New Hotel Planned For Meadowlands

[the dude]

sorry...this is a bit of an aside but relates to the issue of building-height restrictions.

in vietnam, people are encouraged to build vertically as their property taxes are based, in part, on the width of the building. the result is a very dense cluster of 3-6 storey buildings. even their suburban developments are exactly the same as their urban ones.

i've also noticed a very high standard of building here. no balloon frames. solid brick and concrete foundations and walls.

oh ya, keep up the bickering. it's a lot more fun to witness it from afar.

[fastcarsfreedom]

realcity--interesting new avatar--of course Safeway is still in business. Good catch on the old Simpson's logo--the outline of it is still plainly visible on the outside of The Bay here in Windsor--a good 15-20 years after the name change.

thedude raises an interesting point--apparently development/building styles are favorable in Vietnam. I'm just going to leave that one alone.

[the dude]

^no, please, elaborate.

my observation is that people take care of how they build here. that's not been my observation in canada.

i prefer your role as ultra conservative, gun-toting, truck driving, octogenerian, than just simply being a smart ass. it does you a disservice.

[raisethehammer]

what do you mean?? we take care of how we build here.
Look at the Meadowlands....hours and hours of crafsmanship and stunning attention to detail is required to design buildings that wonderful. I mean, they are competing with the Pigott building and TH&B Station for the architectural highlights in our fine city.

[fastcarsfreedom]

Whatever do you mean thedude? I merely said your observation was interesting. You shouldn't try to take things so personally.

Me, a smartass? Afraid not. As for elaboration--let's say I find your insinuation that the urban fabric and construction methods are superior in Vietnam to be a reach.

[the dude]

i think you were being a smartass but anyway...

i try to avoid mass generalizations. with that in mind, i'm not going to suggest vietnam is better. i don't have enough info to back that up. i've just stated that i've noticed a high standard of building here. it's my observation that they spend a lot of time building and designing their homes. also, their homes are owner built just as we used to do. there are some serious artisans at work in this country and so many others around the world. unfortunately, we don't value craftsmanship the way we used to.

sorry, this thread has been derailed, at least in part, by me. my apologies.

[fastcarsfreedom]

On that note thedude--we are in some agreement. Something that is sorely lacking these days is craftsmanship/artisanship and ultimately--design. This concerns me more as it applies to public and commercial buildings--but it does extend, to an extent, to dwellings. With that in mind--some of the innovations that go into home-building today have in fact made homes better, safer and more efficient. Your insight from aborad is nonetheless appreciated.

[LikeHamilton]

Meadowlands hotel/office approved
Six-storey project goes above and beyond Ancaster height restrictions

By Kevin Werner, Ancaster News

Hamilton politicians approved this week a $40 million hotel and office complex on Old Golf Links Road in Ancaster even though it will violate the former town's height restrictions.

The six-storey, 113-room Holiday Inn by developers Denis Vranich and John Bukovac, will exceed Ancaster's three-storey height restriction. But councillors and city planning staff recommended the proposal was "unique" enough that it could exceed the restriction.

In addition to the hotel, which will overlook the Lincoln Alexander Parkway at the corner of Golf Links Road and Stone Church Road, the development will also include a banquet centre, restaurant, an office building, and a two-level parking structure that will accommodate about 300 parking spaces.

The Holiday Inn is expected to have a "retro-look" with coach lighting and brick walls.

The hotel and office complex plan was initially presented to members of the Ancaster Village Core Advisory Committee nearly a year ago by Sergio Manchia, senior planner for Planning and Engineering Initiatives Inc.

Members of the Ancaster planning sub-committee have previously expressed their concerns over building height.

The proponents have argued the hotel will not sharply contrast the surrounding long-term care facility or the Dalton Timmis Insurance building because it will be located in a gully, reducing the building's height.

The gully, the proponents have argued, will mean the buildings' height will be mitigated, in comparison to the surrounding buildings. They have stated only three storeys will be visible from Golf Links Road.

City planning staff stated the proposal is located in a "unique" location, and will service the needs not only of the immediate area, but also a regional market.

The planning and economic development committee approved the plan's Official Plan proposal, and a change in zoning from public to a holding, shopping centre commercial category.

The owners still need to complete a servicing study, finish and get approval to re-construct Old Golf Links Road, and conduct an archaeological assessment of the 1.12 hectare development property.

The committee's recommendation will be voted on at council's Feb. 27 meeting.

If council approves the recommendations, construction is scheduled to begin by late summer of 2008.

[raisethehammer]

maybe they should start digging gulleys all over Ancaster...go down 10, 15 stories so people can actually build something out there that isn't a massive waste of resources like the rest of the burb.

[highwater]

"The Holiday Inn is expected to have a "retro-look" with coach lighting and brick walls."

Ah yes. An ersatz attempt to capitalize on the remaining shreds of Ancaster's history. Call it Disney Ancaster, or Dis-Aster for short.

[raisethehammer]

a buddy of mine had the best name for a newly amalgamated suburban city as proposed a few years back - Flambasterdas!

[fastcarsfreedom]

highwater--the remaining shreads of Ancaster's history? Do you define the entire town by The Meadowlands? The entire "old" Ancaster Village is intact--no large-scale demolitions or redevelopments.

Pass judgement on the building when you see it. First stucco is hated--now bricks and coach lights?

I suspect the planning commitee responsible for Ancaster is going to get busier--as I mentioned previously, I would guess this hotel is going to do really well--and hotels like to cluster--my bet is more of these proposals start popping up in the same area. Completion of the RHVP has made this a major transit point for in-transit traffic headed to Niagara, NY, etc.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by fastcarsfreedom

highwater--the remaining shreads of Ancaster's history? Do you define the entire town by The Meadowlands? The entire "old" Ancaster Village is intact--no large-scale demolitions or redevelopments.

Pass judgement on the building when you see it. First stucco is hated--now bricks and coach lights?

I suspect the planning commitee responsible for Ancaster is going to get busier--as I mentioned previously, I would guess this hotel is going to do really well--and hotels like to cluster--my bet is more of these proposals start popping up in the same area. Completion of the RHVP has made this a major transit point for in-transit traffic headed to Niagara, NY, etc.

I suspect the planning committee for Ancaster will get a lot busier too - fending off mad residents upset with the 6 storey building being built.

They're almost out of land out there anyhow. Don't expect to see a huge development with multiple buildings creating a mini-suburban skyline.
Check that, they THINK they're almost out of land. From my view, they've barely scratched the surface with that land but that's another matter.

And for the record, Dundurn Castle has coach lanterns.
The meadowlands has parking spots, mad drivers, warehouses and NO meadows.

[highwater]

Originally Posted by fastcarsfreedom

highwater--the remaining shreads of Ancaster's history? Do you define the entire town by The Meadowlands? The entire "old" Ancaster Village is intact--no large-scale demolitions or redevelopments.

Pass judgement on the building when you see it. First stucco is hated--now bricks and coach lights?

I wasn't talking about the Meadowlands, I was in fact referring to the 'old' village which is anything but intact. When was the last time you took a drive along Wilson? From Rousseau to Fiddler's Green, you'll find fewer than a dozen historical buildings. With the exception of the barracks, the Masonic Lodge and its neighbouring building, and the Coach and Lantern and Hanley's across the street, there is no continuous historical streetscape, and the remaining buildings are separated by late 20th century infill, strip plazas, gas stations, etc. I think "shreds" is a very apt description, frankly.

I don't need to wait to see a fake historical building before passing judgement on it. As a student of 19th and 20th century North American architecture, I have an aversion to all fake architecture. It doesn't take any imagination or vision to exploit Ancaster's 'historical' aura by building a pseudo-historical building, no matter how nicely they tart it up. Fake is fake.

[fastcarsfreedom]

I'm there frequently--given that my family leaves nearby. True, there is infill on Wilson--I'm not sure how old you are--but I'm old enough to remember from early 1980s onward, and Wilson Street was ALWAYS gap-toothed--and in my lifetime never had the "continuous" streetscape that you see in Dundas, for instance. Again, being unsure of how long you've lived in the area, I can't pass judgement--other than to say that the Wilson streetscape has been improved over the years--with some of the more unfortunate 20th century infill having been removed--gas stations for instance. Again, I would be curious to know what someone of your architectural knowledge and preferences would prefer in infill situations. I suspect nothing would be satisfactory to you.

Given that this Holiday Inn is being built in The Meadowlands this is a completely disjointed discussion. It is nonetheless amusing to read the design being decried--I will be sure to mention it the next time I read a post complaining about stucco.

[highwater]

What do I prefer in infill situations? Same thing I prefer in any situation: attractive, honest, sensitive to its surroundings, built and designed with care and attention to detail. In other words, not like 99.9 % of the crap being thrown up in Ancaster/Anywheresville these days. I don't have a problem with there being infill on Wilson, I just have a problem with you characterizing it as an "intact" heritage district.

You seem to be of the mind that hating stucco and hating fake historical architecture are at odds with each other. They're not. They're one and the same. Stucco, fake stone, vinyl Palladian windows, imitation coach lanterns, etc., etc., are all hallmarks of the quality and vision-challenged vernacular that we see in the infill on Wilson, and in the Meadowlands. Sounds like the Holiday Inn will be right at home. Well, at least it will be sensitve to its surroundings.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by highwater

What do I prefer in infill situations? Same thing I prefer in any situation: attractive, honest, sensitive to its surroundings, built and designed with care and attention to detail. In other words, not like 99.9 % of the crap being thrown up in Ancaster/Anywheresville these days. I don't have a problem with there being infill on Wilson, I just have a problem with you characterizing it as an "intact" heritage district.

You seem to be of the mind that hating stucco and hating fake historical architecture are at odds with each other. They're not. They're one and the same. Stucco, fake stone, vinyl Palladian windows, imitation coach lanterns, etc., etc., are all hallmarks of the quality and vision-challenged vernacular that we see in the infill on Wilson, and in the Meadowlands. Sounds like the Holiday Inn will be right at home. Well, at least it will be sensitve to its surroundings.

Don't forget the lovely Home Depot pillars. For that extra touch of class.....

http://www.landmarthomes.com/

[fastcarsfreedom]

You may be missing my point somewhat--I'm not sure how long you've been active here--but stucco is a recurrent theme--call my mention of the alternative design of the Holiday Inn an exercise in humor/exasperation.

As for Ancaster's "intact"ness--as stated previously--Ancaster never looked like Dundas--ever...completely different animals as far as their streetscape is concerned. You also assumed I was referring to Wilson Street distinctly--and more specifically between Rosseau and Fiddler's Green--while in fact I was referring to the core of the "old" town. Major features like the Hamilton G&CC, old homes, trees, etc are very much intact. Dundas is "intact" also--has a completely different streetwall, but has also lost some heritage building and was relieved of it's trees on King Street during street widening decades ago.

[highwater]

I think you missed my point. There is nothing "alternative" about the Holiday Inn design. Stucco and fake historical doodads are not opposed to one another, but are in fact part of the same crappy continuum.

I have deep family ties to Ancaster and have been visiting the 'old' town, including the HGCC, regularly for at least 40 years. It's a sad fact that the truly historical elements of Ancaster form an ever-diminishing percentage of the building stock. Hence my 'shreds' remark. My original comment was merely a criticism of Holiday Inn's unimaginative attempts to trade on Ancaster's historical reputation, instead of coming up with something original that might actually contribute to the tattered suburban fabric.

[highwater]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

Don't forget the lovely Home Depot pillars. For that extra touch of class.....

http://www.landmarthomes.com/

Gah! You should have put a warning on that link.

PVC just like Grandpa used to make.