Jackson Street Entertainment District Thread

[HX_Guy]

Envisioning a hip downtown
Developers propose an entertainment district to liven up Phoenix

Ginger D. Richardson and Erica Sagon
The Arizona Republic
Feb. 8, 2007 12:00 AM
San Diego has the Gaslamp Quarter, Miami has South Beach and Denver has LoDo.

Now, a group of private developers wants to create a hip hangout spot in downtown Phoenix, one that rivals or even surpasses those found in some of the nation's greatest cities.

The proposed Jackson Street Entertainment District would cut a path across the southern end of downtown, stretching from Central Avenue to Chase Field, and could be anchored by the state's first House of Blues music venue.
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The blockbuster proposal is significant because it addresses downtown Phoenix's lack of full-time residents and nightlife, both of which are key to turning the area into a true destination spot. The new district, when complete, could boast comedy clubs, signature restaurants, live-music spots and art galleries, as well as office space, housing units and a hotel.

Dale Jensen, part owner of the Phoenix Suns and Arizona Diamondbacks, is one of Jackson Street's backers. He said he and his business partners decided to move forward with the idea after realizing that there was nothing to keep people downtown after a Suns or Diamondbacks game.

"The thought was, we have these two big boxes in downtown, the arena and the ballpark, but we really have nothing for people to do but go to that box and go home," he said.

Jackson Street marks the second time in recent months that the private sector has turned its attention to downtown Phoenix in a big way.

Late last year, Phoenix officials approved plans for CityScape, a megashopping, residential and retail project that will give the downtown area its first grocery store in 25 years.

CityScape, which will be just north of the proposed Jackson Street Entertainment District, is expected to complement this newest plan by providing residents and urban workers with a variety of shopping and dining options downtown.

It is expected to feature more national retail chains, while Jackson Street will focus heavily on music and entertainment venues.

Much is still unknown about the Jackson Street proposal, including its cost - early estimates have been about $300 million - tenants and effect on the surrounding Warehouse District.

Downtown residents and artists say they like the concept of an entertainment zone but fear developers will sacrifice some of the neighborhood's unique older buildings in their quest to remake the city's core.

"If we lose the Warehouse District to tall high-rises, we lose the integrity of the area," said Steve Weiss, steering committee chairman for the Downtown Voices Coalition. "We don't want to be just another generic city of tall structures."

Filling a void
The idea of a downtown entertainment district is not a new one.

Phoenix leaders identified the need back in 2004, when they adopted their strategic plan for downtown.

But this marks the first time anyone has moved forward on the concept.

In addition to Jensen, the principals behind the project are Bradley Yonover, Jensen's partner in the Arizona Grand Prix, an Indy-car-style street race that will be held in downtown Phoenix in November; Michael Hallmark, a businessman who designed some of downtown's most notable buildings, including the US Airways Center, the Herberger Theater Center and Chase Field; and David Wallach, a Chicago-based developer who is building downtown Phoenix's first high-rise condominium project, the Summit at Copper Square.

The project's developers say they believe that this is the ideal time to proceed with the plan, in part because the city has made such a huge investment in the downtown in recent years. Big-ticket projects include a new Arizona State University campus, a University of Arizona medical school, light rail, a $600 million-plus expansion of the Phoenix Convention Center and a new $350 million Sheraton hotel.

"It's just the perfect storm of events," Jensen said. "We want to make it so that no one ever comes downtown and says, 'I can't find something to do down there.' "

Unique venues
Early plans call for the Jackson Street district to include 300,000 square feet of office space, more than 1,000 housing units, a hotel, courtyards and paseos that are permanently closed to vehicular traffic, and at least 450,000 square feet of entertainment and retail space. That is nearly three times what is available at the Arizona Center, a downtown shopping mall at Third and Van Buren streets.

Developers have been tight-lipped about what tenants they are trying to lure, but people familiar with the project say principals are already in negotiations with the House of Blues.

It would be the chain's first club in the state.

"Obviously, House of Blues . . . are industry leaders in that genre," Hallmark said. "They're someone who we are talking to and are having ongoing conversations with."

House of Blues, based in Los Angeles, did not return calls for comment.

The deal is not definite, but if House of Blues was to locate in the proposed entertainment district, it would likely be one of the project's few nationally recognized tenants, Hallmark said.

Instead, the majority of the restaurants, bars and shops will be "homegrown and one-of-a-kind concepts," Hallmark said. "If you can find it somewhere else in the Valley, we probably don't want it in the district."

The area, for example, could include a comedy club and movie theater, Hallmark said. He added that he has shared his plans with Sundance Cinemas, a fledgling theater chain for independent films.

Next steps
The Jackson Street project has the potential to completely reshape what has been an underused part of downtown.

Developers, for example, would like to build new retail and residential spaces and literally attach, or "wrap," them around existing buildings, including the US Airways Center and a city-owned parking garage at Third and Jackson streets. The design plan accomplishes several things, including injecting energy into the district, narrowing streets and promoting a pedestrian-friendly environment, proponents say.

But the plan faces some tough political and logistical battles.

First, developers will need the city to OK the proposal. That will likely not happen before April or May because Phoenix first needs to seek bids from anyone interested in creating a downtown entertainment district.

The group behind the Jackson Street project, however, is the front-runner because it already controls most of the land in the area.

In addition, the project's backers will need to persuade downtown artists and historic-preservation groups to buy into the idea. Some already are concerned that the proposal will result in architecturally unique properties being razed.

"If they come in and tear down a bunch of buildings, then what's going to stop somebody else from coming in and doing the same thing?" asked Beatrice Moore, one of the driving voices behind Phoenix's arts community. "I think that would set a very bad example."

Hallmark said he and his partners would go out of their way to integrate historic and unique buildings into plans for the district.

"Our intent is to preserve all of the ones that have character and value," Hallmark said.

If the process goes smoothly, parts of the new entertainment district could be open by 2009.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0208downtowndistrict0208.html

[Vicelord John]

FUUUUUUCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKK!!!!!!!!!!!!

House Of Blues!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?

If that happenes I will purposefully shit myself. I'm about ready to now at the idea of it. That is a sure way of saying "hey move your business here." It's a magnet of entertainment and will by itself transform DT phoenix into an entertainment "tempe."

[HooverDam]

The area, for example, could include a comedy club and movie theater, Hallmark said. He added that he has shared his plans with Sundance Cinemas, a fledgling theater chain for independent films.


Those two things interests me the most. The Valley only has 2 Comedy Clubs (Improv in Tempe, and the Comedy Spot in Old Town Scottsdale) one is very big (Improv) and the other is tiny (Comedy Spot), a club in between those two in size would be very nice.

We only have 2 Independent movie theaters as well (Valley Art and Camelview) and the Valley Art is only a single screen! The Phoenix area is extremely under-served in this area. I'd really like to see a 'brew and view' style theater in the warehouse district that showed independent and classic films.

[PHX602]

Wow that is awesome! Thinking of the Jackson Street entertainment district and cityscape by the end of the decade makes me wet.:slob: :D

[soleri]

Of all the current ideas on the table, the entertainment district has the best prospects. There are a lot of moving parts here but what's great is that you don't have to build them all at once. The "market" doesn't have to be really hot, either. You can build some condos/lofts or office space when the scale is small and the demand is so-so. If there are any impediments here, I don't see them.

[DevdogAZ]

I think it would be great if they could create some sort of driving/parking area south of Jackson St. and north of the train tracks and then make Jackson St. into a pedestrian zone. The north/south streets could cross it, but the areas between the n/s streets, between the Ballpark and Cooperstown, would be off limits to cars.

I think the style of Jacksons on Third and Cooperstown are models for this new district. They've utilized existing spaces without tearing them down, and created both indoor and outdoor spaces. Hopefully those can stay in place and have other things spring up around them.

[HX_Guy]

I just read through 3 pages of comments on the Jackson St Ent. District and there is an overwhelming support from people for this. There are a few who think it's too late or that downtown is a slum, but 90% of people support this and want to see things take shape.

I hope the city and developers read articles and comments online.

[Sekkle]

I hope the city and developers read articles and comments online.

In this case, I agree. But most of the time when I see morons posting their comments on azcentral I feel like I'm going to explode in rage at their idiocy!

The entertainment district would be huge. I think it will be pretty easy for city decision makers to see how important this could be for downtown. Too bad it won't start opening until 2009. I'm impatient!

[HooverDam]

I just read through 3 pages of comments on the Jackson St Ent. District and there is an overwhelming support from people for this. There are a few who think it's too late or that downtown is a slum, but 90% of people support this and want to see things take shape.

I hope the city and developers read articles and comments online.

The people who post on AZCentral bitching about downtown give me a headache. The entertainment district is going to be built by private developers, so if you don't want any part of it- fine. If you hate downtown so much, why are you reading articles about it and crapping on other peoples excitement? People need to learn either just ignore downtown if its not their thing and enjoy living in Gilbert, or take pride in downtown and try to make it better.

EDIT: If anyone saw the actual paper version of the warehouse district story, they had some cool (but small) new renderings.

[kevininlb]

Hey, anyone have a copy of the rendering of Jackson Street Entertainment District that was in yesterday's Arizona Republic? It's a fantastic drawing, with the W in all it's hoped-for future glory. And JSED looks great. I've been searching all over the web for it, thinking I'd post it here, but I can't find it.

Geek alert: I cut out the AZ Republic rendering and taped it to my desk. I love looking at s**t like that!

[PHX31]

/\ Can you scan it or take a picture of it and post it if you can't find it online?????

[HX_Guy]

Hmm, I wonder if I can still find a copy of yesterday's paper anywhere, maybe the gas station?

[soleri]

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/3133/scan0001ou8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[nbrindley]

Wow, thats exciting looking! Fingers crossed it turns out better than Cityscape is looking (Arizona Center Redux)

[HooverDam]

That looks very nice, I'm glad to see they are going to wrap the parking garage in retail, and also put something along the south side of USAC (though there doesn't seem to be room)- I was a bit worried the whole Jackson St thing would feel a bit odd if everything was on the South side of the street only.

[loftlovr]

Thanks Soleri!
-it's about time!

[BA744PHX]

Now that looks nice. Hopefully it all gets done.

[PHX602]

I really like how this project will connect life along with cityscape to the Luhrs area. Is it just me or is the SACS like 400 feet tall in this rendering?

[JimInCal]

Thanks for the scan Soleri!

PHX602, The Summit does look huge here... due to it being the nearest thing in the rendering. I love the lofts and retail wrapping around the existing arena garage. I know they plan to narrow the streets to create developable (is that a word?) real estate and make it pedestrian-friendly. It's going to be exciting to see what happens with the project. This is a real opportuinity for some funky, creative reuse. Can't wait to see it unfold. :yes:

[soleri]

'Economics' working against downtown
Feb. 15, 2007 12:00 AM
by Jon Talton

Hearing of the latest downtown mega-project, Phoenicians can be excused for feeling like Charlie Brown when Lucy promises that this time she really will hold the football for him to kick it.

So many times before the football has been pulled away at the last minute, and we have landed on our duffs in frustration and disappointment. Will the Jackson Street entertainment district be any different?

I'm open-minded. The Jackson Street team includes a businessman with an interest in the area (Diamondbacks co-owner Dale Jensen) and a developer who is actually building something downtown (David Wallach of the Summit).
Yet they, along with the developers hoping to do CityScape, contend with the strange economics of downtown Phoenix. These dynamics have ensured that most of the projects announced with glitzy renderings and models went nowhere.

Unlike cities with successful downtowns, power in Phoenix is oddly distributed. We have few corporations expanding or relocating there. Similarly lacking are real estate players with the means and intentions to really build.

Rather than being in a helper role, City Hall has become a kind of master developer, a role city government is poorly positioned to play. Plans, studies and overlays never seem to change the blocks of empty, blighted land.

Yet behind the scenes, the city's actions have become a kind of real estate "derivative" with its own value. For example, a "player" might present a plan that requires a zoning change or special waiver on, say, height. Once approved, this change makes the land more valuable. Then the temptation to flip the land to the next "player" can become irresistible.

Yet at street level, the football has again been pulled away, and we're left upended amid the blocks of wasteland, dotted with signs promoting dead projects, in the heart of America's fifth-largest city.

Not all the deals are insincere. Among the barriers faced by developers are very high land prices (a consequence, in part, of previous City Councils zoning too many parcels for high-rise, and land bankers holding properties for unrealistically high prices). Developers are left to offer enormous condo towers with units way out of the reach of the average Phoenician.

Many of these projects can never sell beyond 30 percent of the available units, so financing fails, and flipping the land becomes the only way out.

Another strange problem is the local fetish for large, "master-planned" projects. LoDo in Denver and the Gaslamp District in San Diego are not the result of big, integrated projects. They were developed organically, a little at a time, by scores of developers and businesses.

That approach proved more doable compared with going to the capital markets for hundreds of millions in one gulp for a largely unproven downtown. And we lack an Ernest Hahn, the San Diego mall developer, who built Horton Plaza downtown, against all expert advice, because he loved his city.

We also seem to lack the ability at City Hall to do things government should, such as historic reuse. If Phoenix had been in charge in Denver, LoDo would be vacant lots.

The results so far have left downtown Phoenix competing for spec investment against Tempe and Scottsdale, and losing. I hope Jackson Street and CityScape can turn that around.

Does it matter? Yes. Competitive cities offer choices, suburban and quality urban. And the city of Phoenix risks a long eclipse if it can't fix its core.

I start to wonder what would happen if the city would simply say: No more deals. We'll fix historic reuse and code impediments to doing business downtown. No more teardowns. And higher taxes for empty land.

Other than that, let the market work on a thousand parcels of land.


Reach Talton at jon.talton@arizonarepublic.com. Read his blog at taltonblog.azcentral.com.

[Hysonk]

Talton makes me want to scream. Yes, he's insightful at times, but that same drumbeat over and over and over again. Does he (and perhaps others) not see that so much has changed as a result of many dozens of projects. Yes the mega-projects that are city inspired are there, but there are also small projects, what he calls "organic" sprouting everywhere. From the refurbishing of the old Hanny's building, to new restaurants, art galleries and the like, it seems as though Talton beats that same drum regardless of the changes. Maybe he's frustrated with the pace (I am at times too), but all this negative energy is really a downer. I feel better now.

[KingLouieLouie76]

I know I'm mainly a long-time regular lurker on here, however, I thought I would take it upon myself to begin the official Jackson Street Entertainment District thread since it appears to be gradually taking shape.

I contend this along w/Cityscape will be the two major catalysts to catapult downtown Phoenix into the upper-echelon among all major cities.

This would be the best manner in organizing all the developments as they happen documenting all the progress in what might be the most monumental of all the downtown Phoenix projects.

[Vicelord John]

seeing as how it isn't anywhere near breaking ground, this is probably not nessecary.

[gymratmanaz]

At least there is a place for news.......few and far between, but hopefully a slow trickle until it becomes reality. Nothing wrong with HOPE!

[PHX31]

It'll be good to have it all in one thread, rather than searching through the phoenix development thread. Speaking of searching, maybe someone can dredge up the old Jackson Street renderings.

And, I propose, from this day forward, the project and the future district be referred to as simply "Jackson Street" or "Jackson St". None of this "JSED", "Jackson Street Entertainment District", or anything else. Like I've mentioned before, it doesn't need a full on name, and it doesn't need an abbreviation, it should be like Beale St. or Burbon Street. Plus, in the future, when you go there to hang out or have fun or shop or maybe live, you won't say, "I'm going to the Jackson Street Entertainment District tonight," you'll simply say, "I'm headed to Jackson Street for some drinks."

[KingLouieLouie76]

It'll be good to have it all in one thread, rather than searching through the phoenix development thread.

That was my actual MO in creating this thread. I log onto this site on a regular basis yearning for updates regarding this project. Therefore, I thought it would be easier to have a designated thread. It seems that it's beginning to gain some momentum (albeit somewhat at a snail's pace) and I would not be shocked if something more concrete it announced w/in the immediate future.

Here's the renderings:
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/feature1.htm

http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jackson.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jackson01.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jacksonb02.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jackson02.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jacksonb03.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jackson03.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jackson04.jpg
http://www.contact-mag.com/issue6/images/jackson05.jpg

I know this was referenced in the other thread, however:
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2008/04/07/daily22.html

The Jackson Street Entertainment District proposed for downtown Phoenix may be a step closer to happening after the Phoenix City Council considers a related matter at its meeting Wednesday.

After more than a year of negotiations, the city staff has hammered out a lease-purchase agreement for the Jefferson Street parking garage located between Chase Field and U.S. Airways Arena on the south side of Jefferson Street. The agreement must then be signed with representatives of the Phoenix Suns and Arizona Diamondbacks, who need the 1,400 parking spaces on game days.

The ordinance scheduled for council action includes a provision that the professional sports teams, as part of the $20 million lease-purchase agreement, negotiate with the developers of the Jackson Street Entertainment District to allow construction of retail space and rental housing the southern exterior of the garage. That would be the first stage of creating the blockbuster entertainment-related neighborhood that would cover about 20 city blocks.

Dale Jensen, majority owner of the Arizona Diamondbacks and a minority owner of the Phoenix Suns, is one of the primary partners in the Jackson Street development, along with David Wallach, Brad Yonover and Michael Hallmark. Jensen has said that commencing the development by adding retail and residential components to the parking structure is crucial to the entire project. His insider status, however, didn't guarantee that other team owners were keen on the idea.

Though Jensen told the Phoenix Business Journal last fall that a deal to secure the parking garage on behalf of Jackson Street Entertainment District was imminent, it didn't happen.

Deputy City Manager David Cavazos said he has been negotiating with the teams toward a resolution on the garage. The city, meanwhile, needs the $20 million to reimburse another developer, RED Development Co., which is building the nearby CityScape project with additional public parking. Otherwise, the Jefferson Street Garage will be given to RED when its development is partially completed in 2009.

Cavazos said he is optimistic everything can be worked out, if the council approves the deal. He noted that Sun's majority owner Robert Sarver is talking with the Jackson Street folks.

"Robert Sarver met with David Wallach (Monday) to discuss the Jackson Street Entertainment District concepts," Cavazos said. "We walked Jackson Street as part of this meeting. We are hopeful that all of the parties will come together and negotiate in good faith during the next 60 days."

This link provides other Jackson Street related articles:
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/related_content.html?topic=Jackson%20Street%20Entertainment%20District

I just have a feeling again that some official announcement will be made w/in the near future and everything can be charted in a more organized manner.

[PHX NATIVE 929]

seeing as how it isn't anywhere near breaking ground, this is probably not nessecary.

Remedial spelling appears necessary though.

[KingLouieLouie76]

If I can recall, House of Blues and a Comedy club are to be among the potential venues w/in the district.

What other places would everyone on here want become reality?

I personally believe that the Rhythm Room should relocate to downtown and perhaps even a Mickey's Hangover should open up in that general vicinity.

I know Rhythm Room and House of Blues could be somewhat redundant, but House of Blues would cater to professional international/national main attractions, while Rhythm Room can still feature prominently local bands.

I know Dale Jensen is heavily into music and film, so it could be intriguing to see who else would be signed-on.

They must also take into account ASU downtown students (especially undergrads) by having some more coffee shops (which would have some poetry recitals and live bands), but that could be integrated with the retail spots surrounding the Nursing and Cronkite buildings.

A karaoke bar would add some allure. I just hope it doesn't become too touristy oriented though.

[gymratmanaz]

I thought I read that a possible second Rock and Roll Hall of Fame was going in.

[Don B.]

Why do I have this feeling Phoenix "ain't gonna get it," especially with the current economic climate?

dy72lpZWtzo

--don

[kevininlb]

Garage gives team owners big win
Suns, Diamondbacks partners to pay $20 million, beat out Jackson Street developers for key spot
Jahna Berry
The Arizona Republic
Apr. 9, 2008 12:00 AM

Ownership of a parking garage has become a battle between influential downtown Phoenix players, and, in the end, representatives of the Phoenix Suns and Arizona Diamondbacks are likely to get to control the game.

Today, the Phoenix City Council is expected to give the green light to an agreement with the Suns Legacy Properties LLC and AZPB Limited Partnership, representing Suns and Diamondbacks ownership, to take over the 1,400-space city garage because sports fans use it during home games, Deputy City Manager David Cavazos said.

The developers behind a planned downtown entertainment district, who also wanted the garage, are retooling their game plan. advertisement

"The major users of the garage are the Diamondbacks and the Suns," Cavazos said. "Any time you have a third party, it's more difficult to manage the garage according to what the custom and practice has been for many years for traffic control and pricing."

The Jefferson Street Garage is bound by Jackson, Jefferson, Third and Fourth streets.

It's walking distance from both Chase Field, home of the Diamondbacks, and US Airways Center, home of the Suns.

The deal, which calls for the city to sell the garage for a set price of $20 million, will satisfy the teams and will help the proposed district, Cavazos said.

Suns managing partner Robert Sarver couldn't be reached for comment.

The city has asked Sarver to negotiate with the Jackson Street Entertainment District developers, who want to build shops, apartments or condos on the south side of the garage, Cavazos said.

The request, however, is no guarantee that the talks will work out, Cavazos said. That could be a problem for the district.

The project would line both sides of Jackson Street between Central Avenue and Fourth Street with nightclubs, restaurants, shops and music venues, supporters say.

"It was never a requirement for the district for us to own the garage," said one of the Jackson Street developers, David Wallach.

But a key part of the plan includes "wrapping" the south side of the garage with shops and multifamily housing, he said.

"It is easier to develop things you have total control over," he said.

The Jackson Street development team is also studded with heavy hitters. It includes Wallach, who developed the Summit at Copper Square, Diamondbacks majority owner Dale Jensen, entertainment executive Brad Yonover and Michael Hallmark, who designed US Airways Center.

Although the City Council is expected to vote today, the deal is being finalized, Cavazos said.

The final agreement also will ask Sarver to develop the historic Sun Mercantile Building and a hotel in the area so that it's consistent with the Jackson Street developers' plans, Cavazos said.

Last year, Sarver had to scuttle plans to build a $200 million W Hotel on land between US Airways Center and the garage.

The city is selling the garage to fulfill an agreement with CityScape developers.

Under the CityScape pact, Phoenix agreed to use the proceeds of the $20 million sale to help fund the $900 million complex of offices, hotels, shops and restaurants.

The project will cover three blocks between First Avenue, Second, Washington and Jefferson streets.

[vwwolfe]

If I can recall, House of Blues and a Comedy club are to be among the potential venues w/in the district.

What other places would everyone on here want become reality?

I personally believe that the Rhythm Room should relocate to downtown and perhaps even a Mickey's Hangover should open up in that general vicinity.

I know Rhythm Room and House of Blues could be somewhat redundant, but House of Blues would cater to professional international/national main attractions, while Rhythm Room can still feature prominently local bands.

I know Dale Jensen is heavily into music and film, so it could be intriguing to see who else would be signed-on.

They must also take into account ASU downtown students (especially undergrads) by having some more coffee shops (which would have some poetry recitals and live bands), but that could be integrated with the retail spots surrounding the Nursing and Cronkite buildings.

A karaoke bar would add some allure. I just hope it doesn't become too touristy oriented though.

I think an Alamo Draft House would make a great addition to Jackson Street.

[KingLouieLouie76]

I thought I read that a possible second Rock and Roll Hall of Fame was going in.

Yeah, I had recalled this and came across an article announcing it:
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2004/05/10/daily16.html

Whatever happened to it? That would be an obvious major boon.

I still like suggestions that I made in another thread awhile back (some I reiterated in my previous post):

House of Blues was mentioned back last April to be included in the JSED, so that is very promising indeed that is has been confirmed.

I also read about a comedy club being included, which is much needed in downtown. Would attract some of the elite comedians (and should boast some open mic night as well). I would then build several themed venues, perhaps a western type bar, a blues bar (I would consider relocating the Rythym Room to downtown, but some might consider the blasphemy). Maybe then a Creole restaurant/bar that you would typically find w/in the French Quarter. I've always thought those places would attract not only tourist, but local residents who happened to transplant (such as myself) to provide some sort of a "taste of their own home" along w/the flavor of Phoenix. I know this might all seem drasctic, but could be feasible.

Also, perhaps a small casino should open-up in the outlying areas of downtown, but that would generate a lot of controversy.

The need for more 24-hour restaurants (perhaps Mickey's Hangover opens up a downtown Phoenix spot to attract ASU students)... Some more cafes (especially coffee shops that would have recitals).

I know Dale Jensen loves music/film, so I wouldn't be shocked if several music related places open up...especially to anchor in some local talent... It will be all intriguining on how all materializes... Obviously the 2 BIG catalyst (in terms of developments) is JSED and Cityscape and both must become reality or else.....


Something like a Southwestern version of Branson, MO.

[PHX31]

Garage gives team owners big win
Suns, Diamondbacks partners to pay $20 million, beat out Jackson Street developers for key spot



Some how I'm not following this article. It seems to contradict itself. The Jackson Street developers are a part of the Arizona Diamondbacks and they were trying to persuade Robert Sarver to buy the garage (at least that was my understanding). So, this is exactly what Dale Jensen and the Jackson Street development wanted to happen. Otherwise, if the D-backs and Suns didn't buy it, I thought the city was going to give it to RED. I don't think this is a bump in the road, I think it is laying the pavement for Jackson Street. Or am I wrong?

[gymratmanaz]

A theater for plays and also a classy movie house would rock, maybe the kind that serves liquor and dinner.

[Classical in Phoenix]

A theater for plays and also a classy movie house would rock, maybe the kind that serves liquor and dinner.

I heard at one time that an IFC Film House was being considered. I think a theater that shows films different than the main stream (i.e. one showing Independent and Foreign films) would be a great addition.

Casinos are only allowed on reservations, and there is no reservation close to DT.

[Phxbyrd211]

I think it would be a good idea to open a high-end pool hall in the new developement. Although mostly unnoticed, pool is a popular pastime in Phoenix and since the days of The Color of Money there's been a dearth of class joints to play. They are also a colorful night-owl type crowd that could really benifit the growing downtown scene.

[PHX31]

/\ There already was a high-end pool hall downtown that didn't work out, the "lucky break" (name?) was in the Collier's Center where Stoudemire's is right now. Maybe because it was in the awful Collier's Center it closed down (that and downtown was dead on non-sports nights).

[loftlovr]

Some how I'm not following this article. It seems to contradict itself. The Jackson Street developers are a part of the Arizona Diamondbacks and they were trying to persuade Robert Sarver to buy the garage (at least that was my understanding). So, this is exactly what Dale Jensen and the Jackson Street development wanted to happen. Otherwise, if the D-backs and Suns didn't buy it, I thought the city was going to give it to RED. I don't think this is a bump in the road, I think it is laying the pavement for Jackson Street. Or am I wrong?


I am not totally clear on this myself... Is Sarver not buddies with Jensen?
Also- would it not benefit the garage to have retail and condos wrapped around the sides? Sure it may eat up some parking spaces, but wouldn't it raise the demand for parking?

[KingLouieLouie76]

/\ There already was a high-end pool hall downtown that didn't work out, the "lucky break" (name?) was in the Collier's Center where Stoudemire's is right now. Maybe because it was in the awful Collier's Center it closed down (that and downtown was dead on non-sports nights).

I would love the concept of something like this place I frequented in my native Detroit before I relocated out here:
http://www.fifthavenuebilliards.com/RoyalOak_v2/roEvents.htm

In terms of Jensen and Sarver....One person might make a difference in how their rapport is. That is Jerry Colangelo.

If I recall, Jensen was part of the group who ousted Colangelo out as CEO/owner of the Dbacks and reportedly Sarver and Colangelo are rather close.

I wonder how much Colangelo might be involved with this project, which hasn't been clarified. Doesn't he own some of the surrounding land?

[PhxPavilion]

Why do I have this feeling Phoenix "ain't gonna get it," especially with the current economic climate?

dy72lpZWtzo

--don

:haha:

Sadly, I agree.

[JimInCal]

Here is brief interview with David Wallach from the April/May Issue of Kontakt Magazine. It focuses on Jackson Street for the most part. I had never seen the model from this perspective. Notice the two mid-rise (15'ish-story) buildings south of Chase Field and east of 7th Street. I like how the development would stretch the boundaries of the DT core to the south and east. I agree with Wallach's viewpoint on providing variety of affordability levels in housing.

http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/2f508fa787.jpg (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/)

Forward Thinker: David Wallach
Whether described as on the cutting edge, ahead of their time or simply visionaries, our everevolving Valley hosts a few brave souls who are casting the mold that will shape the future of our burgeoning megalopolis.
Meet David Wallach, the “W” behind W Developments. Wallach, a developer from Chicago, took a chance on Phoenix and developed downtown’s first residential high-rise, The Summit at Copper Square. As The Summit’s occupancy is nearing complete, he is moving onto his second endeavor, Omega, a residential tower on the corner of 2nd Ave and Monroe. To top off
his downtown involvement, Wallach is also one of the fathers of the quietly emerging Jackson Street Entertainment District.

You are originally from Chicago. Tell me a little bit about your career there and what inspired you to move to Phoenix? After graduating law school I worked for a developer in Chicago and was fortunate to meet great people over the years, so I got exposed to a lot of wonderful developers
and bankers and lawyers in Chicago. I kind of came to Phoenix by mistake. I was coming out here to meet with a friend of mine, who was building some homes in Paradise Valley, and he invited me to come look at some properties with him. Right before I came out here for that trip, I was introduced to nother man whose building I was interested in buying. I mentioned that I was coming to Phoenix, and he said there was a downtown lot that he thought I would be interested in. And that is where The Summit at Copper Square is now.

Phoenix may be a little later in the game than other cities, but now there’s that urban focus, and it’s one of the reasons that The Summit has been so successful. How will the Jackson Street Entertainment District (JSED) change the face of the city? The one thing that is still lacking in Phoenix is the element of urbanism. Where do you go to sit in a café and have a cup of coffee or a glass of wine and exchange ideas? Where do you go to meet people? We have these huge mega-malls. This isn’t anything against them, but they are not places where people gather to talk and walk down the street and experience things. The JSED will be a place where people can go and meet, sit and congregate, listen to music…and live! One of my favorite laces in the valley is La Grande Orange. People drive and valet park their
cars to feel like they are in an urban environment. That’s what is lacking in downtown, and that’s what the JSED will provide.

What are the stages of development in starting a project such as this? How do you get it from its initial vision to becoming a living and breathing entity?The great thing about what brought this together is the collection of people with varying backgrounds. We are made up of architects and business owners and land developers. It’s kind of that collection of people that bring
this type of project forward. We got the business owners in the area onboard. Some of them are partners in the deal, and others are cheerleaders
for it. And that’s what is needed to bring something like this forward as smoothly as it has been.

This is a model for green planning. What are some examples?The buildings are all going to be designed with as many green aspects as possible. Going green is a very important part of what we are doing, and that is where
we are focusing our energy. The people and companies we are attracting, are those that are focusing on being green. Those are the people that we want in the district. We’ve got the most sunshine anywhere in the world, and
the amount of solar energy we use here is ridiculously low. Things like that are what we need to start looking at very seriously.

Tell me a little bit about the housing that will be here
among the entertainment and retail venues. The housing will combine both high-end and attainable pricing. What makes cities work is a quilt of people. So you can’t just have $500,000 condos. That doesn’t work.
You also need teachers, you need firemen, policemen, young people getting their first place. And creating that environment is definitely part of our goals.
How do you see the light rail changing the city? The change won’t be overnight, but as time goes on, people will start using it and find it much more efficient than using their cars. With the focus on expanding ASU,
and just the influx of teachers and students and visitors to freely move between downtown and Tempe is fantastic. To be able to get from the core out to north Central Avenue like that (snaps fingers), will have a substantial
impact on local businesses. What is your vision of Phoenix 10 years from now?
Personally, I think that the city will continue to grow near the core, just like in other cities. I think we will see lowrise and mid-rise residential and real neighborhoods that are going to start being created. I think that’s what’s really exciting. People might still have to drive or take the light rail, but you are going to have more people connected. That is what makes a great city, that connection.
[Julie Lemerond, additional text by Brandy Howard; photos
by Don Crossland]

[HooverDam]

:tup: Cool stuff, I really hope it happens.

I haven't seen that angle as well. It would be interesting to know exactly how tall those mid-rises are supposed to be, because the Summit looks way out of scale there. In that model it appears to soar way above Chase Field, in reality its only slightly taller.

I hope he's right about more mid-rise development in Phoenix. The Valley has almost zero 3-10 story urban style developments (everything in this height range is fenced off, stucco and tile, bland suburban apartment complexes) and I think if built, they'll go a long way to creating better neighborhoods and a more sustainable pattern of growth.

[Tfom]

What is the thing between US Airways and chase supposed to be? It looks like a blender.

[HX_Guy]

It was supposed to be the W Hotel.

[Buckeye Native 001]

I hope he's right about more mid-rise development in Phoenix. The Valley has almost zero 3-10 story urban style developments (everything in this height range is fenced off, stucco and tile, bland suburban apartment complexes) and I think if built, they'll go a long way to creating better neighborhoods and a more sustainable pattern of growth.

Agreed. I'd rather have a dense urban environment in Downtown Phoenix than a bunch of highrises scattered about haphazardly with nothing to connect them (Midtown, anyone?). Fuck the skyline, make Downtown a place people want to be.

For reference, Washington DC's done a wonderful job in creating an urban oasis despite its height limit. You rarely see anything over four stories, but there's a hell of a lot of stuff to do.

[Vicelord John]

it would be nice if they built this thing. I don't really care what it consists of as long as I get something to do.

[kevininlb]

is the image gone or am I just not seeing it?

[gymratmanaz]

I never saw it. I would like to though.....thought it was just me.

[Vicelord John]

it's still there, assholes. Try waiting for your page to fully load.

[admdavid]

Well, my page loads completely and I don't see anything. :P

[Vicelord John]

my page loads completely, or at least appears to, and then 30 seconds later the picture shows up.

[admdavid]

I had to switch to IE to see the pic. Firefox wasn't loading it for whatever reason.

[AZ KID]

Does anyone know the outcome of that important city council meeting that took place on april 16th

[vwwolfe]

Since Jackson Street has it's own thread now, I thought I'd post some of the renderings and models, although I don't see this project happening anytime soon.

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt3.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt5.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/jsed_azcentral.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt7.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt6.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt4.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt2.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt1.jpg

[PhxPavilion]

Too bad. This is exactly what downtown needs to draw people from the burbs, unique retail and entertainment.

Maybe one day.

[KingLouieLouie76]

Too bad. This is exactly what downtown needs to draw people from the burbs, unique retail and entertainment.

Maybe one day.

Did I miss something?

[gymratmanaz]

I know, did someone say JSED is dead or something?

[PHXguyinOKC]

i hope not, this will be huge for DT

[KingLouieLouie76]

Well, I know this obviously was posted in the main Phoenix development thread, but it's best to revive this thread with the excellent find lurker Matthew provided loftlovr: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showpost.php?p=3748655&postcount=7027

http://phoenix.gov/PLANNING/Z-78-08n.pdf

Lord, I cannot contain my enthusiasm. Let's hope this all comes to fruition!

[PhxPavilion]

It probably will, eventually; just depends on the economy.

Looking at that pdf, the redesign is terrible. It extends too far south into a largely undeveloped area and creates a seperation from downtown. Not good.

[admdavid]

It probably will, eventually; just depends on the economy.

Looking at that pdf, the redesign is terrible. It extends too far south into a largely undeveloped area and creates a seperation from downtown. Not good.

Agreed...mostly.

I like some of the elements of the redesign, but it should continue west toward Central along Jackson St and it must engage the north side of Jackson as well as the stuff that was going on around USAC and the parking garage. Without that, it will create a dead zone between it and the rest of downtown (Cityscape, etc.).

[loftlovr]

I was gonna post these last night but photobucket was jacked up.

Some highlights of the narrative:

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed1.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed2.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed3.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed4.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed5.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed6.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed7.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed8.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed9.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e7/joelcontreras/Pics21/jsed10.jpg

Sure the redesign could raise some questions but I for one would just be excited to have Jackson street "pimped out" and with an Art House cinema and maybe a House of Blue's, a hotel and some more little street-side bars and cafe's.... I know this project would probably take a decade to come to fruition, but I am excited about the small stuff. Jackson street has so much potential. It would be so fun to leave the Dbacks games and walk Jackson, bar hopping... I would prefer for the hotel to be an upscale, trendy, modern hotel personally.

[Don B.]

^ Looks pretty nifty to me. :)

--don

[PHXguyinOKC]

i liked the original idea of wrapping the garage and arena... i just doesn't feel right extending south. i should engage more of downtown.

[glynnjamin]

As much as is it disappointing to see the project move further south, I don't think we can reasonably expect them to go anywhere else. I mean, they have filled in most of the space along Jackson between Central and Chase Field. That is pretty decent redevelopment. Even if they only added the projects along Jackson we would see a significant revival in downtown nightlife. The projects that extend into the warehouse area are just a logical extension of that. There really isn't much land north of Jackson that is available in the area. With the exception of the parking lot to the west of USAC, there isn't much for them to build on. There is cheap land toward the south and all of it is close to both the lightrail and the stadiums.

I would wager that the projects like the HoB and Cinema will go in well before the hotels and other retail space to the south of Jackson.

[PhxPavilion]

As much as is it disappointing to see the project move further south, I don't think we can reasonably expect them to go anywhere else.

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt3.jpg

Why can't they do this again? I would expect them to move south after having completed the above first, thus connecting with downtown and expanding from there.

[nbrindley]

eh, I think it's fine if they develop towards the south rather than north. It will makes those blocks in between even more tempting for development.

[CANUC]

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc262/thomtastic/JacksonSt3.jpg

Why can't they do this again? I would expect them to move south after having completed the above first, thus connecting with downtown and expanding from there.

My guess is that there are a couple of reasons, first if you look at the original concept it relies heavily on two parking garages to provide space for retail and the like. The one at 4th St and Jackson and the one attached to USAWC along with the lot just west of USAWC, now when you take into consideration that the W Hotel is no longer a go and neither is the 12 story building atop the Sun Merc the retail around the 4th and Jackson garage would seem very disjointed. Also, I don’t remember the details but I recall that there where some rumblings about how enthusiastic Steve Kerr was in getting involved with this development so at this point the garage along USAWC may have been put in doubt.

Now if you look at the new renderings and compare them to the original idea you can see that the focus still remains on 2nd St and Jackson and extends outward. So with that in mind following the path of least resistance from this point it would seem logical to look for cheaper more available land which takes you south and to keep it closer to foot traffic i.e. USWAC and Chase Field it would also take you east. Many of the surface parking lots available to both venues are in this area and during events there is a tremendous amount of foot traffic in this area, even more than north of Jefferson. So it just seems logical to go this route and in fact engaging what is left in the warehouse district would great idea. If you remember one of the first attempts at true lofts were the Stadium Lofts on 2nd St and Buchanan and lets not forget the first true high rise condo in downtown (Summit) also happened in the warehouse district.

[combusean]

You can't propose a rezoning of properties you don't own. If the City hasn't signed off on all the workings of the deal, then that's why the garages, etc aren't included here. I'm sure after this is rezoned a separate development agreement will end up between the City and the JSED partners that will end up with tax rebates, etc as well as disposition of the garages.

By then, the residential financing might exist for those wraps because the plan looks to be significantly missing the residential component. A financing issue in and of itself might also be why residential is missing from this plan.

[NIXPHX77]

i'm not really liking what i see overall. kinda disappointed, but hopeful.
maybe they should rename it the "Southside of Jackson St Ent. Dist."
(and farther south.)

[admdavid]

I agree with combusean. I think once the residential market improves and things stabilize, we'll see Sarver and Co. jump into the mix (resurrect the W?) and fill out those areas around USAC and the parking garages. And once things start to happen on the Luhrs block, we'll see a really nice transformation of that area.

I do like the new proposal...the mid-height towers and such really would look nice in that area and can only help integrate the Warehouse district into the overall urbanization of DT.

[Gump]

I agree with combusean. I think once the residential market improves and things stabilize, we'll see Sarver and Co. jump into the mix (resurrect the W?) and fill out those areas around USAC and the parking garages. And once things start to happen on the Luhrs block, we'll see a really nice transformation of that area.

I do like the new proposal...the mid-height towers and such really would look nice in that area and can only help integrate the Warehouse district into the overall urbanization of DT.

I am not sure that Sarver desires to "jump in the mix" - ever. The JSED group is doing the best they can after the City sold the Garage to Sarver without requiring housing wrapped around it, as was suggested from the District's inception. Missed opportunity, probably not coming back...oh well.

[KingLouieLouie76]

Just again trying to keep everything organized under this designated thread:

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showpost.php?p=3786264&postcount=7170


JSED Neighborhood Meeting Tonight

I apologize for this being a last minute notice but somehow I missed the original email from our association. I plan on going upstairs to check things out. If anyone else is interested come on down. The meeting is here at the Summit in the meeting room on the 23rd floor from 6 - 8 pm. Here is an excerpt from that email:

"NEIGHBORHOOD MEETING NOTICE

August 25, 2008

Dear Property Owner, Resident, or Neighborhood Association President:

The purpose of this letter is to inform you that Lazarus and Associates, on behalf of Jackson Street Entertainment District LLC, has recently filed rezoning request Z-07-78-08 and Minor General Plan Amendment GPA-CC-1-08-8, for a 12 acre irregular shaped site located at the southwest corner of 4th Street and Jackson Street (see attached aerial map).

The request would change the zoning from Warehouse Overlay, Downtown Core, A-1 with two (2) Historic Preservation properties to Planned Unit Development (PUD) with two (2) Historic Preservation properties. The requested Minor General Plan Amendment would change the designation from Industrial to Mixed-Use.

We would like to invite you to a neighborhood meeting to discuss these cases and the proposed development. The meeting will be held on Monday, September 8th, 2008 at 6pm at The Summit, 310 South 4th Street, Club 252 on the 23rd floor.

Attached is a copy of the cover page of our application along with conceptual site plans and elevations. A copy of our entire PUD Development Narrative, containing the complete details of this request, is on file with the City of Phoenix Planning Department and available on-line at http://phoenix.gov/PLANNING/pudcases.html. The following describes our requests:

Proposed change: The overall goal of these requested changes is to allow for the development of vibrant, mixed-use, live/work/play district complete with boutique hotels, a variety of residential options, and an assortment of entertainment options including restaurants, lounges, cafes, an arthouse cinema, and a live music venue. The PUD application calls for a minimum of 235 residential units, although full build-out will likely, (and hopefully), result in a much more robust number of 500-700 units. Taller buildings are used intermittently across the 12 acre site, with specific height limits on specific properties as shown in exhibits. No defined density or lot coverage standards currently exist on the properties nor does the application propose limits.

Existing Use: The majority of the uses on the site today consist of surface parking lots, dilapidated and/or vacant structures, or significantly underutilized sites. There is one functioning retail use (Jackson’s on 3rd) and one much needed residential use (The Summit). A couple of functioning storage and wholesaling operations also exist. The two (2) existing historic properties in the application will be renovated and adapted with new uses, while plans call for a third property, which is not designated historic, to also be renovated, dedicated, and adapted with new uses.

Please be advised that meetings and hearings before the Central City Village Planning Committee and the Planning Commission are planned to review this case as well. Specific meeting and hearing dates have not yet been set. You should receive a subsequent mailing identifying the date and location of the meetings/hearings when they have been scheduled.

Please contact me or George Pasquel III at my office to learn more about the case and express your concerns. The City of Phoenix Village Planner assigned to this case is Susan R. Sargent. This planner can answer your questions regarding the City review and hearing processes as well as the staff position once their report is complete. You may contact Susan at 602.262.4065 or Susan.Sargent@Phoenix.gov. You may also make your feelings known by writing to the City of Phoenix Planning Department, 200 West Washington Street, Phoenix, Arizona 85003 and referencing the case number. Your letter will be made part of the case file.

Again, I would be happy to answer any questions or hear any concerns that you may have regarding this proposal.

Very truly yours,



Larry S. Lazarus
LAZARUS & ASSOCIATES, P.C.

Attachments:Aerial Map
Application Cover Page
Elevations
Site Plan

[Summit_Living]

Thanks KingLouie. I was just about ready to adding my post to this thread.

[ljbuild]

My guess is that there are a couple of reasons, first if you look at the original concept it relies heavily on two parking garages to provide space for retail and the like. The one at 4th St and Jackson and the one attached to USAWC along with the lot just west of USAWC, now when you take into consideration that the W Hotel is no longer a go and neither is the 12 story building atop the Sun Merc the retail around the 4th and Jackson garage would seem very disjointed. Also, I don’t remember the details but I recall that there where some rumblings about how enthusiastic Steve Kerr was in getting involved with this development so at this point the garage along USAWC may have been put in doubt.

Now if you look at the new renderings and compare them to the original idea you can see that the focus still remains on 2nd St and Jackson and extends outward. So with that in mind following the path of least resistance from this point it would seem logical to look for cheaper more available land which takes you south and to keep it closer to foot traffic i.e. USWAC and Chase Field it would also take you east. Many of the surface parking lots available to both venues are in this area and during events there is a tremendous amount of foot traffic in this area, even more than north of Jefferson. So it just seems logical to go this route and in fact engaging what is left in the warehouse district would great idea. If you remember one of the first attempts at true lofts were the Stadium Lofts on 2nd St and Buchanan and lets not forget the first true high rise condo in downtown (Summit) also happened in the warehouse district.

Concerning the inconsistent progress (if any at all) of Jackson street,

The first " RED FLAG/s" that looms is/are:

those seriously outdated or (re-modified) highrises of downtown.

First of all, those CITYSCAPE highrise renderings are painted as 40 story

towers & now they have shrunk to 34 & 26 story towers respectively.

The "W" is now dead but it is mysteriously still in the rendering. :koko: :koko:

& the summit in that photo resembles a 30 story or 300 + foot tower, but

instead its a dinky little cracker-jack box that is dwarfed by chase field.

(DONT GET ME WRONG ! Im not saying the rendering is your fault, I just brought it up to make a point about Jackson street.)
I said all that to say this:

it wouldnt surprise me if something "goes screwy" with

the project.:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

but on the other hand hopefully I """will be surprised"""

[PHX NATIVE 929]

""Thanks for chiming in""

[jvbahn]

:previous: Vandercook once mentioned that he had ljbuild on some sort of "block" or "ignore" status. Can anyone tip me off as to how to do the same, I get super irritated every time he adds his two absurdly annoying multi-font cents.

[PhxPavilion]

Then don't read it?

[JimInCal]

:previous: Vandercook once mentioned that he had ljbuild on some sort of "block" or "ignore" status. Can anyone tip me off as to how to do the same, I get super irritated every time he adds his two absurdly annoying multi-font cents.

I'll help you out: Right click on the underlined name you want to block. Select OPEN. You can do this from any post of said forumer. This will go to their user profile. Under the name to the right you will see in white text that states something like "Add so & so to your ignore list". Click on that and a pop-up window will come up where you can control your ignore list.

[gymratmanaz]

Just thought I would post.... ANY NEWS ON THIS? .... I know times are hard. Was just hoping there might be life here!?!?!?!!!

[glynnjamin]

As far as I know...money has dried up...and JSED is in a holding pattern. Renderings are pretty pointless at this moment. By 2010, the market will start seeing some investors looking to take advantage of cheap land and low interest rates and may actually throw some money this way. It is a shame because all of this land on Jackson was bought by people who are just going to hang on to it. There are many private developers that would have bought one of these warehouses and converted it if not for Sarver and the speculators buying up all of the land south of Jefferson.

My gripe with the city (and state of Arizona) of Phoenix and their relationship with developers has always been that they just let the developer do whatever they want. We still have no construction on the Aloft Hotel after the city "required" them to have started in October. The city doesn't force the development of dirt lots. They don't force anyone to actually do what they say they are going to do. I have emailed Gordon multiple times about this issue. I've encouraged him to tax developers who own dirt lots in the downtown area for not using their land. I've encouraged him to tax Sarver and the rest of the JSED people if they are not going to open their warehouses up for art/retail space. I myself would gladly occupy one of those warehouses with multiple businesses if they were available for cheap rent. It seems to me that, when faced with a 30% land value tax increase vs renting your space for $1-$5 sqft to artists and businesses (even if it is only till the market turns), you would gladly take the rent over the tax.

There is a way to turn this thing around but it needs to come from the government, not the market...Thomas Friedman be damned.

[Classical in Phoenix]

"My gripe with the city (and state of Arizona) of Phoenix and their relationship with developers has always been that they just let the developer do whatever they want. We still have no construction on the Aloft Hotel after the city "required" them to have started in October. The city doesn't force the development of dirt lots. They don't force anyone to actually do what they say they are going to do. I have emailed Gordon multiple times about this issue. I've encouraged him to tax developers who own dirt lots in the downtown area for not using their land. I've encouraged him to tax Sarver and the rest of the JSED people if they are not going to open their warehouses up for art/retail space. I myself would gladly occupy one of those warehouses with multiple businesses if they were available for cheap rent. It seems to me that, when faced with a 30% land value tax increase vs renting your space for $1-$5 sqft to artists and businesses (even if it is only till the market turns), you would gladly take the rent over the tax."

While I am in agreement that undeveloped lots are counterproductive to a vibrant downtown, I do not feel that penalizing the owners of these properties is the answer. Someone may purchase a property with the full intention of developing something, and then, before they are able to get plans and pull permits, get caught in a market similar to the one we are in today. Currently the credit market is VERY tight, getting development money is almost impossible. The owner would be penalized for something that has negatively affected him and is totally out of his control.

[glynnjamin]

^ So that means he should be able to hang on to it and do nothing? Sorry no. This is not an issue of property owners' rights when we are talking about downtown Phoenix. Owners who buy land with the plans to build something but with no real money are called "speculators"...not developers. Sound projects will be built. Poor projects will not. That is the wonderful thing about the market...especially during a recession...it weeds all of the bad "Chateaux on Central"-type projects out.

You miss the point of my legislative idea. If you want to avoid the tax, rent/lease your space out. Something is better than nothing. A developer who owns an empty parcel of land could promote a community garden or drop a temporary structure onto the space and house offices or retail. Making your corner into something positive will have positive effects on 1)your ability to get financing and 2)your ability to flip the project when the market returns.

Case in point, Jackson Street is empty and vacant on non-game nights despite a few bright spots. No one knows that there is anything down there because there really isn't. Go and rent those spaces out for cheap and you'll see more artists, boutiques, and restaurants open up and create a nightlife down there. Then, the banks see Jackson St as a better investment because they know it can support business. This benefits the owner of the space both financially (through the avoidance of a tax and the revenue from rent) and in the long term investment sense.

The idea is to force people to open up. We need more community. The market bubble pushed a lot of the positive development out and away from downtown because prices inflated so quickly. The warehouse district could have been something by itself if JSED hadn't bought it all up and driven up the price of the places that they did not. People need to be forced to think creatively in times like these. Otherwise, nothing gets done and we wait until 2010 or later.

[Classical in Phoenix]

I respect your opinion and you bring up an interesting concept when you mention doing something as simple as a garden of some type on a vacant parcel. As long as you limit it to something as simple as that to avoid taxation, your idea may work.

What I think may be problematic is if you forced everyone to develop their properties at one time or be penalized. What would happen if every vacant property downtown were developed at once? Opportunities for new development, or redevelopment, will become more costly and difficult. Great downtowns develop over time. Because there were large portions of downtown un or underdeveloped, ASU was able to build a campus, U of A was able to bring a med school, the civic center was able to expand and the Sheraton was built. Going a little further back, Chase Field was able to be built. Now with these projects, hopefully there will be a snowball effect and more projects will come on line.

I want a vibrant downtown as much as anybody (REALLY...REALLY...REALLY!). I just don't want to see something that will force the market instead of letting it mature on its own.

[HX_Guy]

We still have no construction on the Aloft Hotel after the city "required" them to have started in October.

Actually the time to start construction has not expired. I really don't think they can break the agreement unless a formal amendment to the original agreement is filed.

For this particular project, the developer has until 12/20/2008 to complete construction drawings, satisfy all requirements for issuance of building permits, provide evidence of financing commitments, provide an executed franchise agreement with Starwood Hotels.

Once they had all of that done, either on or before 12/20/08...they then have 90 days to start construction. If we don't see dirt moving by 03/2009 then we should be worried.

[gymratmanaz]

Can we at least get the art movie house?!?!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[glynnjamin]

I stand corrected on the Aloft project. It was my understanding that October was their deadline.

As far as rising cost of development by developing everything at the same time...your examples prove my point, not yours. Taylor Place was dropped in on lots that used to be developed. Chase Field as well. The Cronkite School was a parking lot, ya, but I've seen them tear down far more than build on already vacant lots. Take the Jewel Box, for example, they tore it down to replace the parking lot that Cronkite took over. Even grass would present an improvement over the current dirt lots. The installation of a sprinkler system and some seed would be a small amount of money compared to the proposed tax and would go a long way to improving downtown AND the heat island.

As far as the art movie house thing goes...it shows my point. I've got three people with multiple reel-to-reel projectors who want to drop an art house theater into downtown but cannot afford access to a warehouse. Some couches, bean bags, risers, speakers, and a little carpentry would provide downtown with the makings of a movie theater. After some profits are made, you get a liquor license and turn the place out. Everyone wins.

[Classical in Phoenix]

Okay, I'm on your side now.:cheers:

[HooverDam]

t. I've got three people with multiple reel-to-reel projectors

You know 3 people w/ 35MM commercial reel to reel projectors- wtf? What the heck do they do with them?

[gymratmanaz]

Each of them also has thirty-three kitty cats..... :) (kidding)

[glynnjamin]

You know 3 people w/ 35MM commercial reel to reel projectors- wtf? What the heck do they do with them?

They bought them when a theater closed in Seattle. They rent one of them out and just keep the others around incase something breaks. They bought them to start a theater here but cannot afford warehouse space and redevelopment.

But ya, i know...weird.

[KingLouieLouie76]

I'm bored at the moment, so I decided to google to see if I could come across anything new regarding Jackson Street Entertainment District.

Sure enough I found a new site devoted to this project:
http://www.jacksonstreetphx.com/


I apologize if it has been posted before, but intrigues me.... Especially since we're to believe with the current market conditions that this project is doomed, however, with this new site it leads me to believe that it might be gaining some momentum....

[NIXPHX77]

good find! thanks.
but i think the area planned and shown under "location" is the old one.
didn't the revised planning area send the project to the south,
and not include the Jefferson St parking garage between the ballpark and arena?

[NIXPHX77]

Forwarding...
The Downtown Voices Coalition would like to hear your thoughts and ideas about an application filed for new development in the Jackson Street/Warehouse District area.
Please read the summary (below) and send your thoughts, comments and questions to Steve Weiss, the DVC chair, at steve@nofestivalrequired.com. If possible, send him your thoughts before our next meeting, on Saturday, May 9.

And here's how to read more about the application itself:

On the Downtown Voices Coalition website, right hand column under "Where can I find," there's a link to PUD information & cases:
http://phoenix.gov/planning/pudcases.html
The PUD in question is Z-78-08 (the third one down).
Thanks,
Tim Eigo

Secretary

www.downtownvoices.org
Phone: 602.340.7310
fax: 602.416.7510
cell: 602.908.6991

Downtown Voices Coalition is a coalition of stakeholder organizations that embrace growth in downtown Phoenix, but is mindful that healthy growth should be based upon existing downtown resources -- the vibrancy of neighborhoods, the strength of the arts community, the uniqueness of historic properties, and the wonderful small businesses that dot downtown. All of these assets should be stepping stones to be built upon, rather than shattered in the wake of downtown development.

__________________________________________________________________________________

Jackson Street Entertainment District PUD
*
It was decided at our April meeting to pull together a list of recommendations to present to the developers of the proposed Jackson Street Entertainment District, city officials, and affiliated interest groups. Because the developers have refined their plan, submitted their Planned Urban Development (PUD) proposal to the City, and begun their community outreach, this is the appropriate time to add our collective voice to the discussion.

The suggestion was made to organize our list of recommendations around DVC's ten priority issues. Doing so ensures we "cover all the bases" on all the things we've espoused since our formation in 2004. So please review our ten priority issues below, create a reply e-mail or Word document, and type under each or any heading what you would like to see added to, modified, or deleted from the project. If there are other recommendations you would like included that don't fall under these priority issues, feel free to add them at the bottom. I'll then collect all of your responses, organize them, and present them for group review and approval.

As background material for you:

* More detail about DVC's priority issues:
http://downtownvoices.org/priority-issues/
* Jackson Street Entertainment District PUD application (Z-78-08):
http://phoenix.gov/planning/pudcases.html
* Jackson Street website: http://www.jacksonstreetphx.com/
* Map of Warehouse District Overlay:
http://www.phoenix.gov/planning/zovmap26.pdf
* Slide show of remaining Warehouse District historic/vintage
buildings:
http://downtownvoices.org/2008/08/30/what-remains-of-phoenixs-warehouse-district/

* You can also do a search within the Downtown Voices website on
"warehouse district" for past news: http://www.downtownvoices.org

DVC Priority Issues:

Affordable Housing:

Arts and Culture:

Coordination of Planning:

Design Guidelines:

Diversity and Cultural Inclusion:

Historic Preservation:

Locally Owned Businesses:

Neighborhoods:

Public Spaces:

Transportation:

[Vicelord John]

I just decided from those renderings.... westgate #2

[HooverDam]

I just decided from those renderings.... westgate #2

Right because this is a bunch of inward facing chain stores surrounded by miles of parking lots. :rolleyes:

[AZ KID]

From the AZ Republic....

Jackson Street project is too good to ignore
2 commentsJun. 10, 2009 12:00 AM

Incongruous as it may seem in the current real-estate market, the Jackson Street entertainment district in downtown Phoenix is forging ahead once more.

It has been a tough haul for this plan to dramatically make over the southern side of downtown. But some ideas are just too good to grind to a halt.

In terms of the planning process, the entertainment district at last seems to be on a fast track. The ambitious plan for a mix of nightclubs, restaurants, commercial and residential space, and, perhaps, a boutique hotel on the blocks south of US Airways Center has been slowed by the economy, but is gaining traction again.
We're gratified to see it. Few projects planned for the central city have the possibilities for transforming downtown like Jackson Street does.

The proposal went through a Phoenix Village Planning Committee review earlier this week. Tonight it is scheduled for review by the municipal Planning and Zoning Committee. Unanticipated delays notwithstanding, the entertainment-district plan could go before the full Phoenix council by the first of next month.

In one form or another, the rare combination of gritty, old industrial buildings and sleek, new development has been under consideration for many years. At one time, the proposal included elements on both sides of Jackson Street, north and south.

Now, it is mostly on the southern side, with the height of new construction limited to 140 feet or less.

Like all the ambitious plans to make over downtown, the entertainment district has suffered from financing setbacks in recent months. Along with many other high-profile Phoenix-area projects, the district became entangled in the tragedy-marred collapse of Mortgages Ltd. last year.

Larry Lazarus, a veteran Valley development attorney working on Jackson Street, contends projects like this one are easier to finance in downturns because it is "linear" - a series of low-rising developments that can be financed incrementally, as opposed to an all-or-nothing high-rise.

"This is a brand-new zoning category," said Lazarus. "So any time you do something new, you're a pioneer."

Conceptually, Jackson Street has been an easy sell. Phoenix has a paucity of the sort of funky, old buildings that can be rehabbed into nightclub and restaurant venues. Jackson Street has those. Even now the area is drawing artists' studios and clubs. And it provides sufficient space for complimentary new development.

Jackson Street one day is going to be a major attraction in downtown. The planning process is bringing it that much closer to becoming a reality.

[Vicelord John]

I'll believe it when it happens.

This would be a huge thing for me as it's a 5 minute walk, but I don't believe it will happen.

[gymratmanaz]

Who knows though, with the new 5 restaurants going in, maybe that will help push things along more than before?