What makes a city big?

[The Chemist]

Originally Posted by DungHeap

I was born and raised in Calgary and always though it was a big city. That was my perspective then. Now, however I don"t think of Calgary as a big city at all. The reason being, I now live just outside of Tokyo which is just a sprawling mass where you can"t tell one area from another. I truly realized how small Calgary was (for me) when I flew back last New Year. Looking out the plane window, it appeared so small. I was a little taken aback to be honest. It really felt different because I had been away for a while.

I know it's really hard to compare Calgary to Tokyo, but that is what has affected my view of Calgary as a big city or not. Maybe I was a little naive, I had never really though about it until we were on the plane. Living in a crowded mass of humanity has showed me just how lucky Calgary is to have space and so few people. From one extreme to the next I suppose. I know everyone won't have the same opinion just my experience from the last 4 years or so.

Thank you for this thread it is something I have really been thinking about lately. I think it is so interesting to get different views.

Replace Tokyo with Shanghai, and this is exactly how I feel. Took the words right out of my mouth.

[The Chemist]

Originally Posted by floobie

People have different definitions of big for sure. I'll throw out of a few things that make a city feel big to me:

- Big bridges. Vancouver definitely shines in that respect. Calgary doesn't, and can't, realistically.
- Rail transit. Grade separated especially. And lots of it.
- Some big ass elevated streets that span much of the city, while most of the inner city ones are small and dense.
- A biggish, populated metro area. This is something Calgary won't realistically have for a long time. But, I'm not really that disparate to have it. I like how it's basically instant rural once you leave the city limits. The contrast makes the urban portions feel more urban to me.
- Population density... Obviously.
- People walking around. Calgary's core could use more of this. The office district could stand to diversify a bit.
- The skyline. Calgary definitely covers that base.
- Multiple denser districts outside of the main core.

Shanghai meets every one of these criteria. It's a big city's big city.

[Calgarian]

Density, vibrancy and lots of amenities. Calgary is getting there, still have about 10 years worth of work before we really have that big city feel I would guess. The last 10 years has seen this city come a long way, hopefully the next 10 will be even better.

[Ferreth]

What makes a big city feel big?

- Diversity. Any kind of restaurant you can think of. Many different cultures, living intermingled and in their own areas. Different areas of the city have a different look and feel.
- A big city never sleeps. There are always cars on the road, and at least a few people on the streets of denser areas. Transit is always available in some form.
- Buy anything. You don't have to go the next bigger city to buy stuff.
- Lots of transit infrastructure: at least some sort of train or subway system.
- Density. Not everywhere, but at least one large area and some smaller ones scattered around it.
- Cultural and sporting destination. You have big name attractions that draw people in from far and wide.

My feeling is that Calgary is just crossing into the "big city" realm. It felt like a medium - sized city growing up in the '80's to me - Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal were the only big cities at that time. For me, the things that are pushing Calgary in to the big city realm are better high end retail, and more people out at at all times of the day. There is never a time in Calgary anymore that the roads are truly dead. Calgary is still weak on high end retail and specialty stores - but it's getting better. Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver are still usually getting stores before Calgary, but not always, and Calgary is usually right behind "the big 3" in terms of getting a new retailer. The other glaring thing missing is that transit is NOT always available in some form. We need night buses running the core lines to finally cross into the big city realm in my books.

I'm going to open a can of worms here, but Edmonton to me does not feel like a big city - yet. It doesn't really have the one big high density area (Calgary's CDB and beltline) and it seems very dead to me at 3 in the morning when I've been there, at least compared to Calgary. I'm not sure about being able to buy anything - I'd suspect Calgary has Edmonton beat on the high end retail and specialty stores as well.

[ACT7]

Very interesting thread.

I think probably the single biggest factor for me is street life. Lots of people have already said high density communities, especially the downtown, but I think to truly have a real big city feel, it has to extend beyond the downtown. To me, street life would include neighbourhood upon neighbourhood of sidewalk cafes, eclectic restaurants, both local and international retail (street front stores, although big malls can surprisingly add to a big city feel if done right). Major international events also help but not just one time things like the Olympics - consitent and sustainable ones. Thriving music, arts, and sports scenes help.

Some of the more intangible qualities I find are things such as feeling like, when you're driving into a city, there's a such a huge difference between the high density urban core and the surrounding suburbs. I don't know if Calgary is quite there yet. I find that the 'street life' feel downtown isn't all that different from the suburbs, other than during office hours. For me, probably the single biggest intangible is the weirdness of humanity that big cities have. The variety of people, not just ethnic variety.

These things tend to happen organically over time, but urban planning has a lot to do with it. Until Calgary develops more higher density living, the 'big city feel' may not happen as quickly as we hope.

[CorporateWhore]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

Density, vibrancy and lots of amenities. Calgary is getting there, still have about 10 years worth of work before we really have that big city feel I would guess. The last 10 years has seen this city come a long way, hopefully the next 10 will be even better.

10 years is way too optimistic. It's probably more like 50 for us to reach that level.....that's if we ever do. Calgary is still a landlocked city in the middle of nowhere when you look at things objectively. Outside of the economy, there's not a lot of other things to draw people here if they don't have a local connection. If energy goes downhill, we'd turn into Winnipeg 2.0.

We will never be a truly big city.....Tokyo, Shanghai, NYC or even Toronto...never gonna happen. But I can see us being a Minneapolis or Seattle in 30 years. Minneapolis already looks and feels like like Calgary and Edmonton combined.

[RyLucky]

Great topic!

What makes a city "big"? What makes a city "great"? Do we want to be "big" or do we want to be "great"?

I've traveled to 33 cities in Europe, a dozen in the United States, and a dozen in Asia. One thing that sets North American cities apart from the rest of the world are our vast green spaces, an important determinant of quality of life. The WHO recommend cities have 9 m^2 of green space per capita. Calgary has 78 m^2 per capita, not including semi-public spaces like Heritage Park, COP, and golf courses. Our parks are safe, free, have free amenities like public washrooms, and are cultural gathering spots. We have everything from naturalized areas to manicured gardens. Many spaces serve multiple roles, such as water retention, recreation, wildlife protection, and cycling corridor. Simply put, our park system is second to none. Other Canadian and American cities have great park systems as well, but this is rare in the rest of the world.

The other thing that sets Calgary apart from even other Canadian cities (ie Toronto) is the feeling of community, ownership, and optimism. Where else do thousands of volunteers wake up at 4 am in all corners of the city to cook free pancakes for their neighbours?

Our public spaces in combination with our public involvement drastically improve our quality of life relative to many of the big cities in the world. I believe as Calgary continues to grow, this will only improve, especially if we make the right choices. Maybe I'll write another post regarding what specifically Calgary needs to improve.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by freeweed

I suppose that depends if you're only including Toronto proper or not. I think it's a bit unfair to punish Calgary for going with a unicity concept - the GTA has far more low density SFH sprawl than Calgary.

Outside of the CBD and surrounding area (and I'll grant that it's HUGE), the GTA just goes for miles and miles of low density. Still feels pretty "big city" to me due to the sheer scale of it all.

Keep in mind that the GTA also has a fair number of older preserved small-town "downtowns" in its urban area (Port Credit, Oakville etc.) as well as newly built city-centres (Mississauga, Markham, Scarborough etc.). These all contribute to the big city feel.

In Calgary once you leave downtown and a couple surrounding neighbourhoods it's only suburbs. Bowness kind of has an old town feel but even still not that much.

For a closer comparison I'd suggest Calgary and Ottawa. Calgary certainly has a bigger and more impressive downtown but Ottawa has probably 3 or 4 the number of older urban neighbourhoods such as the Queen W example DizzyEdge posted. The reason for this of course is simply that Ottawa was a city of almost 100k when Calgary wasn't much more than a railway stop.

Calgary feels more and more like a big city every time I go back in comparison to when I was growing up, but getting all the way there will mean a lot of redevelopment of areas outside of the core. Which seems to be happening at an increased pace now.

[flar]

I'd say it's the layers, and that used, worked-in feel. It's hard for a newish city like Calgary to have it, but in time it will.

[RyLucky]

Here is my $20B wishlist of infrastructure to make Calgary a world class city:

-SELRT, NCLRT, Eighth Ave Subway, LRT to 17th Ave SE, FMC, Rockyview, MRU, CIA
-A 20-30 000 person downtown convention Centre
-A central library with world-class architecture
-Improved bike infrastructure through Downtown and the Beltline, especially across the CPR tracks
-West Village redevelopment
-regional rail network
-A better streetside environment in the Beltline (street wall, foliage separating pedestrians and cars, etc)
-improved pedestrian environment in industrial areas
-higher density at every suburban c-train station. Redevelopment of 'big box' shopping malls
-a direct path from U of C to FMC
-better cooperation with Tsuu T'ina (not only for the sake of the ringroad, but also to develop social integration and historical & cultural assets)
-one or two more major tourist attractions (ie. a 200-foot sandstone castle at Shaganappi Golf Course)

We are on the right track. The projects underway will greatly improve the city:
-Airport expansion, Riverwalk, Stampede redevelopment, 13th Ave greenbelt

[Neon_Xeon]

I think another factor that contributes to the big-city feel is the economy. Calgary's economy is mostly based on the energy industry, and I think this reason is something preventing us from moving forward. Big cities like Toronto, NYC, San Francisco, etc...... all have diversified economies. And of course, along with the stuff on everyones wishlist on here.

[logan5]

Noticed this thread in the Canada section...

The C Train is a high quality rapid transit system, so it's surprising to see so little transit oriented development in Calgary as this is a major component to a "big city" feel - it's a catalyst for density. I guess there's not enough demand for it or it's the policy makers - not sure actually.

Like others are saying density is the key.

[MichaelS]

Definitely not the policy makers in Calgary. We have very good transit oriented policies. I have a feeling it is more just the market demand, but this appears to be shifting. Give it time and we will see these nodes build up even more.

[CorporateWhore]

One of the reasons Calgary is no where close to being a big city.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/opinion...029/story.html

Big cities embrace their cultural institutions and nourish them, not ignore them to the point of irrelevance. The state of cultural institutions here is frankly embarrassing.

[Wooster]

^ visual arts institutions are not in great shape - performing arts institutions are doing just fine - for example National Music Centre, Epcor Centre, Folk Fest etc.

With the Glenbow, I think they should simply be taken over by the Province - their operating model doesn't seem to make much sense. I also feel Glenbow has a bit of an identity crisis - it needs to decide to be a museum of civilization/history and let another institution emerge as a proper visual art gallery. Lots of opportunity too for the old science centre site for visual arts.

[DizzyEdge]

or just be all about western canada, and leave the other exhibits to some Calgary branch of the RAM

[TallBob]

Corporate: I agree with your last 2 posts. Calgary in time is probably on the line of Minneapolis/St Paul, Denver, Vancouver a stretch, but that's about it... Don't know about 30 - 40 years from now. But it'll never be in TO's catagory or Chicago, SF, ect. It isn't allways about "Who's got the tallest buildings" or how big the new public library should be (Libraries were a great urban asset at one time, but not anymore). IMO. It's the diversity of it's people and their livelyhood's, ect, ect. The poulation of the area will eventually determine how good/great any city will be. You can't allways build your way to a "Cosmopolitan" environment. It helps, but no sure thing. Just my 2 cents.

[Kilgore Trout]

There's definitely an intangible element in what makes a city feel "big." There's a kind of insouciance that all big cities share.

Density and population are important too but it's always good to remember that there are some very dense, very bustling cities that feel like complete backwaters -- just come to Asia to see what I mean.

[Xelebes]

When the north side of the (Bow) river develops density and a skyline, making Calgary's downtown feel like it is already too large or full.

[Bassic Lab]

Originally Posted by Kilgore Trout

There's definitely an intangible element in what makes a city feel "big." There's a kind of insouciance that all big cities share.

Density and population are important too but it's always good to remember that there are some very dense, very bustling cities that feel like complete backwaters -- just come to Asia to see what I mean.

I agree that there is definitely something beyond density and population that does it. I think it has something to do with having a place in historical, cultural, political, and economic trends that gives a city a wider identity that the world recognizes. Rome could empty out but it is still going to be Rome and it will always feel important.

To that end, I think it has a lot to do with population and time merely because both increase the chance of something remarkable developing or happening. It also simply serves to raise awareness, increasing the chance that a place is referenced in the popular culture. Notice that the "big Canadian cities" (Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver) are the ones that get referenced in American films?

Being an energy centre in a time of growing energy scarcity will likely help Calgary in this regard. So will small things that just put the name out there, like being the Prime Minister's hometown.