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casper
Feb 11, 2017, 2:29 AM
I saw the big ad in the paper today and realized that the cockpit windshield has a black "mask"
- which is bound to elicit comments of robbery and airline "bandits".

I thought it was a salute to the racoon. A poorly understood animal, that in Canada never gets the credit deserves due to those silly beavers that get all the public attention.

You don't think it was Air Canada's love for racoons?

YVR Bruce
Feb 11, 2017, 3:12 AM
You don't think it was Air Canada's love for racoons?

Indeed, they may be very partial to racoons; perhaps this presages a bid for Porter.

But it may not have anything to do with that. At the launch, one of my buddies immediately named it ZoroJet. Much less negative than the robbery/banditry angle.

gillty
Feb 11, 2017, 5:33 AM
Didn't see anyone post the Rouge livery. Mainline vs. Rouge 767 for comparison.
The global route map looks really sharp in my opinion and I've included some other rasters from the pdf.

https://abload.de/img/767ml6kovb.pnghttps://abload.de/img/767rougezbq0v.png

https://abload.de/img/acexpress64r4t.png

https://abload.de/img/acmapworld33rqm.png
https://abload.de/img/acmapamericashyru8.png
https://abload.de/img/acliverydesign1gvooz.png
https://abload.de/img/acliverydesign2i3qr8.png

source: Air Canada (PDF) https://www.aircanada.com/content/dam/aircanada/portal/documents/PDF/media/livery/illustrative_guide_en.pdf (https://www.aircanada.com/content/dam/aircanada/portal/documents/PDF/media/livery/illustrative_guide_en.pdf)

trofirhen
Feb 11, 2017, 6:23 AM
what's probably more interesting is that despite Vancouver being Seattle's # 1 by far, Seattle is not Vancouver's top international destination. ...

To my knowledge, Los Angeles is Vancouver's #1 foreign destination, followed by London Heathrow, , then Beijing. Sorry I forget where I got these figures, but I think they're accurate.

Alpine
Feb 14, 2017, 9:46 PM
what's probably more interesting is that despite Vancouver being Seattle's # 1 by far, Seattle is not Vancouver's top international destination. ...

It has been mentioned in some publications (like The Economist (http://www.economist.com/news/americas/21708667-meet-northern-neighbours-vancouver-and-seattle-seek-come-closer-together)) that Vancouver has closer ties with San Francisco than with Seattle, and the two cities don't have as close of ties that one would expect from being only 200 kilometres apart.

LeftCoaster
Feb 14, 2017, 9:56 PM
Air Canada's CS300s could enable broad network changes

10 FEBRUARY, 2017
SOURCE: FLIGHTGLOBAL PRO
BY: JON HEMMERDINGER

Though Air Canada has described its incoming Bombardier CS300s as replacements for Embraer 190s, a top Air Canada executive has suggested the fleet plan could evolve.

Air Canada president of passenger airlines Benjamin Smith says the new Bombardier aircraft could prove as transformative as Boeing 787s, allowing Air Canada to make broader network changes.

During an interview with FlightGlobal at Toronto Pearson International airport on 9 February, Smith makes clear that Air Canada's plan calls for the CS300 to replace the E190.

"But that's assuming our network is static," he adds.

"This airplane is so good [that] we think it's going to want to go on every route in North America," Smith says of the CS300.

"The economics – it's got CASM rates that are equivalent to much larger airplanes. So it may enable us, or give us the opportunity, to rethink our bank structures, how our network is designed," he adds.

Air Canada has orders for 45 CS300s, with deliveries scheduled for between 2019 and 2022, according to Flight Fleets Analyzer. The 25 E190s scheduled for replacement are only about 10 years old, Fleets Analyzer shows.

"It's kind of like the 787," Smith says of the CSeries.

Air Canada initially ordered 787s as replacements for ageing Boeing 767s and Airbus A330s.

But the 787s proved so efficient on long-haul routes that Air Canada instead used them to launch a major international expansion, Smith says.

Air Canada ended up keeping the A330s in its mainline fleet, and transitioned the 767s to its newly-created low-cost subsidiary Rouge, Smith notes.

Thanks to the 787, Air Canada "rejiggered our entire network," Smith says. "If we can hit a similar home run with the CSeries, that would be amazing."

CSeries would be "perfect" for a route such as Vancouver to Boston, which "stretches the legs of the Airbus narrowbody", Smith says.

Or, Air Canada could potentially deploy CS300s from extreme-eastern Canadian cities to destinations in Europe, or from Vancouver to Hawaii, Smith says.

Smith says Air Canada remains confident Bombardier will meet its delivery schedule, downplaying the possibility that recent delivery delays could stretch into the coming years.

"We don't have a concern about the delivery schedule on the CSeries," Smith says. "We have a long history with Bombardier. We know their leadership extremely well."
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/air-canadas-cs300s-could-enable-broad-network-chang-434067/


Good write-up on the potential of the C series for air Canada. I think this plane will open up markets like Boston, Washington, Miami etc.. for year round daily service. These planes really cant come fast enough for YVR.

officedweller
Feb 14, 2017, 11:02 PM
Damn - they should have used the Rouge design for both,
with the regular airline having the black colouring on the tail extending downwards and a red logo.

Didn't see anyone post the Rouge livery. Mainline vs. Rouge 767 for comparison.
The global route map looks really sharp in my opinion and I've included some other rasters from the pdf.

https://abload.de/img/767ml6kovb.pnghttps://abload.de/img/767rougezbq0v.png

Canadian74
Feb 15, 2017, 1:05 AM
The oversized roundel of Rouge looks very bad imo. Not mainline worthy. If you weren't canadian you probably woudn't even be able to figure out what it was

AC wanted a completely different look for mainline and Rouge which I think they have accomplished.

trofirhen
Feb 15, 2017, 1:24 AM
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/air-canadas-cs300s-could-enable-broad-network-chang-434067/


Good write-up on the potential of the C series for air Canada. I think this plane will open up markets like Boston, Washington, Miami etc.. for year round daily service. These planes really cant come fast enough for YVR.

Fantastic!! Boston, Washington, Miami (and maybe more) year round?!!
That would put YVR firmly in the North American market mainstream! Hope it goes!!
YYZ has Kansas City, and San Antonio, now. Imagine getting those, plus maybe Charlotte (huge banking centre), Orlando, Atlanta, Albuquerque ....

jmt18325
Feb 15, 2017, 1:26 AM
That plane can't come soon enough. It's too bad it's two years out.

mezzanine
Feb 15, 2017, 5:54 AM
Well, who knows if this will come to pass but I look forward to any development in 2017. With US federal regulators likely slowed by transition and a protectionist-minded admin, I wonder where Thai can route its A350s/787s...

THAI prepares for return to North America
National carrier appoints exclusive GSA for US and Canada

Posted On:
11th January, 2017

Thai Airways has appointed a new general sales agent (GSA) in North America, as the national carrier prepares to relaunch flights across the Pacific.

Having previously flown to New York, Los Angeles and Toronto, THAI suspended its last North American route in 2015, as rising fuel costs made such ultra-long-haul flights unprofitable. Thailand’s FAA rating has since been lowered, meaning that THAI is no longer permitted to launch flights to the US.

But the country expects to see the FAA restrictions lifted in future, and recent deliveries of its new fuel-efficient long-haul aircraft such as the Boeing 787 Dreamliner and Airbus A350 are paving the way for the launch of new direct trans-Pacific flights to destinations such as San Francisco, Seattle and Vancouver.

In preparation for this, THAI has now appointed Anjuna LLC, the airline services company, as its exclusive GSA for the US and Canada.

“We are honoured to lead Thai Airways’ initiative to grow its footprint in US and Canadian aviation markets,” said James Vaile, CEO of Anjuna. “Our partnership will expand Thai Airways’ world class global services, provide an enhanced customer experience for all passenger classes, and deepen Thai Airways’ presence in US and Canadian markets.”

http://www.traveldailymedia.com/245817/thai-prepares-for-return-to-north-america/

deasine
Feb 15, 2017, 12:45 PM
I was quite torn by the livery in the beginning, but I think it's beginning to grow on me and I have heard that the pictures do not do the design justice in-person. I will reserve my judgement when I see it in person!

Cage
Feb 15, 2017, 4:47 PM
I was quite torn by the livery in the beginning, but I think it's beginning to grow on me and I have heard that the pictures do not do the design justice in-person. I will reserve my judgement when I see it in person!

I was okay with the new livery until the weekend when it flew over my house in YYC.

From the ground ithe new livery is great. The placement of the rondelle on the belly and again on the lower half of the fuselage is very unique and well placed for looking from the ground. From a distance, th new black and red tail is much more visible than the legacy toothpaste colour.

rxp
Feb 15, 2017, 8:05 PM
Well, who knows if this will come to pass but I look forward to any development in 2017. With US federal regulators likely slowed by transition and a protectionist-minded admin, I wonder where Thai can route its A350s/787s...



http://www.traveldailymedia.com/245817/thai-prepares-for-return-to-north-america/

is this the rumour you were talking about Johnny?

jmt18325
Feb 15, 2017, 8:13 PM
Do you really want to fly on a plane that lost it's FAA safe rating?

SFUVancouver
Feb 15, 2017, 9:04 PM
Recent photo of the new Air Canada livery in natural light and regular operation.

https://images.planeimages.net/2BKJ37dHkFD6KdU4CnVTXEgVP/images/sohjmrxa3W5L_main
Source (https://planeimages.net/StanleyIp/sohjmrxa3W5L)

The red on black roundel on the tail is actually far more visible than I expected. I love the look of it. I thought that the contrast would be poorer, but I was wrong.

I'm not loving the black eyeliner. The white/bare metal mullions of the cockpit windows detract from the unified black look that was intended. I think that it looks kind of goofy and could live without it.

I also thought that the roundel at the front of the fuselage would look better above the windows and beside the Air Canada wordmark. But seeing it again, in daylight, I think that it looks fine.

Overall, I like the new livery. I really quite liked the current/old "ice" livery, but I am coming around to this new one.

connect2source
Feb 15, 2017, 10:18 PM
Great pick SFUVancouver!!! I actually love it!! Love the return of the rondelle on the tail, and yes, far more visible than expected!! LOVE the eye-mask, very unique in the industry and I'm confident it will be copied, totally reminiscent of TCA's DC-8's which sported a similar mask in the early 60's. The black font is reminiscent of the first Air Canada livery before the change to red letters in the late 70's. Each element represents a part of AC's history.

Was never a fan of the 'toothpaste - digital leaf' livery, glad to see it replaced with this.

rxp
Feb 15, 2017, 10:38 PM
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-15/air-canada-s-plan-of-attack-flies-over-america

"Air Canada has a “soft target” of about 50 percent connecting traffic at its hubs, up from its current 41 percent."

I assume that target is for Pearson, does anyone have our stats?


The article also talks about YYZ:
"With a newer fleet and some on-board amenity upgrades, Air Canada is counting on its Toronto-Pearson hub to become a competitive factor in luring more global jet-setters. The airport has structured operations so passengers connecting at Pearson don’t need to claim and re-check their bags. Pearson also introduced a “baggage image and weight identification system” (BIWIS) in 2013, which takes a photo, weighs, and scans for radiation on each bag that arrives, which satisfies the post Sept. 11 restrictions imposed on U.S.-bound flights."

I assume YVR knows about BIWIS, but are we getting it as well?

All quotes from https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-15/air-canada-s-plan-of-attack-flies-over-america emphasis are mine.

SFUVancouver
Feb 15, 2017, 10:45 PM
In my experience, here's the thing about connecting through Toronto from a Canadian city en route to the US: you need to go through US Customs pre-clearance, but you aren't allowed to proceed until your bag has been unloaded and processed. If you have a tight connection and run from your gate to customs pre-clearance, you may find that you cannot proceed at first. I had a tight connection last week and brought my roller bag as carry-on and breezed through and made my flight. On a previous trip, when I checked my bag and my flight arrived late at YYZ, I dashed from my gate to pre-clearance but couldn't proceed for quite a few tense minutes. Once through customs, I raced to my gate and was only able to get my connecting flight because it was also late.

Large Cat
Feb 16, 2017, 12:55 AM
In my experience, here's the thing about connecting through Toronto from a Canadian city en route to the US: you need to go through US Customs pre-clearance, but you aren't allowed to proceed until your bag has been unloaded and processed. If you have a tight connection and run from your gate to customs pre-clearance, you may find that you cannot proceed at first. I had a tight connection last week and brought my roller bag as carry-on and breezed through and made my flight. On a previous trip, when I checked my bag and my flight arrived late at YYZ, I dashed from my gate to pre-clearance but couldn't proceed for quite a few tense minutes. Once through customs, I raced to my gate and was only able to get my connecting flight because it was also late.

Can confirm. I once waited there for over 45 minutes while my bag failed to show up...luckily I had a long connection. On top of that, the Customs Pre-Clearance area is rather difficult to find when coming from your flight, and then the walk to many of the U.S. flights can be LONG (anything in that long wing near the old terminal that you used to have to take a bus to get to). So try to get a long connection, please.

SFUVancouver
Feb 16, 2017, 1:29 AM
Can confirm. I once waited there for over 45 minutes while my bag failed to show up...luckily I had a long connection. On top of that, the Customs Pre-Clearance area is rather difficult to find when coming from your flight, and then the walk to many of the U.S. flights can be LONG (anything in that long wing near the old terminal that you used to have to take a bus to get to). So try to get a long connection, please.

My rule of thumb for connections is absolutely no less than 45 minutes at US hub airports for same carrier connections with manageable carry-on, and I try for an hour-plus as often as possible. Anything less than an hour is a stressful, tight amount of time to make a connection but it is doable. I've made such connections in IAH, ORD, SFO, SEA, PHX, SLC, DEN, LAX, and MSP with about 45 minutes on the clock and made it through by the skin of my teeth. It's awful to connect with so little time, particularly if you are stuck in the back of the plane and you can just feel the minutes tick away and you know that you are going to have to run your lungs out to make the connection. With that said, with YYZ, honestly, 90 minutes is my minimum and I just as well avoid it whenever possible. I flew about 100k miles last year and deliberately avoided YYZ for all but one (unavoidable) flight. I just hate connecting through Toronto. I'll fly through ORD in a heartbeat over YYZ, and ORD is notorious for its bad connections.

I flew through YYC and its new international terminal on the weekend. I landed at the end of the new pier and got to see first hand what the walk is like. From gate to customs to baggage hall to YYC Link to my departure terminal (A), that all took a while. It felt longer than what we're generally used to in mid-sized Canadian airports, but it wasn't egregious. The YYC Link felt kind of goofy at first, the plastic body creaks, but it did shorten the journey considerably. They did a nice job on the new concourse and baggage hall is beautiful.

casper
Feb 16, 2017, 2:51 AM
Can confirm. I once waited there for over 45 minutes while my bag failed to show up...luckily I had a long connection. On top of that, the Customs Pre-Clearance area is rather difficult to find when coming from your flight, and then the walk to many of the U.S. flights can be LONG (anything in that long wing near the old terminal that you used to have to take a bus to get to). So try to get a long connection, please.

Now that it is the same overhead walkway as international connections it is a bit easier to find. Does involve a lot of walking.

YVR is equally bad if you are doing WestJet. Same path as internal connection and then from the international gate area an into a US customers security point. But it does not open all that early in the morning. Last time I did it coming off an early Victoria flight I had to wait a while until they opened the US connections security clearance.

SFUVancouver
Feb 16, 2017, 10:36 PM
One more real-life photo of the new Air Canada livery, with a bonus of the Air Canada retro livery, too.

http://i.imgur.com/4Id86iY.jpg?2
Source (https://www.reddit.com/r/aviation/comments/5ugrc8/new_vs_old/)

I think that it looks pretty good. I still like the current/old livery better. The eyeliner looks pretty good from afar, but it looks too large and cartoony on narrow-bodies. I keep going back and forth on my opinion.

The tail is my favourite part of the new design, but the low contrast red on black roundel doesn't really pop in overcast lighting.

jmt18325
Feb 16, 2017, 10:42 PM
I'm really going to miss the A321.

Klazu
Feb 16, 2017, 10:48 PM
Am I the only one thinking that the new livery looks very much like Delta? I did like the "leaked" white livery more.

LO 044
Feb 17, 2017, 2:44 PM
I'm really going to miss the A321.I didn't know AC is getting rid of it's 321's.

jmt18325
Feb 17, 2017, 2:45 PM
I didn't know AC is getting rid of it's 321's.

I'm just assuming, since they ordered enough Max jets to replace all of the 320/321s.

Canadian74
Feb 17, 2017, 4:04 PM
Am I the only one thinking that the new livery looks very much like Delta? I did like the "leaked" white livery more.

There was no leaked livery, they were fan made fantasy visions

trofirhen
Feb 17, 2017, 4:18 PM
Am I the only one thinking that the new livery looks very much like Delta? I did like the "leaked" white livery more.

Like DELTA? I can see your point, a little, but I still think that's stretching it.
From a distance, an approaching plane, maybe. On the tarmac, parked outside the terminal? No IMO.

casper
Feb 17, 2017, 7:31 PM
I'm just assuming, since they ordered enough Max jets to replace all of the 320/321s.

The deliveries are spread out over many years. I would not be surprised if the last Airbus left the fleet 10 years from now.

Air Canada does have some 321 that are less than a year old.

trofirhen
Feb 17, 2017, 8:00 PM
Sure, YVR has more international traffic for the moment, largely thanks to our fantastic Asia connections. But don't rest on your laurels. This one's moving up fast. Take a peek.

http://www.airport-world.com/news/general-news/5922-seattle-tacoma-set-to-become-a-top-10-gateway-in-us-for-passenger-traffic.html

SpongeG
Feb 17, 2017, 8:11 PM
well with the chinese investors leaving the vancouver market for the seattle area they will need the flights to china.

Chikinlittle
Feb 17, 2017, 9:03 PM
I'm really going to miss the A321.

What exactly do you like about the A321? It's nearly the Airbus equivalent to the B757... a long narrow tin can.

craneSpotter
Feb 17, 2017, 9:15 PM
Sure, YVR has more international traffic for the moment, largely thanks to our fantastic Asia connections. But don't rest on your laurels. This one's moving up fast. Take a peek.

http://www.airport-world.com/news/general-news/5922-seattle-tacoma-set-to-become-a-top-10-gateway-in-us-for-passenger-traffic.html

Looks like SEA will continue with strong growth in 2017...Jan 2017 is up 6.8% over 2016. International up over 16%.

SEA is now the 9th busiest airport in the US (45.7 million). They have also started their North Satellite expansion and renovation project - with 8 new gates.

jmt18325
Feb 17, 2017, 9:41 PM
What exactly do you like about the A321? It's nearly the Airbus equivalent to the B757... a long narrow tin can.

I like the way it looks and it's comfortable.

jmt18325
Feb 17, 2017, 9:42 PM
Sure, YVR has more international traffic for the moment, largely thanks to our fantastic Asia connections. But don't rest on your laurels. This one's moving up fast. Take a peek.

http://www.airport-world.com/news/general-news/5922-seattle-tacoma-set-to-become-a-top-10-gateway-in-us-for-passenger-traffic.html

Considering the A321 is larger than the Max 9, maybe it won't be leaving at all.

LeftCoaster
Feb 17, 2017, 10:28 PM
Fantastic!! Boston, Washington, Miami (and maybe more) year round?!!
That would put YVR firmly in the North American market mainstream! Hope it goes!!
YYZ has Kansas City, and San Antonio, now. Imagine getting those, plus maybe Charlotte (huge banking centre), Orlando, Atlanta, Albuquerque ....

This was all my opinion, let's not go off the rails here.

Looks like SEA will continue with strong growth in 2017...Jan 2017 is up 6.8% over 2016. International up over 16%.

SEA is now the 9th busiest airport in the US (45.7 million). They have also started their North Satellite expansion and renovation project - with 8 new gates.

SEA will continue it's strong growth, but it is starting to get very capacity constrained and is not currently far enough along in it's expansion planning to effectively combat this.

Also, worth noting the fleet upgrades being considered.

Delta has a decent amount of new wide bodies on order, however these are to be split between their 8 overseas hubs, whereas ACs widebody expansion is concentrated in 3 with YYZ and YVR receiving the bulk of the new planes.

I still expect YVR to outpace SEAs growth in the near future.

Considering the A321 is larger than the Max 9, maybe it won't be leaving at all.

I could see a renegotiated maximum plane alotment to Rouge and the newer 321s getting transferred there. Same with the A330s or 787-800s.

Genauso
Feb 17, 2017, 10:35 PM
I like the new paint job.

Nothing is forever, and right now it makes me feel like they are space planes from the future.


Here's a great article covering Air Canada:

Air Canada’s Plan of Attack Flies Over America A massive international expansion, attractive hubs for global jetsetters, and now brand new routes across its southern border. by Justin Bachman and Frederic Tomesco February 15, 2017, 12:00 AM PST (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-15/air-canada-s-plan-of-attack-flies-over-america)

There's too much to summarize, but I'll tease you with
Air Canada has a “soft target” of about 50 percent connecting traffic at its hubs, up from its current 41 percent, Smith said. By comparison, Air France-KLM has about 70 percent at its Amsterdam Schiphol hub, while the Persian Gulf trio—Emirates Airline, Etihad Airways, and Qatar Airways Ltd.—all top 90 percent at their respective hubs.

Air Canada’s full-throated foray into long-haul flying has been fueled by a massive fleet renewal program, which includes 25 Boeing Co. 787s, and the migration of older Boeing 767s from its mainline fleet to its low-cost Rouge subsidiary. The carrier also has 12 additional 787s on order, 61 Boeing 737 Max planes that start to arrive later this year, and 45 Bombardier CS300s on tap for 2019 and beyond.

Without off-loading traffic to Rouge, boosting hub traffic (of which Vancouver is one) from 40 to 50% is huge. If the adjustment is only through addition, that's a 50% increase (averaged across YVR, YYZ, YUL)

The article tells the story of Air Canada's strategy in part by explaining it's past and how the new aircraft fit in, and leveraging the advantage of Canadian airports which may not get the operating subsidies American ones do, but they do have some independence.

Air Canada is taking a chance here, it is the most leveraged full-service airline (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-02-07/near-1-000-debt-level-to-worsen-for-korean-air-as-won-seen-weak). It's not easy work for a quick reward, and I commend them for trying.

on a related note, the Bombardier C Series which has had its delays, was featured in the Economist magazine (http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2017/02/comfort-strangers). At the same time Flight Global (https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/air-canadas-cs300s-could-enable-broad-network-chang-434067/) had an article about the C Series and its potential to re-shuffle routes:
Though Air Canada has described its incoming Bombardier CS300s as replacements for Embraer 190s, a top Air Canada executive has suggested the fleet plan could evolve.

Air Canada president of passenger airlines Benjamin Smith says the new Bombardier aircraft could prove as transformative as Boeing 787s, allowing Air Canada to make broader network changes.

During an interview with FlightGlobal at Toronto Pearson International airport on 9 February, Smith makes clear that Air Canada's plan calls for the CS300 to replace the E190.

"But that's assuming our network is static," he adds.

"This airplane is so good [that] we think it's going to want to go on every route in North America," Smith says of the CS300.

"The economics – it's got CASM rates that are equivalent to much larger airplanes. So it may enable us, or give us the opportunity, to rethink our bank structures, how our network is designed," he adds.

craneSpotter
Feb 17, 2017, 11:00 PM
SEA will continue it's strong growth, but it is starting to get very capacity constrained and is not currently far enough along in it's expansion planning to effectively combat this.

Also, worth noting the fleet upgrades being considered.

Delta has a decent amount of new wide bodies on order, however these are to be split between their 8 overseas hubs, whereas ACs widebody expansion is concentrated in 3 with YYZ and YVR receiving the bulk of the new planes.

I still expect YVR to outpace SEAs growth in the near future.


I think you are right regarding current constraints to capacity and delayed planning and expansion at SEA.

First, Delta has said it will likely not add any new international routes from SEA until the new International Arrivals Facility is compete in late 2019. (https://www.portseattle.org/Business/Construction-Projects/Airport-Projects/Pages/iaf_revised.aspx) Second, the north satellite expansion/renovation (https://www.portseattle.org/Business/Construction-Projects/Airport-Projects/Pages/N-Sat-modernization.aspx) won't be fully open until 2021, with phase one scheduled to open mid-2019.

This delayed terminal/capacity expansion has to hamper the potential growth at SEA for the next few years. Maybe this is additional good news for YVR - considering Air Canada's plans for international route expansion by connecting more US passengers thru YVR. We should continue to see some robust transborder growth :cheers:

Cage
Feb 17, 2017, 11:38 PM
I'm just assuming, since they ordered enough Max jets to replace all of the 320/321s.

With the release of the 2016 annual report today, the 2018 fleet plan has been announced. AC will receive at least 2 max8s this year and will get another 16 max 8s in 2018. Set to leave the fleet in 2018 are 6 319s and 4 763s (mainline).

My initial expectation was that AC would retire their first 320s that are approaching 30 years old before replacing the 319.

There is also the possibility that AC has disclosedthe 2018 fleet plan to appease the stock market analysts and to not transmit the real plan to competitors.

Comparing the Q4-2016 numbers for both AC and WS, its apparent that the AC program to put widebody aircraft onto the transcon markets is hurting WS more than AC. However I also suspect the analyst community to react negatively to the additional capacity. So AC puts out a fleet plan saying the domestic 763s will leave first to appease the larger stakeholder community. Then come 2018 says AC, "we had a change of heart and the 320s will be the first to go".

There was no leaked livery, they were fan made fantasy visions

There were some leaks coming from the HQ base at YUL and the admin offices near YTZ. The leaked images are too close too the design specs that AC would have handed out to the proponents.

The deliveries are spread out over many years. I would not be surprised if the last Airbus left the fleet 10 years from now.

Air Canada does have some 321 that are less than a year old.

10 years sounds about right, especially as the fleet includes references to both mainline and rouge.

The newer 321s are all at rouge. AC got some midrange 3-6 year old 321s for mainline. These 2 321s have a newer Airbus interior than all other 320 series aircraft.

Considering the A321 is larger than the Max 9, maybe it won't be leaving at all.

The 321neo is kicking the stuffing out of the max9. Boeing has stated that they will improve the max9 over time (the have to, otherwise Airbus will walk away with all orders going to the the 321neoLR). The longer AC waits to take delivery of the max9 the better chance of getting the performance improvement packs into their max9 builds.

Gordon
Feb 17, 2017, 11:42 PM
The north Satellite Expansion is for Alaska.

Canadian74
Feb 18, 2017, 12:05 AM
The 321neo is kicking the stuffing out of the max9. Boeing has stated that they will improve the max9 over time (the have to, otherwise Airbus will walk away with all orders going to the the 321neoLR). The longer AC waits to take delivery of the max9 the better chance of getting the performance improvement packs into their max9 builds.

Would a MAX10 fit in AC's fleet?

And how long does rouge intend to fly the 319s and 321s? Will they eventually be replaced by Airbus NEOS or 737MAX?

whatnext
Feb 18, 2017, 12:06 AM
well with the chinese investors leaving the vancouver market for the seattle area they will need the flights to china.

Some posters jumped down my throat when I dared point out the whole arrival experience at YVR in international seems like it's one big promo to pimp Vancouver out to Chinese property investors: "Get your permanent residency from ABC immigration consultants, buy in XYZ development etc etc"

A bit off-putting for visitors from anywhere else in the world.

Cage
Feb 18, 2017, 12:13 AM
Would a MAX10 fit in AC's fleet?

And how long does rouge intend to fly the 319s and 321s? Will they eventually be replaced by Airbus NEOS or 737MAX?

The 321neoLR would be a better fit for AC because where Ac wants to use this aircraft type is at Rouge. These 321s would be used for YVR/YYC to Hawaii and YYZ to the British isles (LHR excluded).

AC doesn't have the right equipment to copy the 752 TransAt operation that is at UA EWR and DL JFK. The new 321LR would provide this lift.

Rouge intends to fly the Airbus narrowbody on a long term basis. Fleet plan is out 15+years.

trofirhen
Feb 18, 2017, 12:57 AM
Some posters jumped down my throat when I dared point out the whole arrival experience at YVR in international seems like it's one big promo to pimp Vancouver out to Chinese property investors: "Get your permanent residency from ABC immigration consultants, buy in XYZ development etc etc"

A bit off-putting for visitors from anywhere else in the world.

Now it's Seattle's turn to swallow that. (YVR could do with routes other than China, added to its destination roster) Those ads will probably remain at YVR anyway.:uhh::runaway:

jmt18325
Feb 18, 2017, 1:53 AM
.

mezzanine
Feb 18, 2017, 6:40 AM
Some posters jumped down my throat when I dared point out the whole arrival experience at YVR in international seems like it's one big promo to pimp Vancouver out to Chinese property investors: "Get your permanent residency from ABC immigration consultants, buy in XYZ development etc etc"


You are, after all, complaining about foreign influence, on a thread about an international airport.

And the CEO of said airport wants to cultivate traffic from china and maximize non-aeronautical revenue (http://www.aspireaviation.com/2015/02/24/interview-craig-richmond-chief-executive-president-vancouver-airport-authority/).

Why are you torturing yourself? :???:

mezzanine
Feb 18, 2017, 6:52 AM
Hat tip to cage for finding this AC link on a financial and operations analysis from the last part of 2016. (https://www.aircanada.com/content/dam/aircanada/portal/documents/PDF/en/quarterly-result/2016/2016_MDA_q4.pdf)

Not sure if i found anything new wrt YVR. Wasn't aware about AC renewing code sharing agreements with Thai airways - wonder if that increases the chances of possible service to BKK.

Other tidbits - more international routes are key:

Air Canada remains focused on identifying new international growth opportunities to generate increasedprofit and diversify its network which also lowers its risk profile. Part of this strategy focuses on the development of additional synergies offered by alliances with foreign carriers. Consistent with 2016, in 2017, more than 90% of the airline’s planned capacity growth is in international markets. International growth is being pursued on a lower-cost basis, primarily through the introduction of new Boeing 787 aircraft,
increased seating on Boeing 777 and Airbus A330 aircraft, and by an increase in flights operated by Air Canada Rouge.

jmt18325
Feb 18, 2017, 7:13 AM
According to the numbers on Aircanada.com, two of those six 767s have already left the fleet in the last month. On the document, as of December 31st, there were 14. There are now, according to Air Canada.com, 12.

Orcair
Feb 18, 2017, 2:42 PM
According to the numbers on Aircanada.com, two of those six 767s have already left the fleet in the last month. On the document, as of December 31st, there were 14. There are now, according to Air Canada.com, 12.

Yea, from my records they are C-GEOU and C-GEOQ, both of which I believe are going to Rouge. Every time I flew on C-GEOU it was delayed so good riddance!

jmt18325
Feb 18, 2017, 4:39 PM
That would seem to say that they are following their fleet plan, and it actually does make sense. They are worried that fuel is going to go up this year. That would make the mainline 767s and 319s the least cost effective for them.

trofirhen
Feb 18, 2017, 8:43 PM
According to the numbers on Aircanada.com, two of those six 767s have already left the fleet in the last month. On the document, as of December 31st, there were 14. There are now, according to Air Canada.com, 12.

Yea, from my records they are C-GEOU and C-GEOQ, both of which I believe are going to Rouge. Every time I flew on C-GEOU it was delayed so good riddance!

That would seem to say that they are following their fleet plan, and it actually does make sense. They are worried that fuel is going to go up this year. That would make the mainline 767s and 319s the least cost effective for them.

:) I'm interested in something here. Wit your exchanges, and agreement, that the 767s and other models are not to your preference and are thankfully, being phased out......

What aircraft do you see becoming the most frequntly purchased? The most cost-effective, the best size and range for markets etc etc.
The Bombardier C-series? The 737H? What? Please this is a question of intellectual curiosity only, not criticism. Thanx;)

Orcair
Feb 18, 2017, 9:38 PM
:) I'm interested in something here. Wit your exchanges, and agreement, that the 767s and other models are not to your preference and are thankfully, being phased out......

What aircraft do you see becoming the most frequntly purchased? The most cost-effective, the best size and range for markets etc etc.
The Bombardier C-series? The 737H? What? Please this is a question of intellectual curiosity only, not criticism. Thanx;)

If AC actually took care of their 767s I would love them, since Row 19 is one of my favourite seats on Air Canada. The reality is though that the 787 provides more seats at similar/lower costs than the 767 and can be used for long/thin and short/heavy routes - thus, it can replace the 330 and 767 with one model, with all the efficiencies this brings in crewing and maintenance.

Re: the 319, it is heavy for its size, as an A320 shrink, while the CSeries 100 and 300 are more efficient and lighter at both sizes, while still being part of the same family. Also, the CSeries is designed with lighter materials and takes more advantage of the new generation of engines vs. the 737MAX and A320neo which are penalized by their 60s/80s empennages.

To answer your question, I think we will see airlines ordering CSeries/Embraer E2s at the sub-150 seat threshold or have airlines abandon this class size, due to labour costs. For 150-180 seats, I think the 737-8 slightly edges out the 320neo, but the 321neo is miles ahead of the 737-9 in the 180+ seat area, meaning some airlines might just take the 320neo as the family. Basically, the most efficient aircraft in their segment.

jmt18325
Feb 18, 2017, 10:17 PM
:) I'm interested in something here. Wit your exchanges, and agreement, that the 767s and other models are not to your preference and are thankfully, being phased out......

To be honest, I've had only one experience with the 767. It was on Rouge, and other than the almost non existent recline, I found it very comfortable.

What aircraft do you see becoming the most frequntly purchased?

I really have no idea. I'm not expert, I'm just some guy. There are 5 787s coming on line this year, and 6 767s leaving the mainline. I'm not sure what is replacing the missing 767.

Edit: I misread - there are 9 787s coming this year.

The most cost-effective, the best size and range for markets etc etc.
The Bombardier C-series? The 737H? What? Please this is a question of intellectual curiosity only, not criticism. Thanx;)

And this is far outside of my expertise. All I really know is this (in terms of Air Canada). The 767 in mainline will have the worst CASM in Air Canada's widebody fleet. It's a solid bet that the worst CASM in the mainline narrowbody fleet will be the A319 (as it's a shrink of the A320). That means that the more efficient aircraft (the 787 is something like 25% more efficient than the mainline 767, and on par with the Rouge 767. Shifting them over to Rouge in the absence of newer used 767s on the market (Amazon has ruined the used market) would seem to be the best use of frames with life left is where they are most efficient in a higher fuel environment.

The A319 at Rouge is something like ~7% more efficient than the one at mainline. The Max 8 is said to be about 10% more efficient than the mainline narrow body fleet average. As the A319 is the least efficient mainline narrowbody (of the Airbus variety, anyway), it makes sense to cut those costs first.

jmt18325
Feb 18, 2017, 10:21 PM
My question - will some of the newer A320s/321s make their way over to Rouge to replace some of the 319s, or to grow the fleet?

Canadian74
Feb 19, 2017, 2:59 AM
The 321neoLR would be a better fit for AC because where Ac wants to use this aircraft type is at Rouge. These 321s would be used for YVR/YYC to Hawaii and YYZ to the British isles (LHR excluded).

AC doesn't have the right equipment to copy the 752 TransAt operation that is at UA EWR and DL JFK. The new 321LR would provide this lift.

Rouge intends to fly the Airbus narrowbody on a long term basis. Fleet plan is out 15+years.

It would be nice if Rouge gets 320/321neos in a few years. Canadian skies will be full of 737MAX otherwise. Some variety would be nice

LO 044
Feb 20, 2017, 3:54 PM
Personally i have always loved AC's 767 and 330 aircraft more so from seating arrangements than anything else. With all the chatter about how much more efficient the 787 is regardless of the length of the route, why is AC keeping the 767 or 330 at all besides aircraft availability? I can see AC holding out the 767's until a new agreement can be made with Rouge pilots to transfer over more aircraft but keeping 8 330's doesn't seem to make sense. Can/do 330 pilots fly other Airbus aircraft and vice versa the 319/320/321 pilots? If not then you are keeping a pilot base for only 8 aircraft which again doesn't make sense but i have no idea how it all works on the pilot staffing side so maybe people can correct me.

Again personally but i have always liked AC's 320 aircraft over WS's 737 aircraft. I'm assuming it's based on the seat and the material used on it but AC's 320 family always "seems" more spacious to me. Saying that, i never care for flying LH's 320/321 aircraft and that is definitely based on LH's seats. Bottom line is i will miss AC's 320's when they leave the fleet.

Cage
Feb 21, 2017, 12:03 AM
Dumped a response into the wrong thread, should not have used multiple open tabs.

Anyways short story for YVR thread, WS is expanding out of YXX to take on Newleaf competition in YWG.
Surely you can't be serious that WS thinks Newleaf is a threat. I am serious, and don't call me Shirley.

connect2source
Feb 21, 2017, 1:23 AM
The 321neoLR would be a better fit for AC because where Ac wants to use this aircraft type is at Rouge. These 321s would be used for YVR/YYC to Hawaii and YYZ to the British isles (LHR excluded).

AC doesn't have the right equipment to copy the 752 TransAt operation that is at UA EWR and DL JFK. The new 321LR would provide this lift.

Rouge intends to fly the Airbus narrowbody on a long term basis. Fleet plan is out 15+years.

Completely agree!! A321neos are the king of the MOM ( middle of market ) at the moment, and killing the 737MAX-9's in sales, 1388 vs 418 at the moment ( wiki ) and that's not even including the A321neoLR which seem unmatched in range and runway performance, hence AC is certainly going against the tide with this order. Even the US carriers are scrambling to add dozens of A321's at the moment, AA alone will have over 300 soon.

AC's decision was most certainly based on the deal the got from Boeing because little-to-nothing about the MAX even comes close to the neos at the moment, the present 737-900 is a dog, the MAX9 will likely follow suit. Horrible runway performance, especially hot and high and chronic weight and balance issues, many require a tail-stand to prevent tipping at the gate when loading and unloading. Shame AC went in this direction.

casper
Feb 22, 2017, 3:44 AM
Personally i have always loved AC's 767 and 330 aircraft more so from seating arrangements than anything else. With all the chatter about how much more efficient the 787 is regardless of the length of the route, why is AC keeping the 767 or 330 at all besides aircraft availability? I can see AC holding out the 767's until a new agreement can be made with Rouge pilots to transfer over more aircraft but keeping 8 330's doesn't seem to make sense. Can/do 330 pilots fly other Airbus aircraft and vice versa the 319/320/321 pilots? If not then you are keeping a pilot base for only 8 aircraft which again doesn't make sense but i have no idea how it all works on the pilot staffing side so maybe people can correct me.

Again personally but i have always liked AC's 320 aircraft over WS's 737 aircraft. I'm assuming it's based on the seat and the material used on it but AC's 320 family always "seems" more spacious to me. Saying that, i never care for flying LH's 320/321 aircraft and that is definitely based on LH's seats. Bottom line is i will miss AC's 320's when they leave the fleet.

The key thing to keep in mind on the A330 pilots is they use to run a much larger fleet. I believe they operated the A330 and a340. Now that the 340s are all gone it is a small fleet that is still left.

rxp
Feb 24, 2017, 5:03 PM
what is this i am seeing that air canada has one flight/ day to LHR in the summer? what happened to the 787 dreamliner being added on last year?

http://aircanada.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=935

Alexcaban
Feb 24, 2017, 5:06 PM
what is this i am seeing that air canada has one flight/ day to LHR in the summer? what happened to the 787 dreamliner being added on last year?

http://aircanada.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=935

Was cancelled in favour of adding FRA with the 788 and LGW with ACr.

mezzanine
Feb 24, 2017, 5:08 PM
AKAIK, not re-announced for this year and effectively cancelled.

Other posters might have more info on why/plane utilization, but I think new AC service to LGW (rouge) and FRA played a role.

edit - jinx!

Johnny Aussie
Feb 24, 2017, 9:54 PM
AKAIK, not re-announced for this year and effectively cancelled.

Other posters might have more info on why/plane utilization, but I think new AC service to LGW (rouge) and FRA played a role.

edit - jinx!

Perfect case of shifting capacity.

Way too many seats were added to LHR to justify keeping the second daily flight.

Also, FRA has been on Air Canada's to do list for yonks.

So a perfect shift.... move the second daily to FRA and add a few weekly LGW.

LeftCoaster
Feb 24, 2017, 9:55 PM
But we still don't know what AC is going to do with it's extra LHR slot do we?

Seems like an incredible waste to not use it. Can they lease it to another airliner?

Johnny Aussie
Feb 24, 2017, 10:40 PM
But we still don't know what AC is going to do with it's extra LHR slot do we?

Seems like an incredible waste to not use it. Can they lease it to another airliner?

Well with the summer sched season kicking in in about 3 months.... pretty late in the game to announce any new LHR flights... not sure if LHR has a use it or lose it clause (I'm sure they do) but not sure if you can keep a slot idle for a short period of time :shrug:

Johnny Aussie
Feb 24, 2017, 10:43 PM
Last few days YVR blog has posted the following...

A good summary of what's coming up by Craig Richmond:

http://www.yvr.ca/en/blog/2017/craigs-corner-the-year-ahead

Mentions the D expansion and the new "F" concourse for transborder... it's all happening.... YVR staying ahead of the game!

"...we will start work this year on the Pier D expansion project." and "...at the same time, we will start work on our ambitious Transborder expansion, where we will build out our US check in area and create a new “Pier F” for our airline partners."

I think the term "new services" isn't necessarily appropriate in the case of China Airlines for example... but new as in the A350...

And a summary of new routes / services increases:

http://www.yvr.ca/en/blog/2017/new-routes-and-services-roundup

nname
Feb 24, 2017, 10:54 PM
Well with the summer sched season kicking in in about 3 months.... pretty late in the game to announce any new LHR flights... not sure if LHR has a use it or lose it clause (I'm sure they do) but not sure if you can keep a slot idle for a short period of time :shrug:

Maybe they took a gamble and sold the slot for $$$$, and hope to buy it back for cheap after the 3rd runway is built (if that ever happens)

LeftCoaster
Feb 24, 2017, 10:56 PM
Well with the summer sched season kicking in in about 3 months.... pretty late in the game to announce any new LHR flights... not sure if LHR has a use it or lose it clause (I'm sure they do) but not sure if you can keep a slot idle for a short period of time :shrug:

Ya I wouldn't anticipate a new YVR-LHR route announcement for S17, I just figured we would have heard they sold or leased it to someone by now. Those things are literally worth millions.

LeftCoaster
Feb 24, 2017, 11:01 PM
Last few days YVR blog has posted the following...

A good summary of what's coming up by Craig Richmond:

http://www.yvr.ca/en/blog/2017/craigs-corner-the-year-ahead

Love the first comment in the comments section:

How about adding another direct flight to India 🇮🇳, linking Vancouver with Amritsar ATQ


I guess we're not the only airport enthusiasts with unrealistic exceptions. :haha:

LeftCoaster
Feb 24, 2017, 11:15 PM
"...we will start work this year on the Pier D expansion project." and "...at the same time, we will start work on our ambitious Transborder expansion, where we will build out our US check in area and create a new “Pier F” for our airline partners."

Interesting that Pier F (I'm assuming this is the East Concourse and its little finger) will go at the same side as Pier D

Also, I'm curious if by starting work this year they mean physical or design work. That is quite quick to start physical work, but given the level of design that has gone into the fly through they have likely already completed a lot of the initial design work.

trofirhen
Feb 25, 2017, 2:17 AM
Interesting that Pier F (I'm assuming this is the East Concourse and its little finger) will go at the same side as Pier D

Also, I'm curious if by starting work this year they mean physical or design work. That is quite quick to start physical work, but given the level of design that has gone into the fly through they have likely already completed a lot of the initial design work.

Surprised to hear, though, that pier F (Transborder) will start off with only four gates.

nname
Feb 25, 2017, 3:03 AM
Surprised to hear, though, that pier F (Transborder) will start off with only four gates.

Maybe it's 4 new gates + 7 replacements for E90-96 = 11 gates?

Reecemartin
Feb 25, 2017, 3:33 AM
Off topic but somewhat curious, are their any plans for a second hotel at YVR? Something akin to the Alt at Pearson (a budget offering) seems like a good idea, maybe at Sea Island Centre?

casper
Feb 25, 2017, 4:42 AM
Off topic but somewhat curious, are their any plans for a second hotel at YVR? Something akin to the Alt at Pearson (a budget offering) seems like a good idea, maybe at Sea Island Centre?

The blog post had reference to two projects outside the terminal that improve the customer experience. A hotel would fit the bill. I guess the Delta is the only other hotel on the island beyond the Fairmount.

Reecemartin
Feb 25, 2017, 4:46 AM
The blog post had reference to two projects outside the terminal that improve the customer experience. A hotel would fit the bill. I guess the Delta is the only other hotel on the island beyond the Fairmount.

Indeed, and a direct link to the Canada alone would be ideal.

mezzanine
Feb 25, 2017, 5:40 AM
Is there a need for another airport hotel? besides pacific gateway the westin wall centre seems like a swish place right on the river's edge with shuttles/taxi vouchers. even the river rock hotel would be a viable candidate right on the canada line.

then there are the ones off the radar in richmond city centre like the sheraton and radisson. i see a lot of asian flight crews getting snacks at the yaohan before their bus trundles off to the radisson.

casper
Feb 25, 2017, 4:12 PM
Is there a need for another airport hotel? besides pacific gateway the westin wall centre seems like a swish place right on the river's edge with shuttles/taxi vouchers. even the river rock hotel would be a viable candidate right on the canada line.

then there are the ones off the radar in richmond city centre like the sheraton and radisson. i see a lot of asian flight crews getting snacks at the yaohan before their bus trundles off to the radisson.

More passengers all tends to suggest a need for more hotels. Not certain what the average vacancy rate is for local hotels, however I encounter cases of having people come over to Vancouver and discover with some big event downtown they can't get a hotel room anywhere in Vancouver.

Reecemartin
Feb 25, 2017, 4:29 PM
More passengers all tends to suggest a need for more hotels. Not certain what the average vacancy rate is for local hotels, however I encounter cases of having people come over to Vancouver and discover with some big event downtown they can't get a hotel room anywhere in Vancouver.

Also IMO airport hotels can be a great place to stay when you have a rail link, in a couple different cities I have stayed at the airport and then just used the rail link to get into the downtown, can be quite an affordable option.

nname
Feb 27, 2017, 6:52 PM
According to Airlineroute, China Southern had opened reservation for Vancouver - Mexico City

excel
Feb 27, 2017, 7:12 PM
Nice! I remember flying JAL from YVR-MEX when I was a kid. Pretty sure it was my first 747.

Jebby
Feb 27, 2017, 11:09 PM
Nice! I remember flying JAL from YVR-MEX when I was a kid. Pretty sure it was my first 747.

Me too. We'd take that flight 4 or 5 times a year to visit family in Mexico. JAL's 747s were fantastic.

My grandma still has some of the down feather mini pillows from those flights lol

trofirhen
Feb 27, 2017, 11:32 PM
delete

thenoflyzone
Feb 28, 2017, 7:43 AM
not sure if LHR has a use it or lose it clause (I'm sure they do) but not sure if you can keep a slot idle for a short period of time :shrug:

Yes they do have a usage policy. Use it 80% of the time or lose it I believe.

But we still don't know what AC is going to do with it's extra LHR slot do we?

Seems like an incredible waste to not use it. Can they lease it to another airliner?

If you can sell it, then you probably can lease it out too. Dont have a concrete example though.
However since there is a "use it or lose it" policy, better make sure the airline you lease it out to uses the slot.


Ya I wouldn't anticipate a new YVR-LHR route announcement for S17, I just figured we would have heard they sold or leased it to someone by now. Those things are literally worth millions.

Highest I've heard is US$75 millon for a single slot pair. (Primetime morning)

Cage
Feb 28, 2017, 3:07 PM
Maybe they took a gamble and sold the slot for $$$$, and hope to buy it back for cheap after the 3rd runway is built (if that ever happens)

AC was leasing a couple of slot pairs from UA for Many years, then a few years back, AC quietly bought the slots from UA.

Here is the announcement where UA will bring a new 6th daily Sumer only service on EWR-LHR. http://www.incentivetravel.co.uk/airportairline/37764-united-airlines-increases-london-heathrow-new-york-frequency-to-six-times-daily

While the time don't necessarily line up on the LHR end, AC, UA and LH will trade amongst themselves to deprive the competing alliances from getting a hold of the slot. The ATI++ joint venture allows for these inherently anticompetitive actions to be legal.

fredinno
Feb 28, 2017, 7:09 PM
Is there space for a major runway on the north side on Sea Island? If not, it might be a better idea to rezone it industrial and connect a rail spur to it- so that industry can unload cargo directly onto the planes- and at the Ioco ferry if it's ever built

Genauso
Feb 28, 2017, 7:37 PM
Is there space for a major runway on the north side on Sea Island? If not, it might be a better idea to rezone it industrial and connect a rail spur to it- so that industry can unload cargo directly onto the planes- and at the Ioco ferry if it's ever built

Bulk cargo doesn't get flown, containers arrive by truck and have security/customs inspection procedures.

If you want to learn about YVR's future options with some background, they run a very tight ship http://www.yvr2037.ca/

Reecemartin
Feb 28, 2017, 7:49 PM
What are the plans for YVR in regards to sea level rise, isn't sea island basically already at sea level? With the West Antarctic sheet in much worse conditions than were expected for a long time we could sea a lot of sea level rise sooner than expected, compounded with soil inundation and furthered earthquake risk Id hope they have somewhat extensive mitigation plans.

fredinno
Feb 28, 2017, 10:30 PM
Bulk cargo doesn't get flown, containers arrive by truck and have security/customs inspection procedures.

If you want to learn about YVR's future options with some background, they run a very tight ship http://www.yvr2037.ca/

I know, the idea is more for special cargo, and for a future Iona Ferry, along with some close-in industrial land without destroying ALR.

Airplanes use smaller containers than the normal cargo size.

It's right by the ocean as well, depending on the boat sizes, maybe we could drop cargo into the North Arm in boats?

Also, if Airships take off to replace helicopters in remote transport, they could carry full-sized cargo.

Also, rail coming near the Airport could allow for some integration and cargo flights.

What are the plans for YVR in regards to sea level rise, isn't sea island basically already at sea level? With the West Antarctic sheet in much worse conditions than were expected for a long time we could sea a lot of sea level rise sooner than expected, compounded with soil inundation and furthered earthquake risk Id hope they have somewhat extensive mitigation plans.

Simple, it would truly fit its name of Sea Island ;)

Reecemartin
Feb 28, 2017, 11:12 PM
I know, the idea is more for special cargo, and for a future Iona Ferry, along with some close-in industrial land without destroying ALR.

Airplanes use smaller containers than the normal cargo size.

It's right by the ocean as well, depending on the boat sizes, maybe we could drop cargo into the North Arm in boats?

Also, if Airships take off to replace helicopters in remote transport, they could carry full-sized cargo.

Also, rail coming near the Airport could allow for some integration and cargo flights.



Simple, it would truly fit its name of Sea Island ;)

Lol the foresight doesn't appear to be there, the amount of investment in heavy infrastructure on Sea Island and in Richmond is immense, having to fight to keep water back is something that is both expensive and more treating the symptoms rather than the cause.

gordoninvancouver
Mar 1, 2017, 12:13 AM
What are the plans for YVR in regards to sea level rise, isn't sea island basically already at sea level? With the West Antarctic sheet in much worse conditions than were expected for a long time we could sea a lot of sea level rise sooner than expected, compounded with soil inundation and furthered earthquake risk Id hope they have somewhat extensive mitigation plans.

Likely they have some plans, I saw some information about raising dykes. However if you search Vancouver Sea Level Data and look at the statistics you will see that sea level rise here is on a pace of about 10 cm per century. Or an inch every 3 decades. So maybe a problem some day but even if the rate of rise triples not a problem for the next few decades.

fredinno
Mar 1, 2017, 6:25 PM
Likely they have some plans, I saw some information about raising dykes. However if you search Vancouver Sea Level Data and look at the statistics you will see that sea level rise here is on a pace of about 10 cm per century. Or an inch every 3 decades. So maybe a problem some day but even if the rate of rise triples not a problem for the next few decades.

Really, since big tsunamis and tropical storms aren't going to come near Vancouver until maybe 2100, the main loss is the steady erosion of the Fraser River Banks. :(

Is it worth it to build a seawall- especially since doing so would hopefully protect the structural integrity of DeltaPort? I mean, those things would be pretty expensive. :P

Reecemartin
Mar 1, 2017, 9:59 PM
Really, since big tsunamis and tropical storms aren't going to come near Vancouver until maybe 2100, the main loss is the steady erosion of the Fraser River Banks. :(

Is it worth it to build a seawall- especially since doing so would hopefully protect the structural integrity of DeltaPort? I mean, those things would be pretty expensive. :P

Good question

zahav
Mar 2, 2017, 8:29 AM
Jan stats are posted. Overall growth at 9.4%, very nice! Domestic up 5.6%, T-Border up 7.4%, Asia/Pacific up 22.4%, and Misc. up 27.1%. Amazing growth for Asia and Misc, those are amazingly high #s! Europe down 5.9% though, this is a second month of that. I wonder what the deal is! The other sectors are more than keeping things up though, international (inc. tborder) is up 13% still. With international growth more than double domestic, the split is now 47% domestic, 53% international. Great way to start the year I'd say!

nname
Mar 2, 2017, 4:56 PM
Air Canada intend to discontinue direct service YVR-YMM

https://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/ruling/2017-a-27

nname
Mar 2, 2017, 5:03 PM
Europe down 5.9% though, this is a second month of that. I wonder what the deal is!

Reduction of YVR-AMS to 4x weekly?

Gordon
Mar 2, 2017, 5:32 PM
I wonder how the construction of Pier F will impact the operation of the east apron holdroom( gates 90-96)?

It will be interesting to see if West jet intends to go daily with yvr ymm

SFUVancouver
Mar 2, 2017, 7:57 PM
Jan stats are posted. Overall growth at 9.4%, very nice! Domestic up 5.6%, T-Border up 7.4%, Asia/Pacific up 22.4%, and Misc. up 27.1%. Amazing growth for Asia and Misc, those are amazingly high #s! Europe down 5.9% though, this is a second month of that. I wonder what the deal is! The other sectors are more than keeping things up though, international (inc. tborder) is up 13% still. With international growth more than double domestic, the split is now 47% domestic, 53% international. Great way to start the year I'd say!

Thanks for the news and summary of the details. Those are very solid numbers, and we're talking year over year on a blockbuster 2016. The dip in Europe doesn't surprise me terribly and I expect that it will come roaring back as we get into spring.

LeftCoaster
Mar 2, 2017, 10:33 PM
Thanks Zahav.

Europe is a bit concerning, I don't know why it is down so much, I can't think of any services have cut seats to last winter, so it must be lower loads which is concerning.

Other than that those numbers are incredible. 22% to Asia is crazy huge, and given the capacity growth on the sector through the summer, likely to stay high.

SFU I doubt Europe will come roaring back, there is only an additional 4% capacity to the region over S16 so there isn't a ton of room for growth. Add in the crazy low fare competition that is happening in the US and Eastern Canada and I don't think we're going to see much Euro growth over the next 18 months.

trofirhen
Mar 2, 2017, 10:53 PM
Thanks Zahav.

Europe is a bit concerning, I don't know why it is down so much, I can't think of any services have cut seats to last winter, so it must be lower loads which is concerning. .........


SFU I doubt Europe will come roaring back, there is only an additional 4% capacity to the region over S16 so there isn't a ton of room for growth. Add in the crazy low fare competition that is happening in the US and Eastern Canada and I don't think we're going to see much Euro growth over the next 18 months.

Here in Europe, the unemployment rate is generally high, and national budgets are under strain from various sources, like the impending Brexit, financing the refugee influx,
and the outsourcing of much of the manufacturing sector to Asia. A lot of people, in most domains, are feeling the pinch.
That could be a big part of it, but why it dropped off so abruptly, I don't know.