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  #481  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 5:42 PM
freerover freerover is online now
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I'm skeptical the power outage at the Atlanta will make much of an impact but I guess you never know.


Will Atlanta's airport outage hurt its Amazon HQ2 bid?
http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/19/tech...nta/index.html
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The massive power outage that crippled Atlanta's main airport on Sunday came at a particularly bad time. The city is believed to be a leading contender to host Amazon's second headquarters.
Experts cite Atlanta's cost of living, talent pool and access to the world's busiest airport as some of its top advantages.
But now one of its biggest selling points -- Hartfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport -- could also be a trouble spot.
"The timing is really horrible for Atlanta," Ilir Hysa, a senior economist at Moody's Analytics, told CNN Tech. "Amazon might be in the process of short listing who's in and who's out at this point."
The airport outage began with a fire at a Georgia Power underground electrical facility, according to Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed. The fire stranded passengers on planes and in dark terminals. More than 1,000 flights were canceled in and out of the airport. The cause of the fire is still being evaluated.

"[The airport] turns now from an attraction to sort of a problem," said Hysa.
Related: Cities are doing wacky things to host Amazon's second headquarters
While Hysa doesn't believe the incident will stop Amazon from choosing Atlanta, the outage will likely become a talking point.
"It definitely will be on its radar," he said. Amazon will probably want to learn more about what triggered the issue and whether it has the potential to happen again, Hysa added.
Earlier this year, Amazon encouraged cities to submit proposals to host its second headquarters. The company later said 238 cities and regions across North America sent in requests for consideration.
Amazon says it's looking for a suburban or urban area with more than 1 million people and access to mass transit, as well the ability to attract technical talent. The new facility, to be called HQ2, will cost at least $5 billion to construct.
In recent months, gambling site Paddy Power and Sperling's BestPlaces pegged Atlanta as the company's number one pick. Moody's listed Atlanta second behind Austin, Texas.
Related: The city Amazon picks for its second headquarters will change forever
However, Sunday's incident is a reminder of Atlanta's potential infrastructure issues. The city already suffers major traffic congestion and its public transportation system isn't as sophisticated as other cities, according to experts.
"Atlanta has done great work recently to improve infrastructure, but congestion remains a problem," Hysa said.
For example, the city broke ground last year on an $800 million improvement project for Interstate 285/State Route 400 to address traffic jams.
Still, an influx of 50,000 workers to the city would add to existing traffic problems, said Bert Sperling, founder and CEO of Sperling's BestPlaces.
Atlanta is the eighth most congested city in the world. The average commuter spends 70.8 hours in traffic per year, according to a 2016 survey from transportation analytics firm INRIX.
But Sperling doesn't expect drawbacks such as heavy traffic and Sunday's airport power outage to hurt Atlanta's chances with Amazon (AMZN).
"The [outage] won't make an impact, unless it somehow points to a vast infrastructure meltdown," he said. "[Atlanta] maybe has less negatives than anywhere else does."
Marcelo Ballvé -- VP of intelligence at CB Insights -- agrees, noting the airport remains one of Atlanta's biggest assets.
"You can't do better than Atlanta if you're looking at an air hub, in terms of connections offered," Ballvé said.
Amazon declined to comment. The Atlanta Mayor's office did not respond to a request for comment.
The article points out infrastructure issues in Atlanta but that's true with every major city. Still, they are real concerns that will likely have to be addressed.


The recent news from TXDot is catastrophic for Austin for a lot of reasons. There is a reason why republicans and democrats were at their office petitioning TXdot not to kill 4 major Austin projects. They were joined with major business groups including the commerce chamber which does a lot of lobbying to get major investments including Amazon. Groups included: Capital Area Metropolitan Planning Organization Chair Will Conley, state Rep. Celia Israel, Capital Metropolitan Transportation Authority Chair Wade Cooper or representatives from the Downtown Austin Alliance, the Austin Chamber of Commerce, the Austin Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, the Circuit of the Americas and the Alliance for Public Transportation)

Delaying major work on 35 by maybe 5 or so years is not going to bode well for the city with any potential investments. The move by TxDot kills the 35 overhaul, mopac south overhaul, 183 toll/free lane which would directly connect from mopac toll lane/71 Oak Hill Expressway. I can't even begin to explain how awful this is for the city. Ugh.
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  #482  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 5:49 PM
Pemgin Pemgin is offline
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One power outage at Hartsfield-Jackson will not undo decades of reliability and good management. You don't become and retain the title of world's busiest airport by fucking things up on the regular. Amazon may be looking to see how the parties responsible for the outage respond and prevent it from occurring again, but it's very unlikely it will weigh significantly in their decision.
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  #483  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 6:01 PM
Dcbrickley Dcbrickley is online now
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Originally Posted by Pemgin View Post
One power outage at Hartsfield-Jackson will not undo decades of reliability and good management. You don't become and retain the title of world's busiest airport by fucking things up on the regular. Amazon may be looking to see how the parties responsible for the outage respond and prevent it from occurring again, but it's very unlikely it will weigh significantly in their decision.
My question is; why would I want to locate my company in the city that ALREADY has the world's busiest airport? I would much rather locate to a city where I could have some input on building infrastructure that will be needed for my company. Austin could fit the bill.
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  #484  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 9:10 PM
freerover freerover is online now
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Originally Posted by Dcbrickley View Post
My question is; why would I want to locate my company in the city that ALREADY has the world's busiest airport? I would much rather locate to a city where I could have some input on building infrastructure that will be needed for my company. Austin could fit the bill.
Thanks an interesting point. How do you mean? I’m not sure what input Amazon could have on infrastructure. The thing is that Atlanta is a busy airport because it has over 200 gates so it flies direct to a lot of places.

The Austin Airport will have around 30 gates when Amazon would get up and running and maybe around 60 when Amazon hits their final phase of 2hq expansion.

I feel like the main priority with the value of the airport are direct connections. The extra hours of connecting flights is lost cost and it adds up.
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  #485  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 11:14 PM
Pemgin Pemgin is offline
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Originally Posted by Dcbrickley View Post
My question is; why would I want to locate my company in the city that ALREADY has the world's busiest airport? I would much rather locate to a city where I could have some input on building infrastructure that will be needed for my company. Austin could fit the bill.
Why go through the hassle of having to build it up in Austin when the infrastructure is already in place at Hartsfield-Jackson? Austin's airport is nowhere close to competing in terms of number of flights and destinations or direct flights. One major reason that companies relocate to Atlanta is because the airport already serves their needs.
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  #486  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 11:46 PM
freerover freerover is online now
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Originally Posted by Pemgin View Post
Why go through the hassle of having to build it up in Austin when the infrastructure is already in place at Hartsfield-Jackson? Austin's airport is nowhere close to competing in terms of number of flights and destinations or direct flights. One major reason that companies relocate to Atlanta is because the airport already serves their needs.

I don’t really understand why so many people (including the Mayor) thinks Amazon wants to come to Austin and fix the city’s problems. I think they would love to redevelope a rundown/abandoned part of a city like what you would find in Pittsburg, Baltimore, DC or Detroit. They talk about those kind of improvements in the RFP as it relates to Seattle.

Btw, I met someone from Seattle that was convinced HQ2 is going to Pittsburgh. She is in the business community there however it wasn’t anything close to inside information. It was just Surprising.
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  #487  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2017, 11:53 PM
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F1 Tommy F1 Tommy is online now
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I would think air cargo infrastructure would be more important than passenger. So they will pick Memphis or Louisville.
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  #488  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 12:43 AM
freerover freerover is online now
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I would think air cargo infrastructure would be more important than passenger. So they will pick Memphis or Louisville.
This is a corporate HQ. They aren’t building product warehouses.
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  #489  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2017, 5:35 PM
paul78701 paul78701 is online now
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Originally Posted by freerover View Post
I don’t really understand why so many people (including the Mayor) thinks Amazon wants to come to Austin and fix the city’s problems. I think they would love to redevelope a rundown/abandoned part of a city like what you would find in Pittsburg, Baltimore, DC or Detroit. They talk about those kind of improvements in the RFP as it relates to Seattle.

Btw, I met someone from Seattle that was convinced HQ2 is going to Pittsburgh. She is in the business community there however it wasn’t anything close to inside information. It was just Surprising.
I think you're overestimating the impact of the negatives. No city is going to be perfect. No matter which city they go to, there are going to be challenges and realities that will have to be dealt with. Infrastructure, politics, etc. I don't think anyone really believes that Amazon wants to "fix" anything for anyone. But I'm sure Amazon is well aware that no place will be perfect and will be able to reason out what is and is not workable for them.
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  #490  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 12:04 AM
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freerover - Do you think you constantly point out reasons Austin won't get HQ2 is because you are guarding yourself against the letdown you'd experience if you were all gung-ho and we didn't get it?

I'm not saying your thoughts are wrong at all, but every time someone wants to say something positive, you come in with the wet blanket. Let them get excited.

I've noticed most potential HQ2 cities have at least 1 poster filling this same role. Must be human nature.
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  #491  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 1:00 AM
freerover freerover is online now
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Originally Posted by lzppjb View Post
freerover - Do you think you constantly point out reasons Austin won't get HQ2 is because you are guarding yourself against the letdown you'd experience if you were all gung-ho and we didn't get it?

I'm not saying your thoughts are wrong at all, but every time someone wants to say something positive, you come in with the wet blanket. Let them get excited.

I've noticed most potential HQ2 cities have at least 1 poster filling this same role. Must be human nature.
Yea I get that. It's mostly because I (and a few others) feel like there is a kind of arrogance of people here in Austin where they overlook major issues that need to be addressed or they dismiss them their impact because Austin has intangibles that make up for it. We can't just assume the economy will stay strong without continuously looking for ways to strengthen it and that is what I think is happening.

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Originally Posted by paul78701 View Post
I think you're overestimating the impact of the negatives. No city is going to be perfect. No matter which city they go to, there are going to be challenges and realities that will have to be dealt with. Infrastructure, politics, etc. I don't think anyone really believes that Amazon wants to "fix" anything for anyone. But I'm sure Amazon is well aware that no place will be perfect and will be able to reason out what is and is not workable for them.
This is certainly possible. I think we'll have a better idea once Amazon gets to a relative short list. I hope that if Austin isn't in the "next round" or whatever you want to call it that people will feel like they have to take a lot of these issues more seriously. Obviously, I would love for them to be there.
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  #492  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 5:05 AM
Dcbrickley Dcbrickley is online now
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I would love for them to be there.
We will be there.
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  #493  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2017, 3:03 PM
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Originally Posted by freerover View Post
I hope that if Austin isn't in the "next round" or whatever you want to call it that people will feel like they have to take a lot of these issues more seriously. Obviously, I would love for them to be there.
If we don't get HQ2 but come close, my hope is that Amazon actually puts out a statement like, "Austin this could be us but you[r transit] playin" to really get our politicians to be brave enough to take away car lanes for center-running light rail down Lamar/Guad (with southern terminus either on S Congress or Riverside and eventually ABIA).

I have zero doubt we check EVERY single other box for Amazon, with some boxes checked twice. Perhaps we get dinged for some bathroom-bill type nutjobs but that's out of our hands.
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  #494  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2017, 10:19 PM
jtown,man jtown,man is offline
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Originally Posted by freerover View Post
You're seriously suggesting that they just forgot or decided to ignore Austin?

It's hard to discuss this with you because you are clearly not objective. You deny all reports and metrics that highlight decencies with the Austin bid. All of them. You try to spin every little thing. I'm not saying that you are wrong in every single issue however nothing is black and white and the fact that you can't acknowledge any real decencies in the city highlight your defensiveness in this matter.

I'm sorry if that feels like a personal issue but it's more than I don't see the value in spending the time in replying when I don't feel like you are actively listening so there is no discussion. It's just never-ending arguing about the same thing. If you feel like this is me avoiding your points then that's fine. I just don't want to take the time to argue for the sake of arguing.




I'm not sure what you mean. Could you clarify? I don't think Trump will have any power in this matter at all and I'm not sure he will care if its around DC since it's private but who knows. He associates Amazon with liberals and the Washington post so he could tweet about it.

I think the politics that comes into play are state and city politics. The current council is not easy for anyone to work with and they don't seem to see the value in job creation. With Texas, Greg Abbot has promised to give Amazon a big PR problem when they try (and likely pass) a bathroom bill which will put a lot of pressure on amazon considering they are making Texas a 2nd home. It's worth mentioning that Georgia passed a bathroom bill a few years ago but the Governor vetoed it and I doubt they will consider it again after what happened to North Carolina. I honestly think this is going to eliminate all Texas cities but I don't want to get into a big political argument. The fact that the two guys that basically blocked the bathroom bill from passing in 2017 are retiring, it makes this issue that much more damning. Anyway, let's just assume that no one at Amazon cares about having their HQ in a state with a bathroom bill because that's depressing and kills the discussion.
I don't understand some conservatives deal with these "bathroom" bills. However, the Left's reaction to them seem insanely overly done. A company will not move to a state for NO OTHER reason other than a bathroom bill passes that will affect 0.01% of the population? Its rather silly, and it shows what conservatives have been saying for decades:

The Left controls the Media. Only by controlling the Media could they make such a small issue seem like WW3.
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  #495  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2017, 10:31 PM
jtown,man jtown,man is offline
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Also, on the actual topic, Amazon.

As a former resident of Austin, and someone who will always have Austin in my heart, I think yall have a lot of obstacles.

Traffic. I know I know, other cities have traffic. I spent 6 hours on 95 and 64 from DC to Norfolk last week when it is 3 hours with zero traffic. However, no matter where you go in Austin you are going to inevitably hit traffic. At least in the DC area you have the METRO to get you around select spots.

Public Transport: Never going to happen on a legit scale.

City politics: It seems the city thinks their current growth is static and they need no worry about keeping jobs flowing. They are also anti development and can't get the city behind a comprehensive rail system the city desperately needs. Could you imagine rail from Round Rock to downtown? You would save so much time rather than sitting in 35 traffic.

Size: The city is growing, no doubt about that. But I think at its current size, its too small for what a large corporation like Amazon will bring. The Highway network isn't large enough or expansive enough, its rail network barely exists, and its overall built form isn't there.


Take my opinion for what its worth.
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  #496  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2017, 10:55 PM
freerover freerover is online now
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Originally Posted by jtown,man View Post
I don't understand some conservatives deal with these "bathroom" bills. However, the Left's reaction to them seem insanely overly done. A company will not move to a state for NO OTHER reason other than a bathroom bill passes that will affect 0.01% of the population?
You may not agree that it's a big deal but it is what it is. In North Carolina, The NCAA, NBA, PayPal, Lionsgate, Deutsche Bank, Costar, Dropbox, Voxpro, various concerts and (according to the Bank of America CEO) many other companies canceled projects/offices/investments as a result of their bathroom bill. The estimated losses in jobs, investments and tourism was over 3.5 billion.

You can say that it shouldn't matter but for anyone to say that it wouldn't matter in Texas ignores very clear extensive evidence to the contrary. These incidents along with local corporate pressure led to the republican governor in Georgia to veto their bathroom bill.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jtown,man View Post
Also, on the actual topic, Amazon.

As a former resident of Austin, and someone who will always have Austin in my heart, I think yall have a lot of obstacles.

Traffic. I know I know, other cities have traffic. I spent 6 hours on 95 and 64 from DC to Norfolk last week when it is 3 hours with zero traffic. However, no matter where you go in Austin you are going to inevitably hit traffic. At least in the DC area you have the METRO to get you around select spots.

Public Transport: Never going to happen on a legit scale.

City politics: It seems the city thinks their current growth is static and they need no worry about keeping jobs flowing. They are also anti development and can't get the city behind a comprehensive rail system the city desperately needs. Could you imagine rail from Round Rock to downtown? You would save so much time rather than sitting in 35 traffic.

Size: The city is growing, no doubt about that. But I think at its current size, its too small for what a large corporation like Amazon will bring. The Highway network isn't large enough or expansive enough, its rail network barely exists, and its overall built form isn't there.


Take my opinion for what its worth.
I mean.... all of this. I agree with every point but that seems to suggest that I'm anti-austin. These are the realities and the frustrating thing is that a few of them are fixable if people would embrace flaws. The 2020 transit bond will be make or break for Austin. The city already suffered a setback with TxDot canceling 35 reconstruction in the next decade. Adler is going to try to get the ledge to help the city in other ways in 2019 in preparation for a likely multi-billion 2020 transit bond.

A part of me feels like you should improve the bus system with more transit only lanes and improve the mobility designs in the roads that are cited in the corridor reports, pursue commuter hard rail lines like the Green Line, Airport and Mokan but abandon light rail. Watch and see what Musk is figuring out with his system. They are making their tunneling machines more and more autonomous and thus underground transit becomes more and more economical. I don't know if his machines would work in Austin but there is hope.

The vision of that should be more clear when Project Connect releases the results of their current transit studies. Everyone has a boner for Rail down Lamar until they see it's going to require turning it from a 4 lane street to 2.
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  #497  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2017, 12:48 AM
chinchaaa chinchaaa is offline
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Originally Posted by jtown,man View Post
I don't understand some conservatives deal with these "bathroom" bills. However, the Left's reaction to them seem insanely overly done. A company will not move to a state for NO OTHER reason other than a bathroom bill passes that will affect 0.01% of the population? Its rather silly, and it shows what conservatives have been saying for decades:

The Left controls the Media. Only by controlling the Media could they make such a small issue seem like WW3.
insanely overly done in what way? 0.01% or not, transgender people deserve be treated with respect. people spoke with their wallets and the government is listening. maybe you should, too.
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  #498  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2017, 1:56 AM
AwesomeSAView AwesomeSAView is offline
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Is it for sure that Austin is getting the second Amazon HQ?
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  #499  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2017, 2:41 AM
freerover freerover is online now
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Is it for sure that Austin is getting the second Amazon HQ?
There is nothing to suggest that it’s for sure going anywhere. Amazon has done a good job at killing leaks.
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  #500  
Old Posted Jan 3, 2018, 9:24 PM
Dcbrickley Dcbrickley is online now
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https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/n...338&j=79441701

The Irish have us tied with Atlanta.
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