[mr.x]

PREMIER UNVEILS NEW VISION FOR BC PLACE & ART GALLERY

VANCOUVER – A major renovation of BC Place Stadium – including a retractable roof after 2010 –
will expand the city’s sport, culture and entertainment district; feature a new home for the Vancouver
Whitecaps; and provide a waterfront site for a new Vancouver Art Gallery, Premier Gordon Campbell
announced today.

“We asked PavCo chair David Podmore to develop a long-term plan for one of British
Columbia’s landmark facilities. What he found was BC Place is in good shape but, like any facility
that age, is in need of upgrades,” said Premier Campbell. “The upgrades pre- and post-Olympics will
significantly reduce energy consumption and extend the life of this world-class facility for another 30
years. It will also give us the opportunity to create a vibrant arts and sporting community for residents
and visitors alike.”

Upgrades to BC Place will occur in two phases. Renovations to suites, seating, washrooms and
concession stands, and enhancement of the existing roof liner will occur before the 2010 Olympic and
Paralympic Winter Games. A new retractable roof will be put in place after the 2010 Games. Both
phases are expected to go out to tender within five months, subject to design, completion of a business
case and cost-benefit analysis and government approval.

“Once we’ve completed our design and planning, we’ll finalize the budget and, subject to
provincial government approval, get a fixed price contract with a guaranteed timeline,” said Podmore.
“As much of the preparatory work on the roof as possible will be done prior to the 2010 Games. The
remaining work to install the new roof will be completed over an estimated eight months after the
Games are over. This is exactly how BC Place was planned and built more than 25 years ago. By
waiting until after 2010 to complete the retractable roof, we’ll get better competitive pricing.”

A retractable roof by itself will cut energy costs for BC Place by one-third, $535,000 annually.
A further $100,000 annually will be saved through operational savings. For example, the stadium will
no longer need air-lock doors to support the roof. Further options, such as solar panels and geothermal
heating, will also be explored.

As part of the new roof and upgrade, which is expected to be complete early in 2011, the
Whitecaps will start playing at BC Place in the summer of 2011, part of a five-year lease with renewals
after 2016. That will give the team the opportunity to apply for a Major League Soccer (MLS)
franchise.

“We are looking forward to playing under the retractable roof at BC Place starting in 2011,”
said Bob Lenarduzzi, president of Vancouver Whitecaps FC. “We are confident that the planned
renovations will make BC Place a more versatile venue, very suitable for soccer and a variety of other
international calibre events. The move to BC Place will allow us to pursue the opportunity for an MSL
franchise and will open up a host of additional opportunities that we are excited to bring to
Vancouver.”

“BC Place has been our home field for 25 years, so we’re thrilled with the plans to upgrade it
and add a retractable roof,” said Bob Ackles, BC Lions president and CEO. “To be able to play
outdoors under a retractable roof is going to make the whole experience even more enjoyable for our
fans. As much as we enjoy playing under the dome, the chance to enjoy a game on a summer night will
be very popular with our fans and players alike.”

As part of the bigger vision for this part of downtown Vancouver, PavCo has been working
with the City of Vancouver, the Vancouver Art Gallery and Canadian Metropolitan Properties, the
owners of the Plaza of Nations, to move the Vancouver Art Gallery to False Creek. Currently, less than
three per cent of its collection is on display, because of space restraints.

In return for future development considerations from the City of Vancouver on its False Creek
property, Canadian Metropolitan Properties is providing the Vancouver Art Gallery with a waterfront
site for its new 320,000 square-foot facility. The Province has already contributed $50 million towards
the new gallery.

“The gallery has experienced unprecedented growth in the last decade, and with more than
40,000 members, record-breaking admissions and a growing collection of 10,000 artworks, is now
bursting at the seams,” said gallery director Kathleen Bartels. “The False Creek location presents an
exciting opportunity to imagine a new Vancouver Art Gallery on this beautiful waterfront site, one that
would serve as an anchor for this extension of Vancouver’s thriving cultural community. In addition to
Premier Campbell’s recent commitment of $50 million, we are extremely grateful to the Province of
British Columbia for bringing us another step closer to realizing our dream for a new Vancouver Art
Gallery.”

Development and the sale, or lease, of lands around BC Place are expected to generate more
than $100 million towards the cost of the new roof and upgrades. Additional revenues will come from
new sponsorships and expanded business opportunities.



http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/8630/68503015bd5.jpg

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/4062/95653755if0.jpg

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/306/35521388xu5.jpg

http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/4370/50436235bi5.jpg

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/8936/84899419hy9.jpg

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/7317/16942348vj7.jpg





BEFORE
http://blogmedia.thenewstribune.com/media/BC_Place.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/2/1496642_84bd79ef7e.jpg

[Overground]

Thanks...damn you're fast getting those up!

So you're right about the Commerzbank roof. This also has the look of the London Olympic stadium as well.

[mr.x]

Thanks...damn you're fast getting those up!

So you're right about the Commerzbank roof. This also has the look of the London Olympic stadium as well.

A bit like the Millennium Dome in London too:
http://updatecenter.britannica.com/eb/image?binaryId=74880&rendTypeId=4



BTW, in the first rendering, the building that replaces the Plaza of Nations site is the NEW ART GALLERY (i think that's what i heard).

[Overground]

That's what I heard too!! That's a real doozy to soak in.....so much info it's a bit overwhelming.

I'm trying to think what other city has a stadium with a similar "crown" design. I though I saw one somewhere.

[vanlaw]

Last few paragraphs of the news release - the building that is where Edgewater Casino currenlty sits will be the new Art Gallery. That would be cool, but came outa left field!

http://www.bcplacestadium.com/newsreleases/BC_Place_Future.pdf

[officedweller]

Thanks.
The towers seem to encroach on the development parcels. Hopefully they'll ditch the colours.
For the Plaza of Nations - does that mean the "plaza" - concert venue - is toast?? And why does a windowless art gallery need to be on the waterfront - it certainly won't have south facing windows into the galleries.
In return for future development considerations from the City of Vancouver on its False Creek
property, Canadian Metropolitan Properties is providing the Vancouver Art Gallery with a waterfront
site for its new 320,000 square-foot facility. The Province has already contributed $50 million towards
the new gallery.

[Hed Kandi]

THIS CALLS FOR A CELEBRATION!

http://deephousepage.com/smilies/club.gif http://deephousepage.com/smilies/spinning.gif :banana: :dancing: :leek: :upload_71700: :pepper: :awesome: :eeekk: :cucumber: :apple: http://www.universdj.com/fauxrhum/images/smiles/tripnana.gif http://www.universdj.com/fauxrhum/images/smiles/eusa_dance.gif http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/smilies/carrot.gif http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/smilies/awesome.gif http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/smilies/dj.gif

[flight_from_kamakura]

i'm stunned.

[vanlaw]

Thanks.
For the Plaza of Nations - does that mean the "plaza" - concert venue - is toast?? And why does a windowless art gallery need to be on the waterfront - it certainly won't have south facing windows into the galleries.

I think the concert venue is already toast - the stage is still physically there, but are there any events scheduled for there this summer?

I think the gallery would look much diff than that - probably just an idea to get something into the rendering.

[mr.x]

For the same design at a new site, it would cost $1-1.2 billion to build. What a great deal we got. :D

The roof engineering process will take 6 months, while the tendering process will take another 3 months. No wonder why they couldn't do it. However, as we all know, interior renovations will begin almost immediately.

[Hed Kandi]

Question about the design.

The rendering shows "2010" as the date with the open roof. Does that mean that the roof will be open during the olympics?

[mr.x]

Question about the design.

The rendering shows "2010" as the date with the open roof. Does that mean that the roof will be open during the olympics?

No, it won't open in 2010. The roof will be built by 2011, the existing inflatable roof will be upgraded for 2010.

[officedweller]

My concern is that the Art Gallery may "sterilize" the site more than what was there before. i.e. it may try to be too exclusive. I don't see the Art Gallery hosting a rock concert in any open air venue that it may have on its site.

I'd rather see the Art Gallery be "semi-waterfront" with a real concert venue on the waterfront. Art galleries don't want direct sunlight - so it doesn't need the views of the water. Look at the old courthouse - all of the windows are blocked off.


Backgrounders from the BC website:

BACKGROUNDER

2008OTP0136-000774

May 16, 2008
Office of the Premier

QUICK FACTS ABOUT BC PLACE

BC Place is the largest multi-use facility in British Columbia
Top choice for business and industry for exhibition and spectator events
Annual economic activity generated: $58.1 million (2007)


Home to the 2010 Olympic Opening and Closing Ceremonies
Host of nightly Victory Ceremonies for the 2010 Olympic Games
Home to the 2010 Paralympic Opening Ceremonies


Built in 1983 to rejuvenate the False Creek area
First covered stadium in Canada
Built with enough concrete to build a sidewalk from Vancouver to Seattle, Washington
Finished on time and on budget at $126 million


Current roof area: 10.25 acres (largest air-supported dome in the world, pressurized by 16 jet engine fans)
Current roof material: Teflon coated fibreglass consisting of two layers of fabric, 1/30 inch (0.85 millimetres) thick.


Current capacity: 60,000
Occupied more than 200 event days per year
95 per cent occupancy in fall and spring show seasons
36 event days used for BC Lions regular season home games and other sporting events
Sold out private suites and hospitality areas


Circumference: 760 metres (2,500 feet)
Number of revolving doors: 50
Field: 1,500 pieces of turf, assembled like a jigsaw puzzle


-30-



BACKGROUNDER

2008OTP0136-000774

May 16, 2008
Office of the Premier

VANCOUVER ART GALLERY EXPANSION

· The gallery seeks to design and build a new facility that supports the gallery’s potential, matches the achievements and ambitions of Vancouver’s artists and draws international attention to Vancouver and British Columbia.

· With less than three per cent of the gallery’s 10,000 artworks currently on display in the courthouse building, a new gallery will provide much-needed space for the permanent collection, including its extensive holding of British Columbian art.

· In 2005, the Plaza of Nations site was identified by the gallery’s board of trustees as one of the top locations for a new building.

· The Plaza of Nations site will allow the gallery to construct a building of approximately 320,000 square feet, double its current size, with a footprint of approximately 110,000 square feet, providing additional opportunities for outdoor gallery programming on the waterfront.

· While the courthouse facility has considerable heritage value, it has a lack of functional space, a number of environmental concerns, seismic vulnerabilities and aging systems.

· The gallery initiated a master planning process in 2003 which concluded that it must at least double the size of its existing facility (157,000 square feet). Further, the study concluded that an expansion on the gallery’s current site at Robson Square is highly problematic due to heritage and other issues.

· Extensive program planning has produced a list of potential elements of a new Vancouver Art Gallery, including:

o Dedicated permanent exhibition galleries;

o Expanded temporary exhibition galleries;

o State-of-the-art permanent collection storage;

o Increased collection access, including significant artist archives;

o Outdoor space for the presentation of art and community gatherings;

o Greatly expanded school, family and children’s programming, including hands-on learning spaces and classrooms;

o A significant lecture space;

o Welcoming and comfortable gathering spaces;

o A larger gallery Store;

o Expanded venue rentals, including outdoor spaces;

o Adequate space for staff and volunteers;

o Increased integration of technology; and

o An environmentally sustainable building.

-30-

[deasine]

Wow... Looking good! =D The Art Gallery expansion is imo the best part. BC Place looks a little odd, but hey I guess anything looks better than it is right now =)

[djh]

WHOA! The Art Gallery announcement almost overshadows the roof announcement.

But it raises many questions:

- The empty parking lot site on Georgia that *everybody* here said was *definitely* going to be the new Art Gallery (JLousa?)...what happened to that proposal?
- The current Art Gallery site? Any hints of what will happen there? I've heard discussed the idea of other smaller galleries/museums moving in (e.g., the Vancouver Museum and the Space Centre)?
- Remember when the new Convention Centre's plans originally expanded and the waterfront space that was allocated for an arts facility was bumped? Well there was a certain amount of city funds set aside for that development. Would that be included in this project as the city's contribution?
- I think the Edgewater Casino has a lease on that site until 2013, so does this mean this project is not going to happen until at least 2014?

and finally
- towerguy3...where are you...?

[Jared]

what i posted in the Canada forum:


As part of the new roof and upgrade, which is expected to be complete early in 2011, the
Whitecaps will start playing at BC Place in the summer of 2011, part of a five-year lease with renewals
after 2016. That will give the team the opportunity to apply for a Major League Soccer (MLS)
franchise.

a couple thoughts:

- If this is turning into a permanent home for the Whitecaps then what will happen to Swanguard? Also, I would assume that the proposed Waterfront stadium will be axed?

- I was always under the impression that BC Place's field was smaller than a regular soccer field.

- Will they convert the field to grass?

[mr.x]

Commissioner's Vancouver statement
Garber comments on stadium renovation announcement

Major League Soccer Communications
05/16/2008 01:05AM

Following today's announcement in Vancouver that BC Place will undergo renovations, Major League Soccer Commissioner Don Garber issued the following statement:

"We believe Vancouver is a potential market for a future Major League Soccer expansion team. There is no doubt the market for professional soccer exists in Vancouver, as we saw last November when nearly 50,000 fans attended the exhibition match between the Los Angeles Galaxy and the Whitecaps.

"We understand the newly renovated BC Place Stadium will be a world-class facility. We look forward to learning more about the proposed renovations so that we may determine whether BC Place can serve as an interim venue for an MLS team pending the construction of a soccer-specific stadium.

"MLS will have 16 teams by 2010 with the addition of Seattle next year and Philadelphia the following season. We are currently in discussions with potential expansion team owners and local governments in many markets across North America regarding the 17th and 18th teams.

We look forward to continuing our discussions with the Whitecaps regarding the opportunity to award a Major League Soccer expansion team to Vancouver in the future."

[officedweller]

Hopefully the Larwill Park site will be redeveloped with office towers - that would add some life to the "cultural precinct" and extend the office district towards GM Place.

No word on who will take the old VAG space - but odds on bets are for the Vancouver Museum - I'll bet the Space Centre stays put and expands since the planetarium is there.

The theatre component for the Coal Harbour site was for an indoor performance theatre, so I doubt that would end up at the art gallery (it would also be isolated from the other theatres) - maybe it will stay at the Larwill Park site.

The glass pavillion has always been considered a "legacy" building from Expo86. Maybe it will be retained. I really doubt that they will be allowed to extend the foreshore into False Creek as depicted in that first rendering.

BC Place used to host the Whitecaps when they were part of the NASL.

[mr.x]

what i posted in the Canada forum:




a couple thoughts:

- If this is turning into a permanent home for the Whitecaps then what will happen to Swanguard? Also, I would assume that the proposed Waterfront stadium will be axed?

- I was always under the impression that BC Place's field was smaller than a regular soccer field.

- Will they convert the field to grass?


1) Swanguard has always been a community facility, for local track meets, community events, and the occasional concert. It will stay, it only has a seating capacity of about 6,000.

2) This is being advertised as the interim home of the Whitecaps. They want to be part of the MLS, and there are only 4 franchise spots left. With BC Place, which is now an acceptable MLS stadium, they can secure a franchise spot. Waterfront Stadium discussions will still continue, but of course this stadium renovation development at BC Place will no doubt hinder the process to a certain extent.

3) not sure about the natural grass.

[twoNeurons]

I think it would be really sweet for the Vancouver Museum to have to such a prominent spot in the middle of the city, if they get the current VAG spot.

I think it's a little big for the Vancouver Museum though, and I'd like to see something more interesting... like maybe history of the Region.

[Overground]

If Seattle is playing in a 70k Qwest Field without a tractable roof, and on fake turf no doubt, with the upper stands tarped off to leave 24k seats to watch Sounders matches, I think BC Place for the Caps should be totally suitable for MLS, perhaps more so than Qwest Field. With the Caps even further offering to build a specific stadium down the road, you would think that this is no-brainer for what MLS wants.

I think the pitch is still going to be fake turf as it needs to be used for the Lions as well as conventions. Also, I think a real grass turf needs proper sunlight on the full pitch which the proposed roof will not offer, unlike Commerzbank or Wembley which does.

[mr.x]

^ tell that to trueviking in the Canada forum thread on the stadium:


BC place is not an acceptable stadium for MLS....the league requires soccer specific stadia with no football lines and natural grass....they want them in the 20 000 seat range....TFC was lucky to be admitted with plastic, but they would not have gotten a franchise if the plan was skydome.

the new franchises of MLS come with new stadia of this type, or a concrete promise to construct one...if vancouver thinks that this move will secure them an MLS franchise, they are dead wrong...it will do the exact opposite.

where do you see that this is a temporary move?


http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/sports/story.html?id=a3371ec6-bedf-4321-9d0d-59e834b57a49&p=2


"Lenarduzzi said moving into 60,000-seat BC Place Stadium is not an option for the Whitecaps, even on a temporary basis as negotiations continue on the waterfront stadium.

"BC Place Stadium is not an option, both financially and as a proper facility," he said. "First impressions with the public are very important. We want a stadium that our fans can identify with, and be comfortable with, from the very first game."





doesnt exactly sound like MLS are thrilled with the idea.....its exactly what i said...if the other stadium is concrete they would allow BC place, but do the people in vancouver see it as temporary?.....i still dont see where it says that is the plan....until the mayor or the people involved in the waterfront stadium actually say they they percieve this as a temporary move, i wont believe it......can you imagine the USL whitecaps playing on a plastic field with football lines and 52 000 empty seats...that will be awesome.

renovating BC place is a great thing, but i would be very surprised if this moves the city into MLS's sights....there are several cities now with appropriate venues (montreal included), looking for franchises.

MLS isnt exactly clamouring to get into vancouver...this will not woo them, unless the waterfront stadium is more real as a future project.

MLS was very interested in seattle and their ownership group...thats why they allowed a substandard venue...vancouver has to compete with larger cities that are ready now...not possibly in 10 years...

MLS will not move into BC place....guaranteed....not without a solid plan in place for a move to an appropriate venue.

the whitecaps should distance themselves from this because it will only slow progess on a real stadium...public perception will be why allow another stadium when we are spending 200m on BC place...why cant they play there?



NOTE: the article he mentions is from November 2007.:koko: :haha:

[Overground]

Especially when Lenarduzzi said this in the last couple of weeks....

Whitecaps president Bob Lenarduzzi said Tuesday the club is still 100 per cent committed to building a soccer-specific, natural grass stadium on the Vancouver waterfront, but would consider B.C. Place as a temporary venue if major renos are announced shortly as expected.

"Our priority is still the waterfront stadium, but given that it's taking as long as it has, we need to have alternatives if the opportunity to move to a higher level is available," said Lenarduzzi.

"It would be a short-term solution, as we're looking at the waterfront stadium being our permanent solution but of course we're mired in that process right now."

[raggedy13]

Great news all around today. I'm a bit surprised about the VAG location announcement, especially after just reading an article a day or two ago about how the Edgewater Casino has been doing really well and wants to expand.

Anyways, if the VAG does go to False Creek, it would give us a great opportunity to create our own Sydney Opera House of sorts. I'm sure a location like that could inspire some amazing designs in an international design competition.

[mr.x]

Look at stadium roof in post-Olympic light

Miro Cernetig, Vancouver Sun
Published: Friday, May 16, 2008

Now that we're putting up a retractable roof costing as much as $200 million over BC Place Stadium, the prudent question for the provincial cabinet is, well, what's really the point now?

Let's face it. The provincial government didn't get its act together quickly enough to get this job done by 2010. Now, with about 600 days to go until the Olympics, a new roof won't happen until after the Games, when the international spotlight has moved on.

Won't, one might ask, the great moment have passed to justify such a major expenditure?

Actually, no.

Yes, the argument for a $200-million roof seems hard to make at first beyond the Olympics. There are only a handful of B.C. Lions games in a year where the roof would be open. Even factoring in a few trade shows that might want to be open air and some events -- maybe the monster-truck rally or a mega rock concert in the summer -- and you wonder when else would that mega roof be cracked open in the city of rain?

One of the important rationales for the retractable roof was always to have a more modern-looking stadium up and ready for the 2010 Olympics. An architectural statement for the world to see. That chance has been lost, at least for the Olympics.

There was also the additional benefit of an open roof making it less problematic to put the Olympic flame inside BC Place. Now there will likely need to be a multimillion-dollar ventilation system built to keep the air clean and cool.

But you have to look at this mega-roof in the post-Olympics light. Nobody knows what this city will be like in the next 30 years, the length of time by which this renovation will extend the life of BC Place. Perhaps by then our metropolitan economy, with one million more residents, will finally be big enough for Triple A or major league baseball? Will there be a push -- with Seattle and Vancouver joining forces -- to host soccer's World Cup? Or maybe even a Summer Olympics? Don't forget there was a move a few years ago for a cross-border bid for the 2008 Olympics, with Seattle and Vancouver as joint hosts.

It's not such a crazy notion. Neither West Coast city is big enough to host those events, which are a quantum leap larger than the Winter Olympics, on their own. But together they could host the Cascadia Games, fitting in an age when boundaries and nationalism matter less and less. In fact, that dual-city idea is taking flight.

Both Tourism Vancouver and the Seattle Convention and Visitors Bureau have floated the idea of another run at the International Olympic Committee for the 2028 Summer Games. They have also talked about a bi-national bid for the 2020 World's Fair and maybe even soccer's World Cup in 2018 or later.

In the shorter term, we'll get a taste of just how useful BC Place might be when the Vancouver Whitecaps start playing there. The soccer team's quixotic attempt for a waterfront stadium continues, but in the meantime a revamped BC Place will give them a home -- one eventually with a retractable, translucent roof that will mean they can have natural turf. (That grass may take root even sooner. The plan is to take down the inner lining of the stadium to let more light in.)

So our mushroom in bondage, as BC Place has been aptly called, will soon be a memory. So will all the empty parking lots surrounding it. This is going to spark the biggest change to downtown Vancouver since the redevelopment of the old Expo 86 lands in the old industrial lands around False Creek.

The stadium's new top will come with a multibillion-dollar real-estate development. That's because the plan is to sell all those parking lots around the stadium to developers, who in exchange for the right to put up new towers are expected to pay for the retractable roof and other amenities.

That means there's an enormous planning challenge ahead for the City of Vancouver, too. There will have to be new roads, parking and parks for the thousands of people who will be living around BC Place after the Olympics.

There's already grumbling from people in Yaletown who feel they are living too dense a lifestyle. Another 5,000 or 10,000 neighbours will raise urban stress big time. This may be the spot where Vancouver's EcoDensity debate is really fought out.

But that's all a few years away. Until then, the big concern is keeping that roof up until the Olympics are over. The man responsible for that is David Podmore and he's got to have this recurring nightmare: the old BC Place roof ripping and deflating again during the Games, while the world watches.

The engineers say it's unlikely. But Podmore is taking no chances. He's flying in reams of extra material, so if disaster hits, he'll at least be able to sew BC Place back together again.

mcernetig@png.canwest.com

[WarrenC12]

Make no mistake, the MLS is pissed about the Qwest field debacle, and they likely won't grant another MLS franchise to a city that doesn't have firm plans to build the kind of stadium they want. Remember its not the MLS looking for expansions, there are 6 cities looking for 2 spots. For Vancouver its probably us or Montreal... tough competition.

I'm all in favor of both the "new" BC Place and a waterfront stadium. It would be great to have everything in place by 2014 or so. The Whitecaps are committing to a 5 year lease through 2016, but maybe there are provisions for getting out of it.

[Pinion]

Is Edgewater Casino gassed in that location for sure now? I'm a bit surprised considering how well they were doing despite being in a building with almost no parking near it. They were spending money on the building like they expected to be there for decades. Will they get bribed with a new location to end their lease early? (Maybe the current VAG building? jk)

I'm surprised Plaza of Nations news was tied in with the BC Place announcement.

[mr.x]

what it should look like in 2010.....but it won't:
http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/4531/32371319cz0.jpg

[jlousa]

^^wow I'd figures the TV towers would be done by then :tup:

Too many posts all over the place about this, figured this one is probably the main one. Glad to see the renos planned and the roof looks good (I still think it's a waste though). I'm really suprised by the VAG annoucement though and have a feeling not everything annouced is going to come to fruitation ala clamshell. For one thing that city is in charge of zoning the land around the stadium not the province, and they have been very vocal about it being officespace and only officespace.
The city has also spent alot of time and money on their cultural district plan which this new location doesn't fit into, sure plans can change but there is an awful lot going on here. (CHMC donating land for the VAG in exchange for future zoning???? The province has no say in that)

Anyways happy about the stadium, shocked about the VAG.

[twoNeurons]

I think if we got a retractable roof for the Olympics, it would end up being overpriced and underwhelming.


Seriously, what are we really trying to prove? I hate that attitude. Do things that make sense because they make sense, not because a bunch of people on TV are going to see.

Saying all that, the Olympics were undoubtedly the influence behind this change, whether it happens before or after, despite what the papers say.

[mr.x]

I think if we got a retractable roof for the Olympics, it would end up being overpriced and underwhelming.

Well, all of the 56 multicoloured columns and the multicoloured glass panels (with the Winter Games sport symbols), as well as the new exterior glass facade, will be completed in time for 2010. Everything shown in the stadium's exterior renderings will be done by 2010.

It's interesting to mention that yesterday, on Team 1040, an insider leaked out exactly what would be happening today and the plans for BC Place. He also mentioned that the province had a "Plan A and Plan B". Plan A was to build the retractable roof after 2010; Plan B was to build the retractable roof in time for 2010 - as a decision to be made at a later date if there is enough time.

Though it's probably unlikely, especially since we don't know the credibility of the phone caller (though he was quite convincing, and they had him on for 5 minutes!), it's possible that the province and Pavco are keeping these plans behind doors. Also consider that VANOC needs to know what type of venue they'll be working with for the ceremonies sometime this summer.


I don't see how it would be underwhelming...it would still be the same design, though possibly at a higher cost.

[johnjimbc]

I don't understand the last post. The announcement just talks about internal improvements, yet Mr X just mentioned that all the colored columns and glass panels on the exterior will be in place by the Olympics (if I understood that post correctly).

So, does anyone have any idea what the exterior will look like DURING THE OLYMPICS?

I ask because I have long thought that it wasn't the roof that looked dated to me . . . it is the dark, dirty, scummy looking 25-year old concrete structure below the roof. You know, the building itself?

So I'd be thrilled if some of those sleek (very Olympic looking) panels were in place for 2010. But I'm not sure I'm getting that from the announcement . . . it just seems implied in some of the posts since the announcement.

If anyone can clarify, would love to hear it. Thanks.

[Overground]

What X said before. So in a nutshell what I've gathered from everything is that the outside will be done in 2010(glass facade etc), including the structural work for the roof except the actual roof placement and it's parts(beams?) won't be done and in place until 2011.

[jhausner]

They said on the team 1040 today that it will be completed by Summer of 2010 minus the roof, not by 2011. 2011 is when the Whitecaps start in the statiums. That would lead me to believe that there is a good chance that all the external changes WILL be completed by the Olympics aka the grey ugly around teh building.

And all the internal upgrades will also be upgraded by then.

I also think the above is correct in that they have Plan A and Plan B, Plan B being to complete it by the Olympics. It's safe to say to the public that it will happen after just in case it doesn't work out, but imagine if they do work it out and say "Oh btw we will complete it in time for the Olympics."

My only concern is that it takes quite a while to plan the opening and closing cerimonies for the Olympics. Given it is a closed dome right now I would imagine they are putting a lot of thought and effort into using that to their advantage. If they get through the process near the Olympics and suddenly the roof changes, it could be risky for the cerimonies which, let's face it, are the most visible portion of the Olympics from a world standpoint.

Most people watch the Olympics for those 2 events only.

[johnjimbc]

I do understand a bit better now (and am somewhat relieved). I think this is an incredibly positive announcement overall. Sounds like they were trying to make sure they didn't over promise, but were clearly trying to do what they could to developer a plan for a quality venue for the ceremonies.

I think they've said what they can at this point, and the announcement is a good way to rally the powers that be . . . and the public . . . to the cause of having the venue look as good as it can given the constraints.

[officedweller]

Well, all of the 56 multicoloured columns and the multicoloured glass panels (with the Winter Games sport symbols), as well as the new exterior glass facade, will be completed in time for 2010. Everything shown in the stadium's exterior renderings will be done by 2010.


I doubt that - the columns are steel and their erection would carry a high construction cost - the cost escalation that is being avoided....
I could see the panels being erected for the games, as long as the phasing allows it (i.e. they don;t get in the way of tower erection). BTW - note that those blue and green panels are all above the current rim of the dome.

[mr.x]

They said on the team 1040 today that it will be completed by Summer of 2010 minus the roof, not by 2011. 2011 is when the Whitecaps start in the statiums. That would lead me to believe that there is a good chance that all the external changes WILL be completed by the Olympics aka the grey ugly around teh building.

And all the internal upgrades will also be upgraded by then.

I also think the above is correct in that they have Plan A and Plan B, Plan B being to complete it by the Olympics. It's safe to say to the public that it will happen after just in case it doesn't work out, but imagine if they do work it out and say "Oh btw we will complete it in time for the Olympics."

My only concern is that it takes quite a while to plan the opening and closing cerimonies for the Olympics. Given it is a closed dome right now I would imagine they are putting a lot of thought and effort into using that to their advantage. If they get through the process near the Olympics and suddenly the roof changes, it could be risky for the cerimonies which, let's face it, are the most visible portion of the Olympics from a world standpoint.

Most people watch the Olympics for those 2 events only.



if only they had worked faster with this planning process, and announced the whole thing 6 months ago. There would not have been a problem with completing it in time for 2010.

I think it's brilliant that they left themselves a crack in the door to work with, just in case things go smoothly. If they can get the roof up from April 2010 to the summer of 2010, in just a few months, they should definitely try their absolute best to do it before 2010.



---------

With regards to the ceremonies planning, I have to say that so far, I am disappointed with the whole process. Athens started planning for their shows 7 years before the Games, Beijing 5 years, Torino 4 years, Vancouver 2.5 years.

Not to mention that the ceremonies budget....they originally projected that it would cost $40-million to stage the opening/closing and the money would come from the private sector/sponsorships. Then they got $20 million from the feds to spend on the ceremonies, but the budget still remains at $40 million. Shouldn't the 2010 opening/closing ceremonies budget be $60-million?

In comparison, Athens spent $100 million. Beijing will be spending around the same amount. Torino spent $40 million (btw, their ceremonies were just awful). And Sydney and Salt Lake spent between $25-30 million.

[excel]

wow great news all around, thanks.

[mr.x]

VANOC welcomes BC Place Stadium plans: Upgrades for 2010 and retractable roof post-Games for premiere Olympic venue

May 16, 2008
VANOC Release

Vancouver, BC — The Vancouver Organizing Committee for the 2010 Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games (VANOC) welcomed today the Province of British Columbia’s decision to upgrade BC Place Stadium facilities before the 2010 Winter Games, and to move ahead with a retractable roof, in the facility’s life beyond the Games.

The announced pre-Games upgrades — including renovations to suites, seating, washrooms and concession stands, and the enhancement of the existing roof liner — will ensure the facility is in top form in time for the 2010 Winter Games. VANOC’s financial contribution towards the stadium upgrades will be used in large part to upgrade access for people with disabilities. The new retractable roof, to be constructed after the Games have concluded, will ensure BC Place remains a premium venue long after the Games are over.

“BC Place Stadium has always been the perfect stage for spectacular ceremonies in 2010, offering the opportunity to stage special effects and spectator comfort unique to these Winter Games. The upgrades announced today will help ensure a great spectator experience," said John Furlong, VANOC Chief Executive Officer. He also commended BC Premier Gordon Campbell and PavCo (BC Pavilion Corporation) for plans to complete a retractable roof at BC Place after the 2010 Winter Games. “We support the decision to complete the new roof after the Games, and are very familiar with the savings that can be found when construction is undertaken under the right timing.” Continued Furlong, “Outside of the sport venues, BC Place Stadium is where many of the most spectacular and inspiring moments of the 2010 Winter Games will happen. Memories will be made there and BC Place Stadium will permanently gain a special stature as a premiere Games venue. With the global exposure afforded by the 2010 Winter Games, a new retractable roof, post-2010, and as home to the Vancouver Whitecaps and the BC Lions, BC Place Stadium will clearly attract world-class professional sport and celebration events for years to come.”

The Vancouver 2010 Olympic Winter Games Opening Ceremony will take place in the 60,000-seat BC Place Stadium on February 12, 2010. The Closing Ceremony, to take place on February 28, 2010, will also be held at BC Place Stadium. During the Games period, Nightly Victory Ceremonies will also be held there. This will be the first time in Olympic Games history that the Olympic Ceremonies will be staged in the comfort of an indoor venue. The Paralympic Winter Games Opening Ceremony will be held at BC Place Stadium, on March 12, 2010.

In addition to the in-stadium spectators, an estimated three billion television viewers are expected to watch the Opening Ceremony on February 12.

VANOC is responsible for the planning, organizing, financing and staging of the XXI Olympic Winter Games and the X Paralympic Winter Games in 2010. The 2010 Olympic Winter Games will be staged in Vancouver and Whistler from February 12 to 28, 2010. Vancouver and Whistler will host the Paralympic Winter Games from March 12 to 21, 2010. Visit www.vancouver2010.com

[hollywoodnorth]

I think its about time for a

Go GORDO Go! the man sure knows how to get it FUCKING DONE!

I`m in awe............

[mr.x]

I think its about time for a

Go GORDO Go! the man sure knows how to get it FUCKING DONE!

I`m in awe............

Too much credit....he should've made this announcement a year ago, at the latest, so that it could've been done by 2010.

[clooless]

Well, all of the 56 multicoloured columns and the multicoloured glass panels (with the Winter Games sport symbols), as well as the new exterior glass facade, will be completed in time for 2010. Everything shown in the stadium's exterior renderings will be done by 2010.

Wow, that's quite the improvement. Do we know this for certain?

[Yume-sama]

It looks a lot better than I had expected it to :slob:

[mr.x]

Interesting picture.....note the water leakage at Commerzbank Arena's roof. I guess it's possible that the players could use it to cool off. :D
http://www.smart-travel-germany.com/image-files/frankfurtstadium2_large.jpg
http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/53169412.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=780858ABC91EC2145C5B94DDD1A0D5FDA40A659CEC4C8CB6

With that said, I believe it only happened once and the problem was resolved....apparently, for just that one time the roof didn't unfold and lock properly 100%.




If that ever happened at BC Place, it would pose some major problems to the events below. Considering that the rim of the retractable roof is a little deeper into the field than Commerzbank, it would affect concerts, trade shows, and might even require football games to be delayed.

[mr.x]

Wow, that's quite the improvement. Do we know this for certain?

I got it from another member at another forum, who is quite credible and works for the media.

[Cypherus]

Defintely positive news. Even if the external glass panels are installed by 2010, but the roof pillars are not completed (as officedweller credibly asserts), then the stadium would look a little more acceptable.

[Innersoul1]

Congrats Van-City All Stars! This looks like it will be an amazing project! The current roof at BC place has always been a visual landmark and the new roof will certainly follow in this tradition!

[hollywoodnorth]

Too much credit....he should've made this announcement a year ago, at the latest, so that it could've been done by 2010.

meh better late than never.

[mr.x]

Some pics from the BC Place website:



This is what the upper tier concourse looks now, with the glass windows - which will be removed, and possibly replaced with more opaque and modern looking windows.
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_windows.jpg



The entry concourse today
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_entrance.jpg



Concourse.
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_Level2Concourse1.jpg




Ramps to the lower-tier seats.
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_Ramps3.jpg





BC Place Stadium cafeteria/bar/restaurant
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_foodcourt.jpg
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_AllStarBar1.jpg







BC Place mens restroom
http://www.bcplacestadium.com/images/big_Urinals.jpg







They've got a lot of work to do.

[MistyMountainHop]

I think its about time for a

Go GORDO Go! the man sure knows how to get it FUCKING DONE!

I`m in awe............

But a year too late!

[towerguy3]

They can't do anything about the windows cause the building is airtight. When and if they put a Retractable on, only then can the windows go.

Those ugly windows are there to show the world in 2010.

Question is: how far does $ 50 million go? How much reno can you really do with a Stadium that covers 10 acres?

probably not much considering the cost of construction.

[clooless]

I would imagine that the engineers involved in the renovation are taking into account the structural necessities of the elements that will undergo renovation. That's sort of their job.

[deasine]

I don't see the windows in the renderings...

[clooless]

I don't either. Obviously the engineers have a contingency to allow for the fact that the windows are required to maintain positive pressure inside the building during construction. Perhaps the roof will be deflated for a period of time to allow for construction. Either way, they're not just going to wallpaper over the windows.

[towerguy3]

Deflation before 2010 is not an option. Every time you deflate and reinflate, you stress the panels and the connections with the cables, which can cause tears.

When the roof deflated last time, tears occured. It's risky, considering the roof is a patchwork as is.

[Hed Kandi]

$50 Million is really just a drop in the bucket.

This stadium is really going to be an embarrassment on the world stage especially after being compared Beijing's venues, which have set a new standard of architectural excellence.

[LeftCoaster]

To be honest I dont think 99% of the viewing public gives a s%*t about the look of BC place stadium... especially considering the cameras are all going be trained on the opening ceremony presentation going on at the floor or on the freshly renovated exterior from above.

What people are going to see is a stadium set in the middle of a sea of high rises, in a beautiful location with an assuredly boring opening ceremony occuring inside, as they are almost always are boring. Everyone on this fourm blows up at the state of BC place but the bottom line is almost everyone outside of this forum does not know or care how old and ugly this stadium currently looks.

And also 50+ million (it was assuredly be over 50 million, that's how government tenders work) in cosmetic improvements to the stadium will actually go a long way. It will allow for completly renovated washrooms, a new lighting system, new sound system, a refurbished concourse and many more cosmetic interior improvements. 50 million dollars for a renovation of a structurally sound building is actaully quite a bit of money.

[agrant]

:previous: I think I remember seeing this discussion before. Summer games and winter games are on different levels when it comes to money being put into venues. If you were to compare an upgraded BC Place with all the past winter olympic stadiums, we stand pretty tall. It shouldn't be an embarrassment, because what really matters is the actual sporting venues and I think we'll have set new standards there.

[twoNeurons]

To be honest I dont think 99% of the viewing public gives a s%*t about the look of BC place stadium... especially considering the cameras are all going be trained on the opening ceremony presentation going on at the floor or on the freshly renovated exterior from above.

What people are going to see is a stadium set in the middle of a sea of high rises, in a beautiful location with an assuredly boring opening ceremony occuring inside, as they are almost always are boring. Everyone on this fourm blows up at the state of BC place but the bottom line is almost everyone outside of this forum does not know or care how old and ugly this stadium currently looks.

And also 50+ million (it was assuredly be over 50 million, that's how government tenders work) in cosmetic improvements to the stadium will actually go a long way. It will allow for completly renovated washrooms, a new lighting system, new sound system, a refurbished concourse and many more cosmetic interior improvements. 50 million dollars for a renovation of a structurally sound building is actaully quite a bit of money.

I can't remember what Torino's stadium looked like... or Salt Lake's or Athens, and although Beijing's structures are stunning, most people don't know what they look like today.

[WarrenC12]

Competing with China? There's a lot of reasons we can't and shouldn't do that. :D

[mr.x]

$50 Million is really just a drop in the bucket.

This stadium is really going to be an embarrassment on the world stage especially after being compared Beijing's venues, which have set a new standard of architectural excellence.

I'm not sure where twg3 got the $50-million figure.....but $50-million is actually quite substantial, considering it goes towards cosmetic expenses on an existing concrete structure for the concourses.

I don't think we can compare with Beijing's venues, especially since these are the summer games. You have to consider that their main stadium, which is quite a bit bigger with a lot more seats and concourse space than BC Place, cost ~$1.2-billion to build - and that's with cheap labour and expropriating land without compensation. Build the bird nest in Vancouver, and it'll probably end up being the most expensive stadium ever built with a cost of $2+ billion.


This is just what I think could happen, posted at Canucks forums......The roof will cost around $150-million (assuming the papers are correct), and I highly doubt that includes the cost of the glass facade around the stadium. Just an example of some potential costs, what it could look like:

Roof replacement and exterior renovations: $150-million + exterior?
Concourse and gathering area renovations: $60-millions
Restroom renovations: $7-million
Lighting, acoustics: $7-million
New seats: $11-million
Accessibility improvements: $5-million
Videoboards and ring board: $10-million (based on GM Place cost)
Concession/bar renovations: $20-million
Other: $10-million

TOTAL: $280-million
+ Project contingency: $20-million

[mr.x]

I can't remember what Torino's stadium looked like... or Salt Lake's or Athens, and although Beijing's structures are stunning, most people don't know what they look like today.

Just for comparison's sake, Torino's Stade Olympique was a structure built at the time of Mussolini's regime. It has 27,000 seats....8,000 temporary seats, including on the field, were added for the Olympics for a capacity of 35,000. Renovations on the stadium including a new roof over the stands cost 20 million pounds, or CAN$40-million.


BEFORE - Torino '06
http://www.olympic.org/common/images/games/gallery/venues_torino/v2.jpg


AFTER
http://www.comune.torino.it/torinoplus/files/File/testate/olimpiadi-stadio.jpg
http://images.beijing-2008.org/20070505/Img214050879.jpg
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41428000/jpg/_41428918_stadium_ap_416.jpg
http://www.jndstravelog.com/Europe/Torino2006/Images/Stadium.jpg




With that said, the stadium helps built the atmosphere of the ceremonies. Just look at Sydney's ceremonies, the venue helps a lot. Same goes with Athens, which spent around $400-million on stadium renovations and a new roof - which does not include the $90-million they spent on the hole for the lake during the opening.

If Vancouver went ahead with both phases of the BC Place reno plan for 2010, it would be by far the most substantial Olympic Stadium renovation for the Winter Games - ever. B.C. Place, I believe, is also the largest Winter Games Olympic Stadium ever.





With Salt Lake, Rice Eccles went through a US$50-million renovation in time for the Games (46,000 seats).
http://k43.pbase.com/u7/talshiarr/large/1258705.RiceEcclesNight2.jpg
http://k53.pbase.com/u7/talshiarr/large/1258704.RiceEcclesNight1.jpg
http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/1147648.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1939057D9939C83F106B3CA79F39A4D12E05A5397277B4DC33E
(from left to right: 2008 Republican Crazy Presidential Candidate Romney, President Bush, Rogge)

[twoNeurons]

Yeah, about 1,321,851,888 (http://www.google.ca/search?q=Population+of+China&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a) reasons. :D

[towerguy3]

BREAKING NEWS FROM NW: MORE TROUBLE WITH DOME ROOF

I keep telling you guys, there is serious problems with that roof and we are going to have a major incident and people are goint to get hurt.

If they don't get a Retractable Roof on before 2010, there is going to be another incident. I could bet a steak on that. Read this:

More trouble with the roof at BC Place stadium.
Vancouver/CKNW(AM980)

5/23/2008


Sounds like there could be more trouble with the roof at BC Place stadium.

It was a big topic in the legislature today.

The NDP repeatedly went after minister responsible Stan Hagen over an alert that was issued......two days before the premier went public with word we'd be getting a retractable roof.

".........Mr. Speaker there was a deflation alert two days before the announcement. Was the minister aware of that or not???"

Minister Hagen went to great lengths to avoid actually answering the question, and instead went time-travelling through various moments in provincial history.

"...............I was here when the NDP opposed building the original BC Place stadium! I was here, Mr. Speaker, when the NDP opposed Expo 86!"

In January of 2006 part of the dome roof came flapping loose during a strong windstorm.
The provincial Liberals say the roof at BC Place is safe.

[towerguy3]

A deflation alert? This is huge news. That means there could be something structurally wrong with the roof as is.

[mr.x]

^ it was human error again:


Stadium roof collapse averted

By BOB MACKIN

B.C. Place Stadium's air-supported fabric roof was in danger of falling down, just two days before Premier Gordon Campbell went there to announce it would get a retractable roof by 2011.

A source told 24 hours that air pressure fell dramatically and the roof was deflating at 11:55 a.m. on May 14. The incident was safely resolved, but the source said the automated system of fans and dampers needs an overhaul to prevent trouble when the 2010 Winter Olympics open at B.C. Place on Feb. 12, 2010.

Warren Buckley, CEO for taxpayer-owned stadium landlord B.C. Pavilion Corporation, claimed a control room operator noticed a slight decrease in air pressure and dispatched a security guard who found workers using a diesel generator near an open door. The door allowed air to escape rapidly, but was closed and the air pressure returned to normal, he said.

WorkSafe BC, the provincial workplace health and safety regulator, has noted numerous complaints about the use of diesel equipment inside the stadium.

Buckley said the air-support system that keeps the Teflon-coated fibreglass roof aloft is not earmarked for replacement before the 2010 Games. He said the dampers are brand new and the fan system is constantly monitored.

Several NDP MLAs grilled Stan Hagen, the Liberal minister responsible for B.C. Place, during Question Period in the B.C. Legislature on Friday afternoon. At first he rattled off a list of projects opposed by the NDP since the 1980s. He did not answer whether he was aware of the May 14 incident, but eventually said the stadium roof is inspected daily and is safe. He did not comment on the air-support system.

"Given that it's going to be the venue for such an important event, they should really turn their mind to it," said NDP critic Norm Macdonald after Question Period. "We should never be in a place to be worrying about the reliablility of the roof."

The 25-year-old stadium's roof ripped and collapsed under the weight of snow, ice and slush after a Jan. 5, 2007 storm because the roof was not heated. Management branded it a "controlled deflation."

[mooks28]

If they don't get a Retractable Roof on before 2010, there is going to be another incident. I could bet a steak on that. Read this:



Why on earth would you bet money on people getting hurt? :koko:

[Cypherus]

Why on earth would you bet money on people getting hurt? :koko:

That's not his point. Anyways, it's a shame something wasn't done about this roof a few years ago. Vancouver's Olympics would be tainted across the centuries if the roof deflated on 60,000 spectators during the opening or closing ceremonies.

[cornholio]

That's not his point. Anyways, it's a shame something wasn't done about this roof a few years ago. Vancouver's Olympics would be tainted across the centuries if the roof deflated on 60,000 spectators during the opening or closing ceremonies.

Bad publicity is still publicity and sometimes bad publicity is better then good publicity. I really believe that if the roof deflated during the ceremonies then the net benefit would be positive for our city though thats something that would be hard to calculate. Its all about ramming the name Vancouver in to peoples heads, spending millions on a perfect and stunning ceremony is pretty hard and not guaranteed to work, a embarrassing accident works much better. I can tell you that the only Olympic city other than Montreal that I can name between the 60's and 80's is Munich. Believe me when I say that this is not a bad thing for Munich.

Just my two cents.

[Rusty Gull]

Unfortunately, if the roof collapsed during the Olympic Games -- or worse, during the opening or closing ceremonies -- it would be an event that would certainly make Vancouver a household name around the world. And not in a positive way.

[crazyjoeda]

Bad publicity is still publicity and sometimes bad publicity is better then good publicity. I really believe that if the roof deflated during the ceremonies then the net benefit would be positive for our city though thats something that would be hard to calculate. Its all about ramming the name Vancouver in to peoples heads, spending millions on a perfect and stunning ceremony is pretty hard and not guaranteed to work, a embarrassing accident works much better. I can tell you that the only Olympic city other than Montreal that I can name between the 60's and 80's is Munich. Believe me when I say that this is not a bad thing for Munich.

Just my two cents.


That is twisted, but you have a point. Still it takes a long time for people to forget something, like why Munich is on the map. It's a beautiful city but its far from Germanys largest city, but for me it comes to mind as easily as Berlin and Frankfurt.

But it would be better if people take away only good memories from Vancouver's Games rather than have Vancouver become a household name for a disaster.

Luckily, I think it is extremely unlikely that the roof will deflate during the games. BC Place stood for over 20 years before deflating in a snow storm after months of extreme weather.

[eduardo88]

That is twisted, but you have a point. Still it takes a long time for people to forget something, like why Munich is on the map. It's a beautiful city but its far from Germanys largest city, but for me it comes to mind as easily as Berlin and Frankfurt.


Munich only comes to mind for you cause of the olympics? what about the fact that it's germany's 3rd largest city, argueable it's most affluent, the capital of bayern...and must i mention: Oktoberfest...

[cornholio]

Munich is a important city but the fact is that because of the tragedy that happened during their Olympics the city is much more well known. Anyways its all marketing, you know it doesnt really matter how you ram a name in to someones head the only thing that matters is that you actually ram it in there. Im sure most people know Munich held the summer games in the 70's, im also sure that most people cant name the other cities that held the summer games in the 70's or 80's or 60's.
Here i named three completely insignificant towns of the top of my head.
Maythorpe
Walkerton
Lockerbie
I bet that most of you know of most of them, and many of you can probably find them on a map fairly easily. I can also bet that if you were driving by chances are pretty decent that you might just stop on your way, maybe to just check it out or to just fill up your car because to you (subconsciously) it is a known town, you know of it so it feels more comfortable to stop in it, even if you know of it because of some very negative event.
Anyways im getting way of topic again.

My whole point was that a embarrassing accident such as a deflated bc place roof during the opening ceremonies in reality is not really a bad thing, infact Vancouver would likely benefit in almost impossible to calculate ways.
Maythorpe
Walkerton
Lockerbie

[twoNeurons]

I never really thought of Munich as the Olympics until the movie came out. However, I did know it as the home of Oktoberfest and famous for pretzels and Beer Steins.

You could be right, but I think it only goes so far and for so long.

Lillehammer I could see, because I was alive at the time of the games. Other small cities (or smaller areas of cities) that have exposure from negative publicity that I can think of are "nagasaki, hiroshima, nanking, Jakarta, Kobe, Compton (part of LA), Dresden (Fire bombed WWII) and maybe a few others if I think hard.

[eduardo88]

I never really thought of Munich as the Olympics until the movie came out. However, I did know it as the home of Oktoberfest and famous for pretzels and Beer Steins.


Actually Bretzl (pretzel) is swabian

[johnjimbc]

that having the roof deflate during opening ceremonies (or at any time during the Olympics) would have ANY even REMOTE positive aspect for Vancouver.

That is, unless you believe people will think warmly and rally to visit the city deemed responsible for what would be universally considered the most embarrassing international public spectacle in history.

I can't believe this discussion has continued beyond the initial post. I suggest ideas for how the city and the Olympics will work to make absolutely sure that does NOT happen.

[cornholio]

Ok i promise this is my last post on the topic. Marketing is not about conjuring up warm and fuzzy feelings about something, otherwise a guy kicking another guy in the nuts wouldent be such a great way to market Burritos. Marketing is all about getting a name in the head and thats it, it can then also go further and try to link that name to certain feelings or other memories to attempt to increase the chances of stirring it up at opportune times. So you can use, comedy, tragedy, drama, sad commercials, evil commercials, bad commercials, annoying commercials, it really doesnt matter so long as it stands out a rams a name or idea in to someones head...Its one reason I hate commercials and think they should be illegal, because its not advertisement but rather forced brain washing. So back to BC place, im sure no one really wants the roof to deflate, including me but really the facts say that it doesnt seem to be able to have a negative impact on the city and marketing of the Vancouver name brand(which is really the whole point of the games). Anyways all I was trying to do is play devils advocate here, everyone said it would be horrible, I tried to look at the facts and take a different approach and say wait a minuit it wouldn't be bad for the city and it would help accomplish exactly what we are trying to do, that is market the Vancouver name brand. Also its important to mention that there are obvious negatives with such a incident, but their significantly outweighed every time by the positives.
Now that I was thinking about the Olympics I remembered that horrid London logo, and now im going to be checking to see the flight specials to London to see if I can take a trip since I havent been there in a while and enjoy the city...all thanks to the worst Olympic logo ever, or maybe its not so bad after all.

[twoNeurons]

the facts say that it doesnt seem to be able to have a negative impact on the city and marketing of the Vancouver name brand(which is really the whole point of the games).

So true it's laughable. The Olympics ceased becoming a venue to promote harmony through sports a LONG time ago. If anything it polarizes national sentiment, pitting one country against another.

Ask not what you can do in the Olympics, but what the Olympics brand can do for you!:D

[jlousa]

Forgetting about marketing for now.
The roof will not deflate. Heck when the panel burst in the snow storm (due to human error) the roof did not deflate, if you remember they had to make the desicion to deflate the roof to prevent more damage. Should a panel somehow burst the remaining fans will automatically power up and keep the roof up. Even in the case of a complete power outage, it would take 2-3 hours for the roof to deflate (with no tears).
Seems odd that in 25yrs we've only had 1 deflation which was caused due to human error yet people are convinced there could be one during the olympics. Pretty sure staff are going to be on their toes during the games.

[LeftCoaster]

If they don't get a Retractable Roof on before 2010, there is going to be another incident. I could bet a steak on that.

Really? Well I'm hungry...

[towerguy3]

Yes it was a controlled deflation. What did you expect them to do, leave the roof up indefinitely with air blasting out the hole and the roof bopping up and down with speakers and lights swaying back and forth and falling down??!

With 60,000 people inside, I'm sure the plan is to turn all 16 fans on full blast to blow the roof completely off the building.

Better that than the roof falling down onto people, right? Yes, that is indeed the plan.

The roof was coming down anyways as the air was rushing out of the hole, so in order to slow the drop of the roof, they turned on more fans to control the rate of drop.

Only when the roof was fully down did they turn OFF the fans.

And how do you expect them to so finely control the ventilation during Flame time when just two days before the Premier made his announcement the alarm bells went off in the control room simply due to the effect of a door being left open?

If the roof is that sensitive to pressure variations that a simple door being left open would get alarm bells ringing in the control room, I sure would like to know how you figure sucking air from the cauldron is somehow going to keep the roof from sagging.

[towerguy3]

Jlousa I'm going to buy you a steak. I'm not really acknowledging I lost the bet but I'll buy you one, just not too big please. You can buy me a 7 up.

Can we all meet on the 19th? How many are you are in?

I need someone's help in organizing this please.

[jlousa]

Didn't Mike K talk about a meet coming up soon?
We should just do it then.

[towerguy3]

okay, you let me know...

[jlousa]

Not much new, but worth the read.

May 28, 2008
BC Place owners plan retractable roof for stadium
RICHARD GILBERT
staff writer

The owners of BC Place stadium are planning major upgrades, which include a new retractable roof.
However, the new roof won’t be built in time for the opening and closing ceremonies of the 2010 Winter Olympics.
The City of Vancouver and the Crown corporation that manages BC Place stadium, BC Pavilion Corporation (PavCo), are working on a plan to allow development on the property around B.C. Place. The main objective of this joint initiative is to finance basic repairs and maintenance on the building, as well as major upgrades.
Premier Campbell recently announced that the air-supported Teflon dome roof at BC Place stadium will be replaced with a retractable roof. The upgrades to the stadium will occur in two phases
“As much of the preparatory work on the roof as possible will be done prior to the 2010 games. The remaining work to install the new roof will be completed over an estimated eight months after the games are over. This is exactly how BC Place was planned and built more than 25 years ago,” said PavCo chairman David Podmore.
“By waiting until after 2010 to complete the retractable roof, we’ll get better competitive pricing.”
Renovations to suites, seating, washrooms and concession stands, and enhancement of the existing roof liner are being undertaken, so that the stadium can host the opening and closing ceremonies of the 2010 Olympic Games.
According to Podmore, the refurbishments will cost about $ 4 million, with a large part of this money being used to improve accessibility for people with disabilities.
The familiar white Teflon air-supported roof of BC Place will be replaced by a retractable roof after the 2010 Winter Olympics in Vancouver.
After the 2010 Olympic Games, the rehabilitation work will include replacing the air-supported Teflon dome roof with a retractable roof.
Both phases are expected to go out to tender within five months, subject to design, completion of a business case and cost-benefit analysis, and government approval.
“Once we’ve completed our design and planning, we’ll finalize the budget and, subject to provincial government approval, get a fixed price contract with a guaranteed timeline, explained Podmore.”
PavCo asked for tenders for replacing the current roof from the three companies in the world that build air-supported structures – Bird Air, Fabri-tec and Hi-Tec.
It also decided to look at whether a more modern form of roof could be built.
A retractable roof by itself will cut energy costs for BC Place by one-third, which is about $535,000 annually.
An additional $100,000 annually will be realized through operational savings.
For example, the stadium will no longer need air-lock doors to support the roof.
“We support the decision to complete the new roof after the games and are very familiar with the savings that can be found when construction is undertaken under the right timing.” said John Furlong, Vancouver Olympic Committee CEO.
Podmore also plans to replace all the seats and the main floor slab, which has been damaged over the years and doesn’t have up to date electrical plugs and wiring.
Green sustainable features will also be included.
Generating electricity with photovoltaic cells and using geothermal heating and cooling will further increase the energy efficiency of the building.
The 2010 Olympic Winter Games opening ceremony will take place in the 60,000-seat BC Place Stadium on February 12, 2010, with the closing ceremony to follow about two weeks later.
During the games, nightly victory ceremonies will also be held at the stadium.
The Paralympic Winter Games Opening Ceremony will be held at BC Place Stadium on March 12, 2010.
Development of commercial and residential property on the lands around BC Place are expected to generate more than $100 million towards the cost of the new roof and upgrades.
Additional revenue will come from new sponsorships and expanded business opportunities.

[mr.x]

According to Podmore, the refurbishments will cost about $ 4 million, with a large part of this money being used to improve accessibility for people with disabilities.

In that case, this is nothing new. The $4-million is what VANOC had budgeted on comsetic and accessibility renovations for BC Place since 2003.

[miniaturesnickers]

^^^

I think that that's just someone getting their numbers crossed.

I don't believe the renos have been put to tender yet, and if it has, it certainly hasn't been for very long. That and Podmore has refused to talk about numbers thus far.

I wouldn't be surprised if the seating replacement alone cost more than $4 million.

I believe VANOC's still throwing in $4 million for accesibility improvements, as per their news release.

[mr.x]

^ hopefully you're right.

I'm quite sure the seating replacement will cost much more than $4-million. For comparison's sake, it cost $3-million to replace the Pacific Coliseum's 15,000 seats in time for the 2006 World Juniors. I'd peg the BC Place seat replacement cost at between $9-12 million.


To think that the people in charge thought they could actually get away with $4-million in "cosmetic and accessibility renovations" for BC Place.....it's amazing that these incompetent individuals have been thinking this was possible for 5 years. It's almost like they forgot how important the Olympic Stadium was.

[deasine]

well from day 1, they weren't really worried about this stadium at all. If they did, we would've had a new roof under construction right now. sigh =(

[LeftCoaster]

From the previous plans I had seen (preliminary) they were just discussing removing the worst seats, and not an entire seat replacement... hence the 4 million dollar figure. I would be quite surprised if they redid every single seat... then again I was quite surprised about the retractrable roof so maybe this one will be another pleasant one too.

[miniaturesnickers]

That doesn't account for the suite upgrades, new concessions, etc that have all been promised. That and the "enhancements to the current roof liner."

If one takes each part of the renovation on its own, it probably doesn't look like too much, but when all put together, you'll no doubt end up with a much larger figure than $4 million. I suspect that the $50 million figure that's been tossed around a few times is likely closer to the actual number. That said, even if Podmore is saying $4 million for the renos, which again I highly doubt, VANOC is still contributing its $4 million to accessibility improvements... so at the very least, if this obvious misquote is fact, we're getting an $8 million improvement.

I think however that VANOC was fairly confident that the renos would happen, and perhaps even pressuring the Gov't behind closed doors, though that's just an assumption PavCo in each year of their business plan going back a few years has made reference to evaluating what upgrades were needed as part of the Games.

[towerguy3]

Does the roof even need an inner lining attached?

Cause the 4 triangular panels around the rim including the panel that was replaced do not have an inner lining attached.

[officedweller]

The inner lining forms the bottom of the "duct" used to channel the warm air to melt snow on the roof - but may be removed for "looks".

[johnjimbc]

that at this late stage of the game, and even with a huge "announcement" a couple of weeks back, that no one can quite piece together an actual LIST of improvements that will be completed and the timetable for them (pre and post Olympics).

It just seems bizarre to me. I still don't have a clear image of how extensive . . . or how minor . . . the "improvements" will be for the Olympic timeframe.

I appreciate everything that folks have said here and for the many articles on the subject, but the caveats - or complete disparities - in the described improvements are a bit disconcerting.

I am sure there must be - or at least hope there is - someone in the know with a comprehensive list of must-have improvements (and like-to-have improvements if possible) for the opening ceremonies.

And I hope at some point some one actually sees fit to publish that list for the public.

[bils]

that's prolly cuz they don't want to promise anything before the olympics. they'll just work as fast as they can, and whatever gets done will be done, and whatever is leftover will be done after.

[johnjimbc]

I think you're probably correct, and that is actually what concerns me. At some point they had better have a list and a project plan. It's not like me spot cleaning my home on a Saturday afternoon . . . there has to be a pretty detailed plan.

Imagine hosting a big dinner for a couple dozen people and saying, "We'll just start cooking in the morning and see what we have done by the time people show up."

Sounds like a recipe for embarrassment to me.

I am hoping it is more like them having lists and plans that are in work (we are less than 2 years away now), but they just don't want to over-promise so they just are holding back on the details.

That is my hope, anyway.

[WarrenC12]

I think you guys are getting pretty worked up about nothing.

Lets be honest, they could hold the ceremony in there tomorrow and it wouldn't be a disaster or embarrassment as a building. I'd be more concerned about the product that will be on the ice (I'm sure they will put a temporary rink in there) for the ceremony itself than the building it will be held in.

[towerguy3]

The Whitecaps signed a Letter of Intent with Pavco to play in BC Place, not a 5 year Lease yet.

How much weight does a Letter of Intent have legally? Is it binding on both Pavco and the Whitecaps to close a deal?

[jlousa]

A letter of intent has the same legal bearing as an engagement ring. Should mean something, but doesn't guarntee anything, but it looks pretty.

[miniaturesnickers]

Both the VANOC and Government press releases contain a list of improvements we can expect pre-2010. I'd say that's probably the bare minimum anyway.

The interior renovations and the roof I believe have yet to be put out to tender, and likely will be soon. We'll no doubt see a list then, as they need to know what to ask for.

If it gets to be this time in 2009 and nothing's been done, I think THEN we can panic. For now let's just enjoy the sun.