CHICAGO | Lucas Museum of Narrative Art

[kolchak]

I certainly hope that no matter where this is built (if at all in Chicago) that it doesn't look anything like it does in the current renderings.

[pilsenarch]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

Montgomery Ward could have begged for a water fountain on the side of the armory or post office or whatever obliterated the last blade of grass in Grant Park. We're glad he didn't.

BUT, as you yourself have pointed out, he did make an offer to the Field... apparently Montgomery Ward does not buy into your slippery slope argument and did not think EVERY exception to the rule will obliterate "the last blade of grass" in Burnham Park.

(did you misplace your cap?)

[Mr Downtown]

It was exactly the slippery slope Ward was worried about. He said he would drop his opposition to the Field Museum if the parks commission would promise that was the last building they'd try to put in the park. They said no dice.

Negotiation only occurs when both parties think the other has something to offer. Like the city today, the parks commission thought Ward had no common-law rights that could overcome an act of the General Assembly. Subsequently, the state supreme court yet again explained to people with poor reading skills that no buildings means—surprise—no buildings.

[pilsenarch]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

It was exactly the slippery slope Ward was worried about. He said he would drop his opposition to the Field Museum if the parks commission would promise that was the last building they'd try to put in the park. They said no dice.

Negotiation only occurs when both parties think the other has something to offer. Like the city today, the parks commission thought Ward had no common-law rights that could overcome an act of the General Assembly. Subsequently, the state supreme court yet again explained to people with poor reading skills that no buildings means—surprise—no buildings.

seriously, reread what you just wrote... he did NOT think this was a slippery slope... so for example, the FotPL COULD have negotiated that this was the last building in the Museum Campus with a significant expansion of parkland, but they chose to keep it a parking lot with no increase in parkland and no dictate that this would be the last building on the Museum Campus...

basically the same deal Ward thought up...

really, find the beanie

[LouisVanDerWright]

Guys, this discussion is pointless. We have another Jarta situation on our hands til this shits thrown out.

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by JK47

Those sites being the Reese Hospital site or the McCormick Place Marshalling Yard. The latter doesn't even seem feasible since it's a narrow site between LSD and the Metra Electric with limited access. Decking over the Yard and/or the Metra Electric would be absurdly expensive (which also makes building it on a deck west of LSD unlikely as well) and likely a non-starter. Not to mention that the Yard is also an important part of McCormick Place's infrastructure. The Reese Hospital site doesn't even fit the criteria of the proposal (e.g. adjacent to water). Though oddly enough maybe FoPl isn't aware of that since Cassandra Francis said that building the LMNA on the Reese site would "allow the Museum Campus to be expanded to the south." Which is strange since there is space in the Museum Campus for a Museum.
Why would we need to expand the Museum Campus at all in that case?

The marshalling yard is not that narrow (it's just very long). The current Lucas Museum plans include a level of underground parking plus a new garage built over the IC tracks... building over the marshalling yard would NOT be "absurdly expensive" compared to the current plans for Lucas. Any cost would come from building a long-span structure but you could do this creatively by adjusting the truck arrangement. Hell, you could just double-deck half of the lot and build the Museum on the remaining half.

Point being, there are alternative sites out there that would work well for Lucas, but it sounds like the city is being just as difficult as FoTP by refusing to allow discussion. Possibly that comes from Lucas directly, but what's one waterfront site vs. another?

The unique benefits of the current site are really pretty minor. You get rid of a lakefront parking lot and you have some synergy with the other museums. That's about it.

[nomarandlee]

Originally Posted by ardecila

The unique benefits of the current site are really pretty minor. You get rid of a lakefront parking lot and you have some synergy with the other museums. That's about it.

I would really only give ot the first point. And really it overlooks a scenic yacht harbor for the wealthy rather then sitting right ar the lake.

The synergy it would have with the other museums is also rather weak. Given the lack of propensity for walking in our culture today I don't envision to many walking or strolling from one of the 3 museums to the Lucas. It is a longer stroll then it looks especially for tourist.

[sentinel]

Originally Posted by nomarandlee

I would really only give ot the first point. And really it overlooks a scenic yacht harbor for the wealthy rather then sitting right ar the lake.

The synergy it would have with the other museums is also rather weak. Given the lack of propensity for walking in our culture today I don't envision to many walking or strolling from one of the 3 museums to the Lucas. It is a longer stroll then it looks especially for tourist.

This is beyond ludicrous, and really hope you don't actually believe this. Unbelievably preposterous arguments against this museum, just grasping at straws at this point; embarrassing obstructionist nonsense. The deliberate inversion of logic by haters regarding the location of this institution is becoming laughable.

[r18tdi]

Originally Posted by nomarandlee

I don't envision to many walking or strolling from one of the 3 museums to the Lucas. It is a longer stroll then it looks especially for tourist.

Let's see, the walking distance from the steps of the Field Museum to the front door of Adler is roughly 0.6 miles. The distance between the Field Museum and the site of LMNA? Also 0.6 miles.

I suppose you're entitled to your opinion, but I recommend you first get a grip on the actual distances involved.

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

Guys, this discussion is pointless. We have another Jarta situation on our hands til this shits thrown out.

Haha - was my first thought. I don't think Mr. Downtown is going to leave the forum though if FOTPL loses the lawsuit.

[brian_b]

Originally Posted by ardecila

The current Lucas Museum plans include a level of underground parking plus a new garage built over the IC tracks

No, the garage is slated to be built between the IC tracks and Lake Shore Drive.

The air rights over the IC tracks are owned, at various heights, by a real estate developer and the many condo associations to the west of the tracks.

[prelude91]

I'm curious as to what everyone's thinking is here in terms of the Lucas Museum controversy.

Does everyone believe the city has the right to offer up this parcel or this is a special case since George Lucas wants to build a museum in this spot?

What if someone wanted to build a museum next to the Lucas Museum (assuming it is built); would you be ok with that?

What if George Lucas wanted to build his museum in Lincoln Park (the park), would you be ok with that?

I'm just trying to understand why everyone feels the city has the right to offer up this site, and what all of your opinions are on continuing to build on the lakefront.

[k1052]

Originally Posted by prelude91

I'm curious as to what everyone's thinking is here in terms of the Lucas Museum controversy.

Does everyone believe the city has the right to offer up this parcel or this is a special case since George Lucas wants to build a museum in this spot?

Yes

What if someone wanted to build a museum next to the Lucas Museum (assuming it is built); would you be ok with that?

Physically I'm not sure where it would go since the LMNA would be sandwiched between Soldier Field and Lakeside Center. I'd be cool with repurposing Lakeside into another museum of some sort.

What if George Lucas wanted to build his museum in Lincoln Park (the park), would you be ok with that?

Entirely depends where and how. Replacing an ass ugly parking lot (like the SW corner of Clark/LaSalle) Ok. Tear down the conservatory or drain the North Pond for it...uh no. Also it isn't like Lincoln Park is museum free...

I'm just trying to understand why everyone feels the city has the right to offer up this site, and what all of your opinions are on continuing to build on the lakefront.

Because they have an arguable legal right to do so.

[LouisVanDerWright]

Originally Posted by prelude91

I'm curious as to what everyone's thinking is here in terms of the Lucas Museum controversy.

Does everyone believe the city has the right to offer up this parcel or this is a special case since George Lucas wants to build a museum in this spot?

It's not a special case in the context of the museum campus. It might be if it were proposed for another location.

What if someone wanted to build a museum next to the Lucas Museum (assuming it is built); would you be ok with that?

That depends on what you mean by next to. If it were trying to cram something in between it and soldier field or McCormick, then no that's too crowded, but if some other billionaire shows up and wants a museum on Northerly where the concert venue is (again, where FOTP when the city leases park land to a for profit business?) then sure, let er rip.

[Quote]What if George Lucas wanted to build his museum in Lincoln Park (the park), would you be ok with that?

Again, it all depends. Is he replacing another non-green space use? I would have a harder time with Lincoln Park because it's not the museum campus. This kind of use doesn't belong there, it's too intense. But if someone wanted to open a baller ass nature museum or zoo there, then why not.

I'm just trying to understand why everyone feels the city has the right to offer up this site, and what all of your opinions are on continuing to build on the lakefront.

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by brian_b

No, the garage is slated to be built between the IC tracks and Lake Shore Drive.

The air rights over the IC tracks are owned, at various heights, by a real estate developer and the many condo associations to the west of the tracks.

Actually the developer owns all of the air rights in this area, including the garage site, according to an old Crain's article. Apparently the garage is only happening with his (silent) cooperation.

Although, yes, the garage won't technically span over the tracks but it will span over the 18th St offramps.

http://www.chicagobusiness.com/Asset...ckLandSwap.jpg

[Via Chicago]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

Maybe Lucas can be convinced to add a giant wing to the Art Institute called the George Lucas Wing of Narrative Art?

AIC couldnt care less about Rockwell, or most of the rest of his collection for that matter. its the whole reason hes staking out on his own in the first place.

[ithakas]

Originally Posted by Via Chicago

AIC couldnt care less about Rockwell, or most of the rest of his collection for that matter. its the whole reason hes staking out on his own in the first place.

I'm guessing most of the people arguing that this will be a bunch of Rockwells thrown together or a place to stash Star Wars toys haven't taken a close look at this interior rendering of the musuem, which clearly indicates that technology's place in narrative art will be central to its DNA:

[Via Chicago]

well, that wouldnt be compatible with the AIC either, is my point (i was responding specifically to TUPs suggestion)

[XIII]

Originally Posted by Via Chicago

well, that wouldnt be compatible with the AIC either, is my point (i was responding specifically to TUPs suggestion)

AIC is, with certain exceptions, an "old masters" and contemporary art museum. What George Lucas is proposing is a completely different approach to a museum.

From the info on the museum so far, this would be something more like the Ghibili museum in Tokyo http://www.ghibli-museum.jp/en/ combined with a visual arts bent. You wouldn't see Ken Griffin donate $500m of DeKooning here, but you may see something more like the V&A does

http://www.vam.ac.uk/content/exhibit...ay-curtain-up/

This would draw a different crowd for different reasons and would be a huge complement to the exiting campus

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by ithakas

I'm guessing most of the people arguing that this will be a bunch of Rockwells thrown together or a place to stash Star Wars toys haven't taken a close look at this interior rendering of the musuem, which clearly indicates that technology's place in narrative art will be central to its DNA:

Or the fact that most people haven't even looked at the website which shows featured artists for illustration, painting, digital art, and film.

http://www.lucasmuseum.org/

Here's the count of artists listed that will be in the museum
* Illustration: 47 artists
* Comic Art: 26 artists
* Photography: 16 photographers
* Children's art: 14 artists
* Digital sculpture: 11 artists
* Animation: 10 toons
* Makeup/Creature Design: 10 movies
* Digital Illustration: 9 artists
* Digital Cinema: 9 movies
* Set design: 9 movies
* Costume/Fashion design: 8 designers
* Pinup art: 7 artists
* Digital Architecture: 6 architects
* Cinematic Design: 6 movies
* Visual Effects: 5 movies
* Digital fine art: 2 artists
* Prop Design: 2 categories

If you count just the art, photography, sculpture, and architecture listed here - there's 131 different artists featured for the museum. This isn't even counting the movie stuff which has a lot more than just what Lucas has done.

Basically, if anybody thinks this is some Star Wars museum and/or a shring to George Lucas it means they're either (a) a complete fucking idiot or (b) haven't taken about 5-10 minutes to read about what the museum is. Unless you think that Dior, Alexander McQueen, Zaha Hadid, Norman Rockwell, MC Wyeth, and movies like Citizen Kane, Metropolis, and Le Voyage dans la Lune have ANYTHING to do with George Lucas.

I honestly cannot believe the lack of understanding out there about what the museum actually is. Yes, there will be Lucas stuff in there, obviously, but most of the stuff for the museum has absolutely nothing to even do with the guy or any of the work that he's done.