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  #2081  
Old Posted Apr 24, 2018, 9:10 PM
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No. Part of the NCC's January announcement surrounding the agreement in principal with RVL included the outright elimination of DCDLS.
Where did you see that? I only saw that RVL was designated as the preferred proponent so they could negotiate.
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  #2082  
Old Posted Apr 24, 2018, 9:35 PM
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Where did you see that? I only saw that RVL was designated as the preferred proponent so they could negotiate.
It was a foot note in only a few news articles following the January announcement. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find a reference.

EDIT: Closest I could find, but I know I've seen this elsewhere;

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Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post

Until we see a shovel with Sens logo, these are only baby steps on LeBreton

Kelly Egan, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: January 25, 2018 | Last Updated: January 25, 2018 7:01 PM EST

And now that we are down to one proponent, why must all the details be kept secret? What does the agreement in principle say? What is the “fair market price” the parties have agreed to?

NCC chair Marc Seaman said the board spent four hours Wednesday on the LeBreton file, privately going through the history and discussing the current agreement. Four hours? And what does the public get? Four paragraphs of highlights.

At face value, it is a momentous step, one that may lead to fundamental changes in how the capital lives, works and plays. But, behind the curtain, there are nerves in the wings, surely.

To contact Kelly Egan, please call 613-726-5896 or email kegan@postmedia.com
Twitter.com/kellyegancolumn


http://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/col...ps-on-lebreton
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  #2083  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2018, 3:24 PM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
It was a foot note in only a few news articles following the January announcement. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find a reference.

EDIT: Closest I could find, but I know I've seen this elsewhere;
Thanks. It doesn't seem necessary to eliminate the second proponent before an agreement is reached, so I wonder why they would do that.
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  #2084  
Old Posted May 17, 2018, 12:07 PM
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Here's a time lapse of a portion of Calgary's LRT being covered while remaining operational for what seems like most of the construction period. It's the site of their new central library. Shows how the LRT line near Pimisi Station could be covered during the redevelopment of Lebreton Flats.

Video Link
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  #2085  
Old Posted May 17, 2018, 3:31 PM
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But DCDLS said it was impossible!! How could this be!?
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  #2086  
Old Posted May 17, 2018, 8:35 PM
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But DCDLS said it was impossible!! How could this be!?
Special effects; behold the power of Hollywood!
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  #2087  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 12:41 AM
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But DCDLS said it was impossible!! How could this be!?
Not so much concerned with DCDLS claim that it's impossible, when Calgary demonstrated that it is indeed possible, but it's at what price. The DCDLS rep that I spoke to awhile back scoffed at the $25 million amount Rendez-Vous was estimating it would cost to cover the tracks. If this is indeed what Rendez-Vous budgeted for such a project, I have my doubts it will happen, and certainly not at that price.
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  #2088  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 12:09 PM
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During the development of the Scott St CDP, the City did a rough estimate of the cost of decking over the transitway trench from about Stirling to Parkdale or Holland. It’s been a while, so my memory is fuzzy, but I feel like it was in the $10-15M range. Is gjhall around? Do you remember?
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  #2089  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 12:20 PM
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During the development of the Scott St CDP, the City did a rough estimate of the cost of decking over the transitway trench from about Stirling to Parkdale or Holland. It’s been a while, so my memory is fuzzy, but I feel like it was in the $10-15M range. Is gjhall around? Do you remember?
Would be interesting to see what they estimated the cost to be, but not really comparable to Lebreton, as with the trench the walls are already in place. Would imagine the cost for Lebreton would be higher by a factor of 2 or 3 at least.
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  #2090  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 12:56 PM
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Would be interesting to see what they estimated the cost to be, but not really comparable to Lebreton, as with the trench the walls are already in place. Would imagine the cost for Lebreton would be higher by a factor of 2 or 3 at least.
The part that was already walled because of the trench was pretty small compared to the amount of new wall that needed to be built.
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  #2091  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 12:58 PM
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During the development of the Scott St CDP, the City did a rough estimate of the cost of decking over the transitway trench from about Stirling to Parkdale or Holland. It’s been a while, so my memory is fuzzy, but I feel like it was in the $10-15M range. Is gjhall around? Do you remember?
That's a bit different since there are already side walls on the trench. In covering the line at Lebreton Flats you'd have to build side walls and then cover it.
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  #2092  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 2:01 PM
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No argument, the cost per metre would be higher, pick your multiplier, 2x, 3x, 4x, whatever; but Stirling-Parkdale and Stirling-Holland are pretty similar distance-wise to Booth-Preston and Booth-CityCentre, respectively, so one could use that benchmark to ballpark a comparison estimate pretty easily, I think.
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  #2093  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 4:08 PM
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In Calgary, the "trench" is maybe half the site, if that. I think it would have had little impact on the project.

I don't know about RVL $25 million estimate (2016 dollars), but I honestly think that it might be cheaper, or at least comparable to Calgary's cover, per capita, for the most part (with the station cover being a little more expansive).

What is important to remember is that that part of LeBreton Flats is already in a literal hole. Regardless of if they cover the tracks or not, RVL will be building a parking garage between Scott and the Confederation Line to serve the entire south side of the district (much like Lansdowne). So one of the walls, a full wall as opposed to Calgary's ramp, doesn't count within the cost of the new tunnel (or adds a moderate amount since this wall will support half the live weight of cars above the tunnel as opposed to Calgary's live weight of pedestrians using the future ramp).

Another consideration with this new street is the overall engineering requirements are reduced compared to Calgary, where the new library's structure had to be even stronger to support the 6 storey building. In this case, we're looking a the scope of the entire project, comparing the structure to support a road vs a building. In Ottawa, it's the walls and the roof, in Calgary, it was constructing an entire building over space they couldn't use for support.
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  #2094  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 5:36 PM
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In Calgary, the "trench" is maybe half the site, if that. I think it would have had little impact on the project.

I don't know about RVL $25 million estimate (2016 dollars), but I honestly think that it might be cheaper, or at least comparable to Calgary's cover, per capita, for the most part (with the station cover being a little more expansive).

What is important to remember is that that part of LeBreton Flats is already in a literal hole. Regardless of if they cover the tracks or not, RVL will be building a parking garage between Scott and the Confederation Line to serve the entire south side of the district (much like Lansdowne). So one of the walls, a full wall as opposed to Calgary's ramp, doesn't count within the cost of the new tunnel (or adds a moderate amount since this wall will support half the live weight of cars above the tunnel as opposed to Calgary's live weight of pedestrians using the future ramp).

Another consideration with this new street is the overall engineering requirements are reduced compared to Calgary, where the new library's structure had to be even stronger to support the 6 storey building. In this case, we're looking a the scope of the entire project, comparing the structure to support a road vs a building. In Ottawa, it's the walls and the roof, in Calgary, it was constructing an entire building over space they couldn't use for support.
That makes sense for one wall if they were already planning a parking garage to butt up right next to the rail line. I'm still thinking $25 million - which is what the DCDLS rep told me Rendez-vous was budgeting, I never confirmed that was accurate - is fairly low-ball amount for such a project these days.
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  #2095  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 5:49 PM
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That makes sense for one wall if they were already planning a parking garage to butt up right next to the rail line. I'm still thinking $25 million - which is what the DCDLS rep told me Rendez-vous was budgeting, I never confirmed that was accurate - is fairly low-ball amount for such a project these days.
That's correct. Here's an article from the Ottawa Citizen dating back to 2016 about the project. This is where I read about the parking garage argument originally. The $25 million figure is quoted here.





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  #2096  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 6:11 PM
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That's correct. Here's an article from the Ottawa Citizen dating back to 2016 about the project. This is where I read about the parking garage argument originally. The $25 million figure is quoted here.
Great, thanks for the link. We'll just have to wait and see if that figure ends up being accurate or considerably off the mark.
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  #2097  
Old Posted Yesterday, 5:46 PM
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Originally Posted by McC View Post
During the development of the Scott St CDP, the City did a rough estimate of the cost of decking over the transitway trench from about Stirling to Parkdale or Holland. It’s been a while, so my memory is fuzzy, but I feel like it was in the $10-15M range. Is gjhall around? Do you remember?
Sorry don't recall the figure!
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  #2098  
Old Posted Yesterday, 6:45 PM
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If that's the figure (adjust for inflation), I feel like it would be worth doing, a few hundred meters a year. What is the ward's parks budget?
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  #2099  
Old Posted Yesterday, 7:19 PM
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They're putting a road - Canada Drive - atop the LRT, and there will be buildings on either side of it.. does this mean they're basically going to raise all of Lebreton to a higher grade?
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  #2100  
Old Posted Yesterday, 7:23 PM
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LeBreton Flats is currently a big hole, so they're just leveling it to the same height as Albert Street on the South end and SJAM on the North side.

The rendering of Pimisi provides a good perspective of this dip.

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