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  #25001  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 3:16 PM
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emathias emathias is offline
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Originally Posted by k1052 View Post
Fulton River Park is basically unusable for anyone but dog owners now. They had to cancel the movie series they were running a while back because there was too much crap on the grass all the time. I walk by it twice a day 5 days a week and would never consider setting foot on the grass for fear of landmines. As for the sidewalks...yea...a lot of sidewalks in the area have a perpetual poop problem. I do wish there were some effective enforcement options.
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
^ That won't work. It's been shown time and again that the severity of the punishment barely has any deterrent effect, it's the odds of being caught that matter. So unless we are going to install dog poop cameras, this behavior will continue as it does now.
That is the one thing I hate about Paris, which is otherwise my favorite city: the sheer amount of literal crap on the sidewalks.

I think severity of punishment does factor in. The City should basically have two punishments: 1) $100 fine for the first offense, 2) second offense for dog nuisance violations is $500 AND permanent confiscation of the pet. If people start losing their dogs due to not cleaning up the crap, I think the problem will take care of itself very, very quickly.

I know that isn't fair to the dog, but it's not fair to kids to have the health risk associated with feces both directly and indirectly from the rat populations it contributes to.
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  #25002  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 3:41 PM
Kenmore Kenmore is offline
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yeah, pet owners who don't pick up their crap are the worst.

fwiw, people in and around margate park are so much better than when i lived in evanston...which was a total disaster
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  #25003  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 5:07 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
^^^ What exactly is a NY style hotdog? One that has sat in lukewarm water all day in a cart on the street and then smothered in ketchup?
A flimsy weiner on a plain bun.

You can argue Chicago vs New York style pizza till you're blue, but when it comes to hot dogs, Chicago definitely bitch slaps New York into submission.
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  #25004  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 8:14 PM
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ChiTownWonder ChiTownWonder is offline
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Originally Posted by emathias View Post
That is the one thing I hate about Paris, which is otherwise my favorite city: the sheer amount of literal crap on the sidewalks.

I think severity of punishment does factor in. The City should basically have two punishments: 1) $100 fine for the first offense, 2) second offense for dog nuisance violations is $500 AND permanent confiscation of the pet. If people start losing their dogs due to not cleaning up the crap, I think the problem will take care of itself very, very quickly.

I know that isn't fair to the dog, but it's not fair to kids to have the health risk associated with feces both directly and indirectly from the rat populations it contributes to.
I'm all for the fine, but confiscation of the pet? way too far. I don't know if you have a dog(i dont), but owners of dogs love them like children. Sometimes couples get a dog to be like their child. you cant just take them away. yea its annoying to see dog shit in the park and the people that don't pick it up are jackasses, but take their dog away? its not really fair. the fine makes sense and should go up every time they disobey the law.
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  #25005  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 8:44 PM
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I'm all for the fine, but confiscation of the pet? way too far. I don't know if you have a dog(i dont), but owners of dogs love them like children. Sometimes couples get a dog to be like their child. you cant just take them away. yea its annoying to see dog shit in the park and the people that don't pick it up are jackasses, but take their dog away? its not really fair. the fine makes sense and should go up every time they disobey the law.
And if a parent was constantly allowing their child to shit on the sidewalk, how long would it be before the child was taken by child protective services? Being a parent has a level of responsibility, and if you demonstrate you can't live up to that level the state does step in. I don't see a difference here.

Last edited by emathias; Jul 21, 2014 at 9:15 PM.
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  #25006  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by emathias View Post
And if a parent was constantly allowing their child to shit on the sidewalk, how long would it be before the child was taken by child protective services? Being a parent has a level of responsibility, and if you demonstrate you can't live up to that level the state does step in. I don't see a difference here.
The child would be taken because 1, people don't go to the bathroom outside. allowing your child to do so is improper instruction of the child. It would be like if a parent taught a kid that its OK to swear in public. dogs go outside in the first place so its not like they are wrong to go inside and they should be taught to go inside, a human child is diffrent than a dog
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  #25007  
Old Posted Jul 21, 2014, 10:22 PM
Rizzo Rizzo is offline
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Simple enforcement and community service would address the pet problem. Reason people don't care is because they can afford the small $150 fine. But burden them chores that take time? You know they'll be upset. Community service will show them civic responsibility and that it takes time to clean up litter on the streets.
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  #25008  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:04 AM
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Originally Posted by emathias View Post
That is the one thing I hate about Paris, which is otherwise my favorite city: the sheer amount of literal crap on the sidewalks.
Paris is pretty bad, but clearly you've never been to Bueno Aires.

The most exclusive high-rent, top one-precent districts in that city are literally covered in pet shit. No one even attempts to pick it up or even avoid stomping upon it. Civic pride is shockingly poor down there. Their world-renowned opera house still has "fuck Bush" graffiti on the side of it. C'mon!
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  #25009  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:05 AM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by Hayward View Post
Simple enforcement and community service would address the pet problem. Reason people don't care is because they can afford the small $150 fine. But burden them chores that take time? You know they'll be upset. Community service will show them civic responsibility and that it takes time to clean up litter on the streets.
The reason people don't care is that there is virtually no risk of enforcement. How many people do you know who have been caught and ticketed? Probably none. Meanwhile people care a hell of a lot more about a $60 street sweeping ticket because there is a near 100% probability of getting fined if you leave your car on the street on street sweeping day. Who do you know who has gotten a sweeper ticket? Probably everyone you know who regularly keeps their car on the street has had at least one if not multiple instances of being fined for that.
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  #25010  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:19 AM
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Looks like this may be happening soon? 27 unit building at the triangular lot at Oak & Larrabee with some ground floor retail. Demolition permit was issued on 7/11 for the only building on the entire lot.

http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2...rrabee-oak.php
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  #25011  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:24 AM
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Originally Posted by marothisu View Post
Looks like this may be happening soon? 27 unit building at the triangular lot at Oak & Larrabee with some ground floor retail. Demolition permit was issued on 7/11 for the only building on the entire lot.

http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2...rrabee-oak.php
Fingers crossed for something more urban and forward thinking compared to its neighbors. Not holding my breath though.
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  #25012  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:28 AM
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Fingers crossed for something more urban and forward thinking compared to its neighbors. Not holding my breath though.
I think what you see in that link is what we will get. I do wish something denser was there too. The lot isn't huge but it could support more for sure. It would be a cool spot for a midrise, especially for all those workers at 600 W Chicago.

I think those upscale townhomes are going up nearby that too.
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  #25013  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 6:04 AM
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Originally Posted by marothisu View Post
Looks like this may be happening soon? 27 unit building at the triangular lot at Oak & Larrabee with some ground floor retail. Demolition permit was issued on 7/11 for the only building on the entire lot.

http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2...rrabee-oak.php
Very sad for me. this plot could look so cool if a larger building were to be put there, dont really like the design either. these triangular plots are my favorite because they result in buildings like the flatiron in NY or the one on Milwaukee and Damon. but still its good to see the Cabrini area being developed.
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  #25014  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 1:26 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Some more possible West Loop news too. 3 buildings around Lake & Aberdeen were issued demolition permits last Thursday. Curbed had an article last summer about a 20 unit contemporary condo building, not cheap, that will go up there. Again though, wish it was denser.

http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2...p-contempo.php

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  #25015  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 1:41 PM
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emathias emathias is offline
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Originally Posted by marothisu View Post
Some more possible West Loop news too. 3 buildings around Lake & Aberdeen were issued demolition permits last Thursday. Curbed had an article last summer about a 20 unit contemporary condo building, not cheap, that will go up there. Again though, wish it was denser.

http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2...p-contempo.php

That would be a nice building. In some small, rural town.
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  #25016  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 1:55 PM
joeg1985 joeg1985 is offline
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^ Pretty slick looking building. Is this on the south or north side of Lake? All that open air space facing the tracks might not be very pleasant. It will certainly look cool as you whiz by on the L however.
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  #25017  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 2:38 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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^ Pretty slick looking building. Is this on the south or north side of Lake? All that open air space facing the tracks might not be very pleasant. It will certainly look cool as you whiz by on the L however.
I'm about 99.8% sure the long side of the building is actually facing Aberdeen. So at least the front of the units will not be facing the tracks. According to that article too, the 4 bed/3 bath are $800K-$950K and since it was written a year ago it could possibly be even more now?
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  #25018  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:04 PM
SamInTheLoop SamInTheLoop is offline
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^^^^ ^^^ I totally get and am sympathetic to the complaints about lower density and shorter than this one should be......on the other hand, boy do I love this design!! (similarly torn with the Studio Dwell project on the near north side - I think somewhere in the greater ex-Cabrini area.......)
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  #25019  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 4:09 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop View Post
^^^^ ^^^ I totally get and am sympathetic to the complaints about lower density and shorter than this one should be......on the other hand, boy do I love this design!! (similarly torn with the Studio Dwell project on the near north side - I think somewhere in the greater ex-Cabrini area.......)
I'm more torn on the West Loop one because at least Cabrini will need to have some number of lowrise buildings. We can't expect all of Cabrini to be highrises or it will have the same problems as the South Loop with a lack of street level character. We are building a neighborhood from scratch there and that means we should seek out some high density buildings and some lower density infill as well. There will be plenty of space left there for highrises down the road and we already getting some like the Grec design by Target.
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  #25020  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2014, 5:23 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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My concern for any major selling off of land, such as the Cabrini Green redevelopment, remains the city's almost reflexive tendency to do it this way. Are we simply never doing to see land cordoned off into smaller preZoned lots and sold off any more? That is the only way to insure that we will get the fine grained development that we all cherish in our cities. Otherwise expect to see a bunch of replicas of the New City development.
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