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-   -   AUSTIN | Colorado Tower | 397 FEET | 29 FLOORS | Complete (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=198901)

BevoLJ Apr 18, 2012 11:08 PM

AUSTIN | Colorado Tower | 397 FEET | 29 FLOORS | Complete
 
Proposed 30-story office tower could alter downtown skyline
Austin American Statesman
By Shonda Novak | Wednesday, April 18, 2012, 05:30 PM


Quote:

Cousins Properties Inc. says it plans to build a 30-story office tower at Third and Colorado streets, a project that could become the first new high-rise office building built in downtown Austin since Cousins opened Frost Bank Tower eight years ago.

Cousins intends to break ground late this year on the new tower, which would have about 390,000 square feet of office space, said Tim Hendricks, senior vice president with Cousins. Twelve of the 30 stories would be for a parking garage with 900 spaces. The building would also have 6,000 square feet of street-level retail.

The project, which Cousins is calling Colorado & Third, would rise on what is now a parking lot across Colorado Street from Sullivan’s Restaurant.

San Antonio-based Hixon Properties Inc. formerly planned to build an upscale hotel on the site. Hendricks said Hixon and Silver Ventures, also based in San Antonio, would partner with Cousins in the project. The land is owned in a partnership between Hixon and Silver Ventures.

Hendricks declined to comment on the estimated cost of the project or potential financing options.

http://alt.coxnewsweb.com/shared-blo...pdate%2010.jpg

...

http://www.statesman.com/blogs/conte...e=rss_business

Jdawgboy Apr 19, 2012 1:56 AM

Taller!!!!, would love to see that taller, love the design just make it 10 floors taller.

wwmiv Apr 19, 2012 3:01 AM

I'm wondering if this is an L shaped tower.

BevoLJ Apr 19, 2012 3:07 AM

I don't think so. It is only on the bottom two lots on the Colorado side of the block. The two bottom lots that are on the Congress (next to Manuel's)side are still parking. There is a little ally that breaks that block in half.

wwmiv Apr 19, 2012 3:16 AM

... Bevo, the lot shape has nothing to do with my point. Look at the rendering. Does it not strike you that this could be an L-shaped tower and we're seeing the outside of the L?

East7thStreet Apr 19, 2012 3:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BevoLJ (Post 5671656)
I don't think so. It is only on the bottom two lots on the Colorado side of the block. The two bottom lots that are on the Congress (next to Manuel's)side are still parking. There is a little ally that breaks that block in half.


I think he meant maybe we are looking at the bottom of the "L" and it's actually just two slender rectangles splintered together.

wwmiv Apr 19, 2012 3:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by East7thStreet (Post 5671675)
I think he meant maybe we are looking at the bottom of the "L" and it's actually just two slender rectangles splintered together.

Exactly

wwmiv Apr 19, 2012 3:28 AM

Also, the title of the thread is misspelled. It's Colorado not Colorodo.

JAM Apr 19, 2012 2:52 PM

Too bad its only 30. Isn't that the height of everything else over there? No dimension.....

Jdawgboy Apr 19, 2012 6:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAM (Post 5672047)
Too bad its only 30. Isn't that the height of everything else over there? No dimension.....

I agree, would like to see an office tower more comparible to the Austonion.

austlar1 Apr 19, 2012 8:04 PM

If something gets built on the parking lot fronting Congress, it will sure have an impact on the light and views on the east side of this proposed building. I wonder whether this design takes that into consideration? I guess we would all like to see a rendering of the eastern facade for this baby. If it is "L" shaped that might create a light well on the eastern side in the event something gets built in front of it. I seem to rember the proposed hotel was only going to occupy a quarter of the block, so I guess that would leave the other quarter fronting Congress open for development. I wish this thing was going up on Congress.

kingkirbythe.... Apr 19, 2012 9:43 PM

Maybe a nice mid rise for that parking lot.

GoldenBoot Apr 19, 2012 10:30 PM

I too, would love to have a taller (and skinnier) building on this site. As it is more expensive to build taller, the numbers must support a taller building (i.e., the margin must be the same or better).

Furthermore, let’s not jump too high with this “building boom” potential just yet…it is just that…”potential.” And the basic definition of “potential” is simply; the proposed has not been accomplished.

Do not get me wrong. I was born here in Austin and am very interested in making it a “World Class” city (culture, architecture, food, entertainment, etc.).

However, not all developers (at least here) really care about that…as they should be. They are considering how much money they can make on each and every project. This is why Tom Stacy has not “started” construction of his proposal. It cost much more, and there is far more risk in developing a site than preparing it for development. Stacy’s site has the highest density approvals of any site in Central Texas. He has simply increased the value of his property. In addition, let’s not forget that he owned the site where Frost Bank is now located. He did the same thing with that site as he has done with his property at Sixth & Congress…obtained all of the required entitlements to build such a building as Frost prior to selling the site to Cousins. The reason we should feel “warm” about the Sixth & Congress project is because it has yet to come onto the market…at least publically.

Jdawgboy Apr 19, 2012 10:49 PM

You are right GoldenBoot, as far as I know T Stacy is still planning on building something eventually, we just do not know the scope of the project. I am looking forward to the day we do know more.

As far as this tower is concerned we will see what happens with the final rendering. They did a story on KXAN at 5 about it and the spokesperson with Cousins said they hope to get started on construction this October. Of course the story also found somebody who complained about not enough parking Downtown (which is just not true), she never goes down there, (oh well...) She complained that she does not want Austin to be like Houston or Dallas but its people like her that live away from the core and don't go Downtown that cause a lot of the congestion problems we have. In order for Austin to be different, we need to grow up, not out. My feeling is that lady was talking about highrises but fact is its low level sprawl that causes congestion and Houston and Dallas are filled with Sprawl in all directions. We may not be able to control what happens with our suburbs but we can control what we do within the city limits and we are heading in the right direction as long as we continue to see Downtown grow up.

migol24 Apr 19, 2012 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jdawgboy (Post 5672737)
You are right GoldenBoot, as far as I know T Stacy is still planning on building something eventually, we just do not know the scope of the project. I am looking forward to the day we do know more.

As far as this tower is concerned we will see what happens with the final rendering. They did a story on KXAN at 5 about it and the spokesperson with Cousins said they hope to get started on construction this October. Of course the story also found somebody who complained about not enough parking Downtown (which is just not true), she never goes down there, (oh well...) She complained that she does not want Austin to be like Houston or Dallas but its people like her that live away from the core and don't go Downtown that cause a lot of the congestion problems we have. In order for Austin to be different, we need to grow up, not out. My feeling is that lady was talking about highrises but fact is its low level sprawl that causes congestion and Houston and Dallas are filled with Sprawl in all directions. We may not be able to control what happens with our suburbs but we can control what we do within the city limits and we are heading in the right direction as long as we continue to see Downtown grow up.

i'm just getting tired of those types of people that it's not even worth it taking into consideration what they have to say.... unless, of course, it's anything new and worth considering.... but it's not. texans, for the most part, especially the one's who live in suburban neighborhoods don't know what "urbanization" is. they think they know... but they don't. they think that just by building buildings causes sprawl... i dunno how they come to that. i don't know what makes them rationalize that what austin is experiencing is the same thing that has happened in houston or dallas. i guess they just don't understand the dynamics of it... and the differences between san francisco and los angeles. they think those types of cities are exactly the same... and then there are cities like atlanta, houston and dallas and that austin is following in those same trends. that's simply not the case in any shape or form. there's like no possible way to rationalize that.

The ATX Apr 19, 2012 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jdawgboy (Post 5672737)
You are right GoldenBoot, as far as I know T Stacy is still planning on building something eventually, we just do not know the scope of the project. I am looking forward to the day we do know more.

As far as this tower is concerned we will see what happens with the final rendering. They did a story on KXAN at 5 about it and the spokesperson with Cousins said they hope to get started on construction this October. Of course the story also found somebody who complained about not enough parking Downtown (which is just not true), she never goes down there, (oh well...) She complained that she does not want Austin to be like Houston or Dallas but its people like her that live away from the core and don't go Downtown that cause a lot of the congestion problems we have. In order for Austin to be different, we need to grow up, not out. My feeling is that lady was talking about highrises but fact is its low level sprawl that causes congestion and Houston and Dallas are filled with Sprawl in all directions. We may not be able to control what happens with our suburbs but we can control what we do within the city limits and we are heading in the right direction as long as we continue to see Downtown grow up.

I saw that news story, and just like in any development story, the local media found a local who bemoans development. These people cannot expect to be the last person moving to Austin. NIMBYs have to wake up and realize that a developer conceived of their home and the place where they work at some point in the past.

Jdawgboy Apr 20, 2012 12:29 AM

Very true indeed.

BevoLJ Apr 20, 2012 2:45 AM

What is the real constraint here?
Austin Contrarian
Chris Bradford


Quote:

Austin badly needs more downtown office space. Austin's downtown Class A rents are higher than either Dallas or Houston's, which is absurd. But it is difficult for developers to line up money to build an office building on spec, particularly without a large anchor tenant to soak up a few floors. Austin doesn't have many firms looking for large blocks of downtown space.

Cousins Properties will try, though. It has announced plans for a 30-story office tower at Third and Colorado streets. The tower would have about 390,000 square feet of office space and 6,000 square feet of street-level retail. Twelve of the 30 stories would be for a parking garage with 900 spaces. It would be downtown Austin's first new high-rise office building since Frost Bank Tower opened eight years ago.

Given the intense demand for new office space downtown, why limit the project to "just" 30 stories? On net, this building will yield just 17 or so floors of office space. Why not more?

Downtown zoning regulations limit the building to a floor-to-area ratio ("FAR") of 8:1. The owner got approval in 2009 for a FAR of 12:1, but the zoning ordinance restricted the increase to a hotel use, and the developer needs 15:1 FAR anyway. Althought it's ridiculuous that central business district zoning limits this downtown site to around eight floors of office space (parking doesn't count against FAR), that's not the real constraint on this building's size. The developer is asking for 15:1 and I expect it will get it.

I suspect the real constraint here is parking. Drivers will only drive up so many ramps in order to park their cars. The taller the garage, the bigger the pain it is to park on the top floors. This puts a practical cap on the number of floors a parking garage can contain. The developer is proposing a 12-story garage, which is an aggressive estimate of that cap. It's safe to say that this plan would maximize the amount of parking on site.

...

Read more: http://www.austincontrarian.com/aust...+Contrarian%29


KevinFromTexas Apr 22, 2012 1:22 AM

I only count 27 floors in the rendering. I'm guessing it'll be around 350 feet tall. That'll make it our 2nd tallest office building, but today that would be Austin's 11th tallest building, and possibly the 26th tallest in the city in a few years time. Love the design, though. Duda/Paine is designing it. They also did Frost.

I'm not exactly surprised it's not going to be very tall. It would mean blocking the views from The Austonian. And I'm not surprised it has some fancy crown either since the light pollution would also interfere with residents in The Austonian. I am wondering how they'll light the crown so that it shows up, but isn't a distraction.

ExportMolson Apr 22, 2012 6:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas (Post 5675025)
That'll make it our 2nd tallest office building

Frost Bank Tower - 33 floors, 515'
One Congress Plaza - 30 floors, 398'
One American Center - 32 floors, 397'

KevinFromTexas Apr 24, 2012 1:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExportMolson (Post 5675510)
Frost Bank Tower - 33 floors, 515'
One Congress Plaza - 30 floors, 398'
One American Center - 32 floors, 397'

I meant to say it'll be our 2nd tallest office tower if it's 400 feet tall. I am the one that found those building heights. :)

I sent an email to someone at Cousins, and they said the office tower at Colorado & 3rd is still in the design phase and that they aren't releasing the details until they're finalized.

lzppjb Dec 19, 2012 7:00 PM

This may have been posted on some other thread, but they have a panorama view on their site that I thought was neat.

http://3rdandcolorado.com/content/panorama

lzppjb Dec 19, 2012 7:38 PM

Their fact sheet: http://3rdandcolorado.com/sites/defa...-Sheet-Oct.pdf

371,348 sq ft now listed.

wwmiv Dec 19, 2012 8:39 PM

So this is moving forward still? Great!

MightyYoda Dec 19, 2012 8:47 PM

It was supposed to start before the end of the year. Sounds like it is still moving forward, but does anyone know what hurdles remain before it can break ground?

lzppjb Dec 19, 2012 9:26 PM

I just emailed the gentleman listed at the bottom of the site. Hopefully he responds back with some information.

KevinFromTexas Dec 19, 2012 9:29 PM

One thing I'm interested in knowing is the height.

lzppjb Dec 19, 2012 9:40 PM

Kevin,

I asked if the project was still moving forward, when it would break ground, what hurdles are left (if any) and what the height would be.

ahealy Dec 20, 2012 2:02 AM

I just emailed as well. They're supposed to break ground any day now from what I remember :shrug:

LoneStarMike Dec 20, 2012 7:21 AM

I'm thinking the delay might have partly been due to all the street work they were doing at that intersection. There was a news story on KVUE about the bars in the Warehouse District having "Warehouse Wednesdays" to try and get their customers to start coming back, so it sounds like all that street construction in the vicinity of the planned building has been completed.

Austin1971 Jan 28, 2013 6:35 PM

Any idea when/if this will ever break ground?

JoninATX Jan 28, 2013 9:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Austin1971 (Post 5990825)
Any idea when/if this will ever break ground?

Sometime this year. I know they are having a big event at the W Hotel on Feb. 27 for all projects that will be breaking ground this year. So hopefully we will hear more information about this project.

http://i1072.photobucket.com/albums/...ps587bcae9.jpg
From AusTXDevelopment.

keone Jan 31, 2013 10:03 PM

I hadn't seen these renderings posted yet:

http://www.dudapaine.com/images/3rdcolorado_042.jpg
Duda-Paine Architects

http://www.dudapaine.com/images/3rdcolorado_05.jpg
Duda-Paine Architects

KevinFromTexas Feb 1, 2013 1:10 AM

That link also shows the shape of the building. I remember someone thought it could be L shaped. It's not, it's rectangular with the longest side facing Colorado. This also shows the size of it. It'll be about as bulky as Frost. You can also compare it to 301 Congress to the right.

http://www.dudapaine.com/images/3rdcolorado_01.jpg
http://www.dudapaine.com/3rd-colorado.html

Syndic Feb 1, 2013 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keone (Post 5995624)
I hadn't seen these renderings posted yet:

Wow, those look really nice. That could turn out to be a pretty awesome place. I fully endorse the increased use of wood. It seems to be becoming more trendy as people start valuing the natural, Earthy feel more.

keone Feb 15, 2013 9:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syndic (Post 5997301)
Wow, those look really nice. That could turn out to be a pretty awesome place. I fully endorse the increased use of wood. It seems to be becoming more trendy as people start valuing the natural, Earthy feel more.

The ceilings are going to be a faux-wood product (metal with faux wood veneer).

Here are some elevations pulled from their license agreement application... looks like just under 400' currently. My guess is that it will end up around 390'.

http://i.imgur.com/gQWX9u6.png
http://i.imgur.com/TUrYmwO.png

City of Austin (https://www.austintexas.gov/devrevie...er_permits.jsp) (Search 2012-101063 RW)

Jdawgboy Feb 16, 2013 12:38 AM

I really wish this tower was going to be taller, that location is screaming for a 500 to 800 footer range. It's close to the Austonian and would have made a nice companion tower if it was a similar height. Too many buildings in Downtown are basically the same height give or take a few feet and it makes our skyline look very flat when viewed from certain locations, especially coming in on I-35 from the north.

KevinFromTexas Feb 16, 2013 4:58 AM

I snooped around a little more and found two PDF files showing the building elevations showing all the heights. The only thing is apparently there are two different designs, and one is a little taller than the other. I'll send an email on Monday to someone with the developer to get a confirmed height on the official final plan.

First is the taller design.

440 feet to the mechanical screen. This would be the official building height.
421 feet to the mechanical penthouse roof.
406 feet to the main roof.
386 feet is the top floor height.
30 floors
5th tallest in Austin.

The shorter design was listed as the "final plan". Unfortunately it's not quite 400 feet.

396 feet to the mechanical screen. This would be the official building height.
379 feet to the mechanical penthouse roof.
363 feet to the main roof.
343 feet is the top floor height.
29 floors.
12th tallest in Austin.

Here is the page with the two files showing the two different heights. Use the PDF with the taller design to do the measurements. The lobby elevation is 474 feet. The PDF for the shorter design doesn't show the lobby elevation, but I would assume that number wouldn't be different between both plans.

https://www.austintexas.gov/devrevie...erRSN=10839323

The ATX Feb 16, 2013 5:35 AM

We seem to be stuck with new buildings being in the 400' to 450' range, give or take. Although I'm not complaining too much about it since we are seeing a lot of them. But I don't like seeing sites outside of the CVC limiting themselves to that height.

wwmiv Feb 16, 2013 6:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hill Country (Post 6017274)
We seem to be stuck with new buildings being in the 400' to 450' range, give or take. Although I'm not complaining too much about it since we are seeing a lot of them. But I don't like seeing sites outside of the CVC limiting themselves to that height.

When we're in the 2.5 to 3.5 million people metro range, we'll see larger proposals. The problem, really, is having developable blocks at that point.

Myomi Feb 16, 2013 7:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jdawgboy (Post 6016935)
I really wish this tower was going to be taller, that location is screaming for a 500 to 800 footer range. It's close to the Austonian and would have made a nice companion tower if it was a similar height. Too many buildings in Downtown are basically the same height give or take a few feet and it makes our skyline look very flat when viewed from certain locations, especially coming in on I-35 from the north.

I agree completely. Though this tower will be great for downtown, I continually find myself hoping that this project, among all projects, won't make it. Though, I am sure that this isn't a popular opinion on this forum, but I almost would be OK if this lot stayed surface parking for 5 years if it meant a project twice it's height. I feel that this lot deserves so much more because of its premier location.

migol24 Feb 16, 2013 8:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myomi (Post 6017354)
I agree completely. Though this tower will be great for downtown, I continually find myself hoping that this project, among all projects, won't make it. Though, I am sure that this isn't a popular opinion on this forum, but I almost would be OK if this lot stayed surface parking for 5 years if it meant a project twice it's height. I feel that this lot deserves so much more because of its premier location.

Yeah, I hear you. It now kinda makes me wonder that if all the spots not restricted by the CVC do get taken up by not so tall skyscrapers, Austin will probably never see a thousand footer rise.

NYC2ATX Feb 16, 2013 9:39 AM

The biggest problem here, and it's been brought up before, is the parking requirements. Office towers in Austin will need to provide parking for their tenants until either the city decides otherwise, or a transit system renders them less necessary...and then the city decides otherwise. Yes parking can be placed underground, but that increases costs exponentially, and it's not appealing to developers. Hotel builders with an already signed brand property or residential builders in Austin's current real estate environment will drop the extra cash because they know they'll make money back on their investments, but commercial office space, as always, is the least certain. Therefore, to build a towering office building now would likely require a massive and undoubtedly hideous parking structure, and if that's the case, I'd rather wait until there is a transit system to support tall office buildings than have them built now in bloated form. We don't want Austin to become Houston or Atlanta, at least not in that sense.

the Genral Feb 18, 2013 5:53 AM

I think the size of this tower is right for the location. Matching or exceeding the height of the Austonian just a block away wouldn't do much for the skyline. This is an opportunity to get rid of surface parking, add quality density, and not have to wait 5 or more years to get it done. It doesn't seem that long ago when we would have all been salivating to get this tower built.

Komeht Feb 18, 2013 8:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by migol24 (Post 6017402)
Yeah, I hear you. It now kinda makes me wonder that if all the spots not restricted by the CVC do get taken up by not so tall skyscrapers, Austin will probably never see a thousand footer rise.

1000 footer? In Austin? LOL, I think we're getting way way way ahead of ourselves. Austin is a long long long way for having the kind of economy that could justify such a monster, let alone have the kind of populace that would ever permit it to happen.

Spaceman Feb 18, 2013 4:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Komeht (Post 6019215)
1000 footer? In Austin? LOL, I think we're getting way way way ahead of ourselves. Austin is a long long long way for having the kind of economy that could justify such a monster, let alone have the kind of populace that would ever permit it to happen.

The Fairmount could be the determining factor as to whether we see anything 500 feet being built in the next several years..more than the needed hotel room availability it is a barometer on the high rise mind set of DT developers..Austin could end up looking like Washington D.C.. many buildings all the same height..Trapped by restrictions preserving, justified in some cases, views of historic structures..

migol24 Feb 18, 2013 7:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Komeht (Post 6019215)
1000 footer? In Austin? LOL, I think we're getting way way way ahead of ourselves. Austin is a long long long way for having the kind of economy that could justify such a monster, let alone have the kind of populace that would ever permit it to happen.

No one is getting ahead of themselves. I'm simply speaking about this in the long run, which could be 10 or 20 years from now. That is very possible and could very well happen. The T Stacey building was going to be around 830 ft... anyways, that didn't happen, but something like that can happen someday, if only the lots not affected by the CVC don't get taken all up.

austlar1 Feb 18, 2013 9:10 PM

If somebody credible proposed a 1,000 footer on an appropriate site downtown and had the financing lined up and ready to go, the damn building would go up with little or no opposition and lots of enthusiastic support in the media and in the community. Austin is ready. It is nonsense to speculate otherwise. The Austin office market may not be ready, but that is a seperate issue.

JoninATX Feb 18, 2013 9:52 PM

There are several sites in downtown where a shortfall building could go up.

http:// http://www.austinchronicle.c...feature1-1.jpg

Particularly this site.
http://www.austinchronicle.com/news/...ng-change/all/

ATXboom Feb 19, 2013 12:56 AM

IF Austin ever gets a 1000 footer it will be an ultra-premium hotel + condo tower brand... mark my words. The days of mega corp headquarters don't exist... thanks to technology, businesses can run on fewer and fewer people than ever before. This reflects the increasing jobless trend paired with record corporate growth. Most of the huge towers in Chicago and NYC are residential too... Out of all the Texas cities, Austin is the most likely to have such a tower.... don't we have the tallest residential tower west of the Mississippi? Plop a 500 room hotel on the Austonian and you might be there... look out for Trump Austin lol.


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