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  #18901  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 3:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Being annoying as usual but...

When are we going to start boycotting Chinese stuff en masse?

https://www.hrw.org/world-report/201...hina-and-tibet
The Chinese have never pretended to be our Allies. Nor have we always stood by them.
     
     
  #18902  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 3:15 PM
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Outside of the political and diplomatic implications, I must say I am a bit bemused by the pronouncements I am hearing from some Canadians quoted in the media who talk about "swearing off" everything that's American in their lives.

Yeah, right guys.

(Does this make me a bad person?)
I’ve made it a vow not to go as long as Trump is President. No great loss, I can afford to visit lots more interesting places around the world. My Mom, born American, refuses to go also. Her last surviving brother was up here last month and was taken aback by her vehement refusal to come down for a visit.
     
     
  #18903  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 3:15 PM
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The Chinese have never pretended to be our Allies. Nor have we always stood by them.
It's a complex issue, I agree. Just trying to get people to think outside the box, as I find many of us aren't very discerning or profound in what we choose to get indignant about these days.
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  #18904  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 3:25 PM
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It's a complex issue, I agree. Just trying to get people to think outside the box, as I find many of us aren't very discerning or profound in what we choose to get indignant about these days.
The ability of humans to ignore the real monsters and problems of the world and focus on relatively tiny issues in the grand scheme of things is one of the hallmarks of the human race.
     
     
  #18905  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 3:25 PM
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It's a complex issue, I agree. Just trying to get people to think outside the box, as I find many of us aren't very discerning or profound in what we choose to get indignant about these days.
China is not insulting our PM or threatening our economic well-being at the moment, so it doesn't seem surprising. Not many of us are preoccupied by the state of the world/Canada's geo-political situation in 2050. Perhaps we should be.
     
     
  #18906  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 4:56 PM
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Really, would you put it past Trudeau?
Yes. But I don't have to go on faith, I am Canadian so I have seen the man in a million contexts and at all ages of life. Therefore, I know what his dang eyebrows look like. You can't gaslight me into thinking he has fake eyebrows, I've seen him covered in sweat in a boxing match.
     
     
  #18907  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 4:58 PM
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The ability of humans to ignore the real monsters and problems of the world and focus on relatively tiny issues in the grand scheme of things is one of the hallmarks of the human race.
Indeed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bread_and_circuses
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  #18908  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 10:10 PM
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I stlll think improved market access is more likely tha full dismantling of the supply management regime. Depends what the U.S. side is willing to give in exchange. I see that Maxime Bernier has decided that this is the right time to renew his call for dismantling of supply management. A test of Scheer's control over his caucus on the horizon?
Bernier booted from Tory front bench.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/poli...er-from-front/
     
     
  #18909  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 10:49 PM
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The dairy lobby is obviously more powerful than I thought. If the conservative party won't support free trade and the dismantling of communist state apparatus, what is the point of them?

Good for Bernier for putting his principles ahead of his career ambition.
     
     
  #18910  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 11:30 PM
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Bernier booted from Tory front bench.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/poli...er-from-front/
Scheer passed the test.
     
     
  #18911  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2018, 11:31 PM
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The dairy lobby is obviously more powerful than I thought. If the conservative party won't support free trade and the dismantling of communist state apparatus, what is the point of them?

Good for Bernier for putting his principles ahead of his career ambition.
Doug Ford came out of his meeting today opposed to tariffs but supporting the supply management regime.
     
     
  #18912  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 2:11 AM
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Can anyone explain what benefits there would be to dismantling the dairy supply management system, besides potentially lower prices?
     
     
  #18913  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 2:24 AM
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Can anyone explain what benefits there would be to dismantling the dairy supply management system, besides potentially lower prices?
In theory, it would open export markets to Canadian milk, egg, and poultry producers. Also, in theory, there would be industrial benefits, such as new dairy product processing facilities that are currently discouraged by high milk prices.
     
     
  #18914  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 2:24 AM
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Can anyone explain what benefits there would be to dismantling the dairy supply management system, besides potentially lower prices?
- lower prices
- more startups (new entrants currently have to purchase quotas from exisitng producers)
- better selection due to increased competition
- more innovation due to increased competition
     
     
  #18915  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 2:29 AM
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Isn’t the trend of fewer larger producers that many blame on the dairy management supply system a phenomenon that has been seen nearly across the board in the agriculture / horticulture industry (indeed the entire food processing industry) throughout the industrialized world for decades?
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  #18916  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 3:44 AM
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Can anyone explain what benefits there would be to dismantling the dairy supply management system, besides potentially lower prices?
That is more than enough reason in itself, one industry should not get a free pass to operate as a cartel just because they have a strong lobby. We'd also get more access to European cheese and butter and not be forced to eat the crap they produce here. Apparently it's literally impossible to bake a proper croissant because the butter to make them cannot be imported to Canada.

That and the other reasons above - by scrapping supply management we would have access to export its product to other markets. But Canada is too small minded for that, unable to shake its self image of a raw material supply to the British Empire.

Scrapping supply management should be just a minor part of trade reform. More importantly, we should be scrapping every single barrier to trade between the provinces, as well as dismantling some of the oligopolies in telecom, airlines etc.
     
     
  #18917  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 4:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
Isn’t the trend of fewer larger producers that many blame on the dairy management supply system a phenomenon that has been seen nearly across the board in the agriculture / horticulture industry (indeed the entire food processing industry) throughout the industrialized world for decades?
It's pretty much across the board in all sectors. How many book stores are there compared to 1950? How many electronic shops? How many grocery stores?

Consolidation into large conglomerates has been the trend no matter the industry in question.
     
     
  #18918  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 5:32 AM
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Originally Posted by milomilo View Post
That is more than enough reason in itself, one industry should not get a free pass to operate as a cartel just because they have a strong lobby. We'd also get more access to European cheese and butter and not be forced to eat the crap they produce here. Apparently it's literally impossible to bake a proper croissant because the butter to make them cannot be imported to Canada.

That and the other reasons above - by scrapping supply management we would have access to export its product to other markets. But Canada is too small minded for that, unable to shake its self image of a raw material supply to the British Empire.

Scrapping supply management should be just a minor part of trade reform. More importantly, we should be scrapping every single barrier to trade between the provinces, as well as dismantling some of the oligopolies in telecom, airlines etc.
Totally agree with everything you said other than the croissant part but that's only b/c I have no frickin' idea if that's true or not. Why does a relatively small group of farmers need price guarantees (huge subsidies!) and protection from competition when no other agricultural sectors do other than poultry which also doesn't need it? These guys remind me of the taxi cartels in this country. They need to be dismantled as well.
     
     
  #18919  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 11:32 AM
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Chrystia Freeland for PM????

She just handed Donald Trump his ass in her speech in Washington last night!

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/in-w...tter-1.4705430

Pretty gutsy to obliquely reference demagogues while speaking within spitting distance of the White House.
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  #18920  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2018, 12:52 PM
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It's pretty much across the board in all sectors. How many book stores are there compared to 1950? How many electronic shops? How many grocery stores?

Consolidation into large conglomerates has been the trend no matter the industry in question.
Back in the late 60's our farm was 960 acres and we were considered a large farm for the area. Dad grew a rotation of wheat, oats, barley and flaxseed. We had around 70 beef cows (purebred herd that supplied breeding bulls and replacement heifers to local commercial herds) and 6 dairy cows that we supplied cream and surplus milk to the local creamery. We also had pigs, laying hens and broiler chickens. Any extra eggs went to the local co-op. Then the marketing boards said you couldn't sell milk or eggs unless you had a quota and so we got out the dairy cows and laying hens. Our neighbours all did the same thing and soon the local creamery disappeared along with farm fresh eggs from the co-op.
Today my brother farms approx. 2300 acres of a rotation of wheat, soy and canola. In addition he runs a 100 cow/calf purebred beef operation. He is now considered a medium sized farm. I think the closest dairy farm to him now is about 45 miles to the north near Brandon.

https://www.manitobacooperator.ca/ne...e=homepage&i=3

It’s a tale of two kinds of farms in Canada, without much in between.

The well-established trend to fewer farms will continue in the coming years as smaller operations focus on supplying local markets and the larger ones concentrate on export sales, says Ron Bonnett, president of the Canadian Federation of Agriculture.

Small farms will be operating in a niche role in meeting a growing demand for locally grown foods while the larger operations will be driven by lowering their cost of production to remain internationally competitive, he told a recent Canadian Agri-Food Policy Institute conference.

The result is that farmers will have to decide whether to become larger or locally focused, he said. “People will have to make a decision on which way they’re going.”

With that trend will come a shift in how farmers view markets, he said.

“Now we have a lot of product grown with the expectation that someone will buy it,” he said.

In the future, producers will have “to be more directed to the retail market and able to meet sustainability goals and food safety requirements.”

Whether farms are large or small, they will need to become technologically sophisticated, which will create job opportunities that could only add to the labour shortages facing agriculture, he said. While he doubts technology will replace all manual labour on farms, “we’ll need innovations or we won’t hit the $75-billion agri-food export goal.”

Agriculture economist Douglas Hedley says that Statistics Canada doesn’t define what a farmer is and Business Risk Management (BRM) programs are not well geared to the needs of small farms.

At this year’s Canadian Agriculture Economics Society conference, Hedley asked during a panel discussion on BRM programming about what was being done to accommodate the growing number of small and commercially viable farms. His main point was that the BRM programs have a “one-size-fits-all approach” that was oblivious to the growing split into small and large farms. No one on the panel had an answer, even with the review of BRM programs underway as part of the introduction of the Canadian Agriculture Partnership in March.

When CAPI held its workshops across the country on the steps needed to fully implement the Barton report, it found a lot of interest in ensuring government farm programs accommodated larger and small operations. That’s expected to be included in a report on its consultations due out in mid-June.

There are still a lot of farms across Canada that depend on off-farm income to supplement earnings from sales of farm products, Hedley said in an interview.

While he thinks they should be fully covered under BRM programs, the government attitude seems to be ‘they have off-farm income so why should we worry about them.’

Hedley pointed to research done by Alfons Weersink of the University of Guelph’s department of food, agriculture and resources economics on the changes in farm sector. In an article published last December in the Canadian Journal of Agriculture Economics, Weersink concluded Canada is transitioning from a farm sector “that was very homogeneous to one with significant differences in size and/or orientation. The decline in the number of ‘average-size’ farms and the growth in the number of large farms are due primarily to technological innovations that push operations producing commodities to grow as a means of capturing economies of size.

“The increase in the relative number of small farms is also due partially to technical advances that allow for the production of food goods with the desired quality attributes to be delivered to the appropriate market,” he said. “This market is continually being differentiated due to demographic and income shifts. The growing heterogeneity in farm structure complicates the assessment and design of farm policy.”

When the farm sector was homogeneous, it could be encouraged through support and extension programs, he said. “The policy objective has shifted toward improving the competitiveness of the sector, but for which of its components? The trend toward greater heterogeneity is likely to continue.”

Weersink’s analysis found that 30.7 per cent of farms had sales of more than $2 million in 2016 compared to 5.9 per cent in 1981. The largest sales category was between $100,000 and $250,000 which nearly one-third of the farms achieved in 2016. Just over 20 per cent of farms had sales between $500,000 and $1 million and just over 22 per cent had sales between $1 million and $2 million.

However, the largest number of farms were between 10 and 69 acres.

In 1981, “the bulk of the census farms were in the 240–399 acres category and the distribution was approximately normal.” About half the farms sold less than $25,000 and around five per cent sold more than $250,000.” By 2016, the average size nationally was 820 acres.
     
     
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