MEMPHIS | Development News

[DoomJ]

Originally Posted by entcolin

From the Binghampton Development Corporation Facebook page. Has anyone heard what's going to go on this corner? The daily traffic count on that corner is outrageous, and with the new cycle path going in soon, this is a highly visible piece of property.

It's actually the southeast corner- they're aiming to put some kind of grocery store there, I think-

[arkitekte]

^Good. Those are an eyesore and are horrible in every shape, form, and fashion.

Originally Posted by Wayward Memphian

Sad to hear. Memphis needs an Allegiant to service touristy destinations. They have really hit the Cincy market can't figure why not Memphis. Allegiant also is moving into New Orleans.

I think Delta is about to cut more flights at MEM. I don't necessarily think that will lead to another carrier entering the market. The discontinued use of regional jets is what's mainly going to keep MEM from scoring any seasonal operations for tourists.

[James Owen]

Some more details on the proposed UT Health Science Center Master Plan, including a map and renderings of some of the new buildings being planned and developed:

New Buildings and Amenities to Change the Face of UTHSC as Part of Newly Unveiled Master Plan for Growth
University of Tennessee Health Science Center - Communications & Marketing

http://news.uthsc.edu/new-buildings-...an-for-growth/

The University of Tennessee Health Science Center (UTHSC) campus of the future will have at least 15 new buildings to meet expanding academic, research, clinical care and support needs. It will also have improved pedestrian and bicycle routes, better traffic flow, more parking, well-designed green spaces and landscaping, prominent signage, 10 renovated buildings, and updated housing options.

The improvements are part of a Campus Master Plan designed to enhance UTHSC’s stature as an urban academic medical center and secure its spot as the nucleus of the evolution of the Memphis Medical Center district.

The plan, drawn by the award-winning architecture and design firm of Perkins + Will after more than a year of discussions with faculty, staff, students and community stakeholders, focuses on giving UTHSC’s urban campus a more clear sense of identity, showcasing existing and emerging research and clinical centers of excellence, strengthening use of Health Sciences Park as the campus heart or center, making campus open spaces useful and attractive, reinforcing strong pedestrian routes, and grouping like and complementary endeavors and colleges together for ease of access.

Some projects and improvements in the plan are funded and under way, and some will evolve over the next five years and beyond.

Master Plan website:
http://www.uthsc.edu/masterplan/

It should be noted that this is just a rough draft of those plans, with the final version expected sometime next year.

[Wayward Memphian]

Originally Posted by arkitekte

^Good. Those are an eyesore and are horrible in every shape, form, and fashion.



I think Delta is about to cut more flights at MEM. I don't necessarily think that will lead to another carrier entering the market. The discontinued use of regional jets is what's mainly going to keep MEM from scoring any seasonal operations for tourists.

Depends on fuel. If oil stabilizes around 80 a barrel, it may allow some smaller carriers to pick them up or a reintroduction by Bombardier or Embraer . It was the cost of fuel that had folks dropping the 50 and 70 seaters. I look at the little Branson Airport. It lost its Southwest flights. A little company call Elite Airways comes in under the Buzz Airlines name and offers to Chicago and Houston services 4 days a week and if booked out in time, at 99 bucks each way on CRJ 200s. They do charge 35 bucks a checked bag . They extended the supposedly seasonal service through Jan 5 before dropping them for the dead of winter. They areU said to be adding flights to DC/Dulles and Melbourne Florida in the spring. And... you have smaller markets that are growing and they are starting to get vocal about getting hammered by legacy prices. Take XNA, due to Walmart, we have a good amount of nonstops but the expense is staggering. I can drive to Dallas and fly to Abu Dhabi on one of the ME 3 for near the same money Delta wants for the Minneapolis nonstop. Our little XNA will surpass over 600,000 enplanements for 2014 putting it real close to top 100 airports in the US. But I'll gladly drive a little over an hour to Branson to fly the kids to DC in a summer or two for half of what it costs at XNA. XNA is a good 30 minutes or more from where I live in Fayetteville, so it's not all that much difference.

[Wayward Memphian]

Yep, Delta is cutting New Orleans, Dallas, Pittsburg and Regan\DC. That might bode well for when Frontier supposedly restarts Washington flights.

It's funny that you haven't heard anything from Memphis media in regards to Frontier's quick cut of the Memphis flights. Wonder if Delta's cut will change that though it's American dominated.

Allegiant just moved into New Orleans.

[Uptowner]

Originally Posted by Wayward Memphian

Yep, Delta is cutting New Orleans, Dallas, Pittsburg and Regan\DC. That might bode well for when Frontier supposedly restarts Washington flights.

I don't know the metrics behind any of this, but I'm shocked that the Mem-NOLA flight lasted as long as it did. It had to be both, the most expensive and shortest flight that Delta offered from NOLA. You can fly directly to NYC or LAX from $200-300 on mainline aircraft where they wanted $500+ for a flight to Memphis on a cramped 50 seat crop duster. People would just rather drive or take the train. I also have a colleague who travels to Memphis on business from Boston who frequently complains about ticket prices, to the point where he's considered flying to Nashville and driving over.

[Wayward Memphian]

Originally Posted by Uptowner

I don't know the metrics behind any of this, but I'm shocked that the Mem-NOLA flight lasted as long as it did. It had to be both, the most expensive and shortest flight that Delta offered from NOLA. You can fly directly to NYC or LAX from $200-300 on mainline aircraft where they wanted $500+ for a flight to Memphis on a cramped 50 seat crop duster. People would just rather drive or take the train. I also have a colleague who travels to Memphis on business from Boston who frequently complains about ticket prices, to the point where he's considered flying to Nashville and drivers l driving over.

I know zilch about airline business but there seems to be an overemphasis on megahubs. I'll go out of my way to avoid Atlanta when my family of 4 flies. I'm rooting for outfits like Southern Airways Express. While not cheap, they are not astronomical either. I'm a son of a cropduster, I've got some time behind a Cessna 172 with my Dad showing me the way. There just seems to be opportunities to be had. Like I mentioned, some small firm could come in and start a St. Louis -Memphis- New Orleans bunny hop flight on a CRJ 200 (50 seater you are hating on)on a Fri and Sun schedule to capture weekend getaway folks. That gets folks from St. Louis and Memphis on a flight to New Orleans and back. I'm totally a fan of the Allegiant model but they should just be more upfront with the nickel and dime crap.

Say I want to see my Brother that lives in Kansas City for his Birthday in on a weekend in Feb an I'm in Memphis. I can fly American/US Air for around 300.
But that takes me to Charlotte and then to KC. A could use little ol' Seaport operating out of the old terminal and it's EAS service and get to KC round trip for 200 with a little stop in Harrison and quicker than any turn I see listed via American/US Air. Don't know the reliability of Seaport but I ain't afraid of a Cessna Caravan. Hell, as a taxpayer, I'm paying for that subsidized service.

[Dr Nevergold]

Originally Posted by Wayward Memphian

I know zilch about airline business but there seems to be an overemphasis on megahubs.

This is absolutely the case. The airlines are too focused on dumping all passengers in only a handful of airports, which sacrifices both safety and comfort levels for passengers.

Here are the number of hub closures I can name off in just the past 15 or so years:

Pittsburgh (US Air), Kansas City (TWA), St Louis (TWA-American), Cincinnati (Delta), Cleveland (Continental-United), and now Memphis (Northwest-Delta). Raleigh and Nashville both lost their American hubs in the 1990's; however, in Nashville's case (and in Kansas City as well) Southwest has come in to add flights and capacity back. Some of these other airports have never recovered. Pittsburgh has a mega-hub that barely has 10 million passengers a year with most gates laying empty.

Folks, that's tens of millions of passengers per day in capacity that has been lost in favor of dumping these passengers through other facilities that often weren't designed for the task. Two of those airports listed above are mega-hubs, Pittsburgh was designed for 40-50 million passengers a year without major expansion. Cincinnati could easily handle 40 million passengers a year. Both of those airports have underground trains and multi-terminal setups to serve tens of millions of daily passengers.

This is a prime reason why quality of airline service continues to drop. Mergers occur, and the company shuts down its competition and closes the extra capacity. Prices go up, service capacity and quality go down.

Delta broke promises to regulators, Congress, and to Memphis. Delta, before merging with Northwest, said they intended on expanding the low-cost Memphis operation, not shut it down. Its a sad day for all air travel, because Memphis offered a hub without the congestion of some larger facilities and good weather with terrific on time performance. The people who hurt are the consumers at large, not the city of Memphis.

There is positive news, as a smaller non-hub airport, while you'll be limited with non-stop flights you will absolutely see cheaper prices in the future as low cost carriers come in to fill the void over time. Hub airports are always more expensive to originate flights out of for the customer side.

[Dr Nevergold]

In addition to my previous comments, wanted to add that Memphis has key advantages and is going through its de-hubbing the proper way.

1) FedEx remains hugely important for the airport. It also pays a majority of the airport fees for operations, so the fact that Memphis is losing millions of annual passengers won't really affect its ability to fund operations. The FedEx factor makes Memphis' dehubbing for passenger traffic different from other airports as those airports had to deal with massive cost shifts. It is my understanding FedEx pays 85% of airport operations.
Source: http://www.commercialappeal.com/busi...of-former-hubs

2) They are modernizing the airport passenger facilities and reducing gates to make taxi space larger. Instead of allowing gates to go empty, they're repurposing the airport for its current age.

Since Northwest/Delta operated a medium sized hub, not a mega hub, it is possible that Memphis - while not having the same non-stop locations - may be a better airport in the long term. When more carriers consider and start service in Memphis, passenger count will bounce back a little. I could see Memphis rebounding to near 10 million passengers a year in the long term since the regional population that it draws for airport traffic is rather large (Jackson, Jonesboro, Tupelo and all points between). More competition always lowers prices, and this is all while simultaneously receiving a major facilities update so the terminal and concourses have larger interior space and more attractive look even if there are fewer gates.

Lower airfares, better terminal, and more airlines to choose from are great even if you're losing a many non-stop services. So the de-hubbing isn't necessarily bad for Memphis in many respects.

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Dr Nevergold

2) They are modernizing the airport passenger facilities and reducing gates to make taxi space larger. Instead of allowing gates to go empty, they're repurposing the airport for its current age.

Since Northwest/Delta operated a medium sized hub, not a mega hub, it is possible that Memphis - while not having the same non-stop locations - may be a better airport in the long term. When more carriers consider and start service in Memphis, passenger count will bounce back a little. I could see Memphis rebounding to near 10 million passengers a year in the long term since the regional population that it draws for airport traffic is rather large (Jackson, Jonesboro, Tupelo and all points between). More competition always lowers prices, and this is all while simultaneously receiving a major facilities update so the terminal and concourses have larger interior space and more attractive look even if there are fewer gates.

Lower airfares, better terminal, and more airlines to choose from are great even if you're losing a many non-stop services. So the de-hubbing isn't necessarily bad for Memphis in many respects.

You're right on that. The main issue with MEM (this falls at the feet of the Airport Authority and the City of Memphis) is that they allowed Delta to build an absolute monopoly at MEM. That's not to knock on Delta at all, good for them that they were able to do that, but the Airport Authority could somewhat counter that by offering incentives to other airlines for select routes that particularly catered to Memphis' actual O&D passengers. Yes, Delta told them and Congress that they wouldn't de-hub Memphis, but that's on them for being that ignorant.

The City as well as media have done a pretty good job at fooling the general public into thinking this is all Delta's fault (as can be seen with the Delta Does Memphis Facebook page). MEM's main struggle now is that even with Delta's de hub and continual cutting of flights they still hold the Memphis market. Southwest, Frontier, etc. aren't going to come in and save that airport. If Delta or American control a certain route and want to offer fares for $350, why would anyone else offer anything extremely cheaper. They're there to make money as well. If you want a decent laugh, take a look at who made up the Airport Authority's board...the Mayor's wife was a member...

The one and only thing, imo that the City can do to correct this has nothing in particular to do with MEM and that's expanding the tourist market in Memphis. Find a way to get people to actually need to fly to Memphis and eventually the market will open back up. That;s still pretty hard even with new or modified convention space as conventioneers take into account ticket prices when planning conventions.

I'm all for the demolition and mothballing of various sections of A and C. It should allow them to function much more efficiently and save money. What's funny is people complaining about the new parking garage as somehow that's also Delta's fault.

The airport itself is par for the course along with other things in town.

[Dr Nevergold]

^By definition, hub airports are primarily focused only on the hub airline. Charlotte pretty much bends over and serves only US Air, and they have high prices. In Atlanta you're predominantly dealing with Delta or whats left of the AirTran/Southwest merger. Memphis was no exception, it was the same situation when it had a hub. They did what the hub airline asked for because they had no choice.

Yea, it pretty much is Delta's fault for leaving Memphis out in the cold. Any suggestion to the opposite is to misunderstand the situation. They wanted to shutter the extra capacity and kill the competition. That competition used to be Northwest.

In the Midwest, they opted to keep Northwest's Detroit operation since they just built a brand new airport with an awesome terminal. They shut down Cincinnati since it was a slightly older terminal. But, the goal was to get rid of Northwest's capacity so they didn't have the competition. Cincinnati's airport wasn't particularly old (the terminals received regular updates and expansions), but the Detroit airport opened just before this merger and was brand spanking new, so they opted to keep that.

That's the real story of the Delta merger. Delta came out on top, big time. Closed two hubs and squashed competition so they could take more flights with fewer aircraft and maximize profits. Thinking Memphis had any say in the matter is the real joke. Memphis and its local governments didn't have anything to do with this. Although I probably am not going to convince you of this fact given that you've asserted you know otherwise.

[Uptowner]

Serious question. What incentives would Delta have had to keep Memphis, Cincinatti, etc. at full capacity with the proximity of Atlanta, Detroit, etc.?

[Dr Nevergold]

^None. Delta was determined to close hubs after they purchased NWA, that was the point of the merger.

[Dr Nevergold]

BTW, location of Memphis has little to do with it. Charlotte is much closer to Atlanta than Memphis, but they have a hub airport with 40 million passengers/year and growing just because US Air wants it to be the place they do business.

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Dr Nevergold

Thinking Memphis had any say in the matter is the real joke. Memphis and its local governments didn't have anything to do with this. Although I probably am not going to convince you of this fact given that you've asserted you know otherwise.

Comical.

You love trying to turn what I've previously said regarding whatever topic into something that I didn't say that you can argue. Delta did its own thing. Memphis should have as well.

Any city that proactively is trying to grow in whatever aspect is going to promote competition, not give up all to one particular corporation. Any city that does is bound to fail; I can name you a few if you need help thinking of them. Working in city government I see that every hour of every day. The City of Memphis and the Airport Authority went out of its way to cater to Delta and in turn ran off Frontier completely while other airlines cut service at MEM due to the Airport Authority catering to Delta. Should they have seen the writing on the wall? Yes. Was MEM an airport with a high O&D passenger number? No. This is cause for concern with any transportation planning office whether that's air or not. You have to produce numbers of passengers who are specifically flying to or leaving your city. Who's responsible for that?

Delta makes cuts and guess what? There's not much of any other airline to fly to or from MEM on. Now, is that Delta's fault or the Airport Authority's for not maintaining alternate options? You can argue that Delta made is so expensive that no one wanted to fly to or from MEM, but whose shoulders does it fall on to maintain an airport with various options for passengers? The Airport Authority is there for a reason and they've pretty much cleaned house and replaced them for a reason. This isn't the only instance where the City has dropped the ball in a major way. It's hard for me to see how the general public doesn't see where their city appointed board failed them in a major way and continue to want to blame one particular corporation for that.

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Dr Nevergold

BTW, location of Memphis has little to do with it. Charlotte is much closer to Atlanta than Memphis, but they have a hub airport with 40 million passengers/year and growing just because US Air wants it to be the place they do business.

Because they're two different airlines focusing on two different cities to operate out of. Once again this brings up the point of the Airport Authority not realizing what was directly in front of them. Based on geographical proximity alone that should have been cause of concern.

[Wayward Memphian]

Originally Posted by arkitekte

Because they're two different airlines focusing on two different cities to operate out of. Once again this brings up the point of the Airport Authority not realizing what was directly in front of them. Based on geographical proximity alone that should have been cause of concern.

I wonder about Spirit, wonder if they are looking at Memphis. Talk about cheap, like they say your ass and the gas.

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Wayward Memphian

I wonder about Spirit, wonder if they are looking at Memphis. Talk about cheap, like they say your ass and the gas.

I'm surprised they haven't tested the water some...same with Allegiant, especially since Frontier came on board. I don't particularly think Frontier abandoning that DAL route is telling much...Dallas is right around the line of drive vs. fly. Could I see them (Spirit) picking up a DFW or ORD route from MEM...maybe. It just depends, although American has those on lock.

[Dr Nevergold]

Originally Posted by arkitekte

Comical.

You love trying to turn what I've previously said regarding whatever topic into something that I didn't say that you can argue. Delta did its own thing. Memphis should have as well.

Any city that proactively is trying to grow in whatever aspect is going to promote competition, not give up all to one particular corporation. Any city that does is bound to fail; I can name you a few if you need help thinking of them. Working in city government I see that every hour of every day. The City of Memphis and the Airport Authority went out of its way to cater to Delta and in turn ran off Frontier completely while other airlines cut service at MEM due to the Airport Authority catering to Delta. Should they have seen the writing on the wall? Yes. Was MEM an airport with a high O&D passenger number? No. This is cause for concern with any transportation planning office whether that's air or not. You have to produce numbers of passengers who are specifically flying to or leaving your city. Who's responsible for that?

Delta makes cuts and guess what? There's not much of any other airline to fly to or from MEM on. Now, is that Delta's fault or the Airport Authority's for not maintaining alternate options? You can argue that Delta made is so expensive that no one wanted to fly to or from MEM, but whose shoulders does it fall on to maintain an airport with various options for passengers? The Airport Authority is there for a reason and they've pretty much cleaned house and replaced them for a reason. This isn't the only instance where the City has dropped the ball in a major way. It's hard for me to see how the general public doesn't see where their city appointed board failed them in a major way and continue to want to blame one particular corporation for that.

Memphis has as many carriers as Nashville does, and the Charlotte mega-hub east of Atlanta only has about 3 more carriers than Memphis (and those airlines offer specialty flights, not major service). These other airports do not have a great deal more airliners to choose from. Memphis doesn't have many non-stop flights now because its not a hub, plain and simple. You're really misunderstanding the entire situation.

It is just easier for me to state you don't have a lot of factual information on this topic and leave it at that. I know you mean well with your insistence that Memphis should have better political leadership, but it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. MEM is doing a fabulous job at renovating the terminal and Southwest set up shop only months before the hub was decommissioned at MEM in 2013.

Don't forget another mega-merger completed last year. American now fully owns US Airways, the deal closed in fall 2013. They are under contractual obligation under merger rules to maintain all their hubs for 3 years, the US Airways brand is being dismantled slowly and it'll all become American in due time. After the 3 year period in fall of 2016, we'll eventually see more industry consolidation.

http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2013/11/...-lawsuit/?_r=0

America only has 3 traditional airliners (Delta, United, American) plus Southwest. There isn't much competition anymore, no one else exists, and all other airlines besides these 4 are significantly smaller carriers with very small flight networks. This is another issue, and another topic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._North_America

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Dr Nevergold

Memphis has as many carriers as Nashville does, and the Charlotte mega-hub east of Atlanta only has about 3 more carriers than Memphis (and those airlines offer specialty flights, not major service). These other airports do not have a great deal more airliners to choose from. Memphis doesn't have many non-stop flights now because its not a hub, plain and simple. You're really misunderstanding the entire situation.

That's incorrect.

"Only three more carriers" adds up considering the flights that are offered at both of those airports.

You don't have to explain to me how a hub work. Save you time.

It is just easier for me to state you don't have a lot of factual information on this topic and leave it at that. I know you mean well with your insistence that Memphis should have better political leadership, but it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. MEM is doing a fabulous job at renovating the terminal and Southwest set up shop only months before the hub was decommissioned at MEM in 2013.

When have I criticized MEM and the modernization of the terminal? If anything I've praised them for that. Once again you are insinuating something I never said in addition to calling me out on not having factual information when your own ramblings are anything but factual.