of the existing loft building to be dedicated to residential suites. Register now to take part in the grand opening of our new presentation centre."

http://www.bauerlofts.com/

I wonder where the new lofts will be! :)
After Bauer and Barrelyards, I don't think there are any brownfield sites left in Waterloo. Soooo.... New lofts in Kitchener? New condos in Waterloo that shouldn't actually be called lofts? It'll be interesting to see how this pans out.

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[Deez]

Holy smokes.

1) That Centre Block design looks pretty sweet. They've mostly maintained the streetfront retail while cranking up the density. Thumbs up.

2) Holy Uptown, Batman. With Barrelyards going through and the International Affairs building going up across the street, that is gonna be one busy area in a decade or so. Awesome!

[Cambridgite]

Whoa! Those new pics are very nice! :tup: High five!

What's the building to the right in the elevation? RBC? It doesn't look that shape in the 3D model.

[Cambridgite]

Waterloo OKs BarrelYards vision
Region's largest development project to create brand new town in centre of city
TAMSIN MCMAHON
WATERLOO (Jun 26, 2007)

http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa262/AndrewEH/TheRecord-2007Jun26-A04.jpg

Waterloo council gave the green light to the $250-million BarrelYards project, paving the way for the largest development project in the region.

Councillors unanimously approved changes to zoning requirements that will allow London-based Auburn Developments to build highrise luxury condominiums and apartments buildings, along with hotels, shops and offices in the old industrial heart of the city.

"We're creating a brand new town in the middle of our city," said Coun. Mark Whaley. "It's pretty marvellous."

Plans for the complex on about five hectares (12.7 acres) of the former Canbar lands at Erb Street and Father David Bauer Drive include:

-Two 25-storey condominium towers;

-Four apartment towers, two 21-storeys high, one 18 storeys high, one 12 storeys high;

-12 townhouses;

-10 lowrise mixed-use residential and retail units;

-Two hotels with 280 rooms;

-230,000 sq-ft of commercial office and retail space;

-2,250 parking spaces, most of which would be in a two-level underground garage.

The project was the first major development proposal approved by the new council, which earlier this year supported plans to redevelop a parking lot at Waterloo Town Square into a public square.

The city scrapped a height and density cap that would have restricted the apartment buildings and condominiums to no higher than seven storeys.

Instead, the developer is planning several highrise buildings along Father David Bauer Drive.

Yesterday's council approval signalled an end to a decade-long debate on the property between the city and residents who wanted to keep their low-rise leafy streets from becoming a crowded city core overrun with traffic.

In 1998, Canbar asked the city to change its zoning restrictions in order to turn the site, which once held its fibreglass and plastics manufacturing business, into a commercial and residential complex. The company hoped to sell the land to a developer that would build a series of highrise apartments, hotels and business space. But those plans were scuttled after residents balked at bringing Toronto-style development and traffic into the quiet suburban core.

The company scaled back its plans and Auburn Developments bought the site in 2005. The land had undergone an environmental cleanup and passed a 2003 Ministry of the Environment audit.

The BarrelYards is the largest project that Auburn has undertaken, said company president Jamie Crich. The company is also developing the Arrow Lofts in Kitchener.

Plans for the project were scaled up from original concept, which was for 750 apartments and condos in mostly low-rise buildings, a 120-room boutique hotel and mostly above-ground parking.

Construction could start as early as this fall and would take between four and seven years, depending on how strong the market is for the project, Crich said in an interview.

But he said he's confident there is strong interest in a massive development in Waterloo and that his company has been flooded with calls from interested residents and businesses.

"You can't do everything overnight, but there is definitely a good strong market here. The city's done a great job with their Uptown and people are responding. They want to live there."

Local companies have long been pushing for a downtown Waterloo hotel and conference centre. Yesterday, Crich said the company is proposing both a long- and short-stay hotel, and would push for conference facilities.

Auburn has been getting as many as five calls a day from interested hotel chains since putting out a request. The hotels would be built by the hotel chains themselves.

He wouldn't name the potential hotel operators, but Crich said they were "some five-star hotels. Great brands have expressed an interest in being here."

Both the city and the developer said they would ask the region to make some road improvements, such as traffic lights and left-turn lanes, to Erb Street, said consultant Chris Pidgeon of GSP Group.

The developer isn't expecting the region to support the proposed changes, Pidgeon said, but they are critical to building the hotels.

The city is still negotiating to share the cost of about $100,000 in improvements to Father David Bauer Drive, such as landscaped medium and bike lanes on both sides.

John Shortreed, who lives on neighbouring Euclid Avenue, was concerned that the city was approving zoning changes before knowing the region would support road improvements to protect residents and pedestrians from an onslaught of new traffic. "It's a huge impact on a very small neighbourhood," he said.

Mike Hudson, who also lives on Euclid, was concerned the proposed highrise condos and apartments would destroy the natural skyline of Waterloo Park. "We should consider what it is about Waterloo Park that makes it special and try and see if that can be preserved," he said. "I don't think it can be preserved in its current form with very large office towers immediately adjacent to the park."

The proposal doesn't include any affordable housing, but a staff report said the developer plans to look into any low-cost housing opportunities and that creating luxury units would free up affordable housing elsewhere in the city.

Uptown Coun. Ian McLean said the project shows Waterloo is a leader in intensifying in its downtown. "Because we're running out of land, we will continue to be a leader and show Kitchener and Cambridge and other parts of the region how to intensify in a way that respects our existing neighbourhoods and provides for our future," he said.

I love this project and the pictures of it! I can't believe it's starting this fall! :banana:

But GAHHHH! NIMBYs! :hell: They're so annoying! And what a typical concern. Toronto-style development....big, bad Toronto :haha: . What is with the paranoia and people being scared of big cities and high densities in this region? It's not going to remain a small town, get over it!!! It's not even a small town right now...it's a sprawl town!! What's worse, having a couple big "Toronto-style" buildings to look at, or being stuck in traffic jams all the freaking time because Joe Schmoe thinks high densities and mixed-uses cause traffic and car dependency? This project will help to support the future LRT. But I guess with all that density, Uptown Waterloo runs the risk of becoming a slum too. Give me a break.

And what's up with the guy who wants to preserve views of Waterloo Park? What is there to really view from your place unless you actually walk into it? If anything, views from Waterloo Park will be enhanced as those towers will give it some definition and a feeling of enclosure. From the hill, you will have much more of a city to look out into. It will be beautiful at night. The increased population will enable more people to conveniently use the park. I look forward to this fine addition to Uptown Waterloo and am glad that the city chose it instead of a vacant lot.

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