Should Canada Be Preparing for a Destabilized USA?

[JM5]

Originally Posted by O-tacular

It's more than that. His excuse stating the anti fascist protesters inflamed the situation and were equally to blame was praised by David Duke and also used by white supremacists before he took the podium. His talking points are their talking points. His xenophobia is their xenophobia. They embrace Trump over any Republican candidate before him. He welcomes it and gives them tacit support.

Well, the counter protesters did attack the white supremacists as they were making their way towards the square. As others pointed out, the white supremacist did have a permit while the counter protesters didn't.

As for tacit support of white supremacy, one of his closest aids and son in law is Jewish. Guess he's suffering from cognitive dissonance.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by JM5

Well, the counter protesters did attack the white supremacists as they were making their way towards the square. As others pointed out, the white supremacist did have a permit while the counter protesters didn't.

As for tacit support of white supremacy, one of his closest aids and son in law is Jewish. Guess he's suffering from cognitive dissonance.

Added to the list. Check.

[niwell]

I don't think Trump is a white supremacist, or even close to it*, but I think he does enjoy fanning the Culture Wars. And by him I mean likely Bannon. I'm not sure Trump is fully aware of what he's doing at all times.

*In general I think Trump looks down at most people that he sees as below him. There's probably some racism here, but not targeted in the way neo-nazi groups or the KKK are. The motivations are probably more aligned with classism.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by niwell

I don't think Trump is a white supremacist, or even close to it*, but I think he does enjoy fanning the Culture Wars. And by him I mean likely Bannon. I'm not sure Trump is fully aware of what he's doing at all times.

*In general I think Trump looks down at most people that he sees as below him. There's probably some racism here, but not targeted in the way neo-nazi groups or the KKK are. The motivations are probably more aligned with classism.

I don't think he's even much of a racist or anti-Semite, by the standards of older privileged white American men. The "great" America he claims to want back, however, would be a decidedly white-dominated society (or, if I'm wrong, he has done a supremely poor job of explaining how it would not be). He seems to think, based on comments this week, that everybody having a job would be the panacea. While it wouldn't hurt, I don't think he's ever tried to elaborate on how this would further equality in his country or what that more perfect union would look like.

[O-tacular]

Originally Posted by niwell

I don't think Trump is a white supremacist, or even close to it*, but I think he does enjoy fanning the Culture Wars. And by him I mean likely Bannon. I'm not sure Trump is fully aware of what he's doing at all times.

*In general I think Trump looks down at most people that he sees as below him. There's probably some racism here, but not targeted in the way neo-nazi groups or the KKK are. The motivations are probably more aligned with classism.

I think he knows exactly what he's doing when he throws red meat to the white supremacists. He also is rabid in his Islamophobia and hatred of Syrian and other majority Muslim immigrants. And let's not forget how he feels about Mexicans... I'm just waiting for the n word tape from the Apprentice to drop.

[hipster duck]

Originally Posted by JM5

Well, the counter protesters did attack the white supremacists as they were making their way towards the square. As others pointed out, the white supremacist did have a permit while the counter protesters didn't.

It may be coincidental, but I've noticed that you value following procedures and rules over adhering to some underlying morality.

For example, the white supremacists have the wrong morals: ultimately, they want to subjugate - and perhaps even annihilate - people of colour in the United States. But they applied for a marching permit, and the counter-protesters, whose position is that the white supremacists are wrong (their counter-position isn't to subjugate or kill white people) didn't, so, in your view, the counter-protesters were in the wrong.

Same with your position on the Confederate states. The Confederacy was all about owning human beings as property, not based on the traditional debt slavery with the right to manumission of ancient times (also morally wrong, but not quite so morally wrong), but a pseudo-scientific belief in racial inferiority that was already morally reprehensible in the 1850s. But, as you posit, because the North attacked them when they threatened to secede, they had the right to defend themselves, and the South had a legitimate fight on their hands.

If we try to be as objective (impossible, but we should try), certain human rights are universal and sacrosanct. Human beings are not inferior based on a pseudo-scientific concept; killing or subjugating other people based on your belief in that person's inferiority is also wrong. I don't think these things can be contested. If groups believe these to be true, they are wrong. Laws and procedures are supposed to exist in the service of preserving those human rights, not the other way around. So you are prioritizing the wrong thing.

As for tacit support of white supremacy, one of his closest aids and son in law is Jewish. Guess he's suffering from cognitive dissonance.

That's a red herring. Judaism/anti-semitism isn't what's at issue in Charlottesville.

[rousseau]

Yeah, one thing that's always bothered me about the sanctification of Rosa Parks is that she was in clear violation of a city ordinance.

I mean, you can't argue against this. It's an undeniable fact.

[O-tacular]

Originally Posted by rousseau

Yeah, one thing that's always bothered me about the sanctification of Rosa Parks is that she was in clear violation of a city ordinance.

I mean, you can't argue against this. It's an undeniable fact.

Yep. More succinct than I could have put it.

Trump's permit comment said it all to me. Everything with him and his defenders is about technicalities. Well technically slavery was legal back in the day. Does that make those who fought it the bad guys? Technically segregation was the law too. I guess Martin Luther King Jr. was a criminal. Or if you're Rob Anders Nelson Mandela was a terrorist.

Reminds me of this quote:

[hipster duck]

I also just realized that given the number of times Donald Trump has filed for bankruptcy, he might have actually wound up being a slave in Ancient Greece. But not in the Antebellum South, of course.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by rousseau

Yeah, one thing that's always bothered me about the sanctification of Rosa Parks is that she was in clear violation of a city ordinance.

I mean, you can't argue against this. It's an undeniable fact.

Am I a bad person because this made me laugh?

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by rousseau

Yeah, one thing that's always bothered me about the sanctification of Rosa Parks is that she was in clear violation of a city ordinance.

I mean, you can't argue against this. It's an undeniable fact.

Touché.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Am I a bad person because this made me laugh?

You want bad person? Yesterday, watching the breaking news from Barcelona, my first thought was "that's appalling". My second thought was "oh good, CNN is not talking about Trump"!

[kwoldtimer]

Media reporting that Bannon is "out" at the White House. The fun just never stops, although in this case it seems a very good thing.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by JM5

As others pointed out, the white supremacist did have a permit while the counter protesters didn't.

Wrong. The counter-protestors had a permit.

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Am I a bad person because this made me laugh?

Considering the satirical intent, and the fact that it was moi who made you laugh, I'm pretty sure you're not a bad person!

[niwell]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Media reporting that Bannon is "out" at the White House. The fun just never stops, although in this case it seems a very good thing.

I wonder if Bannon will turn on Trump now? He seems the type to document everything that has been said in case he needs revenge in the future. It will be a fun ride, that's for sure.

[rousseau]

It just gets scarier and scarier:

US government demands details on all visitors to anti-Trump protest website
Privacy advocates call warrant for IP addresses of 1.3 million people who visited inauguration protest website an unconstitutional ‘fishing expedition’

The US government is seeking to unmask every person who visited an anti-Trump website in what privacy advocates say is an unconstitutional “fishing expedition” for political dissidents.

The warrant appears to be an escalation of the Department of Justice’s (DoJ) campaign against anti-Trump activities, including the harsh prosecution of inauguration day protesters.

On 17 July, the DoJ served a website-hosting company, DreamHost, with a search warrant for every piece of information it possessed that was related to a website that was used to coordinate protests during Donald Trump’s inauguration. The warrant covers the people who own and operate the site, but also seeks to get the IP addresses of 1.3 million people who visited it, as well as the date and time of their visit and information about what browser or operating system they used.

The website, www.disruptj20.org, was used to coordinate protests and civil disobedience on 20 January, when Trump was inaugurated.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...rant-dreamhost

[MolsonExport]

^more "fresh air" from that fascist and his deplorable administration.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Media reporting that Bannon is "out" at the White House. The fun just never stops, although in this case it seems a very good thing.

The latest blast of "Fresh Air" from the Fright House. Bannon is Banned:

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/steve...ry?id=49295772

[MolsonExport]

Another example of Trump's "Gravitas": Chinese state media revel in Donald Trump's Charlottesville woes

Presidency proving propaganda boon to party outlets that have spent decades trying to depict US as place of conflict and chaos