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  #6121  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 8:03 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
(I realize some might say "but Toronto", but Toronto is twice the size and can support a team much more readily as a result.)
Eh? Who would say "but Toronto"? There has always been a massive NBA-ready population in the GTA, of which the 600,000-strong black population is of course a large part of that. And the GTA is legitimately a second-tier basketball talent feeder.

It's the only city in Canada that works for the NBA.
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  #6122  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 8:08 PM
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^ I know. I put that there expecting someone to say that if Toronto could support a team, that Vancouver could too. They're two very different cities.
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  #6123  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 8:21 PM
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Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
Vancouver didn't fail as a market, though. The owner wanted out, the Canadian dollar killed the team, and the NBA lockout was the nail in the coffin.
Fair enough but I don't know how good I to would look for the league to go back to a "failed" market before trying those that haven't had a chance yet. I use failed loosely after what you stated but that's how I see it anyways.
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  #6124  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 8:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
Eh? Who would say "but Toronto"? There has always been a massive NBA-ready population in the GTA, of which the 600,000-strong black population is of course a large part of that. And the GTA is legitimately a second-tier basketball talent feeder.

It's the only city in Canada that works for the NBA.
Toronto is the best basketball city in Canada I agree. The second is probably... wait... ready for this?... Halifax.

But I've always found Canadian cities (even the best ones) have quite bit less of a grassroots basketball culture than will even your random American city that is not really known for being a basketball hotbed. And even in small cities and towns basketball culture runs deep across almost the entire USA. (I realize this is changing rapidly, especially in Toronto.)

None of this is surprising though, given the place of hockey in the Canada sportsphere.
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  #6125  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 8:40 PM
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Yeah, I definitely wouldn't say that a Seattle team would cover "the market" there. It's too far. Right now, people cheer for the Blue Jays, not the Mariners. Basketball fans here won't give a rat's ass about a Seattle NBA team. It'll continue to be the Raptors/Golden State/Cleveland/whatever other team people feel like bandwagonning.
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  #6126  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 3:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Toronto is the best basketball city in Canada I agree. The second is probably... wait... ready for this?... Halifax.

But I've always found Canadian cities (even the best ones) have quite bit less of a grassroots basketball culture than will even your random American city that is not really known for being a basketball hotbed. And even in small cities and towns basketball culture runs deep across almost the entire USA. (I realize this is changing rapidly, especially in Toronto.)

None of this is surprising though, given the place of hockey in the Canada sportsphere.
Americans like sports more than we do. We do hockey, mainly. And some curling, I guess. Then there are the North American mainstays, football and baseball, that have essentially rubbed off on us.

Everything else is niche. There's a serious Raptors' fan base in the GTA, but elsewhere? You don't see the games on the TVs in the sports bar here in Stratford, for instance.
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  #6127  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 3:31 AM
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
I actually know someone who has been with the Grizzlies organization since the beginning, amazingly enough. According to him Vancouver is never getting an NBA franchise again, and the news of the move to Memphis was met with unqualified excitement and relief. Vancouver was essentially the Atlanta Flames of the NBA. It just didn't work.

From what he tells me the next two additions for the NBA will be Seattle and Las Vegas.
They were part of the problem as the Grizzlies were poorly run from top to bottom. From the basketball executives who blew draft picks, to the business side that had poor marketing and did zero community outreach. I remember a long-form story that outlined the Vancouver Grizzlies didn't have a youth outreach strategy. They put up billboards and opened the door and expected people to come watch games. It was a flawed way to do things and they messed it up.

Vancouver is a weird sports market but Basketball is a sport that would tap into the younger and ethnic demographics there. You don't need millions of fans for an NBA team, Toronto does fine with its 100,000 rabid basketball fans.

Lastly, the dollar does not matter. These sports teams now are sophisticated and get savings elsewhere. NBA teams receive large revenue payments from the league in $USD, everything they do with New York is $USD, they pay talent in $USD and have grown to hold US $ accounts to help hedge against currency fluctuations. Toronto Raptors also have the benefit of having near exclusive ability to market and grow revenues here in Canada as they have the market all to themselves. Raptors are more than fine, people forget they bring in more revenue each year to MLSE than the Maple Leafs. This isn't the 90s anymore.
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  #6128  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 4:40 AM
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Fair enough but I don't know how good I to would look for the league to go back to a "failed" market before trying those that haven't had a chance yet. I use failed loosely after what you stated but that's how I see it anyways.
The NHL, at least, has done it repeatedly....Winnipeg, Atlanta, Denver, Minnesota....and San Jose isn't far from the Bay Area.
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  #6129  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 4:56 AM
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The NBA is like Top 40 music... shallow and completely image driven. The Raptors have to show Drake's face every 30 seconds to keep its young fans interested. The NBA is not a league for terribly bright people.

Sure there's a chance the NBA could come back to Vancouver, and it would probably be a lot more successful than last time, but we have no hope of winning a championship. We don't have a hip hop superstar in Vancouver to give the team the high profile image that motivates these players. Also, Vancouver is completely unknown to these guys. This is Siberia to them, so they will simply not give 100%, or even 90%. The team would give up on the city from day one, just like they did last time.

Vancouver's more of a baseball city...
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  #6130  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 4:44 PM
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Then there are the North American mainstays, football and baseball, that have essentially rubbed off on us.
Other way around. Football is a Canadian sport that the Americans bastardized.
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  #6131  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2017, 3:21 PM
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Originally Posted by logan5 View Post
The NBA is like Top 40 music... shallow and completely image driven. The Raptors have to show Drake's face every 30 seconds to keep its young fans interested.
I didn't want to say it, but I think there's some truth there. People like to suggest that young Asians are into basketball and that a team in Vancouver is a nobrainer. However, I think they're probably more into the culture generally, which has kind of become conflated with youth culture in general, than actually paying money to watch NBA basketball itself.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure if the NBA came back to Vancouver there would be plenty of Chinese faces in the stands... I just don't think there would be enough of them. I think interest in basketball is more about the look, the music, maybe shooting around with your friends at the basketball court, etc. It's not about watching the Grizzlies vs. the Bucks when Vancouver is 20 games out of first place.
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  #6132  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2017, 4:25 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
I didn't want to say it, but I think there's some truth there. People like to suggest that young Asians are into basketball and that a team in Vancouver is a nobrainer. However, I think they're probably more into the culture generally, which has kind of become conflated with youth culture in general, than actually paying money to watch NBA basketball itself.
If it's cool to go to people in Vancouver will go to it. You can see that if the Canucks start losing people stop going - if they're not winning they're not cool to go to and be seen at. It works on similar levels for the Whitecaps and Lions.

If a team is perceived as cool and hip they'll pack the stands in Vancouver, otherwise they'll be middling. I'm not sure how a prospective MLB team would be perceived like an NBA team would be. I think an NBA team would do well initially but if they start losing (again) I don't know how long support would hold out for.
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  #6133  
Old Posted Dec 31, 2017, 2:16 PM
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Canada defends Spengler Cup title with victory over Switzerland
Canadian Press December 31, 2017

DAVOS, Switzerland – Canada has won its third straight Spengler Cup, beating Switzerland 3-0 on Sunday.

It’s the country’s 15th time winning the title overall.

Goaltender Kevin Poulin led the game, making 36 saves in the shutout.

After a scoreless first period, Zach Boychuk and Maxim Noreau both scored in the second.

David McIntyre gave the Canadians a more comfortable lead in the third.

Hockey Canada is using the six-team tournament as a final evaluation before deciding on its Olympic roster next month.
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  #6134  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 6:03 PM
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My pick ( Brooke Henderson) for Canadian female athlete of the year.

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And now the 2 time Canadian Press Canadian female athlete of the year. And she just turned 20!

https://globalnews.ca/news/3934877/b...e-of-the-year/
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  #6135  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2018, 7:04 PM
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Raps are 2nd in the east (2.5 behind Boston but 5 games in hand). 4th in the entire league (with 2 games in hand on the Warriors).

Just an actual status report on a Canadian's invention... not home-grown talent but cheering is about nothing but net. ;-)
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  #6136  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2018, 7:25 PM
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Two good Winnipeg boys, Kenny Omega and Chris Jericho, put on a show at Japan's version of Wrestlemania at the Tokyo Dome early this morning. Putting my homer hat on, it's kind of cool to see a couple of guys from here work their way up from the local indy circuit years ago to the heights of the wrestling world.


Source: deadspin.com
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  #6137  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2018, 7:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Maldive View Post
Raps are 2nd in the east (2.5 behind Boston but 5 games in hand). 4th in the entire league (with 2 games in hand on the Warriors).

Just an actual status report on a Canadian's invention... not home-grown talent but cheering is about nothing but net. ;-)

Last year Raps only finished 2 GB the Celts for top spot in the East. If Demar and Kyle didn't suffer lengthy injuries, Raps would have for sure finished 1st. Year before they finished only 1 GB Cavs.

As expected though, Cavs weren't trying to finish 1st. They'll do the minimum to finish with a respectable record save their stars for the playoffs.

Nonetheless, would have been a nice feeling to finish 1st, but that means nothing come playoff time. Just a couple years ago ATL finished 1st at 60-22 and got smacked by the Cavs in the Conf. finals.

But in a league where only 3 and sometimes 4 or 5 teams have a chance at the championship, if you can finish 1st in the conference, might as well enjoy the feeling while it lasts. Go Raps!
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  #6138  
Old Posted Jan 5, 2018, 3:02 AM
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Originally Posted by HomerSPC View Post
Other way around. Football is a Canadian sport that the Americans bastardized.
You're absolutely correct but I doubt you'll ever convince some Canadians of that.
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  #6139  
Old Posted Jan 5, 2018, 5:29 AM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
Two good Winnipeg boys, Kenny Omega and Chris Jericho, put on a show at Japan's version of Wrestlemania at the Tokyo Dome early this morning. Putting my homer hat on, it's kind of cool to see a couple of guys from here work their way up from the local indy circuit years ago to the heights of the wrestling world.
It really was a terrific match, and likely the most accessible match on the card for non-wrestling fans. Jericho is 47 but can still wrestle a match with the best of them.

Canada was all over the card last night. Michael Elgin is from Oshawa, and several others (most notably Kushida) have spent significant time working in Canada. Even if it gets put down regularly, it's cool to see the country's mark on professional wrestling.
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  #6140  
Old Posted Jan 5, 2018, 2:52 PM
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^ I am not really a wrestling fan, my interest is mainly limited to nostalgia from watching it when I was a kid. I got caught up in the hype for this match though, so for the first time in probably at least 25 years I watched a pay per view event.

I have never seen a NJPW match before and I watched the Jericho/Omega one expecting a super-technical, high-flying display, and I ended up with some kind of circa 1978 NWA brawl, at least during the first half

Spectacular match though, and downright riveting from start to finish.
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