The Next Youth-Magnet Cities

[brickell]

Originally Posted by Evergrey

Warm weather was the strongest predictor of metropolitan growth during the post-war suburban sprawl era... crappy weather cities may experience a bit of a resurgence since the Sunbelt produced almost universally awful metropolitan environments... traditional cities in the North have many great attributes... but sun and warmth will remain a major competitive advantage for the Sunbelt...

Here's another good one. I'm not saying that places like Pittsburgh can't be great cities. Seattle has done well despite their lack of sunshine, but to brush off the effects of climate completely seems disingenuous. By most measures, Pittsburgh and Buffalo are two of the more miserable places weather wise on the east coast.

PERCENT POSSIBLE SUNSHINE (ENTIRE UNITED STATES)
                                   (First Order Stations Only)

                 Greatest % Possible                    Least % Possible

             1. Yuma, AZ                90        1. Quillayute, WA          33
             2. Las Vegas, NV           85        2. Elkins, WV              40
             3. Phoenix, AZ             85        3. Pittsburgh, PA          45
             4. Tucson, AZ              85        4. Grand Rapids, MI        46
             5. El Paso, TX             84        5. Marquette, MI           46
             6. Fresno, CA              79        6. Syracuse, NY            46
             7. Reno, NV                79        7. Sault Ste. Marie, MI    47
             8. Flagstaff, AZ           78        8. Seattle-Tacoma Ap, WA   47
             9. Red Bluff, CA           78        9. Alpena, MI              48
            10. Sacramento, CA          78       10. Buffalo, NY             48
                                                 11. Portland, OR            48

src: http://www.wrcc.dri.edu/htmlfiles/western.extremes.html

[Codex]

Manchester, England.

Manchester - has the busiest gay village in Europe, one of the largest China Towns and Rusholme the cities curry mile has a Brick Lane feel to it. Manchester Northern Quarter is closely linked with the cities Bohemian scene. Manchester is also world famous for it's musical creativity and many bands, as well as clubs such as the late Hacienda. Manchester also has one of the largest student populations in Europe and is recognised as being one of the most creative cities in both the UK and Europe.

Manchester Bands -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...rom_Manchester

http://www.prideofmanchester.com/music/#history















































Manchester's Northern Quarter doubling as New York City for the film 'Alfie' (2004).





Canal Street at the Heart of Manchester's Gay Village - The Gay Village is one of the busiest in Europe.

http://www.manchester2002-uk.com/gay/gay-vill2.html

http://www.manchester2002-uk.com/gay/gay-vill1.html

[Brandon716]

Its obvious some people weigh weather more than others, but with that list - which looks like the source is weatherbase.com - you have to remember the possibility of sunshine has a certain stipulation. If a day is considered 'mostly cloudy' even though it has sunshine throughout, does that mean the day is considered a 0% possibility of sunshine day?

Yes, this region and the Pacific Northwest does have a cloudier time than much of the country, but I don't think its as much of a factor as people make it out to be. Just like Evergrey hated this year's summer months, I thought they were fantastic. 70'ish or 80'ish virtually every day and I don't think we had but two weeks where the temps rose to 90 or above. Ironically I think we had a heat wave in April for a week or two and then another one in late summer and that was it - perfect for me as I start to sweat profusely at 75 or above in the sun.

Evergrey, I can't help but see how you've started to have negative feelings about Pittsburgh all around since you've apparently lost your job recently. I hope things improve for you... I'm in the same boat job-wise, although I'm less inclined to blame the city for it as I've lost jobs all over the country at this point.

^BTW, Manchester looks quite the urban charm. Didn't know it was as gay friendly as it is. Thanks for sharing!

[jboy560]

I've always felt that Manchester was a nice place, but jeez...that city is beautiful! Great post!

[Evergrey]

Originally Posted by Codex

Manchester, England.

Manchester - has the busiest gay village in Europe, one of the largest China Towns and Rusholme the cities curry mile has a Brick Lane feel to it. Manchester Northern Quarter is closely linked with the cities Bohemian scene. Manchester is also world famous for it's musical creativity and many bands, as well as clubs such as the late Hacienda

these are lovely photos... but shouldn't this be a photo thread instead of a post within a City Discussion?

[Codex]

Originally Posted by Evergrey

these are lovely photos... but shouldn't this be a photo thread instead of a post within a City Discussion?

Thank you.

I posted them to show American forumers Manchester, as a picture is worth a thousand words, however I don't feel they need to be posted again in your post. I also do not plan to post any further pictures.

[Matthew]

The city to watch in North Carolina is Wilmington. They are creating jobs in a variety of fields, have interesting architecture, are an arts center and the city is on the coast. People are now discovering Wilmington. There is some concern about hurricanes though. The Wilmington area hasn't seen a hurricane since the 1990's.

[edmontonenthusiast]

Originally Posted by Codex

Thank you.

I posted them to show American forumers Manchester, as a picture is worth a thousand words, however I don't feel they need to be posted again in your post. I also do not plan to post any further pictures.

Thanks for doing this. It's nice to see different places discussed outside of the US or Canada.

[Jeff_in_Dayton]

After spending a few days in DC, I certainly agree that Washington is a youth magnet. Lots of people in their 20s and 30s. This does seem like a youthful city compared to what im used to in Ohio

[KB0679]

Originally Posted by Matthew

The city to watch in North Carolina is Wilmington. They are creating jobs in a variety of fields, have interesting architecture, are an arts center and the city is on the coast. People are now discovering Wilmington. There is some concern about hurricanes though. The Wilmington area hasn't seen a hurricane since the 1990's.

One of Wilmington's disadvantages is that it sorely lacks connectivity. It's a pain to get to anywhere besides Raleigh and points west via I-40.

[Matthew]

That is true, but it hasn't hurt Wilmington's growth over the past few years. Growth has accelerated and the area has gained a few headquarters. Wilmington is projected to grow from the 75,000 in 2000 to an estimated 105,000 - 110,000 people by 2010. If I-20 was extended to Wilmington, a population of 160,000 people by 2020 and a port twice as large as currently envisioned wouldn't surprise me. If an Interstate between Asheville and Wilmington, incorporating Charlotte's Independence Blvd., was built, it would help and maybe add a spur to Florence, if South Carolina will agree to build their section (not likely). NC could tell SC to build their end of I-20 or this new Interstate, if they want NC to build its ends of Interstates leading to South Carolina's coast. If I-20 ended in Wilmington, South Carolina would see a big impact at Charleston's port, from an Atlanta to Wilmington Interstate.

[Strange Meat]

Originally Posted by Codex

Thank you.

I posted them to show American forumers Manchester, as a picture is worth a thousand words, however I don't feel they need to be posted again in your post. I also do not plan to post any further pictures.

of course, moving to manchester isn't exactly an option for the vast vast majority of american youth.

[kool maudit]

"move to manchester: the smiths were great in the 80s"


?

[KB0679]

Originally Posted by Matthew

That is true, but it hasn't hurt Wilmington's growth over the past few years. Growth has accelerated and the area has gained a few headquarters. Wilmington is projected to grow from the 75,000 in 2000 to an estimated 105,000 - 110,000 people by 2010. If I-20 was extended to Wilmington, a population of 160,000 people by 2020 and a port twice as large as currently envisioned wouldn't surprise me. If an Interstate between Asheville and Wilmington, incorporating Charlotte's Independence Blvd., was built, it would help and maybe add a spur to Florence, if South Carolina will agree to build their section (not likely). NC could tell SC to build their end of I-20 or this new Interstate, if they want NC to build its ends of Interstates leading to South Carolina's coast. If I-20 ended in Wilmington, South Carolina would see a big impact at Charleston's port, from an Atlanta to Wilmington Interstate.

And this is exactly why SC will not agree to extend I-20 to Wilmington. From SC's point of view, it would make much more sense to have I-20 extended to, and terminate in, Myrtle Beach instead of Wilmington.

Being that Wilmington and Myrtle Beach are experiencing similar growth rates, I'm assuming that most of Wilmington's growth is from retirees, like Myrtle Beach's?

[Matthew]

Myrtle Beach doesn't have a port and doesn't have any jobs, outside cleaning hotel rooms, operating rides and retail/restaurants. Myrtle Beach is a retirement and tourist destination.

Wilmington attracted a corporate headquarters recently from another city in the Carolinas and PPD in Wilmington built a skyscraper recently for their corporate headquarters and those are very high paying jobs. Most companies like this are located at RTP. Add to this port expansion and jobs in these fields. Jobs is the difference between a retirement community and a youth magnet. Many young people want to live in some of the same places people want to retire at. Unfortunately, not all of these places have jobs. The cities on the coast or mountains creating jobs, will become youth magnets. And again, Wilmington has a great arts community. I have a few friends from Wilmington and have worked in independent film (post production). It's a great place, but I remember watching 8 out of every 10 hurricanes hitting Wilmington in the 1990's. Many of the people moving there have never evacuated for a hurricane. I have and remember the boarding-up, long lines in stores and bad traffic leaving.

[KB0679]

Originally Posted by Matthew

Myrtle Beach doesn't have a port and doesn't have any jobs, outside cleaning hotel rooms, operating rides and retail/restaurants. Myrtle Beach is a retirement and tourist destination.

Wilmington attracted a corporate headquarters recently from another city in the Carolinas and PPD in Wilmington built a skyscraper recently for their corporate headquarters and those are very high paying jobs. Most companies like this are located at RTP. Add to this port expansion and jobs in these fields. Jobs is the difference between a retirement community and a youth magnet. Many young people want to live in some of the same places people want to retire at. Unfortunately, not all of these places have jobs. The cities on the coast or mountains creating jobs, will become youth magnets. And again, Wilmington has a great arts community. I have a few friends from Wilmington and have worked in independent film (post production). It's a great place, but I remember watching 8 out of every 10 hurricanes hitting Wilmington in the 1990's. Many of the people moving there have never evacuated for a hurricane. I have and remember the boarding-up, long lines in stores and bad traffic leaving.

I'm aware of the lack of corporate presence in Myrtle Beach and Wilmington's respectable corporate presence, but it still seems reasonable to assume that most of Wilmington's growth is due to retirees. From 2000-2008, Myrtle Beach grew by 60K people; Wilmington grew by 72K people (more than any other MSA in the state except Charlotte and Raleigh). I know the two cities have their differences, but I'd suspect that at least half of Wilmington's growth is driven by retirees.

[brickell]

Not to pick on Wilmington, but being a "youth magnet" seems to be about more than just jobs and arts. It may be improving but it's got a lot of competition.

Is it reasonable to assume that DC, Atlanta and Houston are the biggest youth draws for the south right now? Is Florida on their radar?

[Matthew]

The key word is "Next." D.C., Atlanta and Houston are "Current" youth magnets. I moved to Atlanta, because Asheville (a great place to retire) doesn't have jobs. Many young people love Asheville, but can't find a job and leave after college. Wilmington has potential to be a "Next" youth magnet. And Florida is an example of a "Current" youth magnet area filled with retirees. Notice the Florida cities with jobs are the cities attracting young people. As I said, retirees look for the same things young people look for, but retirees don't need a job and can live anywhere. Young people need a job. Wilmington is the "little Hollywood," with movie studios, a beautiful and historic downtown with bars and restaurants, a great arts scene and Wilmington has an ocean. Combine this with jobs and it has potential to be a next youth magnet. In North Carolina, its difficult to beat Wilmington.

[cabasse]

Originally Posted by brickell

Not to pick on Wilmington, but being a "youth magnet" seems to be about more than just jobs and arts. It may be improving but it's got a lot of competition.

Is it reasonable to assume that DC, Atlanta and Houston are the biggest youth draws for the south right now? Is Florida on their radar?

like uhhh helloooooo miami?!

new orleans comes to mind as well

[Jasonhouse]

Originally Posted by brickell

Is it reasonable to assume that DC, Atlanta and Houston are the biggest youth draws for the south right now? Is Florida on their radar?

If it is, it really shouldn't be, save for young grads in certain specialized professions.