[Evo5Boise]

Has anyone noticed the progress on Boise's soon to be tallest building? I noticed the new control tower at the Boise Airport is starting to emerge on the horizon.

I could see it from I-84 on my way back into town from the east.

Didn't have my camera with me, but look's like they are moving along!! :banana: :banana:

Wow I forgot about that. I haven't been out that way in awhile.

[Boizean]

Has anyone noticed the progress on Boise's soon to be tallest building? I noticed the new control tower at the Boise Airport is starting to emerge on the horizon.
Yes I have. I happen to drive by it every day. If I can remember I'll snap a couple of pics tomorrow afternoon.

Here's the rendering of it.

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/7135/boitowerrs3.jpg

[Boisebro]

Thanks, and you're welcome! :cheers:

I check this board almost daily, but just haven't had any reason to chime in. Not much going on around here these days other that depressing news about projects being cancelled, delayed, or downsized. :(

BTW, I'm not the only poster that's gone AWOL. What has become of Boisebro? He must still be around 'cause he posts regularly over on BroncoCountry.

Where ya at bro'?:shrug:

oh, i've been lurking. but like others, i've been disappointed in the lack of movement on so many projects, downsizing of others, legal issues, etc.

but it's not just the projects. it's more than that -- it seems that boise is hemorrhaging jobs. first it was ore-ida years ago skipping town, then boise cascade sale/downsize, albertsons buyout, washington group, micron layoffs, HP is a fraction of the size it was 10 years ago... it's not a sign of a healthy corporate community. and it's depressing.

and while there are good things happening (jefferson, aspen, news of the transit center), there are still too many bad things (delayed road improvements, boise tower debacle, lack of movement on mission site tower, downsizing of whole foods tower, convention center questions, library blocks still not underway, etc.)

i try to post from time to time, but it's becoming more and more difficult to be optimistic that boise will see progress in its skyline.

as for the whole foods redesign, i think it's "okay." nothing real groundbreaking to me. my two main issues are 1) earth tones again. blech. somebody get them a memo that we already have our city quota of earth-toned buildings downtown. and 2) they're missing the boat if they don't make the residential half taller. people pay for views, and that location almost guarantees a north, east and south view for the foreseeable future (i.e. nobody's going to build south, east or north of there to block their view anytime soon.) they'd be better off having the residential portion taller and skinner... maybe even with the same number of units... but give the residents units that are at or above the surrounding structures. that'd be a big part of their selling point, because where else can you all but guarantee a view?

anyway, i hope i'm not a stranger on the boards much in the future, but that depends on good news coming from boise. big news. exciting news like cranes in the air, not just ink on paper and hot air in the wind.

give me cranes. then i dance. :banana:

give me status quo... then i :yuck:

cheers, all. :cheers:

[Evo5Boise]

as for the whole foods redesign, i think it's "okay." nothing real groundbreaking to me. my two main issues are 1) earth tones again. blech. somebody get them a memo that we already have our city quota of earth-toned buildings downtown. and 2) they're missing the boat if they don't make the residential half taller. people pay for views, and that location almost guarantees a north, east and south view for the foreseeable future (i.e. nobody's going to build south, east or north of there to block their view anytime soon.) they'd be better off having the residential portion taller and skinner... maybe even with the same number of units... but give the residents units that are at or above the surrounding structures. that'd be a big part of their selling point, because where else can you all but guarantee a view?





I couldn't agree more.

[el conquistador]

I'm actually thinking that Boise is weathering the craptastic economy pretty well. We have two projects underway downtown, one of which is large-scale (for the area). Sounds like office vacancies DT are low as well. Yeah, building are gettin hacked down, but they are because, as much a some don't like hearing this, Boise's area is just not yet ready for the big stuff. IMO, as long as surface lots are getting covered and the 'sandlots' between Front and Myrtle start getting some activity, I'm happy. As for the jobs, welcome to globalization. What is disconcerting for me is the lack of movement in the Treasure Valley to attract another large satellite branch of some conglomo-corp. But, a couple things that will help that in the future are the community college (low cost alternative to training a workforce), and someone finally tuning in to all the national ratings for Boise and being business friendly. When the Treasure Valley can start pumping out skilled workers, it will make a company's decision much easier to settle in. You can thank our do-nothing legislature for hurting the city in regards to infrastructure, education, etc., so it is up to the region to get past that and progress. And I think the people here are aware of that and calling for change.

[Cottonwood]

Boise seems to be doing better than alot of other cities in the current economic conditions and even though some corp. headquarters have shuffled and downsized or moved, this city still has a large corporate headquarters presence and even moreso than several larger cities. What is happening in Boise is the same as is happening all over American so we are not unique in the fact that some jobs are taken overseas. America isn't the powerhouse it used to be. The press has stated that the valleys job growth is booming in the smaller companies who expand or move here. I think the smaller companies are a safer bet for a secure economy than a bunch of large corporate headquarters that get bought out or downsize.
Boise can really gain from the depressed national economy because large companies are going to want to relocate and find a more cost effective city to set up shop in and Boise is usually a contender until our hick governor opens his mouth.

[el conquistador]

Boise can really gain from the depressed national economy because large companies are going to want to relocate and find a more cost effective city to set up shop in and Boise is usually a contender until our hick governor opens his mouth.

Ain't that the truth. And sometimes I feel he tries to 'punish' Boise because he doesn't like Bieter. This parochial, authoritarian bullshit towards Boise by the damn republican leadership is ridiculous. This state needs more balance (note, not a swing the other way, just more balance) if it wants to truly progress.

[Cottonwood]

Looky here, an aerial construction tour at KTVB.COM




http://www.ktvb.com/perl/common/slideshow/sspop.pl?recid=9835&location=www.ktvb.com



http://www.ktvb.com/images/slideshow/may1408-aerial/images/aspen3.jpg

[Boizean]

Good to hear your still lurking around Boisebro. Yes the news is depressing, I agree. It seems like as soon as things are about to really start developing downtown some economic downturn takes place just in time to prevent it.



Well I did remember to get a pic of the airport tower but as things will go...my card reader will not transfer any images. :irked:

Oh well, I see KTVB has done a tour which includes the airport tower (not as far along though).

KTVB pics (http://www.ktvb.com/perl/common/slideshow/sspop.pl?recid=9835&location=www.ktvb.com)
KTVB video (http://www.ktvb.com/video/index.html?nvid=244948)

[alphawolf]

as for the whole foods redesign, i think it's "okay." nothing real groundbreaking to me. my two main issues are 1) earth tones again. blech. somebody get them a memo that we already have our city quota of earth-toned buildings downtown. and 2) they're missing the boat if they don't make the residential half taller. people pay for views, and that location almost guarantees a north, east and south view for the foreseeable future (i.e. nobody's going to build south, east or north of there to block their view anytime soon.) they'd be better off having the residential portion taller and skinner... maybe even with the same number of units... but give the residents units that are at or above the surrounding structures. that'd be a big part of their selling point, because where else can you all but guarantee a view?

Exactly how I feel too. Its good to see your's and other's opinions around here again.

[Evo5Boise]

Ya I saw KTVB's project air tour on the news last night. Funny thing is they kept saying the Aspen was 18 stories when I thought it was only supposed to be 17. ????

[Boizean]

Funny thing is they kept saying the Aspen was 18 stories when I thought it was only supposed to be 17. ????
It is only supposed to be 17 floors.

It would be shocking if a Boise project actually increased by just one floor! How sad. :(

[Boiseguy]

I think the whole boise place situation has everyone down in the dumps.. the reality is.. the economy nationwide is shit.. and that effects everyone when it comes to lending for large scale projects. I think the fact that boise is seeing a 17 story tower rise out of the ground is a good thing, I think that as soon as the convention center and hotel are built, things will change. By that time the economy will have rebounded, or atleast credit options... there's still lots of people moving here... and that is what drives developement. If gas prices start getting out of control like they have been.. Nampa/Caldwell don't seem so affordable and reasonable anymore.... as for the Hotel, who cares really if its downsized.. its still going to be built.. and that's one less dirt lot downtown...we need to get more infill downtown so that large scale buildings are proposed. I mean downtown is flanked on one side by the river and bsu.. on two other sides historic districts and neighborhoods, and to the west is the river as well. If some cheap ass wants to build a 6 story building downtown to cover a dirt lot.. good on him...whether its part of the skyline or not.. it will definetely add vibrancy, which in turn produces more demand for downtown locations... If all the dirt lots are filled up with midrises...then the only feasible way to develope further is to go up.. and go up big...
I don't think we should be worrying too much...boise shouldn't be sitting here trying to win over every single big company that's looking to relocate.. because we are sitting on hundreds of smaller companies with huge potential, that believe it or not... are loyal to the area.... Basically as a tax payer.. do you want to hire someone from within that you trust and know can do the job? or do you want to take the risk in outside resources that are fickle and aloof? Micron is a prime example of a local company that grew here, by being fostered in the local economy.. there are lots of other companies that are capable of doing the same thing... but aren't given the chance because our leaders are looking for a "quick fix" If something sounds too good to be true.. then it probably is... Microsoft would not be considering an expansion here in boise if they didn't realize the potential and threat of our technolgoy sector, If they are recognizing it so much so that they would consider choosing Boise over Denver, then perhaps our leaders should be recognizing it too rather than sitting here with thumbs in their ass assuming they chose idaho because we have good potatoes and pretty mountains :rolleyes:

[Evo5Boise]

If gas prices start getting out of control like they have been.. Nampa/Caldwell don't seem so affordable and reasonable anymore....

Main you nailed it! I am currently looking to buy a house. The woman and I actually looked in a Caldwell neighborhood (where my friend built) because it is just so damn cheap. But being that our lives are wrapped around Boise, that is alot of commuting. And when we factor in gas costs to and from work and etc; You might as well pay a few hundred dollars more in a mortgage payment to live closer.

[Boiseguy]

Main you nailed it! I am currently looking to buy a house. The woman and I actually looked in a Caldwell neighborhood (where my friend built) because it is just so damn cheap. But being that our lives are wrapped around Boise, that is alot of commuting. And when we factor in gas costs to and from work and etc; You might as well pay a few hundred dollars more in a mortgage payment to live closer.

I lived in Sydney Australia back in the late 90's and many of my friends questioned how I afforded it, simple.. I didn't have to own a car... no car payment, no car insurance, no petrol costs, which amounted to almost 200 dollars per week I didn't have to fork out... Granted sydney had mass transportation and trains, but even going to the supermarket and daily arrands requires a car in the suburbs... but living in a city center that is well established.. you really don't need a car at all.. If I ventured out of the city on the weekend.. I could rent a car downtown for 50 bucks for the weekend

[Evo5Boise]

I lived in Sydney Australia back in the late 90's and many of my friends questioned how I afforded it, simple.. I didn't have to own a car... no car payment, no car insurance, no petrol costs, which amounted to almost 200 dollars per week I didn't have to fork out... Granted sydney had mass transportation and trains, but even going to the supermarket and daily arrands requires a car in the suburbs... but living in a city center that is well established.. you really don't need a car at all.. If I ventured out of the city on the weekend.. I could rent a car downtown for 50 bucks for the weekend

Man, that is one place in the world I want to visit before I die. Australia in general really.

[boisecynic]

Now on youtube, the whole 1970 Bill Onweiler aerial Greenbelt promotional video, from which came the screencaps I posted last week.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dskPRdi2k9I

http://i32.tinypic.com/jfxlrl.png

[BrianInBoise]

[QUOTE=boisecynic;3555094]Now on youtube, the whole 1970 Bill Onweiler aerial Greenbelt promotional video, from which came the screencaps I posted last week.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dskPRdi2k9I

That was awesome to watch. I am a frequent user of the Greenbelt and I cannot image what our City would be like without. Thank God for the people who had the foresight to make it happen.

One thing I noticed in the video was, compared to current day, the lack of trees along the River, especially near downtown. Amazing to see how much the city has changed in 40 years.

[Sawtooth]

Head downtown and hang out at the green expo.
It you take your bike there is free bike valet parking. And there is some downtown development news too with a solar powered stage planned in the near future for The Grove Plaza.

mmmmmmmmmmm greens!




http://www.idahogreenexpo.org/

[boisecynic]

I was there earlier, test drove one of those electric mopeds. It was kinda cool but a bit gutless, but I'm kinda heavy too.

[jard]

Main you nailed it! I am currently looking to buy a house. The woman and I actually looked in a Caldwell neighborhood (where my friend built) because it is just so damn cheap. But being that our lives are wrapped around Boise, that is alot of commuting. And when we factor in gas costs to and from work and etc; You might as well pay a few hundred dollars more in a mortgage payment to live closer.

Hey Chris, let me know if you need a lender, my sister is in the business, she will hook you up right.

[BrianInBoise]

Ya I saw KTVB's project air tour on the news last night. Funny thing is they kept saying the Aspen was 18 stories when I thought it was only supposed to be 17. ????

Found this on the Aspen website news update:

http://www.theaspen.net/news.html

18 floors indeed. Also to note, they only have seven condos left... this fact has to get some of these other stalled project of the ground... no?:shrug:

[Boizean]

18 floors indeed.
Nice catch Brian! I wonder if this increases the overall height or if each floor is just shorter. It was slated to be 194' at 17 floors, at 18 floors could this extra floor push it to 205'+-? Will we ever know?

[boi2socal]

That same page says they're pouring the 12, 14, and 15th floor (no 13th floor). So I'm guessing techincally there are 17 floors.

[jard]

That same page says they're pouring the 12, 14, and 15th floor (no 13th floor). So I'm guessing techincally there are 17 floors.

Oh, good find. I hate it when the do that.

[Boizean]

That same page says they're pouring the 12, 14, and 15th floor (no 13th floor). So I'm guessing techincally there are 17 floors.
:doh: Figures! I should have known better.

[boisecynic]

Interesting Aspen info guys.

I think this might interest some of you. The City of Boise's website has a cool mapping feature. One of the things it can do is measure distance and area. To make measurements, look for the red button, hovering the cursor over it will tell you it's advanced tools, click it to reveal new buttons.

http://www.cityofboise.org/Departments/IT/GISAndMapping/InteractiveMaps/index.aspx

Scroll down to the "Boise Interactive Mapping System " link.

[rudimentalist]

Glass panels, going up, on the Aspen, right now. Anyone have a camera handy for the drive home?

[Cottonwood]

WaterCooler project opens in Downtown Boise


http://www.idahostatesman.com/business/story/388190.html

[Cottonwood]

Wine Tours.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/eyepiece/story/393240.html







Where are the updated pics of The Aspen?!?!?

[rudimentalist]

Testing, one, two... (tap, tap) Is this thing on?

Slow week. Wish I owned a camera. I ride past The Jefferson and The Aspen every day, and they look great.

[boisecynic]

By popular demand, Aspen glass facade pics, 5-29:

http://i29.tinypic.com/24ymxwh.jpg

http://i26.tinypic.com/2w5ri20.jpg

Bonus Pics:

http://i27.tinypic.com/10e0t8w.jpg

This guy has been on PBS on the Oregon Field Guide show. He drove all the way over to surf the 36th Street play wave (Settler's Canal?). Pic from greenbelt on Garden City side, Clocktower Pond in background. This was 5-18, flow between 6500 and 7000 CFS.

http://i25.tinypic.com/v8oemw.jpg

Downstream a bit further, the secondary diversion structure on the Farmer's Union Canal that sends excess water back to the Boise River.
http://i25.tinypic.com/2uorkf8.jpg

Downstream along that return channel, the new footbridges in Veterans Park. Look out, LOW clearance!
http://i29.tinypic.com/e0kizs.jpg

This week as of 5-29 river flow at about 1050 CFS, 36th St wave, same wave as the surfer dude above, much lower flow.
http://i26.tinypic.com/xcjiqb.jpg

[eastidaho]

Nice work BC, way to come through for the rest of us. :banana:

[Cottonwood]

Yes, thanks for the pictures Boisecynic.



Boise is becoming quite the Diva when it comes to top 10 city lists.




http://www.ktvb.com/news/localnews/stories/ktvbn-may2908-boise_ranking.4082d2f6.html

http://kiplinger.com/features/archives/2008/05/2008-best-city-boise.html

(notice they spelled Boiseans as Boisians)

ROCKY MOUNTAIN HIGH TECH

How do folks get any work done around here? The skiing, snowboarding, fishing, biking and kayaking in and around Boise are an almost irresistible temptation to desert your desk. Glance northward from the city's orderly downtown business and shopping district, and the majestic slopes of the Boise foothills beckon.

VIDEO EXTRA:

Take Our Walking Tour Through Boise

Those in search of classy entertainment may be surprised. Says Susan Thayer, who relocated four years ago from Albany, Ore., to run sales for Episciences, which makes Epionce skin products: "The city has evolved into a magnet for the arts." She and her spouse, Terry, frequent the theater, as well as Boise's own symphony, opera and dance companies.

When they're not casting a line or taking in a show, a growing number of Boisians work for local high-tech businesses, the fruits of which make up the state's biggest exports. Micron Technology and Hewlett-Packard are the Boise Valley's two largest employers. But the area also cradles smaller technology and e-commerce firms, which come to make the most of low business costs -- about a third less than in California or Washington.

Employers know they'll find a high proportion of college graduates here (37%, compared with the national average of 27%) and that new hires will find plenty of affordable housing. Explore Boise's eclectic mix of old and new neighborhoods and you'll find homes with a median price of $235,000. The average work commute is 18 minutes.

For those in search of a small-but-happening feel, the burgeoning suburb of Eagle is the place to go. Lloyd Mahaffey, previously an executive at Honeywell, Apple Computer and Verifone, moved to the former farming town in 2004, hoping to find a laid-back place where his kids could hunt and play tennis while he dabbled in winemaking and developed real estate.

Eagle's soil tests perfectly for the cultivation of red-wine grapes. Now Mahaffey is developing ten homes reminiscent of Italian villas, each with its own 4-acre vineyard. After visiting him in Eagle, several friends are planning to relocate to the area. Be advised: "When you first arrive, you have to downshift and adjust to a more relaxed pace," says Mahaffey.

NEXT: No. 5 -- Colorado Springs


Yeah Colorado Springs! your are next!

[boisecynic]

BC leaves the confines of the west end and mtn bikes the loooooonnng trek to the far flung hinterlands of Barber Park. EPC bridge gets some camera time. Sorry that the quality is worse than usual, all these pics were on my cell phone cam.

I included this because the UI ecohydraulics lab is going to work on the Boise River Recreation Park project.
http://i25.tinypic.com/awykbr.jpg

Inside the above building is this, the flume, I'm gonna try to get a tour when they mock up the whitewater features, so stay tuned. Photo from:

http://www.uidaho.edu/ecohydraulics/facilities.shtml
http://i29.tinypic.com/sw9vk7.jpg

On the way to Barber Park I made a side trip to WS Mesa, I know, I'm a mtn biking animal. I bought this lot while I was up there.:cool:
http://i29.tinypic.com/3520vp4.jpg

EPC Bridge from north bank greenbelt looking southwest.
http://i26.tinypic.com/25dlu.jpg

EPC Bridge project from south bank looking northeast.
http://i32.tinypic.com/29pxatz.jpg

The old tree is gone. Sawtooth, don't you have a file photo of this tree?
http://i30.tinypic.com/2mg6ull.jpg

But there's another monster maple just to the east:
http://i31.tinypic.com/x4n97a.jpg

3 hours later, I'm back in town and wait, WHAT'S THIS?
http://i28.tinypic.com/2wn5suf.jpg:cool:

[boisecynic]

I forgot to mention that I saw a chain link fence going up at 12th and Jefferson just west of Boise Plaza. Looks like they're going to build the garage there.

[In Boise]

:yes: Great photos Boisecynic! Thanks for posting!!!

[Boizean]

Glass is looking good! Ah heck! The whole Aspen project is looking good. :cool:

Only six more floors to go!

Thanks for the pics cynic.

[bathysphere]

here's an update on the jefferson taken 5/29. i think this building is going to be a really nice size for the part of downtown it is in. two more floors to go!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/cooling/JEFFERSON.jpg

oh, and i'm new here. i've been reading for quite some time, but finally decided to sign up. i also got a few pictures of the aspen, but boisecynic beat me to it. :worship:

[el conquistador]

Welcome aboard, Bathysphere! :banana:

[Cottonwood]

Convention Center news:

http://www.idahostatesman.com/boise/story/397132.html

[el conquistador]

Convention Center news:

http://www.idahostatesman.com/boise/story/397132.html

I was extrememly disappointed about the Discovery Center news. But, hopefully the new convention center will be good to go. This is getting weird IMO.

[Evo5Boise]

Come on Simplots. Build a nice litter tower. :D

[Boizean]

Yes indeed, welcome to the fray (or lack thereof) Bathysphere!

Now you can listen to the crickets with the rest of us. :cheers:

Nice pic of the Jefferson and I agree it's a good fit for that part of downtown at this time.

[alphawolf]

Come on Simplots. Build a nice litter tower. :D


They already have space leased in One Capital Center, so hopefully with that space and the offices off Federal Way coming together we should see something decently sized.

[BrianInBoise]

They already have space leased in One Capital Center, so hopefully with that space and the offices off Federal Way coming together we should see something decently sized.

You would think that since they (Simplot Co.) are one of the last big dogs in town that they would want that kind of statement building downtown. Something like the Boise Plaza proposal x3. :tup:

[Cottonwood]

You would think that since they (Simplot Co.) are one of the last big dogs in town that they would want that kind of statement building downtown. Something like the Boise Plaza proposal x3. :tup:

I wouldn't count on it especially since it has taken one of the Simplots years to remodel that old house in Hyde Park. years and years and it still isn't completed......:shrug:
..and it is just a house.....

[boisecynic]

:previous: :jester: somebody needs to :whip: the Simplot responsible for that mind numbing project

[cman]

I wouldn't count on it especially since it has taken one of the Simplots years to remodel that old house in Hyde Park. years and years and it still isn't completed......:shrug:
..and it is just a house.....

That is a personal project of one of the Simplots. I think he drug his feet to piss off the Historical District.

[boisecynic]

That is a personal project of one of the Simplots. I think he drug his feet to piss off the Historical District.

I think you're right cman. I vaguely remember something controversial about the original plan for that place. The owner wanted something more than what he was finally allowed to do. Isn't it supposed to be a bed and breakfast? Guess this requires another trip to the library.

[Visualize]

BIETER'S TO-DO LIST FOR BOISE INCLUDES NEW LIBRARY
The mayor also updates plans for a whitewater park and outlines his vision for a Downtown streetcar system.

Boise Mayor Dave Bieter wants to raise $15 million to $20 million of private money to help pay for a new main library Downtown.

In his State of the City address Tuesday morning, Bieter said he'd form an advisory committee within 60 days to find the money.

After the speech, Bieter said he envisions a $50 million building paid for by the donations and a serial or bond levy.

STREETCAR SYSTEM

Bieter announced an ambitious goal Tuesday: In the next four years, western Downtown Boise will have a new streetcar system to help spur redevelopment in neglected areas. Boise had an effective trolley system from 1891 through 1928, Bieter said.

"If we can do it in 1908, surely we can do it in 2008," Bieter said.

Instead of a trolley-shaped rubber-wheeled bus that would simply travel along the roads, Bieter wants a system built on steel rails - with a fixed pathway. The goal is to encourage business and high-density housing to locate along the rail lines because the route is fixed, Bieter said.

As much as 50 percent of the estimated $40 million to $50 million price tag could come from a local improvement district - a special taxing district approved and paid for by landowners within a specific boundary.

The route would likely run between 8th or 10th Streets to perhaps as far west as 30th Street, Bieter said. The system would likely be governed by a quasi-government agency, apart from the city and Valley Regional Transit, he said.

RIVER RECREATION PARK

Also Tuesday, Bieter announced a $1 million pledge from the Harvey Neef family to develop a whitewater park on the Boise River. Dr. Paul Collins of Boise also donated $200,000.

The whitewater park will be adjacent to Esther Simplot Park off 30th Street. The city has committed $750,000 to what is expected to be a more than $4 million project. The Neef family made its pledge in memory of Harvey Neef's son Ray, who died in a kayaking accident.

City parks officials plan changes to the Boise River bed to create an intermediate whitewater course. Construction is likely to begin next winter when water levels are low, Bieter said.

TRANSIT FUNDING

Bieter called on the 2009 Idaho Legislature to pass local option taxing to help the state's urban communities pay for transportation and mass transit.

He urged lawmakers to "end the war on 'the great state of Ada.' "

Bieter, who delivered his speech without notes or a teleprompter, said he forgot to mention during the speech he would seek a statewide voter initiative if lawmakers fail to deliver local option taxing next year.

"We need to end this dichotomy and end the urban-rural fighting and move forward," Bieter said.

http://www.idahostatesman.com/newsupdates/story/399811.html

[alphawolf]

I don't understand why the city can't run thier own street car!?! Is it because they would become liable in the case of an accident and thats too much for them to handle? Did someone else call dibs on running it? I don't see it being employee costs, because that wouldn't be too big of a crew for what, 3 routes.

[boisecynic]

Street Car essay today in Statesman:

http://www.idahostatesman.com/eyepiece/story/405024.html

Go leave your comments! I did.

I hereby declare the Riverside Medical Center a dud!

Here's my comment to the statesman:

Travel lanes could remain as is. Why would they have to be dedicated? Timing of the lights could remain as is, as well. Furthermore, any street car should somehow connect with BSU. The only way is through Julia Davis Park to somewhere near the footbridge. The current rebuilding of the 3rd Street entrance sure didn't take a streetcar into consideration.

3rd/4th Streets could make a loop from Idaho/Main into JD Park to the footbridge, especially considering the removal of the warehouse at 4th and Grove.

I'm usually pro-development and I think the mayor's proposal is a good one but I'm on the fence on this one. I think it's a bit premature, maybe 10 years from now would be a better time. West End redevelopment is stalled. It looks to me like the Riverside Medical Center at 27th and Fairview is a dud. They've had plenty of time to get their permits together and there's nothing but weeds.

However, all you naysayers, in 1992 you got the Broadway/Chinden connector that you wanted, which destroyed the Fairview/Main corridor. The least the taxpayers could do is to help Fairview/Main recover.

By the way, Boise City government. The weeds at the Riverside Medical Center lot are in violation of city code (over a foot tall). Open a case.

[rudimentalist]

Dropped car this morning at Les Schwab (13th & Jefferson) to get snow tires swapped out, and walked through downtown to work. The ground is very much broken on the north half of the block containing the Greyhound bus terminal (bound by 12th, 13th, Jeff and Bannock), space that previously hosted parking for Boise Cascade/Boise Paper/etc. Lotsa digging, with a parade of trucks moving dirt and rubble away. This is going to be a garage, right? Anyone have access to renderings?

[Boizean]

This is all I could find, probably not quite what you were hoping for though.

Click for Plan View (http://pdsonline.cityofboise.org/pdsonline/Documents.aspx?id=200802011415331090)

Click for Elevations (http://pdsonline.cityofboise.org/pdsonline/Documents.aspx?id=200802011416594370)

Based on the drawings, it looks like this is still going to be 8 levels. :shrug:

[JCW]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portland_Streetcar

I live in Portland, grew up in Boise. Portland was the first city to bring back a streetcar in recent memory - and it is fantastic. It has spured hundreds of millions on dollars of investments that a new bus route would never do, encourages people to walk and make downtown more vibrant, and is just all in all a great way to get around.

Also, it does NOT remove a lane from traffic but, like a bus, travels with traffic.

Portland did a similar thing to the 30th street route with the Pearl District and South Waterfront. These were two areas close to downtown with NOTHING but abandoned lots, unused warehouses and general blight. With an investment by the city in the streetcar developers knew the people would folow - and again invested a TON of money in the downtown area on everything froms condos to office buldings and retail.

This is something Boise definitely needs to make happen.

[boisecynic]

Thanks for your input JCW. Do you know if the City of Portland gave concessions to developers along or near the streetcar routes, like reduced parking space requirements?

[City Of Trees]

3rd/4th Streets could make a loop from Idaho/Main into JD Park to the footbridge, especially considering the removal of the warehouse at 4th and Grove.
Heh, I read that earlier and was happy that I was able to spread my 3rd/4th couplet idea out there. :cheers:

[Cottonwood]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portland_Streetcar

I live in Portland, grew up in Boise. Portland was the first city to bring back a streetcar in recent memory - and it is fantastic. It has spured hundreds of millions on dollars of investments that a new bus route would never do, encourages people to walk and make downtown more vibrant, and is just all in all a great way to get around.

Also, it does NOT remove a lane from traffic but, like a bus, travels with traffic.

Portland did a similar thing to the 30th street route with the Pearl District and South Waterfront. These were two areas close to downtown with NOTHING but abandoned lots, unused warehouses and general blight. With an investment by the city in the streetcar developers knew the people would folow - and again invested a TON of money in the downtown area on everything froms condos to office buldings and retail.

This is something Boise definitely needs to make happen.



I agree with you. Boise used to have one of the most extensive trolley lines of any city in the nation back in the day (Boise was one of the fist cities in the Western US to have a line) and if it worked then it will work now.

[JCW]

Good question on parking - not sure of the answer on that one other than I know the city worked with the developers quite a bit to make this happen. That said, the city actually tries to LIMIT the number of parking spaces - vs trying to encourage more. Take a look at this docuement for the North River District. https://scholarsbank.uoregon.edu/dspace/bitstream/1794/5860/1/Portland_North_Pearl_District_Plan.pdf . This is the next phase of the Pearl District in Portland. Maybe the easiest way to think about it is the Library Blocks to Bodo on a much larger scale with much more residential development. Also similar to the concepts being talked about or the area around 30th.

On your question on parking specifically jump to page 45 as it talks about transit options.

For the first phase of the Pearl I know tax incremetn financing was used and the city signed up for the streetcar, building some parks, etc. 15 years later there is so much money coming in from the new businesses, residents, etc the city is trying to figure out how to move some of the money out of the Pearl to fund other developments even though legally there are supposed to keep spending the money in that area for a few more years.

[boisecynic]

Good question on parking - not sure of the answer on that one other than I know the city worked with the developers quite a bit to make this happen. That said, the city actually tries to LIMIT the number of parking spaces - vs trying to encourage more. Take a look at this docuement for the North River District. https://scholarsbank.uoregon.edu/dspace/bitstream/1794/5860/1/Portland_North_Pearl_District_Plan.pdf . This is the next phase of the Pearl District in Portland. Maybe the easiest way to think about it is the Library Blocks to Bodo on a much larger scale with much more residential development. Also similar to the concepts being talked about or the area around 30th.

On your question on parking specifically jump to page 45 as it talks about transit options.

For the first phase of the Pearl I know tax incremetn financing was used and the city signed up for the streetcar, building some parks, etc. 15 years later there is so much money coming in from the new businesses, residents, etc the city is trying to figure out how to move some of the money out of the Pearl to fund other developments even though legally there are supposed to keep spending the money in that area for a few more years.



JCW, this is good stuff, because there are some well-organized and intelligent (but misguided,:) ) people in Boise who are adamantly opposed to tax increment financing.

[boisecynic]

In other news, here's a couple of pics of the site work for the parking garage next to Boise Plaza. Somebody asked about 8 stories, I believe I read somewhere that it's been scaled back to 6 stories.

http://i31.tinypic.com/2hcereu.jpg

http://i28.tinypic.com/2vvnzwh.jpg

[Cottonwood]

Boise gets top marks in Brooking Institution's economic vitality report
Report says other U.S. metro areas can achieve prosperity by emulating the Valley



BY KATHLEEN KRELLER - kkreller@idahostatesman.com
Edition Date: 06/12/08


The Boise metro area is top in the nation on three key measures of economic vitality, making the region an example of the kinds of economic policies the next U.S. president should pursue.

That's the conclusion of a Brookings Institution report being released today that argues that the productivity of the nation's metro areas drives the national economy, and that new federal technology, infrastructure and environmental policies are needed to improve metro economies and benefit the nation.

The Brookings Institution is an influential think tank in Washington, D.C. The 108-page report is part of the institution's Metropolitan Policy Program, which identified three key factors with a wide variety of specific indicators and then looked at how the nation's top 100 metro areas measured up on each.

And on those key economic measures - productivity, "social inclusion" and environmental sustainability - Boise ranked in the top third in all three categories and better overall than any other metro area in the United States.



http://www.idahostatesman.com/eyepiece/story/409246.html


http://media.idahostatesman.com/smedia/2008/06/11/22/06_metropolicy_fullreport.source.prod_affiliate.36.pdf

[Evo5Boise]

In other news, here's a couple of pics of the site work for the parking garage next to Boise Plaza. Somebody asked about 8 stories, I believe I read somewhere that it's been scaled back to 6 stories.



Something in Boise getting scaled back? No way! :haha:

[jard]

Here are a few pictures of the Aspen
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk92/jardlives/DSCF2660.jpg

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk92/jardlives/DSCF2661.jpg

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk92/jardlives/DSCF2688.jpg

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk92/jardlives/DSCF2689.jpg

[jard]

I'm going to love the glass on this building when it is done. Look at how good it already works.

[BrianInBoise]

Question on the Aspen:

When the parking garage was designed CCDC, was there always the plan that a building/tower would be built on the side of it? Or was the developer driving down Front St. one day, saw that little patch of grass and said damn, that would make a great spot of a 17 story tower? :shrug: I sure hope the success of this building leads to more creative uses of space downtown.

[alphawolf]

There were plans originally for a skybridge connecting the garage with the centre on the grove. I can't recall why it wasn't build, but that seems to have worked out for the best.

[Visualize]

Anyone know what building BSU has started construction on over by Beacon? I noticed the elevator column is already a couple of stories.

I found the 2005 comprehensive plan and it isn't matching up with the recently completed parking garage and the numbers were too small to read what anything else is supposed to be.

[alphawolf]

I can't recall who else mentioned it but there seems to be a low-rise going up there for the nursing department and such (I think) Visualize. I believe its nine stories, but it could be seven if I remember correctly.

[City Of Trees]

http://www.idahobusiness.net/archive.htm/2008/06/16/Boise--Plaza-owners-start-garage-project

Rafanelli & Nahas is in the “very early design phase” on an office building tabbed for the northwest corner of 11th and Idaho streets, and is in discussions with Boise Parks & Recreation and the Capital City Development Corp. urban-renewal agency about a proposal to develop a park at the southwest corner of 11th and Bannock streets, he said.

That would be immediately across the street from the Hitchcock Building (Record Exchange & Neurolux). That entire block is a parking lot except for the El Korah Shrine. Very good to see that action is going on filling those lots, and I also like the idea of a park in the middle of an area that's destined for major office development.

[Visualize]

Thanks alpha, that's more substantial than I had expected, though the other ones around it aren't small themselves.

When built out that area is going to look like a mini downtown. They should put in some dense apartments in the mix otherwise that area is going to turn into a huge dead zone anytime classes aren't going. Making it a truly livable urban academic environment would be epic.

[Visualize]

http://www.idahobusiness.net/archive.htm/2008/06/16/Boise--Plaza-owners-start-garage-project

Rafanelli & Nahas is in the “very early design phase” on an office building tabbed for the northwest corner of 11th and Idaho streets, and is in discussions with Boise Parks & Recreation and the Capital City Development Corp. urban-renewal agency about a proposal to develop a park at the southwest corner of 11th and Bannock streets, he said.

That would be immediately across the street from the Hitchcock Building (Record Exchange & Neurolux). That entire block is a parking lot except for the El Korah Shrine. Very good to see that action is going on filling those lots, and I also like the idea of a park in the middle of an area that's destined for major office development.

That would be a good location for a park. It would probably attract all sorts of characters when the area is more developed. It would serve the business aspect but at the same time Neurolux and the Record Exchange always have people milling around that would inevitably set up shop across the street in a park.

This is a lot of excitement for the area. I can't wait to see how it develops.

[Cottonwood]

:previous: The lot they want to put the city park on is excellent because it already has a lot of mature trees.
I am curious to how tall the new office tower might be? Boizean broke this news a while back ( it is buried in this thread somewhere) and there was/is talk of a new hotel as well.

[ianjt]

Hi everyone, I'm new here :)

Actually, I have been lurking for quite a while and just decided to join up. I am a BSU student and an avid mountain biker around here (I have a few great skyline shots from the hills).

The BSU building that has started recently is the new Health and Wellness/Nursing program building. It is going to be called the NORCO building from what I gather. Here's a link to some basic information:

http://media.www.arbiteronline.com/media/storage/paper890/news/2007/08/22/News/StateOfTheArt.Nursing.Building.Becomes.Reality.Thanks.To.Generous.Donations-2933716.shtml

Also, I have heard that it is only 4 stories, which was from an older article--I am thinking the plans may have changed to a bigger building. The reason for possible change in plans is that Boise State is now requiring all development on campus to be 5 stories at least. I think this shows great use of the land and intelligent development strategies.

On that note, I know from staff members who work at BSU that construction will start some time soon on a new apartment complex (at least 5 stories) down around the same area as Norco. I know the school is pushing for more students to live on campus so don't be surprised if we start to see lots of taller dorms/apartments popping up around the campus.

Annnddd. The new business building is coming at some point as well as the new alumni center, but I have no idea when. And lastly, the campus school (currently the art building) is going to be removed in the no-too-distant future. I am not sure what will replace it, but, again, it should be something of a decent height. :D

[Evo5Boise]

Wow, Boise State is really growing isn't it?

[Visualize]

Thanks for joining and sharing ianjt, good info.

That is great news that BSU has mandated a self imposed minimal height requirement. Now if they could only figure out a relative style they want to build in and stick with it. Having some buildings built one way and then another makes the campus look tacky and disconnected.

[ianjt]

Thanks for joining and sharing ianjt, good info.

That is great news that BSU has mandated a self imposed minimal height requirement. Now if they could only figure out a relative style they want to build in and stick with it. Having some buildings built one way and then another makes the campus look tacky and disconnected.

I couldn't agree more. I have a feeling that will be an issue in the future. Perhaps the architects or the committee responsible for the general aesthetics of campus buildings can find a way to re-do some of the buildings if not all of them. I hope that issue comes to Kustra and company's attention before BSU gets too big. Heck, I'll do it for them :whip:

I have a strong feeling that an aesthetically constant (for lack of better words) campus could pull in more students. Look at all of the smaller liberal arts colleges and larger, more notorious universities...


Edit: Evo; yes it has. Enrollment is passing 20k this fall. And, while BSU is not THAT hard to get accepted to, it is the most selective public university in Idaho. I think that, given some more time, BSU is going to a make a real strong name for itself.

[Evo5Boise]

Wow, those are some good numbers. It really has grown ever since I can even remember seeing the campus as a kid. I mean, even look at their sports. They were no name nobody's in the NCAA II 12 years ago. Now everybody has seen The Broncos play on television and know who they are.

[Boizean]

Welcome to the forum ianjt. :cheers:

I am curious to how tall the new office tower might be?
It was a five or six floor building that was to follow after the parking garage, last I heard.

[BoiseAirport]

Hey! Always nice to see a new Boise forumer here.

Hi everyone, I'm new here :)

Actually, I have been lurking for quite a while and just decided to join up. I am a BSU student and an avid mountain biker around here (I have a few great skyline shots from the hills).

Very nice! I will actually be going to BSU in the fall myself.

Anthony

[IFtowner]

:previous:

As will I.


:cool:

[IdahoMountainBoy]

:previous: You guys be sure to take GIS with Charla Adams, she's a great instructor :tup:

[jard]

Edit: Evo; yes it has. Enrollment is passing 20k this fall. And, while BSU is not THAT hard to get accepted to, it is the most selective public university in Idaho. I think that, given some more time, BSU is going to a make a real strong name for itself.

Wow, I had no idea.

[NYC Rick]

In other news, here's a couple of pics of the site work for the parking garage next to Boise Plaza. Somebody asked about 8 stories, I believe I read somewhere that it's been scaled back to 6 stories.

http://i31.tinypic.com/2hcereu.jpg

http://i28.tinypic.com/2vvnzwh.jpg

Do you have images of the building that is going up?

[Cottonwood]

The new Business building on Capitol Blvd will be nice..getting rid of that old hotel and surface lot will make a huge difference to the campus.

[Cottonwood]

News was posted about this topic in the forum last week, but here is more info from the current issue of the IBR.

IBR news--

Boise streetcar plan moves forward



http://www.idahobusiness.net/archive.htm/2008/06/16/Boise-streetcar-plan-moves-forward

[ianjt]

Hm... I traced that route they named on a map and it seems a little small. I would have thought they would make an effort to extend some tracks down to BSU and maybe out towards the major downtown neighborhoods (North end for sure).

Then again, the route has room to grow and Boise is still a little small to accommodate support a big trolley system.

Thoughts?

[Cottonwood]

Do you have images of the building that is going up?

Here is a link to the site of the developer.
http://www.rafnah.com/

There isn't any news on the site about the garage and the other buildings they want to build on those lots, but info is still on line for Capitol Plaza.
If must still be "pending"....................................................................................................................................................

[City Of Trees]

They should use 2nd Street at the eastern border--that street is practically unused by motor traffic while 1st Street is more critical juncture for St. Luke's access, etc. I'm also a bit leery about using 17th Street when it's a handy backdoor road to access both Main Street to the south and Harrison Boulevard to the north.

I'll have to think about this "figure eight" idea some more, but they should also consider utilizing Grove Street from 10th to 17th. That's another street not heavily used by motor traffic and it would really infuse the Linen District hopes.

====

Also, regarding BSU, I would love to see them convert Belmont Street to a pedestrian/bike path and have it be a nice mixed used area with school usage on upper floors and businesses common for college students on the ground level. They could also directly connect it to the Greenbelt at the eastern end.

[Boiseguy]

nice to see more midrises filling in downtown and in the university area...

[Boizean]

Do you have images of the building that is going up?
It's just a parking garage going in at this location. One that is being constructed to free up the surface lots in the vicinity (other properties they own) for further development of which a six floor office building and a maybe a park is expected to follow shortly thereafter. No renderings of the future office building but rough drawings of the garage can be found Here (http://pdsonline.cityofboise.org/pdsonline/Documents.aspx?id=200802011416594370).

[Visualize]

The planned "dowtown cirrculator" route according to this source. http://www.idahobusiness.net/archive.htm/2008/06/16/Boise-streetcar-plan-moves-forward The approximately three mile route - which would run west down Idaho St. from 1st to 17th, then east down Bannock to 10th, south to Main St. and east to 1st

Personally I think the run would be better suited to run west down Idaho St. from 1st to 11th, then west down Bannock to 17th, south to Main St. and east to 13th, south to Myrtle, east on Myrtle to 11th, North to Main, and east back to 1st.

Using their route you would be touching both sides of the same blocks for seven blocks. Seems like a bit of an overkill. One block away is not very far and then it spreads the impact out a little more. I have the route go the wrong way down thirteenth which I don't think would be a problem if it were protected with a median, especially if they added another lane on the east side for a few blocks which is very plausible right now since there are only parking lots on that side. I think building the convention center and then not connecting the rail to it would be a big mistake not to mention there is a vast amount of land in that area begging for development maybe moreso than a few blocks north for its closer proximity to the greenbelt, library, 8th st. Marketplace, and for not having to cross both Front and Myrtle. Granted my route would cost a little bit more but I think the benefits would be worth it.

I don't necessarily think connecting it to BSU is the best idea because nobody that goes to BSU can really afford to live downtown and by the time anything is really happening downtown which is usually in the evening, classes have already basically ended for the day and not to many people are down there. BSU is also served by fairly frequent bus service to downtown not to mention is well within walking distance for anyone of that age group. Cost/Benefit....Cost trumps.

[ianjt]

The planned "dowtown cirrculator" route according to this source. http://www.idahobusiness.net/archive.htm/2008/06/16/Boise-streetcar-plan-moves-forward

Personally I think the run would be better suited to run west down Idaho St. from 1st to 11th, then west down Bannock to 17th, south to Main St. and east to 13th, south to Myrtle, east on Myrtle to 11th, North to Main, and east back to 1st.

Using their route you would be touching both sides of the same blocks for seven blocks. Seems like a bit of an overkill. One block away is not very far and then it spreads the impact out a little more. I have the route go the wrong way down thirteenth which I don't think would be a problem if it were protected with a median, especially if they added another lane on the east side for a few blocks which is very plausible right now since there are only parking lots on that side. I think building the convention center and then not connecting the rail to it would be a big mistake not to mention there is a vast amount of land in that area begging for development maybe moreso than a few blocks north for its closer proximity to the greenbelt, library, 8th st. Marketplace, and for not having to cross both Front and Myrtle. Granted my route would cost a little bit more but I think the benefits would be worth it.

This is a great point. I think touching two sides of the same city blocks for 16 streets is a bit pointless. They are not covering as much of downtown as they can, and there is sense to wait for the trolley to come by your stop unless you want to go all the way down to 17th. Say you live on 4th or 5th and want to go to 11th or even 15th (bear with me); why wait for the trolley when you can simply walk a straight line?

I think the answer is to bring people from their homes into the city, thus more connections to the neighborhoods. Personally, I think Washington DC does this well. They have a few lines that stretch way out into the suburbs and then they all meet and rotate in the city center.


I don't necessarily think connecting it to BSU is the best idea because nobody that goes to BSU can really afford to live downtown and by the time anything is really happening downtown which is usually in the evening, classes have already basically ended for the day and not to many people are down there. BSU is also served by fairly frequent bus service to downtown not to mention is well within walking distance for anyone of that age group. Cost/Benefit....Cost trumps.

I can see your point here. But... I am one of the many students that, after classes, finds his (or her) way to coffee shops, restaurants, stores, etc. downtown nearly every day. I would love to leave my car at BSU and catch a trolley ride in. I see tons of students every day downtown. The restaurants and coffee shops are also major employers of college students (having been in this position myself)--giving more incentive for a trolley into town.

Also, it's a good walk on a hot or cold day all the way to the city center. Lots of students want to take a quick run in for some food or coffee (myself and many friends), but since the parking at BSU is basically :slob: , a trolley ride in might be a good alternative being quicker (walking all the way to what seems like Meridian for your car is annoying and time consuming) and more efficient (day-time parking downtown can get annoying).


Anyhoo, my two cents... :shrug:

[alphawolf]

It's just a parking garage going in at this location. One that is being constructed to free up the surface lots in the vicinity (other properties they own) for further development of which a six floor office building and a maybe a park is expected to follow shortly thereafter. No renderings of the future office building but rough drawings of the garage can be found Here (http://pdsonline.cityofboise.org/pdsonline/Documents.aspx?id=200802011416594370).

I can't make out the height in that PDF.

[boisecynic]

Regarding Boise Plaza parking structure, it appears to be 8 stories, and that's what it says on the permit as well. I can't remember where I read about the 6 floor version. In other news, the clear and grub permit for Riverside Medical Center is now listed as expired. Sigh. Address is 2619 W Fairview for those who want to search Boise PDS.

[boisecynic]

Regarding the trolley route. I suggest Bannock and Grove as the routes. Visualize was spot on about the route touching opposite sides of the same block, that would be a waste. Almost everyone can walk or wheelchair one block. One of my favorite things about Bodo was the opening of the streets. I don't mean just for cars either. It's much easier to get around on bike or on foot in Bodo than before. How's Bodo relevant? Keep reading for the good controversial stuff!

So, what do we do at the Grove Plaza, everybody's wondering? Punch it through!

I know this will raise hackles but I've always been against blocking off transportation corridors in city downtowns. The section through the Grove Plaza could remain off limits to cars and the Plaza could be one of the main trolley stops. The Farmer's Market crowd will no doubt pitch a fit but I think it would enhance it. Grove dead ends at 3rd, at the west end of the courthouse, a building which is high on the needs list for a trolley. 3rd St is an excellent choice for the leg to the north and definitely not too far from St Lukes. I might be getting really far fetched but the trolley could continue east from 3rd to 1st via that area behind the courthouse which is what I believe an Idaho Power substation. That way it could conveniently service the Water Center building and Civic Plaza Apartments.

[City Of Trees]

I might be getting really far fetched but the trolley could continue east from 3rd to 1st via that area behind the courthouse which is what I believe an Idaho Power substation. That way it could conveniently service the Water Center building and Civic Plaza Apartments.
I have long wanted a bike path to go down that corridor, and connect with the sidewalk/path that follows the Front Street extension and meets up with the Greenbelt in Municipal Park. I'm not sure if there's enough room now behind the courthouse and the St. Luke's parking garage, but that corridor did used to hold the rail spur that went to Barber Valley....hmmm...

Anyway, my thought for a real simple route, like I kinda suggested, would be Bannock/Grove/2nd/10th/18th. Put the main transit station at the parking lot that's on 10th and Grove, you could also have a park and ride at the empty lot on 17th and Idaho behind Cabana.

[Cottonwood]

I think they should put a route straight down State Street from St. Lukes to 17th or 18th. It would result in a reduced lane each direction on State Street from 8th to 18th, that is a small stretch, but oh well, people would have to deal with it:) I really think that most people taking State into downtown from the West should turn onto 27th Street and use the Main/Fairview corridor and that State from 27th into downtown should become more of a residential street--much like it used to be---after all that is part of the charm of entering the downtown area on State--is seeing the old well kept homes.
The original routes used some North end streets such as 24th, 15th, 13th...
There was even a route from downtown to Ustick.

[City Of Trees]

I think they should put a route straight down State Street from St. Lukes to 17th or 18th. It would result in a reduced lane each direction on State Street from 8th to 18th, that is a small stretch, but oh well, people would have to deal with it:) I really think that most people taking State into downtown from the West should turn onto 27th Street and use the Main/Fairview corridor and that State from 27th into downtown should become more of a residential street--much like it used to be.
Whenever they get the 30th Street extension in, that would also help out in giving State Street folks another option.

I still want a State/Jefferson one-way couplet, and it was planned to happen in the late 70s/early 80s, but one of either St. Luke's or the neighborhood west of Downtown got it denied.