Official Mountain West NBA Thread 2

[TonyAnderson]

What are the odds the Jazz finally make it back to the Finals just to face the new Jordan, Lebron James, and get denied again as 'Bron starts his dynasty run? I can already see him pushing off on Kirilenko for the game winner.

[scottharding]

The only difference between LA and Denver, is LA actually wins the gimme games. Dallas has become far over-rated, because of their win streak they had. OKC is more dangerous than Dallas or Jazz, but will not be able to play properly come playoff time, because of lack of experience. Utah is most dangerous, but will tire over a playoff series, as will Dallas. If Denver gets Kenyon and Karl back as currently planned and LA doesn't get Bynum back, I don't see how the Lakers can get past Denver.

I don't see what makes you think Utah will tire through a playoff series. In the last twenty years, only San Antonio has played more playoff series. Sloan knows how to handle it. And of the eight teams in the West currently in playoff seeds, Utah's age situation is ideal in that they've been there before, they've won playoff series and have experience, but they're still one of the younger teams. Only Oklahoma City and Portland are younger. And the Jazz are far less beat up than Denver. Utah has weaknesses, but legs isn't one of them.

[TonyAnderson]

OKC tore up the Lakers last night. They really don't seem to have THAT much talent, but they play like a college basketball team with their energy, hustle, teamplay, and defense. I haven't been a believer in them all season, especially when I think about playoffs, but they're slowly changing my mind.

[SnyderBock]

Their talent is in their bigs. they have Kobe plus their bigs, Gasol, Odem and Bynum. They don't really have a good PG or a quality backup PG. They don't have a quality backup SG to Kobe (Ariza was a huge loss). They don't have a quality starting SF, nor a good backup SF. They got Kobe and the bigs and role players who work with in their system. Denver, Dallas, Utah and OKC are possibly all more complete teams than the Lakers. Coaching is under-rated and Phil Jackson plays a huge role in their success, just as Karl does with Denver and so as Sloan with Utah.

It seems all a team in the NBA needs to win, is one elite finisher/scorer, a couple All-Star caliber bigs and a future Hall of Fame type coach and it really helps to have an All-Star level PG. Sure the two best teams in the NBA in the Lakers and Cavs both have below average PG's, but they both have players who facilitate of the double team well in Kobe and LeBron, which makes up for the lack of a top level PG.

[wrendog]

Their talent is in their bigs. they have Kobe plus their bigs, Gasol, Odem and Bynum. They don't really have a good PG or a quality backup PG. They don't have a quality backup SG to Kobe (Ariza was a huge loss). They don't have a quality starting SF, nor a good backup SF. They got Kobe and the bigs and role players who work with in their system. Denver, Dallas, Utah and OKC are possibly all more complete teams than the Lakers. Coaching is under-rated and Phil Jackson plays a huge role in their success, just as Karl does with Denver and so as Sloan with Utah.

It seems all a team in the NBA needs to win, is one elite finisher/scorer, a couple All-Star caliber bigs and a future Hall of Fame type coach and it really helps to have an All-Star level PG. Sure the two best teams in the NBA in the Lakers and Cavs both have below average PG's, but they both have players who facilitate of the double team well in Kobe and LeBron, which makes up for the lack of a top level PG.

I'm pretty sure he was referring to the Thunder, not the Lakers. :)

[TonyAnderson]

Yes I meant the Thunder, sorry.

So the Mavs beat the Nuggets tonight and Denver falls from 2nd to 5th. Wow! This is going to be one close race from 2nd to 5th, and even 2nd to 8th (Spurs are 8th right now and only 4 games back).

[scottharding]

Yeah, crazy! Utah moves up to third, first in the NW division, and only a half game behind Dallas at number 2. So many teams being so close together. It's amazing how balanced out the western conference has become. Even the Lakers, who hold a comfortable five game lead over Dallas, are beatable. New Orleans thumped them tonight. The Western conference title is there for which ever team wants it most.

[SLC4L]

:previous:

Oh no! Ego's are collapsing and expanding! Also... Go Jazz! I remember earlier this season when people were going off on how bad they were, and here I was saying, "Stick with them... It's a long season." This is the man formally known as MetroFanatic bytheway.

[TonyAnderson]

I still feel the same. They're too sporadic to do anything noteworthy in the playoffs.

[SnyderBock]

Nuggets just have to get Kenyon healthy, Ty Lawson healthy, Birdman healthy and Coach Karl back and they will be ready for playoffs. I never would have imagined that Coach Karl had this big an impact on the success of the Nuggets. They don't even look like a playoff team without Karl and Martin. And they played alright without Martin when they still had Karl around. This adversity could make them stronger and prepare them for a tough fight to the Championship. This may be their turning point, where they ave to come together at a new level, or fade away. At this point, their final position doesn't even matter. if they can get right, they will be the best team in the west and capable of defeating any opponent they are matched up against.

[scottharding]

I still feel the same. They're too sporadic to do anything noteworthy in the playoffs.

I don't think the Jazz have been too sporadic since the all-star break. They're 30-9 since then, which is good for best in the West, and the best league record since the break behind Cleveland. And the Jazz March schedule was grueling. I think this is the most solid Jazz team we've seen since the Finals years, and they can do just as much damage in the West as anyone.

[5280]

Dudes, I'm not judging, but why in the hell does Jerry Sloan still have Boozer and Miles in the GS game???? Up by 30 in the 4th with the playoffs a few games away? That makes absolutely no sense to me. I'd really like some intel on this, because it seems like insanity. Game is well over, why risk Boozer rolling an ankle or something?

[SLO]

I don't think the Jazz have been too sporadic since the all-star break. They're 30-9 since then, which is good for best in the West, and the best league record since the break behind Cleveland. And the Jazz March schedule was grueling. I think this is the most solid Jazz team we've seen since the Finals years, and they can do just as much damage in the West as anyone.

The Mavericks are 18-5 since the break, dont think there have been 39 games since the break. The Jazz are 18-7 since the break, but they have been great. Cleveland is 16-5.

The west is crazier than ever, I think the Lakers will retain the #1 seed, but then its up for grabs, lose one game and you'll drop.

[scottharding]

Ah yes, my bad. The 30-9 record is since January, the start of the year.

[TonyAnderson]

Well the RNC members in town got to witness one of the better regular season games I've ever seen. Jazz beat Thunder 140 to 139 in overtime. I also found out Kevin Durant's normal range is about half-court. He's like a better, more athletic version of Reggie Miller.

[scottharding]

What an awesome game! Both Deron Williams and Kevin Durant have 40+ games. So many players making clutch plays. And yeah, Durant is a freakin' machine. Some of those shots are inhuman. Sorry Kobe, time to pass the torch. Those Nike puppet commercials should be between Lebron and Durant, because the fight for the crown is between those two.
Sweet win for the Jazz. Four to go.

[Ronald-Dregan]

what an emotional draining game... I haven't felt this spent at a game for quite some time. That being said we dodged a bullet because Durrant was clearly fouled on the last shot. I have never in my life seen such a terribly officiated game in my life. Ive been to around 200 Jazz games, but have never seen such bad refereeing of a nba game. Go JAZZ :D

[Crush_Buds]

Sorta off topic...but is there a NFL team that the majority of the people root for?

[FrancoRey]

Correction. The Nugs will win the Northwest. ;)

If I'm not mistaken, two of the teams in your sentence are 0-1 and Denver is 2-0. ALL are as a result of...Denver. :D

The season is long. Relax NBA fans! There's still roughly 80 chances for your teams to make it right.

Ahem. 'Twas a squeaker, but the prophecy has been fulfilled! NUGGETS WIN THE NORTHWEST! :banana:

And all these Jazz fans that were so worried about their team. We ended up with the same record. Let the trash talking and madness begin! If only Phoenix was still in here...what a fun three-way slug fest that would've been.

Looking forward to game one in Denver.

[cadetwhite]

^^^ Definitely! Saturday night will be very interesting, I only wish I had tickets!

[Ilsaz]

So I'm flipping through the channels and on ESPN2 they are interviewing Chauncey Billups about the Nuggets' late season struggles, the absence of coach Karl, etc and I notice something peculiar about the Denver backdrop: the Four Seasons is only 30 stories high and there is a giant crane there.

You can see cars moving along Speer Boulevard, so it makes me giggle at the trouble they went to to put up an old backdrop of Denver. I mean, it was a nice day today. Surely they could have sat Billups in front of a window or something? Or maybe have shot some footage that wouldn't be so easily dated.

Nothing too important. It just made me giggle.

PS: Go Nuggets.

[TonyAnderson]

Sorta off topic...but is there a NFL team that the majority of the people root for?

For Utah? Typically it's the Broncos, but there's also a decent fan base for the 49ers (a lot being due to the BYU - Steve Young connection).

There's also some fan base for Oakland.

I've seen a map that shows different markets and their team preferences in another thread somewhere here at SSP.

[TonyAnderson]

Ahem. 'Twas a squeaker, but the prophecy has been fulfilled! NUGGETS WIN THE NORTHWEST! :banana:

And all these Jazz fans that were so worried about their team. We ended up with the same record. Let the trash talking and madness begin! If only Phoenix was still in here...what a fun three-way slug fest that would've been.

Looking forward to game one in Denver.

No Martin. No Karl. No second round :)

Ahem ... assuming Boozer is ok.

Actually, I think Denver has the better team, and they have home court. It'll be pretty tough for the Jazz to pull this off.

[SnyderBock]

So I'm flipping through the channels and on ESPN2 they are interviewing Chauncey Billups about the Nuggets' late season struggles, the absence of coach Karl, etc and I notice something peculiar about the Denver backdrop: the Four Seasons is only 30 stories high and there is a giant crane there.

The Nuggets vs. Suns game they just nationally televised had blimp shots of Denver and there was no Four Seasons, no Spire and as far as I could see, not even cranes for those buildings. Maybe in another couple of years, they will update their shots?

[scottharding]

It's the same here in Salt Lake. Some of the arial shots they show are from years back. They still show the old Key Bank tower, which was demolished two years ago now, I think.

[Ilsaz]

I can almost understand it with expensive aerial shots. I know the stuff used on TNT is often taken from helicopter, not blimp and uses very expensive nose-mounted camera equipment. It's actually the stabilizers that are spendy.

But a relatively static picture being used for a backdrop? It does not compute. It was nice yesterday. Why not put Billups in front of a real window instead of a greenscreen. It just makes me laugh at how unnecessarily complicated television make things sometimes.

I am predicting the Phoenix Suns to win the western conference this year. But I expect Denver to get out of the first round. Sorry Utah. And, being a 4 seed is better than a two or three seed. Right now, I'd rather face the Lakers in the second round than the Suns. Amirite?

[SnyderBock]

It wasn't the Suns game, it was the Spurs game I was talking about up there^
The Suns game was in Phoenix, lol! For the Spurs game in Denver, I didn't see Four Seasons, Spire or even cranes for those towers.

So far tonight in playoff game Nuggets vs Utah, I have yet to see them either, but then again they didn't start showing the game until there was only about 4 minutes left in the first quarter. I'll keep watching for them ;)

[cadetwhite]

Ha ha, did anyone just see the Utah fans of Carmelo Anthony commercial?!

[FrancoRey]

Can't say I did. Can anyone post?

What a great W for the Nuggets. 42 points from Melo!?! Yikes. And JR turning on the 3-show in the 4th quarter was the dagger.

Feel a little bad for Utah. How do you lose 3 good players in such a short span to injuries/sickness? Crappy luck.

[SnyderBock]

Sometime shortly after the second half of the season started, JR Smith suddenly looked to slow down. First half, he seemed out of control, like he was rushing the game, forcing plays, forcing shots, forcing penetration, forcing passes, etc.

Second half, he just slowed way down. The game is comes to him now. He penetrates far more effectively, passes far more (he's looking like a player with PG potential in the second half). His shot selection has improved and he only seems to fire up bad shots now when it doesn't matter, late in games that are blow outs and stuff. His consistency level has gone way up in the second half.

JR Smith seems to be finally capitalizing on his full potential and that's not good news for other teams in the NBA playoffs. With Kenyon martin looking good, Ty Lawson back, Birdman healthy again and JR Smith playing at his highest level ever, not to mention Billups having a career best season and Melo having his best season ever. It's suddenly gone from bleak to great looking for the Nuggets. Heck Afflalo has been an improvement over Jones, Nene has been working on becoming a more consistent post scoring presence.

This whole Denver Nuggets team looks like an upgrade to the team that Nearly took down the Lakers in the Western Conference finals last season.

It's no lie, they have just gone through their greatest adversity ever, as a team. If they had not ended the season with this adversity of loosing Kenyon, Coach Karl, Ty Lawson and the emotional challenges associated with that, they could have challenged the Lakers for the #1 seed out west--with the way the Lakers ended the season. That is, had Denver kept playing and stayed healthy, the way it had through February, they would have approached 60 wins. But instead they endured adversity and perhaps became a stronger, more united team in the process. Perhaps this team now has the drive to take it all the way.

[TonyAnderson]

Ha ha, did anyone just see the Utah fans of Carmelo Anthony commercial?!

Yeah, what was that all about? I couldn't tell if it was serious or making a parody.

[CPVLIVE]

Ha ha, did anyone just see the Utah fans of Carmelo Anthony commercial?!

Yeah, what was that all about? I couldn't tell if it was serious or making a parody.

Here it is - most certainly not serious. Very humorous - when Melo's head floats up I just can't help laughing.

kZPeP69tdoc

[cadetwhite]

I think it is serious, who would pay for an ad to make a joke about fans of Carmelo Anthony in Utah?

[CPVLIVE]

I think it is serious, who would pay for an ad to make a joke about fans of Carmelo Anthony in Utah?

About as serious as an episode of South Park. It's a Jordan brand ad - you see it in the bottom right corner at the end.

[cadetwhite]

^ha ha okay

Well, Its F****ing hilarious! The expression on carmelo's face is awesome.

[Orlando]

Way to go Jazz! You can beat Denver in their house!

[TonyAnderson]

We've got a series. The Jazz couldn't miss a shot.

[TonyAnderson]

About as serious as an episode of South Park. It's a Jordan brand ad - you see it in the bottom right corner at the end.

I actually find the underlying theme of South Park episodes to be pretty serious. Which is annoying. Anyway, I thought that said Jordan in the bottom right but couldn't make it out for sure. Lol, weird.

[SnyderBock]

They showed it again tonight, Carmelo Anthony Fans of Utah! The whole world has no idea what this commercial is about, but they know it's some kind of joke. I like that commercial. It kind of puts salt Lake City in their seats. :p

IT'S SO FUNNY!

[SLO]

Great game last night, glad I stayed up.
It will be funny to see the fan reaction in SLC regarding the Carmelo commercial.....

[SLC4L]

So I'm flipping through the channels and on ESPN2 they are interviewing Chauncey Billups about the Nuggets' late season struggles, the absence of coach Karl, etc and I notice something peculiar about the Denver backdrop: the Four Seasons is only 30 stories high and there is a giant crane there.

You can see cars moving along Speer Boulevard, so it makes me giggle at the trouble they went to to put up an old backdrop of Denver. I mean, it was a nice day today. Surely they could have sat Billups in front of a window or something? Or maybe have shot some footage that wouldn't be so easily dated.

Nothing too important. It just made me giggle.

PS: Go Nuggets.

My favorite part about Jazz games broadcasted is that they use footage from around Christmas time. So you can be watching a playoff game in April/May and see a Christmas Tree atop the Shilo Inn.

Also, I like your avatar. I just saw Spoon at the Coachella Music Festival this past weekend.

[TonyAnderson]

They showed it again tonight, Carmelo Anthony Fans of Utah! The whole world has no idea what this commercial is about, but they know it's some kind of joke. I like that commercial. It kind of puts salt Lake City in their seats. :p

IT'S SO FUNNY!

It also kind of pokes fun at Carmelo as well. Makes him look stupid. Well, at least we get a free skyline shot out of it.

[blm3034L!fe]

Last night's game was very dissapointing, The Nuggs need to step it up, no excuses even though the Freethrow ratio between the two teams is way off balance. Non of that matters. Denver has the Talent to take out Utah, I honestly believe majority of the issues with Denver are directly related to Coach Karl being absent. If Sloan were MIA the Series would be 3-0 Denver Right now. It's all good, if Denver can tie up the Series Sunday then I say Denver will win it all. If Dnever drops 3-1 Sunday it's over!!! :(

[wrendog]

Last night's game was very dissapointing

No it wasn't.

[TonyAnderson]

I'm surprised it wasn't even close. I feel like Sunday is a must-win for both.

[scottharding]

I think you're right BLM about the Nuggets hurts having a lot to do with the absence of George Karl, although I don't think it would be too different if Sloan was gone. As good as Sloan is, Deron Williams is the reason the Jazz are in command of this series. It's interesting to hear the media and analyists singing his praises this year, and finally giving him the credit he deserves. (Barkley said he as passed Nash and Paul as the best PG in the league). Those of us here in SLC have seen Deron do this many many times. He has that superstar mentality that makes talented players supurb players. And when Deron gets going like this, others on the team follow. He's like Billups, or Kidd or Nash that way. A player like Boozer or Millsap will have a great night, but really it's Williams feeding and distibuting.
Anyway, needless to say, I'm way proud of what the Jazz are doing right now. It really shows this team's maturity. Not so long ago, losing AK and Memo would have caused this team to roll over. I just hope they can show the same metal if/when they meet the Lakers next round.

[Ronald-Dregan]

I hate to say it but Denva Is cracking at the seams...
I went to game and it was nice to see Boozer have a nice game tonight, I must admit I had denver beating us 4-1, but the fragile nature of Denver has really turned them on their bellies. Did anyone see Crymello whinning at the refs at halftime, I couldn't help but laugh out loud at how pathetic he is as a human being.

GO JAZZZ!!!!!!!!!
BEAT DENVER IN DENVER

:tup: :notacrook: :shrug: :cool:

:whip: :whip: :whip: :whip: :whip: :whip:

[SnyderBock]

Honestly, the refs do need to get their act together. Calling touch calls on Denver and ignoring hard contact against Denver has got to stop. And it's interesting how Utah is allowed to have 3 or 4 defenders in the paint, often one or two not guarding a man, for more than 3 seconds. That's not typically allowed, it's illegal defense. I never knew how ugly the Utah fans are. Chanting "Denver Sucks" and random screams of profanity at Denver players loud enough to be heard on National TV. Utah fans are delusional if they think they have a better team than Denver and have any hope of getting past the Lakers. Only Denver stands a chance to get past the Lakers in Round 2. Utah won 3 in a row and now so can Denver.

[wrendog]

Honestly, the refs do need to get their act together. Calling touch calls on Denver and ignoring hard contact against Denver has got to stop. And it's interesting how Utah is allowed to have 3 or 4 defenders in the paint, often one or two not guarding a man, for more than 3 seconds. That's not typically allowed, it's illegal defense. I never knew how ugly the Utah fans are. Chanting "Denver Sucks" and random screams of profanity at Denver players loud enough to be heard on National TV. Utah fans are delusional if they think they have a better team than Denver and have any hope of getting past the Lakers. Only Denver stands a chance to get past the Lakers in Round 2. Utah won 3 in a row and now so can Denver.

LOL.. Good hell buddy. I feel the opposite. Denver gets away with sooooo much crap. I think the refs are actually doing a decent job out there. Every fan thinks their team is getting screwed. As far as the "Denver Sucks" chant, did you not watch the first two games of the series? "Utah Sucks" was heard more than cheers for the Nuggets.....

[SLC4L]

I heard "Utah Sucks" plenty of times when they were in Denver. Ron Boone (one of our local sportscasters) even went out to say, "Do you really think they mean that?" ... then Utah went on to beat them. Last night the only thing I could hear heckle-wise from Utah fans was a guy saying "Stop crying Melo" another saying something along the lines of "How does it feel to be 1 for 10" and then something with the word "ass" in it, but considering how tame that is to Boozer's "Get your hands off me mother f*****" to Nene, I don't think it would have bothered them much.

On another note, last nights stock footage was up to date.

[scottharding]

Wow, a Denver fan thinks the refs are favoring Utah, and a Utah fan retaliates saying no, Denver is getting the calls. That's sports for you. We all see what we want to see as fans.
The truth? Dick Bevetta was reffing last night. He is considered THE veteran ref in the league. And he and Sloan have an ugly history. If any ref in the league would have a vendetta against Utah, it would be Bevetta. (A Bevetta Vendetta. Ha) But no, there's a reason he has the reputation and the league respect that he does. As the senior official on the floor, he assured that the game is called as accurately as possible.
And when Mello puts a stiff-arm into Wes Mathews neck, yeah. That's an offensive foul.
To be fair though, I do have to say Mello has come a long way as far as his attitude goes. He is more patient than he used to be. Remember last year when he defied George Karl and refused to come out of a game? Bet he wishes he had Karl back now. Trial and error, I suppose. Now at least, he's trying to keep composure and lead his team.

But this series has demonstrated that team unity and discipline will win a series. Go Jazz.

[SLC Projects]

Honestly, the refs do need to get their act together. Calling touch calls on Denver and ignoring hard contact against Denver has got to stop. And it's interesting how Utah is allowed to have 3 or 4 defenders in the paint, often one or two not guarding a man, for more than 3 seconds. That's not typically allowed, it's illegal defense. I never knew how ugly the Utah fans are. Chanting "Denver Sucks" and random screams of profanity at Denver players loud enough to be heard on National TV. Utah fans are delusional if they think they have a better team than Denver and have any hope of getting past the Lakers. Only Denver stands a chance to get past the Lakers in Round 2. Utah won 3 in a row and now so can Denver.

:previous:
:haha: You Denver fans are such hypocrites. So it's ok for you guys to chant "Utah Sucks" but then when the table turns and people here do the same you guys start crying like bitches. :haha: Funny.
Denver is falling apart and I'm loving every minute of it. :haha:

[SnyderBock]

Denver's not falling apart, this is pretty much exactly how they've played since Gorge Karl went out. I'm sure the Nuggets are going to make their last stand and make it a formidable one at that.

Maybe fans do see what they want to see, but I keep seeing Melo and Billups hacked in the head and not getting calls and then on the other end, light contact getting called as fouls against them. But the refs actually started doing this to Denver about 3 weeks ago, it' snot isolated to the Utah series. It was like the refs got together one day and devised a plan to make it tougher for Denver to get to the line.

[TonyAnderson]

Boozer's playing for BIG MONEY this offseason. He's playing his a$$ off. Man, I hope we can resign him.

I also thought Denver had this in about 5-6 games. They've turned out to be much softer than I expected. The one thing about any Jerry Sloan team is they are physically tough out there.

About the refs, I always think they're a little too quick too blow the whistles, but still, the Jazz won both games pretty handily so it's a pretty moot point.

[SnyderBock]

It's not really a moot point, because Denver had double digit leads in those games, but the refs not calling Utah for the defensive 3 second violations, not calling fouls against Utah when Denver penetrated into the paint, literally made scoring in the paint nearly impossible, which relegated Denver a a jump shooting team, which is what allowed Utah to come from behind and gain the lead and go on to win. That's exactly how these games went down.

[Ronald-Dregan]

Honestly, the refs do need to get their act together. Calling touch calls on Denver and ignoring hard contact against Denver has got to stop. And it's interesting how Utah is allowed to have 3 or 4 defenders in the paint, often one or two not guarding a man, for more than 3 seconds. That's not typically allowed, it's illegal defense. I never knew how ugly the Utah fans are. Chanting "Denver Sucks" and random screams of profanity at Denver players loud enough to be heard on National TV. Utah fans are delusional if they think they have a better team than Denver and have any hope of getting past the Lakers. Only Denver stands a chance to get past the Lakers in Round 2. Utah won 3 in a row and now so can Denver.

Haha epic fail on the personal comments about Utah fans being ugly. True the nuggs might have a better shot at lakers, but it is irrelevant and shows how sore your ass must feel. You sir have exposed your own homerish, spoiled, and conceded personality by illustrating a post such as this. You live in a vast egomaniacal state of denial my friend. Keep trying to find ways to balance your hurt and shame, through personal criticism, and irrelevance. Sounds to me like you need a hug and some tissues. When you are ready, please do accept Utah has just beaten your nuggets and has them on the ropes. By all means have hope your nuggets can come back.
We can't change what happened, we can only analyze it, and move forward?

GO JAZZZ!! :yes:

[Ronald-Dregan]

It's not really a moot point, because Denver had double digit leads in those games, but the refs not calling Utah for the defensive 3 second violations, not calling fouls against Utah when Denver penetrated into the paint, literally made scoring in the paint nearly impossible, which relegated Denver a a jump shooting team, which is what allowed Utah to come from behind and gain the lead and go on to win. That's exactly how these games went down.

It would not have anything to do with the fact Deron is owning the entire Denver guard roster? Or maybe Utah's Defence has staggered every Denver player except Crymello? How about double the assists? More efficient execution? I guess the reffs are more of a factor in games then I realized:shrug: ...
Keep the excuses coming it adds fuel to the pool of denial you choose to swim in. One of my fav quotes come to mind here...

"Excuses are like Ass-hole's. Everyone has them, and they all stink."
Jazz 3-1 hopefully 4-1

[wrendog]

It's not really a moot point, because Denver had double digit leads in those games, but the refs not calling Utah for the defensive 3 second violations, not calling fouls against Utah when Denver penetrated into the paint, literally made scoring in the paint nearly impossible, which relegated Denver a a jump shooting team, which is what allowed Utah to come from behind and gain the lead and go on to win. That's exactly how these games went down.

Listen, I know it sucks that you will most likely lose to the Jazz, but dude, you have some major nugget goggles on. Yes, fans see what they want to see cause they are fans. I don't notice the missed calls on the Jazz (and obviously there are some) just like you don't notice the missed calls on the nuggs. You see Melo get hacked and no call and get pissed, I see Fes standing straight up and down while Nene bowls into him for a layup and foul is called on Fes. It happens both ways and as fans, we only see the injustices on OUR team.

[SLC4L]

Just a few thoughts:

I can recall an instance when Boozer's hand literally grazed one of the Denver player's arm as he went for the layup and a foul was called (they even showed a replay from above looking down).

The problem with the Nuggets isn't because of George Karl, they've played together long enough to know his game, it's that Billups isn't taking control and the team is relying too much on Carmello, who has been in foul trouble the past 3 games.

While the Jazz have been to the line plenty of times, their % is quite dismal. So they're making up for lost free throws with points in the paint.

The ratio of Jazz assists to Nugget assists is ridiculous. You pass the ball and find the open man, you're golden.

This is the playoffs, you see harder fouls than you would in the regular season. The home crowd for any team is often referred to as the sixth man. My point, the crowds are going to be a lot more ruthless during the playoffs.

[SnyderBock]

Personal attacks Ronald-Dregan? Come on, it's all just fun and games here. Seriously, at some point about 3-4 weeks before the season ended, refs suddenly stopped calling a good 20% of the fouls against the Nuggets. Look at the statistics, free throw shots for Denver have plummeted over the final month of the season and it's carried over into the Utah series. It's severely impacted the Nuggets game and done so at a time when they are facing great adversity with the loss of Karl. Better off-the-ball movement and passing will help, but Billups has seemingly been AWOL. I don't know why Denver has stayed away from it's zone defense, it would shutdown this Utah offense far better. We'll see if Denver can make the series 3-2, it will take some major adjustments.

[Ronald-Dregan]

I am definitely pulling for OKC to beat the lakers. I wouldn't care if the jazz lost in second round, as long as OKC beats LA that would make my day. OKC in 6 baby!!!!!!!!!!!

[TonyAnderson]

Wouldn't it be crazy if the Jazz, as a 5 seed, had home court in the second round?

[wrendog]

Wouldn't it be crazy if the Jazz, as a 5 seed, had home court in the second round?

You mean like in 2007? :)

Yes, the Jazz were officially the 4 seed, but in reality, they were the 5 seed as the Rockets had home court.

[SnyderBock]

This seems to support my theory about the refs suddenly calling games differently against the Nuggets favor to a degree which completely ripped away a major part of their game--starting about the time Karl went out. You guys keep taking rips on me, calling me bias and say I'm just seeing what I want to see. I'm not, I'm reporting a completely non-bias observation I have made. And this apparent predigest against the Nuggets, by the refs is the main force giving a shorthand Utah--with less talent and experience--an advantage in this series. It's not something I'm making up. Now ESPN experts Chris Broussard & John Hollinger have written an article supporting exactly what I've been claiming all along; the ref are not calling the games fairly against Denver anymore and haven't for over a month, ever since Karl went out:

Nuggets, Dantley not getting calls (http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2010/insider/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=PERDiem-100428)
PER Diem: April 28, 2010
By John Hollinger
ESPN.com

As the Denver Nuggets prepare to tip off Game 5 Wednesday in their playoff series against the Utah Jazz, one of the big questions that must be asked regarding the Nuggets is this: What happened to their formerly reliable free throw advantage?

Denver led the league in free throw attempts and the Jazz fouled more than any other team in the NBA this season, so we might have expected a Nuggets parade to the line. Yet through four games it's Utah that enjoys a plus-13 advantage in free throw attempts.

What gives? Well, there appears to be more to the story, one that's been developing since interim coach Adrian Dantley replaced coach George Karl on the sideline. As our Chris Broussard pointed out earlier in the week, the Nuggets are getting fewer foul calls under their interim coach than they did under Karl. Denver went to the line 31.6 times per game under Karl but just 27.2 in the 19 regular-season games the Nuggets played under Dantley. In those games, Denver's plus-315 free throw edge under Karl transformed into a minus-14 deficit under Dantley.

In 61 games with Karl on the sideline this season, Denver averaged .392 free throw attempts per field goal attempt. That figure not only led the league by a wide margin but was also one of the best figures in recent NBA history.

With Dantley, that figure dropped all the way to .323, which was just slightly above the league average and the ninth-best figure in the league. (Note: To compare like pieces of fruit here, all Dantley data is regular season only.)

We're talking about a whopping 17.6 percent difference in free throw attempts per field goal attempt, and we're talking about a large-enough sample size -- 19 games, or nearly one-quarter of a season -- that it can't be dismissed as a short-term fluke.

My search for obvious explanations turned up little. Denver played eight times at home and 11 on the road, but it also played several weak defensive teams under Dantley -- including each of the bottom four in defensive efficiency.

Injuries was my next thought, as it might mean that players less likely to draw fouls were on the floor. But the only regular to miss significant time, forward Kenyon Martin, doesn't draw fouls at a high rate. In fact, he gets to the line dramatically less often than his most frequent replacement, Chris Andersen, and roughly as frequently as the two other players (Joey Graham and Johan Petro) who filled in for him. If anything, Martin's absence should have helped on that front.

One might think that the Nuggets attempted different shots, and that would account for the free throw disparity, but they really didn't. Denver attempted 1.9 percent fewer shots in the basket area under Dantley than under Karl. It's hard to imagine how that explains 17.7 percent fewer free throw attempts per field goal attempt.

Finally, you might think, maybe it's just one of those things -- an unusually huge random variation, but a random one nonetheless. Still, every other metric supports the hypothesis that Dantley is the Rodney Dangerfield of coaches...

CLICK HERE TO READ FULL ARTICLE! (http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2010/insider/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=PERDiem-100428)

[scottharding]

So the refs don't respect Dantley? Dantley is not as good at intimidating or badgering the refs?

Or have you and these journalists uncovered a conspiracy to eliminate Denver because we all know what a huge national following the utah Jazz have. Such a big-market team would surely mean better ratings for the league should they advance. Yes, it all adds up. The league is trying to create a clear path to the championship for the Jazz.

Or maybe.... maybe.... Denver doesn't respond to Dantely, and therefore they don't play as well. Maybe when Chris Anderson took himself out of game 4 and refused speak to his coaches it was an indication for a team that has fallen apart. You may notice as your digging through stats to uncover the scandals that in addition to shooting less free-throws, Denver is also assisting less on field goals, and rebounding less than they did under Karl.
There's a reason they're known as the "Thuggets." They're very undisciplined. Karl had found a way to ralley them, but now that he's gone, it appears it's not so different as the Iverson days. Remember those first round exits? Looking familiar? That line of thinking makes the most sense to me...
...But maybe I'm part of the conspiracy....

[TonyAnderson]

I think it's called playoff ball. There's a little more contact and physical play that is allowed. Denver needs to toughen up.

[CPVLIVE]

So the refs don't respect Dantley? Dantley is not as good at intimidating or badgering the refs?

Or have you and these journalists uncovered a conspiracy to eliminate Denver because we all know what a huge national following the utah Jazz have. Such a big-market team would surely mean better ratings for the league should they advance. Yes, it all adds up. The league is trying to create a clear path to the championship for the Jazz.


A little defensive are we? I just read the article and nowhere could I find Hollinger suggesting that there was a conspiracy here. He's found a statistical anomaly here and is merely suggesting a reason for it. Denver is shooting 17.7 percent fewer free throw attempts per field goal attempt (with approximately the same number of shots in the basket area) under Dantley versus Karl - that much is one of the few facts we have here. BTW, the statistics cited are from the regular season exclusively and do not include the playoff series with the Jazz. The Nuggets appear to be shooting the same shots as before, but are being fouled less. That's a huge variation that is not easily exlpained. Did the defense the Nuggets faced when Karl left suddenly get better? Did the Nuggets take worse shots? (he mentions that the shots are taken in the 'basket area') Did the Nuggets not 'respond to Dantley, and therefore they don't play as well' as suggested by you? I don't know but it's unlikely that any of those reasons can adequatley explain the 17.7 percent fewer free throw attempts per field goal attempt. Hollinger suggests the explanation is Dantley gets no respect. Well that's probably because the refs don't even know he's there. Dantley sits quietly on the bench as if he's waiting for a bus. During the playoffs you need an effective head coach, one who can advocate for your team, game plan, change line-ups, counter moves by the opposing coach etc, etc. If this wasn't the case then noone would be paying the big bucks to guys like Jackson and we could return to the days of player-coaches. Denver definitely needs to get to the rim and the free throw line to be effective- it's a big part of their game. Anyhow, You just have to hand it to the Jazz as they are clearly the better team right now. I'll conclude with a re-post of mine from March 25:

'I could be wrong but I don't see Denver being much of a factor from here on out. The Kenyon Martin injury hurt, but was manageable. The loss of Karl though, is turning out to be the back-breaker. I never have liked Karl much, but without him Denver is lost. Dantley is really clueless and the team seems to have lost any fire and is just going through the motions. The organization has declared Karl will be back in time for the playoffs, but that's looking like wishful thinking considering Karls recent rush to the emergency room with severe blood clots in his legs and lungs and his apparent inablility to communicate whatsoever. That doesn't sound like a man looking to return to NBA coaching any time soon if at all. Dallas will more than likely crush Denver on Monday. That will be the final game of a five game road trip for Denver that included two back to back games. After playing Orlando on Sunday I doubt Denver will give Dallas much of a game.'


EDIT: I posted this after watching Dantley enter the witness-protection program during the Mar 20th game versus Milwaukee.

[SnyderBock]

I think the refs are just calling the games different now, with Karl not in there running it. I don't think it's a conspiracy. I'm not even sure the refs are aware of it, but it is real and it's having a huge impact on the Nugget's game. They have gone from playing at an elite level, to playing at a .500 level since Karl went out and there has been no greater factor, then not getting the foul calls they have always got called over the last 2+ seasons. So far in tonights game, it has seemed much better game calling by the refs--I hope it stays this way. What is amounts to though, is that Denver was getting the calls that the elite teams get, like the Lakers, Spurs, Cavs and Celtics, then suddenly Karl goes out and they stop getting those calls all the elite teams get, for no apparent reason. It should have never gone down that way and I hope it stops now. The Nuggets were getting to the line at a historic rate, prior to loosing Karl and it might be possible the refs got together and said we need to make it a little harder for them to get to the line. I think that would be the extent of any conspiracy. It still wouldn't make it right, especially headed down the stretch and into the playoffs.

But much of this goes back to the regular season, it's not just playoff basketball. Denver has become frustrated by the ref game calling, they have become too forced on offense and too lax on defense. So TonyAnderson has a point, Denver needs to step it up, like they did last season in the playoffs. If Denver does, Utah is in trouble, because Denver can sweep a playoff series when at their best, they can win 3-4 games in a row and they only need 3 in a row.

[SLC4L]

:previous:

Haha! And you're complaining about not getting any calls.

[wrendog]

Well nuggies, there's your fouls!

[xseven]

Gotta hand it to Denver. They played the balanced offensive game that stupid melo whined about after losing three straight games.

Utah will wrap this up Friday.

[SnyderBock]

stupid melo whined about? He called his team out and they responded. The refs read ESPN's article and knew they better call this game right. There were a lot of fouls, but not many bad fouls. And I think Darrent Williams is stupid too. Also, loosing Okur helped Utah against Denver. Billups stepped up tonight and played the way everyone had been expecting him to play this whole series. JR Swish is back. Frenchie is Denver best post defender, not Kenyon. And don't call the Law son, cause the Jazz have a warrant and better not show their face in Denver again!

[Ronald-Dregan]

Good game overall
Much credit to the nuggs for playing good decent ball.
I thought nuggs actually played their "bread, and butter", which matches up great against Utah.. IT was a close game because Utah kept turning the ball over and over. Denver capitalized near the end more... The first 38 mins I thought Utah was definitely gonna pull it out, but Denver was actually picking us apart midway through 4th quarter. Damn fine game though, I wouldn't say Denver has gained momentum, but They showed signs of life, so kudos to Denver!!

As far as refs, I do notice the playoffs are officiated differently then regular season. I think it's because I watched this game at a bar (on TV rather than in person) When I'm at the game it's more emotional and hyped up.
Nothing we can do about it, as long as the stay consistent in officiating entire series I'm fine with it.

I am still quite confident jazz will take care of business Friday. gg nuggs!
Someone needs to tell Fesenko to be more alert and stop turning damn ball over :haha: . It's gonna be a war Got my ticks. already. :yes: :cool:

[delts145]

Dammit, I was hoping the Jazz would wrap it up last night. Oh well... Another game, and it's great for downtown business!

[SnyderBock]

May whoever takes this series, also take down the Lakers (assuming OKC doesn't come from behind and do so--which I don't expect to happen with their lack of experience).

The Jazz took one in Denver and all the Nuggets have to do is take one in Utah. That's it, just this one game in Utah is all Denver needs. I want to see a game 7, I don't want this series to end at 6, I love game 7's!

[scottharding]

I wasn't being defensive. I was just saying that the way Snyder was describing the Nuggets problems, it sounded as though he thought the refs were favoring Utah, which is a typical thing to say when you're favorite team is getting it's ass kicked and you don't want to admit that they're just getting beat.
Last night, the Nuggets got back to the way they played most of the season, and they got the calls because when they moved the ball they put the Jazz defense into a scramble. It's the same way the Jazz got calls in the last three games. I don't think the refs have favored Utah on purpose of subconsciencely. I think that when a player (Melo) keeps going one on one, and he's banging and swiping and stiff-arming his defender, and his defender bangs and slaps back, they don't call anything because they'd be calling double fouls all night. When the defense fouls because they got lost following the ball, that's an easier call.
Kudos to the Nuggets. They didn't lay down. I felt the Jazz played a good game for the most part, but Denver just wouldn't allow themselves to be put away.
They can't stop Deron Williams, but then the Jazz can't stop Melo. The team that gets better play from their bench wins this series.

[blm3034L!fe]

Plain and simple the Nuggets are not playing to thier potential, are the calls/no calls questionable? Damn right! But I think if the refs seen better ball playing from the Nuggets like last nights game. Then the calls would be more even. Either way if Denver can get a win game 6 Friday in Utah. Then I honestly believe they will come back to the Mile High and win the series... :fingerscrossed:

Oh and on a side note, I have noticed the past two games the Spazz are putting their acting to good use, like that bullshit D will pulled last night waving his hands around like someone hit him, Aflallo was no where near him D will just lost the ball. But I give him an A for the acting job to get yet another BAD CALL!!! Paaalease. For the simple fact that Utah Sucks I hope the Nuggs win the Next two games and shut all these Spazz fans up! Cause I'm pretty tired of hearing about it to be honest. Nuggs are the better team, better talent and skill it just hasn't reflected in this series, or the past 2 months really, ever since Coach George Karl has been out... I would llike to see how the Utarded Spazz would be performing if Sloan was MIA... If that were the case Denver would have already won this Series by 4 - 0 GURANTEED!!!!!!!

[SnyderBock]

See, this is all fun and games again! Aren't you Jazz fans glad Denver won, so we can keep on having more fun? Lets all wish hard for game 7, nothing will be better! I want GAME 7!

[scottharding]

Yeah, Snyderbock, those last posts were funny. You're right, this is a fun series. I for one, never expected an easy win for the Jazz last night. I'm a die hard Jazz fan, but I know Denver is a wicked good team. I'm just proud to see my team's got the balls and the pride to fight with a team like the Nuggets. And I think Nuggets fans should be proud too. I truly don't think either team is getting more/better calls than another. When Denver is at home, the calls fall a little in Denver's favor. When Utah is at home, we have the favor. That's home-court. But in all five games thus far, both teams have shown they've got talent and guts, and it's made for a great series. The West is so damn stacked, it could be any team on any given night. No team is a sure bet to beat any other.
Although I have to be honest. I don't want a game seven. haha. Of course, I want my Jazz to get it done in SLC.

[wrendog]

See, this is all fun and games again! Aren't you Jazz fans glad Denver won, so we can keep on having more fun? Lets all wish hard for game 7, nothing will be better! I want GAME 7!

Game 7's are great as long as my team wins! :D :D

[SLC4L]

Oh and on a side note, I have noticed the past two games the Spazz are putting their acting to good use, like that bullshit D will pulled last night waving his hands around like someone hit him, Aflallo was no where near him D will just lost the ball. But I give him an A for the acting job to get yet another BAD CALL!!! Paaalease.

Somebody wasn't watching Chris Andersen.

[delts145]

Suns beat Blazers 99-90 to advance to round 2

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700028601/Suns-beat-Blazers-99-90-to-advance-to-round-2.html

PORTLAND, Ore. — Jason Richardson scored 28 points, including five 3-pointers, and the Phoenix Suns advanced to the second round of the playoffs with a 99-90 victory over the Portland Trail Blazers in Game 6 on Thursday night...

.

[SLC Projects]

blm...
You think you're funny talking sheeit behind a computer screen? Your lil'Nuggets will have their ASSES handed to them on friday son!!!! Complain all you want Denva will never get to the finals again.How long has it been for you lames? Melo's a beeoch....Smith can't hit the broad-side of a barn outside of Denver....K-mart is just that "K-MART", a cheap store everyone can afford that sells crap. So I hope your lame ASS tunes into watching the second round JAZZ vs them FAKERS.:cheers: :cheers:

:previous:
LOL, that was funny. The Chicken Nuggets have NEVER even been to the finals. The only "Conference titles" they have was one they won back in 1976, but I believe that was the Denver Rockets? Not the Nuggets. So that doesn't really count then. But if you Nuggets fans want to count that then us Jazz fans might as well count that the Utah Stars won the 1971 ABA Championship. Case and point......When it comes with professional basketball Utah has been to the finals more then Denver. Maybe one day Denver you guys will make the finals in the NBA.:yes:

[KevinFromTexas]

Trash talking is one thing, speaking correctly is another.

Keep it civil and literate, folks.

[TonyAnderson]

No chance in the most intimidating place to play in the NBA, Nuggets. Sorry.

[FrancoRey]

All I ask is that you beat all the other douches left in the West. You would be the only one I support, since I hate the Fakers and the Spurms. Phoenix is okay I guess, but then that would mean supporting those who once trash-talked the worst of us three teams in this forum. :)

Good luck, Utah, you're gonna need it.

[xseven]

Gotta hand it to Denver. They played the balanced offensive game that stupid melo whined about after losing three straight games.

Utah will wrap this up Friday.

This.

[scottharding]

Wow, what a game. Both teams showed some metal. And the refs called it even. They called A LOT, but they did call it both ways. 91 total freethrows between the two teams, and both shot terrible from the freebee line.
Good win for the Jazz. We are the poster team of underdogs. The Boozer/Williams era has now won four playoff series, and had home court for only one of them. The Jazz have one- that's right, ONE- player on their team right now that was a lottery pick, and that's Deron Williams. Every other player was a late first round at best. Booz, Millsap, CJ, Okur, all second rounders. Mathews, Price, Gaines, all undrafted. But look at what they accomplish. I love it. It's so fun to root for them.
Go Jazz. For the love of God, shake the mental funk and give the Lakers Hell!

[SLC Projects]

Yes the Nuggets win and Jazz lose tonight . Pretty good day ;-)

:previous:
Yes the Jazz just ended the Nuggets season tonight. Guess that would be a pretty good day for us then. :haha:


I guess we now know who the TRUE northwest division champions are. Sure Denver might have won the northwest ( barely ) but we're the ones who will be moving on and sending you guys home for your long summer break.


:haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

[SLC4L]

I know you're happy projects, and I hate to be THAT guy, but I just want to remind you of this:

Jazz=:Titanic: :drowning: :dead:

Nice to see last season is repeating itself. I told you guys from the beginning.

This is why I said:

I've always had the attitude that "anything could happen," and that is why I remain optimistic about the Jazz. Nothing is set in stone until the season is over, and there are still 74 games left. Who knows, they could go on big win streak... the Rockets did like 30 games two seasons ago.

And what happened? They went on a 9 game win streak, had a terrific win-loss ratio starting in January, and are now in the western semi-finals.

And my favorite MLB team, the Red Sox, are doing the same thing right now, yet I remain hopeful. It's a LONG season and plenty can happen... it's like a reverse murphy's law.

Also, I'm not bringing this up to belittle you, just reminding you to stay optimistic when it comes to the Jazz and the slump they usually go through at some point in the season.

[TonyAnderson]

If the Jazz don't win it all, and I don't think they will, I'd love to see Phoenix and Steve Nash get a title.

And where's Greenbro when you need him? It would be nice to rub this in his Blazer-loving face.

[scottharding]

I'm with you Tony, on the Suns being my second pick behind the jazz. I'll definately be hoping to see them beat San Antonio. I'd love to see a Utah/Pheonix match up in the Western conference finals.

[Ronald-Dregan]

I would not like to see the suns...

We swept San Antonio

[shakman]

IMO Steve Nash deserves a ring; no if, and or buts. I like the Jazz but it would be nice to see the Suns win it all just so Nash can have a title as part of his Hall of Fame resume.

[TonyAnderson]

And Grant Hill :tup:

[blm3034L!fe]

Break out the Brooms LA is going to Sweep Utah!!! I hope neither Utah or LA make it to the SHIP! Well I guess I should rephrase that, I hope LA doesn't make it to the SHIP. Go PHX take out LA then Le-bra and the Cavs!!! :cheers:

[cadetwhite]

^Yeah, for all the shit utah fans talked in here it will be a pleasure to watch the Lakers beat them down, and I've never rooted for the Lakers in my life!

[TonyAnderson]

It is a bit amusing that you'd cheer for a rival that knocked you out of a chance at the Finals last year, but I don't blame you cadet. A less talented Jazz team with two key injuries beat up on a better Nuggets team. That has to REALLY hurt as a fan. A Nuggets team that had a shot this year to get to the finals, but instead just proved talent doesn't beat toughness. The Lakers have proven they have both, and I don't think it's a surprise to any Jazz fan that we lost both in LA. The fact that we were in both games and gave ourselves a chance to win is really the most I could hope for. We did the same in Denver and were able to get one, but this time we just barely came up short.

I'm loving the extra recognition the team is getting, as well as Salt Lake City and the incredible fans of Utah.

[cadetwhite]

^to be honest . . . I'd argue if I could. It was clear that Denver didn't put out playoff effort (except for a couple players). Utah wanted it more, they won it legitimately and I'll concede that. It kills me, cause the nuggets can be an amazing team when they get their shit together, they showed that in their regular season games against the Lakers. Until George Karl is back to 100% the nuggets are going nowhere, he is their backbone.

[SLC Projects]

^Yeah, for all the shit utah fans talked in here it will be a pleasure to watch the Lakers beat them down, and I've never rooted for the Lakers in my life!

:previous:
You guys are just pissed, because you guys got owned by the Jazz in the first round. Enjoy your long summer Denver. :haha: At least we can agree on never rooting for the Lakers.