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nname
Jul 14, 2018, 2:16 AM
Just noticed this posted on an travel agency website:

http://oi63.tinypic.com/9s3zn9.jpg

Now the time is almost up, who will be taking over JL's place for the second half of summer?

Seems like the US departure E85 had just been switched to a DL flight to SEA.

SpongeG
Jul 14, 2018, 8:10 AM
of interest

9QZNQjDoYKY

Johnny Aussie
Jul 14, 2018, 8:27 AM
of interest

Sounds like many of my colleagues! Gday Aussie!

And using LHR for footage?

YVR will be one massive construction zone for years to come.

Gordon
Jul 14, 2018, 6:41 PM
Good Video.

It seems that gate D75 is frequently unused during peak time so maybe after JAL's remote stand test D59 will only be used when necessary.

nname
Jul 14, 2018, 9:13 PM
Good Video.

It seems that gate D75 is frequently unused during peak time so maybe after JAL's remote stand test D59 will only be used when necessary.

Whenever I checked, D75 is always in use. But it's generally use for flights with multiple segments where one of the segment is not bookable. For instance, CAN-YVR-MEX (CZ), MNL-YVR-YYZ (last year on PR), and Mexico-YVR-YYC (TS).

CareerShow
Jul 14, 2018, 9:28 PM
Anyone have any idea how AC's Zurich, Paris, and Frankfurt flights are fairing?

SpongeG
Jul 15, 2018, 8:57 AM
unrelated but I get to spend just over 16 hours getting to know the dreamliner, yay?

1WZb66hFBkQ

Johnny Aussie
Jul 15, 2018, 9:17 PM
unrelated but I get to spend just over 16 hours getting to know the dreamliner, yay?

Hmmm that wouldn’t happen to be to MEL would it?

Johnny Aussie
Jul 15, 2018, 9:46 PM
Last round of schedule updates has AC operating 17 daily flights to California for winter 18/19.

LAX 5 (includes a daily 73MAX and an A321 - boosted from 4 daily)
SFO 4 (no change except one will be operated by an Express CR9)
SJC 3 (boosted from 2)
SAN 3 (boosted from 2)
PSP 1 (new daily mainline - replaces twice weekly rouge)
SMF 1 (new route)

Also DEN being bumped to twice daily from one for the entire winter schedule.

Gordon
Jul 15, 2018, 10:20 PM
Rouge is now basically ou of the YVR market. how is it doing elsewhere is canada?

Johnny Aussie
Jul 15, 2018, 10:44 PM
Rouge is now basically ou of the YVR market. how is it doing elsewhere is canada?

Well, there will still be two daily LAS next summer :haha:

KIX now showing 6 weekly 788s effective first week of July (daily x 6)

However.... the following still showing in the schedule as of now... subject to change of course....
DUB 5 weekly rouge first week of July
NGO 3 weekly rouge first week of July

libtard
Jul 15, 2018, 11:38 PM
Another power outage at the airport

SpongeG
Jul 16, 2018, 6:55 AM
Hmmm that wouldn’t happen to be to MEL would it?

yea, I bided for an upgrade I kinda hope I don't get it though lol, so expensive.

I landed today from up north, there is a lot of work going on at the east end of the runway, what are they doing?

Johnny Aussie
Jul 16, 2018, 11:08 PM
yea, I bided for an upgrade I kinda hope I don't get it though lol, so expensive.

I landed today from up north, there is a lot of work going on at the east end of the runway, what are they doing?

Welcome to Australia! I can see your plane diverted to SYD.

Edit: stuck in a queue taking off from SYD now. Pretty long delay!

You’ll get here eventually! Beautiful sunny winter morning and clear skies.

nname
Jul 17, 2018, 12:15 AM
DUB 5 weekly rouge first week of July
NGO 3 weekly rouge first week of July

I remember a couple of weeks ago, NGO was no longer shown on AC's site for booking (still displayed in schedule), but now they seems to make them available again :???:

Maybe there's a chance of them keeping the route next summer, since the load seems to be good late-June and early-July (with a few flight very close to being sold out)?

Johnny Aussie
Jul 17, 2018, 12:30 AM
I remember a couple of weeks ago, NGO was no longer shown on AC's site for booking (still displayed in schedule), but now they seems to make them available again :???:

Maybe there's a chance of them keeping the route next summer, since the load seems to be good late-June and early-July (with a few flight very close to being sold out)?

Yeah who knows. I think next summer’s schedule is far from finalised. If a route is definitely being cancelled I would expect that to be pulled pretty soon though.

Good news about KIX though - almost daily :)

nname
Jul 17, 2018, 12:49 AM
Last round of schedule updates has AC operating 17 daily flights to California for winter 18/19.

LAX 5 (includes a daily 73MAX and an A321 - boosted from 4 daily)
SFO 4 (no change except one will be operated by an Express CR9)
SJC 3 (boosted from 2)
SAN 3 (boosted from 2)
PSP 1 (new daily mainline - replaces twice weekly rouge)
SMF 1 (new route)

Also DEN being bumped to twice daily from one for the entire winter schedule.

Although it's nowhere near California, I guess it's worthwhile to mention that YXY is now 3x daily and YZF is 2x daily for most of the winter :D


Welcome to Australia! I can see your plane diverted to SYD.

Wonder what happened... flight tracking site show weird flight path past Hawaii...

Johnny Aussie
Jul 17, 2018, 1:55 AM
Although it's nowhere near California, I guess it's worthwhile to mention that YXY is now 3x daily and YZF is 2x daily for most of the winter :D

Wonder what happened... flight tracking site show weird flight path past Hawaii...

Plenty of increases next winter from YVR. Hawaii, Mexico, Phoenix as well. Yes, YVR loses MCO on rouge which no doubt many will focus on that the sky is falling. WestJet will still be flying to MCO from YVR for those who prefer non stops.

AC37 just touched down... will be over 4 hours late by the time it gets to the gate.

trofirhen
Jul 17, 2018, 2:27 AM
Plenty of increases next winter from YVR. Hawaii, Mexico, Phoenix as well. Yes, YVR loses MCO on rouge which no doubt many will focus on that the sky is falling. WestJet will still be flying to MCO from YVR for those who prefer non stops.

AC37 just touched down... will be over 4 hours late by the time it gets to the gate.

:)A question, please: what was the AC flight C37 departure point? Thank you.

nname
Jul 17, 2018, 4:58 AM
:)a question, please: What was the ac flight c37 departure point? Thank you.

This should have all AC (mainline) long-hual flights :D

AC
1 YYZ HND
3 YVR NRT
5 YUL NRT
7 YVR HKG
9 YYC NRT
11 YUL PVG
13
15 YYZ HKG
17 YVR TPE
19
21
23
25 YVR PVG
27 YYZ PVG
29 YVR PEK
31 YYZ PEK
33 YVR SYD
35 YVR BNE
37 YVR MEL
39 YVR KIX

42 YYZ DEL
44 YVR DEL
46 YYZ BOM
48
50
52
54
56 YYZ DXB
58

61 YYZ ICN
63 YVR ICN
65
67
69
71
73
75
77
79

82 YUL TLV
84 YYZ TLV
86
88
90 YYZ GRU
92 YYZ SCL
94 YYZ EZE
96
98

800
802 YVR ZRH
804
806 YVR CDG
808 YUL CMN
810
812 YUL KEF
814
816 YYZ KEF
818 YUL DUB
820 YYZ SNN
822 YYT LHR
824 YYZ AMS
826 YYZ WAW
828 YUL LYS
830
832 YUL BRU
834 YUL GVA
836 YYZ MAD
838 YOW FRA
840 YVR FRA
842 YYZ DUB
844 YYC FRA
846 YYZ MUC
848 YYZ LHR
850 YYC LHR
852
854 YVR LHR
856 YYZ LHR
858 YYZ LHR
860 YHZ LHR
862
864 YUL LHR
866
868 YYZ LHR
870 YUL CDG
872 YYZ FRA
874 YUL FRA
876 YYZ FRA
878 YYZ ZRH
880 YYZ CDG
882 YYZ CPH
884 YUL CDG
886
888 YOW LHR
890 YYZ FCO
892 YUL FCO
894 YYZ MXP
896 YVR LHR
898

Seems like if NGO is ever going mainline, most likely it'll be AC65, 67, or 69?

And for DUB... well, seems like AC is quite short in number for Europe... AC804?

SpongeG
Jul 17, 2018, 6:41 AM
Welcome to Australia! I can see your plane diverted to SYD.

Edit: stuck in a queue taking off from SYD now. Pretty long delay!

You’ll get here eventually! Beautiful sunny winter morning and clear skies.

I leave YVR on wednesday and get to Melbourne on friday, I got an email today and they gave me an upgrade to premium economy, it is going to be better since its 16 hours+ on the plane. I'll suffer on the way home in economy.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 17, 2018, 6:57 AM
I leave YVR on wednesday and get to Melbourne on friday, I got an email today and they gave me an upgrade to premium economy, it is going to be better since its 16 hours+ on the plane. I'll suffer on the way home in economy.

That’s funny! Here I am thinking you were flying in today!

Hope your flight actually goes nonstop! Today’s was over 4 hours late.

We just booked premium economy on EVA Air from TPE to YVR for Xmas for less than AC in economy. Pretty easy decision!

Gordon
Jul 18, 2018, 3:56 PM
KE YVR ICN is using D59 today

nname
Jul 19, 2018, 6:04 AM
Air New Zealand adds Boeing 787 service to Vancouver in NW18

Air New Zealand in Northern winter 2018/19 season is introducing Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner aircraft on Auckland – Vancouver market, replacing 777-200ER. The 787-9 aircraft will operate from 31OCT18. Additionally, during peak season the Star Alliance member will introduce additional service, up to 8-9 flights a week.

28OCT18 – 02DEC18 4 weekly (Day x124)
03DEC18 – 09DEC18 5 weekly (Day x24)
10DEC18 – 09FEB19 8 weekly (NZ022/025 operates Day 6; Additional flight added on 08JAN19)
10FEB19 – 24FEB19 7 weekly
25FEB19 – 28MAR19 6 weekly (Day x2)

NZ024 AKL2005 – 1210YVR 789
NZ022 AKL2230 – 1435YVR 789

NZ023 YVR1825 – 0530+2AKL 789
NZ025 YVR2055 – 0800+2AKL 789

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/279648/air-new-zealand-adds-boeing-787-service-to-vancouver-in-nw18/

I assume it would be the version with more Y and less PY and C?

Hourglass
Jul 19, 2018, 6:11 AM
Cathay Pacific will begin 4x/week service from Hong Kong to Seattle on 31 March 2019. Different markets, but will be interesting to see what the impact is -- if any -- on YVR. I'm guessing CX saw an opportunity to jump in since DL is ending their HKG-SEA service.

mezzanine
Jul 19, 2018, 7:06 AM
Yeah, interesting to see how the forum at airliners parses this new CX/SEA service. a late night SEA departure with a 0525 arrival will force a long layover for india-bound pax. the timing also seems to mirror BR service from SEA with similar connections to SE asia, with perhaps better connections to mainland china from HKG versus BR/TPE.

The flight returns to SEA at ~ 2100, limiting connections to further points in the USA.

Well, we'll see how this service does and how it impacts YVR business. as always, watch the J/PY demand, and on the flip side watch out for oddly unsustainable seat sales at YVR and SEA..

LeftCoaster
Jul 19, 2018, 8:00 PM
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/279648/air-new-zealand-adds-boeing-787-service-to-vancouver-in-nw18/

I assume it would be the version with more Y and less PY and C?

The daily flight is the Y heavy configuration and the Tuesday/Saturday extra service is the premium heavy configuration.

Yeah, interesting to see how the forum at airliners parses this new CX/SEA service. a late night SEA departure with a 0525 arrival will force a long layover for india-bound pax. the timing also seems to mirror BR service from SEA with similar connections to SE asia, with perhaps better connections to mainland china from HKG versus BR/TPE.

The flight returns to SEA at ~ 2100, limiting connections to further points in the USA.

Well, we'll see how this service does and how it impacts YVR business. as always, watch the J/PY demand, and on the flip side watch out for oddly unsustainable seat sales at YVR and SEA..

Seems to be primarily aimed at O&D to SEA with schedules like that. I'm sure at 5x PW or even daily they'll be fine.

LeftCoaster
Jul 19, 2018, 8:05 PM
Anyone catch this article on Daily Hive? It's 'custom content' which means it was paid for an written by YVR.
http://dailyhive.com/vancouver/vancouver-international-airport-yvr-by-the-numbers

The one tidbit I found really interesting is that they said they expect destinations to expand from 127 today to 144 by 2020. That's 14 new destinations in the next 24-30 months.

What do you guys think they'll be? Here are my guesses:

https://i.imgur.com/3UFt8Tc.png

Of course red is domestic, blue is trans-border and orange is intl'.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 19, 2018, 10:12 PM
I leave YVR on wednesday and get to Melbourne on friday, I got an email today and they gave me an upgrade to premium economy, it is going to be better since its 16 hours+ on the plane. I'll suffer on the way home in economy.

Ok now it’s official! Welcome to Australia and unlike Tuesday’s flight AC37 arrived nice and early.

Enjoy your trip.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 19, 2018, 11:45 PM
Singacouver has a nice ring to it.

YVR twitter picked up on this followed by a friendly exchange between YVR and SIN :haha:.

http://www.anna.aero/2018/07/04/singapore-vancouver-is-skyscanner-unserved-route-of-the-week-with-130000-searches/

Firebrand
Jul 20, 2018, 12:46 AM
Anyone catch this article on Daily Hive? It's 'custom content' which means it was paid for an written by YVR.
http://dailyhive.com/vancouver/vancouver-international-airport-yvr-by-the-numbers

The one tidbit I found really interesting is that they said they expect destinations to expand from 127 today to 144 by 2020. That's 14 new destinations in the next 24-30 months.

What do you guys think they'll be? Here are my guesses:

https://i.imgur.com/3UFt8Tc.png

Of course red is domestic, blue is trans-border and orange is intl'.

Still no direct flight to Orlando? I wonder if there is since I flew and stayed there for eight days. (This might be a stupid question since I’m not familiar with aircraft flight routes, service, destinations and so on.)

Johnny Aussie
Jul 20, 2018, 1:32 AM
Still no direct flight to Orlando? I wonder if there is since I flew and stayed there for eight days. (This might be a stupid question since I’m not familiar with aircraft flight routes, service, destinations and so on.)

Seasonal nonstop on Westjet winter only.

Firebrand
Jul 20, 2018, 5:52 AM
Seasonal nonstop on Westjet winter only.

For December to March or November to February?

Then again, Disneyland is much closer to YVR than Disneyworld is. HNL is much closer to where I live than PUJ (Dominican Republic), where my family lives.

trofirhen
Jul 20, 2018, 11:34 AM
Anyone catch this article on Daily Hive? It's 'custom content' which means it was paid for an written by YVR.
http://dailyhive.com/vancouver/vancouver-international-airport-yvr-by-the-numbers

The one tidbit I found really interesting is that they said they expect destinations to expand from 127 today to 144 by 2020. That's 14 new destinations in the next 24-30 months.

What do you guys think they'll be? Here are my guesses:

https://i.imgur.com/3UFt8Tc.png

Of course red is domestic, blue is trans-border and orange is intl'.

:2cents::2cents: IMO, domestic seems fine.
Transborder... what drives the Nashville market? (I know Calgary has a Nashville flight on WS .... tied to the music industry? I'd have thought maybe MCI would be more profitable)
International: Singapore, YES!! Istanbul, YES!! But why only PTY and not GRU? Apparently there's a big Tokyo-São Paulo market.
And Dubai? Do we need that?? Hanoi but no Bangkok? hmm

Hot Rod
Jul 20, 2018, 3:41 PM
:2cents::2cents: IMO, domestic seems fine.
Transborder... what drives the Nashville market? (I know Calgary has a Nashville flight on WS .... tied to the music industry? I'd have thought maybe MCI would be more profitable)
International: Singapore, YES!! Istanbul, YES!! But why only PTY and not GRU? Apparently there's a big Tokyo-São Paulo market.
And Dubai? Do we need that?? Hanoi but no Bangkok? hmm

Ya, I would make the following amendments:

Remove Reno OR Austin
Remove Nashville
Remove Dubai
Add Sao Paulo
Add Bangkok
Add Chongqing


Sao Paulo is obvious for the reasons already mentioned. Bangkok due to it being an already identified city pair, along with Vietnam Airlines/Hanoi. Chongqing because it is by far the biggest city in China without non-stop service to Canada.

thenoflyzone
Jul 20, 2018, 6:21 PM
The way the article is written, YVR seems to confirm 144 destinations by 2020. So either they already know which airlines will launch what routes, or they are simply projecting the growth of the last 5-10 years. I think it might be a bit of both, but with oil prices on the rise, and AC's growth period ending, 144 by 2020 is a bit optimistic.

Nonetheless, here goes....

One of the new destinations is Liberia. That one is confirmed.

As for the rest, as far as long haul is concerned, SIN and IST are the two likely destinations. China and the U.A.E have bilateral challenges, so those are out. Of course some Chinese airline already serving YVR can juggle it's schedule and add Xian. Vietnam is too long and too low yielding, especiallly with oil prices on the rise.

In the US, from Lefty's list, all except PHL are long shots. MIA is a long shot also. Don't see AA launching it. They already have YVR-South America covered through DFW. AC couldn't make MCO work, so MIA is a tough sell. With the DL tie-up, it makes more sense for WS to launch ATL rather than MIA. I can definitely see AA launching PHL-YVR though.

In Misc, PTY is a likely candidate, once they get their hands on some Max 8s. GRU has been discussed ad nauseum. We all know the challenges of South America, especially deep South America.

As for the Canadian cities, all of them make sense, except for Windsor. YQB needs more west coast destinations, but it will be a tough sell. WS is trying YYC-YQB this year, seasonally. Hopefully it stays. So a YVR-YQB would be cool to see also.

So to sum up, 144 by 2020 is a nice wishlist. Chances are they wont get there by 2020.

osirisboy
Jul 20, 2018, 8:53 PM
What's yvr thinking that they can add all those new destinations??!! Who do think they are, Montreal or somethin?

whatnext
Jul 20, 2018, 9:38 PM
Who's the genius at YVR who thought it would be a great idea to install those new anti-van attack bollards during peak season?

And multiple sets of speedbumps leading up to the terminal? :hell:

nname
Jul 20, 2018, 9:42 PM
The way the article is written, YVR seems to confirm 144 destinations by 2020. So either they already know which airlines will launch what routes, or they are simply projecting the growth of the last 5-10 years. I think it might be a bit of both, but with oil prices on the rise, and AC's growth period ending, 144 by 2020 is a bit optimistic.

I believe some of the 7M8 and CS3 A220s are for expansion? Maybe these new generation aircrafts will make some of the routes viable.

LeftCoaster
Jul 20, 2018, 10:24 PM
Still no direct flight to Orlando? I wonder if there is since I flew and stayed there for eight days. (This might be a stupid question since I’m not familiar with aircraft flight routes, service, destinations and so on.)

There is a direct flight to Orlando, and it's counted as one of the 127.

The way the article is written, YVR seems to confirm 144 destinations by 2020. So either they already know which airlines will launch what routes, or they are simply projecting the growth of the last 5-10 years. I think it might be a bit of both, but with oil prices on the rise, and AC's growth period ending, 144 by 2020 is a bit optimistic.

Nonetheless, here goes....

One of the new destinations is Liberia. That one is confirmed.

As for the rest, as far as long haul is concerned, SIN and IST are the two likely destinations. China and the U.A.E have bilateral challenges, so those are out. Of course some Chinese airline already serving YVR can juggle it's schedule and add Xian. Vietnam is too long and too low yielding, especiallly with oil prices on the rise.

In the US, from Lefty's list, all except PHL are long shots. MIA is a long shot also. Don't see AA launching it. They already have YVR-South America covered through DFW. AC couldn't make MCO work, so MIA is a tough sell. With the DL tie-up, it makes more sense for WS to launch ATL rather than MIA. I can definitely see AA launching PHL-YVR though.

In Misc, PTY is a likely candidate, once they get their hands on some Max 8s. GRU has been discussed ad nauseum. We all know the challenges of South America, especially deep South America.

As for the Canadian cities, all of them make sense, except for Windsor. YQB needs more west coast destinations, but it will be a tough sell. WS is trying YYC-YQB this year, seasonally. Hopefully it stays. So a YVR-YQB would be cool to see also.

So to sum up, 144 by 2020 is a nice wishlist. Chances are they wont get there by 2020.

Liberia is already counted in the 127. Their website "Destinations Brochure" (http://www.yvr.ca/-/media/yvr/documents/facts-sheets/destinations-brochure_2018_03.pdf?la=en) displays 125 current destinations, so Liberia and one other I can't figure out are the missing destinations to get it to 127.

As for the rest of the intl. I was thinking a new china route would be one of the weird tack-ons like China Eastern does with Kunming. MU in particular had expressed interest in a Xi'an tack on in the past. Only reason I included Dubai was the bilateral negotiations supposedly taking place right now. I could see YYZ going daily and a few more nuggets tossed out to YUL and YVR. Hanoi is a longer shot but I could see it happening, the economics remind me of Philippine Airlines, but they have more appropriate planes for the route.

As for transborder I based it off the 2016 O&D from Statscan. Miami is just a shade under 100k O&D, its the largest unserved transborder route if I recall correctly, and much higher yielding than Orlando. Austin is 26k in O&D and growing quickly, with growing tech sector links and teh A220 I could see it making sense. Nashville was a reach, but Vancouver's O&D is higher than Calgary's and apparently their route is exceeding expectations, so I don't know why AC couldn't take a swing at it. Spokane... well I dunno, seems close.

As for Canada its a tough one as there are only so many airports in the west that can even land a plane large enough to get there, so it's slim pickings. I think it's more likely we add Lima or Chongquing than Windsor so maybe I should just remove one of the domestic destinations.

Gordon
Jul 20, 2018, 10:53 PM
China Canada Bi-lateral

How much space is there for Canadian airlines to add flights to china?

The DL frlight to ATL is a red eye, could they no get a better landing slot?

nname
Jul 21, 2018, 12:19 AM
There is a direct flight to Orlando, and it's counted as one of the 127.



Liberia is already counted in the 127. Their website "Destinations Brochure" (http://www.yvr.ca/-/media/yvr/documents/facts-sheets/destinations-brochure_2018_03.pdf?la=en) displays 125 current destinations, so Liberia and one other I can't figure out are the missing destinations to get it to 127.


Hmm... Tofino Long Beach and Tofino Harbour is counted as different destination?
Or it's missing Vancouver Harbour... Helijet have two daily YVR-CXH flights on weekdays.


As for transborder I based it off the 2016 O&D from Statscan. Miami is just a shade under 100k O&D, its the largest unserved transborder route if I recall correctly, and much higher yielding than Orlando. Austin is 26k in O&D and growing quickly, with growing tech sector links and teh A220 I could see it making sense. Nashville was a reach, but Vancouver's O&D is higher than Calgary's and apparently their route is exceeding expectations, so I don't know why AC couldn't take a swing at it. Spokane... well I dunno, seems close.

If AC wants to build a hub in YVR like they did in YYZ, then those short-hual flights like Spokane, or maybe even Oakland, Ontario, Santa Ana, Eugene, Boise would make sense (similar to Harrisburg, Savanna, Rochester, etc from YYZ). But the thing is... The TPAC offering at YVR is much much less than the wide range TATL flights in YYZ. In fact, what makes YVR special that will attract people to connect here? You can list a whole list of European destination for YYZ, but for YVR... I can only think of KIX, NGO, .. and to a much lesser degree, DEL, TPE, BNE, and MEL.


China Canada Bi-lateral

How much space is there for Canadian airlines to add flights to china?

I lost count already... but Canada only used about half of them, so at least 4 dailies left.
The problem is... getting a slot at any of the Chinese airport is probably much harder than the bilateral negation...

mezzanine
Jul 21, 2018, 5:25 AM
I know IAD is officially on the list already, but it's a few weekly flights in the summer for cruise ship passengers IIRC. Regular year-round flights to IAD would really be a boost to YVR for transit hub aspirations and as a regular, important connection. based on the statscan report, 2016 O+D is larger than AUS and in the realm of SAN.




If AC wants to build a hub in YVR like they did in YYZ, then those short-hual flights like Spokane, or maybe even Oakland, Ontario, Santa Ana, Eugene, Boise would make sense (similar to Harrisburg, Savanna, Rochester, etc from YYZ). But the thing is... The TPAC offering at YVR is much much less than the wide range TATL flights in YYZ.

also consider places that already have service from other carriers, but would enhance/strengthen the AC hub. For instance, SLC has DL/WS service to YVR, but AC service would really synergize with their AC's TPAC hub. (skyteam transfers may be comparable, but can't say for sure.)

How is AC's YVR/DFW service doing?

Johnny Aussie
Jul 21, 2018, 5:41 AM
I know IAD is officially on the list already, but it's a few weekly flights in the summer for cruise ship passengers IIRC. Regular year-round flights to IAD would really be a boost to YVR for transit hub aspirations and as a regular, important connection. based on the statscan report, 2016 O+D is larger than AUS and in the realm of SAN.

also consider places that already have service from other carriers, but would enhance/strengthen the AC hub. For instance, SLC has DL/WS service to YVR, but AC service would really synergize with their AC's TPAC hub. (skyteam transfers may be comparable, but can't say for sure.)

How is AC's YVR/DFW service doing?

Just remember for new transborder routes a large enough O&D with decent yields and/or the ability to feed onward connections (on either end or both ends) are vital to making a new route viable. Washington/Baltimore is miles ahead in O&D than AUS or SLC. There is adequate O&D to SLC but not high enough as a stand-alone. SLC is served by DL because DL has a decently sized hub there.
AUS still a long shot. Give it a few more years maybe. Also having the right aircraft with the right economics is also a factor.
MIA/FLL certainly on the cusp of making the route work and possibly PHL.

Don’t forget people, Toronto is just that much larger of a market with much larger business activity than Vancouver.

mezzanine
Jul 21, 2018, 6:00 AM
There is adequate O&D to SLC but not high enough as a stand-alone. SLC is served by DL because DL has a decently sized hub there.

I suspect there are a lot of economics and incentives that i'm unaware of that makes this so, but those statements conflict. Why is the same O+D suitable for DL's 2 flights from YVR to SLC and not for AC?

that being said, AC had to drop their YYZ/SLC flight a while ago.

nname
Jul 21, 2018, 6:31 AM
How is AC's YVR/DFW service doing?

LF for the last 12 months... and since I got the data loaded, I throw in a few other routes for comparison

DFW BOS MCO DEN SAN SJC
17/02 58.9% 93.0% 77.3%
17/03 71.9% 95.4% 73.9%
17/04 55.5% 91.3% 89.8%
17/05 65.8% 63.2% 87.2% 72.0%
17/06 85.1% 75.1% 88.6% 84.7%
17/07 83.7% 80.7% 79.6% 90.8% 87.0%
17/08 79.8% 78.9% 82.3% 91.2% 85.9%
17/09 75.8% 88.9% 76.2% 88.9% 74.8%
17/10 65.0% 84.2% 68.5% 83.7% 71.1%
17/11 80.7% 76.3% 87.8% 76.8%
17/12 79.7% 77.6% 73.7% 84.3% 73.4%
18/01 78.0% 62.7% 78.0% 86.6% 69.8%


And since YYZ-SLC was mentioned, there's the LF before it was cancelled

17/02 60.0%
17/03 74.5%
17/04 62.2%
17/05 66.3%
17/06 83.6%
17/07 85.7%
17/08 86.4%
17/09 79.7%
17/10 72.6%

Johnny Aussie
Jul 21, 2018, 8:53 AM
I suspect there are a lot of economics and incentives that i'm unaware of that makes this so, but those statements conflict. Why is the same O+D suitable for DL's 2 flights from YVR to SLC and not for AC?

that being said, AC had to drop their YYZ/SLC flight a while ago.

DL’s hub in SLC has a vast array of destinations that the YVR flights can feed on to. From SLC to YVR there are far fewer options for SLC originating passengers.
So, again, the YVR-SLC flights are there only because of DL’s hub. If DL didn’t have a hub there there wouldn’t be any direct flights to SLC. The O&D wouldn’t be enough to sustain probably even a single daily CR9.

thenoflyzone
Jul 21, 2018, 1:42 PM
China Canada Bi-lateral

How much space is there for Canadian airlines to add flights to china?


Plenty, but AC is on record as saying they want more slots at PEK and PVG. They are not interested in serving secondary Chinese cities.

Hmm... Tofino Long Beach and Tofino Harbour is counted as different destination?


All airports do this. LGW, LHR are counted as different destinations. Same with CDG or ORY. Although I admit, Splitting Tofino is pretty silly.....

Airport authorities use silly marketing tactics. That's just the way it is. And it's not just limited to YVR.

And since YYZ-SLC was mentioned, there's the LF before it was cancelled

17/02 60.0%
17/03 74.5%
17/04 62.2%
17/05 66.3%
17/06 83.6%
17/07 85.7%
17/08 86.4%
17/09 79.7%
17/10 72.6%

This proves two things. Anyone can fill a plane to pretty much anywhere in peak summer out of Canada. The shoulder seasons and winter is where the challenge is at. Mind you, those are still decent load factors even during the shoulder season.
Second, and probably more importantly, decent load factors dont mean the airline is making money on the route. It's been said numerous times.

mezzanine
Jul 21, 2018, 9:06 PM
DL’s hub in SLC has a vast array of destinations that the YVR flights can feed on to. From SLC to YVR there are far fewer options for SLC originating passengers.
So, again, the YVR-SLC flights are there only because of DL’s hub. If DL didn’t have a hub there there wouldn’t be any direct flights to SLC. The O&D wouldn’t be enough to sustain probably even a single daily CR9.

I think there's more nuance though, and more potential for YVR. SLC is more of a hub for USA/transborder and really limited with intl. a dedicated AC feed to itl flights IMO may be profitable.

I wonder how AC's flight to DFW will do in the long-term, as much it would be interesting to see what WS does with its 787 service wrt YVR versus YYC.

So is SLC destined to be another Cincinnati, continually cut and reduced to a shadow of its former self? Probably not. But is it destined to grow in Delta’s network? Also a probable no.

Over the past decade, the traffic has fluctuated in a rather narrow band and that is likely to continue—with a gradual upward slope. There are a number of factors that lead to this conclusion.

•SLC has an excellent location and serves well as a collection and distribution point for communities in the intermountain West, providing an alternative to Denver, which is larger and a battleground between United, Southwest and Frontier.

•Unlike Cincinnati (or Memphis), SLC is far from any alternative connecting hub in the Delta network, again making the location an advantage.

•Southwest has a very strong presence at both Las Vegas and Phoenix (with US Airways), making those points dubious hubs for any other legacy carrier. But WN does not have the local service, small-aircraft capabilities that are required for small cities like Billings, MT or Fargo, ND. The feed traffic that Delta enjoys at SLC is probably dependable and may even grow—with little or no competition.

•Delta’s major hubs are built around a complex domestic/international cross-feed. The absence of that at SLC will continue to limit the hub’s expansion. While individual international flights may work, there is neither the synergy nor the customer base to support an extensive international network.

•With a 75% share, most frequent travelers are probably Delta/SkyTeam devotees, and when traveling over long distances most will likely opt for a Delta connection over one of its other, frequently-linked, hubs. Another international hub is unnecessary.


https://centreforaviation.com/analysis/reports/salt-lake-city-a-vulnerable-hub-57213

stiffdeadman
Jul 21, 2018, 9:51 PM
I think there's more nuance though, and more potential for YVR. SLC is more of a hub for USA/transborder and really limited with intl. a dedicated AC feed to itl flights IMO may be profitable.

I wonder how AC's flight to DFW will do in the long-term, as much it would be interesting to see what WS does with its 787 service wrt YVR versus YYC.



https://centreforaviation.com/analysis/reports/salt-lake-city-a-vulnerable-hub-57213

salt lake city is rebuilding the whole airport into a new state of the art facility. the existing airport buildings (terminal, parking, etc.) will all be gone by 2024, replaced with a massive new terminal and satellite concourse. i'm sure delta was heavily involved and won't be going anywhere.

mezzanine
Jul 21, 2018, 11:56 PM
salt lake city is rebuilding the whole airport into a new state of the art facility. the existing airport buildings (terminal, parking, etc.) will all be gone by 2024, replaced with a massive new terminal and satellite concourse. i'm sure delta was heavily involved and won't be going anywhere.

my CAPA link is from 2011, but I still think AC to SLC has viability. DEN is a similarly located airport but the only TPAC service IIRC is to Tokyo. And this is a with a large, efficient and mature airport with a *A hub to boot.

My point is TPAC from SLC even with Midwest feed may have difficulty that YVR can serve especially while SLC is catching up.

nname
Jul 22, 2018, 12:22 AM
DL’s hub in SLC has a vast array of destinations that the YVR flights can feed on to. From SLC to YVR there are far fewer options for SLC originating passengers.
So, again, the YVR-SLC flights are there only because of DL’s hub. If DL didn’t have a hub there there wouldn’t be any direct flights to SLC. The O&D wouldn’t be enough to sustain probably even a single daily CR9.

I can definitely see SLC possible with a daily CR9, as it seems like AC have a much lower performance target for Express route than mainline or Rouge. However, based on the LF data, if there is an extra plane lying around, AC would probably better off adding a summer 4th daily to SAN or even SJC, rather than use it on SLC...

Maybe that could happen in 2020, as it seems like the SJC and SAN are good candidate for conversion to mainline CS3 A220 route.

Also, it's not surprising to the huge increase in Hawaii service... as AC's flight currently have high-80 to low-90% LF to HNL and OGG year-round.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 22, 2018, 12:28 AM
my CAPA link is from 2011, but I still think AC to SLC has viability. DEN is a similarly located airport but the only TPAC service IIRC is to Tokyo. And this is a with a large, efficient and mature airport with a *A hub to boot.

My point is TPAC from SLC even with Midwest feed may have difficulty that YVR can serve especially while SLC is catching up.

DEN is a much larger city and a much larger O&D Market from YVR and both are Star Alliance hubs.

Do you know how large the SLC - Asia market is?

DL would easily feed the SLC traffic through its SEA hub (both DL hubs). DL is using SEA as its trans pac hub plus DL has plenty of Asian flights from its other hubs in LAX, MSP, DTW and ATL. DL’s hub at SLC is primarily a domestic transfer hub with very limited Canadian flights.

Also YYZ-SLC also a larger O&D Market

In any event I disagree. I don’t think YVR-SLC would be on AC’s to do list for the many reasons stated above.

nname
Jul 22, 2018, 12:45 AM
DEN is a much larger city and a much larger O&D Market from YVR and both are Star Alliance hubs.

Do you know how large the SLC - Asia market is?

SLC is the primary entry and exit port for the Yellowstone tour.

The other options are LAS, LAX, and to much a lesser degree, SFO, DEN, SEA, YVR, and YYC, but theses will require a long long bus ride.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 22, 2018, 1:20 AM
SLC is the primary entry and exit port for the Yellowstone tour.

The other options are LAS, LAX, and to much a lesser degree, SFO, DEN, SEA, YVR, and YYC, but theses will require a long long bus ride.

Yes and like most tourist destinations these would be incorporated into other tours and destinations. I suppose some would travel half way around the world just to see Yellowstone. Probably a reason why DL dropped SLC-NRT.

One can also easily connect to Jackson or West Yellowstone from SFO or SEA.

nname
Jul 22, 2018, 1:44 AM
Yes and like most tourist destinations these would be incorporated into other tours and destinations. I suppose some would travel half way around the world just to see Yellowstone. Probably a reason why DL dropped SLC-NRT.

One can also easily connect to Jackson or West Yellowstone from SFO or SEA.

Except, none of those tour starts in those smaller airport. It's just not cost effective to have a base there. The nearest major city is SLC.

You know those Chinese or Korean tour package... trying to cram as many destinations into as few days and as cheap as possible. Connection? That's just a waste of time. SLC is just too hard to get to if you're a Star Alliance frequent flyer, and if you want to do Canadian Rockies and Yellowstone in a single trip, there's no better choice than a 4-days bus ride through pretty much nothing... :rolleyes:

Maybe DL should've run SLC-ICN and SLC-PEK instead :cool:

Johnny Aussie
Jul 22, 2018, 3:02 AM
Except, none of those tour starts in those smaller airport. It's just not cost effective to have a base there. The nearest major city is SLC.

You know those Chinese or Korean tour package... trying to cram as many destinations into as few days and as cheap as possible. Connection? That's just a waste of time. SLC is just too hard to get to if you're a Star Alliance frequent flyer, and if you want to do Canadian Rockies and Yellowstone in a single trip, there's no better choice than a 4-days bus ride through pretty much nothing... :rolleyes:

Maybe DL should've run SLC-ICN and SLC-PEK instead :cool:

Without beating this to death... again, probably why there aren’t any direct flights from SLC to anywhere in Asia.. not even seasonal.

We will have to agree to disagree... I don’t see a viable market for AC to add YVR-SLC, you do and that’s cool.

nname
Jul 22, 2018, 3:21 AM
Without beating this to death... again, probably why there aren’t any direct flights from SLC to anywhere in Asia.. not even seasonal.

We will have to agree to disagree... I don’t see a viable market for AC to add YVR-SLC, you do and that’s cool.

I guess we all agree on AC not going to start it in the near future. Just that I feel it's on AC's list, but it's nowhere near the top, and there's a chance of AC would start it after some of the existing CR9 routes such as SAN, SJC, ORD, PHX got converted to mainline A220... and you feel there are better place to put those CR9 on :rolleyes:

mezzanine
Jul 22, 2018, 4:10 AM
DEN is a much larger city and a much larger O&D Market from YVR and both are Star Alliance hubs.

Do you know how large the SLC - Asia market is?

DL would easily feed the SLC traffic through its SEA hub (both DL hubs). DL is using SEA as its trans pac hub plus DL has plenty of Asian flights from its other hubs in LAX, MSP, DTW and ATL. DL’s hub at SLC is primarily a domestic transfer hub with very limited Canadian flights.

Also YYZ-SLC also a larger O&D Market

In any event I disagree. I don’t think YVR-SLC would be on AC’s to do list for the many reasons stated above.


That's the funny thing about route development - there is a lot at play to make a route sustainable.

YVR-ANC is a third less of the O+D of SLC according to the statscan 2016 report with no further AC connections at ANC AFAIK, but AC has a nonstop route, year round IIRC.

nname
Jul 22, 2018, 4:15 AM
That's the funny thing about route development - there is a lot at play to make a route sustainable.

YVR-ANC is a third less of the O+D of SLC according to the statscan 2016 report with no further AC connections at ANC AFAIK, but AC has a nonstop route, year round IIRC.

Summer seasonal. That route is great for those 1-way Alaska cruise ;)

LF for the route:

17/05 71.6%
17/06 85.0%
17/07 87.6%
17/08 88.5%
17/09 80.4%

mezzanine
Jul 22, 2018, 4:37 AM
Summer seasonal. That route is great for those 1-way Alaska cruise ;)


[facepalm]

regardless, IMO AC SLC/YVR has more viability, but time will tell..

Johnny Aussie
Jul 22, 2018, 4:57 AM
Summer seasonal. That route is great for those 1-way Alaska cruise ;)

LF for the route:

17/05 71.6%
17/06 85.0%
17/07 87.6%
17/08 88.5%
17/09 80.4%

That’s a great example of route catering to a very specific market - the one way cruise market. These flights would be EMPTY without the one-way Alaska cruises. Good to see the high LFs too.
Even without DL on SLC-YVR I doubt it’s on AC’s radar. AC would also be competing against a strong DL frequent flyer base. And the fact that DL reduces both YVR and YYC to only once daily CR9/E75 over winter is another indication of its very limited year round viability. Load factors would most likely be well under 50% if AC attempted the route.

thenoflyzone
Jul 22, 2018, 2:16 PM
Miami is just a shade under 100k O&D, its the largest unserved transborder route if I recall correctly, and much higher yielding than Orlando.

Not really. You're counting FLL/MIA as one route. The two might be linked, but each airport serves a different purpose.

FLL O&D was 47,000, MIA 41,000. These are 2016 numbers. So FLL, a lower yielding market, has more pull than MIA.

The distance involved and the fact that most people want to go to FLL, explains why you don't have YVR-MIA non stop.

MCO-YVR is almost double the O&D of MIA-YVR.

trofirhen
Jul 23, 2018, 12:54 AM
.....................................
FLL O&D was 47,000, MIA 41,000. These are 2016 numbers. So FLL, a lower yielding market, has more pull than MIA.

The distance involved and the fact that most people want to go to FLL, explains why you don't have YVR-MIA non stop.

MCO-YVR is almost double the O&D of MIA-YVR.
But wouldn't that warrant a year-round, and not seasonal service? Or is the yield still not enough?

thenoflyzone
Jul 25, 2018, 7:23 PM
But wouldn't that warrant a year-round, and not seasonal service? Or is the yield still not enough?

Annual O&D numbers don't mention anything about the seasonality of a market. Just because the O&D is high doesn't mean year round non stop service can be maintained. A lot of variables at play.

LeftCoaster
Jul 25, 2018, 8:55 PM
Not really. You're counting FLL/MIA as one route. The two might be linked, but each airport serves a different purpose.

FLL O&D was 47,000, MIA 41,000. These are 2016 numbers. So FLL, a lower yielding market, has more pull than MIA.

The distance involved and the fact that most people want to go to FLL, explains why you don't have YVR-MIA non stop.

MCO-YVR is almost double the O&D of MIA-YVR.

Sure MCO is nearly double, but much lower yielding.

YVR-MIA on its own should be enough to launch on AA, given their vast Caribbean and Latin american hub there. Add in some low yielding FLL pax, which is a whopping 35 minute drive from MIA, to fill the back and the route should be flying today.

As far as being one of the 14 I can't imagine it isn't one of the most likely.

As for the rest of the transborder I really do think AUS and PHL are just a matter of time. AUS mainly on the back of how important it is becoming in the US tech and tourism scene, and PHL because of what AA is trying to build there.

nname
Jul 26, 2018, 5:18 AM
Not sure if this was posted before... Aeromexico is increasing YVR-MEX to up to 19x weekly during the peak winter weeks.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 26, 2018, 10:15 PM
Not sure if this was posted before... Aeromexico is increasing YVR-MEX to up to 19x weekly during the peak winter weeks.

Be curious how much is O&D YVR-MEX and how much is onward connections.

Must be doing well. Plenty of competition on that route now.

Hourglass
Jul 27, 2018, 5:33 AM
Be curious how much is O&D YVR-MEX and how much is onward connections.

Must be doing well. Plenty of competition on that route now.

According to Routes Online (https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/breaking-news/274652/route-rundown-dub-hkg-mex-yvr-sin-hrb/), O&D is ~100K.

Seems to be quite a high % of connecting traffic. The AC flight is 60% point-to-point with the remainder connecting to Asia and the rest of Canada.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 29, 2018, 7:30 AM
Viva Aerobus will operate one of the two weekly flights to PVR on behalf of Sunwing this winter.

So not a big deal but a new airline to look out for every Saturday evening (arrives 2125) and departing on Sunday mornings (0900) on A320s.

trofirhen
Jul 29, 2018, 3:23 PM
Viva Aerobus will operate one of the two weekly flights to PVR on behalf of Sunwing this winter.

So not a big deal but a new airline to look out for every Saturday evening (arrives 2125) and departing on Sunday mornings (0900) on A320s.

Viva Aerobus, is, I believed, based in Monterrey. Wouldn't it be great to get regulat YVR-MTY (it's a banking centre) with them, and Volaris to GDL !? Nothing like beefing up Mexico
For the moment, anyway.;)

Hourglass
Jul 29, 2018, 3:31 PM
UAE and Canada amend air service agreement:

https://www.businessamlive.com/canada-expands-air-transport-agreements-with-united-arab-emirates-egypt/

Don’t think this will result in EK flying to YVR. I’m guessing they would use the increased frequency to first beef up their YYZ service.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 29, 2018, 3:52 PM
UAE and Canada amend air service agreement:

https://www.businessamlive.com/canada-expands-air-transport-agreements-with-united-arab-emirates-egypt/

Don’t think this will result in EK flying to YVR. I’m guessing they would use the increased frequency to first beef up their YYZ service.

You are correct. EK won’t be flying to YVR anytime soon.

..........

UPDATE

Cue the whimpers, whiners and whingers....

That sure didn't take long...

Etihad increasing YYZ to 5 weekly

https://www.etihad.com/en-ae/about-us/etihad-news/archive/2018/etihad-airways-to-increase-frequency-to-canada/

Emirates increasing YYZ to 5 weekly

https://www.emirates.com/media-centre/emirates-to-fly-to-toronto-five-times-a-week-starting-august-18

thenoflyzone
Jul 30, 2018, 2:10 PM
^

Like I said, 14 new destinations in 2 years is a tad optimistic, especially with AC starting to trim down capacity to offset fuel prices.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/air-canada-fares-capacity-earnings-1.4764325

Other Air Canada executives told analysts in a conference call Friday that the company was analyzing the potential for cutting some of its seating capacity in the fourth quarter as another response to the higher fuel prices.

Still no Turkey bilateral update. Wonder what's taking so long. That's YVR's best bet for new long haul service.

teriyaki
Jul 30, 2018, 6:29 PM
Emirates and Etihad increasing their schedule to 5x each makes the most sense. As much as I'd like to see another carrier added to YVR. Even if they added YVR. That'd be a twice weekly frequency, hardly a useful route and destined to be an expensive experiment for minimal benefit to the travelling public.

nname
Jul 30, 2018, 7:10 PM
^

Like I said, 14 new destinations in 2 years is a tad optimistic, especially with AC starting to trim down capacity to offset fuel prices.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/air-canada-fares-capacity-earnings-1.4764325

I think they already did for Q4... at least some of the planned frequency are reduced:

- Frequency reduction - YYZ-RSW/MIA
- Planned frequency increase cancelled - YVR-SJC, YYZ-MSY
- Planned frequency increase scaled back - YVR-SAN/DEN, YUL-MIA

Also, YVR-DEL reduced to 5x weekly for 2 weeks Nov-Dec

YVR-TPE remained 5x weekly through the entire winter (was 6x weekly Dec-Feb last year)

trofirhen
Jul 30, 2018, 8:02 PM
.............(pls excuse edit)

Still no Turkey bilateral update. Wonder what's taking so long. That's YVR's best bet for new long haul service.

That's the one that has me wondering and worrying. IST would be much better than an ME3 airport, and yet Ottawa drags it heels on it. Why? Seattle will get it if YVR does not.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 30, 2018, 8:10 PM
I think they already did for Q4... at least some of the planned frequency are reduced:

- Frequency reduction - YYZ-RSW/MIA
- Planned frequency increase cancelled - YVR-SJC, YYZ-MSY
- Planned frequency increase scaled back - YVR-SAN/DEN, YUL-MIA

Also, YVR-DEL reduced to 5x weekly for 2 weeks Nov-Dec

YVR-TPE remained 5x weekly through the entire winter (was 6x weekly Dec-Feb last year)

Those reductions posted on Airliners.net were filing errors. There have been no changes to those transborder routes. DEL is 6 weekly for the entire winter.

craneSpotter
Jul 30, 2018, 8:35 PM
Viva Aerobus will operate one of the two weekly flights to PVR on behalf of Sunwing this winter.

So not a big deal but a new airline to look out for every Saturday evening (arrives 2125) and departing on Sunday mornings (0900) on A320s.

I noticed Viva Aerobus was added to the airlines that serve YYJ recently ... and I was somewhat curious .. it makes sense now.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 30, 2018, 9:55 PM
YVR will have a record number of flights to Latin America this upcoming winter...

For all intents and purposes this includes Mexico, Central America and the Caribbean:

WestJet 29
Air Canada 21
Sunwing 16
Aeromexico 15 (up to 19 for a couple of weeks)
Air Transat 13
Interjet 8

102 per week.

Throw in all the additional transborder sun destination flights (but yeah we did lose a couple of weekly flights to MCO) this winter and it’s going to be a very busy one.

For transborder I see HNL, OGG, KOA, LIH, SAN, PHX, LAS, SNA, PSP and MCO as sun destinations... LAX is a bit of a mix because it’s more than just a sun destination.

nname
Jul 30, 2018, 10:34 PM
Those reductions posted on Airliners.net were filing errors. There have been no changes to those transborder routes. DEL is 6 weekly for the entire winter.

Well I don't trust that post, as the frequency he listed for AC is about half as what it should be. :D

But still, for instance YVR-DEN is now only 1x daily for part of Nov and Dec, and I remember it was 2x daily before?


YVR will have a record number of flights to Latin America this upcoming winter...

For all intents and purposes this includes Mexico, Central America and the Caribbean:

WestJet 29
Air Canada 21
Sunwing 16
Aeromexico 15 (up to 19 for a couple of weeks)
Air Transat 13
Interjet 8

102 per week..

Maybe Interjet will also add additional frequency like what they did last winter and this summer. I remember last winter they ran 5x weekly to MEX? And this summer is currently daily.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 30, 2018, 11:02 PM
Well I don't trust that post, as the frequency he listed for AC is about half as what it should be. :D

But still, for instance YVR-DEN is now only 1x daily for part of Nov and Dec, and I remember it was 2x daily before?




Maybe Interjet will also add additional frequency like what they did last winter and this summer. I remember last winter they ran 5x weekly to MEX? And this summer is currently daily.

Pretty sure SJC, SAN and DEN were reduced late OCT to mid DEC as per normal.
YVR is still very seasonal and October/November the worst. Pretty much mirrors last winter but the increases are higher once mid December kicks in.
I’m not familiar enough with Interjet’s scheduling pattern to know when/if they increase each season.

Vanzunator
Jul 31, 2018, 5:06 AM
Since there has been some discussions around remote stand operations at YVR, I wanted to share a couple of picture of JAL 787 at one of the remote stands (one of the west de-ice pads - W5). Note the covered stairways, the bus in the picture is not a passenger bus, it is for the cabin crew.
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Al22AxnnXu9qntASsblfDMPhhnnIsg


https://pdzigg.dm.files.1drv.com/y4ppKx7i0zlPARnUDes8pohF6bjB1bC5qWTGSPiWXEMcmiRLl_o8Lwqt4l375Z_lVFTZgIvRoqDetsryhcuwO0JkuxhX0Ep5yzaBbiNG9EfZZsz6H5ULlRz_cZaZTZC4ZveE7eQArnQEn8qkUY92-5LpGiGjAYf_qDb8UAJGZf3GJCMzrsrd0IN4PNKxLt5RgZyNNAR_osHfESMm4V72_P7wA/20180717_201734229_iOS%20%282%29.jpg?psid=1

https://xmkh3w.dm.files.1drv.com/y4pbq0jmixlQEm7QXM4TX49vKcrZW7x_8Qx3Z0MUXVqiRwULKKQVqdy7YmLPjZmpCU1SDrzfadb3O7k79ys9OfYPyS9mra6G_2ml_sMqOq9w-jhpueKCBBoIISQmqvbNWT-oeArF1N30fLxprvuroYa6h4qUo8tQG6CvEe3sXganx-DbQXJv18PLf4a8EYuR-WUaPD1CF3cFFxwXhNvPTNuVA/20180717_201736931_iOS%20%282%29.jpg?psid=1

Gordon
Jul 31, 2018, 4:16 PM
Are the east Remote stands in use?
When the east stands are complete is it likely that some of the Red eye Asian flights will wove to day time departures?

CareerShow
Aug 1, 2018, 4:29 PM
Anyone have the stats for air Canada’s flights this year to Europe?

vanlaw
Aug 1, 2018, 6:43 PM
Anyone have the stats for air Canada’s flights this year to Europe?

Although only anecdotal ...a family member was on AC806 to CDG this past weekend. Said the flight was not even close to full. Full rows free in economy, with most of premium economy empty. Will be interesting to see the load factors for these flights are this summer.

nname
Aug 1, 2018, 6:46 PM
Although only anecdotal ...a family member was on AC806 to CDG this past weekend. Said the flight was not even close to full. Full rows free in economy, with most of premium economy empty. Will be interesting to see the load factors for these flights are this summer.

The stat said otherwise though.


June 2018

Domestic: 1,114,557 (+8.4%)
International: 1,258,544 (+12.0%)
- Transborder: 591,100 (+8.3%)
- Asia Pacific: 398,936 (+14.0%)
- Europe: 220,921 (+13.1%)
- Misc: 47,587 (+44.5%)
Total: 2,373,101 (+10.3%)


http://www.yvr.ca/en/about-yvr/facts-and-stats

Johnny Aussie
Aug 1, 2018, 7:53 PM
The stat said otherwise though.


June 2018

Domestic: 1,114,557 (+8.4%)
International: 1,258,544 (+12.0%)
- Transborder: 591,100 (+8.3%)
- Asia Pacific: 398,936 (+14.0%)
- Europe: 220,921 (+13.1%)
- Misc: 47,587 (+44.5%)
Total: 2,373,101 (+10.3%)


http://www.yvr.ca/en/about-yvr/facts-and-stats

What’s even more impressive?
That’s 220,000 more passengers than June 2017.
YTD already up over 1,000,000 passengers. Of that increase over 635,000 is international pax.
YTD up 9.1%

LeftCoaster
Aug 1, 2018, 9:20 PM
^

Like I said, 14 new destinations in 2 years is a tad optimistic, especially with AC starting to trim down capacity to offset fuel prices.

So a bit of a long shot was given less rights than some expected, hardly warants a 'like I said'... Replace Dubai with any number of viable places. I didn't even tap the Caribbean or Mexico. Monterrey or Guadalajara are very viable, and Sunwing's new MAXs are opening up new routes in the Caribbean. Hard to say a 1xPW to Varadero or Cayo Coco is not within the realm of possibility. Hardly glamorous, but not every route is going to be a long haul world city.

Still no Turkey bilateral update. Wonder what's taking so long. That's YVR's best bet for new long haul service.


I dont think IST is YVRs best bet for new Long Haul, I think it is most certainly still from Asia, Singapore, Asiana or the like. With limited new frequencies this year Asia Pac is still up 14%, there is a lot of demand.

TK has the rights to send 3xPW and they still wont, so something's up.

What’s even more impressive?
That’s 220,000 more passengers than June 2017.
YTD already up over 1,000,000 passengers. Of that increase over 635,000 is international pax.
YTD up 9.1%

Great numbers! I was hoping for double digits and I got it (though barely). I expect the rest of summer to hover around this high growth level then dip back down once some of the new seasonals stop for the year.

nname
Aug 1, 2018, 9:44 PM
I dont think IST is YVRs best bet for new Long Haul, I think it is most certainly still from Asia, Singapore, Asiana or the like. With limited new frequencies this year Asia Pac is still up 14%, there is a lot of demand.

TK has the rights to send 3xPW and they still wont, so something's up.

They haven't sign the bilateral yet. I remember reading somewhere that they are also asking for YYZ-MEX?

Hourglass
Aug 2, 2018, 3:00 AM
Great numbers! I was hoping for double digits and I got it (though barely). I expect the rest of summer to hover around this high growth level then dip back down once some of the new seasonals stop for the year.

That's amazing growth. Anyone think 26 million passengers this year is do-able? Have to wonder how existing facilities are coping during peak periods, though. Expansion can't come soon enough...

They haven't sign the bilateral yet. I remember reading somewhere that they are also asking for YYZ-MEX?

I read somewhere on airliners.net that TK was also holding out for more frequencies. 3x/week seems a bit ... paltry.

trofirhen
Aug 2, 2018, 3:09 AM
...................


I dont think IST is YVRs best bet for new Long Haul, I think it is most certainly still from Asia, Singapore, Asiana or the like. With limited new frequencies this year Asia Pac is still up 14%, there is a lot of demand.

TK has the rights to send 3xPW and they still wont, so something's up.


IST is great for not only Turkey of course, but the Eastern Mediterranean, The Middle East, Central Asia.....
I heard that TK is trying to get 5x / week int YVR (which of course they'll never get) and are banging their heads on the wall trying for something they can't have. Still TK 3x / week is ok.

CareerShow
Aug 2, 2018, 6:01 AM
Is there a place one can find the PAX load factor stats for routes (as we have seen forum members post before on here)? I am curious what the statistics are for a few of AC's routes, and would like to research a touch more in depth.

zahav
Aug 2, 2018, 6:45 AM
YVR's growth of 10.3% for June is amazing, and the top of the airports reporting June (although YUL and YYC had very impressive months too of 10.2% and 9%, respectively). Don't remember a time where those 3 airports all reported such strong results at the same time.

YTD, YVR has the highest % growth in domestic (+7.2%), international non-transborder (+14.3%), total international including transborder (+10.8%), and total overall growth (+9.1%)

thenoflyzone
Aug 2, 2018, 2:19 PM
So a bit of a long shot was given less rights than some expected, hardly warants a 'like I said'... Replace Dubai with any number of viable places. I didn't even tap the Caribbean or Mexico. Monterrey or Guadalajara are very viable, and Sunwing's new MAXs are opening up new routes in the Caribbean. Hard to say a 1xPW to Varadero or Cayo Coco is not within the realm of possibility. Hardly glamorous, but not every route is going to be a long haul world city.

Sunwing already serves Varadero from Vancouver.

And Monterrey and Guadalajara are a stretch. ;) Regardless, you still wont get to 14 new destinations in 2020. And I'm not saying that because its YVR. If ADM came out and said they aim to get 14 new destinations in 2 years, I would be typing the same thing over on the Canadian airports thread.

And btw, Liberia isn't listed in their 2018 airline and destinations list (PDF file).

YVR's growth of 10.3% for June is amazing, and the top of the airports reporting June (although YUL and YYC had very impressive months too of 10.2% and 9%, respectively). Don't remember a time where those 3 airports all reported such strong results at the same time.

YTD, YVR has the highest % growth in domestic (+7.2%), international non-transborder (+14.3%), total international including transborder (+10.8%), and total overall growth (+9.1%)

Indeed, very good growth. June, July and August rarely disappoint.

LeftCoaster
Aug 2, 2018, 7:51 PM
And Monterrey and Guadalajara are a stretch. ;) Regardless, you still wont get to 14 new destinations in 2020. And I'm not saying that because its YVR. If ADM came out and said they aim to get 14 new destinations in 2 years, I would be typing the same thing over on the Canadian airports thread.

Sure you wouldn't... :rolleyes:

You may be right on 14 exactly, but I would assume a specific number like that wasn't plucked from thin air and they they expect to get to, or damn close to, that figure.

And btw, Liberia isn't listed in their 2018 airline and destinations list (PDF file).

You're right it isn't but their destinations list only adds up to 125, not 127, so Craig Richmond has already added it to his destination total in the article.

thenoflyzone
Aug 2, 2018, 11:04 PM
Lefty, you feeling ok?

That's twice you said I'm right in the same post.;)

LeftCoaster
Aug 3, 2018, 12:32 AM
One and a half, I only said you may be right on the first one. :cheers:

Johnny Aussie
Aug 3, 2018, 2:40 AM
Top cargo airports for 2017 released by Stats Canada today.

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=2310025401

Measured in tonnes and increase / decrease compared to 2016

YYZ 443,153 up 15.7% up 60,149
YVR 280,845 up 12.5% up 31,270
YUL 100,437 up 11.4% up 10,275
YHM 97,949 down 10.8% down 11,920
YYC 85,907 up 15.3% up 11,378
YMX 77,412 up 7.1% up 5,154
YWG 61,550 down 26.9% down 22,691
YHZ 27,793 up 4.4% up 1,162
YEG 27,113 up 4.8% up 1,241

Of course YYZ still in a league of its own but YVR is the solid second busiest air cargo market in the country.

YVR had by far the highest growth since 2013 at 44%.
YYC, YWG, YHZ and YEG fairly stagnant between 2013 and 2017.
YHM has lost some clout but YWG had a huge loss between 2016 and 2017.

Cargo was up 12.9% in June at YVR and 11.4% YTD.

thenoflyzone
Aug 3, 2018, 2:35 PM
what's the deal with YHM and YWG?

Cargojet is probably the largest cargo operator at both airports, and yet they had strong results in 2017. Increase in revenues and profits. The cause must be something else.

Maybe the US runs took a hit, what with Trump screwing the pooch. But then YMX would have been affected as well. And yet it isn't.