[TexasPlaya]

Originally Posted by Jasonhouse

Keep Houston out of this thread or it will be locked, and the people perpetuating this distraction will face consequences.

Calm down, I was responding to UrbanactivistTX's comment about Houston needing a hybrid system like Dallas's. I'm not trying to get into Houston vs Dallas but how Dallas's system can't work well in Houston.

Originally Posted by electricron

So what? Metro reports 39,500 rail riders per day, Dart reports a total of 71,100 rail riders per day. Source, both Wikipedia articles.
Riders per mile math:
39,500 / 7.5 = ~5300 passengers per mile.
71,100 / 45 = ~1600 passengers per mile.

Houston Metro's Red Line takes 30 minutes to travel a distance of 7.5 miles, Dallas Dart's Red Line takes 66 minutes to travel a distance of 27 miles. In 7.5 miles, Metro's line has 16 stations, averaging a station every 0.46 mile. In 27 miles, Dart's line has 25 stations, averaging a station every 1.1 mile. Why is it surprising Houston's Metro Red Line gets more ridership per mile? You're never further than a 1/4 mile between rail stations.

But, lets now compare the average speeds of the trains. Dart's Red Line trains average 25 mph, Metro's Red Line trains average 15 mph. When you're building a rail line out to the second ring of suburbs around a major city, speed is more important than riders/mile. I would like to point out Metro's Red Line doesn't even reach Houston's city limits in either the northern or southern direction. Additionally, it doesn't reach north of downtown Houston yet.

So, you're trying to compare Apples to Oranges. Dart has 13 member cities while Metro has 16 member cities. But, their Board of Directors are set up entirely differently. Metro has 7 Board Members, 5 appointed by Houston and 2 by the rest (15 cities). I think it is obvious Metro is set up to favor Houston unfairly. Meanwhile, Dart has 15 Board Members, split proportionally to member cities population. Presently, 8 represent Dallas, the remaining 7 represent the rest. I think it is obvious Dart isn't set up to favor Dallas unfairly.

Because of how the two Boards are set up, it easy to understand why Dart builds rail lines to the suburbs while Metro doesn't. I suggest the reason why Dart has twice the number of daily passengers on its trains is because rail actually goes to the suburbs.

Originally Posted by jtk1519

It does seem a little disingenuous to try and compare Houston's red line, which is in all reality a street car system, to DART's red line which is over 3 and half times longer. Now, if you could isolate just the section of red line that runs through downtown from the Cedars station to the Pearl station, then you could compare that to Houston's line because for that short stretch, the two lines are similar in design and execution, but beyond that the DART red line leaves the city streets and becomes a true rapid transit line.

My point was that Houston can't emulate DART as Urbanactivisttx suggested. I think DART's success is dubious since it does cover a lot more ground then METROs yet only has ~71,000 passengers currently but I am sure it will get better as the system grows. I wasn't trying to compare Houston to Dallas success but to show how two different types operate. I didn't have time to elaborate on it till now, I wasn't trying to start anything.

Houston needs LRT or a "streetcar system" or whatever you want to call it because Houston has significant employment centers within a 5 mile radius of downtown. Plus we already have a commuter system in place, which may not be as effective or flashy as rail but it's there. Maybe DART's setup is the best way to serve the Dallas metro; it seems to try and be a hybrid of commuter rail and light rail but offer none of the advantages of them.