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MalcolmTucker
Jun 29, 2010, 6:52 PM
You're right ... but there MUST be a way to change that. What could we do to get those f---heads in Ottawa to allow Total Open skies, as the article says we should? :hell:

I hope you understand the implications of what you ask for... might get cheaper flights, but definitely not more direct flights under that situation.

trofirhen
Jun 29, 2010, 10:39 PM
I hope you understand the implications of what you ask for... might get cheaper flights, but definitely not more direct flights under that situation.

I'll settle for $$$ cheaper ones. It'll compensate for the hassle of changing planes. :rolleyes:

jlousa
Jun 30, 2010, 2:23 AM
Don't know how Seattle-Paris is doing but the flights are a lot more expensive then Air-Transat. Heck I can fly Air France from YVR to Paris via SLC cheaper then I can out of Seattle.

trofirhen
Jun 30, 2010, 5:31 AM
Don't know how Seattle-Paris is doing but the flights are a lot more expensive then Air-Transat. Heck I can fly Air France from YVR to Paris via SLC cheaper then I can out of Seattle.

Well, they've been flying that route steadily since 2007, so something must be right. Also, perhaps having it year-round, daily, makes a difference. Their winter fares are probably lower, etc ...

Yume-sama
Jun 30, 2010, 6:39 AM
Kind of relates to YVR, I suppose! Tourism Vancouver has said tourism is up 19% from Europe, 9% from USA, and 6% from the rest of Canada so far this June. And they expect a lot more this Summer! Interestingly they didn't mention Asia. But this bodes well for more European action if we can lure more and more Europeans over thanks to the exposure from the Olympics.

whatnext
Jun 30, 2010, 6:45 AM
Kind of relates to YVR, I suppose! Tourism Vancouver has said tourism is up 19% from Europe, 9% from USA, and 6% from the rest of Canada so far this June. And they expect a lot more this Summer! Interestingly they didn't mention Asia. But this bodes well for more European action if we can lure more and more Europeans over thanks to the exposure from the Olympics.

A totally disingenous stat. They're comparing it to last year, which just happened to be the depths of that little thing called the Great Recession.

Yume-sama
Jun 30, 2010, 6:57 AM
Oh. I forgot. We aren't allowed good news when you're around. :P Ho-hum.

Conversely, Tourism Calgary says bookings are down 7% in total from last year. You know, the year of the recession.

SpongeG
Jun 30, 2010, 7:03 AM
its still up better than not - goes to show what was probably lost is coming back - better than not coming back

en2
Jun 30, 2010, 9:54 AM
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/4854447/

Japan Airlines has announced their routes out of Haneda Airport.

This is bad news for people who like to fly JAL from Vancouver to either Hong Kong or Singapore via Tokyo as all HKG and SIN flights out of Narita will be replaced with flights from Haneda airport. From my experience a lot of passengers on the flights to Tokyo transit onwards to Hong Kong.

Haneda airport is located about 1+ hour away from Narita airport by bus or train.

twoNeurons
Jun 30, 2010, 4:46 PM
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/4854447/

Japan Airlines has announced their routes out of Haneda Airport.

This is bad news for people who like to fly JAL from Vancouver to either Hong Kong or Singapore via Tokyo as all HKG and SIN flights out of Narita will be replaced with flights from Haneda airport. From my experience a lot of passengers on the flights to Tokyo transit onwards to Hong Kong.

Haneda airport is located about 1+ hour away from Narita airport by bus or train.

Yeah, it sucks to transfer to Haneda. I think it's longer than 1 hour away though, more like 90 minutes.

It will improve when one of two things happen.
[list]
The new Narita-Haneda Express is made ( planned ) reducing time to 59 minutes.
Vancouver gets a flight to Haneda ( Canada has two unused slots at Haneda, with Vancouver and/or Toronto (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_International_Airport#Future_international_development) as the requested routes

Haneda is finishing a major upgrade to itself this year, which will increase the number of flights it can handle by 50%.

Going forward, I think Haneda will become the place to be for flights to/through Japan to Asia.

Narita is Tokyo's Mirabel... they've just prolonged its demise by the creative use of trains and a policy forcing international flights to land there.

I think the move to Haneda for JAL is a positive one, personally. It's a much more convenient airport for Japanese and the more JAL can make its flights competitive, the better it will be able to compete. I wouldn't be surprised if JAL moves some of its "pseudo-Asian" hubs, like San Francisco, Vancouver and Toronto to Haneda as well. I'd welcome the change, personally... but maybe I'm hoping for to much.

As for flights to France, I would suspect that the reason there isn't a lot of traffic is because there's relatively little advertising for Paris, France. If Air France started flying here, you'd expect a large advertising campaign.

Many people feel that the only way they can get to Europe is through London, Amsterdam or Frankfurt. With the high Loonie and low Euro, I'm surprised we're seeing increased traffic from Europe... though I suspect that any increase due to the Olympics won't last long.

I'd be surprised if I didn't see an increase in Canadians vacationing abroad.

Yume-sama
Jun 30, 2010, 5:09 PM
It is amazingly easy to transfer to Haneda despite the distance. I am thinking perhaps they strategically chose flights with the lowest amount of transfers from other flights at Narita, however.

And it seems they have been trying to make China less "International". Chinese tourists are very important for the Japanese economy~

Even if everyone constantly gripes about their behavior and antics :P

Gordon
Jun 30, 2010, 5:26 PM
Speaking of JAL has their financial situaution inproved ?

The 787s that Air Canada has ordered do have the range to fly non-stop from YYZ to Guangzhou eastbound. It will be interesting to see what AC does, you would hope they would see the sadvantage of servicing one of the largest Asian populations as well.

WestJet has been negotiating some sort of deal with Delta which would likely give them access to their group 'Skyteam' which includes China Southern which could help them decide to start their YVR Guangzhou route.

Yume-sama
Jun 30, 2010, 5:33 PM
Unfortunately not. Just today they announced they're more broke than they thought. Topping 1 trillion JPY ($11 billion).

And will be laying off another 15,000 people~

MalcolmTucker
Jun 30, 2010, 5:35 PM
WestJet has been negotiating some sort of deal with Delta which would likely give them access to their group 'Skyteam' which includes China Southern which could help them decide to start their YVR Guangzhou route.

WestJet plays footsie with lots of foreign airlines and alliances, but where are the results? The only positive was picking up the tv system from a company bought out by JetBlue - otherwise haven't seen anything concrete.

Hourglass
Jun 30, 2010, 5:42 PM
It is amazingly easy to transfer to Haneda despite the distance. I am thinking perhaps they strategically chose flights with the lowest amount of transfers from other flights at Narita, however.

And it seems they have been trying to make China less "International". Chinese tourists are very important for the Japanese economy~

Even if everyone constantly gripes about their behavior and antics :P

Too true, unfortunately. In Hong Kong, the boutiques in Pacific Place used to treat Chinese tourists like they had the plague -- until they started buying up everything in the store!

Now, tourists from the Mainland get treated like royalty.... :worship: :worship: Money talks.

I had a very bad experience transferring from Narita to Haneda to catch a flight to Okinawa once. Misread my ticket and thought I was connecting from Narita! Of course my bus got stuck in bad traffic. Got to the gate just as they were closing the gate...

twoNeurons
Jun 30, 2010, 6:40 PM
Yeah, I don't know about it being easy to connect from Narita to Haneda.

It's a long slog by bus and you have to worry about traffic problems and most trains don't connect directly (http://naa.ivcreation.com/pc_us/). Actually, I'm not sure if any connect directly.

I usually plan to transfer through Narita or if I have to go through Haneda, take the bus for convenience. Transferring without luggage isn't bad, but if you have a lot of luggage, fitting onto a crowded train in Central Tokyo with luggage is not my idea of easy.

Ironically, on my last trip I transferred through Narita and I missed my connection. It was during that snowstorm that shut down Air Canada. We were one of the last flights out, but the flight was quite late.

We had the option of Shinkansen or a next day flight from Haneda... we took the train, even though it meant transferring trains in Tokyo station ( which is MASSIVE, by the way )

All that being said, it will change quite a bit once the new Keisei train comes online ( in a few weeks, if I'm not mistaken ) cutting the time from Narita to downtown to 36 minutes.

Yume-sama
Jun 30, 2010, 7:07 PM
:) There is a limited express from Narita - Haneda that takes 70 minutes.

Alternatively the best course of action is to take the train to Shinagawa, and transfer to Haneda.

Or you can take the bus, but allow 2 hours transfer time.

twoNeurons
Jun 30, 2010, 8:19 PM
:previous:

It just makes me thankful that we only have to deal with a 25 minute trip in Vancouver.

nova9
Jul 1, 2010, 4:00 AM
from www.miss604.com (http://www.miss604.com/2010/06/take-off-fridays-at-yvr.html):
Starting July 9th, 2010 YVR (Vancouver International Airport) will be hosting weekly entertainment and activities during Take Off Fridays.

Both international and domestic terminals will have face painting, live DJs, “Food on the Fly” offers, and free samples from YVR’s shops including Absolute Spa, A&W, Daniel Le Chocolat Belge, Starbucks, and more. You can also check out the Observation Area, with its videos and interactive displays, at any time.

All those who stop by can enter to win prizes featuring a behind the scenes tour of YVR and accommodation at the Fairmont Vancouver Airport.

This will take place every Friday this summer (July 9th until August 27th) from 8:00am until 4:00pm.

whatnext
Jul 1, 2010, 5:21 AM
:previous: Interesting. Who's it geared to? Maybe locals who have a transit pass or faresavers. Definitely not for someone who drives there - that parkade is the biggest rip-off in town.

Hourglass
Jul 1, 2010, 5:35 AM
Don't think this has been posted yet:

Vancouver airport firm buys into three U.K. facilities (http://www.vancouversun.com/entertainment/Vancouver+airport+firm+buys+into+three+facilities/3189448/story.html)

Good to see YVR Airport Services is back on the expansion path after the collapse of the Chicago Midway airport deal and losing the bid to manage London Gatwick. Liverpool might not be as big as Gatwick, but it's probably a more appropriate size for YVRAS to manage anyway.

deasine
Jul 1, 2010, 7:21 AM
:previous: Interesting. Who's it geared to? Maybe locals who have a transit pass or faresavers. Definitely not for someone who drives there - that parkade is the biggest rip-off in town.

Not necessarily. Drivers can go and park for free at Templeton Station, just before entering the Staff Parking Lot/Drop off areas, their's a little dirt road where people park and then explore Sea Island to take photos of planes touching down, or walking through the trails. From there on, your on the Airport Island, so you can ride the Canada Line for free.

trofirhen
Jul 1, 2010, 5:13 PM
Don't think this has been posted yet:

Vancouver airport firm buys into three U.K. facilities (http://www.vancouversun.com/entertainment/Vancouver+airport+firm+buys+into+three+facilities/3189448/story.html)

Good to see YVR Airport Services is back on the expansion path after the collapse of the Chicago Midway airport deal and losing the bid to manage London Gatwick. Liverpool might not be as big as Gatwick, but it's probably a more appropriate size for YVRAS to manage anyway.

Nice to know that YVR is expanding its interests and presence. It's a form of reassurance, given that we seem to be incrementally chipped away at to become a spoke, and never a major hub.

Hourglass
Jul 1, 2010, 5:23 PM
The Vancouver Airport Authority has a pretty strong reputation as an airport operator -- especially given its successful transformation when the government handed over operations of the airport to the local authority.

YVRAS manages a decent collection of small-medium sized airports around BC and the world. They've got some financial clout with Citigroup owning a major stake as well. And infrastructure plays can be very lucrative.

Given the economic situation in the UK, though, I think they've set themselves a challenge with this acquisition.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 4, 2010, 10:42 PM
Did anyone see YVR's May results?

Overall up 7.3%
Domestic up 3.9%
Transborder 9.1%
Asia Pacific 15.8%
Europe 3.5%
Misc 77.7% (assume this is Mexico/Caribbean?)

So, the question is, is there anything in particular to drive this growth - I couldn't think of anything - Olympics were well and truly over, or was May 2009 just particulary not a good month?

trofirhen
Jul 5, 2010, 12:05 AM
The Vancouver Airport Authority has a pretty strong reputation as an airport operator -- especially given its successful transformation when the government handed over operations of the airport to the local authority.

YVRAS manages a decent collection of small-medium sized airports around BC and the world. They've got some financial clout with Citigroup owning a major stake as well. And infrastructure plays can be very lucrative.

Given the economic situation in the UK, though, I think they've set themselves a challenge with this acquisition.
:previous:
Yes, that's true. But still .... imagine if they had been able to acquire LGW .....

Spork
Jul 5, 2010, 12:13 AM
Did anyone see YVR's May results?

Overall up 7.3%
Domestic up 3.9%
Transborder 9.1%
Asia Pacific 15.8%
Europe 3.5%
Misc 77.7% (assume this is Mexico/Caribbean?)

So, the question is, is there anything in particular to drive this growth - I couldn't think of anything - Olympics were well and truly over, or was May 2009 just particulary not a good month?

Economic recovery.

May 2006-1.41m
May 2007-1.44m
May 2008-1.54m
May 2009-1.32m
May 2010-1.42m

SpongeG
Jul 5, 2010, 12:20 AM
Did anyone see YVR's May results?

Overall up 7.3%
Domestic up 3.9%
Transborder 9.1%
Asia Pacific 15.8%
Europe 3.5%
Misc 77.7% (assume this is Mexico/Caribbean?)

So, the question is, is there anything in particular to drive this growth - I couldn't think of anything - Olympics were well and truly over, or was May 2009 just particulary not a good month?

Cruise ship season - more passengers fly in for that

in fact today there were 3 of them at the canada place terminal - one looked like a japanese cruise ship line

whatnext
Jul 5, 2010, 3:48 AM
Alaska Airlines is apparently closing down their members' lounge at YVR. Air Canada must have got to them somehow. :haha:

Hourglass
Jul 5, 2010, 5:36 AM
:previous:

There might be more truth to this than you realize.

Competition on West Coast routes is fierce -- particularly from Star Alliance carriers (of which Air Canada is one). I was surprised to note that Alaska is down to three routes out of Vancouver: Seattle, Portland and Los Angeles. So maintaining a lounge doesn't seem to make a lot of business sense.

At one point, I believe YVR was the third-largest focus city in Alaska's network.

whatnext
Jul 5, 2010, 5:47 AM
:previous: I wonder if Vancouverite Gregg Saretsky's departure (and eventual landing at Westjet) had anything to to do with their diminishing interest in Vancouver.

We have to realize Vancouver is in general a low-yield leisure market.

Gordon
Jul 5, 2010, 3:28 PM
LA has 11 or12 flights \day from yvr in the Summer & SFO has 7 including WestJet's seasonal service. The LA market is saturated.

I would expect westJet will move to daily service once they get more planes

We could also see Virgin America enter the market.

I think WJ should have Wi Fi on it's panes.

trofirhen
Jul 5, 2010, 3:48 PM
:previous: I wonder if Vancouverite Gregg Saretsky's departure (and eventual landing at Westjet) had anything to to do with their diminishing interest in Vancouver.

We have to realize Vancouver is in general a low-yield leisure market.

LA has 11 or12 flights \day from yvr in the Summer & SFO has 7 including WestJet's seasonal service. The LA market is saturated.

I would expect westJet will move to daily service once they get more planes

We could also see Virgin America enter the market.

I think WJ should have Wi Fi on it's panes.
:previous: :previous: :previous:
It's true that Vancouver is a low-yield leisure market, and that this will not change until there are more head offices here, more industry (clean industry) and a diversified economy. If / when Vancouver reaches such a state, I wonder what other markets would be attractive for the city.

trofirhen
Jul 5, 2010, 9:23 PM
... coming to the Vancouver Convention Centre in September. It will be interesting to see if anything for YVR develops out of this. That's what it's all about; routes and destinations.

whatnext
Jul 14, 2010, 5:37 AM
This is bound to give YVR some nightmares, Bellingham has been rated the cheapest American airport to fly out of to anywhere in the USA. Allegiant's coming service to Hawai'i is bound to take a big chunk of business away from YVR flights to the Islands.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB127880371924115595.html?mod=WSJ_LifeStyle_Travel

usog
Jul 14, 2010, 6:08 AM
This is bound to give YVR some nightmares, Bellingham has been rated the cheapest American airport to fly out of to anywhere in the USA. Allegiant's coming service to Hawai'i is bound to take a big chunk of business away from YVR flights to the Islands.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB127880371924115595.html?mod=WSJ_LifeStyle_Travel
Well honestly, there are more Canadians than Americans, from what I've heard,
on the Bellingham flights, so this isn't really anything new.

twoNeurons
Jul 14, 2010, 2:13 PM
My guess is that it affects Abbotsford's flights to US destinations quite a bit.

whatnext
Jul 14, 2010, 2:42 PM
Well honestly, there are more Canadians than Americans, from what I've heard,
on the Bellingham flights, so this isn't really anything new.

Not new, but BLI is really going after flights aggressively. They'll be closed for 3 weeks in Sept to expand the runway:
http://www.portofbellingham.com/library/files/airport/BLI_2010-_public_notification-Runway-Taxiway_Alpha.pdf

AlexYVR
Jul 14, 2010, 2:59 PM
Taking Allegiant is definitely an experience. . .basically akin to driving on a party bus to whatever destination you're headed. People are drunk before they hit the seats, the flights are always 'fun', and the flight attendants look like they have plenty of experiences choking bitches who get out of hand. Having said that, it's good times and so incredibly cheap, EVEN factoring in the Airporter trip and time. Way cheaper than YVR and the airporter drops you off at your front door if you live in Vancouver proper, not something YVR can claim. So worth it.

metroXpress
Jul 22, 2010, 11:41 PM
Well honestly, there are more Canadians than Americans, from what I've heard,
on the Bellingham flights, so this isn't really anything new.

I've heard from many friends that they go to Bellingham for US destinations

sacrifice333
Jul 22, 2010, 11:52 PM
If it's an early-booked Allegiant flight, a Bellingham trip can be worth while.

If you're not booking well in advance it seems that it's best to either stick with YVR or head farther south to SEA.

If flying Allegiant you do have to know the game though. When booking they will auto-option you out the ying-yang to the point that your flight is way more than the one you were comparing to our of YVR. Be aware, click with care!

When considering a trip on Allegiant you also need to be well aware of their baggage policies and fees. I.e. all checked baggage is paid, including golf clubs, etc. Carry-on baggage measurements are quite small and can be viciously monitored. For Allegiant I'd recommend a stuff-able duffel bag without wheels if you want to try to carry-on, lest you be sorely disappointed. (Note if they measure... challenge them and stuff it entirely into their measuring device!)

NOTE: Rumour has it that Allegiant will start service to Hawaii from Stockton and BELLINGHAM later this fall with new (to them) 757s!

SpongeG
Jul 23, 2010, 5:32 AM
they talked about that on TV the other day - or was it the radio... - that claire chick was talking about how bellingham is adding hawaii flights in the fall and expect to get some great deals - bellingham is shutting down in september to extend its runway... so allegiant had a big seat sale a couple months ago for the summer i guess to make up for the week or two they can't fly

i'd recommend priority boarding - you are guaranteed a spot at your seat for your carry on - the people who got on last had to seat miles away from where they had to put their stuff

trofirhen
Jul 24, 2010, 12:36 PM
Bellingham is ramping up for inexpensive flights to Hawaii ..... Seattle is ramping up for more flights to Asia and Europe ..... Toronto is making sure it becomes THE only real hub in Canada ..... Calgary, booming with oil revenue, is drawing more airlines .....

Is the sun setting ever so slowly on YVR? Pray not ............

Johnny Aussie
Jul 25, 2010, 1:53 AM
Bellingham is ramping up for inexpensive flights to Hawaii ..... Seattle is ramping up for more flights to Asia and Europe ..... Toronto is making sure it becomes THE only real hub in Canada ..... Calgary, booming with oil revenue, is drawing more airlines .....

Is the sun setting ever so slowly on YVR? Pray not ............

Bellingham - Back in the 80s both US Airways and Alaska Airlines used to fly mainline jets about 6x daily. Allegiant is an interesting player, but the BLI thing is nothing new. Note YVR transborder traffic actually increased over 9% in May.
Seattle - always has surprised me they haven't had more international flights. I think SEA has finally caught up. Not so sure about "ramping" up though. I would say they have "ramped" up.
Toronto - AC will aways protect their mega-hub of course and the feds, well despite what anyone says, yes, they will always favour the Toronto fortress.
Calgary - that is always the perception...but maybe this statement would have been true a few years ago, but definitely not booming right now. example - employment has actually shrunk here by 0.5% since last year. And not noticing any more airlines (LH is actually reducing service this winter). "Drawing more airlines?" what are you referring to?

trofirhen
Jul 25, 2010, 1:22 PM
Bellingham - Back in the 80s both US Airways and Alaska Airlines used to fly mainline jets about 6x daily. Allegiant is an interesting player, but the BLI thing is nothing new. Note YVR transborder traffic actually increased over 9% in May.
Seattle - always has surprised me they haven't had more international flights. I think SEA has finally caught up. Not so sure about "ramping" up though. I would say they have "ramped" up.
Toronto - AC will aways protect their mega-hub of course and the feds, well despite what anyone says, yes, they will always favour the Toronto fortress.
Calgary - that is always the perception...but maybe this statement would have been true a few years ago, but definitely not booming right now. example - employment has actually shrunk here by 0.5% since last year. And not noticing any more airlines (LH is actually reducing service this winter). "Drawing more airlines?" what are you referring to?

:previous: Being out of the country for over a decade, I guess I got my facts wrong. Excuse me. That Calgary is "drawing more airlines" came from an announcement I read that JAL is going to fly into there. (Not that it would hurt YVR much.) What rankles me is the feds allowing airlines into Toronto that they WON'T allow into Vancouver, forcing a change-of-plane in Toronto, when it sometimes shouldn't be necessary.

Gordon
Jul 25, 2010, 2:37 PM
JAL is an interesting they are in horrible financial trouble. i'm sort of surprised that they would be expanding seeing as they have 2 daily flights out of YVR.

What we need is is a balanced air policy in this country. One super hub may work in a European country that doesn't have the geographical footprint that Canada does.

Is the Federal government interfering with YVR's ability to get the China Southern Guangzhou & the Kingfisher Mumbai services going?

trofirhen
Jul 25, 2010, 4:43 PM
What we need is is a balanced air policy in this country. One super hub may work in a European country that doesn't have the geographical footprint that Canada does.

Is the Federal government interfering with YVR's ability to get the China Southern Guangzhou & the Kingfisher Mumbai services going?

You betcha! (If in doubt, ask Don Baird) :hell:

whatnext
Jul 25, 2010, 5:53 PM
:previous: Being out of the country for over a decade, I guess I got my facts wrong. Excuse me. That Calgary is "drawing more airlines" came from an announcement I read that JAL is going to fly into there. (Not that it would hurt YVR much.) What rankles me is the feds allowing airlines into Toronto that they WON'T allow into Vancouver, forcing a change-of-plane in Toronto, when it sometimes shouldn't be necessary.

I don't believe JAL's in a position to start flying to YYC. Perhaps you're thinking of the the Flight Air Canada added from YYC to NRT?

Of course if YVR is worried about their competitiveness, they could abolish their Airport Improvement Fee. :haha: :haha:like that will ever happen.

Hourglass
Jul 25, 2010, 6:02 PM
JAL is an interesting they are in horrible financial trouble. i'm sort of surprised that they would be expanding seeing as they have 2 daily flights out of YVR

JAL only flies daily out of Vancouver to Narita now (http://www.jal.co.jp/inter/time/pdf/america0328_0831.pdf.

Trofirhen, I don't believe there are any plans by JAL to start Calgary. As Gordon points out, they're in bankruptcy protection right now and axing routes. I think ANA used to -- or maybe still does -- run 1x weekly charter flights to Calgary during the summer, and Air Canada has launched Narita flights. Maybe you're thinking Korean Airlines? They've started Calgary during the summer months 3x/weekly to Seoul.

The number of flights between Japan and YVR have really shriveled up in recent years, I guess partly due to the stagnant Japanese economy. Not so long ago the summer peak season would see something like 25 flights per week between Vancouver and Tokyo Narita, Osaka and Nagoya. Now only Narita is left.

Yume-sama
Jul 25, 2010, 6:33 PM
JAL flies to Vancouver 2x daily 3x per week. They initially axed their MEX - YVR - NRT run... then a couple of weeks later re-instated it.

I don't believe they have any plans to fly to YYC. AC, however, is looking at making it daily year round, and not seasonal.

The Japanese economy is still in recession, for the 19th straight month, and shows no signs of rebounding.

The Japanese Yen, however, is still oddly high to the Canadian Dollar, compared to 2 years ago or so.

Speaking of NRT, when did AC start using the 777-300 for YVR - NRT?

Hourglass
Jul 25, 2010, 8:18 PM
Yume, yeah, I don't understand the strong currency either.

Whatnext, if YVR completely eliminated the AIF, fees somewhere else would have to go up (likely landing fees) due to the ground rent the airport authority pays every year to the federal government, which was over $65 million last year. It's a no-win as far as 'competitiveness' goes.

The AIF and federal ground rent payments to me are symbolic of a greater structural problem with Canadian transportation. The Air Canada CEO alluded to this in his presentation at the Annual General Meeting in May. Combine that with higher gax taxes than in the US, security charges (all of which of course is reinvested by the feds into security infrastructure, naturally... ;) )... well you get the picture. Someone on Airliners.net broke down the cost of a ticket on YYZ-YUL roundtrip ticket on AC a couple of years ago as follows:

YYZ-YUL sector (Q Class): CAD$109.00
YUL-YYZ sector (Q Class): CAD$179.00
Total Fare: CAD$288.00

Navcan and Surcharges: CAD$58.00
Canada Airport Improvement Fee: CAD$27.00
Canada Security Charge: CAD$13.08
Canada-Quebec Sales Tax: CAD$1.20
Canada Goods and Service Tax: CAD$27.03
Total Charges: CAD$126.31

Total Fare: CAD$414.31


Is it any wonder people go south to Seattle or Bellingham?

trofirhen
Jul 26, 2010, 12:54 AM
Although not in sync with the previous posts, what about kicking up a hurricane to the the freaking feds allow other airlines to Vancouver?

Don't like Emirates? Fine. OK. How about Qatar Airways? Major Gulf destination.

And what about service direct to India? Air India? Kingfisher? Jet Airways?

They ALL serve Toronto. What are we supposed to do for the rest of our lives? Fly to YYZ, and connect? That's what it seems. And few people on this forum seem to blink.

trofirhen
Jul 26, 2010, 12:59 AM
JAL is an interesting they are in horrible financial trouble. i'm sort of surprised that they would be expanding seeing as they have 2 daily flights out of YVR.

What we need is is a balanced air policy in this country. One super hub may work in a European country that doesn't have the geographical footprint that Canada does.

Is the Federal government interfering with YVR's ability to get the China Southern Guangzhou & the Kingfisher Mumbai services going?

Good luck on that one! I'm behind you 100%, but you have to remember that in the Feds' eyes, Ontario IS Canada, and that's the way they like it!!
It's enough to make you chuck. :yuck:

nova9
Jul 26, 2010, 5:16 AM
Good luck on that one! I'm behind you 100%, but you have to remember that in the Feds' eyes, Ontario IS Canada, and that's the way they like it!!
It's enough to make you chuck. :yuck:

apparently, having a PM from the West is not enough eh?

Yume-sama
Jul 26, 2010, 5:48 AM
Yuck. Not one who panders SO MUCH to the extreme, to pretend that he is a Leafs fan.

trofirhen
Jul 26, 2010, 6:08 AM
apparently, having a PM from the West is not enough eh?

I don't care where the PM is from. Ontario is STILL Canada in their view.:hell:

Yume-sama
Jul 30, 2010, 1:07 AM
Apparently Mexicana Airlines had three airplanes seized at Toronto, Calgary, and Vancouver. They were sub-leased by AC... who took them back forcefully :P

Well, now at least JAL may HAVE to fly NRT - YVR - MEX lol

Looks like Mexicana is about to collapse imminently...

trofirhen
Jul 30, 2010, 5:21 PM
Knowing now that the Transport Minister John Baird has nixed direct Emirates flights from Vancouver, as well as direct flights from Vancouver to India (... this is CANADA ... so change planes in Toronto...)
.... while looking at the Wikipedia site for Sea-Tac Airport, it seems that EMIRATES is planning, in the near future, direct Sea-Tac > < Dubai flights using the
good old BOEING 787.

Oh Toronto, capital of the world!! What blessings more may we bestow upon you?!?! :superwhip

Yume-sama
Jul 30, 2010, 5:35 PM
Hmm. I'd be willing to cross border for that :D Even if going to America is an unholy PITA.

As for the Mexicana situation, they are flying to Canada using A320's now. After 4 of their A319's were unceremoniously stolen from them :P

Plane-jacking is serious business.

AlexYVR
Jul 30, 2010, 6:35 PM
Knowing now that the Transport Minister John Baird has nixed direct Emirates flights from Vancouver, as well as direct flights from Vancouver to India (... this is CANADA ... so change planes in Toronto...)
.... while looking at the Wikipedia site for Sea-Tac Airport, it seems that EMIRATES is planning, in the near future, direct Sea-Tac > < Dubai flights using the
good old BOEING 787.

Oh Toronto, capital of the world!! What blessings more may we bestow upon you?!?! :superwhip

Yeah Trof I don't quite get what you're trying to accomplish by bringing them to Vancouver as I, for one, will always go to Seattle to fly if it costs less $$. Which it inevitably will.

Yume-sama
Jul 30, 2010, 6:42 PM
I have a feeling it would even cost less than flying directly from YYZ.

I just did a sample search:
JFK - DXB = $1700 return
YYZ - DXB = $2200 return

Both on an A380 :D

nova9
Jul 30, 2010, 8:00 PM
Yeah Trof I don't quite get what you're trying to accomplish by bringing them to Vancouver as I, for one, will always go to Seattle to fly if it costs less $$. Which it inevitably will.

then what is the point of us even advocating for YVR when even a forumer with YVR in their name will not fly through YVR.

I always fly through yvr, i can't be bothered to go down to seattle. my 2 hours is worth much more than whatever i can save.

Yume-sama
Jul 30, 2010, 8:01 PM
That may be true if you make $150 - $250 an hour, depending on what International flight~

I personally wouldn't go through Seattle unless it was an AMAZING circumstance just because I hate going through US Customs / Security.

big T
Jul 30, 2010, 10:30 PM
Two hours is really generous. Seatac is south of downtown, so factoring in border wait you can easily double that estimate I think. And you have to have a car (not everyone does). Really, I think the appeal of flying out of SEA is way overhyped.
That being said, YVR should absolutely be more affordable.

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 12:27 AM
Yeah Trof I don't quite get what you're trying to accomplish by bringing them to Vancouver as I, for one, will always go to Seattle to fly if it costs less $$. Which it inevitably will.

We're on two different wavelengths here:
You're thinking of it on a purely pragmatic, cost-related basis, (which probably makes a lot more sense than mine)
* * * * * * * * * *
I was thinking of it as an addition to the YVR roster to maintain it against Toronto hegemony and give it more importance as an airport.

Otherwise stated, I was not thinking of it so much in a purely $$$ way, as you were, but more on an emotional and civic pride level (which usually loses out, anyway, except that as a Canadian, I hate to see Toronto hogging everything in all domains, as they usually do).

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 12:37 AM
then what is the point of us even advocating for YVR when even a forumer with YVR in their name will not fly through YVR.

I always fly through yvr, i can't be bothered to go down to seattle. my 2 hours is worth much more than whatever i can save.

That may be true if you make $150 - $250 an hour, depending on what International flight~

I personally wouldn't go through Seattle unless it was an AMAZING circumstance just because I hate going through US Customs / Security.

Two hours is really generous. Seatac is south of downtown, so factoring in border wait you can easily double that estimate I think. And you have to have a car (not everyone does). Really, I think the appeal of flying out of SEA is way overhyped.
That being said, YVR should absolutely be more affordable.
:previous: :previous: :previous:
Thank you all for your support and understanding on this. You all have slightly different reasons for not wanting to fly out of SEA-TAC (not that I have anything against SEA-TAC), but this thread is about developing and improving YVR, and I don't just mean changing the chairs in the passenger lounge!! I mean making it a MAJOR airport!

Thanks again!! "Vive YVR!!" :yes:

SpongeG
Jul 31, 2010, 12:50 AM
its 123 miles from the border to seattle and than a few more miles to seatac - depending on how close one lives to the border... for instance my friend is about 10 mins from the border in surrey i am about 20-30 mins from where i am and my friends in vancouver it takes about 45-60 mins

when i flew out of bellingham the place was pretty full with east indians from the valley - judging by what i overheard of where they were from - and a lot of them were in big groups - like 4 or 5 kids with them - the savings on a big group make it worth it for them

I flew out of seattle in the past cause I had a sweet deal 90% off :P and way back in the day my grandparents couldn't fly into vancouver they had to fly into seattle and than drove up to vancouver - something about needing to get the visa or something in seattle anyway it wasn't too bad

too bad emirates - I see tons of arab guys downtown - like 100's - i am sure they would love a direct flight to their region from here where they live for school and go back occasionally

Yume-sama
Jul 31, 2010, 1:06 AM
It's not even really about connecting to the UAE, it's about connecting to neighboring Countries. Lebanon, Pakistan, INDIA, etc.

With our demographics it's almost shameful we have no direct connection to that part of the World, and India with its huge population.

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 1:26 AM
its 123 miles from the border to seattle and than a few more miles to seatac - depending on how close one lives to the border... for instance my friend is about 10 mins from the border in surrey i am about 20-30 mins from where i am and my friends in vancouver it takes about 45-60 mins

when i flew out of bellingham the place was pretty full with east indians from the valley - judging by what i overheard of where they were from - and a lot of them were in big groups - like 4 or 5 kids with them - the savings on a big group make it worth it for them

I flew out of seattle in the past cause I had a sweet deal 90% off :P and way back in the day my grandparents couldn't fly into vancouver they had to fly into seattle and than drove up to vancouver - something about needing to get the visa or something in seattle anyway it wasn't too bad

too bad emirates - I see tons of arab guys downtown - like 100's - i am sure they would love a direct flight to their region from here where they live for school and go back occasionally

It's not even really about connecting to the UAE, it's about connecting to neighboring Countries. Lebanon, Pakistan, INDIA, etc.

With our demographics it's almost shameful we have no direct connection to that part of the World, and India with its huge population.
:previous: :previous: :previous:
It's Transport Minister John Baird who is blocking all this. The reason? So we all have to change at Toronto. (common knowledge by now!!)

You can email John Baird at: mintc@tc.gc.ca

His peronal office phone in Ottawa is 613-991-0700

Enough emails mean votes, and that just might cause him to relent.
He is deliberately stifling the growth of YVR. He knows it. We know it. YVR officials know it, but we're powerless to change it unless there's a groundswell of opposition to the current restrictive, Toronto-favouring, policies.

SpongeG
Jul 31, 2010, 1:37 AM
It's not even really about connecting to the UAE, it's about connecting to neighboring Countries. Lebanon, Pakistan, INDIA, etc.

With our demographics it's almost shameful we have no direct connection to that part of the World, and India with its huge population.

whatever happenned to the kingfisher airlines deal? Gordo made a big deal with the press about a new deal that would have kingfisher airlines having direct india-vancouver flights

there is info somewhere in this place about it when it came out a couple years ago...

jlousa
Jul 31, 2010, 2:15 AM
Yes we know John Baird is stopping it all, he hates Vancouver and loves Toronto. It has nothing to do with Toronto serving a much larger population. All his predecessors shared in the conspiracy as well.

Now lets look at the facts. For a city Vancouver's size we serve a ridiculous amount of international passengers a year. Sure we can improve and we are year after year, but let's be realistic about the situation.

Flying to Barcelona tomorrow direct from YVR.:D

Yume-sama
Jul 31, 2010, 2:26 AM
Flying to Barcelona tomorrow direct from YVR.:D

Ooh~ My friend was just mugged in Barcelona today. Have fun lol

All the unlucky bandits got was his iPhone. Even they'll be frustrated by Telus' lack of good roaming...

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 2:28 AM
Yes we know John Baird is stopping it all, he hates Vancouver and loves Toronto. It has nothing to do with Toronto serving a much larger population. All his predecessors shared in the conspiracy as well.

Now lets look at the facts. For a city Vancouver's size we serve a ridiculous amount of international passengers a year. Sure we can improve and we are year after year, but let's be realistic about the situation.

Flying to Barcelona tomorrow direct from YVR.:D

Thank you, jlousa, for a typically sarcastic response.
First, is your YVR-BCN flight a summer charter or a regularly scheduled flight?
Second, when Emirates - and other airlines have REPEATEDLY REQESTED Vancouver access; why are they turned down by Baird? Got an answer for that one????
As for a city of Vancouver's size serving a "ridiculous" number" of international passengers per year, Brisbane Australia is smaller, yet serves more passengers than we do.
Ditto Oslo Norway. HALF the size of Vancouver, if that. More passengers.
We're on a par per number of passengers with Stockholm Arlanda, (but then, being the capital of Sweden, most of their flights ARE international)

Nevertheless, your "putting me in my place" is done in a less-than-polite fashion, and I would have expected better from a moderator. Please excuse me.

SpongeG
Jul 31, 2010, 2:29 AM
i've heard barcelona is bad and you gotta be careful on the subway

was even watching a travel show - one of the hipper younger ones - and while they were filming they caught on film some of what they were warning about

Yume-sama
Jul 31, 2010, 2:35 AM
Is it turning in to Mexico-lite or something :P? Sheesh, can't trust any of them Spanish speaking places now ;)

SpongeG
Jul 31, 2010, 2:42 AM
yeah they have gypsies who work the trains apparently - the show showed some people having a fight in one of the squares notorious for being a place to avoid even though its a touristy spot - they just said be careful and keep an eye out on what you do

jlousa
Jul 31, 2010, 2:44 AM
The comment wasn't sarcastic it was blunt. :tup: And don't forgot I'm a member of the forum first and entitled to my opinion, I'm only a moderator when acting as one. Two separate things and I do what I can to keep them separated.

John Baird has stopped Emirates from flying in for numerous reasons previously discussed in this very thread, there is no need to rehash them. I certainly hope you don't believe he stopped them to punish Vancouver and reward Toronto because that isn't the case.

And yes my flight is a summer charter, works out fine for me. A great case of supply and demand. :cheers: There is more demand for this flight in the summer time when people are vacationing so the need is meet by additional supply. If the demand was there year round the flights would appear.

My upcoming trips to Paris and to Madrid will also be charters.

SpongeG
Jul 31, 2010, 2:53 AM
cattle flights hate those

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 2:53 AM
The comment wasn't sarcastic it was blunt. :tup:

John Baird has stopped Emirates from flying in for numerous reasons previously discussed in this very thread, there is no need to rehash them. I certainly hope you don't believe he stopped them to punish Vancouver and reward Toronto because that isn't the case.


In fact, no I never did get to the bottom of that question, seeing as how EMIRATES banged on our door repeatedly.

I guess the answer is that Air Canada needs to keep Lufthansa and its Star Alliance partners happy. That's the only reason I can think of. If I'm wrong, PLEASE TELL ME.

Anybody ! .........................

jlousa
Jul 31, 2010, 3:41 AM
It's not a Canadian problem with Emirates it's global and I'll post you an article to show you that shortly. The fact is Emirates is not interested in flying people to Dubai it's interested in flying people thru Dubai, pretty sure we can agree on that right?
Emirates while compensating their pilots at industry rates still has quite a few advantages not shared by it's western competitors which include much lower payrates for their remaining personnel, fuel at rates other airlines could only dream of, tax free operation in Dubai, under market rates for their operation buildings in Dubai and numerous other subsidies/perks due to being state owned.

Here's an article that shows most of Europe is in the same boat as Canada, guess it's not about Toronto after all, but about nationalism.

http://atwonline.com/aeropolitics-regulation/news/european-airlines-determining-how-counter-growing-emirates-0712?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AtwDailyNews+%28ATW+Daily+News%29

Yume-sama
Jul 31, 2010, 3:43 AM
Why would you fly back to Canada, to then fly to Madrid... when you're in Barcelona? You know it's like 3 hours away, right :P?

Where did you find the info on these Summer charters~

Prometheus
Jul 31, 2010, 3:53 AM
The comment wasn't sarcastic it was blunt.

No, your comment was sarcastic. Let's try to keep it real jlousa.

jlousa
Jul 31, 2010, 3:54 AM
Have stuff to do in town that require that I'm here for a few days.;)

The trip to Paris will be slightly later. At only $599+deficit fighting surcharges the flights were all dirt cheap.

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 4:21 AM
It's not a Canadian problem with Emirates it's global and I'll post you an article to show you that shortly. The fact is Emirates is not interested in flying people to Dubai it's interested in flying people thru Dubai, pretty sure we can agree on that right?
Emirates while compensating their pilots at industry rates still has quite a few advantages not shared by it's western competitors which include much lower payrates for their remaining personnel, fuel at rates other airlines could only dream of, tax free operation in Dubai, under market rates for their operation buildings in Dubai and numerous other subsidies/perks due to being state owned.

Here's an article that shows most of Europe is in the same boat as Canada, guess it's not about Toronto after all, but about nationalism.

http://atwonline.com/aeropolitics-regulation/news/european-airlines-determining-how-counter-growing-emirates-0712?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AtwDailyNews+%28ATW+Daily+News%29

Thank you for that article, jlousa! Now I understand. European airlines are threatened, too. :tup:
Nevertheless, a connection point in the Middle East Gulf Region would be great for people going to either that region, or on to, say Africa.
So, may I ask you; would Qatar Airways, for example, pose the same threat?

Millennium2002
Jul 31, 2010, 7:19 AM
Sorry. Apparently I was a few pages back or something when I responded to something that I thought was the latest post.

Johnny Aussie
Jul 31, 2010, 8:10 AM
I am really curious about Canadian bi-lateral agreements.

Where can one actually find the bi-lateral agreements Canada has with each country? (particularly: France, India, Singapore and China).

Also, how does AC's J-class stack up? On all my trips to Canada, I have never flown Air Canada (funnily enough). I am booked on 2 return SYD-YVR (77L) trips through the end of the year and looking fwd to the 15 hour trips (ha). I was recently on SQ's A380 J-class return from MEL-SIN and that was absolutely amazing. The 77W was also excellent.

raskal
Jul 31, 2010, 1:55 PM
I am really curious about Canadian bi-lateral agreements.

Where can one actually find the bi-lateral agreements Canada has with each country? (particularly: France, India, Singapore and China).

http://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/doc.php?did=111&lang=eng

eemy
Jul 31, 2010, 4:16 PM
In negotiating a bilateral agreement, the Canadian government wants to have a balanced agreement that is beneficial to Canadians as well as business. The main benefit Emirates brings is lower fairs - it does not really open up any new markets as the cities it wants to serve already have one stop connections to the major markets it would be serving, and the UAE itself is a very minor international destination from Canada.

From the business perspective though, there is very little benefit to Canadian businesses. No airline in Canada is particularly interested in serving the UAE, but expanding the rights of UAE airlines to Canada would adversely impact the economics of routes that Canadian airlines want to serve or already serve, as well as existing foreign airlines which already serve the market with direct flights (I'm thinking primarily of Air India, Jet Airways and PIA here).

So, the Canadian government has chosen to allow 6 flights per week to the UAE, which, considering the size of the Canada-UAE market, is very generous, but which does not overly affect existing airlines in other markets which would likely be pushed out as a consequence of too much capacity going into the UAE.

While it sucks that YVR and YYC don't get another direct flight to an international destination, it is probably better overall. Attributing it to a pro-Toronto bias in government is a simple and convenient explanation but does stand up to even the slightest scrutiny. This government practically despises Toronto, and vice versa.

trofirhen
Jul 31, 2010, 4:31 PM
In negotiating a bilateral agreement, the Canadian government wants to have a balanced agreement that is beneficial to Canadians as well as business. The main benefit Emirates brings is lower fairs - it does not really open up any new markets as the cities it wants to serve already have one stop connections to the major markets it would be serving, and the UAE itself is a very minor international destination from Canada.

From the business perspective though, there is very little benefit to Canadian businesses. No airline in Canada is particularly interested in serving the UAE, but expanding the rights of UAE airlines to Canada would adversely impact the economics of routes that Canadian airlines want to serve or already serve, as well as existing foreign airlines which already serve the market with direct flights (I'm thinking primarily of Air India, Jet Airways and PIA here).

So, the Canadian government has chosen to allow 6 flights per week to the UAE, which, considering the size of the Canada-UAE market, is very generous, but which does not overly affect existing airlines in other markets which would likely be pushed out as a consequence of too much capacity going into the UAE.

While it sucks that YVR and YYC don't get another direct flight to an international destination, it is probably better overall. Attributing it to a pro-Toronto bias in government is a simple and convenient explanation but does stand up to even the slightest scrutiny. This government practically despises Toronto, and vice versa.

Jeremy; this time I am not referring specifically to EMIRATES, or the UAE. I just want a flight to that part of the world. QATAR is not one of the UAE.
Additionally, what about India? That was on the books for ages; now it's been nixed, too.

As an Ontario boy, you naturally have an (unconcious I admit) Ontario bias, awhen you say "what is good for Canadains..." and it's "better overall...." It isn't. Excuse me. It's better for Toronto and Air Canada. Case closed.

You don't seem to register that this thread is about VANCOUVER INT' AIRPORT, not Toronto, and not Air Canada.

In addition, there is NO direct service from Vancouver to India at all

vanlaw
Jul 31, 2010, 4:35 PM
Yeah Trof I don't quite get what you're trying to accomplish by bringing them to Vancouver as I, for one, will always go to Seattle to fly if it costs less $$. Which it inevitably will.

Not necessarily. Emirates prices their Canadian flights very competitively. Obviously you cant compare the YYZ-DXB prices to their SFO and LAX departures, but compared to their JFK and Houston departures, the YYZ flights can be cheaper by a few hundred.

Although on a special, last year i flew YYZ-DXB (YVR to YYZ on aeroplan points), 4 nights in Dubai. then Dubai-Mumbai then open jaw out of Trivandrum back to Dubai 16 days later, then DXB-YYZ - $1300 CAD total tax in. At that same time, it was significanlty more even in USD to take their JFK and Houston departures.

A couple of moths ago i checked for a friend who was trying to fly to Kenya....Emirates YYZ departures were much less than their JFK and Houston, and obvioudly less than SFO and LAX (although those two are much longer so not really comparable)

jsbertram
Jul 31, 2010, 5:20 PM
I am really curious about Canadian bi-lateral agreements.

Where can one actually find the bi-lateral agreements Canada has with each country? (particularly: France, India, Singapore and China).

Also, how does AC's J-class stack up? On all my trips to Canada, I have never flown Air Canada (funnily enough). I am booked on 2 return SYD-YVR (77L) trips through the end of the year and looking fwd to the 15 hour trips (ha). I was recently on SQ's A380 J-class return from MEL-SIN and that was absolutely amazing. The 77W was also excellent.

Until the direct YVR-SYD flights started, we would use the shared flights operated by Air Canada (YVR-HNL) and Quantas (HNL-SYD) and our travel agent knew to schedule it so we would be able to take a day or two in Hawaii between legs.

Unless you need to get there quickly, I've always encouraged friends and family to do the 'Hawaii weekend mini-vacation' to break up the long flight between SYD and YVR. Even a mid-week 24-hour layover is a nice bonus if you can arrange it.

Sometimes I need the Hawaii layover to recover from "too much family in too few days" syndrome.

Yume-sama
Jul 31, 2010, 5:23 PM
:P Unless you're sitting in Executive First, and completely separated from your family, 17 hours is way too much.

I know a lot of people who will fly to Hong Kong, Tokyo, or Singapore, before going on to Australia. Hawaii would be good, too~

I think I would have to fly to Singapore, and have to take the Singapore A380, by chance :D

MalcolmTucker
Aug 3, 2010, 1:10 PM
Emirates can fly tomorrow to YVR if it wanted to. It does not want to enough - they have three spots they can fly to Canada with.

As for India - how do we know it is not the Indian government holding up a new bilateral?

As for Emirates vs Qatar Airways vs Etihad, here is a link to a good article (and some graphics) that explains they are all pretty much following the same strategy:

The Economist
Aviation in the Gulf
Rulers of the new silk road
The ambitions of the three Gulf-based “super-connecting” airlines are bad news for competitors but good news for passengers
Jun 3rd 2010 | DUBAI (http://www.economist.com/node/16271573)
http://www.economist.com/sites/default/files/images/images-magazine/2010/23/bb/201023bbc564.gif
http://www.economist.com/sites/default/files/images/images-magazine/2010/23/bb/201023bbc568.gif
http://www.economist.com/sites/default/files/images/images-magazine/2010/23/bb/201023bbc569.gif

trofirhen
Aug 3, 2010, 3:50 PM
Emirates can fly tomorrow to YVR if it wanted to. It does not want to enough - they have three spots they can fly to Canada with.


Really? Then why do they keep on asking and asking? And so why don't they "JUST DO IT" ??

I'm not contradicting you, Sir Humphrey, but it all seems to be a total conundrum. EMIRATES WANTS into Vancouver and Calgary, don't they? But the government says no (????)

So what, exactly, is going on here? I'm baffled. Oh, and where are the three spots? :koko:

MalcolmTucker
Aug 3, 2010, 3:57 PM
They use the three spots to fly to Toronto. There is nothing stopping them from scaling that down to 2x a week and flying to YVR once.

trofirhen
Aug 3, 2010, 4:05 PM
They use the three spots to fly to Toronto. There is nothing stopping them from scaling that down to 2x a week and flying to YVR once.

I get it. They're allowed the spots, but only one per week (which they combine with Etihad at Toronto to make 6x per week to the UAE)

Perhaps once a week to Vancouver isn't enough for them.

Emirates seems to be the airline "bogeyman" all over right now, especially given that already-huge Dubai Airport is going to triple in size. And flying cheaply as they do, the could undercut airlines from the world over, making DBX the main transfer hub for most of the world.

OK. What about Qatar Airways? Qatar isn't as big as Emirates, and it's not part of the UAE. It would provide great links onward to places like Nairobi, Johannesburg, Cape Town, etc.

No doubt there's a good reason against that, too.

vanlaw
Aug 3, 2010, 4:33 PM
I get it. They're allowed the spots, but only one per week (which they combine with Etihad at Toronto to make 6x per week to the UAE)

Perhaps once a week to Vancouver isn't enough for them.

Emirates seems to be the airline "bogeyman" all over right now, especially given that already-huge Dubai Airport is going to triple in size. And flying cheaply as they do, the could undercut airlines from the world over, making DBX the main transfer hub for most of the world.

OK. What about Qatar Airways? Qatar isn't as big as Emirates, and it's not part of the UAE. It would provide great links onward to places like Nairobi, Johannesburg, Cape Town, etc.

No doubt there's a good reason against that, too.

Are they actually expanding DXB more, or are you referring to the new airport at the Dubai World Central Trade Zone (about 30km from DXB) - Al Makktoum International? They opened the first of 5 runways in June and will eventually have capacity to land 4 planes simultaneously and handle 160MM passengers per year. DXB is already fairly built out. Emirates Terminal 3 at DXB is a genius design.

trofirhen
Aug 3, 2010, 4:40 PM
Are they actually expanding DXB more, or are you referring to the new airport at the Dubai World Central Trade Zone (about 30km from DXB) - Al Makktoum International? They opened the first of 5 runways in June and will eventually have capacity to land 4 planes simultaneously and handle 160MM passengers per year. DXB is already fairly built out. Emirates Terminal 3 at DXB is a genius design.
:previous:
Whatever the configuration, it is obviously the world's "mega-airport," and as such, not surprising that other countries and airlines are getting nervous about EMIRATES.

All I'd like to see is a connection to the Gulf for geographic / travel time reasons, so I thought QATAR AIRWAYS might do, instead of EMIRATES.

MalcolmTucker
Aug 3, 2010, 5:13 PM
:previous:
Whatever the configuration, it is obviously the world's "mega-airport," and as such, not surprising that other countries and airlines are getting nervous about EMIRATES.

All I'd like to see is a connection to the Gulf for geographic / travel time reasons, so I thought QATAR AIRWAYS might do, instead of EMIRATES.

Qatar doesn't even have a bilateral with Canada. Qatar is playing the same game as Emirates just with different spots, so I doubt they would secure one anytime soon. Didn't you read the Economist article? If they got 3 or 6 slots I would guess that they would service Toronto to skim off more of the traffic to India.

trofirhen
Aug 3, 2010, 6:34 PM
Qatar doesn't even have a bilateral with Canada. Qatar is playing the same game as Emirates just with different spots, so I doubt they would secure one anytime soon. Didn't you read the Economist article? If they got 3 or 6 slots I would guess that they would service Toronto to skim off more of the traffic to India.

OK OK. So where the freak is the service to India? I know AIR INDIA and (I believe, JET AIRWAYS fly there: from Toronto and nowhere else in Canada, of course)

But is there a direct service to India from Vancouver? No there isn't.

All this stuff about Gulf Region airlines taking away service to India is a bit like Don Quixote tilting at windmills.

It's a bit pathetic, in fact, if you'll excuse me.