The New Official Lansdowne Park Conservancy Thread

[lpc]

Corner parking, Horticulture Building, Main Promenade

[lpc]

[kwoldtimer]

Why are there two Conservancy threads, moderators? Either consolidate or kill the old one.

[lpc]

View looking North from Canal (trees removed for inspection in image).

Click on image to enlarge.

[lpc]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Why are there two Conservancy threads, moderators? Either consolidate or kill the old one.

The old one had technical issues and the reason for the creation of this new thread.

Please note, this thread will be the thread replied to by the Conservancy.

[lpc]

RFP: An inevitability at Lansdowne Park

While it is endlessly debatable about the cause of the current highly litigious nature of the sole source city/developer plan, one thing is certain; progress at Lansdowne is going nowhere fast.

With World Cup obligations approaching, avoiding litigation and getting construction underway is clearly in everyones best interest.

How that is done is very straightforward; issue an RFP that respects the democratic directions from City Council.

The requirements for Lansdowne Park are clear:

1. A 24,000 seat stadium expandable to 45,000 on a temporary basis for large events.
2. A rejuvenated and strengthened North Stands and Arena including new outdoor seating, entries and retail space
3. A Green Space
4. A Revenue/Retail Model
5. A Management/Governance Model
6. A traffic management plan
7. A completion time of 30 months

Extra points could be awarded for those bids that neatly avoid heritage, environmental and zoning challenges.
The City can run a 60 day open bidding RFP for best price and best answer for best value.

There is no debate that the park needs to be developed.
There is no debate left about having a stadium at Lansdowne, it must be FIFA ready.

So you are left with two arguments;
getting the best value for the taxpayer and
an open and competitive process.

The City at the moment appears to be gambling that the outcome of the court will allow them to sole source a several hundred million dollar contract. As most prudent people know courts are tricky places.

The real threat is ending up in the middle of July or early August and being told by the court you have to run an open and competitive RFP. But by then you will have lost 5 crucial months and the important summer construction season.

Now is the time for City leadership to take charge.

Get the RFP done now,neatly stop the divisiveness and get best price in the process from the many firms willing to bid on the Lansdowne Park project.

Doing so allow's our city to place focus where it is needed; preparing to welcome the World to our City and Nation's Capital.

[Umpaidh]

A common misconception about the 'Husky Stadium' RFP is found here. The RFP put together by the University of Washington had a complete set of working drawings, specs, etc. put together by architects and engineers already approved by the University, that would be followed by the constructor(s). That is why it only took 90 days.

It's much the same way a school or other public building is constructed today, There are multiple processes that lead up to the RFP that the University of Washington put out there that are missing in the timeline you provided, LPC.

[lpc]

The particulars of a 60 day RFP are up to the City as outlined.

They can make it as specific or as broad as they choose.

What is important is that 60 day RFP's are very doable ( as demonstrated by Federal and Provincial Governments and even the City of Ottawa itself ) and it is highly likely that the City of Ottawa already has one in place ready for release.

[Umpaidh]

LPC, my point was that unless the city has a complete set of working drawings (approved by council) and all necessary paperwork already in place, than there are more steps to be taken before the '60 day RFP' example you have shown can take place.

I agree that the 60 day RFP's are possible when all the paperwork is in place, but the bottom line is that the city is not at that stage yet, neither is OSEG or LPC, for that matter, as both groups are still working on the dwg's.

Edit: Just to reiterate, what the city has outlined before is NOT what is required for a 60 day RFP to be completed properly, let alone legally. I am sorry of someone from Friends of Lansdowne or the LPC has led you astray, and I feel bad for anyone who listens to you if, judging by your name, you are from the Conservancy.

[lrt's friend]

I have not seen any indication that city hall (from staff, mayor or councillors) will have a RFP unless compelled by the courts. This is a non-issue.

[lpc]

Originally Posted by Umpaidh

LPC, my point was that unless the city has a complete set of working drawings (approved by council) and all necessary paperwork already in place, than there are more steps to be taken before the '60 day RFP' example you have shown can take place.

I agree that the 60 day RFP's are possible when all the paperwork is in place, but the bottom line is that the city is not at that stage yet, neither is OSEG or LPC, for that matter, as both groups are still working on the dwg's.

Edit: Just to reiterate, what the city has outlined before is NOT what is required for a 60 day RFP to be completed properly, let alone legally. I am sorry of someone from Friends of Lansdowne or the LPC has led you astray, and I feel bad for anyone who listens to you if, judging by your name, you are from the Conservancy.

You do not need a complete set of working drawings to have a 60 day RFP.

You set up the framework of the requirement, such as specific items that the client (City) needs for the site including stadium.

The fence line of the park is the agreed development area. There are heritage buildings, traffic considerations, retail requirements, and zoning issues along with a need for a management model.

Including those fundamentals in the RFP allows the firms/consortium's to come up with the best mix for the site at best price.

RFP's do not include final drawings, they do include Order of Magnitude and an overall plan. Final drawings are completed during the ramp up to construction and part of the 30 month timeline requirements.

Clearly the less complicated the proposal, the greater the likelihood of completing within the time frame and within budget.

It is highly probable that the City of Ottawa has already drafted the basic RFP and is ready to send it to MERX.

[lpc]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I have not seen any indication that city hall (from staff, mayor or councillors) will have a RFP unless compelled by the courts. This is a non-issue.

Showing any indication publicly would weaken their position, but not having a contingency is not likely.

It is believed that City Staff would already have the RFP ready to release to MERX.

[Umpaidh]

By all means, LPC, show me an example of a 60 day RFP without complete sets of dwgs and all the other work already completed. And as I stated before, the Husky Stadium does not fall under this category, as it had drawings already prepared before going out to RFP.

As an example, the process just for the gardens on Lansdowne took 60 days to narrow it down to 5 eligible companies, and another 120 days for one of the 5 designs to be chosen. Even still, the designs are being further fleshed out to this day.

What it sounds like you want is the process that was used when comparing the OSEG and OS&E groups unsolicited bids, which took about three months or so, is that true?

[lpc]

Actually the RFQ process (unecessary) for the Front Lawn was less than 4 weeks and the RFP process was 60 days (from the first week of March to the first week of May 2010).

Another 45 days was used to have public discussion. Ironically there is still no contract, same as with the overall plan to develop Lansdowne Park.

Neither the Front Lawn or the Lansdowne Park development have any contract completed and both have escape clauses to terminate without award.

All this leads to the conclusion that an RFP and open tender is the only way to proceed and following the guidelines already democratically voted on.

Supplier is a procurement decision and will determine best value for the taxpayer.

The City is coming down to crunch time with the world watching over their shoulder. Not producing for the FIFA events is the real issue at the moment and finding a proposal that is the least complicated will become ever more attractive as the days march on.

[matty14]

Originally Posted by lpc

The owners of the team will remain as Jeff Hunt and John Ruddy, Roger Greenberg and Bill Shenkman.

HAHAHAHA rich. Yeah you want to throw their entire redevelopment proposal out the window and then turn around and have them partner with you so they can own a CFL team and you can say "look, we still have a CFL team!"

The ONLY way a CFL team is coming to Ottawa is if (or, I mean WHEN) the OSEG proposal goes through.

[lpc]

Originally Posted by matty14

HAHAHAHA rich. Yeah you want to throw their entire redevelopment proposal out the window and then turn around and have them partner with you so they can own a CFL team and you can say "look, we still have a CFL team!"

The ONLY way a CFL team is coming to Ottawa is if (or, I mean WHEN) the OSEG proposal goes through.

The Conservancy was contacted by OSEG who confirmed that they can and will play at Lansdowne Park regardless of who builds the stadium or develops the park. What they wished to clarify is that they wished to see more investment on the North Stands and Arena (roof, mechanical, electrical and update the club seating environment in both the arena and North Stands).

The amount planned for the South Stands by the Conservancy/NBBJ bid is more than adequate at $48M as compared to the OSEG bid which proposes $39M. Much comment has also been made that the use of the longer lasting and lower maintenance steel exterior by the Conservancy/NBBJ bid for the stadium South Stands is being very well received by decision makers.

The OSEG Sports division would not be a partner under the Conservancy, they would be a tenant, though they could have participation on the Board.

The financial aspect of CFL is relevant but not necessary. That is to say it is well know that the CFL is a risky enterprise and the amount of financial commitment will no longer be a large component of the Conservancy financials.

The Stadium is a City structure needed to host a world event and that requires an open competitive process.

[AuxTown]

Originally Posted by matty14

HAHAHAHA rich. Yeah you want to throw their entire redevelopment proposal out the window and then turn around and have them partner with you so they can own a CFL team and you can say "look, we still have a CFL team!"

The ONLY way a CFL team is coming to Ottawa is if (or, I mean WHEN) the OSEG proposal goes through.

Ya, what he said!

I only check this thread every week or so as it's starting to give me an ulcer.

[lpc]

Originally Posted by O-Town Hockey

Ya, what he said!

I only check this thread every week or so as it's starting to give me an ulcer.

Yet the facts remain we were contacted by OSEG who have confirmed that who builds the stadium or develops the park does not change their commitment to bringing the CFL to Ottawa.

The fact that they are in fact bound contractually to bring the team regardless of who builds the stadium or develops the park supports their position to us.

[Umpaidh]

So instead of a 4 week RFQ, the city should spend a taxpayers dollars reviewing every single proposal from qualified and unqualified then? Fair enough.

But the RFP process began on February 19th, with the designs unveiled May 20th, and the winning design was selected in early June. Using the cities own wording, this was an aggressive schedule for the plan. That is a total of 90 days, plus a few weeks to deliberate over which plan is best.

And again, the urban park plan is still not ready to put a shovel into the ground, over 10 months later.

Now please provide an example, as previously requested, of a project of equal size that only took 60 days for the entire process to proceed.

[Umpaidh]

Originally Posted by lpc

The Conservancy was contacted by OSEG who confirmed that they can and will play at Lansdowne Park regardless of who builds the stadium or develops the park.

Please provide a link or put out a press release indicating this, and I will believe you.