Centre Block | 67 , 46 m | 18 , 12 fl | Proposed [Archive]

KitchenerBitcher

May 25, 2008, 2:48 AM

I e-mailed the head of downtown and community development, about the status of Centre Block and got this response.

Hello,
Thanks for your interest as having more residents in the urban heart of the city is a key to sustained community downtown. It's a ready market for goods and services and creates a lively activity of people in everyday life in the city!

The final proponent for development of Centre Block is Andrin Homes, the same company which developed Kaufman Lofts. As a private company, they won a bid for this project and are in final stages of agreement with the City which currently owns the property, but the city doesn't proceed with the construction. The status today is that the City is currently in negotiations and with council approval the project proceeds by Andrin to design and development. The hope is that by the fall a decision is made on these details and then the construction can be planned by Andrin Homes.

Silvia Wright
Downtown and Community Development
City of Kitchener
519-741-2392

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 10, 2008, 9:33 PM

Haven't heard anything about Centre Block lately. Everything the city publishes still has Centre Block in the negotiation stage. Does anyone know when council will come out with a decision on this, or when talks are supposed to conclude?

waterloowarrior

Jun 12, 2008, 9:22 PM

CTV News story... according to them council will decide monday night whether to approve it.... more on tonight's newscast at 6

http://www.swo.ctv.ca/news.php?id=1898&PHPSESSID=22bd3ad5d2d0714ee9347ce8989bc991

watch for documents being posted for the meeting
http://www.kitchener.ca/calendar/calendarEvent.aspx?CalPara=16

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 13, 2008, 12:23 AM

Finally, we will at least have an answer to Centre Block. I know I will be crossing all my fingers for a couple of days! Maybe I am being naive, but I really think the city will agree to Andrin's proposal. This is the perfect thing for downtown right now. It could really put us on the map. Does anyone know if Monday's council meeting will be broadcast on the local Rogers station?

jcollins

Jun 13, 2008, 12:01 PM

Is council just deciding if they should go with Andrin's proposal or someone elses? Or is council having to commit any money to this as well?

waterloowarrior

Jun 13, 2008, 7:26 PM

centre block evaluation committee report (http://www.kitchener.ca/Files/Item/item14403_cao-08-010_-_centre_block_evaluation_committee.pdf)

RECOMMENDATION:
That Andrin Investments Limited be selected as the successful proponent for the redevelopment of Centre Block on the basis of the evaluation and recommendation of the Centre Block Evaluation Committee as set out in Report # CAO-08-010, and on the basis of Andrin’s preliminary design concept as presented to Finance and Corporate Services Committee this date; and further that

Staff be directed to continue negotiations with Andrin Investments Limited on the details of a non-binding Letter of Intent to be used as the basis for the preparation of a development agreement for Centre Block.

DHLawrence

Jun 13, 2008, 8:23 PM

Good! Approve it and get on with it already!

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 13, 2008, 9:13 PM

Yeah, I want to see this development get started. Even if it does get approved it will still probably be quite a long, slow process. Although, the speed of Andrin's construction projects in the past has been more favourable than, say, Auburn!

Brenden

Jun 14, 2008, 3:10 PM

Centre Block proposal ready for council
(http://news.therecord.com/News/Local/article/366826)

Centre Block proposal ready for council

http://media.therecord.com/images/f7/30/fb0adf1a4166ab78b2f1987c6e3b.jpeg
June 14, 2008
Terry Pender
RECORD STAFF

KITCHENER

City council will be asked Monday to spend another $5.5 million on the redevelopment of a moribund block in the core.

After a year of negotiations with Andrin Investments Ltd., staff will ask council to select the Brampton-based developer for the long-awaited rebuilding of Centre Block.

It will be the latest chapter in the city's nine-year effort to assemble the land -- bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets -- and persuade someone to redevelop it.

"It continues with the huge momentum we have in the downtown core," said Mark Garner, head of the Kitchener Downtown Business Association and a member of the committee that evaluated the Andrin plan.

Included as part of the deal would be a cash infusion of $5.5 million by the city to pay for the cost of building 250 underground-parking spaces for the public, which Kitchener would own.

"There is a need for increased parking in the core," Garner said. "If we are going to get that growth, I think there is a huge need for that."

If councillors approve the deal, a detailed development agreement must be negotiated with Andrin, which could take up to five months. The company must also pre-sell 60 to 70 per cent of the 384 condominiums it plans for the site before construction begins. Work could start next spring.

It would take four years to finish the $90-million project, which includes two condo towers and shorter buildings that would wrap around Duke, Young and King streets. An underground parking garage with 750 spaces and a courtyard are also planned.

A committee of staff and citizens, formed in early 2007, has evaluated the plan and endorsed it.

"I think it is very important to get some high-quality housing in the Kitchener core," said committee member Rick Haldenby, the director of the University of Waterloo school of architecture.

Andrin wants to convert the historic Mayfair building into a boutique hotel and spa. Retail and live-work units are slated for the three-storey buildings fronting Duke, Young and King streets. The renovation of two other historic addresses on King is also part of the plan. "We need a social and cultural mix in the core, and I think this has the potential to draw people to live downtown," Haldenby said.

The city spent $9.1 million to assemble the land and buy out several businesses. The figure includes $7.65 million for the land and businesses and $1.45 million on legal fees, closing costs and consultants.

Under the proposed deal, Andrin will pay the city $3.1 million -- $2.3 million for the vacant land, $100,000 for a strip of land along King Street and $700,000 for the historic buildings at 11 Young St. and at 156-158 King St.

The 250 parking spaces would cost $35,000 each, for a total of $8.75 million, said Dan Chapman, acting city treasurer.

The city has $5.5 million earmarked for the parking from its economic development investment fund. That, coupled with the funds from the sale of land and buildings to Andrin, would be used to pay for the parking spaces.

"So our estimate right now is that we are about $400,000 short in funding, but we are still in negotiations with Andrin," Chapman said.

The city is on the hook to provide 175 parking spaces to Wilfrid Laurier University students and faculty for $20 a month per space. This was part of the deal negotiated to attract the school of social work to the downtown.

Andrin is no stranger to Kitchener. It partnered with Kimshaw Holdings to convert the former Kaufman factory into condominiums. That project cost more than $40 million.

When the city sought proposals for the redevelopment of Centre Block, three companies submitted plans by April 2007 -- Morguard Investments, the Windmill Development Group and Andrin. Within a few weeks Morguard and Windmill withdrew, leaving Andrin as the sole developer to negotiate with the city.

tpender@therecord.com

Brenden

Jun 14, 2008, 3:15 PM

same Post sorry

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 16, 2008, 8:11 PM

What is actually being decided at tonight's (Tuesday's) meeting regarding Centre Block?

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 17, 2008, 2:37 AM

So on the city's website it sounds like the downtown advisory is all thumbs up for Centre block project after today's meeting! I still really don't know what they were trying to achieve at the meeting though?

Brenden

Jun 17, 2008, 12:13 PM

Core developer selected

Kitchener will pursue Centre Block deal with Kaufman Lofts company
June 17, 2008
Terry Pender
RECORD STAFF

KITCHENER

City councillors unanimously voted yesterday to pursue a deal with Andrin Investments Limited of Brampton for a $90-million redevelopment of Centre Block, which is bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets.

But it will take up to six years to transform the moribund downtown block into a high-density development producing about $390,000 a year in taxes for city coffers.

"It has been a long process," Mayor Carl Zehr said during yesterday's meeting of the finance committee.

About nine years ago the city started buying land and businesses on Centre Block after learning a pornographic movie house was going to open on the block next to City Hall. In total, the city spent about $9.1 million to buy the land, businesses and pay associated fees for lawyers and consultants.

"This is the type of development we have been looking for and it is now on our table," Zehr said.

The proposal calls for two mid-rise buildings containing about 385 condominiums. A 16-storey building will be constructed at Duke and Young streets, and a 12-storey building off King Street.

A four-storey building will wrap around Duke and Young streets. Another four storey building will be built along that block's now-vacant stretch of King Street.

A public courtyard will be built in the centre of the block, and an underground-parking garage with 750 spaces will be built. The first floor of that garage will have 250 spaces for the public. The city will buy those spaces from Andrin for $8.75 million.

"Quite frankly I am very pleased," Coun. John Gazzola said.

A development agreement must be negotiated between the city and Andrin. Once that is in place Andrin will begin pre-selling condos. If all goes well construction could begin next spring.

Andrin is well know to city officials as that company did the $40 million conversion of the old Kaufman factory into condominiums.

"We really look forward to working with you and creating a great development for our downtown," Coun. Geoff Lorentz said.

"I think this will be a real boost for our downtown core, and it will certainly add a lot of character and excitement to our downtown, which we really need," Lorentz said.

In 1998, the year before the city started buying land on Centre Block, the land and businesses there produced $35,000 in city taxes. Once the proposed development is completed it will produce an estimated $390,000-a-year in city taxes, and another $800,000 annually to be split among Waterloo Region and the two school boards.

"Fundamentally this is going to bring significant new dollars to our community," Coun. Berry Vrbanovic said.

Peter Smith, the head of Andrin Investments spelled out the timelines for city councillors.

The first phase would see the buildings constructed at Duke and Ontario streets, along with part of the underground garage. The second phase includes the buildings on the King Street side of the block, and the rest of the underground-parking garage. The third phase is the conversion of the Mayfair building into a boutique hotel and spa.

"My guess is that would be over a five or six year period, with phase one being about 24 months, phase two being about 24 to 36 months and the Mayfair following after that," Smith said.

Smith said Andrin must pre-sell 70 to 75 per cent of the condos before construction begins.

tpender@therecord.com

looks like we are moving forward!

koops65

Jun 17, 2008, 3:41 PM

I hope that was just a typo about the 16 storey building, its supposed to be 18, isn't it? Anyways, good news. I doubt there will be any problems selling those units.

Section ThirtyOne

Jun 17, 2008, 4:50 PM

Isn't 70-75% of units presold an awfully high number to wait for before beginning construction?

IIRC, most condo developments begin construction at a far lower number.

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 17, 2008, 6:03 PM

Yeah that does seem high, I think they will be able to do it though. The paper must have made a mistake with the 16 storeys.

BusyBerliner

Jun 17, 2008, 11:42 PM

it will take up to six years to transform the moribund downtown block into a high-density development

That's just a bit depressing. :(

Looks like we may be stuck with a parking lot as our region's centerpiece till 2014 - or longer if there are more delays.

This just seem like so far far away. Especially since I can remember being excited about centre block redevelopment schemes eight years ago now and to think we're still six years away is just a bit sad.

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 22, 2008, 1:20 PM

What is being decided on Monday Night'scouncil meeting?

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 24, 2008, 3:19 PM

It says on the city website that final approval was to be decided at last night's council meeting. Has anyone got any information on this? It was not in the paper today.

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 25, 2008, 3:00 AM

I e mailed my councillor, Christina Weylie about what happened in last night's council meeting regarding Centre Block. She said that Andrin will be putting together a final proposal for council to consider. She also said that Andrin can start to test the waters for interest in the condos. Maybe we will start seeing some advertisements this Summer.

kitchener-lrt

Jun 25, 2008, 2:17 PM

Here's a blunt question:
Is Centre Block a go?

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 25, 2008, 3:09 PM

lol I've been asking the same thing for a couple of days! I've been e-mailing and I can't seem to get a straight answer from anyone at City Hall. My prediction is that negotiations will drag on through the Summer, and hopefully we will have an official answer by the Fall.

KitchenerBitcher

Jun 26, 2008, 2:12 AM

A source at City Hall told me that the deadline to sign the documents is October 31st, and it is doubtful that they will be ready before then. After that Andrin is anxious to start selling, and once they have sold their 75 %, construction should soon follow.

koops65

Aug 11, 2008, 7:39 PM

Good news to see that things are slowly progressing... lets hope they get their 75% fast!

kwoldtimer

Aug 12, 2008, 1:06 AM

I really hope that this succeeds. Having been in Kitchener recently, I was struck that there seems to be a good deal of development underway or being discussed around the edges of the downtown core, but that there is a tremendous need for something in the centre to start to pull things together. It seemed to me that a lot is riding on the success of the Centre Block proposal.

Cambridgite

Aug 12, 2008, 1:54 AM

Finally!!!!! :gaah:

:banana:

kitchener-lrt

Aug 12, 2008, 2:47 AM

Finally!!!!! :gaah:

:banana:

I'll second that!:notacrook:

Duke-Of-Waterloo

Aug 12, 2008, 3:13 AM

:jester:

Section ThirtyOne

Oct 29, 2008, 12:07 PM

http://news.therecord.com/News/CanadaWorld/article/435820
Fiscal chill stalls Centre Block

October 29, 2008
Terry Pender
RECORD STAFF
KITCHENER

The worldwide financial crisis will delay by six to eight months the start of the long-awaited redevelopment of downtown Kitchener's Centre Block. Peter Smith of Andrin Homes, the Brampton-based developer behind the $90-million plan, said the company will launch a campaign after next June to pre-sell the approximately 385 condominiums planned for the site.

"The market is sluggish right now, we all know that, not just in Kitchener but throughout the area," Smith said in a telephone interview yesterday.

Plans call for four new buildings on the block bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets. Two mid-rise buildings, one on King and one at Young and Duke streets, will house most of the condominiums. A park and an underground parking garage with 750 spaces are also planned. Low-rise buildings will front King Street and wrap around Young and Duke streets. Smith expects the economy to pick up after the second quarter next year, and the company sees little point trying to sell any units before then.

"We would try to time our launch with a more positive outlook in the market," Smith said.

"You don't want to go out at a time when there is a lack of confidence because that kind of makes the project stale."

For years, the city has tried to redevelop the Centre Block properties, which it started buying up in the late 1990s after learning a pornographic movie house was to open. In April 2007, the city announced Andrin Homes would get the nod for the redevelopment of the block. At that time, it was thought construction might start by the spring of this year. Then in June this year, councillors voted unanimously to pursue a development agreement with Andrin Homes, which was to be in place by the end of this month. At that time, it was said construction could begin in the spring of 2009. But negotiations have been delayed, and the development agreement will not be ready until Dec. 10. On Monday, councillors voted to push back the deadline. Lawyers for the city and developer simply need more time to agree on the details, Smith said.

"We are not having any issues with the city at this point at all," Smith said.

Andrin is very familiar with the condominium market in downtown Kitchener. It was behind the award- winning $40 million conversion of the Kaufman factory into condos. As part of the Centre Block project, Andrin set up a website -- livingatcitycentre.ca -- where potential buyers can register for more information.

"Registrations are not as great as we expected, but given the economic times, it's not a surprise," Smith said.

Rod Regier, the city's director of economic development, said the slumping economy may have some impact on the downtown project. But Kitchener's economy remains fairly strong, he said, and the real estate market is more stable in this area than in many other cities.

"I would anticipate that what's happening now might delay the start by a marginal amount of time," Regier said.

"The fact that the real estate market is slowing down a little bit, I don't think it really throws a big question market over the project."
:sly:

koops65

Oct 29, 2008, 3:46 PM

crappy news...

Cambridgite

Oct 30, 2008, 2:35 AM

Lovely...Downtown Kitchener finally has something going for it and then we head into a recession and the banks can't finance it. :no:

ForestryW

Nov 2, 2008, 5:28 PM

Give it time. I have complete confidence this will be built, we just need to ride out the economic doldrums.

KitchenerBitcher

Nov 2, 2008, 9:14 PM

Give it time. I have complete confidence this will be built, we just need to ride out the economic doldrums.

My thoughts exactly. I know this has been going on for an eternity, but I just can't see the city keeping this from going through. Also, I don't know if these have been around for a while, but I just saw my first bus ad for "City Centre" today. So even after their announcement of the delay, they are still interested in promoting the project.

Duke-Of-Waterloo

Nov 26, 2008, 2:11 AM

City protects two heritage sites
(by Terry Pender, THE RECORD)

November 25, 2008

KITCHENER

Two old buildings on a high-profile downtown property are now protected under the Ontario Heritage Act and cannot be demolished without the city's support.

Councillors voted unanimously last night to protect the exterior of the Mayfair Hotel, at Young and King streets, along with the former Hymmen Hardware building at 156-158 King St. West.

Both buildings are owned by the city, which is negotiating an agreement with Brampton-based Andrin Homes to redevelop Centre Block.

Heritage Kitchener was concerned about the future of the buildings and called for the designation under the Ontario Heritage Act.

Council agreed with little discussion.

"I think it means a lot for our community," said Coun. John Gazzola, council's representative on Heritage Kitchener.

The Mayfair Hotel at 11 Young St. was built in 1905 by Edward Lippert. A furniture store and undertaker were originally in the building. Hymmen Hardware opened in 1906.

Rod Regier, the city's director of economic development, said Andrin Homes had no objections to the heritage designations.

"Andrin has known from the outset that the buildings are important to the city," Regier said.

The city has said it wants the two buildings included in the proposed redevelopment of the city-owned land.

Andrin worked with Heritage Kitchener when the developer spent more than $40 million to convert the former Kaufman factory, which is also a heritage building, into condominiums.

The city and Andrin are scheduled to conclude a development agreement by Dec. 10.

The company has said it want to begin marketing the condos in mid-2009.

It wants to pre-sell about 80 per cent of the 385 units before starting construction on the $90-million project.

bauer123

Feb 28, 2009, 3:34 AM

Region's economic woes slow Centre Block start

February 27, 2009
TERRY PENDER
RECORD STAFF
KITCHENER

Andrin Homes says it is still committed to redeveloping a key parcel of land next to City Hall.

But construction won't start until next year at the earliest -- a full decade after the city bought up the downtown land and almost two years after Andrin was selected to develop it.

Andrin plans a $95-million redevelopment that includes 385 condos in four new buildings, as well as underground parking and a parkette.

The launch of a marketing campaign has been pushed back to this fall, and no construction will begin until 80 per cent of the condominiums have been sold.

While the current recession batters housing starts and sales, the market for new condominiums will return, said Peter Smith, president of Brampton-based Andrin Homes. "We are still committed to it 100 per cent," Smith said in an interview.

Late next month, city councillors will be asked to approve an agreement of purchase and sale for the land on Centre Block, on the western half of the block bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets.

The agreement won't include firm deadlines for the start of construction. A separate document, called a development agreement, which details how and when the work is to proceed, will not be ready for approval next month.

"We have had to split the agreement of purchase and sale and the development agreement because the development agreement requires information we don't have," Anne Marchildron of Andrin Homes said in an interview.

Planning for the Centre Block project has not reached the stage where a development agreement can be signed.

"So we can't do a construction contract for an underground garage when we don't have drawings to show what that underground garage looks like," Marchildron said.

"So that's the reason the development agreement has been separated from the agreement of purchase and sale."

The City of Kitchener is selling 2.3 acres and two buildings on Centre Block to Andrin for $3.1 million. Marketing was supposed to begin this summer but has been delayed.

"There is nothing in the market to indicate right now there is any value in putting any money into marketing any project," Marchildron said.

Andrin is concerned about the region's economic reliance on automotive manufacturing, she said. The developer is closely following news concerning a bailout of the Big Three automakers.

"Until we have some idea that there is something going forward . . . why would you go into an area where it's so dependent (on auto manufacturing)?" Marchildron asked. "Listen, if those three go down, there could be some big ripple effects."

The City of Kitchener started buying properties and businesses on Centre Block about 10 years ago, after learning a pornographic movie house was set to open in one building.

By 2000, the city had paid about $9.1 million to assemble the land and look after other costs. Interest charges on that debt have increased the total cost to about $13 million. The longer the city retains ownership of the land, the longer it must carry the costs.

For years, the city worked to redevelop the land, and once considered a new central library for the site. Councillors killed that idea after a public outcry at the $65-million price tag.

Nearly two years ago, Andrin was selected as the developer for Centre Block. A development agreement was expected in September 2008, then in December. There is now no deadline for an agreement.

"We may not be taking anything to the market today, because one wonders whether it might be better to hold off for six to nine months before going to the market," Smith said.

"But we are certainly not slowing down on taking things through the process."

Wonder if 144 park is thinking the same thing. Because I haven't heard anything from that in awhile. But I am a little bumed about this I was hoping it would actually go on sale this summer. This project would really help the downtown.

KitchenerBitcher

Feb 28, 2009, 4:25 AM

I suppose it was to be expected :(

waterloowarrior

Apr 3, 2009, 8:25 PM

centreblock agreement of purchase and sale report
http://www.kitchener.ca/Files/Item/item16149_cao-09-021_-_centre_block_agmt_of_purchase___sale.pdf

attach.
http://www.kitchener.ca/Files/Item/item16149_cao-09-021_-_centre_block_agmt_of_purchase___sale_-_attachment.pdf

DHLawrence

Apr 7, 2009, 7:30 PM

Centre Block land to sell for $3.1M (http://news.therecord.com/News/Local/article/516571)

But it may take 3 years for construction to begin
April 07, 2009
Terry Pender
RECORD STAFF

KITCHENER

It could be up to three and a half years before construction begins on an ambitious redevelopment of city-owned lands in the core.

The Brampton based developer Andrin Limited and the City of Kitchener tabled an agreement of purchase and sale yesterday for 2.6 acres of land on the western half of the block bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets.

"This agreement solidifies the future of Centre Block," Rod Regier, the city's director of economic development, said in a presentation to city council.

"The Centre Block project is one of the most ambitious residential projects in Waterloo Region. It sets a new standard for reurbanization, environmental design and architectural excellence," Regier said.

The city will sell the land for $3.1 million. The agreement is a milestone in the 10 -year-long effort to bring new life into the city-owned lands on the block.

So far, the city has paid out about $13 million to buy the lands, buildings, businesses, and pay associated fees and interest costs.

The 32-page agreement is available on the city's website and will be circulated among several advisory committees in the coming weeks before coming back to city councillors for approval on April 20.

But the details of the building designs, plans for the underground parking garage and construction contracts will not be nailed down until the city and Andrin sign what's called a development agreement.

That should be done by the end of November.

"Just so people understand, in the next week there is not going to be a big new building there," Coun. John Gazzola said.

"So what kind of ballpark time would we be looking at?"¾ Gazzola asked.

The time will largely be a function of the strength of the marketplace, Regier said.

"We have outlined a maximum time it can take, which is 36 months from the completion of a development agreement," Regier said of the project's first phase.

The developer has proposed a $90-million redevelopment that includes two medium rise buildings with about 380 condominiums, underground parking, retail and mixed use space along the streets and the renovation of the Mayfair Hotel and 156-158 King St. West into a boutique hotel and spa.

The development will be done in three phases. The first phase will front on Young and Duke streets and see the underground parking garage constructed.

Phase 1 also includes a building with about 225 condominiums.

Under the proposed agreement of purchase and sale, Andrin must deposit $2 with the city and begin construction within three years of Nov. 30, 2009 or within three years of the signing of a development agreement.

The deadline for the start of construction of Phase 2, which fronts on King Street, is five years from the signing of a development agreement, or five years from Nov. 30, 2009.

The Mayfair Hotel and 156-158 King St. West will be transferred to Andrin within six years from Nov. 30 when the first two phases are complete.

Peter Smith, the president of Andrin, said his company remains committed to the project and is confident the market for new housing will return.

And when the market returns, he said downtown Kitchener is the ideal place to be building new condominiums.

But Smith also counselled patience, saying about 80 per cent of the units must be pre-sold before work begins on any phase.

Smith's company bought the old Kaufman factory and transformed the building into condominiums.

"It does take time, all these deals take time," Smith said.

"I should remind you that we purchased the Kaufman rubber factory in 2002, we started construction in 2006, and we are now out of there," Smith said.

One public delegation appeared before city councillors yesterday urging caution.

Jack Redmond, a retired developer, real estate agent and surveyor, said the agreement needs to be more specific about what lands will be transferred to the developer.

Redmond also said it is very unusual for the city to pay the legal costs for the transaction, something the developer normally covers.

tpender@therecord.com

bauer123

Apr 8, 2009, 1:58 AM

It's good to hear this is progressing although I really hope it's gets going sooner than later. With 144 park selling soon that should give them somewhat of a idea what they will do with this. It seems they wont go to market till they really know it will sell. Can't blame them but this project will be huge for downtown kitchener.

metropolis

Apr 9, 2009, 12:20 AM

They are worried because the Kaufmans took forever to sell out. Phase two anyways did.

notmyfriends

Apr 9, 2009, 1:00 AM

It did?

urban!ty

Apr 9, 2009, 6:29 AM

The Kaufman lofts were in high demand and sold quite well, I believe. Atleast in the context of the downtown Kitchener market.

kauffer

Apr 9, 2009, 1:26 PM

They are worried because the Kaufmans took forever to sell out. Phase two anyways did.
You must be thinking of some other development. Phase II sold out in about six months, which is far faster than the norm. For example, it took more than four YEARS to sell all of the Seagram Lofts...

notmyfriends

Apr 9, 2009, 2:11 PM

Yeah, I was pretty sure after original sales were so good, they went back and even added extra floors to the Kaufman building.

jcollins

Apr 9, 2009, 10:14 PM

Yeah, I was pretty sure after original sales were so good, they went back and even added extra floors to the Kaufman building.

Im pretty sure you're right. So good that those that bought lofts saw immediate jump in the value of them because of the high level of demand.

metropolis

Apr 10, 2009, 2:30 AM

yeah I remember looking at those on 3 different occasions as I was house shopping for over a year. Near the end there I remember the sales guy saying they only had a handful of units available and how he was hoping to finally be out of there cause he'd been there so damn long.

jcollins

Apr 16, 2009, 1:59 PM

Speed up Centre Block, city told

April 16, 2009
Terry Pender
RECORD STAFF

KITCHENER

http://media.therecord.topscms.com/images/9d/f6/373197c34b64abae4d5470789284.jpeg

Some downtown property owners are worried it could take up to 10 years to see a strategic corner redeveloped.

Bernie Nimer, a developer who owns the building at 179 King St. W., said landlords in the core support the city's proposed agreement with Andrin Ltd. for the redevelopment of the western half of Centre Block.

Nimer said the corner of King and Young streets, which includes the Mayfair Hotel and 156-158 King St. W., should be redeveloped sooner than proposed in the agreement.

The buildings have been vacant for years, he said, and it doesn't make sense to leave them like that after the city spends about $8 million on King Street upgrades this year.

Some downtown property owners are willing to help Andrin redevelop the corner sooner, he said.

"I think we have beat this horse to death," Nimer said of the years of work the city has devoted to redeveloping Centre Block.

City officials met with some members of their economic development advisory committee yesterday to get their reaction to the proposed agreement of purchase and sale that will see the city sell 2.6 acres on the block bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets for $3.1 million.

"We all agree these are strategic properties on King Street and we would all like to see them develop sooner rather than later," said Rod Regier, the city's director of economic development. "This is a really important location for the city."

The first phase includes an underground parking garage, about 220 condominiums in a building at Young and Duke streets and a shorter building that wraps around both streets. The second phase includes about 165 condominiums on King in a mixed-use building.

The final phase is the renovation and restoration of the Mayfair Hotel and the building next door into a boutique hotel and spa. The total value of the project is estimated at $90 million.

Ian Cook, of Cook Homes, said the second phase of the project should be done before anything else. It would bring a finished product to King Street faster, Cook said.

"I can tell you that is an active debate within Andrin," Regier said.

Reversing the order of the phasing is complicated by the need to build the underground parking garage first.

Under the proposed agreement, it could take up to 3 1/2 years before construction starts on the first phase.

Mark Bingeman, general manager of Bingemans, said the proposed agreement should see the city compensated for the years of work it has put into the site in case the developer pulls out.

Brian Bennet, a consultant on the advisory committee, said the city should set a deadline for Andrin to build a presentation centre and model suite. That could cost up to $500,000 and demonstrate Andrin's commitment to the project, he said.

The deal will be reviewed by the city's finance committee on April 20. Council is scheduled to ratify the agreement on April 27.

tpender@therecord.com

It just seems like its one thing after another with this project. Lets make it happen!

Cambridgite

Apr 16, 2009, 6:47 PM

Speed up Centre Block, city told

I concur!

aplz

Apr 17, 2009, 6:12 PM

Under the proposed agreement, it could take up to 3 1/2 years before construction starts on the first phase.

Come on...in 3 and a half years nobody will care or remember about this. Hasn't this city learned anything over the past 40 years?

DHLawrence

Jun 16, 2009, 1:59 PM

Centre Block land sold to Andrin for condos (http://news.therecord.com/News/Local/article/553998)
Construction may take until 2012 to begin
June 16, 2009
Jeff Outhit
RECORD STAFF

KITCHENER

Kitchener council will sell a hectare of downtown land to a developer who plans condominiums next to City Hall.

But construction may not launch until 2012, and there may not even be a sales office on site until August 2010.

Council approved the Centre Block deal last night in a 5-2 vote. Coun. John Gazzola and Coun. John Smola were opposed.

"I really feel our taxpayers deserve a better deal," Gazzola said.

Other councillors say it's time to move on and try to develop the site on King Street, just east of City Hall.

"Although this may not be the perfect deal . . . we need to give it a chance," Coun. Berry Vrbanovic said.

"It may not be perfect, but it is a fair deal," Mayor Carl Zehr said.

Some highlights:

If construction launches by Nov. 2012, council will sell the lands to Andrin Limited for $3.1 million. That's after council spent about $13 million over nine years to assemble the lands and buildings.

Council plans to spend up to $8.8 million more, to buy up to 250 underground parking spaces.

Council can pull the Mayfair Hotel from the project if someone else can be found to redevelop it sooner.

Andrin has indicated it must pre-sell about 180 units before constructing a first phase.

The proposed redevelopment ultimately includes about 380 condominiums, underground parking, and retail space along the streets.

Development and construction agreements are still to be finalized.

jouthit@therecord.com

And once again, we get to hurry up and wait.

Bauer_buyer

Jun 16, 2009, 9:03 PM

It appears that all the development planned or in the finishing stages in Waterloo is syphoning off any potential buyers from the Centre Block project.

What with the Bauer complex, 144 Park, the Canbar project and a host of others, Kitchener doesn't stand a chance of any development in the near future.

Sad....but the multi million dollar streetscaping won't go wanting as I'm sure Kitchener people who live downtown will enjoy the beautiful scenery planned for their core.

It's wonderful that every few years they get to enjoy all that Kitchener council bestows upon them.
Wish Waterloo could do the same.

Tibor420

Jun 17, 2009, 1:46 PM

... it never ends with this city. Amazing how at a snail pace this city does business.... im gonna be long dead before I see the Kitchener i want.... our city is run by chimp people.... chimps.

WatDot

Jun 17, 2009, 3:57 PM

Is it just me or does the City of Kitchener love to make poor land development/sale decisions? The past couple year has seen the Uniroyal clean-up and sale of property at a loss, this Centre Block sale at a loss, etc. I realize they have a long way to go to fixing up Kitchener but thank goodness for Mr. Gazzola. These decisions are really starting to add up financially.

zanate

Jun 17, 2009, 7:59 PM

But, is somewhere like Uniroyal a situation where without the City stepping in to fund the cleanup and sale at a loss, the site would languish as being uneconomical?

It looks bad for a site to be sold at a loss, as if taking a brownfield, spending $10mil to detox it and then selling it for $4mil is poor planning. But what is converting some former eyesore into a positively contributing piece of the city fabric actually worth? Would you blink if $6mil went to a streetscape renewal or, to quote a certain Record interviewee, to "fix up our parks"?

My office resided, until recently, in a fairly decrepit office space built on the front of a warehouse in North Waterloo. The landlord cared not to put money into it, and the thing wouldn't be redeveloped-- squeeze rent til it falls apart. Our accountant suspected that the property the building was on had no redevelopment value-- anyone who bought the property to redevelop would have to shoulder the cost of cleanup of site contamination he suspected was pretty severe.

It's not unreasonable to me that the Cities target certain sites like these for rehabilitation on the public dime. Now that's not to say that there isn't ample space for mismanagement along the way... :rolleyes:

WatDot

Jun 18, 2009, 2:18 PM

It's not unreasonable to me that the Cities target certain sites like these for rehabilitation on the public dime.

I understand what you are saying, but in a capitalist society should we not be making the private sector pay for this clean-up and take any loss? We may as well face that we are becoming more and more communist/socialist everyday. Auto Industry bailouts, industrial clean-up. The public (government) is covering for these irresponsible businesses at a rate BEYOND what is received from corporate taxes. That is not responsible or capitalist.

But again, I know what you are getting at... it is good planning or the right thing to do... but in the bigger financial picture it's becoming pretty stupid.

jcollins

Nov 17, 2009, 10:38 PM

Number of residents downtown has grown 31 per cent

November 17, 2009
By Terry Pender, Record staff

KITCHENER — More people are living and working in the downtown area five years after the city launched an ambitious multi-million dollar plan to bring more life to the central neighbourhoods.

“It was recognized that education and knowledge creation would be the foundation,” Silvia Di Donato, the city’s manager of downtown and community development, said in a presentation to city councillors on Monday.

In the past five years more than $100 million in tax dollars was spent on the downtown and surrounding neighbourhoods.

“In a very short time we have already moved to a critical mass in the life sciences,” Di Donato said.

The city provided $30 million and the land for the University of Waterloo school of pharmacy. That led to a medical school next door that will open next year. It also sparked a $40 million conversion of the old Kaufman factory into 249 condominiums and a $30 million renovation of the Lang Tannery.

A bio-tech firm also located in the core. That firm moved into the second floor of a building that was bought and renovated by a local developer. Shopper’s Drug Mart opened a large store on the main floor.

“Our goal is to build investor confidence,” Di Donato said.

“The kind of confidence that will cause businesses and developers of residential-office-retail to want to locate in the downtown to help boost and diversify the economy,” Di Donato said.

City councillors approved the Downtown Strategic Plan in October 2004.

Since then the farmers’ market was opened, a new entrance to Victoria Park was built on Joseph Street, King Street East was reconstructed a couple of years ago and this summer King Street West was done. The Wilfrid Laurier University graduate school of social work opened in the old St. Jerome’s High School on Duke Street.

The city started programs to help building owners improve facades and convert space on upper floors into residential units.

“We are doing really well,” Di Donato said.

The number of people living in the downtown and surrounding neighbourhoods is up seven per cent to 18,774 during the past five years. When you look at just the downtown, the number of residents increased by 31 per cent to 2,100.

The number of businesses in the core increased by 10 per cent to 697 and the number of employees is up by 16 per cent to 11,967. The office vacancy rate was cut in half to 6.8 per cent.

“That’s amazing to me, very good,” Coun. Christina Weylie said.

Attendance at downtown festivals is up to 380,000 from 288,000 five years ago.

About 728 new residential units were built in the core. A new parking garage is going up at Charles and Benton, another will go underground behind the Queen St. Library and a new courthouse will be built off Scott Street.

“Retailers rely on a ready market for their goods and services, convenient if not captive, and therefore rely on residents in and around the downtown,” Di Donato said.

The city and the Kitchener Downtown Business Improvement Area are working with a Manhattan-based consultant in an effort to improve the mix of retailers in the core.

“I think that’s been our problem in the past, which is having the wrong mix of retail businesses and how do we get it right?” Coun. Geoff Lorentz said.

The downtown business association is preparing a detailed plan to change the retail landscape over time.

“We need to attract residents and employees to a magnetic environment to attract talent,” Di Donato said. “Talent is probably the number one driver for the new economy.”

Coun. John Gazzola wanted to know what is happening with Centre Block—2.6 acres of land the city has spent about $13 million to assemble. It is bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets.

“We have not heard anything about that for quite a while,” Gazzola said.

Rod Regier, the city’s director of economic investment, said a development agreement with Andrin Homes should be ready for approval soon.

Brampton-based Andrin has proposed a $90 million redevelopment of the block, which includes condominiums, mixed-use buildings, underground parking and a small park. A development agreement is supposed to be in place by the end of the month.

“We will be bringing a draft of that agreement to council in the next short little while,” Regier said. “We have been meeting steadily over the last little while and progress is being made.”

tpender@therecord.com

Duke-Of-Waterloo

Nov 17, 2009, 11:34 PM

/\ It's great to see that downtown Kitchener is on its way to meeting the density requirements set out in Places to Grow as an urban growth centre. I really wish that Waterloo and Cambridge would take on a similar aggressive municipally-run campaign to attract more investment into their cores. This is especially true for Waterloo since it must meet a 200 residents and jobs per hectare target as well by 2031 (the same minimum gross density target as downtown Kitchener). Downtown Cambridge (Galt) is only 150 residents and jobs per hectare under Places to Grow, but that's not that far off from 200 and that's not to say they shouldn't launch anything either.

WaterlooInvestor

Nov 18, 2009, 2:44 AM

22:30
5378610
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=5378610

waterloowarrior

Dec 7, 2009, 5:38 PM

http://news.therecord.com/News/Local/article/640436
article about Kitchener mayor

A development agreement between the city and Brampton-based Andrin Homes is expected to be made public today, calling for the construction of 385 condos on Centre Block, which is bordered by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets.

Cambridgite

Dec 7, 2009, 9:24 PM

^ I'll believe it once I see shovels go into the ground. Until then, this project is Barrelyards to me.

diegaxo

Dec 8, 2009, 12:46 AM

^ I'll believe it once I see shovels go into the ground. Until then, this project is Barrelyards to me.

Well Barrel Yards is happening very soon.

bauer123

Dec 8, 2009, 3:37 AM

We can only hope... for both...I am curious to see if Center Block does get a go ahead how they do..

As for the barrel yards I think the Apartments are in the first phase so they should get on that because they know they can rent those out.

The condos are in the second phase I think.

jcollins

Dec 8, 2009, 4:01 AM

I wonder why they haven't released a formal announcement yet. The deal was supposed to be made by the 30th of November.

Well, we now have max. 3 years to get the shovels in the ground. Maybe we'll see a sales centre by spring?

bauer123

Dec 17, 2009, 10:33 PM

KITCHENER—A Brampton-based developer says he will sign an agreement next month with the City of Kitchener for a project that will add 385 condos to the core.

Peter Smith, president of Andrin Homes, said an agreement should be in place by mid-January for the redevelopment of the city-owned half of Centre Block, which is bounded by King, Young, Duke and Ontario streets.

“We have agreed in principle and most of the document has been finalized,” Smith said. “Lawyers are now crossing t’s and dotting i’s but there are no issues.”

Next spring the company plans to build a sales office on the block fronting on King Street West.

“We intend to start our sales in August 2010,” Smith said. “We are moving forward, we are encouraged by everything.”

There are some changes to the phasing of the project.

The first phase will now include a building with 235 condominiums and face Duke Street. Phase 2 will include a building with about 150 units on King Street. The last phase is a boutique hotel in what is now the Mayfair Hotel and neighbouring buildings. An underground parking garage below a landscaped courtyard and live-work spaces will also be constructed.

The entire project is worth an estimated $95 million. Once it gets going the redevelopment of Centre Block will be among the largest residential-mixed use projects in the region.

Some property owners in the core do not like the timing for the redevelopment of the heritage buildings at King and Young Streets. They would like to see that part of the development done sooner.

“We have been working very closely with the (Kitchener Downtown Business Improvement Area) and some local people from Kitchener to see how we could advance the boutique hotel and if possible even push it forward,” Smith said.

“There is considerable interest on the part of some people in Kitchener to work with us in a partnership on that,” Smith said of the boutique hotel.

Mark Garner, executive director of the business improvement area, said there is a proposal to get the Mayfair redeveloped much sooner than originally planned.

“I think we’ve got a viable alternative,” Garner said.

A detailed architectural assessment of the Mayfair is being done. That information will be used to develop detailed designs for the renovations.

“I think we are going down the path of a boutique hotel,” Garner said. “The sooner we can start it, the better.”

Garner, city officials, Andrin and some downtown property owners have been talking for months to refine the development proposal and its staging. City councillors voted in April to approve the agreement of purchase and sale with Andrin.

Rod Regier, the city’s director of economic development, said Andrin wants to find someone else to run the boutique hotel and it has looked at stunningly successful renovations of two famous hotels on Queen Street West in Toronto.

“I know people have looked at the Gladstone and they have looked at the Drake,” Regier said. “The concept of a boutique hotel has been very successful in a number of cities.”

There is a multi-use pathway and express buses connecting downtown Kitchener and the research and technology park on the University of Waterloo’s north campus. It’s the kind of connection that’s caught the attention of the marketing department at the City of Kitchener.

The City of Kitchener is targeting young high-tech workers in its marketing campaign for downtown living. It’s paying dividends, as many high-tech workers bought space in the Kaufman Lofts. Open Text recently announced it is constructing another building in the research park and hiring another 800 people.

“The growing number of knowledge workers in high-tech bodes well for this product,” Regier said.

The successful condo developments on Mansion Street and at the farmers’ market on King Street East help the city in its marketing of downtown to both developers and buyers.

“I get the sense that interest is building in condos downtown,” Regier said.

Prompted by word that a pornographic movie house was set to open there, the city bought several buildings and businesses clustered around the western half of Centre Block. By 2000 it had 2.6 acres of land and several buildings. So far the city has spent about $13 million.

City councillors voted to sell that land to Andrin for $3.1 million. The city will also provide $5.5 million to help pay for the construction of the three-level underground parking garage, the first level of which will be for public parking.

So August is the date I suppose for sales to start meaning 2011 start date probably... happy to hear news on this even tho it's taking forever

mpd618

Dec 18, 2009, 2:28 PM

570 News has a picture (http://www.570news.com/news/local/article/9499--signs-of-progress-on-centre-block). Is this really going to be some towers and a lot of empty space? This is good urban design how?

Matt2727

Dec 18, 2009, 3:00 PM

Thats great news that they are moving forward with this. Maybe by the time sales start i'll be able to buy one of the units. Hopefully.

bauer123

Dec 18, 2009, 3:52 PM

i kinda like the fact they have the courtyard in the middle... I like the design.

This will do wonders for the downtown.

jcollins

Dec 18, 2009, 8:43 PM

Ontario1

Dec 19, 2009, 3:50 AM

Correct me if Im wrong, but isn't that the old design for centre block?
It is the old original one.

Ontario1

Dec 19, 2009, 3:56 AM

It is the old original one.

http://www.kitchener.ca/images/centre_block_main_aerial_image.jpg

....Looks pretty good.

DHLawrence

Dec 19, 2009, 3:59 AM

This is the design that was in The Record just over a year ago (from three pages back):

http://media.therecord.com/images/f7/30/fb0adf1a4166ab78b2f1987c6e3b.jpeg

mpd618

Dec 19, 2009, 4:24 AM

I may not have been following this development then. Anyway, that aerial image looks pretty good to me. It at least has street-fronting buildings on most of the perimeter.

Actonite

Feb 23, 2010, 11:14 AM

Kitchener city council voted last night to give staff the green light to finish the deal with Andrin.
Sure would be nice to get a deal done and actually see some sort of work start on the project.

rapid_business

Oct 5, 2010, 11:11 PM

After years of negotiations with the city, the development has finally been approved and construction on the sales trailer is well under way.

http://www.citycentreliving.ca/

From inside the preview centre

View from Duke/Young
http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb210/Cambridgite/City%20Centre%20District/CityCentre1.jpg

Source: Urban Waterloo at 'Wonderful Waterloo'

As posted by Cambridgite in the Cdn. Proposals section.

rapid_business

Oct 5, 2010, 11:12 PM

A follow-up on the model I posted yesterday. Here is the rending, posted by Urban Waterloo of 'Wonderful Waterloo'.

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb210/Cambridgite/City%20Centre%20District/CityCentre2.jpg

Word has it that one of the penthouses have already sold, and the sales office has only been open for a few days now.

Here is another...

jcollins

Oct 7, 2010, 11:28 AM

Was permission given to take stuff from WW? I know there was some heat between SSP and WW and you can't properly link to them, but using bit.ly as Duke suggested would be the proper way to give credit to where you took the image from.

Either way, might be worth asking.

Cambridgite

Jan 11, 2011, 9:01 PM

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb210/Cambridgite/City%20Centre%20District/Holiday2010_WatReg003.jpg

Lugnut

Jun 29, 2011, 2:33 AM

Did anyone buy in this project? I was in the sales office recently, they look fantastic!!

And with the Mayfair being developed now....watch out! This will be one of the premier developments in Waterloo Region Im thinking.

Lugnut

Jul 8, 2011, 8:55 PM

Here's a picture of the Mayfair.

http://media.mmgdailies.topscms.com/images/c5/b7/0bf8c11f470f994070944af54e8a.jpeg

There are some really cool features to this part of the development. The sky bar sounds amazing. And the president of the Charcoal group is one of the guys leading this project. With that being the case the Charcoal Group could be the ones opening the speakeasy, ground floor restaurant, whiskey bar, and sky bar and restaurant.

The proposed redevelopment plan calls for a speakeasy club in the basement and:

First floor — a restaurant, whisky bar, hotel lobby and pool.

Second floor — 13 suites plus a gym and yoga studio.

Third floor — 13 suites and the spa’s reception.

Fourth floor — 14 suites and the spa.

Fifth floor — 14 suites and office space.

Sixth floor — 14 suites and two conference rooms.

Seventh and Eight floors — 14 suites on each level.

Ninth floor — sky bar and restaurant.

Also, is it worth while changing the name of this to "City Center Condominiums"? And the status from Proposed to Approved? Not sure if there's a mod assigned to this section like in the other sections.