[dachacon]

whos the illustrator for us in the diagram section of SSP?
i know its a rush but when can we see a render in the diagram section of Los Angeles? this will be at least 700ft tall with the 60 story building maybe even a little over 800ft. bring this in the top five of downtowns tallest buildings.

[JDRCRASH]

whos the illustrator for us in the diagram section of SSP?

MKmillenium

[citywatch]

Plans for the project, announced Thursday, call for replacing the 1950s-era Wilshire Grand -- located at Figueroa Street and Wilshire Boulevard -- with a luxurious 40-story hotel with as many as 700 rooms and topped by several floors of condominiums.

Next door would be an even taller building, a sleek 60-story tower with 1.1 million square feet of rentable office space. At ground level would be shops, a landscaped park and a public plaza.

Before work can begin on Wilshire Grand, the project must win approval from the city of Los Angeles, a lengthy process. But Thomas said in an interview that if all went according to plan, construction could begin by 2011 and be complete by 2014.
The article failed to mention the biggest point of all: whether the devlpr has gotten funding for the proj yet. I've heard that they still haven't.

And it's been 18 yrs since the last office highrise was built in the hood?!

Way too long of a drought. So this proposed proj really will turn out to be a big april fool's joke if it never sees the light of day.

But the proj at least is creating a stir during the current lull. I still would have rather heard news right around now about the parkfifth tower or the grand ave proj finally going forward. Those projs are more critical to the hood cuz they involve sites that are in bigger need of fixing up.

The same would've been true of this proj too if it wasn't replacing an existing bldg but a gap or deadzone, like the one across the street from the hotel.

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/Viewpark/untitled1.jpg

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/Viewpark/untitled-1.jpg

[Just-In-Cali]

no, not at a 90 percent rate they don't. remember, this is the city where noone can be trusted to back up their words. all talk. don't you agree?

Well now, I think a few people can be trusted in LA...I know we arent the bastian of trustworthiness and resolve that Chicago (ahem) might be, but between the Disney Concert, LA Live, and many of the adaptive reuses, a number of things have been done.
Lets see what happens...we arent going to know anything for sure until at least late 2010. By that time, Fig Central, Park Fifth, and The Grand may all be either dead, or under construction. ;)
As far as financing, a news report last night on channel 9 said that Korean Air may be footing a large part of the bill for this, since they already own the property outright. They also indicated that this structure might come close to rivaling the US Bank in height when including the spire and parapet, and its the first structure to take advantage of the repeal of the "helipad clause" that has given LA a flat topped skyline, though it appears to still have a helipad jutting out from the lower roofline.

[Just-In-Cali]

Hey, here is a news clip from Channel 2 that talks about it...gives more perspective on the structure. :tup:
Enjoy! It says it will be shorter than the US Bank and Aon, but it looks like thats only from a floor number measure.
Thoughts?

http://www.truveo.com/Developer-Has-Plans-For-New-Downtown-Skyscraper/id/594495794

[JDRCRASH]

^Thanks for the link! Interestingly, like Grand Avenue, they've given no specific height.

[Downtown Los Angeles]

this would be so great for our city, i really thinks this will be built. we are due for something like this.

[bmfarley]

^Thanks for the link! Interestingly, like Grand Avenue, they've given no specific height.In many other places there are NIMBY's that latch onto height... using it as a rallying cry to fight a project. I am not saying that is the case here in downtown Los Angeles; however, the developer/architecture team may have seen it elsewhere and chosen to leave that snippet out... assuming the height has been determined.

[JDRCRASH]

^ Even if they gave the height, the common Homeowner Assoc.'s weak complaints about views and traffic don't apply in Downtown anyway.

[JDRCRASH]

this would be so great for our city, i really thinks this will be built. we are due for something like this.

No kidding. 18 years since the last office building was built.:slob:

[WonderlandPark]

With that spire it looks to top AON. But in this market???? I can certainly see the hotel going ahead, that is a great location and badly needs a complete redo and now LA Live is up and running, I don't see a problem on the hotel portion.

[colemonkee]

Off topic city vs. city comments

Guys, I deleted a bunch of comments regarding comparisons to Chicago. Please keep the comments on topic, regarding downtown Los Angeles projects. Warnings have been sent where appropriate.

[colemonkee]

On another, more positive note, this story should make citywatch's day, should it come to fruition. If anyone has been to the Hayward Hotel recently, with the new Crack Gallery and Sixth Street Market, that is a great corner, rivaling 4th and Main for it's storefronts. If you haven't, it's worth checking out. Now the same developer has plans for the Bristol Hotel. From the Downtown News (http://www.downtownnews.com/articles/2009/04/03/news/doc49d688896e50f024353943.txt).


Battling the Bristol’s Blight
Developer’s Plan for Vacant Hotel includes 103 Efficiency Units and Two Ground-Floor Eateries
by Anna Scott
Published: Friday, April 3, 2009 3:20 PM PDT

DOWNTOWN LOS ANGELES - For the last six years, the Bristol Hotel has been a dilapidated eyesore. If new owner Izek Shomof has his way, it will soon be a bustling structure that adds to the vitality of the neighborhood.

“It’s a beautiful, historic building located in a very good area and it’s just sitting there,” said Shomof, who with his business partner and son Eric Shomof paid $2.5 million for the property at 423 W. Eighth St. “Our major goal is to beautify the area, make it more pleasant. It was the same with the Hayward.”

Shomof, who owns a string of market-rate apartment complexes in Downtown, is referring to the Hayward Hotel, a formerly rundown crime-magnet at Sixth and Spring streets that he acquired in 2001. Shomof has since made cosmetic upgrades to the building’s interior and façade, and has brought businesses to its ground floor including a food market, a clothing store and the recently opened D-Town Burger Bar.

Downtown Los Angeles Neighborhood Council President Russell Brown said the building has improved significantly.

“It has changed immensely,” he said. “They had all kinds of drug dealing and crime and it was pretty bad, and they’ve done a really great job of fixing it up and still keeping it with affordable units in it. I know they’ll do a really good job with the Bristol.”

Revitalizing the 1906 Bristol could also provide a long-awaited complement to surrounding businesses, including the Golden Gopher bar and the Italian eatery Colori Kitchen. Shomof hopes the property, which will continue to serve low-income residents, will open by the end of the year. Shomof would not disclose how much he plans to spend on renovations, but said the project will be funded privately.

“This will be a positive catalyst for the area,” said Golden Gopher owner Cedd Moses. “For too long, the Golden Gopher and Colori Kitchen have been the only businesses willing to take a chance on this stretch of Eighth Street.”

Changing Hands

Shomof bought the Bristol from Adolfo Suaya, who acquired the property in 2003.

Suaya, a high-profile restaurateur, originally planned to convert the building into a hotel with a nightclub and restaurant. The Bristol’s 103 rooms, mostly inhabited by low-income tenants, were vacated a few months after the sale. Suaya’s plans, however, were soon derailed by legal tangles.

About 20 former tenants filed a wrongful eviction lawsuit against Suaya in 2004, and Suaya ultimately paid about $226,000 in damages. The next year, the Community Redevelopment Agency filed a lawsuit against Suaya, alleging that redeveloping the hotel would violate an agreement the agency had with prior owner Chae Ro: The CRA had loaned Ro $1.5 million in exchange for keeping the property as low-income housing until July 2015.

Last year, Suaya settled with the CRA. According to the settlement terms, the Bristol would have to serve as affordable housing if it reopened before July 2015. However, Suaya was not required to reopen the building at all, raising concern that he might let it sit vacant for seven years.

Instead, Suaya put the property on the market, but the legal restrictions helped make the property a tough sell.

In September, National Housing Ventures, a small nonprofit with ties to the Amerland Group, was in escrow to purchase the property for $4.5 million, but the deal fell through because of financing difficulties.

Suaya said he is relieved that the building finally sold. “It was time to move on.” he said. “I’m glad I got it off my hands.”

Shomof said he finalized his purchase of the Bristol about three weeks ago. He plans to apply for the Section 8 federal rent subsidy program.

Section 8 buildings can be lucrative investments even for private developers. In September the Related Cos., the developer behind the $3 billion Grand Avenue project, purchased a Section 8 building at 740 S. Olive St. Related West Coast President Bill Witte said at the time that such properties “can provide decent cash flow if they are reasonably sized and there’s no market risk.”

If the Bristol does not qualify for Section 8, Shomof said, his long-term plans for the property could change.

“Section 8 or not, we have to continue it as low-income housing” until 2015, he said. What happens beyond that “is something that we have to look at at the time.”

For now at least, Shomof plans to renovate the Bristol’s 103 units as efficiency apartments.

Most of the units already have individual bathrooms, he said, but he will likely add kitchenettes. “We’re hoping by the end of this year that the building will be open,” said Shomof. “All we have to do is cosmetic.”

The new ground-floor businesses, he said, will include a second D-Town Burger outpost and a restaurant similar to L.A. Café, which is on the ground floor of his Spring Tower Lofts at 639 S. Spring St.

That is welcome news to local stakeholders who have considered the boarded-up Bristol a stumbling point for a key block.

“I’m very pleased that the hotel is being used,” said Mike Pfeiffer, executive director of the South Park Business and Community Benefit District, which operates just south of the Bristol. “It will be a key anchor in bringing back that block.”

Contact Anna Scott at anna@downtownnews.com.

[Downtown Los Angeles]

No kidding. 18 years since the last office building was built.:slob:we are way past due because it seems like most of LAs towers over 600 ft were built within 4 or 5 years.

[ladowntowner]

^ We can't be "way overdue" until the market can truly support building new projects on that scale and they aren't being built.

[Just-In-Cali]

^Overdue or not, if they intend on building it, and have set a start date that is 2 years off, then it is still feasable, even if right now it wouldnt be. Many times in history, large buildings have been built even without the financial prosperity to support them.
Im not all ready to start booking my hotel room, but it is probably one of the most interesting ad ambitious proposals for the downtown area in the last 20 years, so in that way, we are overdue. So Im somewhat hopeful.

[edluva]

Many times in history, large buildings have been built even without the financial prosperity to support them.


which means those buildings were not called for. they were not "due" and were probably financial losses. no developer builds skyscrapers with the purpose of improving a skyline. they do if for profit.

la is not a city which requires much class a office space in downtown. there's no market for it because we are blue collar. frankly speaking, la is not considered profitable for big buildings. whether or not it is "due" is entirely the point. i don't understand why you think that somehow waiting 20 years justifies building a skyscraper at a financial loss. what sort of logic is that?

[LosAngelesBeauty]

^ No developer in the US. Try China and UAE.

[edluva]

well, we are not state-planned. and i still doubt china or uae build skyscrapers based on something as juvenile as whether they are "due".

[Downtown Los Angeles]

what happened during the late 80s and early 90s that is not happening now?

[Just-In-Cali]

which means those buildings were not called for. they were not "due" and were probably financial losses. no developer builds skyscrapers with the purpose of improving a skyline. they do if for profit.

la is not a city which requires much class a office space in downtown. there's no market for it because we are blue collar. frankly speaking, la is not considered profitable for big buildings. whether or not it is "due" is entirely the point. i don't understand why you think that somehow waiting 20 years justifies building a skyscraper at a financial loss. what sort of logic is that?

Yet again...hearing with one ear only gets you half of what is said. :yes:
I said...and I quote "Im not all ready to start booking my hotel room, but it is probably one of the most interesting and ambitious proposals for the downtown area in the last 20 years, so in that way, we are overdue. So Im somewhat hopeful."
How you can misconstrue that, I dont really know. I said its the most interesting proposal I have seen in a long time, and HOPEFULLY, by 2011 when they would start and then 2014 when they finish, there might be a market for it. :rolleyes:
What sort of logic is it to assume no structure ever can be PLANNED during a financial bust so it can be built for when the market recovers?

[edluva]

^none of what you said explains how it is "overdue". the fact that something is overdue assumes by logic that its arrival was justifiably anticipated or due at some point in the past. you haven't established what factors exactly made this project due to begin with. the fact that it is "interesting and ambitious" alone does not establish that a project was ever scheduled or "due", and nor does having a 20 year drought of office space in conditions which justify that no construction of office space occur. you still have made no indication as to why this proposal was ever "due" or should have gone up in the past during conditions where it was never justified. your post above thus also makes no indication as to why you think this should be considered "overdue"

again, you are making absolutely no sense.

[WonderlandPark]

Lighten up, the term "overdue" is used all the time. The Dodgers are overdue for a World Series. Doesn't mean anything except that the Dodgers should have a title, in my opinion. I think downtown is overdue, doesn't mean I think the economy justifies a tower, just that it has been way freakin' long since a new office tower went up.

[edluva]

Lighten up, the term "overdue" is used all the time. The Dodgers are overdue for a World Series. Doesn't mean anything except that the Dodgers should have a title, in my opinion. I think downtown is overdue, doesn't mean I think the economy justifies a tower, just that it has been way freakin' long since a new office tower went up.

well, i wouldn't be making a point of it if that's the way he meant it. but it's not the way he meant it. he was trying to make some sort of an argument of it so i'm just countering his argument. below he is suggesting that we are "due" for a financially unjustified building on the basis that "it's been too long". it's a ridiculous statement and borders on being juvenile (his statement, that is)

Originally Posted by Just-In-Cali
Many times in history, large buildings have been built even without the financial prosperity to support them

[Just-In-Cali]

Im not continuing this nonsense. Ed, really...
My point has been made, and no one but you seems to be having difficulty understanding what I meant.
For the record...YET AGAIN...IN BIG BOLD LETTERS...:irked:

"Im not all ready to start booking my hotel room, but it is probably one of the most interesting and ambitious proposals for the downtown area in the last 20 years, so in that way, we are overdue. So Im somewhat hopeful."

All I was saying...is we have been overdue for some really facinating ideas for downtown...all this other stuff your talking about has NOTHING to do with my statement.

"Many times in history, large buildings have been built even without the financial prosperity to support them"

This is a FACT...plain and simple. It has happened, it can happen, and will again.

[edluva]

^you haven't explained a thing. in what way are we "overdue"? in having interesting proposals as opposed to uninteresting ones? or in having proposals at all? and what makes dtla "due" for such things to begin with? the period of absence of such proposals?

so is there a normal timeframe along which were expected to be getting "interesting proposals" which aren't supposed to be built? like are we due for "interesting and ambitious proposals" every 5 years? or are we due for "interesting and ambitious proposals" around 12 year intervals?

don't worry, i get your statement. i'm just being very sarcastic about your comment because it's pretty vapid, like many others you make. :)

[DowntownGymRat]

If Grand Ave. Project can't get off the ground, then there's no way these new buildings are getting built in the Wilshire Grand's footprint any time soon. Assuming the plan doesn't get scrapped, I'd say you're looking at a 2015 groundbreaking at the earliest. I also agree with everyone about building on an already empty lot. I understand that Korean Air owns the discussed property, but why not buy the empty lot next to 777 Tower from Maguire Properties and build a mix-use highrise with a skybridge connecting directly to the newly renovated Wilshire Grand? I've stayed at the Wilshire Grand many times and think it's a great hotel....no need to demolish it.

[Just-In-Cali]

^

don't worry, i get your statement. i'm just being very sarcastic about your comment because it's pretty vapid, like many others you make. :)

:haha: :haha: :haha: Oh ed! You know how to make me...and many others...laugh.
You get worked up over the most confounded things. We should grab drinks somewhere and you can tell me more about this 'wacky' world you live in...must be a facinating place! :D
Oh and your sarcasm is about as thin as your logic. Fun to listen to though, like those guys that carry the "the end is near" signs around on Wilshire. If I give you a dollar, will you calm down?...it works for them.

[Downtown Los Angeles]

oh whoa whoa whoa, i shouldnt have ever used the word "overdue" in the previous page. i guess i meant its about time la should get another highrise. but i still agree that we are over due because los angeles is eventually gonna have more highrises built for sure so wheather or not this 60 storey highrise gets built, we are due for a new highrise.

[colemonkee]

I don't know if I'm a moderator or a babysitter, but I do know that this is oddly entertaining to watch. ed and just-in-cali, you guys need to agree to disagree and call it that. Or I will make you both sit in the corner for a couple of days.

[Just-In-Cali]

He started it...:P
Okay okay, Im over it.

[RuFFy]

Anyway overdue boys, here's that building we have no need for you guys were talking about! ;) While I was doing my daily stroll through an assortment of online papers I found this story http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009/04/amid-slump-one-part-of-downtown-remains-hot.html

I'd like to draw attention to a particular part of the story where they are talking of a new tower being proposed, see for yourselves and if anyone knows anything please advise:

A proposed 43-story downtown skyscraper -- the second such project disclosed in as many weeks -- is scheduled to be considered for key approvals by the Los Angeles City Planning Commission on Thursday.

The condominium and retail complex is being proposed for a site between Figueroa and Flower streets near the Convention Center by CA Human Technologies, a South Korean joint venture, project spokeswoman Veronica Becerra said.

[Steve2726]

:previous: I believe it's listed on the first page of the thread and here are the corresponding renders-

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/741/1340figueroanewgy0.jpg

[JDRCRASH]

^ Thats an old (and crappy) rendering:

http://la.curbed.com/uploads/2009.04.libeskindbuilding.jpg

[JDRCRASH]

no developer builds skyscrapers with the purpose of improving a skyline. they do if for profit.


I have to disagree....(hope i'm not going too off-topic here, Colemonkee)

1 Kilometer high.....
http://www.dubaichronicle.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/nakheel-harbour-tower2.jpg

[Just-In-Cali]

Anyway overdue boys, here's that building we have no need for you guys were talking about!

I'll try not to take that personally Ruffy...;)

This was another proposal that I really liked...just because its so completely different than anything downtown now.
Dont know if condos are the way to go, but its still cool looking. I really think many of these condo projects in South Park should go hotel, or rentals. They will recover faster than high end condo sales.
(waits for the usual suspects to rain on everyones parade) :rolleyes:

[SD_Phil]

I'm taking my usual "wait and see and cross fingers" approach. If even half of these proposals make it I will be a happy boy.

[petescafe]

Greetings Programs

Some photos before the rain set in tonight.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b340/TheGhostlyGreatDunn/DSC_0001_16.jpg


The foundation for the lap pool is taking shape.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b340/TheGhostlyGreatDunn/DSC_0003_13a.jpg

END OF LINE

[QuarterMileSidewalk]

no developer builds skyscrapers with the purpose of improving a skyline. they do if for profit.

I have to disagree....(hope i'm not going too off-topic here, Colemonkee)

1 Kilometer high.....
http://www.dubaichronicle.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/nakheel-harbour-tower2.jpg


... actually about dirt-high. Cool tower, but I don't think they're ever really gonna actually get to build it, and even if they do, it would still only be practical if Nakheel can figure out how to make a PILE of money from it.

The skyline of the city has never been the purpose of construction, only an aesthetically appealing result of religious symbolism (the lofty, heaven-referencing spires of medieval cathedrals), and economics (a skyscraper is, most basically, "a machine to make the land pay," either because there is demand, or speculation on future demand). Yes, the architects and developers can choose the shape of the building, or maybe stick a spire on it, but I feel that the primary concern is to make sure the individual building is functional and beautiful, not the entire city. The overall skyline will take shape over the course of time, but not in a puposeful way. Buildings have purposes, and "interesting shape on the horizon" is not one of them.

[edluva]

^thank you for that badly needed dose of reality, quartermile. lots of kids here don't like the reality.

[colemonkee]

Speaking of reality, I was unaware that the Medallion would have residential units on that corner of 4th Street. It's great to see the residential creep slightly east.

[Just-In-Cali]

Skylines progress over time, that is true. Some rich men over time have built structures for the sheer purpose of making a statement...that is true as well. Some buildings are built solely for the need of space...true on that count as well.
All this back and forth is really redundant if we are simply talking about skylines and buildings in general.
As far as THE LOS ANGELES SKYLINE...we can deduce that there will be no "ego driven" structures anytime soon, or even ones built for profit at least for a few years.
QuarterMiles point is well taken, but JD had a point too. Ed was pointless as usual (thats why we love him) and colemonkee stayed on topic about Medallion! Bravo.

[edluva]

^Speaking of pointless...;)

bravo, colemonkee for staying on reality...er...on topic.

as far as residential creeping east, medallion joins the little tokyo/arts district in bringing folks to this side of downtown. what i would love to see is the conversion of historic district to private sector commercial use since economically, that is the driving force for redevelopment. i'm not all that convinced that we need tons of people living in the cbd to be successful, though nice it would be, because downtown can never have enough residents to support the kind of retail and in the quantities we want it to have - for that we need hundreds of thousands of affluent white collar or creative types in and around downtown. LA simply doesn't have much of that to spare. and even in its heyday, downtown la's commercial vibrancy as a center for high end dept stores was due in large part to its centrality to affluence in surrounding neighborhoods, and ironically, the same red cars which helped lead to its decline.

downtown should be seen in context of a greater core. in that respect, downtown LA's fundamental problem stems from "commercial flight" to suburbs and a geographical isolation from the affluent consumer bases of our city's core (eg westside). downtown LA is isolated from its potential consumer base by vast stretches of poverty. downtown looks the way it does today precisely becuase poverty is its consumer base.

the problem, since we're focused on reality rather than juvenile fantasy ;), is how does the city draw more upmarket commercial tenants when there's no consumer base to cater to? putting in a strict charter like old town pasadena wouldn't work since the areas surrounding downtown aren't affluent like the SGV - you end up with the present scenario, many great plans with no action. many proposals and no money. all talk and no play.

what sucks about union station is its horrible urban design. it's a big parking lot and it's isolated by a big freeway. it's effectively ruled out its own role as a seed for ped-oriented commercial development. so far, little tokyo station and 7th/metro are the only two stations that have potential of stimulating commercial activity in their respective hoods. the remainder of downtown la is inhibited by crappy urban design and poverty.

[Downtown Los Angeles]

^sorry if im going off topic CM, are you a man or a woman? hahaha sorry. I had to ask, please dont let this bother anybody.

[colemonkee]

^ Last time I checked, I was a man. And that was pretty recently, as I've had a lot of coffee today.

[Downtown Los Angeles]

^nooooo i meant to ask edluva..hahaha. k sorry different subject.:D

[JDRCRASH]

^ LOL! :haha:

....here's more good news:

Downtown LA park design gains approval (http://www.chicoer.com/news/national/ci_12091545)

The Associated Press

Posted: 04/07/2009 02:07:59 PM PDT

LOS ANGELES—Designs for a $56 million park in downtown Los Angeles have been approved by the Los Angeles County Board of Supervisors. The designs approved Tuesday for the 16-acre park on county-owned land include gardens, a performance lawn, a children's play area and other features.

Most of the park's construction costs are expected to be paid by developers of the $3 billion Grand Avenue project, a high-rise complex that would be built adjacent to the park site. Progress on that project has stalled, however.

The park would cover the four blocks between the Music Center and City Hall. The board approved the drawings 3-0, with one supervisor absent and another abstaining.(gee I wonder who?:rolleyes:) The design still needs approval by the city's Community Redevelopment Agency.

[Mid-Michigan]

A lot of areas of the Los Angeles metro looks very clean/ new, though I begin to see the complete opposite, such as the downtown area.

[JDRCRASH]

^ Errr ...depends on where you go in DT... naturally the Financial District, the Civic Center and now South Park are gonna be the cleanest in the area.

[JDRCRASH]

Downtown Down to One Crane (http://blogdowntown.com/2009/04/4203-downtown-down-to-one-crane)

By Eric Richardson
Published: Wednesday, April 08, 2009, at 03:07PM

http://photos.blogdowntown.com/3425111668_f2f91bdd23.jpg
From Flickr by Eric Richardson
The crane at Concerto prepares to lower one of its vertical sections.



DOWNTOWN LOS ANGELES — During the residential boom of recent years, Downtown boosters liked to joke that the crane was the area's official bird.

That bird's become endangered.

Today the construction crane at Concerto is stepping itself down, leaving Downtown with just one remaining crane at L.A. Live's Ritz Carlton tower.

Of course, that's not exactly a bad thing. The cranes come down as construction projects complete, and their dwindling numbers simply mean that the
projects started during the recent boom are nearing their opening dates.

In the summer of 2007, one could look from L.A. Live and see a half-dozen of cranes within just a few blocks. Two were on the L.A. Live project, one was at South Group's Evo, one was over Hanover's 717 W. Olympic, one high above work at Meruelo's 717 W. 9th. The final one went up on the site of Astani's Concerto project in July.

The sole remaining crane, positioned above the Ritz Carlton tower, will likely not last many more months. Glass installation on the project has less than a dozen floors to go, at which time the crane's work will be complete.


It will likely be a while before Downtown's next crane appears. A pair of large proposals have appeared in recent months and the Park Fifth and Grand Avenue projects are still slowly moving forward, but all need to secure financing and approvals before construction begins.

Concerto's sales center opened last week at the corner of Figueroa and 9th.

[JDRCRASH]

And here are the other photos Blogdowntown took:


Concerto


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3412/3425111972_2ff4b00e5a.jpg?v=0
From Flickr by Eric Richardson


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3656/3425112266_8ef51e6f34.jpg
From Flickr by Eric Richardson





Ritz-Carlton Hotel and Tower


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3323/3425112638_3e5e456744.jpg?v=0
From Flickr by Eric Richardson

[petescafe]

Greetings Programs

Here's a quick good Friday pic.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b340/TheGhostlyGreatDunn/DSC_0001_17.jpg

That's all.

END OF LINE

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Wow it's actually coming along quite fast

[Downtown Los Angeles]

Greetings Programs

Here's a quick good Friday pic.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b340/TheGhostlyGreatDunn/DSC_0001_17.jpg

That's all.

END OF LINEWhat is this just a parking building?

[Steve2726]

More of the Libeskind designed tower at 13th and Fig-

Christopher Hawthorne weighs in, click the link for his commentary-

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/la-et-notebook11-2009apr11,0,7766716.story

http://www.latimes.com/media/photo/2009-04/46153291.jpg

[edluva]

^good article. it addresses the role that downtown's exclusionary approval process plays in limiting a more organic vitality from taking hold. it also makes a backhanded comment about downtown's overall undesirablility to institutional developers.

downtown is in a shitty situation - let it develop organically with little guidance from planning commission and the only guys willing to fill those lots are people like palmer. put any sort of requirements on developers and we're left with empty lots.

[LAMetroGuy]

It's no secret that downtown is undesirable to developers :rolleyes: Downtown LA is part of an urban revitalization process. You can only revitalize something that... well... needs revitalization!

I love the Ritz tower, that is one amazing phallic tower!!!

[DJM19]

I definitely agree that a single building should not take up so many parcels of land.

[petescafe]

What is this just a parking building?


Just to give you an idea.
Here's the area that the photo is covering.


http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b340/TheGhostlyGreatDunn/md2_model14_w580a.jpg

[edluva]

It's no secret that downtown is undesirable to developers :rolleyes: Downtown LA is part of an urban revitalization process. You can only revitalize something that... well... needs revitalization!

yeah, that's no news. the broader point was that the "urban revitalization process" continues to underwhelm despite all those efforts put forward by the planning dept.

on a brighter note, LA Live is phallic indeed. it's apparently quite long and narrow. wonders never ceast! amazing!!! :cheers:

[DowntownGymRat]

Sadly, this is probably my last time to post a pic from my view since I'm moving back to Little Rock, AR next week. But at least it was a nice day to grab a shot of the clear skyline. I'll miss my concrete jungle of downtown LA
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e211/spencerryan/DSCN1845.jpg

[RuFFy]

GymRat, thanks for the pics and best of luck in AR.

In reference to the Libeskind proposal, reading the ladowntownnews article (http://ladowntownnews.com/articles/2009/04/10/news/doc49dfc72918234019623867.txt) it indicates the building is scheduled to break ground in 2010. Though I find that hard to believe, it might be something that interests some of you. :)

[dktshb]

This article pretty much sums up the way I feel with regard to most all the new development that has gone up, is going up, or is in the planning stages of going up in Downtown these last 10 years. Fortunately we still have a lot of the historic core to continue redeveloping.

Here's the article:


High-rises dwarf options for downtown L.A.

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/la-et-notebook11-2009apr11,0,7766716.story

Mega-projects have their place, but two new Figueroa Corridor proposals spotlight the city's all-or-nothing planning mind-set.

By CHRISTOPHER HAWTHORNE, Architecture Critic
April 11, 2009
A pair of high-rise projects planned for the Figueroa Corridor downtown jumped into the headlines this week, as if out of nowhere. The first, set to replace the Wilshire Grand hotel and office complex at Figueroa Street and Wilshire Boulevard, will be designed by AC Martin Partners, the big local firm. It has an estimated budget of more than $1 billion. The other, proposed for a site near the southern edge of South Park, across from the Los Angeles Convention Center, is by Daniel Libeskind, best known for his Jewish Museum in Berlin and his much-altered master plan for the World Trade Center site in Lower Manhattan.


Both projects are backed by Korean groups. Korean Air, and the larger Hanjin Group of which it is a part, owns the Wilshire Grand property, where it wants to build a mixed-use complex crowned by two towers, the taller one 60 stories high. CA Human Technologies, a joint venture of two Korean firms, is behind the 43-story Libeskind tower, which would include 273 residential units stacked atop an eight-level podium containing parking, restaurants and a spa. If completed, it would be Libeskind's first Los Angeles building.

The sudden appearance of these designs, even in provisional form, in the middle of a deep recession prompts a couple of questions. Why now? And why -- when the last thing downtown needs, from an urban-planning point of view, is another stand-alone super-block high-rise, standing aloof from the street and its neighbors -- might we be getting two more?

The first question is relatively easy to answer. The entitlement process in Los Angeles is lengthy, bordering on Byzantine. Developers who want to be first out of the gate when the economy improves would be wise to begin that process now, particularly if it gives them the chance to take advantage of low construction and materials costs that will likely prevail for another couple of years.

A more cynical version of the same answer might go this way: Developers who feel prepared to move forward on the approval front, even if their financing remains iffy, can take advantage of a climate in which the city is desperate to support any signs of new real-estate activity downtown.

The second question is trickier. But it is also crucial, since it goes to the heart of how planning happens in downtown Los Angeles -- and why, despite so much new energy and investment in recent years, the area retains at ground level an extreme split personality, with massive towers mixed in with huge, empty parcels.

The Figueroa Corridor, which city planners have long envisioned as a key connector downtown -- linking the USC campus, on its southern end, with Dodger Stadium to the north -- is a key case study in how that split personality is developed and exacerbated. It is a natural place for high-rise development, given its existing skyscrapers and links to mass transit. It will soon be getting at least two new residential towers: the first phase of the Concerto, a 30-story high-rise designed by DeStefano + Partners, and a 54-story hotel and condo building at L.A. Live, by Gensler.

But certain pockets of it remain filled by the same surface parking lots that dot much of downtown. Particularly south of L.A. Live, the area suffers from an extreme version of the all-or-nothing development approach that city leaders and most developers have long favored. There is almost no middle ground to be found between high-rise towers that take up full blocks at street level and empty swaths of land reserved for cars.

This approach prevents the emergence of the smaller-scale projects that can bring fresh vitality to a block -- and that may move forward even in a downturn, since they require drastically less financing. Such modest projects are also more likely to go to younger and more innovative architects.

The Libeskind tower is the latest example of how downtown moves from one extreme to another. In land-use terms, it is a process that takes us immediately from zero to 60, from emptiness to high-rise density. The site where the tower is set to rise, covering 57,000 square feet, is actually two separate pieces of land that are, in turn, made up of a total of seven parcels. Most of downtown, of course, was originally sliced up the same way, which is why its older sections retain a vital diversity of building forms, architectural styles and uses.

But the presence of a surface parking lot changes that dynamic -- not only for the obvious reason that it trades vitality for emptiness. A parking lot also smooths the way for high-rise developments like the Libeskind tower. It tends to pave over the visual -- and sometimes the legal -- divisions between one small parcel and the next, making it almost a foregone conclusion that the property will remain empty until a mega-project comes along to fill it on a massive scale.

Indeed, the city's planning department has rubber-stamped CA Human Technologies' effort to consolidate the various properties into a single massive development, even though that effort flies in the face of recommendations in new guidelines developed by the same department's Urban Design Studio. Following the department's recommendation, the Planning Commission voted 6-0 Thursday to approve zoning and other variances for the property.

Architecturally, of course, there are lots of ways to make mega-projects successful along the street, including opening them up fully to the sidewalk and designing them to contain a diversity of retail outlets at ground level. Libeskind's scheme, which is not among his finest, tries hard to do this, although the effort is undermined by the slashing forms that cross its podium section. These gashes are his formal trademark, but in this case they bring the massive scale of the tower down to the sidewalk level instead of helping to break it up.

The AC Martin design for Korean Air is even less developed architecturally. It is a sleek marker for a development whose viability is far from certain.

The enemy in this is certainly not the high-rise form itself, which can add immeasurably to the vitality of any city and has long been a vehicle for architectural innovation. It is a process that all but rules out other kinds of development in certain pockets of downtown.

[dktshb]

Best of luck and thanks for your contribution to this thread, DowntownGymRat

[colemonkee]

DowntownGymRat, we're sorry to see you go. Come back soon!

I updated the first page of this thread, adding the Wilshire Grand Redevelopment project, moving 1340 Figueroa to "Approved", and moving LA Live and LA High School #9 to "Completed". If anyone has good shots of either of those completed projects, post a photo, credit the photog and I'll add them to the front page.

[OneMetropolis]

Here's a shot that is pretty recent

April 2009



http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=436612&page=118

[QuarterMileSidewalk]

DowntownGymRat, that's a nice memory to leave with. Good luck in Little Rock!

[colemonkee]

Sakura Crossing

From earlier this morning.

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/4705/sanpedro200904104.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/738/sanpedro200904101.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/8056/sanpedro200904102.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/3762/sanpedro200904103.jpg

[colemonkee]

LAPD HQ

The finishing touches are taking a while, but they're making a pretty big difference. There are a lot more pictures in the LAPD HQ Thread (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=4190535#post4190535) in the General Developments subforum.

http://img2.imageshack.us/img2/2415/lapd200904102.jpg

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/4715/lapd200904107.jpg

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/6460/lapd200904108.jpg

[colemonkee]

Medallion

Thought I would post some different angles on this one. From 4th Street, looking west.

http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/4266/medallion200904101.jpg

From the corner of 4th and Los Angeles. A little out of focus. That's what I get for trying to take pictures while crossing the street...

http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/3469/medallion200904103.jpg

The parking garage from Los Angeles Street.

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/5821/medallion200904102.jpg

[JDRCRASH]

We'll miss you DowntownGymRat! Good luck in Arkansas!

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Nice pics Colemonkee, I am definitely digging the Medallion right now and how well it ties the OBD to the LT.

[Just-In-Cali]

I'm gone for one weekend and Gymrat leaves!!! Were gonna miss your pics...but your gonna keep in touch...so no worries!

[LosAngelesBeauty]

I like this pic from Curbed. It's from the Hollywood Hills and shows how Koreatown and Downtown LA could really meld to create one very large central core.

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/8813/95586089.jpg (http://img27.imageshack.us/my.php?image=95586089.jpg)

[edluva]

^too bad about them being separated by the 110. they are not contiguous enough, whether by commercial use, planning/transportation, or demographics to "meld" into a single core. k-town dies off abruptly one you get close to westlake, and westlake peters out into a commercial deadzone the closer it gets to the 110. and then there's the 110 itself. none of these "neighborhoods" melds into the next - that's how you can tell LA isn't a walkable city. very few pedestrians overall, but more importantly, very few pedestrians bridging one hood to its neighboring hood. little contiguity of urban fabric.

obsessing over optical illusions - taking shots at certain angles to give the impression of a large downtown core when in fact those k-town buildings pretty much line that stretch of wilshire exclusively, and are pretty far from the cbd, may be fun for pretend's sake. same goes for telephoto shots from the getty which suggest more contiguity between CC and Wilshire, and between CC/Wilshire and downtown LA, than actually exist. but it doesn't change the established realities.

downtown LA can look big or tiny depending on your angle because our skyline has really got no depth to it - it's almost like a single row of buildings along a north-south axis. i think it's funny when we try to pretend when we acknowledge flattering ones in exclusion. it's like little kids playing dress-up looking in the mirror - they only care about looking the part.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Yeah that's the sucky part :( That stretch along Wilshire, basically west of the 110 all the way to Vermont, is extremely depressing. Even more so when you see a deteriorating public park with a man made lake that has incredible potential to be, well, "wonderful." Too bad the area is so poor that it is almost impossible for the area to become really used by the middle-class anytime in the near future.

In regards to the 110, if I had to choose, I would still rather cap the 101 north of DTLA because it would have a much more immediate impact connecting Chinatown/Union Station/El Pueblo with the Civic Center, than City West to the FiDi. But why should we have to choose if Downtown LA is actually important to "us?"

[Just-In-Cali]

^ i think it's funny when we try to pretend when we acknowledge flattering ones in exclusion. it's like little kids playing dress-up looking in the mirror - they only care about looking the part.

^^Man, so now we cant even enjoy an interesting view without it being picked apart. LOL.
Its like watching the Wizard of Oz during the part when it goes from black and white to color, then having some peon stop the movie, and explain how its "not true color" and going on and on about how fake it is and how it will never be a real movie. (sighs)
Im sure from some angles Ed must seem like an almost pleasant and down to earth person. (winks at ed):rolleyes:
I like the picture...regardless of what it implies. It must be a few months back as the Ritz is much further along than what is shown.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Edluva is just extremely heartbroken about LA :( and now it's "payback" time. He has "learned as he went along in life" and "got smarter" and now he has a vendetta against LA. He used to call LA a "world-class city" and even defended LA like many other "disillusioned" here on this forum, like me. But this was on a different forum and a different time. He's much smarter now ;) and knows the "truth" and I only hope he finds his way to another city that makes him feel like a fish introduced back into the water. However, some people prefer the life of salmon, always swimming upstream and going against the grain. :P

[RAlossi]

It's interesting to ponder Downtown development these days. I mean, look at it from this perspective: Skid Row ain't ever going anywhere. That and the Garment District (by that I refer to the discount houses with roll-down security doors at night, as opposed to the Fashion District's mix of restaurants and retail) are always going to be right smack dab in the middle of Downtown, cutting off the residential west with the residential east, especially at night.

To the west, as edluva points out, the 110 Freeway is a serious blockage to connectivity. To the South, the 10 Freeway, plus the behemoth Convention Center cut off activity.

So really, the area we're working with is pretty small, including South Park (plus "East South Park" between Grand and Main), the Historic Core, the Financial District, Bunker Hill, Broadway, Little Tokyo and the Arts District.

Meanwhile, the Arts District is evolving on its own, pretty much cut off from the rest of Downtown by Skid Row and seafood distribution centers. True, it does connect with Little Tokyo, but the people living in the new buildings like Artisan and Mura aren't patronizing the businesses in Little Tokyo very much.

Bunker Hill is pretty much never going to become a residential neighborhood, no matter what the psychotic Related Co and County Board of Sups tries to push through (show me the money!). It may be too anti-pedestrian to ever recover. Sorry, "Grand Avenue Cultural Corridor"!

The Financial District will attract some more hotel and maybe a few more residential projects, but won't get to residential critical mass anytime soon for that 24/7 vibe.

Historic Core has potential, but it really backs up against the "Jewelry District" -- which is never going anywhere and is plagued with business that shut down at 5:00pm -- and Skid Row... thus limiting its "connective potential" with, say, South Park or the Arts District.

Little Tokyo is great, but then you've got the frakking Toy District in between it and the Historic Core - another example of the rolled-down security door set that will never change. Is the LAPD motor pool and half of Medallion (when it's completed) enough to stitch together these two neighborhoods? I'm doubtful.
Truly, the faceless cinder-block buildings of the Toy District should be razed and replaced with residential buildings if there's ever hope for connectivity between Little Tokyo and the Core. There are some historic structures worth saving, though.

Maybe I've just become a pessimist, but the "true downtown" that most people really want is much smaller than the area inside the freeway ring. It's so small, in fact, that I'm starting to have long-term doubts about how it will all come together.

[Just-In-Cali]

^...well...then lets just stop. Stop all of it. No more time or effort need be put into Downtown Los Angeles. Lets focus on making the Valley more suburban chique! Eh?
My, I would expect that statement from others (im looking at you ed, downtowner, and others) but im surprised it came from you RAlossi.

[RAlossi]

^...well...then lets just stop. Stop all of it. No more time or effort need be put into Downtown Los Angeles. Lets focus on making the Valley more suburban chique! Eh?
My, I would expect that statement from others (im looking at you ed, downtowner, and others) but im surprised it came from you RAlossi.

Yeah, because that's exactly what I said in my comment above.

Anyway, I hope this actually spurs some discussion about the future of Downtown. It may one day be a collection of cool -- though disparate -- neighborhoods, but probably won't become that vital central city we've been yearning for. Not when its very geographic heart is a rotten blight.

It feels so weird saying that considering what I've done in the past, but that's what living at 6th and Los Angeles has opened my eyes to. The 1st of every month, the welfare checks come in, the dealers follow, the drugs get smoked, and the crazies flood the Historic Core, screaming in the middle of the night.

I now realize that that culture -- the drugs, the prostitution, the insane -- will NEVER be going away, not while government agencies and "nonprofits" get so much benefit from maintaining the status quo (read: funding).

[LosAngelesBeauty]

^ I have always wanted the Jewelry District to GO AWAY for the very reason you just stated. It completely cuts off the Historic Core from the Fidi and is completely detrimental to the long term success of Downtown LA becoming a part of LA where neighborhoods and districts meld into each other organically, creating that kind of wonderful feeling you get in NY.

Plus, the Jewelry District SHOULD BE the beginnings of the a retail district akin to 3rd St (not the Promenade) and Melrose and some chains thrown in there for good measure. Something like a Soho. It should NOT be what is right now, which is a district that takes up WAY TOO MUCH space and serving such a niche group of buyers looking for rings and bracelets.

GO AWAY JEWELRY DISTRICT!!!

[RAlossi]

It's not just that. It's the safety factor, with all these projects in such proximity to the center of the narcotics trade in the city. Hell, the Civic Center might as well be the Prison District with the insanity at Twin Towers and Men's Central Jail (http://tr.im/iVml) - Oh, look, a shiny new women's jail! Just what Downtown really needs.

It unnerves me that I got physically threatened by a guy calling my husband and me "Faggot" -- and finding ourselves completely alone on an empty, dark sidewalk in the evening. God forbid anyone actually leave their loft after 6:00pm!

It unnerves me that I see Crips and 18th Street Gang tagging in the neighborhood more and more. Then two people got shot on Skid Row the other morning.

It unnerves me that I got mugged walking down Main Street -- while I was walking home with two friends! They had insisted on walking me home, luckily for me. We didn't get two blocks before it happened.

It unnerves me that criminals get released from Twin Towers and just make their way down into the Historic Core -- then proceed to threaten me for not giving them money. This is all in addition to the normal everyday harassment and racist, homophobic bullsh*t that comes with living Downtown.

I don't want this thread to stray from development - just had to get it off my chest. This isn't normal, and as you can probably tell, I'm beginning to lose it.
Before, things like this were acceptable (ha!) because of the possibility of change. I love Downtown, I just don't know how much more of this I can stand.

[tommaso]

Yeah, because that's exactly what I said in my comment above.

Anyway, I hope this actually spurs some discussion about the future of Downtown. It may one day be a collection of cool -- though disparate -- neighborhoods, but probably won't become that vital central city we've been yearning for. Not when its very geographic heart is a rotten blight.

It feels so weird saying that considering what I've done in the past, but that's what living at 6th and Los Angeles has opened my eyes to. The 1st of every month, the welfare checks come in, the dealers follow, the drugs get smoked, and the crazies flood the Historic Core, screaming in the middle of the night.

I now realize that that culture -- the drugs, the prostitution, the insane -- will NEVER be going away, not while government agencies and "nonprofits" get so much benefit from maintaining the status quo (read: funding).

Yeah this stuff is all very interesting. And I'll begin by saying that DTLA is flawed at worst and exciting at best! Very controversial statement, I know. However, we all know that there are more dead spots in various parts of downtown than there are in some of the worst cell phone networks. That's saying a lot and not very much. Whether it is the annoying empty lots that may be used for parking, or some ugly buildings that are neither residential nor safe looking, DT Los Angeles is full of holes of what some would call urban blight (and that's relatively speaking). The nicer and decent parts of downtown which have already been identified, are respectable examples of what a flourishing urban area can look like (and you can pick the parts of downtown you like best and that's the kind of nice stuff I'm talking about). And then you have the undeveloped, the underutilized and the skid row-ish, the 'I don't want to be there' type junk. You get the drift. We, and I mean those of us who root for a real quality city atmosphere in downtown, can not stand for anything short of massive improvement to our downtown area.

Suffice it to say that downtown Los Angeles is so rich and diverse that our buildings and streets here are used to represent New York City (Manhattan) in many movies! Yes, I said it, MANHATTAN! Wow! That should be our cue here to Angelenos who have a stake in the downtown of ours, to now say that 'hey! our downtown is just as nice as anybody else's. Now let's treat it with the respect it deserves and clean it up and make a viable city out of it.' And that's really what we are trying to do with downtown Los Angeles, make a city out of it, but it just takes too long to develop to the extent that we need it to become developed. Erecting one large building at a time will not get the job done, and I will add that 5 buildings at a time is not enough either.

So then what is the solution we all are looking for here? Answer: strategize and decide once and for all that downtown Los Angeles is the center of the universe (metaphorically speaking), develop it and market it into the greatest city on Earth! The weather in Los Angeles is perfect, so now let's develop our downtown to fully take advantage of our greatest asset. What could be better than living the city life in perfect weather? You got it friends, NOTHING! I'm a guy who knows like many other knowledgeable city-dwellers that the correct and best way to develop the City of Los Angeles is along the Pacific Ocean. That never happened, so lets just work with what we have and turn downtown into the place we all want it to be, A REAL WORLD CLASS CITY!:)

[milquetoast]

Yayy! And maybe we'll develop that wonderful New York feeling :) Thank God! Finally, right? So organic .... http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee192/trolltoast/dog_vomit-1.jpg

[LAsam]

I can feel a ColeMonkee smackdown coming!

[ThreeHundred]

Now I see why I don't post as much. Not only because of the resession and lack of new projects, but people bitching and moaning too damn much.

I'll go back to lurking until you boys grow up. Los Angeles is flawed like every city on earth.

RAlossi, you would most likely get called a faggot if you and your husband were to walk down any major street hand in hand. And I'm gay before any of you say anything.

Citywatch, powerlines exist in every city on earth. Burying them will not make LA any better or any worse.

Ed, LA is your home. Quite complaining about it and try and enjoy it. I live in Tucson Arizona for comparison. I have a right to complain about where I live.

And colmonkee, Sakura Crossing's color is not that bad. Lol. :frog:

[RAlossi]

Uh-oh, I've pissed off the 'armchair urbanist'. You can go back and re-read my original comment, or not, doesn't matter. The point I'm trying to make, which was perhaps a little skewed by a couple late-night cocktails, is that development, safety, investment and quality of life are all interrelated. You don't get that vital urban experience without increasing all of those. My issue is whether Downtown will be able to find that sweet spot in the next decade or so.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

^ I feel ya RAlossi on the safety issue in DTLA. When I was living there at the Pegasus, I ALMOST got mugged myself at 4th/Broadway and was threatened TWICE at the Yoshinoya at 7th/Olive, which thank Zeus, is now closed.

[colemonkee]

colemonkee smackdown cometh. Many posts have been deleted. Keep it classy San D-- errrr, LA forumers. I'm off to Coachella this weekend, and if I get back to a bunch of bitchy posts, there will be suspenders, errrr, suspensions.

[Westsidelife]

The May Company Garage after a good scrubbing and then some. I had no idea they were rehabilitating this baby. Nice.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3385/3448408997_c709a6d806_b.jpg
From Flickr, by ericrichardson

[citywatch]

powerlines exist in every city on earth. Burying them will not make LA any better or any worse.In the middle of ralossi's disturbing descriptions of his encounters with & observations of crime & his equally worrisome skepticism about the hood's future, & you somehow bring my name into the thread?!!

Even more of an odd segue, cuz I'm bothered that if someone like ralossi finds his patience with the hood wearing thin, then what will be the reaction of those ppl who are 10 times likelier to eventually wander off to the burbs or to a comfy, safe hood dozens of miles to the west or north?

And ralossi mentions armchair urbanists. Nothing more hollow & fake than such ppl (meaning those resting comfortably---& safely!---in armchairs far, far removed from the inner city) being idealistic & dreamy eyed about the dark, depressing side of urban life----& not changing their politics or belief system one iota---when viewing the world from the safety & comfort of a gated house in the palisades or Bev hills, or Hermosa beach or malibu.

btw, threehundred, I was wandering through the streets of paris, london, vienna, berlin, rome, copenhagen, brussels & barcelona the other day, & I swear I saw sights very similar to this all over the place:


http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/Viewpark/14862611_f3f46d2c83.jpg
omar omar

:hahano: :hahano: :hahano:


Sakura Crossing's color is not that bad.But it's not too good either. However, since I recall the yrs & yrs & yrs I'd drive by that location & be bothered by the huge deadzone that once was there (& still makes up a good portion of the block to the north & west), I can live with it.

I just wish the other apt bldg that was supposed to breakground early this yr (or was it early last yr?) directly to the NE of the sakura finally was under construction. One less gap in the hood. Plus the drawing of that bldg makes me think its paint job will be a bit better than sakura's.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3016/2452018855_5d3313a623.jpg?v=0

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2268/2452019071_8f0378c671.jpg?v=0

[citywatch]

^ I have always wanted the Jewelry District to GO AWAY for the very reason you just stated. It completely cuts off the Historic Core from the Fidi and is completely detrimental to the long term success of Downtown LA becoming a part of LA where neighborhoods and districts meld into each other organically, creating that kind of wonderful feeling you get in NY. I'm not sure I fully understand your dislike of that type of retailing in the hood. Would you rather the jewelry district be replaced by a bunch of swap meets & T shirt, counterfeit DVD shops, like what's all over broadway, or bail bond businesses, similar to what has popped up in Little tokyo over the yrs & caused lots of complaints?

BTW, LAB, I notice your posting alot about pasadena in the LA/CA forum, which I'm guessing is the hood you now call home. I think that part of soCal makes for a good model for other cities locally to pattern themselves after. In fact, if more of SoCA was like pasadena (instead of the hoods around rosemead, which is where I had to spend some time several months ago----ugh!), this part of the country would be primo.

Pasadena is still a largely burban---or mostly single family house or smaller bldg---type of hood, but it's more or less consistently nice, or, at worse, OK. So I think if DTLA were surrounded by hoods like pasadena, &, in turn, if pasadena were just a few blocks from DTLA, that would be ideal.

[edluva]

colemonkee smackdown cometh. Many posts have been deleted. Keep it classy San D-- errrr, LA forumers. I'm off to Coachella this weekend, and if I get back to a bunch of bitchy posts, there will be suspenders, errrr, suspensions.

have fun at coachella. i am jealous

threehundred - and i don't have a right to complain about the place i live in. right.

[RAlossi]

Re: Sakura Crossing, the color on the rendering is actually a bit different from the color now that it's finished. I agree that the color scheme isn't bad... the greens are more hunter green than teal. It's got a nice contrast that kind of struck me as I walked past. It's still mostly stucco though...

[LosAngelesBeauty]

BTW, LAB, I notice your posting alot about pasadena in the LA/CA forum, which I'm guessing is the hood you now call home. I think that part of soCal makes for a good model for other cities locally to pattern themselves after. In fact, if more of SoCA was like pasadena (instead of the hoods around rosemead, which is where I had to spend some time several months ago----ugh!), this part of the country would be primo.



Yes, I love Pasadena and am very happy living here. If DTLA could feel like Pasadena, then we should be so lucky.

[yakumoto]

Shamelessly stolen from another thread:

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/3982/picture590.jpg

BEHOLD THE FURY OF THE OVERHEAD WIRES!!!!

[RuFFy]

I can't bring myself to agree with you guys that LA is not a city and will never have an urban feel because I think it already does. I haven't lived in LA since 2006.. but before that I was there since I was born in 1980. When I was born, this was LA's skyline: AON, 611 Wilshire, Bank of America, Transamerica, City National Plaza and Union Bank. That's it. Take a look for yourselves. From the Summer of 1980.

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j198/joseluis626/LosAngeles1980.jpg

Call it an optical illusion, if you want.. but we have come a long way.
Adding to that, 19 years ago our rail system carried 0 passengers. No Metrolink, no blue line, no red, no gold, no extensions, no NOTHING. Today we transport 300k weekday boardings on rail. To put it in perspective in 19 years we've found a way to move the entire population of the City of Tampa every day. Which brings me to my next point. If the Jewelry district's a wall between better districts (I guess) isn't it important to remember that before 1999 South Park wasn't a district we'd care for at all? And having developed the New Jerk thick skin I'll tell you guys that part of urban living is taking it, and dealing it back. I can't tell you guys how many times I shoved people, pushed them into a subway car, made an annoying comment when they decided to pull out their metro card at the turnstile, and SO many other not so friendly Pasadena-like things. Oh, and about the homeless. My NY winter ritual consisted of spraying cologne on my scarf daily so if there was a homeless on the train I'd be able to avoid throwing up by smelling my good self. Living Urban means you get to smell everyone else's fart, literally. All the good and the bad shiiat comes with the experience, including being called a homo as you walk hand in hand with someone of the same sex. Did I mention how many stupid people there are in urban areas?

[ThreeHundred]

My God..is that a Datsun?

And I agree with Ruffy on the fact that living in a downtown (ANY downtown) means you have to learn how to deal with the dregs of soceity. Not to say that the motley crew isn't in the suburbs but they are most known for roaming around a urban enviorment. I live in the desert. You would think that it would be too hot for the cripples and crazies to bother people but they do. Tucson has a very large homeless population. And it's amplified by the huge drug problem that this city has. And while I don't live in downtown Tucson (I live about 4 miles away from it), I go there all the time and I too get bugged when someone asks me for some change or a cigeratte (which I can't really blame them as a pack of Marlboro Smooths are almost 8 bucks out here). I just grin and bear it. You knew that DTLA was iffy when you moved there. But isn't it better now then when you moved there 3, 4, 5 years ago? DTLA is urban. Sometimes it smells.

[Just-In-Cali]

It blows my mind seeing that pic! The first time I saw the skyline, was in 1990...and it still wasnt as sparce as that.
Ruffy...that was genious!!!! You are absolutly right. It takes a person that has lived here and other places like NY to see that despite their great differences, they can both be called great cities, just of different breeds.
I'm sure our "favorites" in here will take exception, but the reality is utopia cant be found in NY or Chicago any more than it can be found in LA. Its just a matter of learning the heartbeat of your specific hometown and finding the parts that give you pleasure. And if you CANT find any in your town...then please...LEAVE it.