[urban_planner]

Valery Construction has begun contruction on an 8 story apartment building on the corner of upper wentworth and stone church rd. The build will have retail on the ground floor with 63 dwelling units on the remaining 7 stories.

I have a B&W rendeing around as well and a crappy photocopy of a site plan.

Anyway I am suprised nobody has posted this yet.

I think its great that finally there will be something of good height on mountian south of the Linc.

[SteelTown]

You gotta post the rendering, we all love artist renderings.

[highwater]

Is it set back, or close to the street?

[FRM]

You gotta post the rendering, we all love artist renderings.

use your imagination, SteelTown :D

[SteelTown]

But I don't wanna!!

[markbarbera]

Valery Construction has begun contruction on an 8 story apartment building on the corner of upper wentworth and stone church rd. The build will have retail on the ground floor with 63 dwelling units on the remaining 7 stories.

I have a B&W rendeing around as well and a crappy photocopy of a site plan.

Anyway I am suprised nobody has posted this yet.

I think its great that finally there will be something of good height on mountian south of the Linc.

I noticed the foundation being prepared a couple weeks back and wondered what was being built here. I'm relieved it is an apartment building and not a gas station or fast food drive-thru.

Is it set back, or close to the street?

Judging by the layout of the foundation it won't be set back from the street. The size of the lot really wouldn't allow for a set back of any significance anyway.

This is a great example of proper infill intensification for the mountain. Hopefully we'll see much more of it. Kudos for Valery for doing a development like this.

[LikeHamilton]

From March 2007

That the Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing be advised that the City of Hamilton recommends the following prioritized proponents be approved under the Rental/Supportive component of the Canada-Ontario Affordable Housing Program:
i) T. Valeri Construction Limited, 480 Stone Church Road East new apartment construction, 63 units. $5.67 million

[matt602]

Suddenly my excitement for this project completely diminishes when I see the term "Affordable Housing".

[highwater]

Well, at least it's on the mountain and not downtown. Thank heaven for small mercies.

Does Valeri ever build anything that isn't subsidized?

[flar]

Suddenly my excitement for this project completely diminishes when I see the term "Affordable Housing".

Affordable housing is desperately needed. A growing proportion of the population in Hamilton (and other Canadian cities) is struggling with housing insecurity. The move to a service economy (which for many means working in retail, call centres and the like) leads to lower wages, which are then eaten up by increasing rents.

This is a good project precisely because it puts affordable housing somewhere other than the downtown core.

[matt602]

Yah... I admit I said my comment with hesitation, as the point you raised certainly came to mind. Still, I can't help but vision a ghetto building in my head when I see the term "affordable housing". I agree though that it is good that this development is out of the downtown core. I am still really angry about the Connaught thing and it has really tainted my view on affordable housing projects.

[bigguy1231]

Passed by this location Friday. They have the construction crane in place finally. This construction seems to be moving at a snails pace.

[geoff's two cents]

Can't help but wonder why this is being built so far from the proposed rapid transit lines on Upper James and Rymal Rd. Is the operating assumption that even people on social assistance are expected to drive cars to get where they need to go?

[flar]

Actually, the fact that a crane is up makes this infinitely faster than almost all of the downtown projects listed here.

And the norm these days is for people on social assistance to be pushed to the edge of cities and destined to a life of 2 hour bus rides. Hamilton is just getting on board this trend, but Ottawa and Toronto already have it down pat.

[bigguy1231]

Can't help but wonder why this is being built so far from the proposed rapid transit lines on Upper James and Rymal Rd. Is the operating assumption that even people on social assistance are expected to drive cars to get where they need to go?

Those rapid transit lines are 30 years away at least and this building was planned before there was even talk of LRT. Besides that there is a bus stop right in front of the place.

[geoff's two cents]

^Fair enough, though it still strikes me as Mississauga- or Burlington-esque to plunk an eight-storey building (social housing or no) in the middle of a mass of one and two-storey single family residences sprawling as far as the eye can see.

[bigguy1231]

^Fair enough, though it still strikes me as Mississauga- or Burlington-esque to plunk an eight-storey building (social housing or no) in the middle of a mass of one and two-storey single family residences sprawling as far as the eye can see.

There are other apartment buildings in the area, just down the street on Upper Wentworth. There are also a number of seniors buildings and nursing homes in the area. Most of that area is townhouses, not so much single family homes.

[hamiltonguy]

Can't help but wonder why this is being built so far from the proposed rapid transit lines on Upper James and Rymal Rd. Is the operating assumption that even people on social assistance are expected to drive cars to get where they need to go?

It's 1) Where there is land available and 2) has good bus connections to Limeridge Mall (which is supposed to eventually be a terminus for a branch of the A line and a stop on the T line) and is only a 2-3 minute bus ride/ a 10 minute walk to a prospective A line station at Stone Church and Upper James.

[hamiltonguy]

There are other apartment buildings in the area, just down the street on Upper Wentworth. There are also a number of seniors buildings and nursing homes in the area. Most of that area is townhouses, not so much single family homes.

Living in that area I can count about 5-6 apartments/ retirement homes in close walking distance. As well there are many townhomes in the vicinity, Catholic and Public High Schools (not quite sure about elementary schools), and it is close to many parks and shops, as well as the police station and YMCA.

Most of the land around here is not being developed as detached housing but as semi-detached, townhomes, or as apartments.

[geoff's two cents]

Sorry folks, I was just going off what I saw on Google street view. Something still doesn't seem right to me, but then again I'm not a southern Ontarian, and plunking larger buildings on the outskirts of town, instead of closer to job centers and in more pedestrian-friendly environments (a la Mississauga and Burlington), was a bit of an urban/suburban culture shock for this Vancouverite. Don't take offense.

I've also done my share of bus-riding out to Limeridge and back and hated it, every single time (what I wouldn't have given for some decent clothing shops downtown!) - long waits, narrow sidewalks, crowded buses, you name it. My bet is most of these people, assisted housing or no, will be driving, and I don't blame them.

[hamiltonguy]

Sorry folks, I was just going off what I saw on Google street view. Something still doesn't seem right to me, but then again I'm not a southern Ontarian, and plunking larger buildings on the outskirts of town, instead of closer to job centers and in more pedestrian-friendly environments (a la Mississauga and Burlington), was a bit of an urban/suburban culture shock for this Vancouverite. Don't take offense.

I've also done my share of bus-riding out to Limeridge and back and hated it, every single time (what I wouldn't have given for some decent clothing shops downtown!) - long waits, narrow sidewalks, crowded buses, you name it. My bet is most of these people, assisted housing or no, will be driving, and I don't blame them.

To be honest I can't see any place for parking on site even for the retail. The buses are packed in this area at rush hour.

[bigguy1231]

To be honest I can't see any place for parking on site even for the retail. The buses are packed in this area at rush hour.

From the looks of it the parking will be on the East side of the building along Limeridge.

[bigguy1231]

Sorry folks, I was just going off what I saw on Google street view. Something still doesn't seem right to me, but then again I'm not a southern Ontarian, and plunking larger buildings on the outskirts of town, instead of closer to job centers and in more pedestrian-friendly environments (a la Mississauga and Burlington), was a bit of an urban/suburban culture shock for this Vancouverite. Don't take offense.

I've also done my share of bus-riding out to Limeridge and back and hated it, every single time (what I wouldn't have given for some decent clothing shops downtown!) - long waits, narrow sidewalks, crowded buses, you name it. My bet is most of these people, assisted housing or no, will be driving, and I don't blame them.

That area has been established for a number of years now. Most of the building going on there now is just infill.

[hamiltonguy]

From the looks of it the parking will be on the East side of the building along Limeridge.

That's what I thought but to be honest it doesn't look like it could fit more than 5-6 cars.

[Dwils01]

Photo from today by me.
480 Stone Church Road. It looks almost complete.
http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m498/DWils01/Cities%20across%20the%20GTHA/001-2.jpg

[Dwils01]

From Today

480 Stone Church parking lot.
http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m498/DWils01/Cities%20across%20the%20GTHA/017.jpg

480 Stone Church.
http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m498/DWils01/Cities%20across%20the%20GTHA/018.jpg

Photos by me.

[Dwils01]

Past by the building today and there are residents living their now so even though the landscaping is not finished, I believe this building is know completed.

[DC1983]

Also take note that the promised retail component never materialized. Shocker.

Honestly.. I hate this building! Desnity is great, but it's in a single-family-home mecca! There are no other buildings even remotely close to this size in this area.

It's ugly, it stands out like a sore (retailess) thumb. The set-back kills the urbanity of this project, and doesn't help the Upp Went/Stonechurch corner at all.

Not a Bitter Billy or anything today, just really dissapointed w/ this development.

[bornagainbiking]

Imagine that this building is occupied by empty nesters that want to be close to the grandkids. Or downsized and sold and still have friends closeby. Any building that is structurally sound and safe is good. Imagine the view.
People living in a new clean condo spending money in town. Density go up not out. This is not a bad thing. With people come business, Necessity is the mother of invention.:banana::banana:
If the units are selling someone wants them, to each it's own.

[bigguy1231]

I have an aunt and uncle who just moved into the building. They are both in their eighties and moved from a rural area just to be closer to their family. So Bornagainbiking you hit the nail on the head with your observations.

[DC1983]

Imagine that this building is occupied by empty nesters that want to be close to the grandkids. Or downsized and sold and still have friends closeby. Any building that is structurally sound and safe is good. Imagine the view.
People living in a new clean condo spending money in town. Density go up not out. This is not a bad thing. With people come business, Necessity is the mother of invention.:banana::banana:
If the units are selling someone wants them, to each it's own.

There's nothing around for an 80 y/o to shop at? Where? The Dance Supplies store across the street?

Sure, these 80 y/os may be driving to the nearest mall/plaza. I hope all the banks in their areas have their insurance paid up to date, cuz there's gonna be a lot more cars thru their front windows in this area ;)

Seriously though, even for Hamilton standards.. this development is a FLOP!

[bigguy1231]

It's just up the street from Limeridge mall. I think it may be only 2 bus stops away from the mall. It's not like it's in the middle of nowhere.

[DC1983]

It's just up the street from Limeridge mall. I think it may be only 2 bus stops away from the mall. It's not like it's in the middle of nowhere.

Then why didn't they build this building IN the Limeridge Mall pkng lot (overflow closest to Limeridge/Upp Went). They would have been ZERO stops from a Transit Node.

The defeatist attitude in Hamilton is really sad, "Well it's better than what was there before" or "At least it adds density" is a weak argument. Sorry.

Anyway, this is just my two cents. I wish we would stop hating on Toronto and actually look to them for urban planning guidance! I can think of at least 3 mall pkng lots which have been and/or are under redevelopment: Sherway Gardens (2 + 1 condo towers), Dufferin/Lawrence (2 condo towers U/C), Don Mills Mall (Shopps at Don Mills walkable outdoor shopping ctr + Parkade + Condo tower).

In Hamilton, a mall on our A-Line Rapid Transit corridor was converted into a Big Box Bonanza where it's stores face inside a giant pkng lot, leaving no room for possible residential development.. ON AN LRT CORRIDOR!
..You gotta admit somethin's wrong w/ our planning dep't when..

[markbarbera]

I will be up that way this weekend, and will reserve my opinion until I have had a first-hand look at the development rather than making a quick judgement on it based on a photo.

Having said that, I seem to recall seeing ground floor space that looked like was geared for retail/commercial use last time I was up that way (I think the big Available sign in the photo is for leasing the commercial space). It sometimes takes a while for retail to commit to a new building. The Gore building at King and John is still trying to find tenants, as is the Spallaci Building further east on King, and those buildings have been completed for several years now.

Assuming there is indeed no retail space available here, there are some shops within a couple blocks of the site. There's a strip mall at Stone Church and Redmond and another at U. Wentworth and Pescara, both within a 5 minute walk, and the mall with the Food Basics is a 10-15 minute walk south to Rymal. And, as pointed out by bigguy1231, the site has (relatively) frequent HSR service at its doorstep.

[markbarbera]

I was by this site and can confirm that there is ground floor retail space as was stated in the original site proposal. The space is vacant, and there is no sign indicating who a future tenant may be. Judging by the layout, I would guess it is geared to accompdate a convenience store and professional services i.e. hairstylist, health services.

[bigguy1231]

Then why didn't they build this building IN the Limeridge Mall pkng lot (overflow closest to Limeridge/Upp Went). They would have been ZERO stops from a Transit Node.

The defeatist attitude in Hamilton is really sad, "Well it's better than what was there before" or "At least it adds density" is a weak argument. Sorry.

Anyway, this is just my two cents. I wish we would stop hating on Toronto and actually look to them for urban planning guidance! I can think of at least 3 mall pkng lots which have been and/or are under redevelopment: Sherway Gardens (2 + 1 condo towers), Dufferin/Lawrence (2 condo towers U/C), Don Mills Mall (Shopps at Don Mills walkable outdoor shopping ctr + Parkade + Condo tower).

In Hamilton, a mall on our A-Line Rapid Transit corridor was converted into a Big Box Bonanza where it's stores face inside a giant pkng lot, leaving no room for possible residential development.. ON AN LRT CORRIDOR!
..You gotta admit somethin's wrong w/ our planning dep't when..

They didn't build in the Limeridge parking lot because they didn't own that property. It's pure folly to believe that this city can tell any developer how to spend their money.

As for Toronto thats a whole different kettle of fish. The demand there is much different than it is here. Because of that demand, the city can demand whatever they want and the developers will comply, because they know they can basically charge whatever they want and the condo's will be snapped up.

As for the former mall on Upper James, I live 3 blocks from it and won't go near the place. I agree with you, it is a bad setup. If they do happen to build the LRT on Upper James, which is nothing more than a pipedream that will never come to be, then those steel and stucco buildings could easily be torn down and replaced if the owner sees an opportunity to profit from doing so.

[DC1983]

They didn't build in the Limeridge parking lot because they didn't own that property. It's pure folly to believe that this city can tell any developer how to spend their money.

As for Toronto thats a whole different kettle of fish. The demand there is much different than it is here. Because of that demand, the city can demand whatever they want and the developers will comply, because they know they can basically charge whatever they want and the condo's will be snapped up.

As for the former mall on Upper James, I live 3 blocks from it and won't go near the place. I agree with you, it is a bad setup. If they do happen to build the LRT on Upper James, which is nothing more than a pipedream that will never come to be, then those steel and stucco buildings could easily be torn down and replaced if the owner sees an opportunity to profit from doing so.

You're right, the City has no right as-to how a private developper spends his/her own money! However, it is the City's responsibility to implement Smart Design that coincide w/ their official plans.

I'm not disputing it's contribution to the City's density, just it's implementation in this case. Y'all know my reasoning, so I wont repeat again.

Said Mountain Plaza (and Centre Mall to boot) are prime examples of poor City planning and allowing developers to walk all over us. "But at least it's something" <-- Ugh.

[bigguy1231]

You're right, the City has no right as-to how a private developper spends his/her own money! However, it is the City's responsibility to implement Smart Design that coincide w/ their official plans.

I'm not disputing it's contribution to the City's density, just it's implementation in this case. Y'all know my reasoning, so I wont repeat again.

Said Mountain Plaza (and Centre Mall to boot) are prime examples of poor City planning and allowing developers to walk all over us. "But at least it's something" <-- Ugh.

The building does coincide with the city's official plan. They are currently developing a new plan to intensify developement in and around Limeridge Mall. They are looking at allowing for redevelopement of the current strip plaza's to include high density housing with first floor commercial.

As for the redevelopement of the Centre mall and the Mountain plaza it's kind of hard for the city to change the rules for something that is already zoned for that use. To do so is just asking for an OMB revue and enormous expense with very little chance of winning.

[DC1983]

^^ Good read: http://raisethehammer.org/article/1383/killing_development_dead