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  #321  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 10:13 AM
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This could have gone in either the Downtown thread or here, but I think this is the right place, given the intention.

Moncton to Buy Highfield Square
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  #322  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 1:09 PM
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In St. John's we're running into the problem that we didn't build a large enough venue when we built Mile One Centre. We have the demand for very large concerts and there's simply nowhere to have them in the city. One solution we have coming forward are large outdoor concert venues. In Galway (Danny Williams' 5 billion dollar development) will have an outdoor venue that will be able to have concerts of 50-60 thousand people. As well as in Paradise (suburb) they are in the process of developing a similar venue.
Maybe a smaller indoor venue if they find that the overhead costs will be too high and a large outdoor veneue for the summer concerts? I don't know?
Does Moncton have a large outdoors venue?
Maybe it would be best to build bigger for the future now there I'm not sure.
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  #323  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 1:43 PM
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Originally Posted by jeddy1989 View Post
Does Moncton have a large outdoors venue?
Maybe it would be best to build bigger for the future now there I'm not sure.
Magnetic Hill
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  #324  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 1:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeddy1989 View Post
Does Moncton have a large outdoors venue?
I guess you've not heard of Magnetic Hill and our 70-80k concerts with U2, the Rolling Stones etc.

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Originally Posted by jeddy1989 View Post
Maybe it would be best to build bigger for the future now there I'm not sure.
That's why we need a 10,000 seat events centre - so we can plan for a Moncton with 200,000 people in 30-40 years time........
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  #325  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 2:50 PM
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ops LMAO hahahah I have through here but decided not to connect the dots in my head lol. I wasn't sure if it was actually in the city or out away or what.

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That's why we need a 10,000 seat events centre - so we can plan for a Moncton with 200,000 people in 30-40 years time........
We're now over 208k but didn't really plan for this amount of growth I guess and I guess Moncton would be banking on attracting people from ALL over the maritimes which would put you in direct competition with Halifax for concerts etc. is there enough hotel space/support economy? I ask because I know that in St. John's there is a waiting list for conventions due to the need for more hotels and venues being booked up, we even had to move our PC leadership convention to further in the summer because most of the hotel space is booked up for the summer already and we just opened two new fair sized hotels.

It's a great conversation to have and you guys are definitely ideally located for large concerts.
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  #326  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 3:18 PM
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City of Moncton sets “affordability cap” for downtown events centre
Times & Transcript Online Today

The City of Moncton has set its “affordability cap” or maximum price it is willing to pay at $95 million including the Harmonized Sales Tax. At that price, the arena portion would have a minimum of 7,500 fixed seats, with the ability to add 1,500 to 2,000 seats.

Mayor George LeBlanc started the questioning by focussing on the number of seats, worrying the set minimum number will make proponents go with that minimum instead of going bigger.

We’ve heard from these two bidders that 7,500 seats makes sense to them,” Chemla said. He reminded the mayor the two aspects of the project, the design build finance of construction, and the operation and maintenance of the facility once it is built means “you are transferring the bottom line risk to the proponents.”

Dube noted the minimums for events like the Memorial Cup and Canadian figure skating and world curling events are within the 7,500 seat capacity.

If we were to attract the World Junior Hockey Championships for instance, “we’re in the bracket of those sorts of events,” the city manager said.

He said 8,500 seats is the sweet spot for concerts.

Arnold expressed disappointment the $95 million would not include a large meeting space or public library, two of the items on council’s initial wish list. Discussions are continuing.
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  #327  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 4:00 PM
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Dube is crazy if he thinks 8500 is the sweet spot for concerts...seriously!?

Why spend $95M to have an arena with 1000 more seats than the Coliseum...seriously...this council is freaking out of touch (or the ones that matter). I'm sooo unbelievably frustrated right now.

Dube noted the minimum for seating...so we are going to build to the minimum? That's stupid!

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  #328  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 5:02 PM
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I think this is the time people start sending emails in to council and start fighting for more seats, we can't allow that to happen, they need, they have to go with 9000 minimum... build for the future not just to have the bare minimum for events,
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  #329  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 8:25 PM
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If they can't afford the right project, don't build it at all.
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  #330  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2014, 10:39 PM
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If the city is serious with moving in this direction, then maybe someone did their homework and are taken a page out of Saskatoon's approach to a new arena.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_Union_Centre

I would love to see a brand new state of the art 10,000 seat arena, but if there is not enough money (public / private) then start out at 7500 seats. Ensure the design allows for future growth.

I know this is not a popular stance here on this forum, but it is really easy making decisions when one is not responsible for paying for it!
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  #331  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 12:34 AM
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I know this is not a popular stance here on this forum, but it is really easy making decisions when one is not responsible for paying for it!
We're not responsible for making the decisions, but either way, we're the ones paying for half of it. I'd gladly pay the extra $15.35 per Monctonian in taxes to make this a 10K arena (if it was 95M for 7500 seats vs 105M for 10K seats. I have no idea).
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  #332  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 6:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walk then Run View Post
I would love to see a brand new state of the art 10,000 seat arena, but if there is not enough money (public / private) then start out at 7500 seats. Ensure the design allows for future growth.

I know this is not a popular stance here on this forum, but it is really easy making decisions when one is not responsible for paying for it!
Harbour Station had an unfinished upper bowl for years. Not sure exactly how many extra seats it would have been, but it was significant. That area finally became suites when the Sea Dogs moved in.

Definitely not the ideal solution, but if cost is a factor it's an option to look at - Get the thing going, and if during construction or after a year there's momentum to add more seats, then the infrastructure is already in place.
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  #333  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 6:09 PM
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Editorial from today's T&T:

Not there yet
Wednesday, March 26, 2014
Times & Transcript
http://22864.vws.magma.ca/index.php?&article_id=12591

Mayor George LeBlanc is right to be unhappy with a price approximately $1 million higher than previously advertised and there is a mighty long way to go yet before the first sod is finally cut for a downtown events centre, yet we must acknowledge City of Moncton staff and Moncton City Council, after what was doubtless hundreds of hours of work, have done a good job getting the project to this crucial point.

Those who have had doubts about the City’s seriousness in making this vital project happen received by far their best signal yet to the contrary on Tuesday with council’s motion, albeit narrowly passed, to purchase 11 acres of the former Highfield Square shopping mall property for $12.5 million. Indeed we expect the mayor is correct when he speculates expropriation would have been cheaper and are puzzled why the City chose not to go this route. But at least the ‘buy’ is done and in the long run it could serve the City well. The events centre itself will require less than half the 11 acres and now the City has control over a considerable piece of land that will be among the most sought-after by developers who want to take advantage of Moncton’s first major ‘core’ development project in 25 years. The new centre could spur growth especially in the immediate downtown area and we believe it is essential that a significant portion of it work within the theme of establishing Metro Moncton as a sports and entertainment capital for Atlantic Canada.

Unfortunately, all the work to get us to this point may have gone for naught with council’s decision Wednesday to issue a request for proposals for a centre with a maximum of 7,500 seats. It is significant in our view that the mayor also cast a nay on this vote. He understands the ‘entertainment capital’ project is in fact a regional competition and Moncton’s main rival for the business, Halifax,already has a 10,000-seat centre and wants to make it bigger. This isn’t about ‘oneupmanship’ on a neighbour, it’s about the business of attracting the best variety and scope of entertainment possible. Council should consider the ‘big picture’ and reconsider this decision.

We Say:

Optimism for events centre gets boost with site purchase, but project too small.

Personal note - It's intriguing that the mayor cast nay votes to both the purchase of the Highfield Square site and to the issuance of the RFP. His reasons are understandable and do not constitute any opposition to the project in general. Indeed, in most ways, the events centre is in fact his "baby". This may be an indication however that he has lost control of the file, and the people really in charge of the project now are the bureaucrats at city hall, supported by the majority of members on city council……..

I wonder if this scenario would be playing out in this manner if Ian Fowler were still alive. Ian had great influence in the city hall bureaucracy and certainly had the "vision thing". He would have been a very valuable behind the scenes booster for this project - certainly much more so than his successor Jacques Dube, who seems to have the demeanour and approach of an accountant or an actuary.

In any event, the T&T editorial is wrong in one important respect. The RFP is not for an arena with a maximum of 7,500 seats, but is instead for an arena with a minimum of 7,500 seats. As such, there is at least a faint glimmer of hope that the final seat count within the affordability cap of $95M might be somewhat higher - perhaps 8,000 or 8,500. I suspect though, given the fact that the RFP is also for management of the facility when completed, that the successful party will opt for a lower number just for fiscal prudence and to improve their bottom line during the management phase of the contract.

All in all, this is a disappointing turn of events.
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  #334  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 7:03 PM
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Originally Posted by magee_b View Post
Harbour Station had an unfinished upper bowl for years. Not sure exactly how many extra seats it would have been, but it was significant. That area finally became suites when the Sea Dogs moved in.

Definitely not the ideal solution, but if cost is a factor it's an option to look at - Get the thing going, and if during construction or after a year there's momentum to add more seats, then the infrastructure is already in place.
Yes, Harbour Station still has the ability to add just over 2000 extra seats if they removed the luxury boxes which would bring capacity to around 8500 for hockey and over 10,000 for concerts. Seems like this would be a good way for Moncton to go as well.

In reading the CBC article the city has set a new deadline of August for a firm commitment from the Feds and Province on funding. With politics you never know, but would be quite surprised to see the Feds kick in. The Province most likely makes their contribution dependent on the Feds.
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  #335  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 7:37 PM
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I was under the impression that the area of the luxury boxes and filling in some of the area around the Zamboni entrance would of added an additional 1800 hundred seats. Regardless, those seats could not be added to capacity for a concert. They would be lost to the stage. Wouldn't be much more capacity than it holds now for a concert, unless of course the stage was in the center as in the Elton John concert.
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  #336  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 7:41 PM
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  #337  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 7:45 PM
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CBC is doing a poll and it suggest that the people are in support of the mayors wants!

5,000 1.78% (8 votes)


7,500 16.26% (73 votes)


9,000 52.34% (235 votes)


Moncton doesn't need a new entertainment complex 30% (133 votes)


With 52.24% voting for 9000 seats, maybe city council will see this and realize that this is what the people want!
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  #338  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 8:57 PM
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The Saint John Harbour Station, and I assume most/all new arenas these days are designed in a way to take advantage of new ideas and technology to accommodate any type of event that will come along.

As you can see below, the end zone seats are partially removed to slide out the main concert stage. This allows more seating capacity around the bowl and the floor.



I just hope to gawd that my city doesn't go cheap and stupid. That's all I ask. Leave room to expand and let a pro design this thing. Please leave this Dube character out of this project.
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  #339  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 9:02 PM
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Hey if its up to the CBC posters.. we will refurbish the old coliseum, because there isn't enough parking for them downtown.. and that people will not go for that reason... I read the comments and they drive me insane... these people know absolutely nothing about how create growth... sorry another rant...
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  #340  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2014, 11:57 PM
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Anything under 10K is a letdown. Sub-10K leaves Moncton with too small of a major venue in ten years and quite frankly is a waste of money for a city with that much growth to build a new arena a few hundred seats larger than the previous.
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