Dead Malls of Canada

[ssiguy]

It both breaks my heart and pisses me off when you have dead malls like Chatham Place.

Chatham is a lovely and historic little city with a very nice downtown. It has the mildest climate outside of BC and gets very little snow. For this reason it is becoming a retirement haven.

Unfortunately it, like all of Canada, has a critical shortage of retirement and assisted living accommodation for it's seniors. This is an ideal candidate for such a purpose built building. The city/province could take the entire second floor and turn it into housing for the elderly. The pathways are very large, the stores could easily be converted into housing units, and the larger areas for kitchen, dining, and recreation.

To add to this is that the seniors have access to all the shops, services, and restaurants of downtown to help them enjoy more independence as opposed to some retirement house km from the nearest shopping area. They, due to being downtown, also have the added benefit of having the best transit in the city.

Such renovations add vitality to the downtown, bring workers downtown, give the remaining businesses more customers, and provide a far superior lifestyle to the residents than sticking them in the middle of no where.

Chatham also doesn't have a university or even a campus of one and such spaces would be ideal for this as well.

[MolsonExport]

25% of U.S. malls are expected to shut within 5 years. Giving them a new life won’t be easy

anyone want to wager how many Canadian malls might end up shuttering?

[MolsonExport]

Will the mall survive COVID? Whatever happens, these artists want to capture them before they're gone

Shediac, NB

cbc

[HomeInMyShoes]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

25% of U.S. malls are expected to shut within 5 years. Giving them a new life won’t be easy

anyone want to wager how many Canadian malls might end up shuttering?

I would wager three for the bulldozer in Regina by 2026. Victoria Square, Northgate and Southland. Cornwall Centre managed to get an Aeropostale recently, but they are trending in the wrong direction as well. But people are back working downtown in reasonable numbers now so I think it survives on lunchtime business for a while.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

anyone want to wager how many Canadian malls might end up shuttering?

Galleria Mall at Dufferin & Dupont recently bit the dust and is being redeveloped. Opened in 1972.


torontoist


Emporis

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

anyone want to wager how many Canadian malls might end up shuttering?

There will be corpses for sure.

But I think there will be more re-invention -- those malls with good locations and transportation connections will see revitalization. Probably including residential development and non-retail commercial or even institutional uses, as the realization that "hey, there's a lot of serviced land just sitting there, available!" sets in.

[MolsonExport]

Galleria Mall.
^what a lime soda experience.

[ssiguy]

Canada will certainly have it's mall casualties but not to near the extent that the US will and for several reasons.

First, nearly all Canadian cities are growing so there is demand for land and hence repurpose of these malls.

Second, our cities tend to enjoy higher densities so more people within a reasonable distance of these malls.

Third, most malls are on a transit route but in Canada our transit systems and usage are MUCH higher than similar sized US cities making them more accessible locations along with Canadian cities tending to have better walking/biking infrastructure.

Fourth, much of these dying US malls are in older post-war areas which have fallen into disrepair and suffering from fast declining populations and surrounding by urban blight and decay which Canadian cities don't generally have.

Fifth, Canada is colder so there will always be a large segment in the winter months that don't want to go to the big boxes when they can shop in climate controlled environments.

Our malls are facing daunting times but not to near the extent that US ones are.

[esquire]

Canada also did not overbuild malls to the same extent that the US did.

[MonctonRad]

Freddy, Moncton and SJ all have one major suburban mall each, so I think they are generally safe.

Freddy and SJ both have downtown malls which are in serious trouble. Brunswick Square in SJ in fact now belongs in the dead mall category.

Malls in smaller towns in NB are all somewhat precarious

[ue]

Originally Posted by HomeInMyShoes

I would wager three for the bulldozer in Regina by 2026. Victoria Square, Northgate and Southland. Cornwall Centre managed to get an Aeropostale recently, but they are trending in the wrong direction as well. But people are back working downtown in reasonable numbers now so I think it survives on lunchtime business for a while.

If Cornwall goes, then malls are pretty much over in Regina, as it's the healthiest one they've got. It'd essentially leave Midtown in Saskatoon as the only strong mall in the province.

[esquire]

Cornwall is the only legit shopping mall in Regina so I'd expect it will remain by virtue of pretty well having a monopoly.

[thebasketballgeek]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

anyone want to wager how many Canadian malls might end up shuttering?

Portage Place is good as gone here and I hope Cityplace meets the same fate (if you can even count that piece of junk as a mall). I thought North Gate and Garden City would have been gone 5 years ago but the boom in NW Winnipeg has made them somehow survive. Especially with Garden City having an amazing Filipino grocer as the anchor with Seafood City and Northgate being the only place to show Bollywood in theatres it looks like both of those malls will transition to have a much larger foreign presence which will be quite fascinating.

[ue]

Is Northgate even considered a mall anymore? I looked it up and I've been by it many times and just took it for one of the many box shopping centres on McPhillips.

Portage Place may get redeveloped and if so, it'll survive in a new form. If not, then yeah, it's not going to be around much longer as-is, I don't think. Cityplace I don't know if it'll get redeveloped or just continue chugging along as a food court, which is decently busy. Winnipeg Square will probably stick around with 300 Main right there.

In Edmonton, Westmount is barely a mall anymore. It has a small corridor of indoor shops and a food court but the rest has been redone into a big box power centre. I could see the remainder finally being dozed for either offices or more big box retail, but the high school next door and seniors in the area do keep the food court busy. I could see Northgate being redeveloped - its busiest segments are the big box retailers (Walmart, Safeway). Mill Woods and Bonnie Doon are set to be reimagined and redeveloped as walkable, outdoor town centres around the new LRT line.

The rest of the malls kind of have their niche
- WEM is a major local and tourist attraction with a wide array of shops, entertainment, and more and remains extremely busy
- Southgate is the next best mall and has a good selection of stores with only one location (Restoration Hardware, Crate & Barrel) as well as other destination retailers like Apple. Connected to the LRT and a freeway. Closest mall to the affluent SW.
- HUB Mall has student residences and university food, shops, and services and is a well used corridor between buildings on the UofA campus
- Meadowlark is mostly big box but the mall has a lot of health services that I don't really see going anywhere
- Kingsway is surprisingly quieter despite being the most prominent mall for the northside and having a lot of destination retailers but I can't see it really going anywhere anytime soon. It's also close to the Blatchford redevelopment so that'll bring in new customers.
- Londonderry 10 years ago I could've said wouldn't last much longer but they recently did a major reno and have attracted some new destination retailers (Simons, H&M) and doesn't really have dead areas
- Sherwood Park and St Albert's malls serve those communities decently
- The Outlet Mall serves as a local mall for Leduc/Beaumont/Devon and as a place to chill if you need to be at the airport as well as a bit of a regional draw for the outlet stores
- City Centre is planning a major rebuild of the west side, with more street-oriented retail but still keeping an indoor corridor. The East will probably remain as-is and has enough of a downtown workforce to keep it afloat.
- Commerce Place and Manulife could wither but I think they'll just putter along

[Loco101]

Malls today in Canada are successful if they are drawing either customers from outside the city or lots of local immigrants.

[thebasketballgeek]

Originally Posted by ue

Is Northgate even considered a mall anymore? I looked it up and I've been by it many times and just took it for one of the many box shopping centres on McPhillips.

Northgate is not really a mall but as you said just a power centre with a small enclosed space. From your description of Westmount they seem to be extremely similar.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by thebasketballgeek

Northgate is not really a mall but as you said just a power centre with a small enclosed space. From your description of Westmount they seem to be extremely similar.

Northgate used to be a mall but it was de-malled and turned into a power centre.

[MolsonExport]

In Edmonton, Westmount is barely a mall anymore.

In London, Westmount is barely a mall anymore. Once it was the largest mall in London, with a wide array of high end stores. When I moved here in 2005 (for the first year, in an apt across from the Mall) it was going downhill fast..that first and only year saw the majority of the second floor empty out, and much of the first floor become cell phone bling, shitty craft stores, hearing aid clinics, etc. LCBO/Shoppers Dog Fart and the banks all moved out first, followed by the more upscale clothing retailers. A few years later, then Zellers (one anchor) closed (a relaunched Target died later too). Then the mall decapitated the third arm to the supermarket, essentially losing another anchor. Then Sears shuttered.

It is a ghost of a mall nowadays. Zero retailing on second floor. A sad handful of merchants eking out an existence on the first floor (much of which is empty storefronts).

[Djeffery]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

In London, Westmount is barely a mall anymore. Once it was the largest mall in London, with a wide array of high end stores. When I moved here in 2005 (for the first year, in an apt across from the Mall) it was going downhill fast..that first and only year saw the majority of the second floor empty out, and much of the first floor become cell phone bling, shitty craft stores, hearing aid clinics, etc. LCBO/Shoppers Dog Fart and the banks all moved out first, followed by the more upscale clothing retailers. A few years later, then Zellers (one anchor) closed (a relaunched Target died later too). Then the mall decapitated the third arm to the supermarket, essentially losing another anchor. Then Sears shuttered.

It is a ghost of a mall nowadays. Zero retailing on second floor. A sad handful of merchants eking out an existence on the first floor (much of which is empty storefronts).

You definitely missed out on the hey day of that mall. It was completely rebuilt in 1989 and was the best mall in London, and under local ownership. I loved going there, especially back when the theaters were upstairs in that now demolished third arm you mentioned. If you went there on a Saturday, you were lucky to get a parking spot in the lower basement level of the underground parking. Now, I don't even think that level is open.

All that said, I am quite impressed that the new owners of the mall that took it over in the year or so before the pandemic have managed to turn it around. The old owners, who also own White Oaks Mall, were in the running to host the Health Unit and when they lost that to CitiPlaza, they sold the place. It's certainly not a retail mecca anymore, and that mainfloor retail leaves a lot to be desired, but the rest of the mall is quite full with offices, the kidney clinic and the gym. A large accounting firm recently moved in the upstairs of the old Target as well. Definitely a positive transformation for the area, compared to how it was looking for the place 10+ years ago.

[MolsonExport]

Shediac Mall: https://www.google.com/maps/@46.2194...i6656?hl=en-US