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View Full Version : "City of Kitchener ponders growth through 2031"


DHLawrence
Dec 2, 2008, 5:13 AM
http://news.therecord.com/News/article/452570

December 01, 2008
Terry Pender
Record staff

KITCHENER — This city is planning now for a population that is expected to increase by 100,000 by 2031.

And that means several neighbourhoods will be targeted for high-density housing and mixed-use developments, city councillors were told Monday.

Staff tabled a draft Kitchener’s growth management strategy.

Coun. John Gazzola wondered if the projected increase of 100,000 people is realistic.

“What s it based on? How good of a figure is that?” he asked.

Alain Pinard, the city s interim director of planning, assured him the population projection is sound.

“Although the numbers do seem high at first glance, they are only slightly higher than our highest growth years,” Pinard said.

Kitchener's population was 215,000 in 2006.

During the past five years the city has added about 1,750 new units of housing, Brandon Sloan, a senior planner, said.

“If you took the last five years and projected it forward at the same rate we would hit that number,” Sloan said.

But Sloan does not want city councillors and residents to focus on whether 100,000 new residents are added by 2031.

“Whether your hit that number in growth projections in 2031 or 2051 or 2071, doesn’t it make sense to plan for it now, so if and when it does happen we have the best plan in place?”

Provincial legislation, called Places to Grow, requires every municipality in Ontario have plans in place that will, beginning in 2015, direct 40 per cent of all new growth into existing neighbourhoods.

The objective is to reduce urban sprawl, ease traffic congestion, improve air quality and create more density, with walkable neighbourhoods, mixed-use developments and superior public transit.

“Kitchener tomorrow will be more walkable, more transit-supported, more urban,” Sloan said.

The city’s urban planners have ear-marked about 47 different neighourhoods for what they call intensification — a variety of housing types mixed with stores and professional services.

These areas include downtown Kitchener, which expects 10,000 new residents or jobs by 2031, the area around Fairway Road and King Street East, King Street West, Queen Street from Joseph Street to the rail line, the neighbourhood around Frederick Street as it crosses the expressway and the area around Highland and Westmount roads.

“We have already identified the areas that are most suitable for intensification,” Pinard said in an interview.

“Good urban design can go a long way to address concerns with intensification.”

Copies of the draft growth management plan can be found on the city’s website. Council and staff are looking for feedback from residents before adopting a final version of the plan in January.

tpender@therecord.com

I'd just like to add:

- Fairway Road as a whole could use a great deal more intensification, not just at that intersection (which does like a fossil from the 1960s).

- Frederick near the Expressway would be improved dramatically if they built something more useful on the site currently occupied by Frederick Mall; that building is a total dive.

rapid_business
Dec 5, 2008, 6:45 AM
Coun. John Gazzola wondered if the projected increase of 100,000 people is realistic.
“What's it based on? How good of a figure is that?” he asked.

Ahhh...the bright minds that get elected in municipal politics..."don't trust the experts...trust your uneducated, gut instinct!"

KW4Life
Dec 5, 2008, 6:35 PM
Ahhh...the bright minds that get elected in municipal politics..."don't trust the experts...trust your uneducated, gut instinct!"

How the hell is "what's it based on," an invalid question? Do you know he is uneducated? Isn't that a question that should be asked by politicians unless already explained?

Why are they projecting higher than record growth?

rapid_business
Dec 5, 2008, 10:46 PM
I'm sorry, you're right, it came off a little harsh. All I'm saying is that it is a fairly stable estimate based on hard number and published in the provincial document, the Places to Grow Act, in 2006.

It isn't record growth at all. What it is, is 50% growth over 25 years. And that isn't even a 2% growth per annum as you need to factor in componded growth percentages.

For example, a city growing at 1% per annum (which is pretty small and stable) will double it's population in 70 years. 2% growth, means it will double in 35 years.

In KW's case, the metro area grew an average of 1.78% per annum from 2001 to 2006. So, doing the math, considering that is the maintained rate of growth, the metro area will double in size 39.3 years. As for growing by 50%, well...at the rate we calculated, it would be less then half that (remember, compound growth), so the estimated growth rate to get to the number of 100,000 by 2031 is even less then we've seen recently.

notmyfriends
Dec 8, 2008, 4:24 PM
I love math.

waterloowarrior
Jan 16, 2009, 9:56 PM
KGMS going to DTS for approval on Monday

http://www.kitchener.ca/city_hall/departments/devtech_services/planning/growth_management_strategy.html

http://wwuploads.googlepages.com/kitchener2031.jpg

DHLawrence
Jan 16, 2009, 11:13 PM
It's nice and dense, but a little slim. I know it's only 23 years from now, but I would have expected it to be a bit thicker than that. Still, it's a lot better than what we have now.

rapid_business
Jan 16, 2009, 11:18 PM
/\ lol...it's a nod at historical civic drawings, that's it. Hardly any real representation. The KGMS is what is more important there...

waterloowarrior
Jan 16, 2009, 11:23 PM
I like this recommendation... a lot of the applications are coming in or are already in for this area...


Investigate the Role of Fischer Hallman Roadsouth of Westmount Road

Determine the feasibility of establishing new greenfield mixed use nodes and corridor on Fischer Hallman Road between Westmount and Plains Road. This could help achieve greenfield density targets and establish an important transit link for the southwest side of the City. This would follow any recommendations from the Fischer Hallman Design Study which will help determine the role of the corridor. A new Planning Community could be established and higher priority given to the lands. Amendments to the Official Plan and direction regarding development applications in the area may be required.

Duke-Of-Waterloo
Jan 16, 2009, 11:41 PM
I like this recommendation... a lot of the applications are coming in or are already in for this area...


Investigate the Role of Fischer Hallman Roadsouth of Westmount Road

Determine the feasibility of establishing new greenfield mixed use nodes and corridor on Fischer Hallman Road between Westmount and Plains Road. This could help achieve greenfield density targets and establish an important transit link for the southwest side of the City. This would follow any recommendations from the Fischer Hallman Design Study which will help determine the role of the corridor. A new Planning Community could be established and higher priority given to the lands.


Ooooohhh the things I wish I could share about vacant Fischer-Hallman South lands. :yes: I currently work in the development industry in Waterloo Region and have a direct inside scoop (and I guess you could say impact as I am currently working on designing an interesting development in that area), but unfortunately none of it is public yet...but if all goes well, it will be good!

One thing I can say however is that the City of Kitchener has plans for a RIM-Park scale (minus the golf course and outdoor playing fields) recreation centre planned for Fischer-Hallman Road and Plains Road. Nothing is for sure yet though.

waterloowarrior
Jan 17, 2009, 12:24 AM
I like the park in Becker Estates :)

http://wwuploads.googlepages.com/beckerestates.jpg

(the marking is from a DTS demo control report)

http://wwuploads.googlepages.com/fish-huron-kitcnener.jpg

Cambridgite
Jan 17, 2009, 1:37 AM
Seems like we're increasingly moving into a modified grid pattern. :)

DHLawrence
Jan 17, 2009, 1:48 AM
Just need to alter the mixed-use/commercial pads to have smaller units on them, and we'll be in business! :)

rapid_business
Jan 17, 2009, 2:45 AM
Seems like we're increasingly moving into a modified grid pattern. :)
Such is the post-modern, suburban planning trend it appears.

Bauer_buyer
Jan 18, 2009, 5:04 AM
One thing I can say however is that the City of Kitchener has plans for a RIM-Park scale (minus the golf course and outdoor playing fields) recreation centre planned for Fischer-Hallman Road and Plains Road. Nothing is for sure yet though.[/QUOTE]

Thank you for that piece of info. but it begs the question, if eventually the two cities merge and become one why would there be a need for another monstrous development devoted solely to sports? We have RIM.
Are we just paying lip service to the "places to grow plan" which stresses core area growth or is this just another make work idea for planners and developers alike.
Enough already!

notmyfriends
Jan 18, 2009, 8:38 PM
Curse this Region for trying to find ways to keep people healthy and in shape.

Bauer_buyer
Jan 18, 2009, 9:39 PM
Curse this Region for trying to find ways to keep people healthy and in shape.

I don't see hordes of people at RIM "trying to keep themselves healthy"
Yes there are the various teams/events/individuals using the facilities but
it's small percentage of the population....and that's a fact....like it or not.

What I'd like to see is something like Waterloo's Rec. centre on Father David Drive...something that appeals more to the general population, which is more centrally located in Kitchener and do I dare suggest along the proposed new LTR?

DHLawrence
Jan 18, 2009, 10:46 PM
They should do something like that with the Aud if they build a new stadium on another site. It's already lightly used by the community, but it could be wholly turned over.

dunkalunk
Jan 18, 2009, 11:14 PM
^ That's just the excuse the region needs to build a larger stadium. Cheers!

Public facilities should be easy for the public to get to by being close to the public or by being wholly accessible by public transit lines. (public)

It would also be an excuse to help naturalize Schneider Creek.

DHLawrence
Jan 18, 2009, 11:51 PM
^ That's just the excuse the region needs to build a larger stadium. Cheers!

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic or not :shrug:

Duke-Of-Waterloo
Jan 19, 2009, 1:02 AM
Public facilities should be easy for the public to get to by being close to the public or by being wholly accessible by public transit lines. (public)


Holy public! :P

notmyfriends
Jan 19, 2009, 1:18 AM
I don't see hordes of people at RIM "trying to keep themselves healthy"
Yes there are the various teams/events/individuals using the facilities but
it's small percentage of the population....and that's a fact....like it or not.

What I'd like to see is something like Waterloo's Rec. centre on Father David Drive...something that appeals more to the general population, which is more centrally located in Kitchener and do I dare suggest along the proposed new LTR?

Yes, you are nothing if not a bastion of facts.

So the difference between that and Rim park minus golf and outdoor fields is... the central location? Anything else sicken you about it? And heaven help us if not 100% of the people around here are into getting themselves healthy yet. Embracing a culture that emphasizes that would help the future. The leagues at RIM all fill up very quickly, so another option seems viable to me. I'm sorry if I don't see the reasons why this is such a bad idea.

Duke-Of-Waterloo
Jan 19, 2009, 3:28 AM
What I'd like to see is something like Waterloo's Rec. centre on Father David Drive...something that appeals more to the general population, which is more centrally located in Kitchener

Interestingly enough, Kitchener had plans to build a large pool/aquatic recreation centre at the present day site of the UW Pharmacy Campus at King and Victoria. It was to be called Poseidon Adventure or something like that. The city was planning for this centre at the same time Waterloo was planning for RIM Park. Due to the obvious proposal for Poseidon Adventure to have a pool (hence the name...), Waterloo felt that there wouldn't be enough of a market to have a pool at RIM Park as well.

Here's one thing that pisses me off. Waterloo's leisure programs and facilities are far more superior than Kitchener's (and I say this even as a former Kitchener leisure service employee of 2 years). Waterloo charges non-residents of the city the exact same price as anyone else to use their facilities and programs/classes, while Kitchener charges an extra fee for non-residents. Waterloo should wake up and do the same, especially if they want to start taking care of their financial woes.

0sprey
Jan 19, 2009, 5:21 PM
I'm not sure charging the handful of "non-waterloo residents" another couple bucks is going to turn into giant wads of cash going into the Waterloo city coffers.

instead, what it might do, is turn away some of these 'non-waterloo residents' from using the facilities. Which will result in even less income to operate the facilities....

I understand your complaint, but sometimes forgetting about the money you 'could have' is better than losing the money you 'do have'.

waterloowarrior
Feb 7, 2009, 3:52 AM
KGMS Implementation phase 1 staff report (http://www.kitchener.ca/Files/Item/item15785_dts-09-023.pdf)