[vanman]

Could Indy roar back to Vancouver?
VANESSA YEE
METRO VANCOUVER
Published: November 04, 2010 5:46 a.m.

Could the defunct Molson Indy return to Vancouver?

Yesterday, Octane Motorsports Events announced the cancellation of the 2011 Edmonton Indy and said they are considering holding the event in other cities, including Calgary, Quebec City and Vancouver.

“There is no doubt that Vancouver is an interesting, major international city,” Normand Prieur, spokesman fot Octane Motorsports, said yesterday.

Walt Judas, a vice-president with Tourism Vancouver, said the event would be welcome as it was popular and generated a lot of buzz.

“It kept locals in the city on Labour day when people normally leave town.”

Vision Coun. Geoff Meggs said people would be ecstatic about having Indy return to Vancouver. The track would have to be close to transit and would need room for bleachers, he added.

In spite of the popularity of the event, NPA Coun. Suzanne Anton said hosting the event would likely be quite challenging.

“I am a fan of the event,” said Anton, but the organization would first have to “iron out the problems” because “much of the course is now the Olympic Village.” The Molson Indy was last held in Vancouver during the summer of 2004 but was cancelled due lack of sponsorships and the pending construction of the Olympic Village in Southeast False Creek.
http://www.metronews.ca/vancouver/local/article/682198--could-indy-roar-back-to-vancouver

[djh]

“I am a fan of the event,” said Anton, but the organization would first have to “iron out the problems” because “much of the course is now the Olympic Village.” The Molson Indy was last held in Vancouver during the summer of 2004 but was cancelled due lack of sponsorships and the pending construction of the Olympic Village in Southeast False Creek.


It seems as if everybody is a big fan of somebody or something when they're gone. I don't remember the city council being very supportive on the Indy when it was here. I seem to remember them raising issues about noise, pollution, costs of policing, rubbish, crime, public safety...but I may be wrong.

Also, I thought the reason the Indy left was because of lack of political and public support, not due to lack of sponsorship? Olympic Village construction was nowhere near started when they left, either. Is this revisionist reporting?

[Smooth]

Funny that Geoff Meggs would like to see the Indy back here but then wants the viaducts removed. The whole reason the Indy was able to work at the south end of False Creek was because the viaducts allowed traffic to bypass that area.

I realize that if the Indy returned then it would probably have to be in a different part of the city. If I were to make a dream track it would run around the eastern portion of Stanley Park (eg. along Stanley Park Dr. then through the park via Pipeline Rd.). I think there would be too many issues with access though.

Realistically, a new track would probably have to go to one of Vancouver's 2nd tier airports.

[go_leafs_go02]

Imagine the environment?!?!!? :yuck:

:haha:

[vanlaw]

I use to be a big fan of Indy, but the whole CART - IRL split debacle, which I believe happened soon after Vancouver lost its race, really screwed the whole thing up. People, including me, lost interest, and NASCAR’s popularity took a huge upswing. Even being back to one series, the interest just isn’t the same as it was before the split.

They really f’d the whole thing up. I can’t remember who was behind the spilt (Ganassi?) but big egos got in the way. Too bad.

[Yume-sama]

Imagine the environment?!?!!? :yuck:

:haha:

We could make them all use ethanol. Sure, it would take away an entire Countries food supply for the amount they'd have to use, but at least we'd feel better about ourselves. :P

It would be cool to have the event back. I was too young to even remember it the last time I went~

[wrenegade]

The Molson Indy and "Vancouver Green Capital" a match made in heaven! LOL!

I'd love to see the Indy come back, but would be sorely disappointed if it happened anywhere outside of False Creek. That is what made it so great. Hosting it out at Boundary Bay/Pitt Meadows/Langley airport would not be nearly as fun. The track would have to be totally redesigned, but I'm sure something could work.

As much as I'd love to see a race through Stanley Park (kinda like the Albert Park circuit in Melbourne) any serious mention of that would have environmentalists heads exploding everywhere.

[BCPhil]

Yeah, that's one of the problems with finishing off the rest of False creek. That space was handy for events, whether it be Indy, Cirque, Red Bull Fluntag, or whatever we need for major events like the Olympics. Prime event space right in the middle of downtown Vancouver will be hard to find for events that can't fit indoors.

Indy around the redone BC Place, past Science World, and brushing up against the Olympic Village, would be really marketable on TV, especially after our notoriety for hosting the Olympics, and keep a place for us on US TV every year.

You could go around BC place on Expo and Pacific blvds, down Quebec (still using the parking lot as part of the 2 way action) and make some kind of loop using 1st, Ontario and 2nd.

But it would be great if, when designing the rest of the developments around False creek, we left the people who are unlucky enough to live there some space so they can enjoy city wide events.

[officedweller]

We could make them all use ethanol. Sure, it would take away an entire Countries food supply for the amount they'd have to use, but at least we'd feel better about ourselves. :P


Indy cars DO use ethanol.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IndyCar_Series

It's the Nascars and club cars that don't.

[jlousa]

Lack of space? Easy solution, install stands along creekside park/Skate Park and along the Science world parking lot, and on the closed off intersections all along the course, no need to touch private property. The kicker here, first every indoor section of race track, have the pits, and start finish line inside the dome with thousands of fans able to watch from the stands.

PS I know it's impractical as the dome isn't long enough to hold the pitlane but it would be pretty cool if it were possible.

[jsbertram]

Funny that Geoff Meggs would like to see the Indy back here but then wants the viaducts removed. The whole reason the Indy was able to work at the south end of False Creek was because the viaducts allowed traffic to bypass that area.

I realize that if the Indy returned then it would probably have to be in a different part of the city. If I were to make a dream track it would run around the eastern portion of Stanley Park (eg. along Stanley Park Dr. then through the park via Pipeline Rd.). I think there would be too many issues with access though.

Realistically, a new track would probably have to go to one of Vancouver's 2nd tier airports.

Run the track up Georgia & down Dunsmuir over the Viaducts, with the hairpin turn at Gore & Prior.

Or would that make Megg's head explode?

Gotta admit, an accident on a viaduct would be s*p*e*c*t*a*c*u*l*a*r. (so would an accident falling OFF the viaducts).

sigh.
ain't gonna happen there.
(double sigh)

[LeftCoaster]

How about one of these two tracks?

The first one is much cooler but would piss off about 20 thousand residents, the second one is much less cool but would affect fewer residential areas. The third one is the environmentalists nightmare.

http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=111983895417546012298.0004945bd36b163e013c7&ll=49.274385,-123.113093&spn=0.01204,0.042272&t=h&z=15

Disclaimer* I know nothing about IRL and how long the track should be, but those general areas could support track changes to shorten or lengthen and make more turns as necessary.

[jlousa]

1st track definitely awesome but it would be way too long, eliminate all 3 bridges and be a logistically nightmare to implement will all those intersection closures, besides it would be a no go as it would also need to close down the burrard bike lane.

2nd one I think would be impractical because of the major long straight aways, and then the impossible grade at the hill at GNW and Clark.

Perhaps UBC could offer up some interesting routing, Richmond might also be viable and has rapid transit easily available.

[LeftCoaster]

Haha I was going to make a joke about the the bike track in the first lane... although I'm sure we would live without it for a day I dont think Gregor could handle it optically. The first track would leave The Granville Bridge open though, as it passes under at both pacific and Lamey's. Is it too long? Like I said I dont know how long an IRL track is supposed to be, but couldnt they just do fewer laps?

Forgot about the hill at the end of GNW, that would certainly screw that routing up... maybe the track could cut left at glen and a temp structure could link the two sides of glen?

[Distill3d]

LeftCoaster:

I liked your concepts. Save for shutting down all 3 downtown bridges, I found the first course would be too long. Toronto's circuit is just shy of 3 KM, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve (Canada's F1 circuit) is about 4 km long an its been used for Indy.

Anyhow, I came up with a couple concepts of my own. 2 Downtown, 1 to piss off the residents around the PNE, and 2 at SFU.

Vancouver Indy Street Course Concepts (http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=117855727029797559766.0004945f99c78e74087c1&ll=49.290265,-123.123511&spn=0.004562,0.011362&t=k&z=17)

jhousla:

I'm not sure the grade of that hill would be that much of an issue. Indy deals with worse than that with Laguna Seca's "corkscrew", and they do alright.

[jsbertram]

Haha I was going to make a joke about the the bike track in the first lane... although I'm sure we would live without it for a day I dont think Gregor could handle it optically. The first track would leave The Granville Bridge open though, as it passes under at both pacific and Lamey's. Is it too long? Like I said I dont know how long an IRL track is supposed to be, but couldnt they just do fewer laps?

Forgot about the hill at the end of GNW, that would certainly screw that routing up... maybe the track could cut left at glen and a temp structure could link the two sides of glen?

I think racing up the GNW hill to Clarke would look terrific with the cars getting some air over the top.

Not unlike Steve McQueen racing though the hills of San Fancisco in Bullitt.

[wrenegade]

No offense, but it seems like not many of you know too much about road racing. Most of those circuits don't seem to offer much, if anything, in the ways of overtaking opportunities. Also, race courses need to be wide. As cool as it would be to have the track use the Burrard, Granville or Cambie bridges, the normal one lane on/off ramps wouldn't work, and using the major ramps would disrupt traffic like crazy. Also, the logistics of some of those courses wouldn't work at all. There needs to be room for a pit lane (and entry/exits) and the area for the teams and trailers. I think that around False Creek is the only place where we could realistically have a track, and probably only for a couple more years before Concord's NEFC land and the Plaza of Nations is redeveloped. Anyways, here's my crack at it. There would need to be some small modifications around some corners (specifically in the area around Quebec & Science World to make the chicane work) and the pit straight.

Vancouver Street Circuit (http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&vps=1&jsv=298d&oe=UTF8&msa=0&msid=103813227275903811798.000495cff0e148db79915)

[physicist1028]

I thought I'd throw a few of my ideas into the ring here...

Vancouver Indy Course Proposals (http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=116143850170182901801.0004960560b22ff77fa89&t=h&z=13)

[hollywoodnorth]

I thought I'd throw a few of my ideas into the ring here...

Vancouver Indy Course Proposals (http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=116143850170182901801.0004960560b22ff77fa89&t=h&z=13)

PNE is a good idea ... lots of room for grandstands, etc


but I think Surrey Central would work best .... multiple skytrain stations .... bus connections, parking out the ass, room for grandstands and all that in the parking lots along King George and cross streets themselves.

[peterprinciple]

I think the Indy would be right at home in Surrey.

[jlousa]

Wouldn't that interfer with the Nascar Truck series that occurs in Surrey? ;)
I'd love to see Indy return to Vancouver, but don't think it's possible to do in the urban setting that would make our city shine on tv. Not sure having the race out in Surrey would be as benefical but I'd be fine with it around the Surrey Central area.

[Coldrsx]

Indy in surrey? haha...

Auto racing is about speed, sex, allure, money, entertainment...

[Nutterbug]

Wouldn't that interfer with the Nascar Truck series that occurs in Surrey? ;)

How about the '75 Mustangs that they leave rusting on their front yard? Do they ever take them out for a drag?

[cornholio]

There are lots of options still available, one I would think would be to loop it around the stadiums and then take it down Cambie street bridge and loop it back across it back to the stadiums. Would have to close Expo boulevard, Cambie street bridge and 2nd street in the Cambie bridge area but it would be long enough with minimal disruptions to residents and plenty of straight ways with Cambie street bridge being wide enough I think to handle a track in each direction.

The viaducts could also be made use of but that would likely result in more disruptions to residents and require the closer of Main street and pretty much Cambie bridge and cut of the Spectrum towers which would be a no go.

Another option is to make use of false creek by using linked up barges to create a track but that might be too difficult to do(can even use barges for grandstands which would be relatively simple).

Also as Jlousa mentioned BC Place can be used for a loop inside though the entrances might be a bit narrow for two tracks and running it straight through would screw up the straight way along Expo which should be made good use off.

Good thing is that they can make this a yearly event and still design and build the developments in such a way as to allow the event to take place after the area builds up...though im not sure what the developers would say about that(doubt it would benefit their marketing strategy) and im sure there would be some future residents complaining regardless of what they sign off on as far as noise and events in the area go.

Edit: The one that would use Cambie Bridge would be 5.5km in length if it looped around the Stadiums and looped down Quebec with a turn around infront of Science world. On Cambie bridge the track can take the south off ramp across 2nd and loop back up on to the bridge. Lots of locations for grandstands and maybe they can build one up to the bridge height on the city owned land by the Olympic village(next to the bridge).

[hollywoodnorth]

another great location IMO would be the Pitt Meadows, Boundary Bay or Abbotsford Airports ... but transit would be a major issue

[Nutterbug]

another great location IMO would be the Pitt Meadows, Boundary Bay or Abbotsford Airports ... but transit would be a major issue

Could event organizers rent shuttle buses?

[Denscity]

Indy in surrey? haha...

Auto racing is about speed, sex, allure, money, entertainment...

I bet a race in Surrey would look better on tv than Edmonton's does. Isnt it on an abandoned landing strip?

[logan5]

If we built a permanent track somewhere in the suburbs, we would certainly attract some major races. Certainly an Indy Car race, maybe F1, who knows? And there are plenty of other racing series that we could host.

I would gladly give up some farm land for a raceway, although that would never fly. But I'm sure there are plenty of possible sites.

[Vancity]

Surrey is a possible location for Indy. What about New West? Richmond? Burnaby?

[hollywoodnorth]

Could event organizers rent shuttle buses?

yes but from experience I can tell you shuttle buses are always dicey. having the race run by 2 skytrain stations like it could in Downtown Surrey and it did in Downtown Vancouver is a much much better situation.

thinking about it more .... Burnaby in the Lake City area could be a viable location as well with plenty of transit (2xskytrain stations) and wide open streets that could easily be blocked off for a week without causing a headache for too many people.

[red-paladin]

Surrey is a possible location for Indy. What about New West? Richmond? Burnaby?

New West?! New West is barely fit to drive through already, I don't think it could support an Indy. In any case, the NIMBYs don' shoot down traffic projects they'll even benefit from so I doubt they'd allow that.

[Denscity]

How does super dense Singapore have a F1 race right amongst its towerscape, at night no less, and there's no room in Vancouver?

[jlousa]

It's F1, and it's Singapore. Could Vancouver hold a Indy race downtown, sure it's physically possible, but it doesn't make it any more likely to occur.

[go_leafs_go02]

Surrey City Centre makes the most sense if you ask me.

[CPE]

I know it would never happen, but I always thought it would be sweet if the city properly paved the roads around Stanley Park and used them as a racecourse. There's some real nice turns on that road.

[ckkelley]

I know it would never happen, but I always thought it would be sweet if the city properly paved the roads around Stanley Park and used them as a racecourse. There's some real nice turns on that road.

Cool idea. One that would surely send any number of groups into an apoplectic fit.

[proudcanuck]

I bet a race in Surrey would look better on tv than Edmonton's does. Isnt it on an abandoned landing strip?

Have you watched the Edmonton Indy race? Edmonton has a great location for their race. They race on the City Centre airport. In 2010 they closed 1 of the 2 runways. The indy race was moved to a new layout onto this closed runway in 2011 and it made for better racing and the fans are closer to the track.

I have been to this race in 2006, 2007 and 2009 and they put on a great event. I attended every Molson Indy Vancouver from 1993 through the last race in 2004. I watch every IndyCar race and follow the series in great detail. A race in Surrey has no cosmopolitan appeal... there is no great scenery. The Edmonton event has more than enough run off area so the drivers are pushing the cars to the limits and beyond. You don't get that on the closed confined street courses. The sightlines are amazing... being able to see 75% of a lap from your seat rather than a few seconds live and then the rest on the big screens... I'd make that trip to Edmonton any day!

And what promotor is going to step up and promote an IndyCar race in Surrey. The sanctioning fee alone that IndyCar would demand, not a small amount. I would love to see it happen, but I'm a little more nailed down to reality than some I guess. The only way the Vancouver area will see another IndyCar race in its future is in the downtown core. Anything else is sure failure.

And in case anyone is wondering, I was born in Surrey and I live in Surrey, and as far as I am concerned the Edmonton Indy is the only worthwhile reason to go to Edmonton!

[physicist1028]

If anyone's interested, I added a few new proposals to my earlier link.

Lower Mainland Indy Proposals (http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?msid=216164792646855276010.0004960560b22ff77fa89&msa=0&ll=49.237776,-123.135796&spn=0.191659,0.445976)

[Coldrsx]

I bet a race in Surrey would look better on tv than Edmonton's does. Isnt it on an abandoned landing strip?

You tell me(all my photos)

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x164/coldrsx/indy%202011/DSC_0983.jpg

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x164/coldrsx/indy%202011/DSC_0873.jpg

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x164/coldrsx/indy%202011/DSC_0857.jpg
all photos of my time there here:

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=21404&highlight=indy

[proudcanuck]

The idea of of the Indy moving to the PNE grounds and Whalley was floated in 1997 for the 1998 race and it was heavily opposed by local residents in both instances.