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View Full Version : Cheyenne, WY of Two Minds About Denver-Like Growth



Evergrey
11-04-2008, 01:13 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/04/us/04cheyenne.html

Cheyenne of Two Minds About Denver-Like Growth

By KIRK JOHNSON

CHEYENNE, Wyo. — This city once dreamed in lofty superlatives — that it could become a major metropolis, axis of the Intermountain West and heavyweight hub of the High Plains.

But by the late 1800s, Denver, 95 miles south in Colorado, had won the contest. Gold strikes and good water supplies made the difference. Cheyenne gradually retreated to its roots as a wind-blown provincial town, dependent on a cold war-era missile base and on Wyoming’s tiny state government for jobs.

Now the Denver area’s relentless growth, with its satellite cities and suburbs that march north toward Wyoming, is grabbing Cheyenne by the lapels.

But maps are political documents, too, and the poll numbers suggest that the same newcomers who have reshaped the Denver metropolitan economy may now be leading Colorado, once-dependably Republican, into the Democratic column by supporting Senator Barack Obama for president. Mr. Obama is ahead in most polls in Colorado going into Tuesday’s election. Wyoming, by contrast, with just over 500,000 people, less than one-tenth of Colorado’s population, is among the most stalwart of Republican states and shows little sign of budging.

The result is not exactly a collision, but rather a kind of accordion affect, like the two-headed Pushmi-Pullyu from the Dr. Dolittle stories. One force is pulling the two states closer as the juggernaut of urbanization shifts the economic and demographic landscape; the other is carving out a deeper separation as most of Wyoming holds firm to its cowboy, go-it-alone ethos.

Change for old Cheyenne, population 55,000, is the one certainty.

Wyoming’s low-rise capital city has long been isolated by virtue of its founding as a railroad town; it was plunked in the state’s southeast corner not for loveliness or riches but because it was midway between the Union Pacific’s other major depots of the 1860s, in Omaha and Ogden, Utah. Now, it is braced for impact.

About 16,000 passenger vehicles cross the border every day, at least 2,200 of them commuters to jobs on one side of the border or the other, according to Wyoming state figures. The Wyoming Legislature, where “mass transit” is seldom heard, took testimony in October from a state consultant who recommended that the state start conferring with planners in Denver who are hoping to build a commuter rail line of 300 miles or more from Wyoming to New Mexico.

“Economics is what we are really after,” said State Senator Michael Von Flatern, a Republican and co-chairman of the Transportation, Highways and Military Affairs Committee. “Denver will be a big megalopolis, and if things move forward on the rail line, and Colorado does their part, I would want Wyoming to tie in.”

People like John Brazzale, a 47-year-old electrician from Cheyenne who has worked here and in Denver, say that they think the knot has already been tied. Now it is time for the honeymoon.

“Something’s coming,” Mr. Brazzale said as he rewired lampposts outside the Union Pacific Depot on a recent morning — old-fashioned bulbs out, energy-efficient fluorescent lights in.

“Just look at the hotels that are going up around here,” he said. “They’re not building them for fun.”

Mr. Brazzale, who described himself as a union man and a Democrat, said that he welcomed the change, and that, who knows, in 20 years, Cheyenne could even become a kind of high-tech wunderkind like Boulder, a Denver satellite known for its fancy restaurants, liberals and geeks.

In a hint of that possible future, the National Center for Atmospheric Research in Boulder, a climate research institute financed by the National Science Foundation, announced last year that its next-generation supercomputer center would be built in Cheyenne. Scheduled to open in 2011, the center will foster interaction between researchers from Colorado and Wyoming who will now have reason to meet in Cheyenne.

Still, Ron Willis is among those who think the old political boundaries will hold, even as things change.

“Colorado is becoming a more Democratic state, but Wyoming will remain Republican,” said Mr. Willis, 32, who runs a state-federal program to help residents weatherize their homes to conserve energy. “I think the two states will remain separated.”

Politics aside, Mr. Willis said that Wyoming still held a monopoly on real Western culture and would not surrender the claim to Denver, regardless of dollar signs.

“Denver has never really been the West,” he said, repeating a commonly heard insult around here that, in rowdier days, might have sparked a fistfight.

At the Cheyenne Area Convention and Visitors Bureau, the group’s president and chief executive, Darren Rudloff, said he thought a greater linkage with Denver was inevitable and mostly positive.

The three conjoined metropolitan areas of northeastern Colorado — Denver-Aurora, Boulder and Fort Collins-Loveland — now press right up to the Wyoming border. Taken together, they are among the fastest-growing areas in the nation over the last two decades, with a population increase of about 44 percent, to just under three million people, according to the most recent Census Bureau estimates.

“I don’t think there’s any business resistance,” Mr. Rudloff said. “But there would be, I think, in some quarters, resistance to losing too much of the Cheyenneness — there would be some push back.”

On the other hand, Mr. Rudloff added, many Wyoming residents have already written off Cheyenne, believing that the city has fallen off the map already and into Colorado. “We’re not Colorado and we’re not totally Wyoming, according to some people,” he said. “So we’re kind of stuck in the middle.”

But if geography is destiny, there is perhaps a historical twist as well. Political and business leaders here say the growth of metropolitan Denver’s population north toward Wyoming, which has no income tax, sharpens the business allure of Cheyenne as a commuting destination for more and more Coloradans, making the city a legitimate contender with Denver for the first time in generations and stirring those old dreams of greatness.

Laura Adams, an accountant with the state government, said she welcomed the new economic connections. “It can only help Cheyenne,” she said. “A lot of people still don’t even know where it is.”

But do not get her started on politics.

Ms. Adams, 51, who described herself as a strong supporter of Senator John McCain, the Republican presidential nominee, is unhappy with Colorado’s political direction and with the Denver news media, which often serves Cheyenne as an afterthought. After the Democrats held their national convention in Denver in August, Ms. Adams said, too many locals fell in love with the party.

“I listen to a radio station that comes from Denver,” she said. “I had to turn it off. I couldn’t stand it any more.”

Top Of The Park
11-04-2008, 02:35 PM
Wyoming is what it is..the least populated state in the Union.....can't do much in the way of change without the population base...But on the good side of things, one can still buy 40 acres for a song if one can take the wind and isolation...;)

Cirrus
11-04-2008, 06:08 PM
I visited Cheyenne once when I lived in Boulder, just to see what it was like.

And you know what? I actually thought it was a pretty nice little city. Not lively or active enough, sure, but there is a very solid base of good urbanism just begging to be used at full potential.

It has a very Parisian-scale building wall downtown:
http://denverskyscrapers.com/urbancolorado/images/photos/cheyenne/lincolnway03-block.jpg

... And who could hate the train station?
http://denverskyscrapers.com/urbancolorado/images/photos/cheyenne/trainstation02.jpg

SnyderBock
11-06-2008, 01:16 PM
Wyoming, by contrast, with just over 500,000 people, less than one-tenth of Colorado’s population, is among the most stalwart of Republican states and shows little sign of budging.

“Colorado is becoming a more Democratic state, but Wyoming will remain Republican,” said Mr. Willis, 32, who runs a state-federal program to help residents weatherize their homes to conserve energy. “I think the two states will remain separated.”

Political and business leaders here say the growth of metropolitan Denver’s population north toward Wyoming, which has no income tax, sharpens the business allure of Cheyenne as a commuting destination for more and more Coloradans, making the city a legitimate contender with Denver for the first time in generations and stirring those old dreams of greatness.

I was just thinking, 500,000 people in the entire state. They say they will always be a Republican State. Then the article talks about the growing attractiveness of Cheyenne to Northern Coloradoans (because of no income tax in Wyoming).

A High-Speed Rail line from Albuquerque to Cheyenne (particularly that part from Denver to Cheyenne), will only father increase the desirability of Cheyenne.

So really, how many Colorado Independents and Democrats would it take to move to the Cheyenne area to serious change the political makeup of the state of Wyoming? As little as 25,000 Independents and Democrats moving north of the border to escape income tax, could have impacts in elections.

Also take into consideration that Wyoming's neighbor to the north (Montana) is becoming a Democratic (blue) state. That's the Rocky Mountain states, New Mexico, Colorado, Wyoming and Montana. Wyoming is the last holdout for going blue and as I pointed out, it won't take very many Coloradoans moving to Wyoming, to have significant impacts in future elections.

Wyoming is a majority Republican state, but like all the Rocky Mountain states, the majority of the mountain towns tend to be more Independent and very conscious about the environment (because they live in such beauty).

Just thought I would point that out.

Thundertubs
11-06-2008, 02:38 PM
Interesting article. I like how the faintest rumblings of Colorado influence = "Denver-like growth."


the majority of the mountain towns tend to be more Independent and very conscious about the environment (because they live in such beauty).

But on the other hand, the desire to preserve and expand mining and logging jobs is just as strong. There are very few ways to support living in such isolated beauty. It's often a newcomers vs oldtimers issue in such towns.

Echo Park
11-06-2008, 04:17 PM
Are there a lot of hipsters in Denver? what about minorities

i may want to move there

Cirrus
11-06-2008, 05:22 PM
No and no, at least not as I suspect you're used to.

The Denver version of the hipster wears lots and lots of North Face, loves hiking above all else, owns a pickup (a smaller one though, like a Tacoma), and in a few years will name his first-born child Granola.

Denver has lots of Hispanics, mostly Mexicans. Otherwise it's pretty white. There are some blacks and some Asians, but not like the coasts.

ski82
11-06-2008, 06:34 PM
Also take into consideration that Wyoming's neighbor to the north (Montana) is becoming a Democratic (blue) state. That's the Rocky Mountain states, New Mexico, Colorado, Wyoming and Montana. Wyoming is the last holdout for going blue and as I pointed out, it won't take very many Coloradoans moving to Wyoming, to have significant impacts in future elections.

Wyoming is a majority Republican state, but like all the Rocky Mountain states, the majority of the mountain towns tend to be more Independent and very conscious about the environment (because they live in such beauty).

Just thought I would point that out.

I wouldn't call Montana blue or even suggest that it may turn blue. Politics there is unlike any other state. They take New Hampshire's motto to heart. Truly a mind of their own. And I love it!

Cirrus
11-06-2008, 08:15 PM
New Hampshire is a blue state.

I'm just sayin'.

SnyderBock
11-06-2008, 10:45 PM
I wouldn't call Montana blue or even suggest that it may turn blue. Politics there is unlike any other state. They take New Hampshire's motto to heart. Truly a mind of their own. And I love it!

Your right, but they (Montana) are very Independent like Colorado. Colorado has about 1.2 million registered Democrats, over 1 million registered Independents and only just over 900,000 registered Republicans. That makes Colorado a three party state with the two largest being Demo rat and Independent. Montana is similar, as is New Mexico. And it won't take too many Coloradoans moving to Wyoming to switch that state to yellow.

sofresh808
11-07-2008, 02:47 AM
Your right, but they (Montana) are very Independent like Colorado. Colorado has about 1.2 million registered Democrats, over 1 million registered Independents and only just over 900,000 registered Republicans. That makes Colorado a three party state with the two largest being Demo rat and Independent. Montana is similar, as is New Mexico. And it won't take too many Coloradoans moving to Wyoming to switch that state to yellow.

If they're moving to Wyoming to escape taxes in Colorado, I seriously doubt they'll help make it purple or yellow, or anything but more conservative. Dunno if its only legend, but I heard Wyoming is the only state without a gay bar, maybe we can do something about that first to attract some blue state migration:cool:

JackStraw
11-07-2008, 04:11 PM
Are there a lot of hipsters in Denver? what about minorities

i may want to move there

Denver has a large amount of fippies for some reason. (wanna bee hippies). Kids that followed Phish, where long dreads, never shower, have hemp necklaces, and are only good when you need to pick up some herb.

Cirrus
11-07-2008, 06:44 PM
^
That is accurate.

Boquillas
11-07-2008, 07:17 PM
If I can weigh in here, at least re: Montana, I'd say the odds are better that MT cities might see Denver-like development in the coming decades before Wyoming does. Missoula, Billings, Great Falls and Bozeman are growing exponentially, are already full of west-coast "ex-pats" and aren't seen as nearly as conservative as Wyoming's larger cities (Jackson excepted). People looking to relocate also see Wyoming as much closer to a wholly rural lifestyle, Montana not so much. IMO Missoula, Kalispell/Whitefish and Bozeman represent the most potential for urban growth. Billings will continue its steady industrial growth, but Butte is shrinking in size. Like Cheyenne, Butte was once a rival to Denver for being central to the mountain west's commerce. It has shrunk over the years from having well over 100,000 people to about 30,000 now.

SnyderBock
11-07-2008, 10:00 PM
I suppose Colorado Republicans might all start to flea to Wyoming. You know, go build some suburban sprawl in Cheyenne to get away from the city, traffic, taxes, etc,... ;P

IdahoMountainBoy
11-08-2008, 02:37 PM
If I can weigh in here, at least re: Montana, I'd say the odds are better that MT cities might see Denver-like development in the coming decades before Wyoming does. Missoula, Billings, Great Falls and Bozeman are growing exponentially, are already full of west-coast "ex-pats" and aren't seen as nearly as conservative as Wyoming's larger cities (Jackson excepted).

Can I ask what you mean by "exponential growth?" I understand tome towns like Bozeman are growing but was unaware of what was happening in Missoula, Billings, Great Falls, etc.

And sorry to derail the thread, but I don't take this piece very seriously. I've driven through the Cheyenne CO/WY border recently many times and see nothing that indicates increased development.

Boquillas
11-08-2008, 07:58 PM
Yes, exponential was hyperbole. Neither Montana nor Wyoming is seeing the anywhere near the kind of growth the other Rocky Mountain West states are seeing. Some of this may have to do with climate and how remote the states are, relatively speaking, from other population centers, but I have no idea.

According to the Western Rural Development Center (http://wrdc.usu.edu/files/uploads/Population/Montana_WEB.pdf), Missoula County and Yellowstone County have experience 33.4% and 27.5% increases in population since 1980. I was mistaken with Great Falls, which has seen about a 2% decrease in the same time. Gallatin County, where I live, has seen an 89% increase (to almost 80,00 people, or roughly the size of Cheyenne's Laramie County) and Flathead County (Kalispell) has seen a 60% increase in growth.

These nos. are certainly minor compared to other states in the region, but they are larger than what Wyoming (http://wrdc.usu.edu/files/uploads/Population/Wyoming_Brief.pdf) is seeing. Laramie county (Cheyenne) grew by 24%, while the state's only other metropolitan county, Natrona (Casper) shrunk by 2%. The smaller a metro's population, the easier it should be to see major % increase with only small numeric increases in population, and Cheyenne doesn't seem to reflect that. On the other side of the state, Teton County (Jackson) has seen a 108% increase in population, though it still remains under 20,000.

Cheyenne is growing, but I agree its growth is not particularly exceptional.

The Agonist
11-09-2008, 12:12 AM
No and no, at least not as I suspect you're used to.

The Denver version of the hipster wears lots and lots of North Face, loves hiking above all else, owns a pickup (a smaller one though, like a Tacoma), and in a few years will name his first-born child Granola.
.

Wow that sounds like they are stuck in 1980s Pacific Northwest.

SnyderBock
11-09-2008, 07:41 AM
It's a unique micro-culture which has adopted some things from 1980's Seattle "Dirt/Goth culture." But it is much more than that. The culture will also remind visitors very much of San Fransisco "Eco-Tech/Tree Huggers" in way. Yet there will always be very obvious, uniquely "Colorado" overtones to the Denver culture. A culture dominated by a people that need only look west to the Rockies, feel the sun shining on their shoulders and instantly have all worries fade away. In Seattle, they have too many cloudy days for that.



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