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  #10041  
Old Posted May 16, 2010, 5:11 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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^ The key is that the Best Buy, Dominick's, CVS, etc not face Clark St.

The Best Buy in that newish development on Clark St in Lincoln Park (not too far from Clark and Diversey) is a great example of how a megalith development can kill the streetscape.

You really do need the smaller retailers to face Clark.
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  #10042  
Old Posted May 16, 2010, 5:25 PM
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^ I think somebody said a while back that the neighbor will be using the second floor of that space (a spa or something?). Not sure about the first floor.

Suburbia in Wrigleyville?
WRIGLEYVILLE | Outrage after alderman OKs development across street from ballpark

May 14, 2010
BY FRAN SPIELMAN City Hall Reporter
Bar, theater and restaurant owners lambasted Ald. Tom Tunney (44th) on Thursday for endorsing a $100 million mixed-use development across the street from Wrigley Field that will sweep them out of the "cool, hip neighborhood."

Roughly eight neighborhood businesses would be displaced to make way for "Addison Park on Clark," a project at Addison and Clark that includes a 137-room Hyatt Hotel, 135 residential units, 145,000 square feet of retail space and 399 underground parking spaces.

The displaced include iO Theater, formerly known as ImprovOlympic, 3541 N. Clark; Bar Louie, 3545 N. Clark; Salt & Pepper Diner, 3537 N. Clark; Goose Island Beer Co., 3535 N. Clark, and Red Ivy, 3519 N. Clark.

Earlier this week, Tunney endorsed the project and took it to a final community meeting. M&R Development revealed that prospective tenants include Best Buy, Dominick's, an Apple Store and a CVS Pharmacy.
All those places on Clark and Addison have very little to do with the neighborhood. They bring in nasty things that urinate all over the place and I ain't talking dogs. We need a hotel in the neighborhood, we need another grocery, we need another anything that will directly benefit the neighborhood. Too many bars and crime on Clark. This project takes the neighborhood back. The articles title is stupid.....because it is suburbs that comes in for the games and leaves their waste in the neighborhood.
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  #10043  
Old Posted May 16, 2010, 5:28 PM
Chicago3rd Chicago3rd is offline
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
^ The key is that the Best Buy, Dominick's, CVS, etc not face Clark St.

The Best Buy in that newish development on Clark St in Lincoln Park (not too far from Clark and Diversey) is a great example of how a megalith development can kill the streetscape.

You really do need the smaller retailers to face Clark.
The issue there is design not store....turning their back to the street with the wall along Clark.

Home Depot a few blocks west on Halsted says Home Depot every step of the way as you walk along the sidewalk.

Hope they do take pedestrians into account on the design side of this. I will only miss one building and that is the greystone on the south side of Addison just west of 7-11.
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  #10044  
Old Posted May 16, 2010, 5:39 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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Why do I have a funny feeling that the Apple store is looking at this site pretty seriously?

They seem to be taking a liking to transit-friendly, high traffic sites on the north side. Maybe they see some potential in this locale that some others may not?

Good companies with smart leadership usually see things that others don't..
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  #10045  
Old Posted May 16, 2010, 6:28 PM
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^As a way to show off their cool products to the folks who come in from Bartlett or Burlington or St. Louis County for Cubs games.
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  #10046  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 3:47 AM
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Looks like 1 column has been poured above street level on the Ritz Carlton Residences


Me
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  #10047  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:53 AM
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Why do I have a funny feeling that the Apple store is looking at this site pretty seriously?
There is an opposite angle, which is that there are too many people there with free time, just strolling around, perhaps drunk or giddy, looking for diversions with no intent, or likelihood, of a purchase. I see it kind of like the Sony Store on Michigan Avenue, which I think ended up inviting in a lot of casual shoppers in to play, but not to purchase. Granted, Apple is not stocked mainly with high-end items like Sony, but they do have their help desk / advice personnel, so you'd have a lot of aimless people wandering in to ask random questions and generally waste the employees' time. However if Apple sees it as a loss-making branding exercise, then more power to them.
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  #10048  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 12:50 PM
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So are they going to basically rebuild the building they demolished on the lot with the Ritz-Carlton? I did a little google earth-ing and saw that the little building in the renderings was already there just as shown?
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  #10049  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 2:25 PM
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Originally Posted by J_M_Tungsten View Post
So are they going to basically rebuild the building they demolished on the lot with the Ritz-Carlton? I did a little google earth-ing and saw that the little building in the renderings was already there just as shown?
http://lynnbecker.com/repeat/farwell/farwell.htm
http://www.preservationchicago.org/c...7/farwell.html

etc.
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  #10050  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 2:37 PM
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All those places on Clark and Addison have very little to do with the neighborhood.
I dont understand this quote. What does have to do with the neighborhood? Locally owned restaurants, bars, and clubs in seperate unique storefronts have far more to do with the fabric of a given hood than faceless corporate chains plopped in a block long mall.

Im not opposed to the idea of a development here. Change happens. But I am very opposed to its execution in this instance. I've long ago tired of the Chicago style clear-cut trend which obliterates entire neighborhood blocks in favor of one "master plan". What makes Chicago great is its diversity; designs like this decrease that.

This block is one of the few in that increasingly soulless area that actually contains some character (with Chicago-centric institutions to boot). I for one, will be sad to see it go. I seriously question if this is what residents actually "want".
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  #10051  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 2:41 PM
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If you are well educated in urban design and understand the psychological impacts buildings can have on generating busy energetic atmospheres, you will understand how a fine-grained arrangement of buildings lends itself to better neighborhood atmospheres.

Developers and architects tend to get very dreamy eyed when they built up all those West and south loop block-long buildings with ground floor retail. It seemingly had the mix of right ingredients to build successful streetscapes, but they were wrong. The areas out front of the buildings have a quiet feel to them, they are not energized in the way Wrigleyville is.....reason being the more subdivisions of architecture you have along the street, the more interesting and diverse a street becomes.

Unless we are downtown, I'm very against large single-building multi-use developments. In my opinion this development should at most occupy the under-utilized space on Addison, not Clark. This project has still not been scaled back enough to be a well fit component for this neighborhood.
Amen brotha.
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  #10052  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 2:44 PM
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Whoa that is sad, now I wish I had not known. Ignorance would have been bliss on this one.
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  #10053  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 2:59 PM
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Hello. I've been reading this forum for a few years but rarely post.

First, let me say that I think a hotel next to Wrigley and some new apartments next to the El are a good idea. I get that.

But I completely agree with Via Chicago and Hayward. A block long mall along Clark will detract from the character of the neighborhood. The developer gets to eek out every last penny of profit but the rest of us get to look at a bag of sh!t for decades.

You know, I would almost go along with this project if the Clark St. facade was saved--a facadectomy would preserve some of that character. As this project stands, it will be a net loss to the neighborhood. Character, something that has great value, will be lost and replaced with utter banality. That is not a net gain.

I also don't buy the argument that these new chain stores (CVS, Best Buy, Dominck's, Apple store) will be sited in their best possible locations because of the proximity to the Addison Red Line stop. If these businesses are for the benefit of the neighborhood, as it is being sold, then they don't need to be next to the El. What are local residents going to do? Walk over to the Addison El stop, get on and ride to Belmont, turn around and come back to Addison, then get off and say, "Gee, I sure am glad these stores are next to the El. It makes it so convenient."
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  #10054  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 3:36 PM
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Get a spine people. When this project is completed everybody here will be wondering why in the world they bitched and moaned about a handful of nondescript facades coming down. This project is an all around plus for the neighborhood. Nobody is going to miss a couple old brick walls and what they contained inside. And nobody is gonna look at the completed project and think 'gosh what a waste, I wish we could have the old corner back.'
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  #10055  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:15 PM
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The farrago of facades along Clark St. is a collection that is more than the sum of its parts. Replacing that with a block long, banal suburban strip mall design ethic is a loss.
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  #10056  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:15 PM
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I know it's being strategically used as a catchphrase to conjure up images of suburbanization and sanitation by its detractors, but this is not a mall. It's two stories of retail topped by a hotel and an apartment building. If that's a mall then so are large portions of Manhattan.

As much as I like iO, I don't feel sorry for any of the business owners who are staging an eleventh hour rally. This project has been on the boards for 3-5+ years; what were they waiting for?
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  #10057  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:20 PM
88th floor 88th floor is offline
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Banal suburban strip mall design ethic. That's what's going to face Clark St.

Don't we deserve better in the city?
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  #10058  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
Get a spine people. When this project is completed everybody here will be wondering why in the world they bitched and moaned about a handful of nondescript facades coming down. This project is an all around plus for the neighborhood. Nobody is going to miss a couple old brick walls and what they contained inside. And nobody is gonna look at the completed project and think 'gosh what a waste, I wish we could have the old corner back.'
No, no, no....we can't disrupt the unique urban fabric of 4 surface parking lots, a 7-11, a lone greystone housing a Starbucks, and a few unremarkable buildings occupied mostly by chain bars that have already had their facades defaced (which are very likely going to be tenants in the new building anyway).
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  #10059  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:34 PM
88th floor 88th floor is offline
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I'm all for getting rid of the parking lots and the 7-11, as well as adding a hotel and almost 150 apartments.

What I dislike is the design aesthetic of the structure that will face Clark St.

What I dislike is the 400 space parking lot---next to an El stop.

What I dislike is suburban strip mall design in the city.

What I dislike is the use of the term, "increased density," as a pretext to accept such things.
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  #10060  
Old Posted May 17, 2010, 4:47 PM
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Originally Posted by k1052 View Post
No, no, no....we can't disrupt the unique urban fabric of 4 surface parking lots, a 7-11, a lone greystone housing a Starbucks, and a few unremarkable buildings occupied mostly by chain bars that have already had their facades defaced (which are very likely going to be tenants in the new building anyway).
Look, if you truly dont see the merits of a streetscape design as such, i cant help you


http://www.bartourguide.com/Wrigleyville.jpg

Cities clamor over themselves to to try and re-create something like that. And we have it. But apparently this developer knows better. Because hey, they've ruined any of our neighborhoods before, have they? Nah, thats never happened in this city...
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