[EdmTrekker]

Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2007 8:20 pm
Post subject: LRT - Downtown to NAIT

The following is appearing on APC (Alberta Purchasing Connection)
http://vendor.purchasingconnection.ca/Opportunity.aspx?Guid=8275F7C6-A3BD-4036-B96E-5B88E8E32F98&


Opportunity Description:
The City of Edmonton Transportation Department invites qualified consultants to submit expressions of interest to undertake concept planning and preliminary design for the north extension of Edmonton’s LRT system from downtown to NAIT. Experience with projects of a similar nature and proposed key team members should be included in a one-page letter outlining qualifications.

The purpose of this study is to complete planning studies, develop a preliminary design, and undertake stakeholder consultation for the proposed LRT extension.

Forward expressions of interest by Friday March 30, 2007 to:

Brad Smid, P.Eng. Senior Planning Engineer
Transportation Dept.
Transit Projects Branch
Suite 710, 10060 Jasper Avenue
Tower 1, Scotia Place
Edmonton, AB T5J 3R8

Terms of Reference for this project will be provided to those firms selected to submit proposals. If you have any further questions, call (780) 496-5955 or email Brad.Smid@edmonton.ca

[EdmTrekker]

Also this was posted to APC
http://vendor.purchasingconnection.ca/Opportunity.aspx?Guid=359A444F-7DF5-4724-AC82-D406FD5484AE&


PLANNING STUDIES FOR NORTHEAST AND SOUTH LRT EXTENSIONS

The City of Edmonton Transportation Department invites qualified consultants to submit expressions of interest to undertake planning studies for the northeast and south extensions of Edmonton’s LRT system. A list of experience with studies of a similar nature and proposed key team members should be included in a one-page letter outlining qualifications.

The purpose of this study is to develop conceptual alignment plans, including defining station/park and ride locations, cost estimates, and undertake stakeholder consultation for the Northeast LRT beyond Claireview to the next station in the Gorman area and the south extension from Century Park to the south city limit.

Forward expressions of interest by Friday March 30, 2007 to:

Brian Latte, P.Eng.
Director, Development Review Services
City of Edmonton
Transportation Dept.
13th Floor, Century Place
9803 – 102 A Avenue
Edmonton, AB T5J 3A3

[frinkprof]

Good to see Edmonton finally kicking their LRT build-out into gear. Perhaps I'll quote my sister in a discussion I had with her regarding the role LRT had to play in the future of Edmonton. She said: "The LRT is great for getting some places in Edmonton. The problem is, it doesn't really go anywhere." Perhaps soon more people will take the LRT in Edmonton as it is now starting to actually go somewhere other than Rexall, Commonwealth, the University and the Northeast.

[e909]

great, more studies. add them to the mountain of studies that already exist, in a traditional edmonton fashion.

[mersar]

Unfortunately studies are pretty much a requirement of doing anything. Look at it positively though, there is money now that can be used so the fact they are calling for studies (and updates to older ones) should mean that there is a good chance of at least some of it happening.

And Edmonton isn't alone in this regard, all governments of any type suffer from this disorder. Calgary is doing similar for our WLRT, we're a bit further ahead and today is the third public open house to show off the residents views on what the WLRT and its associated redevelopment of the impacted neighborhoods will be.

[Coldrsx]

good to see this moving forward...this line will be short but KEY

[sdimedru]

above ground I would imagine?

[Coldrsx]

portal out of 101st/105ave...above ground down 105ave then up 104/5st to nait...

[sdimedru]

so will they need to expand the churchill station? assuming thats where the north line will start

[CMD UW]

great, more studies. add them to the mountain of studies that already exist, in a traditional edmonton fashion.
Dude, you have no clue on how major infrastructure projects are carried out do you?

[feepa]

Ok, not to nitpic, but above ground refers to something like the skytrain? which is Above the ground
ground level would be on the ground, and below ground... below ground.
am I right here, or way off base?

[feepa]

so will they need to expand the churchill station? assuming thats where the north line will start

I dont think theres need for expansion at Churchill. its already a 5 car platform.

The NLRT will divide from the NELRT a little further north of Churchill.

[Distill3d]

so will they need to expand the churchill station? assuming thats where the north line will start

I would think that Grandin was a better starting point and then have the line below grade under 109 ST.

but however, LRT to NAIT? is this line actually needed? NAIT isn't that far from Downtown and to be honest, there are several frequent busses to the core (#8 and #9 come to mind). IMO unless Edmonton is going to make the City Center Airport a viable airport (IE: have WestJet or other small/discount carriers fly in), then why build an LRT spur to NAIT?

[CMD UW]

/\ Because the line will not only serve NAIT, but MacEwan, Royal Alex hospital, Kingsway mall and Victoria Composite. There is also a fair amount of density within those neighbourhoods. The line would also serve the new arena should the Oilers choose the Stationlands site.

[Xelebes]

The buses to NAIT are overcrowded - even in non-peak hours (around noon).

[frinkprof]

I would think that Grandin was a better starting point and then have the line below grade under 109 ST.

but however, LRT to NAIT? is this line actually needed? NAIT isn't that far from Downtown and to be honest, there are several frequent busses to the core (#8 and #9 come to mind). IMO unless Edmonton is going to make the City Center Airport a viable airport (IE: have WestJet or other small/discount carriers fly in), then why build an LRT spur to NAIT?
It is to serve areas to the north of NAIT in the short term by Park and Rides and feeder bus routes, and in the long term by expanding the LRT line up to Northgate.

Also, the LRT is always better even if bus service is good. This is because LRT is in its own ROW making it faster and easier to take, has more capacity, and there are lots of people who would not take a bus, but would take an LRT.

A Churchill connection is preferrable to a Grandin connection because the Churchill connection would connect NAIT and the other north destinations to the whole downtown since trains would continue south after they arrive at Chruchill from the north. Also, this option requires less underground track which is much more expensive than at-grade track.

[e909]

Dude, you have no clue on how major infrastructure projects are carried out do you?
I was trying to be realistic about this study. It's a required step, but this city has always done so many studies without any concrete step at following up with them. It's a step in the right direction, I guess.

[sdimedru]

Ok, not to nitpic, but above ground refers to something like the skytrain? which is Above the ground
ground level would be on the ground, and below ground... below ground.
am I right here, or way off base?

makes sense, in that case I meant ground level

[Coldrsx]

again, this line although short in KM, really connects key nodes currently not connected to the system and sets the stage for further NW expansion.

[teddybear]

This is good news! I am a fan of transit system, and subway/LRT in particular. The public transport of Edmonton still needs improvement. The bus is late. The LRT needs to be expanded.

But I was told that people of Alberta like to drive and that is why they do not pay attention to improving the public transport.

Well, why not extend the LRT also the West, to the Mall, and to the South Common up to the Airport?

[Coldrsx]

This is good news! I am a fan of transit system, and subway/LRT in particular. The public transport of Edmonton still needs improvement. The bus is late. The LRT needs to be expanded.

But I was told that people of Alberta like to drive and that is why they do not pay attention to improving the public transport.

Well, why not extend the LRT also the West, to the Mall, and to the South Common up to the Airport?


-every city's LRT/BUS system needs to be expanded, improved.

- Albertans like their cars, but also, Edmonton is very spread out and has multiple nodes of employment so it is difficult to have an efficient system.

- West LRT is in study/planning

- South LRT is going as we speak all the way to 23ave and will go south towards the airport after that.

-South Common doesnt need LRT, that is a car orientated shopping centre.

[CMD UW]

I was trying to be realistic about this study. It's a required step, but this city has always done so many studies without any concrete step at following up with them. It's a step in the right direction, I guess.

Well, if you think 'studies' is an Edmonton-only thing, think again. You could waltz into the public library in any major city and load up on thousands of studies for 'proposed projects'.

It is a step in the right direction. It shows that the City is committed to continuing their expansion of the LRT before the sLRT opens up. A good step...

[canucklehead2]

This is good news. I believe all Edmonton LRT stations now have the capacity for 5 car trains, which is great.

I don't know about anyone else, but what I would like to see from now on is continual LRT expansion with no breaks in the schedule. We are already far enough behind as it is.

So here is my wishlist timeline at the very latest...
SLRT to Heritage 2009/2010
NLRT to NAIT 2012
SLRT branch to Mill Woods 2012
NLRT to Northgate 2014
WLRT to WEM 2015

Additionally extensions along the CN ROW to the VIA station by the Muni should happen as well as another WLRT to Jasper Place within the next 10 years. These should be done with redevelopment schemes so that there would be an automatic base market built into each extension..

[feepa]

Hey, hey, I want LRT developments as fast as the next guy, but I think your schedule may be a little quicker then what will happen.

[codeman9669]

This is good news. I believe all Edmonton LRT stations now have the capacity for 5 car trains, which is great.

...

I thought Health Sciences was only built to 4 car length right now...but I could be wrong!?! (For some reason, I just recall thinking, at the time, how STUPID it was to only build it to 4 car length. Hopefully I am just out to lunch!)

[Xelebes]

I would place the timeline in 25 years.

Maybe if the cost of materials go down and the cost of labour go down, we might be able to cut off a few years from that, but right now some patience is needed.

[Coldrsx]

^i completely disagree...we need LRT in the next 10 to all parts.

[canucklehead2]

What I don't get is how long its taking to build LRT extensions compared to the past, at least in other cities. Just think of how small the Calgary system would be right now, if it they hadn't pursued aggressive expansion back in the 80's...

Combine our explosive population growth, clogged streets, the Kyoto accord and the need for affordable housing to me at least makes the need for massive expansion to happen right now. As for escalating inflation, there must be a way around it some how in terms of locking in costs/contrasts or potentially opening up Alberta to more guest workers if labour costs are the problem...

[canucklehead2]

Thank you Coldrsx for that, exactly. We are so far behind and the ETS if you take it is literally bursting at the seams during peak hours, so we need the capacity of LRT not only to get people out of their cars, but also to get those already on transit safely and efficiently across the city.

[mick]

nope, you're right. Calgary is only now going to 4 car platforms. They currently operate with only 3 car train sets, and they carry 5 times the numbers we do. 4 car platforms combined with increased frequency can more than adequately serve demand for the forseeable future.

[Xelebes]

^i completely disagree...we need LRT in the next 10 to all parts.

Well, the three legs (S, W, N).

I'm talking about the NW, AP and MW Legs.

[Coldrsx]

we need to "suck it up" and acquire debt for the city and push WLRT within 7yrs IMO...that would be the KEY line not done yet and have a major major impact on how transportation works in this city.

[Xelebes]

I will agree on that.

[mick]

I agree. There is nothing wrong with taking on debt for major infrastructure projects, provided you don't over leverage yourself. I know it has become difficult politically but debt financing is essential to any business venture so why should the city have to avoid it. Hell, no one would ever own a house without it.

[canucklehead2]

This may sound stupid but don't you think the federal governments should just give capital transit project grants rather than loans? I dunno, I mean if we are comparing spending priorities of LRT projects vs. say corporate tax cuts, to me LRT funds would be a no-brainer..