Car Share

[logan5]

The Car2Go were like go carts, and they were smaller, so yes much easier to weave through traffic.

I drive every day to work, and I drive Evo's on the week-ends quite a bit. I definitely drive the Evo differently than my own car. I have a Modo membership as well, just so I have a truck or cargo van at my disposal if i ever need it.

Modo charges 6 dollars an hour and by the km, so if you are doing a big grocery shopping, you can rent a Modo car for 1.5 hours and drive only a few km's to to whichever grocery store, with the rental cost being around 11 bucks. A shopping trip is not practical in an Evo car.

With a combined Evo/Modo/Mobi/transit, you don't need a car if you live in the core, but I will never give up my car.

[FarmerHaight]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

I signed up for Car2Go once when my car was out of service for a few months. I only used it a couple of times, and both times I was super antsy because I was aware that every minute I drove cost me more money.

It wasn't a lot of money, and it wasn't really a rational reaction. But every time I had to stop for a traffic light or got blocked by someone who didn't have the courtesy to pull out of traffic and into the curb lane to wait for pedestrians before making their right turn made me anxious and way more irritated than when I normally drive.

It sounds like you're especially frugal. I would imagine a number of EVO drivers are actually more cautious because of their lack of driving experience so maybe that evens out the reckless bunch?

Originally Posted by logan5

I drive every day to work, and I drive Evo's on the week-ends quite a bit. I definitely drive the Evo differently than my own car. I have a Modo membership as well, just so I have a truck or cargo van at my disposal if i ever need it.

I drive EVOs or rental cars or U-Hauls differently than I drove my own car too, but that's because I am unfamiliar with the vehicles and don't want to deal with the hassle of an insurance claim on a vehicle I don't own. So if anything I drive more cautiously in those vehicles.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by FarmerHaight

It sounds like you're especially frugal. I would imagine a number of EVO drivers are actually more cautious because of their lack of driving experience so maybe that evens out the reckless bunch?

I don't think it's being frugal, it's just that "on the clock" mentality that every second is costing you money.

Hard to get away from honestly.

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I don't think it's being frugal, it's just that "on the clock" mentality that every second is costing you money.

Hard to get away from honestly.

Yes, I get that with U-Haul van rentals and mileage. It was great when we started using the trailers since they're unlimited distance rentals.

[Lexus]

Evo already has new Prius

Untitled by Lexus LX600, on Flickr
Untitled by Lexus LX600, on Flickr

[FarmerHaight]

Originally Posted by Lexus

Evo already has new Prius

I drove one yesterday. Very nice car.

I always made fun of Prius growing up, but I am big fan after using Evo the past few years.

[WarrenC12]

The new Prius looks good, finally. Bigger wheels make it look cool.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by FarmerHaight

I always made fun of Prius growing up, but I am big fan after using Evo the past few years.

There's a reason that taxi owner/operators almost universally choose Prius. It's cheap to operate and reliable as heck.

I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop - the one where they realize that electric vehicles are even better. Maybe they're just waiting for the right kind of model to come out.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

There's a reason that taxi owner/operators almost universally choose Prius. It's cheap to operate and reliable as heck.

I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop - the one where they realize that electric vehicles are even better. Maybe they're just waiting for the right kind of model to come out.

Me thinks the biggest issue for taxi cab companies is actually finding electric vehicles to buy. Tesla's? Available. Cheaper no-frills taxi cab candidates? Order now, arrive in 2025. I don't think you tend to think that far into the future for replacing fleet.

[WarrenC12]

I have seen a few EVs from different manufacturers running as cabs. It might depend on their schedules and charging habits. If they are relying on public fast charging, that is significantly more expensive than residential or commercial rates.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I have seen a few EVs from different manufacturers running as cabs. It might depend on their schedules and charging habits. If they are relying on public fast charging, that is significantly more expensive than residential or commercial rates.

Current Taxi in Kelowna has a 100% Tesla fleet. They also operate in Victoria. There are at leasy a couple of Tesla Yellow Cabs in Vancouver.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Changing City

Current Taxi in Kelowna has a 100% Tesla fleet. They also operate in Victoria. There are at leasy a couple of Tesla Yellow Cabs in Vancouver.

It's also notable that a ton of Uber/Lyft drivers are running EVs.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

It's also notable that a ton of Uber/Lyft drivers are running EVs.

Anecdotally I've heard a few different reasons why so many Ubers/Lyfts are Teslas and none of them are because of a good business case for Teslas.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Anecdotally I've heard a few different reasons why so many Ubers/Lyfts are Teslas and none of them are because of a good business case for Teslas.

Well EVs tend to have much lower operating costs, and require the mileage to justify the big up front cost. Whether or not that justifies a Tesla purchase is another matter.

But the operating profit will be higher with EVs.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Well EVs tend to have much lower operating costs, and require the mileage to justify the big up front cost. Whether or not that justifies a Tesla purchase is another matter.

But the operating profit will be higher with EVs.

The problem with EVs is the limited range compared to ICE cars, and the downtime required for charging which both eat into potential profits.

https://afdc.energy.gov/files/u/publ...rification.pdf

Apparently if a taxi cab company doesn't have overnight charging capabilities (imagine the infrastructure cost of installing chargers for a few dozen cars!) you're only operating at 34% effectiveness. With overnight charging you're at 95% effectiveness.

This probably explains why you see some EV taxis but not full fleet conversions (it's easy to install overnight charging for half a dozen cars, just not a full fleet).

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Apparently if a taxi cab company doesn't have overnight charging capabilities (imagine the infrastructure cost of installing chargers for a few dozen cars!) you're only operating at 34% effectiveness. With overnight charging you're at 95% effectiveness.

This probably explains why you see some EV taxis but not full fleet conversions (it's easy to install overnight charging for half a dozen cars, just not a full fleet).

34% to 95% doesn't make a lot of sense. I assume this is ignoring the existence of fast chargers, which would refresh a cab's battery in a limited amount of time.

Taxis seem to average 300-400kms/day based on a quick google search. Most EVs can do that without even needing a charge.

Yes there are economies of scale with fleets, but L2 chargers aren't that expensive.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

34% to 95% doesn't make a lot of sense. I assume this is ignoring the existence of fast chargers, which would refresh a cab's battery in a limited amount of time.

Taxis seem to average 300-400kms/day based on a quick google search. Most EVs can do that without even needing a charge.

Yes there are economies of scale with fleets, but L2 chargers aren't that expensive.

IIRC using fast chargers (i.e. Tesla Superchargers what else is there?) isn't even cheaper than filling up a Prius. Plus if that's your regular charging method, say goodbye to battery longevity.

Also I don't know what EV you're driving but I certainly wouldn't feel comfortable driving 400km without charging.

FYI it's not just about installing L2 chargers, but the infrastructure for charging a full fleet of cars. Standard L2 charging is about 7.2kW, multiply that by 20 or so and your overnight wattage is looking like 150kW+ which is more than a small to medium sized office building. Most taxi parking lots I assume aren't exactly wired for that sort of thing.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

34% to 95% doesn't make a lot of sense. I assume this is ignoring the existence of fast chargers, which would refresh a cab's battery in a limited amount of time.

Taxis seem to average 300-400kms/day based on a quick google search. Most EVs can do that without even needing a charge.

Yes there are economies of scale with fleets, but L2 chargers aren't that expensive.

Given how incredibly bad drivers most of our cabbies are, perhaps it just boils down to the Prii being more expendable and cheaper to repair after accidents!

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Given how incredibly bad drivers most of our cabbies are, perhaps it just boils down to the Prii being more expendable and cheaper to repair after accidents!

I hate cabbies. I hate Uber/Lyft/Fantuan/DoorDash/etc. drivers. I think they're actual lower forms of human life closer to parasites and worms. They have no respect for other drivers, pedestrians, cyclists, the law, or even their clientele.

But try to remember the last time you saw a cabbie get into an accident.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by chowhou

IIRC using fast chargers (i.e. Tesla Superchargers what else is there?) isn't even cheaper than filling up a Prius. Plus if that's your regular charging method, say goodbye to battery longevity.

Price is more yes, but we're talking a quick boost during the day, or maybe nothing at all. Battery longevity is up for debate, no long term studies have shown it's that bad. A full time LA-Vegas service used Teslas and Supercharging for hundreds of thousands of kms and they performed quite well.

Originally Posted by chowhou

Also I don't know what EV you're driving but I certainly wouldn't feel comfortable driving 400km without charging.

Model 3 long range. Handles 400kms with plenty to spare. EVs perform well in lower speed conditions like a typical urban taxi.

Originally Posted by chowhou

FYI it's not just about installing L2 chargers, but the infrastructure for charging a full fleet of cars. Standard L2 charging is about 7.2kW, multiply that by 20 or so and your overnight wattage is looking like 150kW+ which is more than a small to medium sized office building. Most taxi parking lots I assume aren't exactly wired for that sort of thing.

Yeah there are some challenges, but you also don't really need 7.2kW per car depending on driving and the shifts involved.