[SteelTown]

All Saints makes saintly choice
Church makes way for affordable condo units

June 17, 2009
Paul Wilson
The Hamilton Spectator
http://www.thespec.com/article/584279

Ten years ago, workers spent months carefully dismantling the bell tower at All Saints Church in downtown Hamilton.

Now the stage is set for all the stones at All Saints to come tumbling down.

The church has commanded the southeast corner of Hamilton's royal intersection since the 1870s.

But at King and Queen, as at churches everywhere, times have changed. Since the '60s, pews have emptied out. Too many churches, not enough people.

Back in 1974, somebody made a firm offer to buy the All Saints property for $350,000. The congregation turned it down. Bishop John Bothwell was not amused:

"For a couple of hundred people to maintain this enormous building, when there are three or four other Anglican parishes within a few blocks with similar depleted congregations and enormous buildings, seems to me to be questionable," the bishop said then.

"Of course, the people at All Saints disagree. They feel confident that renewal is close at hand ... God alone can know whether the right decision was made."

Renewal was not at hand. The congregation continued to erode. A church that held 400 now sees 60 or 70 on a Sunday.

There has been a big push for outreach, with a Friendship Centre that for years served people who struggle.

But the building is not so good for that. It is not accessible. It is a dim place, with small windows and dark wood. It is murder to heat. The stone, quarried in one direction and laid in another, is deteriorating.

Five months ago, a thick section of queen-sheet-sized plaster dropped from the ceiling, chopping up the wooden floor. Ever since, the congregation has met in the parish hall next door.

And in the late '90s, Mother Nature -- or maybe God Himself -- sent a message to All Saints that was hard to ignore. A moderate earthquake (Richter 5.4) shook the bell tower and it had to be pulled down.

Ever since, the congregation at All Saints has tried to find a future. And now they have voted. The church that Senator Samuel Mills built in 1872 because he wanted a place of worship closer to home is to come down. So will the century house next door that is the church's parish hall.

In their place, a nonprofit condo tower of up to 11 storeys is to rise. The proposal is now working its way through city hall and it's hoped work can begin in a year.

It was an agonizing decision for the congregation. As one man put it, "My head says yes, but not my heart." Still, he raised his hand in favour of the plan and so did everyone else.

Rector Paula Crippen says "it will be a sad day" when the church does come down, but that members are excited about the new space. All Saints is to get about 2,500 square feet on the main floor of the new complex. There could be a storefront presence on King Street, perhaps a cafe ministry.

The church does not have an historical designation, but is on the city's inventory of 6,500 buildings of interest.

"People will say, 'Why are they tearing down that lovely old building?'" admits Archdeacon Rick Jones. "But what's important for us is the ministry of the church ...

"We're not an historical society. This building worked 100 years ago. It doesn't work today."

He congratulates the people of All Saints. Their plan had to be approved by the diocese, which gave it a standing ovation.

Jones says the church understands the importance of the property, located across from the Scottish Rite. "Both the city and the church want the new building to fit into the streetscape in the most pleasing way possible."

The developer is a group called Options For Housing. In the past 16 years, it has built eight developments in the GTA, from the Distillery District to Scarborough. There are other projects in Vancouver, Montreal, Ottawa, Waterloo and Collingwood.

The units are good quality, but not luxurious, aimed at buyers with household incomes as low as $40,000. Conrad Zurini, a ReMax agent who chairs Hamilton's Affordable Housing Flagship, says the 84 units here would sell for $120,000 to $200,000.

The project is worth up to $15 million. The units are sold at cost. The company then gives condo buyers a second, interest-free mortgage equal to the difference between the cost and market value. That second mortgage only has to be repaid if the resident sells, so buyers rarely flip their units for a quick profit.

Zurini hopes to start holding buyer seminars at the All Saints parish hall in early fall.

[SteelTown]

http://www.tcarch.ca/images/projects/585.jpg

Queen Street Condominiums
- Hamilton, Ontario

Options for Homes not-for-profit condominium project on the site of an existing church, thoughtfully incorporating the materiality of the original building, while also recreating a place of worship.

[adam]

That rendering looks a lot like Joseph Brant Hospital in Burlington... :shrug:

[block43]

Reminiscent of commie block buildings...

[markbarbera]

I'll pass on judging a project's level of quality by squinting at a small low-res rendering without knowing any details about construction elements. What I do know is that this type of development is sorely needed in the downtown area. It's home ownership that is affordable, and it will bring more residents to the downtown area.

[holymoly]

Options for Homes is an interesting outfit. I went to one of their presentations and bought a condominium, but changed my mind and pulled out during the cooling-off period.

If I remember correctly, they make ownership more affordable like this: They offer all purchasers a loan toward the down payment. It's interest-free until you sell or decide to pay off the loan. At that point, the interest is determined: it's equal to the percentage your unit has risen in value -- so if you sell for 10% higher than you bought at, Options gets 10% on their loan. (I'm pretty sure you pay zero interest if the unit value hasn't risen.) They discourage renting out your unit; if you do rent it out, you have to give Options a percentage of the profit.

[adam]

This should attract some young professionals to live downtown - the loan with value-based interest sounds like a good start.

[jgrwatson]

I think this is a great idea. Seems to work well in the other cities mentioned.

Also, to intensify King is also a good idea - we need to meet Places to Grow targets anyways!

[bigguy1231]

It's a great location, but I am not so sure that it should be used for residential purposes. Seeing as it abutts the Hess Village entertainment district, I would hope that the city would require new owners to sign noise waivers, preventing them from complaining about the noise when the village is packed with 5,000 people on a weekend night.

Don't get me wrong, I don't oppose the proposal, I am just thinking ahead. I'd hate to see the only prosperous area of the downtown being dragged down because of a lack of foresight. If you build housing next to what is already a fairly rowdy area there is going to be problems. City council better think very carefully before approving this project. Otherwise they are going to create even more problems than they are now having in the area.

[highwater]

I'd hate to see the only prosperous area of the downtown being dragged down because of a lack of foresight.

It would be a pretty sad state of affairs if a weekend playground for suburban 19 - 25 year olds were "the only prosperous area of the downtown". Thankfully this is not the case. Hess Village will not survive in the long term as the monoculture it currently is. It needs to diversify the age and sophistication of its clientele. The city would be wise to foster a healthier mix of commercial and residential.

[mic67]

Interesting to compare Hess village with Yorkville in Toronto (Yonge and Bloor).

And then contrast it to the Entertainment District in Toronto.

mic67

[Jon Dalton]

a weekend playground for suburban 19 - 25 year olds

I was thinking about that tonight while riding through the smashed up cars and drunk 17 year olds in the parking lot right by Hess. As much as I support it, there needs to be more than just gino bars. If it were to diversify to more resemble Montreal's Prince Arthur for example, that could work in synergy with surrounding residential development. A major project such as this could even be a kick start in that direction.

[bigguy1231]

It would be a pretty sad state of affairs if a weekend playground for suburban 19 - 25 year olds were "the only prosperous area of the downtown". Thankfully this is not the case. Hess Village will not survive in the long term as the monoculture it currently is. It needs to diversify the age and sophistication of its clientele. The city would be wise to foster a healthier mix of commercial and residential.

Give your head a shake. The rest of the downtown is a diasater area, and yes it is a sad state of affairs. As for Hess Village not surviving I remember hearing that 20 years ago, and it's still there bigger than ever. Mixing commercial and residential uses especially when it comes to bars and nightclubs is never a good idea. It's only asking for problems. There should to be a separation of the two, preferably with other commercial uses in between to act as a buffer.

[mic67]

Amen.

[markbarbera]

Having Hess Village remain exclusively a late night drinking destination is strictly limiting its potential. There should be a mix of entertainment options in the area. And yes, there is room for mixed usage, including, but not limited to, restaurants, theatre, 'hip' commercial industry such as advertising, film and television production, hotels and yes, residential condominiums. As far as watering holes go, Hess Village has reached its saturation point.

[highwater]

:previous: Amen.

[highwater]

Mixing commercial and residential uses especially when it comes to bars and nightclubs is never a good idea. It's only asking for problems. There should to be a separation of the two, preferably with other commercial uses in between to act as a buffer.

Separation of uses is what destroyed our downtown in the first place. Thankfully downtown is slowly beginning to recover whether you care to admit it or not, yet you would like to see a continuation of this failed planning practise. With friends like you, Hess Village doesn't need enemies.

[adam]

Its true that Hess Village is the closest microcosm in that area, but the condos are to be built at King and Queen, not in Hess Village.

[omro]

People live in and amongst bars and clubs all the time. In London, Soho is a packed bar/restaurant zone, which doesn't stop there being plenty of people living there. As for new high-rise buildings, there are new buildings in Vancouver which have bars or clubs on the ground/basement floors, offices directly above and then residential above that. The offices effectively insulate the residential floors from the noises below.

It's just a shame a little of Vancouver's high-rise flair can't find it's way to Hamilton, cause IMHO that building is ugly as :( but that's my opinion.

[jgrwatson]

What the hell is wrong with this city! There a bizzilion vacant parking lots ANYWHERE else in the dt. The burnt out building down the way...

Hamilton needs to give its head a shake. Originally, I thought this was the lot behind HHS, but realizing it is the CHURCH itself, this is just sad and pathetic.

[hamiltonguy]

What the hell is wrong with this city! There a bizzilion vacant parking lots ANYWHERE else in the dt. The burnt out building down the way...

Hamilton needs to give its head a shake. Originally, I thought this was the lot behind HHS, but realizing it is the CHURCH itself, this is just sad and pathetic.

As an Anglican I HAVE to back this. We can not afford to keep many of our huge churches, and its the only way we can afford to keep a space in that area of town.

BTW expect 1/2 of remaining Anglican Churches to close in the next ten years. Even when our numbers go up our revenue goes down because nobody gives anymore, they'd rather buy two nice cars, 3 big screen tvs, an xbox, a ps3 and a wii, as well as their motorcycle and million dollar mcmansion in the middle of nowhere.

[realcity]

http://www.tcarch.ca/images/projects/585.jpg

Queen Street Condominiums
- Hamilton, Ontario

Options for Homes not-for-profit condominium project on the site of an existing church, thoughtfully incorporating the materiality of the original building, while also recreating a place of worship.

I can build a better design out of Lego®

[crhayes]

I can build a better design out of Lego®

I think the design is decent... maybe the developer can't afford to make it much better than that. Besides that's just a shitty sketch, it doesn't even make it clear what materials are being used. If a nice combination of stone/brick is used it could actually be a decent looking building.

[flar]

It looks virtually the same as the other dozens of commie blocks in that area.

[realcity]

Good design doesn't cost more.

I don't like the exposed the mech penthouse. Here's what you can do with a headdress
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b276/theshawsphotos/headdress-elevation-view-17floors-s.jpg?t=1248104563

I think it's siding. If its a curtain wall, then why not use glass and cladding panels to make it look post mod.
http://www.sydneyarchitecture.com/cbd/n0631_5005z.jpg

[realcity]

I'm not making fun of TCA. Look what they designed for Ed Square, that was beautiful.

[drpgq]

Here's an article from the post on Options for Homes. I actually think that the fact it isn't for the lowest incomes is a feature, not a bug for downtown Hamilton.

By Matthew Pioro, National Post

The basement room of the West Toronto Baptist Church is full with more than 40 people interested in buying condos on a Saturday morning in early March. Another such meeting will be held in the afternoon. These events continue to be packed, even now, strictly by word of mouth, amidst lower housing sales for the city. The attendees have mostly middle to low incomes and, if they decide to buy, they will probably take a second mortgage that the developer has to offer. This plan, second mortgage and all, not only has the blessing of the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corp. (CMHC), but the city as well.

The past eight months have not been good for condos. Sure, cranes are still raising concrete and steel across the city, but those are projects that started two or three years ago. The units are sold and the developers have secured financing. But sales for new condos in Toronto have been down drastically: 51.6% lower this May compared to last, according to the Building Industry and Land Development Association. Meanwhile, low-rise sales were only down 25.2%. Condos, once the overachievers of the housing market, are now humbled by their low-rise and more market-adaptable siblings. Without more sales, the condo-construction industry will get hit as the current batch of projects start to wrap up in the next six to 10 months. In February, 28,000 construction jobs disappeared in Ontario and more have disappeared since. For the past five years, the city has come to depend on the yearly injection of more than 10,000 condo units built by developers and the accompanying development charges that help the city maintain its infrastructure.

Yet Michel Labbé, the man behind the church-basement meetings, has designed a plan he believes can save roughly 10,000 construction jobs in Toronto. That plan is based on the model he developed to deliver cost-effective housing in the city.

As potential buyers look at floor plans on bristol boards around the church basement, Labbé, the president and founder of Options for Homes, sets up his laptop and projector near the front of the room. Then, with the lights down for his presentation, he explains why the two buildings his non-profit organization is developing on Keele Street, just north of Dundas Street West, had units for $285 to $305 per square foot while most developers in Toronto, he says, can’t sell for less than $360 per sq. ft., even with the troubled housing market. A 610-sq.-ft. one-bedroom apartment costs $186,208; a 1,030-sq.-ft. two-bedroom runs $295,309. At $360 per sq. ft., the low-end of the condo market, those apartments would be $219,600 and $370,800 respectively.

Labbé explains his model for developing cost-effective housing. Options finds not-yet-desirable sites in Toronto — the Distillery District in the late ’90s and the Junction for the current project comprising a 19- and 24-storey tower — for development. It spends little money on marketing, but doesn’t skimp on the buildings: Its builder on Keele Street is Deltera, Tridel’s construction arm. The towers at the Junction site will have solar panels for heating water, carbon filters for air intake and there are plans for a car-sharing program for residents. Amenities such as a spa, gym or concierge are absent. Apart from the eco-features, the buildings, like the nearby grocery store, will be no frills.

Labbé then covers the second mortgage in detail — key to convincing skeptics that the plan isn’t a scam. When a purchaser buys an Options condo, she is offered a 13% mortgage, which is repaid when she sells or rents the unit. The interest is a percentage of the unit’s increase in value. Both the buyer and Options benefit from the equity that comes with homeownership. If the unit hasn’t increased in value at the time of sale, then only the principal is repaid. Options takes the repayment and puts it into Home Ownership Alternatives, a non-profit corporation that will fund future cost-effective building projects. Since Options began in 1993, $12-million worth of mortgages have been repaid and $38-million are still being held.

Labbé describes himself as a democratic capitalist: “The ultimate goal is to have one person have it all — that’s the complete fruition of capitalism today.” The slim 56-year-old is also creative when it comes to solving business challenges. When the CMHC and traditional banks wouldn’t help with the construction financing for the Junction project, Labbé brokered $97-million through a syndicate of seven credit unions, two based in Toronto and four from the western provinces.

That creativity and his tendency to think big led Labbé to formulate a plan that would not only address housing issues in the city, but also the construction slowdown.
“Options feels it’s involved in trying to solve the housing problems of the country,” Labbé says. “Therefore, when a crisis occurs, logically we see ourselves as being part of the solution.”

At the end of January, Labbé sent a memo to the Mayor and the city’s Affordable Housing Office suggesting they designate 5,000 units’ worth of municipally controlled land for a one-time program. Labbé’s organization and other non-profits that could adopt the Options model would then develop these units with sale prices geared to households with incomes less than $75,000. There wouldn’t be any proposal calls, the means by which private developers gain building opportunities; the city would assign land to various organizations. Non-profits, Labbé argues, would be more responsive than the traditional developers because maximizing profits requires careful study. Selling at cost is more straightforward and the unit prices could be lowered even further if the city deferred development charges. Traditional developers and non-profits can also co-exist peacefully because the Options homes bring a different type of buyer into the condo market.

Two months after the memo went to City Hall, it was under cautious consideration. The Mayor’s office had met with Labbé and was reviewing the plan. Sean Gadon, director of the Affordable Housing Office, said he was encouraged that Labbé was putting his mind toward how affordable housing can provide jobs. He was anxious to see housing investments help the economy, so the plan was under review.

Councillor Adam Vaughan has said he is willing to experiment with the non-profit developer’s ideas; however, he has reservations about allocating city lands.
“The amount of land that Labbé thinks the city has is not accurate,” Vaughan says. “It’s not quite as simple as he offers and handing over tracts of land to private hands at reduced rates. … You know, if we start doing that, he won’t be the only practitioner in town and the next person won’t necessarily be quite so honourable as he is. I’m not sure how you control that.”

John Sewell, former Toronto mayor and a housing activist who was involved with the development of the St. Lawrence Market area, also has critiques of Labbé’s plan. While Sewell feels the Options model is good, his concern is its limited ability to reach lower-income households.

“The land cost is maybe 5% of the total cost of the development,” Sewell says. “You need a greater subsidy if you are going to reach people with low incomes.”
Five months after Labbé pitch­ed his idea, it still rests with the city as a viable option, but a little past its due date.

“ ‘Best before’ is a good term be­cause it’s best before, but not poison after,” Labbé says. “So if the city initiated the plan now, they would still save jobs, but they would save them later. They’d still have a lull and layoffs through the winter, but by the time we hit next spring, things would be picking up faster than they otherwise would.”

If City Hall doesn’t choose to pursue Labbé’s idea, his housing model will still be at work in Toronto. He’s hoping to start marketing Option’s next project, a 350- to 400-suite building near Bathurst and Lawrence, in the fall. On his recent family vacation to Peru, he made time to speak with economist, Nobel Prize finalist and promoter of property rights Hernando de Soto, as well as people involved with housing in Lima, to discuss his model. These connections add to the links he has forged in India and Romania. More meetings, such as the ones in the basement of West Toronto Baptist, are on the way, in this city and others.

[Options president Michel Labbé. Photo by Brett Gundlock / National Post.]

[emge]

When I was considering a job in Etobicoke, I had actually looked at a similar program with condos in the area for those making a similar amount (to qualify but not exceed their required income).

It would have been a great option had I got the job there. Of course, I didn't.. and ended up moving here, but I think programs like that, done well, do add a lot of value because of the people they bring to an area and the property taxes -- you get taxpaying working people, skilled or professional (enough of a salary to qualify), generally who value proximity to transit or downtown, with a certain work ethic and value on home ownership - while limiting those looking to rent out or flip.

[SteelTown]

How to give aging churches new life
Councillor wants city to hire a consultant to study upgrades for iconic buildings

September 08, 2009
Dana Brown
The Hamilton Spectator
http://www.thespec.com/News/Local/article/630411

They're stunning, iconic buildings that speak to a time of religious grace and opulence.

They're also aging, some without the means or devotees to return them to their former glory.

The task of finding new uses for Hamilton's historic churches was recently raised among city councillors due to a development at All Saints Anglican Church, at Queen and King streets.

And at least one councillor would like the city to look into options for adaptive reuses for churches, which would allow them to keep their heritage value.

Councillor Brian McHattie is set to introduce a motion at committee today, calling on the city to approve hiring a consultant to look at the issue.

The cost would be no more than $5,000.

"(The All Saints situation) got me thinking that there's no doubt many other churches that are perhaps in that situation," said McHattie.

All Saints was built in the early 1870s. Partnered with a company called Options for Homes, the church plans to knock down its structurally-faltering building, along with the parish hall.

A nonprofit condo tower would replace them with a ministry maintained on the ground floor.

But after the project was recognized at the municipal heritage committee, it was recommended the building be looked at for a heritage designation, freezing the project.

Council first agreed to, then reversed, its decision to move ahead with the heritage analysis.

"In the future, what would be an ideal from our point of view would be to have a way of working with the heritage folks and the city so we could both preserve churches and develop the land around them, perhaps," said Rick Jones, archdeacon with the Diocese of Niagara.

"So that we would have a revenue stream so that we could actually afford to keep the buildings in the condition that they need to be kept in."

McHattie suggests one solution is for the city to provide a Community Improvement Plan, like the downtown renewal or facade program, which offers financial incentives.

But downtown councillor Bob Bratina, whose ward encompasses many heritage properties, isn't convinced a $5,000 consultant is the way to go.

Bratina said the city's development process needs to be perfected so heritage concerns get flagged right away.

There also needs to be a list of priority heritage buildings in the city, something council has approved compiling, the councillor said.

"The only thing I want to emphasize is that we don't have enough ability, as a municipality, to deal, especially an old city like ours, with all the heritage issues that come up," he said.

"And if we have to spend the kind of money we're spending on city hall and the Lister Block, we're in big trouble.

"Because that's 50 million bucks (extra) on two buildings (because of heritage concerns)."

Bratina said if the city wants to keep up old buildings, there needs to be more financial help from the provincial and federal governments.

In 1994, the city purchased St. Mark's Anglican church at Bay and Hunter streets, and it was designated a heritage site the next year. The church has since been sitting without revitalization, because of a lack of funds.

In addition to All Saints, there are three other churches the Diocese of Niagara is currently looking to redevelop.

[SteelTown]

Re-use of Church buildings

Whereas, given the dual dynamic of church congregations shrinking, and churches aging, many churches in Hamilton will become available for re-use and;

Whereas, many of these churches represent significant cultural heritage resources in Hamilton, and;

Whereas, recently in Hamilton several churches have been negatively affected in terms of their heritage value, and;

Whereas, adaptive reuse of churches is occurring in other municipalities

Therefore:

That the item be added to the staff work program for 2010, and that a consultant be hired, at an upset cost not to exceed $5,000, to investigate applicable options to achieve adaptive reuse of churches in order to maintain their cultural heritage value.

The Motion LOST on the following standing recorded vote:
Yeas: Clark, McHattie, Mitchell Total: 3
Nays: Pearson, Bratina, Duvall, Ferguson, Pasuta, Whitehead Total: 6

[SteelTown]

So it looks like the Church will be demolished.

[SteelTown]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/Appster/QueenSt.jpg

[urban_planner]

Nice looking building.

[matt602]

Wow, MUCH better looking than the last rendering. Very nice.

[realcity]

Is this church getting torn down yet? So this condo can start construction

[realcity]

Did McHattie get the consultant thing?

[thistleclub]

Rendering downloadable in PDF form on Brian McHattie's site (http://www.brianmchattie.ca/issues2.php). He writes:

Options for Homes is proposing to build a 12 storey condominium on the site of the former All Saints Church property, located at 15 Queen Street South at the corner of King Street West and Queen Street South. The proposal is for 120 residential units with commercial units on the ground floor.

Options for Homes focusses on affordable ownership.

The proponents are required to apply to the Committee of Adjustment to get permission to build to a height of 38.3 metres instead of 30.0 metres and to be allowed to provide 69 parking spaces instead of 87 spaces.

The proponent held a public meeting on January 26. The Committee of Adjustment application will be heard on Thursday, March 4 at 2:55 p.m. in Room 207 of the Hamilton Convention Centre.

[SteelTown]

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y217/dahammer/QueenCondo.jpg

[urban_planner]

Wow thats even better but its no good to me on paper or in this case computer screen.

[SteelTown]

Committee of Adjustment approved this submission.

69 parking space instead of 87
Height of 38m permitted

I'll update this from Planning to Approved.

[emge]

That rendering looks so much better. I like that the arches are there.

[SteelTown]

If you zoom in you can see the windows, above the front entrance, are from the current church.

[crhayes]

This would be a beautiful building; it's a great design for the location I hope it goes through!!

[SteelTown]

A one-year extension was granted in December 2010 to the conditional site plan approval for the development of a 107 unit multiple residential condominium building at 15 Queen Street South. The proposal is currently the subject of an Ontario Municipal Board hearing.

[thompsdk]

The site plan for 15 Queen St S is nicely included into the city's most recent
LRT plans (http://www.hamiltonrapidtransit.ca/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/August-2011-Consultation-Panels-2.pdf) (see page 6).

The OMB hearing (http://www.omb.gov.on.ca/ecs/CaseDetail.aspx?n=PL100430) is also tomorrow at the old courthouse downtown.

[hammerton]

So how does one buy a condo in this building?

[SteelTown]

So how does one buy a condo in this building?

First they'll need to get OMB's stamp of approval.

[fuller]

If this project has been approved at Committee of Adjustment, then why is it at the OMB? Did council oppose it for some reason, or is the heritage designation standing in the way?

[SteelTown]

Council approved it. But the neighbourhood has a problem with it being 12 storey.

[hammerton]

As a current resident of this neighborhood I would have no problem with a 12 story building going up at this location. :)

[SteelTown]

All Saints sees place to live over place to worship

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/584496--all-saints-sees-place-to-live-over-place-to-worship

A 140-year-old church downtown is at the heart of a local debate around heritage, neighbourhood development and poverty.

The Synod of the Diocese of Niagara and the Hamilton nonprofit corporation Options for Homes want to demolish All Saints Anglican Church on Queen Street South at King Street West to construct a 12-storey, affordable housing apartment. The main level would be used for worship and ministry by congregation members.

But a group of heritage advocates and citizens is fighting two “minor variances” that would exempt the project from the area’s zoning bylaws for parking and building height.

[SteelTown]

Passed the OMB approval.

[pEte fiSt iN Ur fAce]

I've got a very bad feeling about how this one's going to turn out...uuuuugly in other words.

So, why would the diocese want to demolish this church? Don't they recognise its heritage value? Why did we build all these wonderful places of worship if not inspire and awe god-fearing people. Hell, I'm an atheist and I wouldn't dare demolish a church, synagogue, mosque or temple of any kind. Why would they want to replace this beautiful building with a structure inspired by 1960s Belorussian architectural tastes? I suppose there's money to be made or money to be saved, at the very least. It's a terrible shame and I'm quite sure that what remains of the flock will not appreciate the new digs.

[Duckyboy]

All Saints sees place to live over place to worship

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/584496--all-saints-sees-place-to-live-over-place-to-worship

A 140-year-old church downtown is at the heart of a local debate around heritage, neighbourhood development and poverty.

The Synod of the Diocese of Niagara and the Hamilton nonprofit corporation Options for Homes want to demolish All Saints Anglican Church on Queen Street South at King Street West to construct a 12-storey, affordable housing apartment. The main level would be used for worship and ministry by congregation members.

But a group of heritage advocates and citizens is fighting two “minor variances” that would exempt the project from the area’s zoning bylaws for parking and building height.

Affordable housing often means tax-payer funded, which mean more $$$ for someone pulling the strings (often, not even a resident of Hamilton).

Wonderful...

[SteelTown]

Opinions for Homes aren't taxpayer funded.

http://www.optionsforhomes.ca/

They provide interest free loans.

[Duckyboy]

Opinions for Homes aren't taxpayer funded.

http://www.optionsforhomes.ca/

They provide interest free loans.

Well that's great, then!!!! Good to hear.

[SteelTown]

OMB gives All Saints green light to demolish downtown Hamilton church

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/682013--omb-gives-all-saints-green-light-to-demolish-downtown-hamilton-church

A downtown congregation has won a battle with local heritage advocates to demolish its more-than-century-old church and construct affordable housing.

The Ontario Municipal Board delivered a decision to dismiss appeals made by a group of Hamiltonians looking to stop two “minor variances” that exempted the All Saints Anglican Church project from zoning restrictions for parking and building height.

“The members of the All Saints Anglican Church are excited about continuing to move this project forward so they can get on (with) the mission that they know they’re called to,” said Michael Patterson, the Anglican Diocese of Niagara’s executive officer.

“It’s going to be a wonderful asset to the downtown core of Hamilton. It will help with the ongoing renewal of the downtown area.”

The Synod of the Diocese of Niagara and the Hamilton nonprofit corporation Options for Homes plan to demolish the 140-year-old church on Queen Street South near King Street West and build a 12-storey affordable housing apartment building in its place.

The main level of the new facility would be used by the congregation for worship and ministry.

The developers requested a minimum of 69 parking spaces instead of 87 and a maximum height of 12 floors as opposed to six. The city’s committee of adjustment granted the requests in 2010.

But appellants Diane Dent, Robin McKee and, previously, Matt Jelly — who withdrew his appeal before the decision — argued the variances were not “minor” because they would be incompatible with the church’s surroundings and overburden the neighbourhood.

Dent was out of the country and unavailable for comment on Monday. McKee did not return calls for comment on the OMB decision.

Jelly said he withdrew his appeal because the developers’ revised sun and shadow analysis satisfied the Downtown Hamilton Secondary Plan. He said he hoped the developers would incorporate as much of the site’s history into the final product.

Patterson said the church plans to maintain the “historical integrity” of the building by including some of the historic stained-glass windows, the organ, portions of the brick work, the woodwork in the interior of the church and many of the sacramental vessels in the finished facility.

The aging building was “paralyzing” the congregation because of mounting costs, he added.

They not know when the demolition will begin, but are in the final stages of conducting studies for the project, Patterson said. “The big hurdle was the OMB hearing. Now, we’re moving ahead in earnest of getting things done.”

[SteelTown]

Queen South Condominiums

http://upitch.net/

[Beedok]

Looks fairly nice.

[matt602]

Not a jawdropping design but I've seen worse. The height definitely fits well with the area. Should be a nice addition.

[thistleclub]

Respectable presentation for a no-frills entry.

[pEte fiSt iN Ur fAce]

I'm sorry but this is yet another bad move for downtown. If All Saints is no longer viable as a place of worship, then it could be repurposed for any number of uses: music venue, bar / restaurant, bookstore / cafe, etc. Did they even pursue this avenue? It's a no-brainer given its location.

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa121/the_dude1974/bookstorechurch.jpg
dezeen.com

Again, even as an atheist, I see this as a total and complete act of sacrilege. They don't build like this anymore and they NEVER WILL AGAIN! Just imagine the horror of the original parishoners of this church who sacrificed so much to have this beauty erected for their use on Sundays.

This new building will, judging by the awkward use of buttressing at the entrance, be a disappointment. Don't worry about that.

[ihateittoo]

Again I can't accept the location but I want the development. It's a similar situation to that of the school board. I feel there is a wasted potential. But in the case of the church, although needing plenty of repairs, a more significant building which is easier to retain. In general with this kind of development I think the "there's a billion empty lots (on prime corners!)" argument holds.

Lets demolish the car lot at Caroline and King and put it there. I like the size. The design has potential. It's good infill. 1/4 of a massive parking lot gone.

[Pearlstreet]

As a current resident of this neighborhood I would have no problem with a 12 story building going up at this location. :)

Ditto! It looks fantastic. Sad to see the church go, but its current state is unacceptable.