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vanlaw
Jan 27, 2017, 1:08 AM
According to a guy on A.net (who has a grand total of 5 posts) a YVR source said Aeroflot, Turkish and Qatar are interested in flying to YVR pending government approval.

I believe about none of it, short of Turkish and Qatar having "interest", but nothing more than that.

But it's been quiet here lately so I figured what the hell.

I agree that none of this will likely come to fruition but Aeroflot would actually be interesting. YVR-SVO is only marginally further than YVR-FRA, they have a fairly modern fleet and good connections to eastern Europe, central Asia and Delhi. YVR-SVO-DEL is actually shorter than through FRA or HKG.

Alpine
Jan 27, 2017, 2:11 AM
It would probably be sufficient for QR to get a 3x weekly YVR-DOH service via a 359 or 789, but they'll probably want to shoehorn in double daily 388s or 779Xs because that's the classic ME3 business strategy.

And speaking of QR, slavery in Qatar is not just limited to construction of the 2022 World Cup stadiums. It's also practiced on their airlines. (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/the-truth-about-the-luxury-of-qatar-airways/)

Anyway, on a lighter note, I'm surprised that JAL has stuck with 788s for service to YVR. JL17/18 has been operated with a 788 (161 seats!) since Winter 2014. In the pre-bankruptcy-and-3.11 days, JAL had double daily 744s; but after going bankrupt and after the 3.11 earthquake, it was gradually reduced to a daily 772, then a daily 763, before switching to a 788. For comparison, AC3/4 used to be operated by 333s and 763s with overhead monitors; nowadays, it's a mix of 789s and 77Ws.

And since I'm on the subject of the history of TCON aircraft at YVR, if you go only a few years back, the landscape at YVR looked very different:


LHR: BA had a daily 744 (12 weekly 744s in summer), AC854/855 was operated by a mix of 763s, 333s and 343s (again, with overhead monitors; such old aircraft either got Project XM, were sent to Rouge, or are retired)
FRA: LH sent over 343s, then ultra-long 346s, before switching to 744s (which did not, as I erroneously said in a previous post, have overhead monitors, but full AVOD)
China + HK: CA 333s and AC 763s to PEK; MU 333s and AC 763s to PVG; service to Guangzhou didn't even start until 2011; CX had double daily 744s to HKG (until 9/11 and SARS) and I think AC flew 343s before switching to 5 weekly 77Ls.
Other Asia + Oceania: AC 763s did the YVR-HNL-SYD route (only switching to 77Ls when the route was extended to Toronto); AC flew 762s (!) to ICN (not sure about KE). As for Taiwan and the Phillippines, I'm not sure.


I think the only thing that's stayed consistent is KLM, with 5 weekly 772s in summer and 5 weekly 333s (mixed in with 332s) at other times.

Of course, this isn't too far back in history, but that's only because I'm a young whippersnapper. There will be users on this forum who are old enough to remember BA using 742Bs (747-200B) for service to LHR. And on that subject, what was the history of BA's service to YVR? I found an A.net thread (http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=367679) about BA's history to Sea-Tac, but nothing about YVR. Did BA have standalone direct flights on 747-100s separate from LHR-SEA-YVR services? What's the deal?

casper
Jan 27, 2017, 5:03 AM
It would probably be sufficient for QR to get a 3x weekly YVR-DOH service via a 359 or 789, but they'll probably want to shoehorn in double daily 388s or 779Xs because that's the classic ME3 business strategy.

And speaking of QR, slavery in Qatar is not just limited to construction of the 2022 World Cup stadiums. It's also practiced on their airlines. (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/the-truth-about-the-luxury-of-qatar-airways/)

Anyway, on a lighter note, I'm surprised that JAL has stuck with 788s for service to YVR. JL17/18 has been operated with a 788 (161 seats!) since Winter 2014. In the pre-bankruptcy-and-3.11 days, JAL had double daily 744s; but after going bankrupt and after the 3.11 earthquake, it was gradually reduced to a daily 772, then a daily 763, before switching to a 788. For comparison, AC3/4 used to be operated by 333s and 763s with overhead monitors; nowadays, it's a mix of 789s and 77Ws.

And since I'm on the subject of the history of TCON aircraft at YVR, if you go only a few years back, the landscape at YVR looked very different:


LHR: BA had a daily 744 (12 weekly 744s in summer), AC854/855 was operated by a mix of 763s, 333s and 343s (again, with overhead monitors; such old aircraft either got Project XM, were sent to Rouge, or are retired)
FRA: LH sent over 343s, then ultra-long 346s, before switching to 744s (which did not, as I erroneously said in a previous post, have overhead monitors, but full AVOD)
China + HK: CA 333s and AC 763s to PEK; MU 333s and AC 763s to PVG; service to Guangzhou didn't even start until 2011; CX had double daily 744s to HKG (until 9/11 and SARS) and I think AC flew 343s before switching to 5 weekly 77Ls.
Other Asia + Oceania: AC 763s did the YVR-HNL-SYD route (only switching to 77Ls when the route was extended to Toronto); AC flew 762s (!) to ICN (not sure about KE). As for Taiwan and the Phillippines, I'm not sure.


I think the only thing that's stayed consistent is KLM, with 5 weekly 772s in summer and 5 weekly 333s (mixed in with 332s) at other times.

Of course, this isn't too far back in history, but that's only because I'm a young whippersnapper. There will be users on this forum who are old enough to remember BA using 742Bs (747-200B) for service to LHR. And on that subject, what was the history of BA's service to YVR? I found an A.net thread (http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=367679) about BA's history to Sea-Tac, but nothing about YVR. Did BA have standalone direct flights on 747-100s separate from LHR-SEA-YVR services? What's the deal?

Back in the 80s BA would normally do a LHR-YVR-SEA-LHR. That was a common 747 route.

KLM regularly operated 3 engine aircraft to Vancouver. Basically MD-11.

trofirhen
Jan 27, 2017, 5:15 PM
It would probably be sufficient for QR to get a 3x weekly YVR-DOH service via a 359 or 789, but they'll probably want to shoehorn in double daily 388s or 779Xs because that's the classic ME3 business strategy.
I thought that, unlike rogue Emirates, Qatar, now belonging to ONEWORLD, would "abide by the rules" more. Evidently that is not the case.

LeftCoaster
Jan 27, 2017, 6:17 PM
I agree that none of this will likely come to fruition but Aeroflot would actually be interesting. YVR-SVO is only marginally further than YVR-FRA, they have a fairly modern fleet and good connections to eastern Europe, central Asia and Delhi. YVR-SVO-DEL is actually shorter than through FRA or HKG.

I would be shocked to no end to ever see Aeroflot at YVR, but I will say every time I'm back in Vancouver I hear more and more Russian on the streets. It's very strange but it seems like ever since 2010 there has been a big influx of Russian tourists and immigrants to Vancouver.

Aeroflot does have A LOT of new widebody planes coming, including 22 dreamliners, so they're going to have to send them somewhere. I still doubt it would be YVR though.

It would probably be sufficient for QR to get a 3x weekly YVR-DOH service via a 359 or 789, but they'll probably want to shoehorn in double daily 388s or 779Xs because that's the classic ME3 business strategy.

And speaking of QR, slavery in Qatar is not just limited to construction of the 2022 World Cup stadiums. It's also practiced on their airlines. (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/the-truth-about-the-luxury-of-qatar-airways/)

Anyway, on a lighter note, I'm surprised that JAL has stuck with 788s for service to YVR. JL17/18 has been operated with a 788 (161 seats!) since Winter 2014. In the pre-bankruptcy-and-3.11 days, JAL had double daily 744s; but after going bankrupt and after the 3.11 earthquake, it was gradually reduced to a daily 772, then a daily 763, before switching to a 788. For comparison, AC3/4 used to be operated by 333s and 763s with overhead monitors; nowadays, it's a mix of 789s and 77Ws.

And since I'm on the subject of the history of TCON aircraft at YVR, if you go only a few years back, the landscape at YVR looked very different:


LHR: BA had a daily 744 (12 weekly 744s in summer), AC854/855 was operated by a mix of 763s, 333s and 343s (again, with overhead monitors; such old aircraft either got Project XM, were sent to Rouge, or are retired)
FRA: LH sent over 343s, then ultra-long 346s, before switching to 744s (which did not, as I erroneously said in a previous post, have overhead monitors, but full AVOD)
China + HK: CA 333s and AC 763s to PEK; MU 333s and AC 763s to PVG; service to Guangzhou didn't even start until 2011; CX had double daily 744s to HKG (until 9/11 and SARS) and I think AC flew 343s before switching to 5 weekly 77Ls.
Other Asia + Oceania: AC 763s did the YVR-HNL-SYD route (only switching to 77Ls when the route was extended to Toronto); AC flew 762s (!) to ICN (not sure about KE). As for Taiwan and the Phillippines, I'm not sure.


I think the only thing that's stayed consistent is KLM, with 5 weekly 772s in summer and 5 weekly 333s (mixed in with 332s) at other times.

Of course, this isn't too far back in history, but that's only because I'm a young whippersnapper. There will be users on this forum who are old enough to remember BA using 742Bs (747-200B) for service to LHR. And on that subject, what was the history of BA's service to YVR? I found an A.net thread (http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=367679) about BA's history to Sea-Tac, but nothing about YVR. Did BA have standalone direct flights on 747-100s separate from LHR-SEA-YVR services? What's the deal?

Ya YVRs growth in intl service since 2011 has been quite strong. A lot of it is still just making up for lost service from the dark days of 2000-2003 though.

nname
Jan 27, 2017, 8:23 PM
Anyway, on a lighter note, I'm surprised that JAL has stuck with 788s for service to YVR. JL17/18 has been operated with a 788 (161 seats!) since Winter 2014. In the pre-bankruptcy-and-3.11 days, JAL had double daily 744s; but after going bankrupt and after the 3.11 earthquake, it was gradually reduced to a daily 772, then a daily 763, before switching to a 788.

YVR was on JL's shortlist of route cancellation more than twice, but they manage to keep the route going by downgauging to the smallest numbers of seats possible. I'm not sure if YVR is still on that list right now...

Had JL not ordered any 788, I'm pretty sure the route will be gone already...

LeftCoaster
Jan 27, 2017, 10:23 PM
Had JL not ordered any 788, I'm pretty sure the route will be gone already...

Really? Every other carrier on the route has up-gauged or added more Japanese destinations.

There were some dark days where we could have lost it, but even if we did I bet it would have been back by now.

twoNeurons
Jan 27, 2017, 10:26 PM
YVR was on JL's shortlist of route cancellation more than twice, but they manage to keep the route going by downgauging to the smallest numbers of seats possible. I'm not sure if YVR is still on that list right now...

Had JL not ordered any 788, I'm pretty sure the route will be gone already...

May that NEVER happen!

That being said, they've received increased competition as of late from AC Rouge and ANA, who has a better option for most visitors to Tokyo: YVR-HND.

JL's YVR-NRT is useful for OneWorld pax going to Tokyo as well as flights further into Asia, like India or Vietnam. Quite a few will choose to fly through Tokyo over the other options if prices are similar.

CareerShow
Jan 28, 2017, 7:53 AM
May that NEVER happen!

That being said, they've received increased competition as of late from AC Rouge and ANA, who has a better option for most visitors to Tokyo: YVR-HND.

JL's YVR-NRT is useful for OneWorld pax going to Tokyo as well as flights further into Asia, like India or Vietnam. Quite a few will choose to fly through Tokyo over the other options if prices are similar.

As has been discussed on this forum I believe, JAL has the most superior economy seating compared to the other carriers with 2-4-2 seating in economy. I mean they only have 186 seats on the aircraft flying to YVR, basically as much as Sunwing jams onto their 738.

casper
Jan 28, 2017, 9:03 AM
As has been discussed on this forum I believe, JAL has the most superior economy seating compared to the other carriers with 2-4-2 seating in economy. I mean they only have 186 seats on the aircraft flying to YVR, basically as much as Sunwing jams onto their 738.

How are doing financially? There were very close to bankruptcy before. Have they made the changes to they can operate a profit? Once they work through all of the changes they need to be viable, they probably will not have the superior product anymore.

trofirhen
Jan 28, 2017, 2:21 PM
Any updates, on the supposedly upcoming Iran >< Canada Air agreement?
If it happens my big question simply is: Will YVR be included ot not. Double or nothing. :2cents:

later addition:Given the Trump government's upcoming belligerant stance with the Iran leadership,
and the imminenet blocage of Iranian returnees to the USA if this source is right, YVR and YYZ might both
serve not only Canadian, but US markets, indirectly.
http://www.salon.com/2016/02/05/donald_trumps_iran_idiocy_the_interview_that_should_have_ended_his_candidacy_once_and_for_all/

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/11/17/opinions/trump-and-iran-can-work-together-opinion/index.html

connect2source
Jan 28, 2017, 3:12 PM
As has been discussed on this forum I believe, JAL has the most superior economy seating compared to the other carriers with 2-4-2 seating in economy. I mean they only have 186 seats on the aircraft flying to YVR, basically as much as Sunwing jams onto their 738.

Other carriers typically have 3-3-3 seating, all of AC and now most of ANA, JAL is the only major carrier to have 2-4-2 on all 787-8's and 787-9's. ANA is moving lots of their 787's to 3-3-3.

Johnny Aussie
Jan 29, 2017, 2:49 PM
Westjet is adding a second daily flight on YVR-SFO this summer.

http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1354205&sid=6aa7209037ea4ef29e198ac984d1d5d9

Gordon
Jan 29, 2017, 3:11 PM
nice to see West Jet expanding this destination. it should be year around.

zahav
Jan 29, 2017, 8:47 PM
Another AC shift. They are switching Mexico City from mainline to a Rouge A319 (still daily as before). It will be an increase in seats (136 vs. 120). This had been one of Air Canada's steadiest markets without an aircraft change, has been mainline 319 for ages! But in keeping with what seems to be AC policy about not serving the same destination with Rouge and mainline (Express doesn't count since there are destinations that get Rouge and Express), Mexico City will be Rouge A319s from YVR, YYZ, and YUL.

It's odd that PVR is switching to weekly mainline in the summer, only to be switched back to Rouge in the winter. Again, AC policy at work, since in the summer YVR is the only AC city to have non-stop flights to PVR (even the sacred YYZ doesn't have a flight to PVR in the summer!!). But come winter, it's Rouge from both cities. I know YVR and PVR have a very strong link (more than just the last two letters in their airport code, ha....) there are tons of Vancouverites with places down there, and has been for ages, but good to see that AC would scrounge up mainline metal to keep this route in the summer rather than just scrap it and bring back Rouge in the winter.

Just seems funny that Puerto Vallarta (a more 'leisure' destination than Mexico City) will be mnainline, and Mexico City (more of business and connection traffic) will be Rouge! But with fleet planning I guess this is how the cookie crumbles!

Edit: I am guessing this means the flight will rotate with the LAS-YVR flight? The LAS arrival gets in at 1025, and the MEX arrival gets in at 10:00. But the outbound LAS flights leaves at 11:10 and MEX doesn't leave until 14:30. I am no expert at route scheduling, but unless they want to do a turn in under 50 minutes for no reason, it seems that's how it will work? I don't think there's any other Rouge 319s operating out of YVR anymore. That's really valuable international gate real estate from 10:25 to 14:30 though, I wonder of YVR will make them tow it off to free up space, or if they can stay on gate?

Speedbird1
Jan 29, 2017, 9:54 PM
Another AC shift. They are switching Mexico City from mainline to a Rouge A319 (still daily as before). It will be an increase in seats (136 vs. 120). This had been one of Air Canada's steadiest markets without an aircraft change, has been mainline 319 for ages! But in keeping with what seems to be AC policy about not serving the same destination with Rouge and mainline (Express doesn't count since there are destinations that get Rouge and Express), Mexico City will be Rouge A319s from YVR, YYZ, and YUL.

In my mind, it possibly has less to do with consistency across all of the markets and more to do with the expected increase in competition over the next year, with AM going double daily, CZ starting with the high capacity 77Ws, and the expected start of Interjet. This way they can charge the same, get a few more people on the plane, and reduce their fixed costs with the lower staff wages.

Also, most people I know who have taken the AC flight to MEX have been connecting onwards. Not to say there's not a lot of O&D, but considering the timing of the flight, don't think a lot of people want to arrive into a city like MEX after midnight. Not a particularly productive day getting in that late.

excel
Jan 29, 2017, 11:48 PM
Rouge might make sense in MEX seeing as there is a pretty large leisure market going in the other direction now.

nname
Jan 30, 2017, 3:26 AM
Halifax Jun9 - Sep5
WS386 YVR2100 - 0632+1YHZ x247
WS385 YHZ0735 - 0959YVR x135

London ON Jun30 - Sep4
WS236 YVR0915 - 1635YXU x247
WS237 YXU1720 - 1915YVR x247

SpongeG
Jan 30, 2017, 4:13 AM
nice to see West Jet expanding this destination. it should be yora roukd.

yora roukd :uhh:

POCO
Jan 30, 2017, 6:28 AM
Halifax Jun9 - Sep5
WS386 YVR2100 - 0632+1YHZ x247
WS385 YHZ0735 - 0959YVR x135

London ON Jun30 - Sep4
WS236 YVR0915 - 1635YXU x247
WS237 YXU1720 - 1915YVR x247


I really want that direct YHZ route to become year round. Anyone have any idea how it did last summer? I guess well enough that they brought it back... That's probably metal that they use during the winter to fly to a sun destination...

Johnny Aussie
Jan 31, 2017, 1:17 AM
http://www.yvr.ca/-/media/yvr/documents/facts-sheets/december/traffic-update-dec16.pdf?la=en

Mega strong growth in all categories except a very surprising dip in Europe...

Overall Dec growth was 10.5% with TTL INT'L up 13.6% and domestic up 7.6%

Total 2016 growth was up 9.7% with TTL INTL up 11.9% and domestic up 7.6%

TTL 2016 was ~ 22.3M

That's all I have time for now.... Happy analysing!

excel
Jan 31, 2017, 1:31 AM
December 2016:

Domestic: up 7.6%
Transborder: up 14.3%
Asia: up 16.5%
Europe: down 6.0%
Misc: up 21.7%
Total International: Up 13.6%
Grand total: up 10.5%
Cargo: up 5.5%


Year 2016:

Domestic: up 7.6%
Transborder: up 7.4%
Asia: up 15.7%
Europe: up 14.9%
Misc: up 27.0%
Total International: Up 11.9%
Grand total: up 9.7%
Cargo: up 3.2%

osirisboy
Jan 31, 2017, 4:31 AM
Europe up 14.9 for the year but down 6 for December. Thoughts on this?

mezzanine
Jan 31, 2017, 5:15 AM
AC's DEL flight taking a lot of European transfer traffic? A lot of the VFR traffic to india/punjab happens in the winter.

jollyburger
Jan 31, 2017, 5:29 AM
Didn't see this but they're going to open a Pajo’s Fish & Chips in YVR along with five other restaurants:

http://www.yvr.ca/en/media/news-releases/2017/un-nouveau-restaurant-prend-son-envol-a-yvr

zahav
Feb 3, 2017, 7:44 AM
YVR issued a formal release regarding the growth in 2016. It's a great summary, and seeing the stats presented this way makes them seem even more impressive:

http://www.yvr.ca/en/media/news-releases/2017/2016-air-traffic-report

Johnny Aussie
Feb 3, 2017, 8:47 PM
Airliners.net has a thread going for 2016 pax numbers...

So far looks like YVR is fastest growing in NA for overall and international and only ICN and DEL globally have posted higher growth.

Wow.

http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1354587

SFUVancouver
Feb 3, 2017, 9:53 PM
Interesting to see that YVR has more international traffic than Houston. Wouldn't have guessed that.

LeftCoaster
Feb 3, 2017, 11:06 PM
Just happened this year, YVR moved from 10th internationally to 9th internationally in USA/Canada.

http://i.imgur.com/oY6sNjb.png

Within spitting distance of Atlanta and Chicago now. Another year like last will see YVR for sure pass ATL and possibly ORD as well. Crazy times.

excel
Feb 3, 2017, 11:14 PM
How is it possible that JFK YYZ and EWR are all exactly 0.00% change?

LeftCoaster
Feb 3, 2017, 11:26 PM
Haha whoops should have clarified when I posted, they haven't released their 2016 numbers yet.

Johnny Aussie
Feb 3, 2017, 11:32 PM
Interesting to see that YVR has more international traffic than Houston. Wouldn't have guessed that.

Well as of 2016 it does!

Just happened this year, YVR moved from 10th internationally to 9th internationally in USA/Canada.

http://i.imgur.com/oY6sNjb.png

Within spitting distance of Atlanta and Chicago now. Another year like last will see YVR for sure pass ATL and possibly ORD as well. Crazy times.

Most likely will pass ATL and ORD and jump into 7th spot.... CRAZY for such a small city!!

Int'l is also now a majority of YVR traffic at 50.04%

Johnny Aussie
Feb 4, 2017, 12:11 AM
Looks like an unveiling on Feb 9th... Simultaneously in YVR, YYZ and YUL...

http://aircanada.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=1105

LeftCoaster
Feb 4, 2017, 12:13 AM
But they're missing their Calgary "hub"...

CareerShow
Feb 4, 2017, 12:33 AM
But they're missing their Calgary "hub"...

It would appear Calgary is now the airport being neglected.

mezzanine
Feb 4, 2017, 1:22 AM
Uh oh.... (http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/pre-clearance-trump-ban-1.3965666)



Canada looking at legality of enforcing Trump travel ban on Canadian soil

....

No country would have more to lose from the cancellation of pre-clearance than Canada, if it is found that U.S. border agents enforcing the Trump visa ban are in violation of Canadian laws.

There are more pre-clearance points in Canada than in the other five pre-clearance countries put together, and more travellers pass through them.

Without such a system, the U.S. would have to put border agents in many more airports, or it would have to require all Canadian flights to land only at major international airports. Given the costs of the first solution, it seems likely the U.S. would opt for the second.

And so Canada has little incentive to bar U.S. border agents from Canadian airports.

Whatever conclusion the federal government comes to about the legality of the U.S. ban, any resident of Canada who feels he or she has been discriminated against at a Canadian airport has recourse to a Canadian court or to a human rights tribunal, which would then reach its own conclusion.

A ruling against the ban would potentially lead to a crisis over pre-clearance, since U.S. border agents would be obligated to enforce the ban, while Canadian law enforcement could be obligated to prevent them from doing so.


Ultimately once due process runs its course, I can't see how the ban can be continued in canada. I'm not sure how this would effect YVR, maybe mininmally as most (?all) transborder flights go to larger american airports with customs.

nname
Feb 4, 2017, 11:50 AM
Effective April 10th

CZ377 CAN2330 - 2035YVR2205 - 0515+1MEX 788 146
CZ378 MEX0745 - 1055YVR1225 - 1630+1CAN 788 257

CZ329 CAN1400 - 1105YVR 77W D
CZ330 YVR1310 - 1715+1CAN 77W D


Seems like there will be 2 CZ planes at YVR from 1105 to 1225 on Tues-Fri-Sun... There is still enough gate during that time!?

wave46
Feb 4, 2017, 2:01 PM
[URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/pre-clearance-trump-ban-1.3965666"]


Ultimately once due process runs its course, I can't see how the ban can be continued in canada. I'm not sure how this would effect YVR, maybe mininmally as most (?all) transborder flights go to larger american airports with customs.

For the record, I don't support Trump's ban.

However, I'm confused as to why this would affect pre-clearance. US Customs agents have a large latitude to refuse entry into the country. There is no specific right of any foreign national to enter the United States - only citizens have that particular right. To challenge it (in a Canadian court) on the basis of discrimination would be in effect challenging the executive order of a foreign country - ultra vires, I believe the legal term is - it is beyond the legal authority of Canadian courts.

I'd imagine that the US would prefer pre-clearance remain in place for the duration of the ban - it is easier to refuse people and turn them back to Canada rather than leaving them in legal limbo in a US airport.

Cage
Feb 4, 2017, 5:51 PM
For the record, I don't support Trump's ban.

However, I'm confused as to why this would affect pre-clearance. US Customs agents have a large latitude to refuse entry into the country. There is no specific right of any foreign national to enter the United States - only citizens have that particular right. To challenge it (in a Canadian court) on the basis of discrimination would be in effect challenging the executive order of a foreign country - ultra vires, I believe the legal term is - it is beyond the legal authority of Canadian courts.

I'd imagine that the US would prefer pre-clearance remain in place for the duration of the ban - it is easier to refuse people and turn them back to Canada rather than leaving them in legal limbo in a US airport.

Trump's ban would be lifted in Canada the same way it was lifted last night in the USA. Under the Canada process, a lawyer or group of lawyers would challenge the ban on Canadian Constitutional grounds. On filing the Statement of claim, immediate injunctive relief is requested (temporary restraining order) prohibiting USCBP from enforcing the ban on Canadian soil until such time as the voire dire could be held in front of the judge with representative counsel from both sides.

The sticky situation for the Attorney General for Canada, they would be bound by the bilateral treaties to intervene in such a court case and defend the USA's interest. The biggest problem is finding a judge that would issue a TRO ahead of a voire dire. Assuming the plaintiff counsel could find such a judge that was also on docket duty, the plaintiff lawyers are also putting their careers at extreme risk. The plaintiff counsel have a extremely high duty to disclose all facts that may influence the judges decision. If new facts are discovered in the voire dire, the plaintiff counsel is subject to being disbarred.

Johnny Aussie
Feb 4, 2017, 5:52 PM
Effective April 10th

CZ377 CAN2330 - 2035YVR2205 - 0515+1MEX 788 146
CZ378 MEX0745 - 1055YVR1225 - 1630+1CAN 788 257

CZ329 CAN1400 - 1105YVR 77W D
CZ330 YVR1310 - 1715+1CAN 77W D


Seems like there will be 2 CZ planes at YVR from 1105 to 1225 on Tues-Fri-Sun... There is still enough gate during that time!?

Now I guess we just have to wait for Interjet's announcement for MEX.

Cage
Feb 4, 2017, 6:43 PM
Ultimately once due process runs its course, I can't see how the ban can be continued in canada. I'm not sure how this would effect YVR, maybe mininmally as most (?all) transborder flights go to larger american airports with customs.

If the ban is enforced in the USA, it must be enforced in Canada. Attempts to remove the ban in Canada would render all international flights from Canada inadmissible at the destination country. All countries require inbound international flights to check each passenger for acceptable entry documents (passport and visa). The travel ban is reliant on the airlines being forced to conduct the document check. Consequently before anyone in Canada could challenge USCBP, the document check must be rendered inactive. The document check process is a requirement of each bilateral, no document check and no entry rights are granted by the receiving country.

Assuming that someone wanted to challenge the Trump Ban in Canada, they would have to go before a USCBP officer. In order to get before the USCBP in Canada, the airline must conduct a document check. The document check is a requirement of the airline tariff, which passengers agree to on ticket purchase and which the CTA has deemed to be compliant with Canadian law.

First step for a plaintiff is a hearing before the CTA to challenge the document check provisions in the tariff. Second step is judicial review of the CTA decision. Third step is review of the judicial review by the Supreme Court of Canada. If the Supreme Court considers the document check to be contrary to The Charter of Rights and Freedoms, the plaintiff can then go before USCBP and begin their Trump ban challenge.

Johnny Aussie
Feb 5, 2017, 5:15 PM
Delta boosting YVR-ATL to 6 weekly this summer.

All flights will operate with 738s and will operate daily except Tuesdays 1245 departure.

teriyaki
Feb 5, 2017, 6:01 PM
Effective April 10th

CZ377 CAN2330 - 2035YVR2205 - 0515+1MEX 788 146
CZ378 MEX0745 - 1055YVR1225 - 1630+1CAN 788 257

CZ329 CAN1400 - 1105YVR 77W D
CZ330 YVR1310 - 1715+1CAN 77W D


Seems like there will be 2 CZ planes at YVR from 1105 to 1225 on Tues-Fri-Sun... There is still enough gate during that time!?

Does CZ have fifth freedom rights to sell tickets on the yvr to mex legs? That'd be interesting to have a wide body on this route.

Johnny Aussie
Feb 5, 2017, 6:20 PM
Does CZ have fifth freedom rights to sell tickets on the yvr to mex legs? That'd be interesting to have a wide body on this route.

I'm pretty sure they don't.

excel
Feb 5, 2017, 6:58 PM
Good news about ATL. What was the frequency last summer?

casper
Feb 5, 2017, 7:48 PM
If the ban is enforced in the USA, it must be enforced in Canada. Attempts to remove the ban in Canada would render all international flights from Canada inadmissible at the destination country. All countries require inbound international flights to check each passenger for acceptable entry documents (passport and visa). The travel ban is reliant on the airlines being forced to conduct the document check. Consequently before anyone in Canada could challenge USCBP, the document check must be rendered inactive. The document check process is a requirement of each bilateral, no document check and no entry rights are granted by the receiving country.

Assuming that someone wanted to challenge the Trump Ban in Canada, they would have to go before a USCBP officer. In order to get before the USCBP in Canada, the airline must conduct a document check. The document check is a requirement of the airline tariff, which passengers agree to on ticket purchase and which the CTA has deemed to be compliant with Canadian law.

First step for a plaintiff is a hearing before the CTA to challenge the document check provisions in the tariff. Second step is judicial review of the CTA decision. Third step is review of the judicial review by the Supreme Court of Canada. If the Supreme Court considers the document check to be contrary to The Charter of Rights and Freedoms, the plaintiff can then go before USCBP and begin their Trump ban challenge.

Sounds complicated. Someone wanting to do this is more likely to do it at a ground crossing. Preclearance occurs on ships departing Victoria year round and Vancouvrr in the summer. At the Via rail station in Vancouver year round.

I would be surprised if a Canadian court wants to take a stance on it. The airline is simply following the rules if it from a country that does not need a visa or if the passport has a visa your good to go. The issue of how a visa is issued or not into a passport is done in an embassy or consulate.

jmt18325
Feb 5, 2017, 7:51 PM
The problem is that US CBP is here with the consent of the Government of Canada. That means that they have to follow Canadian law.

wave46
Feb 5, 2017, 8:14 PM
I would be surprised if a Canadian court wants to take a stance on it. The airline is simply following the rules if it from a country that does not need a visa or if the passport has a visa your good to go. The issue of how a visa is issued or not into a passport is done in an embassy or consulate.

I suspect everybody is holding their breath until the US judicial system deals with the numerous court cases regarding the executive order.

It does seem prudent that the Canadian government is looking into this matter as it is better to be proactive with a plan as opposed to reactive when someone brings a case before Canadian courts.

I think the only power US CBP officers have in Canada is to deny boarding to passengers. They have no legal power of arrest or detention. I'm not sure if denying boarding is a violation of law.

I think most US flights would be unaffected as with the exception of LaGuardia Airport, which has no customs facilities, but there might be a mess with regards to gates at arrival airports.

jmt18325
Feb 5, 2017, 8:59 PM
I think the only power US CBP officers have in Canada is to deny boarding to passengers. They have no legal power of arrest or detention.

I believe they can hold you for violations of Canadian law.

jmt18325
Feb 5, 2017, 9:00 PM
I think most US flights would be unaffected as with the exception of LaGuardia Airport, which has no customs facilities, but there might be a mess with regards to gates at arrival airports.

I think a lot of flights from Toronto would be affected.

casper
Feb 5, 2017, 11:36 PM
I think a lot of flights from Toronto would be affected.

The reality is aCanadian court is not going to rule on the validity of a foreign country issuing a visa or not. If it ever did it was cause no end of problems. The Chinese or Russian or Japanese or a host of other countries in Canada issue or deny visas for a host of reasons that could or could not be consistent with the Canadian charter. When US customs stamps you passport and let's you board they are basically doing the same thing as an embassy or consolate.

moosejaw
Feb 6, 2017, 2:29 AM
US customs officers operating in Canada have the power to deny boarding similar to andy land border crossing. They have no power to detain nor arrest. The preclearance zone in any foreign airport falls under the jurisdiction of the host country.

stiffdeadman
Feb 6, 2017, 4:14 AM
Delta boosting YVR-ATL to 6 weekly this summer.

All flights will operate with 738s and will operate daily except Tuesdays 1245 departure.

nice. too bad they didn't keep the 757 on saturdays. i'm flying on one in march from seattle to orlando. never flown on one so looking forward to it.

trofirhen
Feb 6, 2017, 7:25 AM
Delta boosting YVR-ATL to 6 weekly this summer.

All flights will operate with 738s and will operate daily except Tuesdays 1245 departure.
I hope this is profitable, and part of a growing trend for regular flights to Atlanta. (ultimately year-round, even, maybe .....)

LO 044
Feb 6, 2017, 7:03 PM
Looks like an unveiling on Feb 9th... Simultaneously in YVR, YYZ and YUL...

http://aircanada.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=1105
I hope they're not changing their livery. I think AC has one of the best looking tails around. So what are you guys hearing about the unveiling? Is AC buying TS? Is it an announcement kicking YYC out of the hub club lol?

jmt18325
Feb 6, 2017, 7:08 PM
I hear they're changing the livery...

trofirhen
Feb 6, 2017, 7:53 PM
I hear they're changing the livery...

To something like this? With only read and white, not too much variation is possible:

http://images.google.fr/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fflaviomcarvalho.com%2Fcontent%2F03-projects%2F06-air-canada-livery%2Fac_012.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fflaviomcarvalho.com%2Fprojects%2Fair-canada-livery&h=1000&w=700&tbnid=Zlfo_g3qEhSQVM%3A&vet=1&docid=ibVVCnOyA4uthM&ei=n9OYWM6sCoavUcmYj6gP&tbm=isch&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=1693&page=0&start=0&ndsp=15&ved=0ahUKEwiO-N2Yn_zRAhWGVxQKHUnMA_UQMwgnKAswCw&bih=638&biw=1366

LeftCoaster
Feb 6, 2017, 10:40 PM
I hear they're changing the livery...

I'd welcome a refresh.

Nothing dramatic, keep the same themes but an evolution not a revolution... to steal from marketing-speak.

LeftCoaster
Feb 6, 2017, 10:41 PM
Delta boosting YVR-ATL to 6 weekly this summer.

All flights will operate with 738s and will operate daily except Tuesdays 1245 departure.

Wow that's unexpected but great news.

Have they announced any timing? Would be great if it tied into one of the Asian banks, making the flights more than just cruise ship feeder.

*Edit: Just dumped this into my spreadsheet, looks like this takes Delta's summer ops to 100 flights per week!

http://i.imgur.com/taxvNdO.png

connect2source
Feb 7, 2017, 12:17 AM
I hear they're changing the livery...

Found this on airliners.net. Looks like a possibility as it mimics Rouge and has lots of grey, much like AC's new cabin and terminal colours. Supposedly we'll likely know on Wednesday.

source : http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/ag130/Dean_Ellison/ac%20new_zpsedsorggq.jpg

casper
Feb 7, 2017, 12:40 AM
Found this on airliners.net. Looks like a possibility as it mimics Rouge and has lots of grey, much like AC's new cabin and terminal colours. Supposedly we'll likely know on Wednesday.

source : http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/ag130/Dean_Ellison/ac%20new_zpsedsorggq.jpg

The one on the bottom looks like the best of the lot.

jmt18325
Feb 7, 2017, 1:12 AM
I was going to say the same thing. It looks much like American's new livery.

teriyaki
Feb 7, 2017, 1:28 AM
Whole thing makes me sad. AC has/had one of the most unique liveries out of the international carriers. It's awesome coming in for a landing at a far-off outpost like LHR or HKG and spotting that distinct ice-blue colour and you just know its an AC plane:).

On top of that, switching the narrowbody fleet to the 737 family will mean even smaller cabin footprint for passengers used to the airbuses. :uhh:

Throw in a render of the CS100/CS300s thought and you got my interest again though!!

mezzanine
Feb 7, 2017, 4:51 PM
Almost forgot about DFW starting on AC ~ 3 days ago:


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C37eHpTVcAAxsTo.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4ArAkbUoAA0C37.jpg


Being flown on CRJ700s:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4ArAkbUoAA0C37.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4ArAkbUoAA0C37.jpg

LeftCoaster
Feb 8, 2017, 12:11 AM
Whole thing makes me sad. AC has/had one of the most unique liveries out of the international carriers.

No one has confirmed the icy colour scheme is going...

Canadian74
Feb 8, 2017, 12:24 AM
No one has confirmed the icy colour scheme is going...

It probably is, looking at the colour palette of their new website

LeftCoaster
Feb 8, 2017, 12:25 AM
Absolutely a possibility, I'm just saying no reason to jump to conclusions already.

jmt18325
Feb 8, 2017, 3:44 PM
George Bush has an Airport named after him? And it's one of the largest in NA?


I'm thinking H.W.

excel
Feb 8, 2017, 4:23 PM
I'm thinking H.W.

Correct. The name change happened 20 years ago.

LeftCoaster
Feb 8, 2017, 7:13 PM
The see-saw continues, China Southern back to full 787 in YVR-CAN.

http://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/271267/china-southern-s17-vancouver-service-changes-as-of-07feb17/

I still think we'll see one more change to 7xPW: 77W and 3xPW: 788, but who knows with all these changes.

trofirhen
Feb 8, 2017, 9:23 PM
The see-saw continues, China Southern back to full 787 in YVR-CAN.

http://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/271267/china-southern-s17-vancouver-service-changes-as-of-07feb17/

I still think we'll see one more change to 7xPW: 77W and 3xPW: 788, but who knows with all these changes.

Which metal will theyuse on the Mexico City leg? 77W or 788, or both?

CareerShow
Feb 8, 2017, 9:44 PM
Any update on the AC LHR slot that is unused?

vanlaw
Feb 9, 2017, 1:02 AM
Found this on airliners.net. Looks like a possibility as it mimics Rouge and has lots of grey, much like AC's new cabin and terminal colours. Supposedly we'll likely know on Wednesday.

source : http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/ag130/Dean_Ellison/ac%20new_zpsedsorggq.jpg

Whatever is being unveiled tomorrow, it appears the aircraft flew in from Indiana last night. A321:


https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/c-gjwi/#c655ef1

Johnny Aussie
Feb 9, 2017, 7:00 AM
Finally!

Effective 15 June YVR - TPE is going daily on 77Ws.

Currently at 5 weekly.

http://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/271303/eva-air-s17-north-america-service-changes-as-of-09feb17/

excel
Feb 9, 2017, 7:52 AM
Nice. Overall TPE has had a big increase with this and AC's daily 787.

zahav
Feb 9, 2017, 8:33 AM
AC has updated their summer scheds, nothing too groundbreaking but some nice improvements I'd say:

-No more Embraer E90 flights at all. We knew this was coming, but there were still a few YYC and YEG flights scheduled with it, as well as Chicago. Those have now been replaced with 319/320 metal
-YYC and YEG back to all-mainline service. There had been a few Jazz-operated flights in the scheds, but those have been replaced with 319/320 as well
-Increased frequencies to YUL and YYZ, and more widebody flights (won't go into flight by flight, but YUL will now have a daily Dreamliner flight, as well as the lone 330 that AC flies from YVR, and then the standard 320/321s. YYZ has 320/321/767/789/777
-Several more Jazz DH3s have been replaced by DH4, this is a big capacity jump (74 vs. 50 seats). Fort St John, PG, Terrace, Kelowna, Seattle, Portland and Victoria will now be fully or majority DH4, and all used to be DH3. YVR definitely is good for larger capacity aircarft. We don't have any AC Express Beechcraft flights, or even any DH1 or CRJ flights, all DH3 and increasingly DH4 or CRA (Saskatoon, Whitehorse, Winnipeg, and all of the other US destinations like San Jose, San Diego, Denver, Phoenix, Dallas)

Probably more changes to come, but this was a nice bump for summer in several areas. Now lets all look forward to the new livery unveiling!

trofirhen
Feb 9, 2017, 2:04 PM
Look at the busiest international routes from Sea-Tac, and look who's number One!! Gets you thinking ....


Busiest International Routes to and from SEA (2015)[44]
Rank City Passengers Annual Change Carriers

1 Vancouver, Canada 562,594 Increase12.9% Air Canada, Alaska, Delta
2 Seoul, South Korea 396,316 Increase22.1% Asiana, Delta, Korean
3 London, United Kingdom 340,364 Increase6.9% British Airways, Delta
4 Dubai, United Arab Emirates 298,476 Increase32.0% Emirates
5 Tokyo, Japan 271,023 Decrease1.1% ANA, Delta
6 Calgary, Canada 257,791 Increase50.0% Air Canada, Alaska, Delta
7 Amsterdam, Netherlands 253,600 Increase1.9% Delta
8 Beijing, China 232,964 Increase10.0% Delta, Hainan
9 Frankfurt, Germany 223,527 Increase34.4% Condor, Lufthansa
10 Victoria, Canada 196,247 Increase6.8% Alaska, Delta
11 Taipei, Taiwan 161,062 Increase4.5% EVA
12 Shanghai, China 159,230 Increase29.3% Delta, Hainan
13 Paris, France 149,734 Increase31.0% Delta
14 Hong Kong 124,300 Increase72.5% Delta
15 Reykjavik, Iceland 117,716 Increase13.0% Icelandair

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle%E2%80%93Tacoma_International_Airport#Airlines_and_destinations

connect2source
Feb 9, 2017, 5:04 PM
New Air Canada Livery!

https://www.facebook.com/aircanada/photos/pb.134146296633274.-2207520000.1486659208./1347893321925226/?type=3&theater

I love it!! Classy mix of the 1993-2004 livery and the original, love the Roundel on the tail!

UPDATE : Facebook has since deleted it, here's a link to an Anet thread with great pics.

http://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1355143&p=19348521#p19348521

vanlaw
Feb 9, 2017, 5:08 PM
New Air Canada Livery!

https://www.facebook.com/aircanada/photos/pb.134146296633274.-2207520000.1486659208./1347893321925226/?type=3&theater

I love it!! Classy mix of the 1993-2004 livery and the original, love the Roundel on the tail!

I think they pulled the album off the FB page as the announcement has been delayed until 9:30. Looks good though! Black tail, engines and underbelly.

Edit: Pics I managed to pull from AC's FB page before the album was removed.

http://i1203.photobucket.com/albums/bb382/eastvan1/16649196_1347893025258589_8178956493385120747_n_zpsa8fov7ya.jpg

http://i1203.photobucket.com/albums/bb382/eastvan1/16508034_1347893038591921_2273885414512898546_n_zpssvchjpav.jpg

Credit: Air Canada (of course)

connect2source
Feb 9, 2017, 5:37 PM
One more :

Source : Airliners.net

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/ag130/Dean_Ellison/16487074_1347893321925226_6994340600754738835_o_zps7gjsacj4.jpg

Canadian74
Feb 9, 2017, 5:42 PM
Anyone else think red titles would have looked better?
Still pretty elegant

casper
Feb 9, 2017, 6:10 PM
Anyone else think red titles would have looked better?
Still pretty elegant

I like it. The old dark green they had in years past would have been better but the black looks good.

trofirhen
Feb 9, 2017, 6:41 PM
Anyone else think red titles would have looked better?
Still pretty elegant

I like it. The old dark green they had in years past would have been better but the black looks good.

I like it. It has a crisp, rather 'chic' look to it. Much better than just red and white, red and white, red and white, red and .......

whatnext
Feb 9, 2017, 8:15 PM
Anyone else think red titles would have looked better?
Still pretty elegant

Yes, I really don't like the black, Way too stark, and what is "Canadian" about it? I would rather they go back to the dark green.

AC seems to have locked itself into this weird belief they have to change their livery every decade. This will be the third since WestJet was created, and they still have the original livery! When was the last time Lufthansa changed their livery?

nname
Feb 9, 2017, 8:24 PM
I'm fine with the new livery, but just find the new route map very hard to read... :(


Finally!

Effective 15 June YVR - TPE is going daily on 77Ws.

Currently at 5 weekly.

http://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/271303/eva-air-s17-north-america-service-changes-as-of-09feb17/

Guess there won't be a 11x weekly seasonal increase from CI from now on.

osirisboy
Feb 9, 2017, 8:31 PM
Yes, I really don't like the black, Way too stark, and what is "Canadian" about it? I would rather they go back to the dark green.

AC seems to have locked itself into this weird belief they have to change their livery every decade. This will be the third since WestJet was created, and they still have the original livery! When was the last time Lufthansa changed their livery?

What makes dark green "Canadian"?

trofirhen
Feb 9, 2017, 8:44 PM
What makes dark green "Canadian"?

Perhaps the association of Canada and forests?:shrug:

LeftCoaster
Feb 9, 2017, 9:06 PM
Finally!

Effective 15 June YVR - TPE is going daily on 77Ws.

Currently at 5 weekly.

http://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/271303/eva-air-s17-north-america-service-changes-as-of-09feb17/

So what does that mean for China airlines. I assume they will be simply daily now, since YYZ went daily on EVA as well.

That would perfectly fit the 11 of China down to 7.

Perhaps the association of Canada and forests?:shrug:

Ya I would say dark green is much more "Canadian" but who says our livery has to derive all its ques from classic Canada.

I like the new livery, but feel a few more subtle jestures would have moved it from a safe good livery to a more exciting livery. A red cheat line along the black fuselage and a better transtiiton from the black of the tail to the white would have been a difference maker for me.

officedweller
Feb 9, 2017, 9:39 PM
It's really pretty bland.

The placement of the logo at the front, below the windows, reminds me of the trademark logo used by the Royal Canadian Mint on coins - like a footnote.

trofirhen
Feb 9, 2017, 10:08 PM
Ya I would say dark green is much more "Canadian" but who says our livery has to derive all its ques from classic Canada.

I like the new livery, but feel a few more subtle jestures would have moved it from a safe good livery to a more exciting livery. A red cheat line along the black fuselage and a better transtiiton from the black of the tail to the white would have been a difference maker for me.

It's really pretty bland.

The placement of the logo at the front, below the windows, reminds me of the trademark logo used by the Royal Canadian Mint on coins - like a footnote.

I think that much of the problem is that it's derivative of "The Colours of Canada" .... the flag. There isn't a lot of room for creativity with just red and white.

casper
Feb 10, 2017, 2:13 AM
It's really pretty bland.

The placement of the logo at the front, below the windows, reminds me of the trademark logo used by the Royal Canadian Mint on coins - like a footnote.

The black makes it striking. It will stand out. When they had the maple leaf on the dark green tail it was very noticeable at many international airports.

YVR Bruce
Feb 10, 2017, 6:00 AM
I went to the YVR event this morning, and one of the interesting features was a current system route map in the 1970's format. But of course much more dense and comprehensive given the growth in city pairs.
Hopefully someone can reproduce it for this thread

deasine
Feb 10, 2017, 11:25 AM
I'm torn by the livery. On the one hand I appreciate its simplicity and the black under belly looks quite classic and classy but on the other hand the tail fin does not stand out anymore unlike the old one, and the Euro White body is just like any other airline. I would have appreciated changing the current tail from the teal to black fading to light grey/green (with a very light green tint) and I think it would have stood out much more.

deasine
Feb 10, 2017, 11:46 AM
@YVR Bruce

The route maps I think you are looking at are these ones! I appreciate these in terms of a design, but really for legibility and function, each Canadian city should have used its own colour.

http://www.winkreative.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/Air_Canada_Maps_01.png

LO 044
Feb 10, 2017, 2:36 PM
^Anyone over 60 will have an aneurysm looking at the new route map. Everyone else looking at it becomes cross eyed. I can understand the new livery although like i've said on other forums i vote thumbs down on it. But does every part of AC need rebranding like a route map? Did Justin Beiber design the route map so they had to include it in the rebranding?

connect2source
Feb 10, 2017, 5:04 PM
The map is a play on their 1970-71 route map. It worked much better when the route system was far smaller.

photo source : http://airline-memorabilia.blogspot.ca
http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/ag130/Dean_Ellison/AC%20air%20canada%201971%202%20route%20maps_zps8zvodeni.jpg

officedweller
Feb 10, 2017, 7:46 PM
I saw the big ad in the paper today and realized that the cockpit windshield has a black "mask"
- which is bound to elicit comments of robbery and airline "bandits".


http://i1203.photobucket.com/albums/bb382/eastvan1/16508034_1347893038591921_2273885414512898546_n_zpssvchjpav.jpg

Credit: Air Canada (of course)

trofirhen
Feb 10, 2017, 8:06 PM
Air Canada's current route map is so extensive, it rivals Delta or British Airways. There are sites on the web where one can see it, but it'd be great if someone could post a link here.

nname
Feb 10, 2017, 10:58 PM
Air Canada's current route map is so extensive, it rivals Delta or British Airways. There are sites on the web where one can see it, but it'd be great if someone could post a link here.

digital copy of inflight magazine would have all the route maps.

Hot Rod
Feb 11, 2017, 12:51 AM
Look at the busiest international routes from Sea-Tac, and look who's number One!! Gets you thinking ....


Busiest International Routes to and from SEA (2015)[44]
Rank City Passengers Annual Change Carriers

1 Vancouver, Canada 562,594 Increase12.9% Air Canada, Alaska, Delta
2 Seoul, South Korea 396,316 Increase22.1% Asiana, Delta, Korean
3 London, United Kingdom 340,364 Increase6.9% British Airways, Delta
4 Dubai, United Arab Emirates 298,476 Increase32.0% Emirates
5 Tokyo, Japan 271,023 Decrease1.1% ANA, Delta
6 Calgary, Canada 257,791 Increase50.0% Air Canada, Alaska, Delta
7 Amsterdam, Netherlands 253,600 Increase1.9% Delta
8 Beijing, China 232,964 Increase10.0% Delta, Hainan
9 Frankfurt, Germany 223,527 Increase34.4% Condor, Lufthansa
10 Victoria, Canada 196,247 Increase6.8% Alaska, Delta
11 Taipei, Taiwan 161,062 Increase4.5% EVA
12 Shanghai, China 159,230 Increase29.3% Delta, Hainan
13 Paris, France 149,734 Increase31.0% Delta
14 Hong Kong 124,300 Increase72.5% Delta
15 Reykjavik, Iceland 117,716 Increase13.0% Icelandair

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle%E2%80%93Tacoma_International_Airport#Airlines_and_destinations

what's probably more interesting is that despite Vancouver being Seattle's # 1 by far, Seattle is not Vancouver's top international destination. ...