PDA

You are viewing a trimmed-down version of the SkyscraperPage.com discussion forum.  For the full version follow the link below.

View Full Version : YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion



Pages : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 [82] 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133

trofirhen
Nov 2, 2015, 8:35 AM
Hmmmm ... nice .... all that's missing is a fistful of South American and Southeast Asian destinations, and maybe Delhi, Melbourne, and Istanbul.

Klazu
Nov 2, 2015, 7:01 PM
Is there anyplace I can find a recent drawing of the proposed expansions at YVR?

Last week I had the opportunity to visit the YVR corporate offices and they had this model in their lobby. I highlighted the planned new extension in red. All photos taken with a cell phone.

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_laajennus.jpg

There is a model of the airport today on the observation platform.

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_yleiskuva1.jpg

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_yleiskuva2.jpg

Panorama from the domestic terminal observation platform. This was taken during noon, so there was not many planes in the bay.

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_nakoalatasanne_panoraama.jpg

Considering how beautiful the airport is, the flight control tower is an ugly beast.

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_lennonjohtotorni.jpg

Domestic terminal. The YVR corporate offices are located in that glass structure.

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_kotimaan_terminaali.jpg

Waiting to board SkyTrain back to city.

http://vuosiamaailmalla.fi/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/yvr_skytrain.jpg

nname
Nov 2, 2015, 7:23 PM
Thanks for the photo.

I always wondered why the gate number in the international wing goes like 54-55-58-64-65. Now I understand, the number 59-63 are reserved for the 5 new gates in the planned expansion!

At least they don't need to renumber all the gates again until the new trans-boarder terminal :D

Klazu
Nov 2, 2015, 7:25 PM
Yep. Of course this model does not show the planned brand new terminal to the east, but I don't know what is the timeframe for that. Like the area overview shows, another SkyTrain station makes sense once that terminal is built, as it will be far from the current terminals.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 2, 2015, 8:20 PM
Thanks for sharing Klaus.

As Craig Richmond mentioned in his speech last week I think an expansion like this will be announced next year. As he said they have very big plans in the works.

I just don't think a 5 gate expansion is going to be enough :)

Minor transborder changes

UA is adding an additional flight (CR7s) to LAX on Saturdays during the peak Xmas period and also in February. An additional flight to DEN on Saturdays around Xmas peak is being added too. These extra services did not exist last winter.

AA has pushed back its third daily flight to PHX. The additional flight will now commence mid Feb and is scheduled to continue right through the summer again. Last winter the third daily flight wasn't launched until late spring. The route will then see one daily 320, one daily 319 and one daily CR9. Once the third flight is added the YVR - PHX route will be served by five daily flights on AA, AC and WS for the remainder of the winter.

DL to SEA will again see 5 daily over the peak Xmas period. A mix of E75s, CR7s and CR9s. The daily SLC flight will now be operated by an E75. SLC scheduled to ramp up to two daily again in the spring.

Looks like AA and DL are both maintaining double daily flights to LAX for most of the winter. AA had drawn down one its flights to five weekly for short periods but those seem to have been reversed.

Fact tidbit of the day: Once rouge ramps up its Hawaii schedules in mid Feb, YVR - Hawaii will be served by 61 flights per week - so most days will see a total of nine flights to HNL, OGG, KOA and LIH.

trofirhen
Nov 2, 2015, 8:45 PM
https://youtu.be/fpqhvKrcHtw?t=2199

For those of you who skipped the Board Of Trade Speech by Craig Richmond some posts earlier, this is a segment from 38:00 minutes on.
You only need to watch 5 minutes of it (up to aout 41 mn) to get the scope that Mr. Richmond is thinking on.
Pret-ty ambitious !!!!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Johnny Aussie
Nov 2, 2015, 10:03 PM
https://youtu.be/fpqhvKrcHtw?t=2199

For those of you who skipped the Board Of Trade Speech by Craig Richmond some posts earlier, this is a segment from 38:00 minutes on.
You only need to watch 5 minutes of it (up to aout 41 mn) to get the scope that Mr. Richmond is thinking on.
Pret-ty ambitious !!!!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I admire his ambitious vision. Having him at the helm is going to make things happen.... And he definitely is already making things happen.

Many factors are out of any airport CEO's control...both positive and negative.. But this guy has the best "can do" attitude. He is certainly not just sitting around watching other airports expand and grow as well. Proactive and ambitious. Love it!

Sounds like a few exciting announcements in the next 12 months.

Vagabond
Nov 3, 2015, 12:02 AM
If I were to make realistic guesses I could see AC starting Frankfurt, Melbourne, and Guangzhao. Can't see many expansions within NA. With Rouge, maybe some leisure routes such as smaller asian cities like Nagoya. Cant see much more european expansion. I could realistically see a Delhi route as well on AC mainline.

I personally feel a YVR-DEL non-stop flight is an inevitability, now that AC has the 787-9. AC will wait a bit to see how YYZ-DEL does before launching from YVR, but I can see them announcing for W16/17 or W17/18. The economics never really made sense until now, but the 789 is perhaps the perfect plane for such a route, so there are now no more excuses. ;) The Chinese carriers will continue to undercut AC on price, but with travel time savings of 6-8 hours each way, I can see a non-stop flight being a massive hit. Plus for those of us who travel on to other cities in India, there will still be time savings, both in the air and on the ground (where immigration could be done at DEL during the layover).

The only real question would be whether such a route would be seasonal or year round (at least, in the short term).

That said, even now, there has never really been a better time to fly to India from YVR. There are so many different routing options (with immensely reasonable layover times) and prices have plummeted. It's now relatively common to see flights to most major Indian cities for under $1100 CAD (and even DEL for under $1000 sometimes), whereas just a couple of years ago, anything under $1500-$1600 was considered a steal. Compare that to flying to Ottawa or Montreal (which can easily cost $750+)!

Johnny Aussie
Nov 3, 2015, 1:14 AM
Winter scheds are showing mainline E90s to YXY, YQR and YXE for some of the winter scheds coming up.

Klazu
Nov 3, 2015, 2:24 AM
Why are we always talking about DEL when we are discussing connections to India? Is it the only Star Alliance hub in India or why is that specific airport so important?

yyc_engineer
Nov 3, 2015, 2:46 AM
Why are we always talking about DEL when we are discussing connections to India? Is it the only Star Alliance hub in India or why is that specific airport so important?

Majority of O/D between Lower Mainland and India is from Delhi or nearby states to the North. (Punjab, etc.)

FWIW DEL is not much of a Star Alliance Hub, and in fact AC 70/71 does not nicely connect to any outbound Air India flights. (probably done on purpose by AI to discourage people from using AC and instead encouraging flying on AI metal from LHR/FRA).

Air India's entrance to Star Alliance is relatively recent and now that AC flies direct Canada-India it's kind of an awkward relationship.

yyc_engineer
Nov 3, 2015, 2:50 AM
I would like to see AC/ACR make YXX-YYZ year round and time it to connect seamlessly with AC 70/71. Then market it aggressively as the best (fastest/easiest/most relaxing/whatever) way to get from the Lower Mainland to India.

They should be able to get 50+ seats on YXX-YYZ continuing onto DEL

Klazu
Nov 3, 2015, 3:00 AM
...in fact AC 70/71 does not nicely connect to any outbound Air India flights. (probably done on purpose by AI to discourage people from using AC and instead encouraging flying on AI metal from LHR/FRA).

Are you alluding that Air India would have that much influence on DEL slot times? I doubt they have scheduled all their own domestic flights not to connect well with two Air Canada flight. It might be more of a happy coincidence for them. :)

Interesting point about the YXX traffic.

nname
Nov 3, 2015, 3:21 AM
I would like to see AC/ACR make YXX-YYZ year round and time it to connect seamlessly with AC 70/71. Then market it aggressively as the best (fastest/easiest/most relaxing/whatever) way to get from the Lower Mainland to India.

They should be able to get 50+ seats on YXX-YYZ continuing onto DEL

Not sure how it would be attractive though. For anyone in Surrey west of the ALR, it is actually faster to drive to YVR than to YXX. Plus there are up to 19 flights a day to YYZ to choose from at YVR, compared to 1 at YXX.

I wouldn't be too happy if the return flight from DEL got delayed and miss the only flight of the day to YXX...

Johnny Aussie
Nov 3, 2015, 3:51 AM
http://yvr.ca/Libraries/Aviation_Marketing/Traffic_Update_September_2015.sflb.ashx

Looks like August with lame growth was just a blip....

September is back to decent growth.

Led by a surge in Asia Pacific up 12.3%

Overall up 4.8% up 79,600
Domestic up 3.4% up 29,500
Transborder up 5.9% up 22,500
Asia Pacific up 12.3% up 29,000
Europe down 1.8% (scheduled up 2.7% though) down 2,800
Misc Int'l up 9.8% up 1,400

Total International up 6.4% up 50,100

If I were a betting man, YVR will almost certainly smash through 20 million pax this year.

YVR is already over 700,000 more pax YTD than the same period last year. Great result so far.

Gordon
Nov 3, 2015, 7:12 PM
Did the modwls show any changes to the West jet Encore area. Ie would be nice if the were some type of cover that would extend ll the wy to the plane.

Klazu
Nov 3, 2015, 7:45 PM
I am sorry, but I didn't pay attention to that.

nname
Nov 3, 2015, 8:01 PM
I think that model pre-date the creation of Westjet Encore. It still got the old A-B pier.

zahav
Nov 4, 2015, 8:09 AM
Sounds like a SkyTeam Lounge is being planned for YVR.

Source - http://www.wcarn.com/news/48/48373.html

See the third to last paragraph.

SkyTeam carriers seem to have a long term growth plan with YVR.

So users would be KLM, Air France, China Airlines, Korean Air, China Eastern, China Southern, Xiamen and Aeromexico.

Also, Delta's seasonal flight to JFK departs after the transborder pre-clearance E gates close (I think around 9pm are the last flights on those gates). So that flight can also use this lounge, provided it stays open late (and it probably should stay open late, considering there will be very late night flights for Taipei (China Airlines), Shanghai (China Eastern), Mexico City (Aeromexico), and New York

Stanford85
Nov 4, 2015, 9:36 AM
In regards to the Westjet encore area, i remember seeing this website for an architecture company a while ago which referred to a pier A commuter facility project at yvr. no dates or anything like that were given though, and the pictures predate the A-B connector so it might have only been an early design concept.

http://www.studioonearchitecture.ca/ (you'll find it under projects - airport and transportation, there's also some other misc projects listed there too like a new jetset parking facility)

the Pier A project above does seem to be present in all the slides of possible terminal expansions that craig richmond showed to the board of trade.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpqhvKrcHtw&t=37m10s (starting at 37:10)

zahav
Nov 4, 2015, 4:04 PM
Regarding the passenger stats, I think it's amazing how transborder has turned around from only a few years ago when it seemed like it was a fading sector, and Seattle/Bellingham were cannibalizing this market. The volume for the first 9 months of 2015 is already higher than the yearly total for all of 2009 (yes I know that was the recession year, but still...)

Johnny Aussie
Nov 4, 2015, 11:19 PM
Regarding the passenger stats, I think it's amazing how transborder has turned around from only a few years ago when it seemed like it was a fading sector, and Seattle/Bellingham were cannibalizing this market. The volume for the first 9 months of 2015 is already higher than the yearly total for all of 2009 (yes I know that was the recession year, but still...)

YVR has a very strong U.S. inbound market.

Combine the low CAD dollar which is attracting even more Americans to fly to BC and fewer Canadians crossing the border to fly out of BLI. BLI is expected to be down about 35% this year.

This helps explain the 8.7% surge in transborder traffic YTD at YVR.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 5, 2015, 9:15 PM
On Twitter YVR is having a poll...

"Which country would you like to see YVR add direct flights to next?"

Choices are Thailand or India.

Poll results as of now:

Thailand 63%
India 37%

Denscity
Nov 5, 2015, 9:38 PM
^^^ Really? India for sure. Must be a way higher O & D than Thailand?

Denscity
Nov 5, 2015, 9:39 PM
I guess because Thailand is more popular for tourists.

Klazu
Nov 5, 2015, 9:41 PM
On the topic of terminal expansion...

Vancouver Sun: YVR eyes expansion as terminal approaches capacity

The Vancouver International Airport terminal will reach full capacity in about five years, according to current projections, and officials say 2016 will play a big role in determining how the facilities are expanded to meet demand.

The Vancouver Airport Authority said it will decide by the second quarter of 2016 how the passenger terminal will be expanded to increase its capacity from the current figure of 25 million passengers annually. The three options being explored include a westward expansion that includes a satellite terminal connected to the main terminal by a tunnel, a centralized expansion model and an eastward one.

YVR president and CEO Craig Richmond said a management team will be researching costs, environmental feasibility, effects on passengers, air-side logistics and other factors in the next four months before presenting a recommendation to the board. Richmond also noted it is crucial for YVR to stay ahead of the passenger growth curve to stay competitive.

“Because we don’t have a 10-million-persons city, we have to be more nimble, and we have to be more aware what customers want,” he said. “We don’t want to get to a place where we are overcrowded, because — let’s say you are flying through here from Shanghai to Dallas — you could choose somewhere else (to connect) pretty quickly if you thought we were overcrowded.”

YVR is projected to welcome 20 million passengers this year, a five-million increase since 1998. During the same period, the airport reduced the number of takeoffs and landings by 50,000 annually by attracting larger, more efficient aircraft. As such, Richmond said the airport will not be looking at a new runway “anytime soon.”

However, airport officials said a terminal expansion will likely require some new taxiways to reduce the travel time of planes between the gates and the runways. Richmond also said YVR is actively looking to engage transit authorities to enhance ground transportation to and from the airport, since an expanded terminal would bring more passengers, who in turn will increase the traffic burden on existing Metro Vancouver roads, rail, and bridges.

Regardless of terminal design, the construction will likely take place within the next two years, in a incremental fashion to avoid being caught in an economic/traffic downturn mid-process, he said.

“We’re looking ahead and saying, ‘Right now, yes, it looks like we’ll have 25 million by 2020, but if that slows down, we would like to be able to slow down the building program,’” Richmond said. “We always like to do things incrementally if we can. Instead of adding 20 gates at once, we’d rather add five, because that seems like a more prudent way to do it.”

To ensure people get their say, YVR has launched a public engagement program for its new master plan, which is due to be presented to Ottawa by December 2016. The other likely major project at the airport would be a geothermal facility to help heat and cool the terminal. The business case is set to be presented within months, Richmond said, with plans for it to be operational by 2020.

Major airports in Western Canada have been undergoing expansions in recent years, the most notable of which is the new international terminal at Calgary International Airport, slated for completion in 2016.

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/eyes+expansion+terminal+approaches+capacity/11492942/story.html

Johnny Aussie
Nov 5, 2015, 10:23 PM
On the topic of terminal expansion...

Like I said earlier... Expect a few exciting announcements in the next twelve months :)

^^
Yes India would have a much bigger O&D than Thailand.

And the poll is now Thailand 62% India 38% ooooh big swing there.. LOL

trofirhen
Nov 5, 2015, 10:28 PM
Given that YVR - SAN, a seemingly profitable market, has been dropped by AC for some years, and never taken on by Westjet,..... is there the profit interest/ the market / the bilaterals / ... to allow Southwest Airlines to try? Seems a possibility. Maybe
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/international-business/us-business/southwest-airlines-targets-canadian-expansion/article20493147/
old news, yes, but hopefully still relevantOr perhaps not ...
Anyone know what did in fact become of this 2014 trumpeting?
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/international-business/us-business/southwest-eyes-northern-push-threatening-air-canada-westjet/article19783679/

tuffyy
Nov 5, 2015, 11:50 PM
Xiamen has recieved CAAC approval to start service to YVR in July 4 times per week from XMN nonstop with the 788.

Denscity
Nov 5, 2015, 11:53 PM
Yes!

trofirhen
Nov 6, 2015, 12:41 AM
Xiamen has recieved CAAC approval to start service to YVR in July 4 times per week from XMN nonstop with the 788.
Good stuff! And wait until YVR gets TWV clearance, and can take on major routes in the USA, Central America, and South America. Sodium on water.!

Johnny Aussie
Nov 6, 2015, 1:40 AM
Xiamen has recieved CAAC approval to start service to YVR in July 4 times per week from XMN nonstop with the 788.

Now just need to keep our eyes peeled for the Canadian approval.

https://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/decisions

Definitely one of the many big announcements to expect in the next twelve months.

********

Now I guess we will have to see about Hainan to Tianjin.

They applied before Xiamen and they are expecting to start in June... so also before Xiamen.

However, found this interesting story... the CAAC is "punishing" three airports in China due to chronic delays. One of these airports is TSN. According to this news item, CAAC is withholding any more new route approvals.... not clear how long being withheld for (it says for the month of October.) So also unsure if this will have any bearing on YVR-TSN on HU!?!?

http://www.wcarn.com/news/48/48251.html

Max.
Nov 6, 2015, 6:26 AM
Hi and welcome to SSP :)

Is it possible for you to provide a source or attach a link?

Do you know if an application to the CAAC has been made?

Normally, if the CAAC publicly announce the application, there is a good chance approval is likely. Hence why I'm bullish on both Hainan and Xiamen.

I know CZ plan to start 4 weekly SZX -SYD soon.

A daily SZX - YVR would be a very bold move by them.

Hi, today the new route from SZX-YVR was signed during the BC delegation in ShenZhen. But not sure it is CZ or others.:)http://ww3.sinaimg.cn/bmiddle/65de2fabjw1exr8fws1tuj21hc140k32.jpg

Hot Rod
Nov 6, 2015, 7:44 AM
Excellent!

YVR-Beijing "check" Air Canada, Air China
YVR-Shanghai "check" Air Canada, China Eastern
YVR-Guangzhou "check" China Southern
YVR-Chongqing MISSING [new T3 being built, set to open late 2016. look for announcement close to then]
YVR-Tianjin "H1 2016" Hainan Airlines
YVR-Shenyang "check" Sichuan Airlines
YVR-Chengdu "check" Sichuan Airlines
YVR-Kunming "check" China Eastern
YVR-Shenzhen "H2 2016" TBD
YVR-Xiamen "Approved" Xiamen Airlines

All of China's top 10 cities/ports covered, with the exception of Chongqing. But as I mentioned, CKG is building a massive T3 that is set to open in late 2016. It WILL have significant International operations as CKG competes against Chengdu and Kunming for the rightful status as the nation's #4 airport gateway after PEK, CAN, and PVG. I say rightful because Chongqing is one of the 5 China National Cities (Shenzhen the other, along with the big 3) and Chongqing is one of the 4 municipalities (the other being Tianjin, along with the big 2). Chengdu and Kunming have amazing tourism markets, and Chengdu in particular has been capitalizing on Chongqing's 'slow' rise to prominence given that city's status of provincial capital (which used to govern the more populated Chongqing until 1997). Chengdu landed Air China and is the #2 hub, therefore it is very well connected Star Alliance and has made things difficult for Chongqing which needs to figure out who it wants to bed with. This will be easier once T3 is compete because it will be the largest and by far the most modern terminal in the interiour of China. China Southern has defacto hub or focus city ops in CKG (and Air China has focus city ops); I'd suspect China Southern to up CKG to full hub (likely its #2) but who knows if Air China will abandon or downsize Chengdu in favor of new digs at CKG? Chengdu knows its days are numbered, and area already planning a new airport to take over from Shuangliu. It's unknown if they will build a fortress, but given its history of utilizing all provincial resources to compete I'd expect it to be a player (hence hoping CKG gets China Southern instead of gaining then losing Air China). ...

sorry for the CKG-CTU mini-rant, but I think it gives a little bit of colour to aide my final thought: Vancouver will get YVR-CKG via China Southern; most likely announced when T3 becomes most complete and the govt/media is there to tout CKG's status as the biggest/best facility in China outside of (or better yet, on par with) the Big 3.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 6, 2015, 7:57 AM
^
Don't apologise at your "rant." Your insight is valuable and I think we are all learning a lot more about China's different regions. Just like Canada and Australia and pretty much everywhere else, airports and airlines competing all the time for a bigger share of the global air traffic market.

Also, like here, just because a city has a large population (or a perceived large population) does not necessarily mean there is a large air travel market attached to it. So again your knowledge is appreciated.

5 years ago I would have thought this would have been some sort of pie in the sky wish list... who would have thought!?

Still unsure exactly what this Shenzhen signing is. Cannot seem to get any more in depth info. Perhaps on the Premier's website in a day or two.

Is it a MOA type thing a la Kingfisher?

nname
Nov 6, 2015, 10:40 AM
Shenzhen is a Star Alliance hub, but Shenzhen Airlines does not have a suitable plane that can fly to North America. Maybe Air China? Air Canada??

At this rate, it won't be long till we got more destinations in China than domestic destinations outside of BC...

jacobparry
Nov 6, 2015, 6:16 PM
Shenzhen announcement was about cleantech, no flight details (yet)
https://news.gov.bc.ca/releases/2015PREM0084-001859

SFUVancouver
Nov 6, 2015, 7:28 PM
Chengdu's new airport will be welcome. Their existing airport, Shangrilu (CTU), is fine, but rather tired. I flew through there in May for a conference on airport development, no less. CTU has a limited number of jet bridges, so even a major multiple-times-daily flight like CTU-HKG on Air China was from a remote stand. However it is definitely a busy airport with a very healthy mix of wide- and narrow-bodies and a surprising variety of international carriers. The terminal itself is pretty austere and there's a ways to go towards sufficiently catering to international non-Mandarin-speaking travellers who are used to travelling through international-calibre terminals. CTU is more of a domestic terminal that handles both international and domestic flights. In fact, it feels a lot like the older terminals of LAX with respect to interior dimensions, amenities, level of maintenance, and interior decor.

Very pleased to see positive momentum on YVR getting more regular flights to China's major and emerging markets. Pretty incredible time to be alive.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 6, 2015, 8:19 PM
Shenzhen announcement was about cleantech, no flight details (yet)
https://news.gov.bc.ca/releases/2015PREM0084-001859

Thanks for the link. Yeah I didn't see anything about flights.

Hopefully get some more info.

I think if the rumour was for daily flights to start that would be overkill on that route. And it was to be on China Southern if it is happening.

Hourglass
Nov 7, 2015, 1:54 AM
Thanks for the link. Yeah I didn't see anything about flights.

Hopefully get some more info.

I think if the rumour was for daily flights to start that would be overkill on that route. And it was to be on China Southern if it is happening.

Agree that's the most likely scenario, but it's worth noting that Shenzhen is also a hub for Hainan Airlines...

Max.
Nov 7, 2015, 2:18 AM
Thanks for the link. Yeah I didn't see anything about flights.

Hopefully get some more info.

I think if the rumour was for daily flights to start that would be overkill on that route. And it was to be on China Southern if it is happening.

The one who post this information is very reliable because he attended the ceremony yesterday. But he was not confirmed it is daily.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 7, 2015, 4:45 AM
The one who post this information is very reliable because he attended the ceremony yesterday. But he was not confirmed it is daily.

I'm not doubting your source. I'm just questioning exactly what was signed.

Is it just a MOA (memorandum of understanding)? Unfortunately these sometimes just end up in the waste basket.

I'd be curious to get more info on it... I'm sure something will come up in the next few days when the story unfolds.

Klazu
Nov 7, 2015, 11:12 PM
Arrived in Santiago de Chile (SCL) today. Turbulent ride from Toronto, but flight was on time and Air Canada got us here. 77W is such a loud airplane compared to the 787 between YVR and YYZ. Fortunately three more 787 flights ahead for us. :) I think this was now the Air Canada's "tin can" 777, but I didn't find it bad at all. Completely normal seat pitch and 3+3+3 configuration.

What caught my eye at the baggage claim was how there were a lot of luggage coming through YVR and likely even more from YVR. Most bags were transiting at YYZ and not originating from there and I suppose YVR could indeed support its own SCL run, although even from Toronto they have the same plane continue to Buenos Aires.

Neat looking city with TALL mountains right next door. It is quite a different feeling to have Mount Baker height peaks only 10 kilometers from Downtown. Almost three times as tall as North Shore Mountains, but with the same distance. I actually first thought I couldn't see the mountains through the smog, only shortly realizing that I have to look WAY more up. :D What is crazy is that there are peaks close to 6000 meters tall just behind these front mountains. Makes one's mind boggle.

trofirhen
Nov 8, 2015, 12:06 AM
Arrived in Santiago de Chile (SCL) today. Turbulent ride from Toronto, but flight was on time and Air Canada got us here. 77W is such a loud airplane compared to the 787 between YVR and YYZ. Fortunately three more 787 flights ahead for us. :) I think this was now the Air Canada's "tin can" 777, but I didn't find it bad at all. Completely normal seat pitch and 3+3+3 configuration.

What caught my eye at the baggage claim was how there were a lot of luggage coming through YVR and likely even more from YVR. Most bags were transiting at YYZ and not originating from there and I suppose YVR could indeed support its own SCL run, although even from Toronto they have the same plane continue to Buenos Aires.

Neat looking city with TALL mountains right next door. It is quite a different feeling to have Mount Baker height peaks only 10 kilometers from Downtown. Almost three times as tall as North Shore Mountains, but with the same distance. I actually first thought I couldn't see the mountains through the smog, only shortly realizing that I have to look WAY more up. :D What is crazy is that there are peaks close to 6000 meters tall just behind these front mountains. Makes one's mind boggle.
Aconcagua is considered a relatively easy climb, given its height. A whole lot easier (except the need for 'gas') at that altitude than Mt. McKinley, or even Waddington!
There'll be a next time. We'll be waiting.;)

Klazu
Nov 8, 2015, 12:40 AM
Yeah, Aconcagua (6960 meters, tallest mountain outside of Himalayas) is an impressive sight when landing on SCL. We had perfect weather and could see it even though it's located on Argentina's side. It is not as prominent as Baker or Rainier, as the peaks surrounding it are 5500+ meters, but it looks very cool with it's own micro-climate on the top.

Most Andes peaks are technically easy to summit, however their altitude requires plenty of acclimatization. Tours summitting Aconcagua are around 20 days, so not something you will do as a day trip. :)

Johnny Aussie
Nov 10, 2015, 5:12 AM
SkyTeam just keeps motoring along at YVR.

DL updated its summer 2016 schedules this week:

The once daily red eye to JFK is returning and has just been loaded into the scheds this week.

A 6th daily flight to SEA on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Sundays was also added.

MSP's afternoon flight has been upgauged to a 739. Morning stays a 738.

The other routes are the same as last summer right now:

2 daily SLC, 2 daily LAX, 2 weekly ATL and 1 weekly DTW.

So depending on the day of the week there will be between 12 and 14 DL flights per day.

stiffdeadman
Nov 10, 2015, 5:25 AM
SkyTeam just keeps motoring along at YVR.

DL updated its summer 2016 schedules this week:

The once daily red eye to JFK is returning and has just been loaded into the scheds this week.

A 6th daily flight to SEA on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Sundays was also added.

MSP's afternoon flight has been upgauged to a 739. Morning stays a 738.

The other routes are the same as last summer right now:

2 daily SLC, 2 daily LAX, 2 weekly ATL and 1 weekly DTW.

So depending on the day of the week there will be between 12 and 14 DL flights per day.

Still a far cry from the days when DL and NW were separate. MSP was 4-5 times daily, DTW was daily, ATL was daily, SLC was 3-4 times daily, the weekly flight to MEM. There was instances of 3 sometimes 4 757's on Saturdays. Way better for spotting then a plethora of CRJs from SEA.

trofirhen
Nov 10, 2015, 7:58 AM
With airlines Stateside gobbling each other up these days, how many US mainline carriers ddoes YVR have now? Three? (AA, UA, DL) ... or more? (No not counting National to Orlando).

WarrenC12
Nov 10, 2015, 3:32 PM
BIV article on expansion:

https://www.biv.com/article/2015/11/critics-question-yvrs-400m-terminal-expansion-plan/

Some interesting "post 2020" options in the graphic.

west1266
Nov 10, 2015, 3:32 PM
HI guys don't normally post but I read the forum all the time. Saw this in BIV regarding the expansion of YVR. It is the diagram of the upcoming expansion.https://www.biv.com/article/2015/11/critics-question-yvrs-400m-terminal-expansion-plan/ Cheers,

trofirhen
Nov 10, 2015, 4:05 PM
Regarding YVR future terminal expansion, Craig Richmond made it pretty clear that he favoured the "green" (or centre) option, rather than a satellite to the west, or a new terminal eastward.
He stated the "western" (blue) as problematic in forcing the removal of the crosswind runway, and the high cost of tunnelling in the spongy soil. The "east" (yellow) terminal, he said, would interfere with YVR-related businesses. So it seems largely decided that the "centre" (green) option will be the one chosen. This was in his Board of Trade speech.

osirisboy
Nov 10, 2015, 4:37 PM
So when they talk about expanding the a b terminals as part of this 400 million 2020 expansion this us in addition to the work they are just finishing on those terminals?

connect2source
Nov 10, 2015, 5:36 PM
As a frequent traveller through YVR, ( I'm leaving for LHR later today ) I'm always surprised at how dead the international gates are after the midday rush and into the evening. Seems YVR could jostle some slots and have enough capacity for years to come. For 19M - 20M passengers / year the size of the terminal and number of gates seems relatively high compared to other airports handling similar passenger counts.

Also, Bruce Cran's take on Bellingham is totally inaccurate in 2015, Bellingham's Canadian traffic is way down due to the loonie's fall and YVR's are way up. The AIF of $20 is totally in-line with most airports in Canada as well.

twoNeurons
Nov 10, 2015, 5:36 PM
HI guys don't normally post but I read the forum all the time. Saw this in BIV regarding the expansion of YVR. It is the diagram of the upcoming expansion.https://www.biv.com/article/2015/11/critics-question-yvrs-400m-terminal-expansion-plan/ Cheers,

Hey west1266, congrats to upgrading status to non-lurker! It's always great to have another voice in the mix!

Welcome! And great first post!


EDIT:
https://www.biv.com/media/filer_public/cc/20/cc20121b-1762-48bb-a2d7-fdaac74f6f32/yvr_expansion.png
source (https://www.biv.com/article/2015/11/critics-question-yvrs-400m-terminal-expansion-plan/)

If they build the yellow terminal to the east, would there be no transborder capacity? How would you transit from one wing to another? Personally, although I'd love to see another terminal to the east, I'm in favor of keeping the airport as compact as you can for as long as possible. Adding that Eastern wing would increase transfers for some passengers. It looks like they'd have to exit the secure zone to change terminals.

Gordon
Nov 10, 2015, 7:06 PM
It will be a while before any Per A expansion is needed because the A|B connector gates are not all being used( B12 27 & 28 are barely ever used.)

nname
Nov 10, 2015, 7:47 PM
It will be a while before any Per A expansion is needed because the A|B connector gates are not all being used( B12 27 & 28 are barely ever used.)

B12 is now being used as A12, as A8 and B11 are closed for construction.

I think the plan is to move all the Encore, CMA, and Hawkair planes into pier A. Once the construction is done on A, then it would free up most of the B pier for reconstruction/renovation.

Maybe B27 and B28 is waiting for Jetlines if it ever start flying? :D

Johnny Aussie
Nov 10, 2015, 9:55 PM
As a frequent traveller through YVR, ( I'm leaving for LHR later today ) I'm always surprised at how dead the international gates are after the midday rush and into the evening. Seems YVR could jostle some slots and have enough capacity for years to come. For 19M - 20M passengers / year the size of the terminal and number of gates seems relatively high compared to other airports handling similar passenger counts.

Also, Bruce Cran's take on Bellingham is totally inaccurate in 2015, Bellingham's Canadian traffic is way down due to the loonie's fall and YVR's are way up. The AIF of $20 is totally in-line with most airports in Canada as well.

Point 1: easier said than done. Flights need to depart from YVR to arrive at their destination to optimise those flights' onward connection capabilities whilst still being able to get some inbound YVR connections as well. That's why you see Asian flights departing late morning to mid afternoon. And then again very late at night into the wee hours of the morning like 1am or 2am. And then for Europe for flights to arrive early mornings they really cannot depart from YVR before 1pm but you will notice flights to Europe are a bit more spread out as for example the second daily AC LHR flight will be departing after 9pm to arrive in LHR after 2pm. And for South Pacific flights they all leave early to late evening only. They really cannot leave earlier or they would be arriving in AKL (for example) before 5am.

Point 2: yeah clearly this guy hasn't kept up to date. I respect people opposing development with accurate and solid evidence but not digging up irrelevant old info to try and sway opinion. Rubbish.

whatnext
Nov 10, 2015, 11:53 PM
Arrived in Santiago de Chile (SCL) today. Turbulent ride from Toronto, but flight was on time and Air Canada got us here. 77W is such a loud airplane compared to the 787 between YVR and YYZ. Fortunately three more 787 flights ahead for us. :) I think this was now the Air Canada's "tin can" 777, but I didn't find it bad at all. Completely normal seat pitch and 3+3+3 configuration..

That's the old configuration. The new high density planes are 3-4-3 in Y. I flew to LHR recently on one which was bearable because it was only half full. Even then the (reduced) washrooms were filthy by the end of the flight, can't imaine what it would be like when it is full.

red-paladin
Nov 11, 2015, 12:01 AM
The 2020 options make sense to me, especially Pier D, that was expected.
I think that Piers A and B should be improved in the case that their expansions go forward though.
After that I'd rather see the Eastern terminal with the new skytrain station than the Western satellite model. While airports with those kinds of satellite terminals with people movers seem cool, they really suck to use.

west1266
Nov 11, 2015, 1:34 AM
I agree I think the eastern expansion makes the most sense...it would give trans-border a dedicated terminal and a skytrain station. The airfield services could easily move to north-side of the north runway. Some form of people mover would be needed between the 3 terminals. The east side taxi-way would need to be apart of this expansion scenario.

I read in another post a few months ago the Pier A expansion was to go ahead beginning of 2016 some architectural firm has some preliminary renderings of it. Sorry I couldn't find the posting to link it.

casper
Nov 11, 2015, 3:00 AM
Hey west1266, congrats to upgrading status to non-lurker! It's always great to have another voice in the mix!

Welcome! And great first post!


EDIT:
https://www.biv.com/media/filer_public/cc/20/cc20121b-1762-48bb-a2d7-fdaac74f6f32/yvr_expansion.png
source (https://www.biv.com/article/2015/11/critics-question-yvrs-400m-terminal-expansion-plan/)

If they build the yellow terminal to the east, would there be no transborder capacity? How would you transit from one wing to another? Personally, although I'd love to see another terminal to the east, I'm in favor of keeping the airport as compact as you can for as long as possible. Adding that Eastern wing would increase transfers for some passengers. It looks like they'd have to exit the secure zone to change terminals.

What would be good if they build out the yellow portion is a three four story terminal. Lowest floor handling all the baggage/technical. Then one level for international departures and a second level for US departures. The middle level for arrivals. Basically what you see with many of the European airports such as Munich.

trofirhen
Nov 11, 2015, 3:35 AM
What would be good if they build out the yellow portion is a three four story terminal. Lowest floor handling all the baggage/technical. Then one level for international departures and a second level for US departures. The middle level for arrivals. Basically what you see with many of the European airports such as Munich.

In his speech to the Board of Trade, Craig Richmond made it clear that the perpendicular (vertical) part of the yellow eastern extension would not be built, as, with jets parked all around, it would crowd out business space essential to YVR.
However, in post 2020, the yellow part running parallel to the road was included in the expansion - presumably as the new US departures wing, and could be included in the "centre" option, colored green; seemingly the preferred option.
The grey "western" option is considered too impractical and expensive, especially given the spongy YVR terrain and the forced disusue of the crosswind runway.

Klazu
Nov 11, 2015, 4:46 AM
That's the old configuration. The new high density planes are 3-4-3 in Y. I flew to LHR recently on one which was bearable because it was only half full. Even then the (reduced) washrooms were filthy by the end of the flight, can't imaine what it would be like when it is full.

Ah, right you are. I thought I saw Premium Economy seats, but I think I was mistaken. It was indeed this (http://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Air_Canada/Air_Canada_Boeing_777-300.php) configuration rather than this one (http://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Air_Canada/Air_Canada_Boeing_777-300ER_77W_new.php). Noisy plane, but quite comfortable. I suppose I still don't want to experience the HD version, based on all the comments. :)

Great flight onboard LAN 787-8 to IPC last night. Dreamliner is so much ahead of old planes when it comes to passanger comfort and I couldn't make a difference between AC and LAN 787-8. AC perhaps has a better entertainment system but LAN has better service. Warm dinner on a 5 hour domestic flight was a nice surprise.

Next up, two B787-9 return flights on LAN and Air Canada. :)

thebus
Nov 11, 2015, 6:18 AM
http://airlineroute.net/2015/11/11/ac-sfolax-s16/

From 01MAY16, Air Canada mainline to operate following routes, instead of rouge:

Vancouver – Los Angeles 5 daily A320 (4 on Saturdays)
Vancouver – San Francisco 5 daily A320 (4 on Saturdays)

With the service adjustment, Air Canada will not be offering Boeing 767 operation on Vancouver – Los Angeles sector in summer 2016 season.

YVR going to all mainline to LAX, SFO but with no widebody service offered. How does this compare to current frequencies?

Johnny Aussie
Nov 11, 2015, 6:35 AM
YVR going to all mainline to LAX, SFO but with no widebody service offered. How does this compare to current frequencies?

Last summer YVR-LAX was 5 daily on rouge - one of those was a 763.
YVR-SFO was 4 daily so that's being bumped up to 5 daily as well.

Winter YVR-SFO remains 4 daily but YVR-LAX drops to 3 daily (one being a 763).

*****

EXPANSION

From what I read about expansion at YVR... By 2020:

Pier D to be extended west with 5 gates added.
Pier A to be extended east with 5 gates added.
Pier B to be given a big overhaul and likely more gates added.

Then they need to decide what they are going to do post 2020.

With Sea Island's water table so high may as well scratch the satellite to the west as tunnelling would be an engineering nightmare and $$$$.
The downside to only extending the current piers even further (after the expansions to 2020) would be not building additional terminal space to cope with all the additional gates. Unless they think most of the passenger volume increase would be coming from connection pax and not O&D.
The Eastern option makes the most sense.

osirisboy
Nov 11, 2015, 6:26 PM
Didn they just finish totally redoing pier b?

Cage
Nov 12, 2015, 12:04 AM
Didn they just finish totally redoing pier b?

Only half of pier B got replaced, and the part that got replaced was the better half. The end of pier B has been neglected since the days of PWA 737-200 Jurassics trolling the water around BC.

Speaking of waters, I think that YVRAA should run a ferry service between main terminal building and the post 2020 satelite terminal. They could either partner up with BC Ferries or go the individual route with Gondolas.

trofirhen
Nov 12, 2015, 1:10 AM
..................
EXPANSION

From what I read about expansion at YVR... By 2020:

Pier D to be extended west with 5 gates added.
Pier A to be extended east with 5 gates added.
Pier B to be given a big overhaul and likely more gates added.

Then they need to decide what they are going to do post 2020.

With Sea Island's water table so high may as well scratch the satellite to the west as tunnelling would be an engineering nightmare and $$$$.
The downside to only extending the current piers even further (after the expansions to 2020) would be not building additional terminal space to cope with all the additional gates. Unless they think most of the passenger volume increase would be coming from connection pax and not O&D.
The Eastern option makes the most sense.

Don't you remember that in his Board of Trade address, he stated that the Eastern option, was problematic in that, if build horizontally AND vertically goung north,
that his, with planes parked all around it would be damaging to businesses
immediately adjacent, and therefore not a good option.

He favoured the "CENTRAL" (green colored) option which includes lengthening all the existing piers, and extending the building East in a lengthy way, without going north.
It's in the video, and is excplicit on this.

nname
Nov 12, 2015, 5:01 PM
Tianjin Airlines plans 4 weekly Chongqing - Tianjin - Vancouver with A330 from June 2016

I'm guessing the Hainan's proposal was rejected? They now applying for Beijing-Calgary starting June.

(Chinese Source from CAAC (http://www.caac.gov.cn/C1/201511/t20151112_83006.html))

Seems like Hainan and Tianjin Airlines are under the same parent company. Tianjin Airlines currently do not own or have any A330 on order, nor have anything else that can fly to Vancouver. Where are they going to get the planes from? Transfer from Hainan?

Johnny Aussie
Nov 12, 2015, 6:02 PM
I'm guessing the Hainan's proposal was rejected? They now applying for Beijing-Calgary starting June.

(Chinese Source from CAAC (http://www.caac.gov.cn/C1/201511/t20151112_83006.html))

Seems like Hainan and Tianjin Airlines are under the same parent company. Tianjin Airlines currently do not own or have any A330 on order, nor have anything else that can fly to Vancouver. Where are they going to get the planes from? Transfer from Hainan?

Hainan is just going gang busters with expansion.

Not sure if Hainan has been rejected, certainly possible, but perhaps two applications hoping to get one approved.

And there is the missing link to Chongqing if this one gets approved.

There have just been soooooo many CAAC application announcements in the last few months to everywhere in the world..Hard to keep track!

hoboman27
Nov 12, 2015, 6:15 PM
Hainan is just going gang busters with expansion.

Not sure if Hainan has been rejected, certainly possible, but perhaps two applications hoping to get one approved.

And there is the missing link to Chongqing if this one gets approved.

There have just been soooooo many CAAC application announcements in the last few months to everywhere in the whole.. Hard to keep track!

Hmm interesting, so maybe that's how YYC got Hainan's service and their A330s

Johnny Aussie
Nov 12, 2015, 6:24 PM
Hmm interesting, so maybe that's how YYC got Hainan's service and their A330s

I think Hainan to YYC has been in the works for a while.

Hainan has plenty of aircraft available for expansion.

And I edited my last post... Sometimes not til I read somebody's post quoting mine do I see errors.

********

Soooo IF this all happens.... direct flights to:

Beijing
Shanghai
Guangzhou
Hong Kong
Tianjin
Shenyang
Shenzhen
Kunming
Chengdu
Chongqing
Xiamen

Bloody hell... What's next?

Wuhan
Fuzhou
Xi'an
Qingdao
Harbin
Nanjing
Hangzhou

Seems rather limitless now.... Who would have thunk it?!

Denscity
Nov 12, 2015, 9:31 PM
YVR is already the North American king of flights to Asia what's next is right!!

trofirhen
Nov 12, 2015, 9:45 PM
I think Hainan to YYC has been in the works for a while.

Hainan has plenty of aircraft available for expansion.

............................

Bloody hell... What's next?

Wuhan
Fuzhou
Xi'an
Qingdao
Harbin
Nanjing
Hangzhou

Seems rather limitless now.... Who would have thunk it?!
Is this for real??? Wheewww!!!!

nname
Nov 12, 2015, 10:24 PM
Bloody hell... What's next?

Wuhan
Fuzhou
Xi'an
Qingdao
Harbin
Nanjing
Hangzhou

Seems rather limitless now.... Who would have thunk it?!

Or Macau.

Remember the Metis TransPacific (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metis_TransPacific_Airlines)? :D

Johnny Aussie
Nov 13, 2015, 4:38 AM
Or Macau.

Remember the Metis TransPacific (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metis_TransPacific_Airlines)? :D

Forgotten about that total sham!

So many alarm bells yet people still thought it was legit.

Hourglass
Nov 13, 2015, 6:42 AM
Hainan is just going gang busters with expansion.

Not sure if Hainan has been rejected, certainly possible, but perhaps two applications hoping to get one approved.

And there is the missing link to Chongqing if this one gets approved.

There have just been soooooo many CAAC application announcements in the last few months to everywhere in the world..Hard to keep track!

Speaking of Hainan Airlines and YVR, here's an interesting piece of news from today about the proposed route to Tianjin:

http://www.chinaaviationdaily.com/news/48/48824.html

Looks to be still on track.

Hot Rod
Nov 13, 2015, 8:51 AM
very nice.

I would assume it would route as Chongqing-Tianjin-Vancouver and not the way they are saying it (TJ-CQ-YVR). Great news nonetheless, I wonder why subsidiary Tianjin and Hainan doesn't do it.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 13, 2015, 9:17 AM
very nice.

I would assume it would route as Chongqing-Tianjin-Vancouver and not the way they are saying it (TJ-CQ-YVR). Great news nonetheless, I wonder why subsidiary Tianjin and Hainan doesn't do it.

Not fully understanding the one airline one route policy in China. Maybe, just maybe, they allow airlines under the same group to operate from the same city.

Since Tianjin Airlines is a subsidiary of Hainan, maybe in the eyes of CAAC, they would allow both to fly TSN-YVR.

Perhaps they would use HU to operate just TSN-YVR and then Tianjin Airlines CKG-TSN-YVR as a way to get a direct CKG-YVR route.

However, based on both applications that would be 9 weekly from TSN-YVR which would appear to be a lot for a startup route.

In any event the question regarding equipment was answered in the China Daily article. Definitely acquiring the A330s from Hainan.

And if the Tianjin Airlines route does get approved it would be their first overseas route... Just like YVR was Sichuan's first overseas route.

Who would have thought the little fishing village of Vancouver would be so popular and in demand from so many different airlines???

Hourglass
Nov 13, 2015, 9:18 AM
very nice.

I would assume it would route as Chongqing-Tianjin-Vancouver and not the way they are saying it (TJ-CQ-YVR). Great news nonetheless, I wonder why subsidiary Tianjin and Hainan doesn't do it.

Correct. Here's a link to the bulletin itself (in Simplified Chinese): http://www.caac.gov.cn/C1/201511/t20151112_83006.html

Running it through Google Translate: "Tianjin Airlines Company Limited application since June 2016, the opening of Chongqing - Tianjin - Vancouver round-trip passenger flights, four flights a week, using the model A330."

Don't know why it's Tianjin Airlines, either, as I didn't think they had any widebody aircraft capable of flying to North America.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 13, 2015, 9:30 AM
Correct. Here's a link to the bulletin itself (in Simplified Chinese): http://www.caac.gov.cn/C1/201511/t20151112_83006.html

Running it through Google Translate: "Tianjin Airlines Company Limited application since June 2016, the opening of Chongqing - Tianjin - Vancouver round-trip passenger flights, four flights a week, using the model A330."

Don't know why it's Tianjin Airlines, either, as I didn't think they had any widebody aircraft capable of flying to North America.

In the China Daily article this is answered they are acquiring an A330 from Hainan. Either a new one they will transfer to Tianjin or perhaps a current one.

Hourglass
Nov 13, 2015, 9:46 AM
In the China Daily article this is answered they are acquiring an A330 from Hainan. Either a new one they will transfer to Tianjin or perhaps a current one.

Ah, didn't see the China Daily article. Thx Johnny

Denscity
Nov 13, 2015, 7:04 PM
Sounds like YEGs rumoured new flight is to Asia and goes through YVR. I wonder where its going?

nname
Nov 13, 2015, 7:45 PM
Sounds like YEGs rumoured new flight is to Asia and goes through YVR. I wonder where its going?

More hints from the thread:
- its 3x weekly flight
- start in next March
- the airiness already serve 2 cities in Canada
- its not EVA Air

If its some airlines from China, there would be a CAAC application by now?

ANA, Japan Airlines, and China Airlines only serves YVR

That's leave only Cathay Pacific, Philippine Airlines, and Korean Air.

Maybe PR will increase YVR back to 11x weekly? Maybe KE will increase to daily year-round? Maybe CX will increase back to 17x weekly and fly some of their new A350 (due in Feb) here? Seems to be good for YVR either way :D

sacrifice333
Nov 13, 2015, 7:55 PM
I'm thinking out loud here... but all we need is BKK (Bangkok), SIN (Singapore), and KUL (Kuala Lumpur) and we'd pretty much be the defacto North American Asian-city airline hub! :tup:

What other major Asian cities would you want on the list of non-stops?

Johnny Aussie
Nov 13, 2015, 8:10 PM
More hints from the thread:
- its 3x weekly flight
- start in next March
- the airiness already serve 2 cities in Canada
- its not EVA Air

If its some airlines from China, there would be a CAAC application by now?

ANA, Japan Airlines, and China Airlines only serves YVR

That's leave only Cathay Pacific, Philippine Airlines, and Korean Air.

Maybe PR will increase YVR back to 11x weekly? Maybe KE will increase to daily year-round? Maybe CX will increase back to 17x weekly and fly some of their new A350 (due in Feb) here? Seems to be good for YVR either way :D

Yeah this speculation has been going for awhile. It's been fun trying to figure it out. I was leaning to EVA as the scheduling and frequencies seemed to fit the model. But since that has been ruled out...

And apparently a CAAC approval is not needed so rule out the Chinese carriers. It would be needed as adding a new foreign city requires approval for Chinese carriers.

Just to add it will be a late evening departure from YEG which obviously means a late evening departure from YVR too.

So if it is KE that would mean they would either be switching some (or all) flights to a late night departure (less likely) or be adding more flights (more likely). Perhaps daily early afternoon departure YVR only then adding a 3 weekly evening flight that originates in YEG. Very few KE NA flights leave in the evenings... Almost all leave in the afternoon. So adding evening flights from YVR would appear unlikely. In addition, it's been publicly stated their growth plans to NA are on hold at the moment. So unlikely it's KE anyway.

CX and PR would also fit into the model as you suggest.

PR has really struggled to make YYZ viable and are reducing it to thrice weekly only when they do the next sched change in March... And as we all know the Filipino population in YYZ is just massive. Yes we don't know the yields but I'm sure would be very low and you would have to have huge VFR volumes to make it work. Also, since the new YEG service is to commence in March which is when PR is cancelling the three weekly standalone flights and reducing YYZ to three weekly... Only to add the YVR terminating flights back again would be very odd. They would have just kept them to sell and then just add on YEG when announced. Even if a schedule change were needed this scenario would be strange. Just don't see this is as a viable plan if this happens.
As of 2011 Filipino population by metro area Stats Canada:
YYZ 230,000
YVR 112,000
YWG 57,000
YYC 50,000
YEG 40,000

So maybe it is CX then?

Canadian74
Nov 13, 2015, 9:07 PM
I'm thinking out loud here... but all we need is BKK (Bangkok), SIN (Singapore), and KUL (Kuala Lumpur) and we'd pretty much be the defacto North American Asian-city airline hub! :tup:

What other major Asian cities would you want on the list of non-stops?

DEL
and for Europe, IST

Johnny Aussie
Nov 13, 2015, 9:18 PM
DEL
and for Europe, IST

DEL is more of a when than an if.

Not putting too much into the AC Investor Day 2018 network opportunity map..... But...

Edit: interesting little note... The 2018 Network opportunity map shown at the Investor Day presentation and the one used at the Boyd Conference in August is slightly different. The former one has BKK linked nonstop to YYZ, the latter one has BKK linked nonstop to YVR.

YVR-TPE I see as more likely than not.
YVR-NGO on rouge is more likely.
YVR-SIN the more I think about it... I'm going out on a limb but the more I think this may actually be something that does eventuate... With the correct equipment it just might work.
YVR-BKK happening much less likely... Despite BKK being the large Star Alliance hub for TG. I would be surprised though.

As for Europe I still see YVR-CDG and YVR-FRA as likely routes. CDG perhaps rouge and FRA perhaps a Dreamliner route.

Hot Rod
Nov 14, 2015, 8:37 AM
Johnny, Im a little confused with your previous post and your intended position.

doesn't YVR already have TPE flights? I wouldn't count that as a new opportunity when two airlines already serve the route. or are you saying that TPE would be a new route for AC. I'd love to see Kaohsiung get some YVR love, personally - a city very similar to YVR.

I agree that the return of Singapore, the addition of Bangkok, maybe a Rouge to NGO, and Ill throw this out there - Vietnam Airlines (Saigon perhaps); along with the China announcements and likely more, Vancouver would be the undisputed NA gateway to Asia.

trofirhen
Nov 14, 2015, 9:26 AM
DEL
and for Europe, IST
I think IST would be great, too.

Hourglass
Nov 14, 2015, 10:14 AM
Johnny, Im a little confused with your previous post and your intended position.

doesn't YVR already have TPE flights? I wouldn't count that as a new opportunity when two airlines already serve the route. or are you saying that TPE would be a new route for AC. I'd love to see Kaohsiung get some YVR love, personally - a city very similar to YVR.

I agree that the return of Singapore, the addition of Bangkok, maybe a Rouge to NGO, and Ill throw this out there - Vietnam Airlines (Saigon perhaps); along with the China announcements and likely more, Vancouver would be the undisputed NA gateway to Asia.

Jakarta **cough cough**. Huge population, growing economy, and a plenty of resources industries. Vietnam probably more likely, though neither likely to happen anytime soon.

In addition to NGO, I'd love to see flights start up again to Fukuoka (recall CP did this route ages ago?).

Now SQ is getting their A350s, maybe the economics could work for a nonstop SIN flight.

BKK might make sense for AC since Thai seems to be pulling back from North America. Perhaps a codeshare with TG? More sense for Rouge given likely high levels of leisure traffic, although I guess Rouge doesn't have the aircraft to do this.

Gordon
Nov 14, 2015, 3:12 PM
How about Bamgkok via Singapore.
The extension to pier A any one know if it will end up being like the AC regional \commuter terminal

EdmontonTraveller
Nov 14, 2015, 5:12 PM
Flew home via YVR on WS 1755 from SNA on Wednesday. Was surprised to find some pilot project going on where I did not claim connecting luggage at Canada Customs. Was directed over to Canada Connections for formalities then guided past the AC connections desk and dumped landside beside the totem. The AC desk was open, but it appeared that I couldn't use AC's shortcut so had to re-clear security at A/B.

Wish I had asked some questions, but I was travelling with some very impatient flyers. Anyone have details on how the baggage piece works? Image the baggage at SNA??? Or simply go hunting for any pieces CBSA wants to inspect based solely on interview? It appears that CBSA had manifest w/ checked luggage info, but not certain.

How long has this pilot been running?

Has anyone tested NEXUS line(s) vs. AC Canada Connections @ YVR to see which is more consistent/faster?

Cage
Nov 14, 2015, 10:45 PM
Flew home via YVR on WS 1755 from SNA on Wednesday. Was surprised to find some pilot project going on where I did not claim connecting luggage at Canada Customs. Was directed over to Canada Connections for formalities then guided past the AC connections desk and dumped landside beside the totem. The AC desk was open, but it appeared that I couldn't use AC's shortcut so had to re-clear security at A/B.

Wish I had asked some questions, but I was travelling with some very impatient flyers. Anyone have details on how the baggage piece works? Image the baggage at SNA??? Or simply go hunting for any pieces CBSA wants to inspect based solely on interview? It appears that CBSA had manifest w/ checked luggage info, but not certain.

How long has this pilot been running?

Has anyone tested NEXUS line(s) vs. AC Canada Connections @ YVR to see which is more consistent/faster?

There are separate USA to Canada connections procedures for AC and WS. Your pilot project appears to be an attempt at bringing WS onto the AC connections experience.

AC connections experience has one going through primary inspection line (that all of Nexus, Automated Passport Kiosks, or traditional CBSA border guard), pick up luggage, follow signs for Canada Connections, drop bag at the bag belt (unless connection is within 45 minutes) and proceed to level 4 for AC connections desk (if your connection is less than 45 minutes) or through domestic connections security. Once through domestic connections security on takes an elevator down to level three by concourse C.

WS connections experience is traditionally that one has to go through primary inspection line, picked up luggage, and exited through the same line as Vancouver pax. The Westjet connections counter was then located in the international reception lounge along with cruise ship connections.

From your description, it looks like WS is trying out emulating the AC experience.

Yes you could have used AC short cut and gone through the AC connections security lane. Infact I have used that connections security line when coming off the RAV/Canada line. At the piont you are at AC connections desk, that area is considered landside and is not part of the secure terminal area.

My latest complaint with YVR security is that they constantly use the Nexus lane for training purposes. So it is among the slowest lanes in the airport. I was last through YVR at the beginning of the month and should have used the connections security lane.

twoNeurons
Nov 15, 2015, 3:23 AM
Jakarta **cough cough**. Huge population, growing economy, and a plenty of resources industries. Vietnam probably more likely, though neither likely to happen anytime soon.

In addition to NGO, I'd love to see flights start up again to Fukuoka (recall CP did this route ages ago?).

Now SQ is getting their A350s, maybe the economics could work for a nonstop SIN flight.

BKK might make sense for AC since Thai seems to be pulling back from North America. Perhaps a codeshare with TG? More sense for Rouge given likely high levels of leisure traffic, although I guess Rouge doesn't have the aircraft to do this.

Wow... CP did FUK? I'd like to see Busan, Korea. As well as Saigon, Singapore (obviously) and Manila.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 15, 2015, 3:31 AM
Wow... CP did FUK? I'd like to see Busan, Korea. As well as Saigon, Singapore (obviously) and Manila.

CP did NRT and NGO.
AC did KIX.

I'm pretty sure YVR never had a scheduled link to FUK. The odd charter though yes.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 15, 2015, 3:37 AM
Yukon's hometown airline has just updated their summer 2016 schedules.

Perhaps noticing a bit of slow down with northern travel?

YVR-YXY being cut from 13 to 12 weekly.

YYC/YEG-YXY being cut from 6 to 3 weekly.

Always subject to change of course.....

Westjet holding on to its three weekly YVR-YXY as its stands now.

Johnny Aussie
Nov 15, 2015, 3:40 AM
Johnny, Im a little confused with your previous post and your intended position.

doesn't YVR already have TPE flights? I wouldn't count that as a new opportunity when two airlines already serve the route. or are you saying that TPE would be a new route for AC. I'd love to see Kaohsiung get some YVR love, personally - a city very similar to YVR.

Sorry.. I should have clarified. Yes, I mean AC adds its own flights to TPE. I would add CAN as well, but AC has that city connected nonstop to YYZ in their 2018 network opportunity map. How dare they!!

Hot Rod
Nov 15, 2015, 6:27 AM
Neurons, we already have Manila. :)

Hourglass, I was also thinking Jakarta as the last major city missing from our list + Kuala Lampor. But I didn't list it becasue I think it is somewhat of a longshot unless it could be combined with Bangkok or Vietnam. I wouldn't want to delay those two higher potential routes just to also get Jakarta though, nothing wrong with connecting from SIN, BKK, or SGN. :)

For Pacific routes, I think we talked about Brisbane (which is coming, right?) but Melbourne is the missing whale and possibly Perth. Should YVR go after a Guam flight and maybe somewhere else in the middle of the Pacific? Guam is a huge United (Continental) hub, A/C should make a go of it and I think Rouge would work.

What about Russia? I am so surprised there never seems to be any interest in Russia flights even though Vancouver is the closest major city in NA to Russia. Isn't there also a Russian population in the city? I'm surprised no Aeroflot and no AC interest. ...

.....

Exciting times for YVR - we're coming up with exotic locations and not even worried about adding any more Europe.

trofirhen
Nov 15, 2015, 11:49 AM
Neurons, we already have Manila. :)
.....
Exciting times for YVR - we're coming up with exotic locations and not even worried about adding any more Europe.

My only exception to that would be adding Istanbul;)